Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
alaskan9974
Topic Author
Posts: 142
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 9:06 pm

Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Thu Apr 02, 2020 4:48 pm

I keep hearing it repeated by staff members that operations will be discontinued. Our local hub has already closed, but I don't see anything formal on it.
 
F9Animal
Posts: 4414
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 7:13 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Thu Apr 02, 2020 5:07 pm

I doubt they are closing doors. They are much needed right now to transport supplies. I'm sure they are also getting a few charters during this time for medical.

I sure hope they aren't closing. Penn Air on the other hand, that poor airline might be on the verge.
I Am A Different Animal!!
 
alaskan9974
Topic Author
Posts: 142
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 9:06 pm

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Thu Apr 02, 2020 5:12 pm

F9Animal wrote:
I doubt they are closing doors. They are much needed right now to transport supplies. I'm sure they are also getting a few charters during this time for medical.

I sure hope they aren't closing. Penn Air on the other hand, that poor airline might be on the verge.

Apparently they were just outside the scope for a bailout sizewise.

They were bleeding cash, their owners refused to offer more capital yesterday and their payroll balance is depleted today, hence the closure.
 
sprxUSA
Posts: 398
Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2004 5:17 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Thu Apr 02, 2020 5:58 pm

F9Animal wrote:
I doubt they are closing doors. They are much needed right now to transport supplies. I'm sure they are also getting a few charters during this time for medical.

I sure hope they aren't closing. Penn Air on the other hand, that poor airline might be on the verge.


Well since they are under the same ownership umbrella, really wouldn't help 7H at all.
Does Ravn get a lot of EAS $$ from DoT? I am assuming so. I would think that that would put them in a better position to get SOMETHING from the gov't. Perhaps they feel they get enough subsidy.
Seems to be the thing in Alaska. Larger carrier folds, small one builds up and repeats the cycle, then another etc. Perhaps it is Grant Aviation's turn to get too big, then Bering Air, and so on.

Reminds me of California late 70s to mid 80s: Golden West and Golden Gate were larger, WestAir and Wings West were still flying 402s. Then GW and GG fail, WIngs West and WestAir become the two big dogs, and then falter as codesharing came along and altered their model.

Always too bad to see a line fail. Flew them a couple of trips (as ERA ANC-ENA r/t DHT and as Frontier Flying Service ANC-FAI o/w BE1) nice operation from my viewpoint.
Gem State Airlines..."we have a gem of an airline"
 
drdisque
Posts: 1272
Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2007 9:57 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Thu Apr 02, 2020 6:04 pm

Ravn did NOT have many EAS routes. EAS probably made up only 15-20% of their revenue.

Looks like ACE will be left picking up the slack and maybe that's for the better as they seem to be much better run.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4805
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Thu Apr 02, 2020 6:17 pm

They gone without a bailout. They ready parked all the penair planes. All the dash’s will be parked any minute
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4805
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Thu Apr 02, 2020 6:18 pm

F9Animal wrote:
I doubt they are closing doors. They are much needed right now to transport supplies. I'm sure they are also getting a few charters during this time for medical.

I sure hope they aren't closing. Penn Air on the other hand, that poor airline might be on the verge.

Penair is owned by ravn and is already closed.
 
alaskan9974
Topic Author
Posts: 142
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 9:06 pm

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Thu Apr 02, 2020 6:44 pm

I heard this morning also, that corporate gave their pilots word this morning to fully fuel all aircraft in rural hubs, and fly them to Palmer. I see a bunch from all over the state headed that way now on flight radar.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4805
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Thu Apr 02, 2020 6:45 pm

alaskan9974 wrote:
I heard this morning also, that corporate gave their pilots word this morning to fully fuel all aircraft in rural hubs, and fly them to Palmer. I see a bunch from all over the state headed that way now on flight radar.

Hagelands done. A couple dash 8s are gonna fly for now.
 
User avatar
EA CO AS
Posts: 15697
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2001 8:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Thu Apr 02, 2020 6:55 pm

So sad to see what was once a robust series of intra-AK carriers gone or nearing failure. PenAir, Era, Hageland, Frontier Flying Service, LAB, Reeve...
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
hiflyeras
Posts: 2227
Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 6:48 pm

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Thu Apr 02, 2020 7:13 pm

Sad news...especially for the staff and their customers in the small villages in Alaska.
 
