Well, good evening folks and welcome to the fourth thread of 2020; the first few posts of the last thread probably gave an ominous feeling, but it still seems difficult to believe that traffic collapsed so completely. It was like a domino effect - one country after another, then one airline after another, cutting back flights and passenger numbers declining to the stage where traffic numbers were in single figures. Here we are now, on the eve of April, with very little idea of when flights will be able to resume.

Just a little flashback to March:

- New EI A330-300 delivery flight, EI-EIM, plus Qatar Airways A330, A7-AEH, arriving to be repainted as EI-EIK (though now in EI colours, with Qatari reg still in place); EI-EWR makes last flight. EI-LRD delivered.
- Flybe ceases operations, a very familiar site in Irish skies for nearly 40 years, previously as Jersey European
- US bars Schengen flights initially, adding Ireland/UK a few days later ...
- Italy, Spain bar access, several other countries introduce restrictions. Traffic has, as the thread title suggests, taken a bit of a dip.

... The rest is history. The only bright point, from an aviation perspective, is Aer Lingus operating several flights from Dublin to Beijing, to collect PPE equipment; these flights are still ongoing. Cargo flights are continuing. As of now, China and South Korea seem to be recovering, but it is difficult to predict when things in Ireland and the EU and UK will get better, with numbers continuing to rise. Stringent public health restrictions on movement and social distancing make it unlikely that we will see changes in April, probably even May. We can only hope that the number of infections and fatalities will keep to a minimum and that the measures taken will be effective.

Here's a link to the last thread: viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1442163&start=300

Dublin Airport to stay open despite 83% drop in flights

Dublin Airport will remain open, as per government guidelines for the repatriation of Irish citizens and the import of medical supplies.

Paul O'Kane, Chief Communications Officer at Dublin Airport, said the airport saw 95% fewer passengers this week compared to the same week last year, while flights are down by 83%.

He said just 2,000 passengers used the airport yesterday, which he said is similar to the capacity of Dublin's Gaiety Theatre.

www.rte.ie/news/business/2020/0331/1127 ... aul-okane/

—

Covid-19 test centre opens at Galway Airport

A new Covid-19 test centre has opened at Galway Airport.

The drive-through facility has been developed in a vacant hangar at the airport, which closed to commercial air traffic eight years ago.

www.rte.ie/amp/1126343/

Hey all! I hope your all doing well with self isolation...A lot of you will know I formally worked for Servisair and avian day and am now BA crew so really feeling th pinch at the moment along with many former and current colleagues.

Fingers crossed things recover quickly, Dublin was doing incredibly well and I hope the transatlantic progress isn’t set back too much!

Wishing everyone the very best through these difficult times.
I hope the current operators can hibernate successfully and bounce back to normality asap.

"BFS Update
As easyJet - in alignment with our other passenger airlines amidst stricter Government directives on social distancing - have made the decision to cease all passenger operations, passenger flights are currently suspended. The airport remains open and operational as we are the main airport for Northern Ireland providing a critical arterial airlink for emergency medical and cargo operations 24 hours a day, all year round. We are still working hard to ensure that vital supplies continue to arrive daily so we can help those who need it most."

BHD is still linked with LHR but other than that there are no flights on the boards.

Cancellation updates from Aer Lingus

Since AA is accelerating their 757 retirements, could this be the end of their PHL-SNN route?

While the 737 MAX could be a contender for replacing the 757, who knows when this will return to service. Could the A321NEO perform the route?

Cheers, EI121

It will be interesting to see which routes survive! As an island nation we require air conectivity. And in the weeks to come it is that conectivity that will determine state support for aviation. The same will apply in the UK!

EI121 wrote:

Since AA is accelerating their 757 retirements, could this be the end of their PHL-SNN route?

While the 737 MAX could be a contender for replacing the 757, who knows when this will return to service. Could the A321NEO perform the route?

Cheers, EI121

The Big 3 US carriers - DL, UA and AA - used 757s extensively on thin transatlantic routes, so they have an equal need for a long haul twin; the A321 seems to fit that gap (even if not 100%) and I believe that all three have ordered it.