User avatar
usxguy
Posts: 1859
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 1:28 pm

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Thu Apr 02, 2020 8:31 pm

Just hit the ADN

But it doesn't appear to be a total shut down..

https://www.adn.com/alaska-news/aviatio ... ommunities
xx
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4805
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Thu Apr 02, 2020 9:00 pm

usxguy wrote:
Just hit the ADN

But it doesn't appear to be a total shut down..

https://www.adn.com/alaska-news/aviatio ... ommunities

The last 3 planes will be parked any day if they don’t get cash. They already parked all Saab 2000s and now all b190s and smaller planes. We’re talking dozens of 135 planes.
 
alaskan9974
Topic Author
Posts: 142
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2011 9:06 pm

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 3:33 pm

usxguy wrote:
Just hit the ADN

But it doesn't appear to be a total shut down..

https://www.adn.com/alaska-news/aviatio ... ommunities

It will be soon if they don’t get cash.
 
Chugach
Posts: 1317
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 10:18 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 4:18 pm

Sad day. Ravn, for all its issues, was/is a vital link for many rural Alaskans. If the end of 7H is truly near it also means that AS will lose some feed at ANC; I wonder if we might see some kind of interline with GV to help fill the gap. In a perfect world it would be nice to see AS send a few Q400’s back north and handle the ENA, HOM, and VDZ flying on their own but that presents a host of logistical issues, mainly that there isn’t any TSA at those airports.

This also means DUT has no passenger service. Not an insignificant issue considering the economic importance of Dutch Harbor.
 
User avatar
JBo
Posts: 1748
Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2005 7:23 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 4:25 pm

Chugach wrote:
In a perfect world it would be nice to see AS send a few Q400’s back north and handle the ENA, HOM, and VDZ flying on their own but that presents a host of logistical issues, mainly that there isn’t any TSA at those airports.


I'm pretty sure that QX could operate those flights under 135 rules and just screen pax and luggage in ANC, just as these other carriers have done, but I'm not certain on that.

Also: is PenAir directly owned by the Ravn Group? I couldn't find any info that shows where they had been acquired by Corvus or any of the other Ravn companies, just that Ravn had taken over PenAir's ticketing.

If PenAir is still financially independent from Ravn Group, they could presumably remain in operation.
I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day.
 
gmcc
Posts: 334
Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2006 3:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 4:58 pm

Chugach wrote:
Sad day. Ravn, for all its issues, was/is a vital link for many rural Alaskans. If the end of 7H is truly near it also means that AS will lose some feed at ANC; I wonder if we might see some kind of interline with GV to help fill the gap. In a perfect world it would be nice to see AS send a few Q400’s back north and handle the ENA, HOM, and VDZ flying on their own but that presents a host of logistical issues, mainly that there isn’t any TSA at those airports.

This also means DUT has no passenger service. Not an insignificant issue considering the economic importance of Dutch Harbor.


Wonder if de havilland still would be able to make the combi Q400 that bombardier did.

https://www.bombardier.com/en/media/new ... ercom.html

Seems like a pretty good solution, not immediate but I bet a business case could be made. Ifnot a new build maybe they could convert one of QX's retired frames collecting dust in the desert.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 7776
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 5:00 pm

alaskan9974 wrote:
usxguy wrote:
Just hit the ADN

But it doesn't appear to be a total shut down..

https://www.adn.com/alaska-news/aviatio ... ommunities

It will be soon if they don’t get cash.


The deadline for applying for CARES payroll grant cash is 5PM Eastern today. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-heal ... 1L2AL?il=0
 
User avatar
NameOmitted
Posts: 860
Joined: Sun Oct 23, 2016 7:59 pm

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 5:07 pm

Does anyone have insight as to specificity why QX left Alaska?
 
User avatar
usxguy
Posts: 1859
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 1:28 pm

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 5:27 pm

the passengers hated the Q400 when they used to have a 737....
xx
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4805
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 5:29 pm

The planes were extremely unreliable in the cold.
 
drdisque
Posts: 1272
Joined: Mon Mar 26, 2007 9:57 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 5:36 pm

gmcc wrote:
Chugach wrote:
Sad day. Ravn, for all its issues, was/is a vital link for many rural Alaskans. If the end of 7H is truly near it also means that AS will lose some feed at ANC; I wonder if we might see some kind of interline with GV to help fill the gap. In a perfect world it would be nice to see AS send a few Q400’s back north and handle the ENA, HOM, and VDZ flying on their own but that presents a host of logistical issues, mainly that there isn’t any TSA at those airports.