Right now, of course, everything is up in the air and airlines are in survival mode; by no means will all of the air routes operated during last summer's peak season be operated this year, even if there is any of the summer left after the current crisis passes. They will not rush aircraft back into service on routes which can't won't sustain it. There will be a lot of hard-headed decision making to be done and it wouldn't surprise me if several airlines either ceased operating or cancelled orders. That said, I don't see long haul twins being first in the firing line for cancellations, but the recovery from the current crisis will be long and painful.

In retrospect, I think we'll see 2019 as the high water mark for airline service for some years to come.

I don't think they will all permanently retire all 757s until the A321neoLRs arrive to operate the thinner T/A routes. AA and UA have ordered the A321neoXLR rather than the A321neoLR, so it wont be in service until 2023. I think Delta has only ordered the standard A321neo so far so I think all 3 will keep some 757s for T/A routes until it arrives, assuming all 3 still exist in their current form in a few months time. I think they will just remove the 757s mostly from the domestic routes. At least some of the 757s will be owned outright by now I assume so there won't be a big finance liability on them if they are grounded.

Sad to see Delta retire all the MD88s and MD90s but the process was well underway anyway.

OA260 wrote:

Cancellation updates from Aer Lingus

I've seen these notifications from EI and I must say that they're not very passenger friendly. Is every passenger intending to travel to Rome aware that the airport code is FCO? Days of operation; what does that mean to your average customer? For us here on A.net, we know this stuff, but I really think that this sort of information could have been put together in a "kinder" sort of way. I suspect it's an interpretation of information being supplied by the Operations Team, that has not been "translated" correctly into information that may be easily understood by man on the street.

Unemployment to ‘surge to 17pc’

The economic cost of the coronavirus crisis will be laid bare this morning as new figures are set to indicate unemployment has reached 17pc - higher than at the peak of the last financial crisis.

www.independent.ie/irish-news/coronavir ... 96160.html

—

Inside near-empty Dublin Airport and Cork Airport with just three planes a day flying in one

Pictures show eery scenes inside Ireland's two biggest airports as coronavirus halts flights around the world.

Cork Airport is now down to three return flights in and out of the airport a day - with all of those travelling to and from London.

www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/insi ... 795619.amp

A new wave of Aer Lingus cancellations

It strikes me that the Aer Lingus cancellations are all a bit “last minute”. I don’t think anyone expects that on Easter Sunday everything will just reopen and return to normal. Even global airlines such as Emirates have grounded pretty much everything until the end of April

Eirules wrote:

It strikes me that the Aer Lingus cancellations are all a bit “last minute”. I don’t think anyone expects that on Easter Sunday everything will just reopen and return to normal. Even global airlines such as Emirates have grounded pretty much everything until the end of April

EI are being opportunistic and playing games . If the customer cancels there’s no refund and it becomes an issue for the insurance companies to fight . Where EI cancels the customer is entitled to a refund which EI doesn’t really want to pay .... hence last minute cancellations or theoretical one stop reroutes to the USA via empty flights to NYC are in EI’s interest . Let’s remember that if EI start to ask for taxpayers money

Galwayman wrote:

Eirules wrote:

It strikes me that the Aer Lingus cancellations are all a bit “last minute”. I don’t think anyone expects that on Easter Sunday everything will just reopen and return to normal. Even global airlines such as Emirates have grounded pretty much everything until the end of April

EI are being opportunistic and playing games . If the customer cancels there’s no refund and it becomes an issue for the insurance companies to fight . Where EI cancels the customer is entitled to a refund which EI doesn’t really want to pay .... hence last minute cancellations or theoretical one stop reroutes to the USA via empty flights to NYC are in EI’s interest . Let’s remember that if EI start to ask for taxpayers money

Yeah I get that but ultimately they’re just tyre kicking. This time next week they’re 99.99% likely to be announcing more cancellations and have to give the refund then anyway

EI always looks after its guests! No matter the cost or consequences!! I have suspicion, in all fairness, that there is an element of 'on a wing and a prayer approach these days!

Can I ask the source of these cancellation charts?
Would be useful to pass to friends but can’t see that info in the website

Eagleboy wrote:

Can I ask the source of these cancellation charts?
Would be useful to pass to friends but can’t see that info in the website

Aer Lingus. Feel free to save image here and forward to your friends.

UK cancellations here :

Fliplot wrote:

EI always looks after its guests! No matter the cost or consequences!! I have suspicion, in all fairness, that there is an element of 'on a wing and a prayer approach these days!

Today they have offered an olive branch to Aer Club members with free Tier Points from 100-350 depending on your tier. Nice bonus all the same.

EI121 wrote:

Since AA is accelerating their 757 retirements, could this be the end of their PHL-SNN route?

While the 737 MAX could be a contender for replacing the 757, who knows when this will return to service. Could the A321NEO perform the route?

Cheers, EI121

I think this year we will not see AA, DL or UA for the whole summer, lot of u.s traffic will not be there and that
was a big chunk of the traffic not even mentioning the Irish and J1's not travelling. Also AA have stated they
have now retired the 757 and 767 fleet.

Galwayman wrote:

Eirules wrote:

It strikes me that the Aer Lingus cancellations are all a bit “last minute”. I don’t think anyone expects that on Easter Sunday everything will just reopen and return to normal. Even global airlines such as Emirates have grounded pretty much everything until the end of April

EI are being opportunistic and playing games . If the customer cancels there’s no refund and it becomes an issue for the insurance companies to fight . Where EI cancels the customer is entitled to a refund which EI doesn’t really want to pay .... hence last minute cancellations or theoretical one stop reroutes to the USA via empty flights to NYC are in EI’s interest . Let’s remember that if EI start to ask for taxpayers money

Yea, they really are treating people badly here. I do wonder are they leaving themselves open to 261/2004 claims with this action tho, due to the fact that these cancellations cannot now be claimed as unforeseen circumstances. While I understand that the entire situation we now find ourselves in was unforeseen and exceptional, cancelling flights within a week of departure I believe now can be foreseen and is no longer exceptional.

If they outright cancelled flights for the next 2 week or month ahead I think they would be ok, but waiting so close to departure (simply to hope people don't claim a refund), could be argued is entirely within the control of the airline.

I think it is extraordinary that EI have been operating such a comprehensive schedule over the past 2 or 3 weeks. I know a lot of routes were cancelled and others reduced in frequency, but FR took down their schedules a lot more quickly. They have been slow to dance routes, but on the other hand they have been operating routes like ORK-LIS and offering changes 120% vouchers. The cargo flights to China have been great publicity for the airline and a reminder that EI still focus on connecting our little island to the rest of the world. Perhaps I'm being overly nostalgic and I'm sure the Irish Government paid EI a pretty penny for the cargo flights, but all the same.

I don't think any of the airlines have been covering themselves in glory to be honest. easyJet have grounded the fleet, zero'd everything out until the end of April, but are only cancelling 7 days in advance. They are doing everything they can to illegally avoid a cash refund and to give a travel voucher, no 10 or 20% incentive. Vueling are doing similar. The only FR flight I have booked has been changed to another date which I would have been travelling on anyway and hadn't got round to booking. I'd be fairly confident taking a voucher from Ryanair or IAG, less so about the rest. Especially if this goes on into the Autumn.

OA260 wrote:

Fliplot wrote:

EI always looks after its guests! No matter the cost or consequences!! I have suspicion, in all fairness, that there is an element of 'on a wing and a prayer approach these days!

Today they have offered an olive branch to Aer Club members with free Tier Points from 100-350 depending on your tier. Nice bonus all the same.

I've been given 25! Im a Green member, so that was a nice surprise.

BDKLEZ wrote:

OA260 wrote:

Cancellation updates from Aer Lingus

I've seen these notifications from EI and I must say that they're not very passenger friendly. Is every passenger intending to travel to Rome aware that the airport code is FCO? Days of operation; what does that mean to your average customer? For us here on A.net, we know this stuff, but I really think that this sort of information could have been put together in a "kinder" sort of way. I suspect it's an interpretation of information being supplied by the Operations Team, that has not been "translated" correctly into information that may be easily understood by man on the street.

I don’t think these charts are actually designed for your average passenger, they’re released to the industry. Aer Lingus hasn’t been emailing these to individual passengers or releasing them on any of their social media platforms.

Are holidays booked for July and August going to happen?
Irish travel experts fear summer will have passed before many flights are back in the air

When will this nightmare end? That is the question many, if not all, Irish people – and people across the world – have been asking themselves in recent days, as the coronavirus crisis has continued to worsen.