This also means DUT has no passenger service. Not an insignificant issue considering the economic importance of Dutch Harbor.


Wonder if de havilland still would be able to make the combi Q400 that bombardier did.

https://www.bombardier.com/en/media/new ... ercom.html

Seems like a pretty good solution, not immediate but I bet a business case could be made. Ifnot a new build maybe they could convert one of QX's retired frames collecting dust in the desert.


DUT was without service for a few weeks a few months ago after the PenAir crash, but that was when Ravn was still flying their Dash 8's. Fitting everything on a B1900 will be difficult. ACE may see very high utilization or wingtip flights (one for pax one for baggage and cargo).
 
durangomac
Posts: 442
Joined: Fri Dec 08, 2006 5:18 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 5:36 pm

NameOmitted wrote:
Does anyone have insight as to specificity why QX left Alaska?


The operation wasn't cost effective, the operation just didn't make money.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4805
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 7:15 pm

I’m pretty sure they are still flying to cdb/sdp/dut for now.
 
User avatar
usxguy
Posts: 1859
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 1:28 pm

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 7:22 pm

DUT was axed
xx
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4805
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 7:36 pm

usxguy wrote:
DUT was axed

The article was wrong. You can still book on fly ravn.
 
MO11
Posts: 1413
Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2017 5:07 pm

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 8:32 pm

32andBelow wrote:
usxguy wrote:
DUT was axed

The article was wrong. You can still book on fly ravn.


According to the Unalaska radio station, the city was advised by the airline that DUT was being dropped.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4805
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 8:40 pm

MO11 wrote:
32andBelow wrote:
usxguy wrote:
DUT was axed

The article was wrong. You can still book on fly ravn.


According to the Unalaska radio station, the city was advised by the airline that DUT was being dropped.

That’s not what I was told by people that work there. But who knows at this point. I think all the routes will be dropped if they don’t get a cash injection within a week.
 
Chugach
Posts: 1317
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 10:18 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 9:20 pm

32andBelow wrote:
usxguy wrote:
DUT was axed

The article was wrong. You can still book on fly ravn.


Ravn told the Unalaska city manager they were leaving by today (Friday).
 
Chugach
Posts: 1317
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 10:18 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 9:24 pm

NameOmitted wrote:
Does anyone have insight as to specificity why QX left Alaska?


The passengers hated them on ANC-FAI and it didn’t make sense to orphan three Q400’s in ANC to essentially fly two routes (one in summer). AS took a ton of flak and bad PR from the Fairbanks community when they pulled the jets out of most of their FAI frequencies.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4805
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 10:05 pm

Chugach wrote:
NameOmitted wrote:
Does anyone have insight as to specificity why QX left Alaska?


The passengers hated them on ANC-FAI and it didn’t make sense to orphan three Q400’s in ANC to essentially fly two routes (one in summer). AS took a ton of flak and bad PR from the Fairbanks community when they pulled the jets out of most of their FAI frequencies.

They would have stayed if they were reliable. They would have expanded even. It really makes no sense they haven’t moved e175s to AK for routes like ADK. You could rotate them through southeast or fai/sea and they wouldn’t be orphaned.
 
Chugach
Posts: 1317
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 10:18 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 10:47 pm

32andBelow wrote:
Chugach wrote:
NameOmitted wrote:
Does anyone have insight as to specificity why QX left Alaska?


The passengers hated them on ANC-FAI and it didn’t make sense to orphan three Q400’s in ANC to essentially fly two routes (one in summer). AS took a ton of flak and bad PR from the Fairbanks community when they pulled the jets out of most of their FAI frequencies.

They would have stayed if they were reliable. They would have expanded even. It really makes no sense they haven’t moved e175s to AK for routes like ADK. You could rotate them through southeast or fai/sea and they wouldn’t be orphaned.


The reliability was the other issue. They had three planes with limited capability for maintenance without flying them empty back to PDX.

I too am a bit surprised the 175’s haven’t found their way north. They can’t replace the cargo capacity of the 737’s but they can provide some extra lift in the summer and also give them the capability to try some off the wall routes like, for example, PDX-JNU or SEA-ADQ, or bring back stuff like PDX-FAI or GEG-ANC.
 
rojo
Posts: 2308
Joined: Tue Sep 05, 2000 6:08 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 10:54 pm

I don't blame Ravn for reducing their schedule to the minimum. How can you make money if the following restrictions are in place?

Travel within Alaska
Effective March 28, 2020 all in-state travel between communities is prohibited (whether resident, worker, or visitor) unless travel is to support critical infrastructure, or for critical personal needs.

This mandate is in effect until and will be re-evaluated on April 11, 2020.


Their big problem is the USPS mail contract. USPS contracts have huge penalties for not delivering on time or on schedule (cancellations or delays). Flying with little to no passengers just to deliver mail is wasting money. Better to park aircraft and avoid bleeding cash.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4805
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Fri Apr 03, 2020 11:53 pm

rojo wrote:
I don't blame Ravn for reducing their schedule to the minimum. How can you make money if the following restrictions are in place?

Travel within Alaska
Effective March 28, 2020 all in-state travel between communities is prohibited (whether resident, worker, or visitor) unless travel is to support critical infrastructure, or for critical personal needs.

This mandate is in effect until and will be re-evaluated on April 11, 2020.


Their big problem is the USPS mail contract. USPS contracts have huge penalties for not delivering on time or on schedule (cancellations or delays). Flying with little to no passengers just to deliver mail is wasting money. Better to park aircraft and avoid bleeding cash.

Congress needs to help them. They don’t fit into any of the parameters of the airline bailout yet they have all the same challenges with way less cash!
 
User avatar
usxguy
Posts: 1859
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 1:28 pm

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 12:50 am

Well all of the DUT/ANC flights are zero'd out in Sabre... so if they aren't cancelled, then they have the busiest in-state route in Alaska right now.
xx
 
rojo
Posts: 2308
Joined: Tue Sep 05, 2000 6:08 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 3:35 am

usxguy wrote:
Well all of the DUT/ANC flights are zero'd out in Sabre... so if they aren't cancelled, then they have the busiest in-state route in Alaska right now.


There is availability between ANC and DUT on 4/6 7H764 operated by a DH8. Looks like they will not fly on Sat, Sun and Thu during the month of April. It goes back to daily in May
 
User avatar
aemoreira1981
Posts: 3533
Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2017 12:17 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 1:20 pm

With all of the Dash 8s being parked, I have to wonder if de Havilland Canada will see a market for a combi conversion for Dash 8s. There is already a new build combi option available...Ryukyu Air Commuter in Japan operates 5 of these, needing just one flight attendant. This would be optimal for many Alaskan and northern Canadian airfields, and could replace the DH8A/B as well on these runs, with cargo capability.
 
Aliqiout
Posts: 374
Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2016 6:10 pm

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:02 pm

Chugach wrote:
32andBelow wrote:
Chugach wrote:

The passengers hated them on ANC-FAI and it didn’t make sense to orphan three Q400’s in ANC to essentially fly two routes (one in summer). AS took a ton of flak and bad PR from the Fairbanks community when they pulled the jets out of most of their FAI frequencies.

They would have stayed if they were reliable. They would have expanded even. It really makes no sense they haven’t moved e175s to AK for routes like ADK. You could rotate them through southeast or fai/sea and they wouldn’t be orphaned.


The reliability was the other issue. They had three planes with limited capability for maintenance without flying them empty back to PDX.

I too am a bit surprised the 175’s haven’t found their way north. They can’t replace the cargo capacity of the 737’s but they can provide some extra lift in the summer and also give them the capability to try some off the wall routes like, for example, PDX-JNU or SEA-ADQ, or bring back stuff like PDX-FAI or GEG-ANC.

e175s are not certified to operate when the ground temperature is -40 or colder, they would be fine in ANC and SE, but not practical in FAI. Maybe they could be used for added frequency in the summer?
 
Chugach
Posts: 1317
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 10:18 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 2:48 pm

Aliqiout wrote:
Chugach wrote:
32andBelow wrote:
They would have stayed if they were reliable. They would have expanded even. It really makes no sense they haven’t moved e175s to AK for routes like ADK. You could rotate them through southeast or fai/sea and they wouldn’t be orphaned.


The reliability was the other issue. They had three planes with limited capability for maintenance without flying them empty back to PDX.