The most pressing concern is now and will remain, obviously, one of public health, while the economic and societal impacts of the Covid-19 pandemic are also being keenly felt globally.

But there is another question many people are asking. “When will I be able to travel again, and is there any chance I will be able to take the summer holiday I have booked and paid for?”

www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/trave ... 9?mode=amp

OA260 wrote:

Today they have offered an olive branch to Aer Club members with free Tier Points from 100-350 depending on your tier. Nice bonus all the same.

25 for me... but I'm on 800 Tier Points in the British Airways Executive Club, with a June renewal date. I've booked flights to get the other 250 I need to get to Gold - now let's hope they go ahead!

Those dissing Aer Lingus and cancelling close to the flight... it's not uncommon. My Finnair booking for 2-6 April was on their cancellation list since the middle of March. The actual notification to me came four or five days before travel. Part of the reason they're doing rolling cancellations is the fact that once it happens, people start calling them. Doing it on a rolling basis manages the customers contacting them. Imagine the carnage if they cancelled a month's worth of flights all at once. Passenger queries would be through the roof, no-one would be able to get through and then you'd have the associated complaints. It's smart to cancel as you go for that reason alone.

Plane carrying medical supplies from China lands at Shannon Airport




A Qatar Airways cargo flight bringing medical supplies from China to help in the ongoing fight against Covid-19 landed at Shannon Airport this afternoon.

It is understood the cargo aircraft is carrying ventilators as well as emergency beds to be distributed to hospitals across the country and to boost medical equipment during the Covid-19 crisis.

www.rte.ie/news/2020/0402/1128163-shann ... ronavirus/

AA just announced reductions for their summer schedule, PHL-SNN and CLT-DUB are axed for this summer. ORD-DUB and PHL-DUB to resume from June 4th and October 7th, respectively. DFW-DUB from July 7th. (Though all of that is subject to further delays given what’s going).

http://news.aa.com/news/news-details/20 ... oom_Alerts

BrianDromey wrote:

I think it is extraordinary that EI have been operating such a comprehensive schedule over the past 2 or 3 weeks. I know a lot of routes were cancelled and others reduced in frequency, but FR took down their schedules a lot more quickly. They have been slow to dance routes, but on the other hand they have been operating routes like ORK-LIS and offering changes 120% vouchers. The cargo flights to China have been great publicity for the airline and a reminder that EI still focus on connecting our little island to the rest of the world. Perhaps I'm being overly nostalgic and I'm sure the Irish Government paid EI a pretty penny for the cargo flights, but all the same.

I don't think any of the airlines have been covering themselves in glory to be honest. easyJet have grounded the fleet, zero'd everything out until the end of April, but are only cancelling 7 days in advance. They are doing everything they can to illegally avoid a cash refund and to give a travel voucher, no 10 or 20% incentive. Vueling are doing similar. The only FR flight I have booked has been changed to another date which I would have been travelling on anyway and hadn't got round to booking. I'd be fairly confident taking a voucher from Ryanair or IAG, less so about the rest. Especially if this goes on into the Autumn.

OA260 wrote:

Fliplot wrote:

EI always looks after its guests! No matter the cost or consequences!! I have suspicion, in all fairness, that there is an element of 'on a wing and a prayer approach these days!

Today they have offered an olive branch to Aer Club members with free Tier Points from 100-350 depending on your tier. Nice bonus all the same.

I've been given 25! Im a Green member, so that was a nice surprise.

Well said Brian Dromey.
Refreshing to read such a balanced post.
On balance I feel that Aer Lingus have provided great coverage and there certainly is an.element of keeping linkage to Ireland going and then the China flying.

I can only imagine cancelling all flights at once would inundate the phone lines and that might not be the best. For any airline schedules changing drives enormous work. Under the circumstances I think they are doing an excellent job.

Don't compare EI and FR. They are not rhe same. One has a fleet of 60 aircraft, give or take and the other 300 aircraft, give or take. It would have been criminal if EI did not operate the Peking rotations - given they have the aircraft, crews and need the revenue. It is admirable they were able to commence so quickly. Fares of 500 plus on routes where standard fares were 200 plus is gouging - irrespective of which carrier charged the fares. Refunds are the legal way to resolve cancellations and all airlines are using every means possible to preserve cash! No one said that EI was not doing an excellent job, the question was at what cost to their guests? Only time will tell as to how well their, EI and FR, balance sheets will hold up!

Gentlemen,
Perhaps some compassion and tolerance might be in order. Airlines and their staff are coping with unprecedented problems, staff worried about their own and their families health, working with fare systems not prepared for this, worried about their jobs in the short term. Perhaps doing the job of another person in an unfamiliar area. I don't and never have worked in aviation but I have seen other organisations under stress. Sure stupid decisions get made, and usually by those that do not have to explain them.

Be kind please, money isn't everything.

dstc47 wrote:

Gentlemen,
Perhaps some compassion and tolerance might be in order. Airlines and their staff are coping with unprecedented problems, staff worried about their own and their families health, working with fare systems not prepared for this, worried about their jobs in the short term. Perhaps doing the job of another person in an unfamiliar area. I don't and never have worked in aviation but I have seen other organisations under stress. Sure stupid decisions get made, and usually by those that do not have to explain them.

Be kind please, money isn't everything.

Sorry, I have upmost sympathy with the staff of Aer Lingus (I have many friends there), and I think no one is even remotely suggesting we would like to see EI fail.

But when the shareholder is almost bragging that they have 8 billion in cash, yet they can't do the decent thing and give "guests" their money back (many of whom really need it right now), then they deserve to be called out on it.

They are not running those China flights for free either btw.

al2637 wrote:

But when the shareholder is almost bragging that they have 8 billion in cash, yet they can't do the decent thing and give "guests" their money back (many of whom really need it right now), then they deserve to be called out on it.

They are not running those China flights for free either btw.

Part of the survival strategy at IAG seems to be to conserve cash and operate as many flights as possible, they seem to be running quite a few cargo-only flights across the group. You can be sure these aren't charitable donations! At IAG the individual OpCos have been free to do as they wish to achieve this. BA give a voucher or Cash on request, Vueling offer a voucher (if they cancel the flight) but deny cash refunds. EI have made an incentive of 120% of the value of the flight, or cash on request. Now the end goal of all of these strategies are the same, but EI appears more customer friendly.

Elsewhere, easyJet have taken a similar view to Vueling - deny cash at all costs, ignore the inevitable cancellation until close to departure (I understand the logic of limiting customers who will need to contact the airline). Wizzair offered me 120% voucher and then converted it into 100% cash once the voucher was generated - which was immediate. As I said I have changed my FR flights to an alternate date that suits anyway. Im not sure about their refund policy - I think it was 100% cash refund within the App.

I had a booking with EI, and also a booking with BA. EI flights for mid march, BA for 10th April. Went online 14 days before travel, and requested voucher from EI - all processed and email receipt. I continued to receive all the usual "online check in" emails etc from EI, 3 weeks later, still no voucher.
BA flight for 10th April. Received email 10 days ago advising of cancellation, and money to be refunded in 7 to 10 days. BA App showed flight cancelled, and full refund given without even have to request it. Money was back in the bank 7 days after receiving the email from BA.

What do you mean it's not all about money - of course it is ALL about.money and the airline, any airline, will do what ever it can to preserve its cash pile! EI is paying staff 50% for April and May or so it reported and I am sure it will avail of ant/ all state intervention. As it should! None of the above dismisses the shocking facts of job losses and unemployment! What is a tad terrifying is that so few airlines can manage on a day to day basis - airlines are large deposit holders where the deposits are spent before the service has been provided! Of course It's all about money!

Also received a voucher from IB immediately online.
It’s issued instantly!!
EI on the other hand stating that it takes weeks to issue the voucher.

No Aer Lingus flights upcoming for me, but I'm sure the refund/voucher tactic is a common one across IAG. My BA flight on April 19th is unsurprisingly cancelled. When I attempted to claim my refund, using some sort of java script workaround published online, I found that the page auto refreshed as soon as I entered my booking number and a voucher was issued without me choosing one. I also have an upcoming Easyjet flight. so far my status is as 'checked in'.

Wizzair operate in a slightly different region, where cash tends to be king. They could cause serious damage to their brand if they were not seen to play fair and direct refund! Am impressed that Wizzair are using short haul A321 aircraft for medical supply flights to Peking and short haul A321 aircraft for repatriation flights to Chicago, Miami and other US cities. Working outside the box!!
'

Fliplot wrote:

Am impressed that Wizzair are using short haul A321 aircraft for medical supply flights to Peking Working outside the box!!
'

Same as Aegean :



Not being paid for it either its being done via private sponsorship.

—-

CityJet has no plans to appoint examiner, says CEO Byrne

THE veteran boss of Dublin-based airline CityJet has told the Irish Independent that he believes the company can avoid having an examiner appointed to the carrier despite the enormous pressure being put on the aviation sector during the coronavirus crisis.

https://amp.independent.ie/business/iri ... 99176.html

Congrats to Aegean too. Amazing what can be achieved when needs must!
EI have started to support Aer Club members too. Good to see and congratulations on the initative!

I would like to see Cityjet survive - it has been at the brink a few times already! Surely if it survives it would be well placed to get aircraft in the air quickly - especially with smaller aircraft to serve a smaller market, to begin with?

Reports that Dublin based Avolon leasing has cancelled 75 Boeing 737 MAX Aircraft.

Anyone see the EI crews on the Late Late show? Quite impressive.

alancostello wrote:

AA just announced reductions for their summer schedule, PHL-SNN and CLT-DUB are axed for this summer. ORD-DUB and PHL-DUB to resume from June 4th and October 7th, respectively. DFW-DUB from July 7th. (Though all of that is subject to further delays given what’s going).

http://news.aa.com/news/news-details/20 ... oom_Alerts

Besides AA, have any other airlines made changes affecting the entire summer schedule (i.e. complete route suspensions, delayed starts to well into peak season)? Most seem to be working on a month-by-month basis at the moment.

Interesting that Chicago and Dallas will be the AA transatlantic gateways. Seems like Philadelphia and Charlotte are both pared back substantially.

Skyblue39 wrote:

Interesting that Chicago and Dallas will be the AA transatlantic gateways. Seems like Philadelphia and Charlotte are both pared back substantially.

For PHL probably because it wasn’t authorized as one of the 13 USA entry airports for international flying for right now it’s probably why they pushed the start date to Oct.

Fliplot wrote:

Anyone see the EI crews on the Late Late show? Quite impressive.

Yes, a very impressive team! I was particularly intrigued by that captain who had been with the airline since 1979; not often you get someone in any job for 40 years, let alone as a pilot! He must have seen some changes over that time!

Amazing that SIX EI A330s were involved in this operation at the same time today.

Speaking of A330s, I saw that Willie Walsh mentioned the possibility of some of the EI A330s being retired; probably EI-LAX and 'DAA on the chopping block first. Wonder what this means for the ex-Qatar aircraft, A7-AEH/EI-EIK?

kaitak wrote:

................
Speaking of A330s, I saw that Willie Walsh mentioned the possibility of some of the EI A330s being retired; probably EI-LAX and 'DAA on the chopping block first. Wonder what this means for the ex-Qatar aircraft, A7-AEH/EI-EIK?

Doubt it will ever operate for EI. Taxied past it the other day.
Lovely new paint job on it , looked great in the sunshine but it still has A7-AEH registration.
If EI haven’t taken possession then lease may not commence.

I wonder what USA routes are likely to be culled when all this settles down? One assumes JFK, BOS, SFO & ORD will survive. I’d imagine MIA could be in trouble, perhaps EWR too if they want to consolidate NYC at JFK. Will they leave PHL to AA once they eventually join the joint venture? Probably unlikely to see 3 west coast routes if demand is as low as being predicted. No idea how MSP is performing.

British Airways ceased their Belfast City service as of Saturday 04 April and only one rotation is being operated to Heathrow each day, by Aer Lingus. No other services.

No passenger services at Aldergrove now but freight services are continuing as usual.

Passenger claims Aer Lingus staff pulled her from toilet with pants still down as flight about to take off

An Aer Lingus passenger has filed a lawsuit claiming she was injured after attendants pulled her out of an aeroplane toilet as her flight was about to take off.

American national Mary Oshana alleges she was dragged back to her seat while her pants were still below her knees, exposing her buttocks and genitalia to other passengers.

https://amp.independent.ie/irish-news/c ... 05258.html