I too am a bit surprised the 175’s haven’t found their way north. They can’t replace the cargo capacity of the 737’s but they can provide some extra lift in the summer and also give them the capability to try some off the wall routes like, for example, PDX-JNU or SEA-ADQ, or bring back stuff like PDX-FAI or GEG-ANC.

e175s are not certified to operate when the ground temperature is -40 or colder, they would be fine in ANC and SE, but not practical in FAI. Maybe they could be used for added frequency in the summer?


That is the point I was trying to get at. DL has used the 175 in FAI in winter in prior years but a once-daily from SEA is different from trying to build a trunk operation within the state.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 7776
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 3:00 pm

32andBelow wrote:
Congress needs to help them. They don’t fit into any of the parameters of the airline bailout yet they have all the same challenges with way less cash!


How do they not fit the parameters of the airline bailout? Maybe they've furloughed people already.

U.S. Mail is going to get delivered - no matter the cost. The State of Alaska will subsidize a carrier(s) to ensure freight and passenger operations (although they'd surely rather do it with Federal money). They're not going to say 'Go die' to dozens of villages.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4805
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 4:36 pm

Aliqiout wrote:
Chugach wrote:
32andBelow wrote:
They would have stayed if they were reliable. They would have expanded even. It really makes no sense they haven’t moved e175s to AK for routes like ADK. You could rotate them through southeast or fai/sea and they wouldn’t be orphaned.


The reliability was the other issue. They had three planes with limited capability for maintenance without flying them empty back to PDX.

I too am a bit surprised the 175’s haven’t found their way north. They can’t replace the cargo capacity of the 737’s but they can provide some extra lift in the summer and also give them the capability to try some off the wall routes like, for example, PDX-JNU or SEA-ADQ, or bring back stuff like PDX-FAI or GEG-ANC.

e175s are not certified to operate when the ground temperature is -40 or colder, they would be fine in ANC and SE, but not practical in FAI. Maybe they could be used for added frequency in the summer?

You aren’t going to find many aircrafts that are certified to work at temps less than -40.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4805
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 4:38 pm

Chugach wrote:
Aliqiout wrote:
Chugach wrote:

The reliability was the other issue. They had three planes with limited capability for maintenance without flying them empty back to PDX.

I too am a bit surprised the 175’s haven’t found their way north. They can’t replace the cargo capacity of the 737’s but they can provide some extra lift in the summer and also give them the capability to try some off the wall routes like, for example, PDX-JNU or SEA-ADQ, or bring back stuff like PDX-FAI or GEG-ANC.

e175s are not certified to operate when the ground temperature is -40 or colder, they would be fine in ANC and SE, but not practical in FAI. Maybe they could be used for added frequency in the summer?


That is the point I was trying to get at. DL has used the 175 in FAI in winter in prior years but a once-daily from SEA is different from trying to build a trunk operation within the state.
DL uses BCS1 on SEAFAI now. Just shows how many different tools they got on they’re medium and thin routes.
 
Chugach
Posts: 1317
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 10:18 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 4:38 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
The State of Alaska will subsidize a carrier(s) to ensure freight and passenger operations (although they'd surely rather do it with Federal money). They're not going to say 'Go die' to dozens of villages.


You probably haven’t been following Alaska politics for the last couple of years...(not that I would expect you or anyone else who doesn’t have AK ties). It takes a special kind of governor to get both sides of the aisle to detest you.

The USPS is already contracting with cargo carriers to provide mail service...ACE, Northern Air Cargo, etc.

Passenger service is a different story. Ravn has been a mess for years. If they go away completely there’s not an obvious candidate that can step in and fill the void. Even if they don’t go away, I’d have a hard time envisioning them doing much more than their historic core routes...ENA/HOM/VDZ/ADQ to feed AS at ANC.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4805
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 7:14 pm

Chugach wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
The State of Alaska will subsidize a carrier(s) to ensure freight and passenger operations (although they'd surely rather do it with Federal money). They're not going to say 'Go die' to dozens of villages.


You probably haven’t been following Alaska politics for the last couple of years...(not that I would expect you or anyone else who doesn’t have AK ties). It takes a special kind of governor to get both sides of the aisle to detest you.

The USPS is already contracting with cargo carriers to provide mail service...ACE, Northern Air Cargo, etc.

Passenger service is a different story. Ravn has been a mess for years. If they go away completely there’s not an obvious candidate that can step in and fill the void. Even if they don’t go away, I’d have a hard time envisioning them doing much more than their historic core routes...ENA/HOM/VDZ/ADQ to feed AS at ANC.

The state has no money due to 20 dollar oil. I don’t understand why they’d ever fly to adq against AS. It’s redic. I wonder if seyberts are trying to get a group together to get their Saab’s back. I wouldn’t be totally surprised.
 
User avatar
usxguy
Posts: 1859
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 1:28 pm

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 8:37 pm

Well Danny parked the 135 the moment his dad stepped away from the PenAir ops.

State of Alaska *will* need to step in, since they pay for Medicaid/Medicare travel in Alaska... add in DPS/Troopers, etc.

I'm still in shock that Ravn didn't at least cut frequencies. The Canadian carriers are keeping all points connected in Canada, albeit with frequency cuts. Even Old Crow is seeing at least 3 flights a week to Whitehorse.
xx
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4805
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 9:02 pm

usxguy wrote:
Well Danny parked the 135 the moment his dad stepped away from the PenAir ops.

State of Alaska *will* need to step in, since they pay for Medicaid/Medicare travel in Alaska... add in DPS/Troopers, etc.

I'm still in shock that Ravn didn't at least cut frequencies. The Canadian carriers are keeping all points connected in Canada, albeit with frequency cuts. Even Old Crow is seeing at least 3 flights a week to Whitehorse.

I think ravn is going to be 100% tits up within 2 weeks if they don’t get a lifeline. They’re grounding of Penair a week ago and laying off basically that whole company went pretty under the radar
 
Chugach
Posts: 1317
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 10:18 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Sat Apr 04, 2020 11:54 pm

usxguy wrote:
Well Danny parked the 135 the moment his dad stepped away from the PenAir ops.

State of Alaska *will* need to step in, since they pay for Medicaid/Medicare travel in Alaska... add in DPS/Troopers, etc.

I'm still in shock that Ravn didn't at least cut frequencies. The Canadian carriers are keeping all points connected in Canada, albeit with frequency cuts. Even Old Crow is seeing at least 3 flights a week to Whitehorse.


I’d say Alaska and Yukon are like apples and oranges when it comes to air service needs. You can count one one hand plus a finger the number of Yukon communities that currently have scheduled air service from Air North, and Yukon has about 5% of the population that Alaska has. Far easier to cut frequencies and maintain destinations in those circumstances.

Hindsight is 20/20, but if Ravn had kept its core flying in Southcentral Alaska and not tried to be a bush carrier they’d probably be a lot better off now. Rural Alaska flying is a ton of work with little financial upside.
 
Aliqiout
Posts: 374
Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2016 6:10 pm

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:12 am

32andBelow wrote:
Aliqiout wrote:
Chugach wrote:

The reliability was the other issue. They had three planes with limited capability for maintenance without flying them empty back to PDX.

I too am a bit surprised the 175’s haven’t found their way north. They can’t replace the cargo capacity of the 737’s but they can provide some extra lift in the summer and also give them the capability to try some off the wall routes like, for example, PDX-JNU or SEA-ADQ, or bring back stuff like PDX-FAI or GEG-ANC.

e175s are not certified to operate when the ground temperature is -40 or colder, they would be fine in ANC and SE, but not practical in FAI. Maybe they could be used for added frequency in the summer?

You aren’t going to find many aircrafts that are certified to work at temps less than -40.

The Q400, and all the 737s and CRJs are.
 
MO11
Posts: 1413
Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2017 5:07 pm

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:07 am

Chugach wrote:

Hindsight is 20/20, but if Ravn had kept its core flying in Southcentral Alaska and not tried to be a bush carrier they’d probably be a lot better off now. Rural Alaska flying is a ton of work with little financial upside.


It's actually the other way around. The "bush carrier" bought out ERA Alaska in 2009.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 4805
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Ravn Alaska closing its doors?

Sun Apr 05, 2020 1:22 am

Aliqiout wrote:
32andBelow wrote:
Aliqiout wrote:
e175s are not certified to operate when the ground temperature is -40 or colder, they would be fine in ANC and SE, but not practical in FAI. Maybe they could be used for added frequency in the summer?

You aren’t going to find many aircrafts that are certified to work at temps less than -40.

The Q400, and all the 737s and CRJs are.

If they went to bombardier they can probably get performance numbers below -40. The Saab 340 couldn’t go below -35 and flew to mcg. Can count on one hand the amount of flights that were canceled due to cold.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos