Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
flyingqueen
Topic Author
Posts: 54
Joined: Sun Oct 27, 2013 5:54 pm

TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 12:58 am

I could not find the topic anywhere, and cannot seem to paste the GDS upload, but seems like TAP loaded new destinations over the weekend. I think this is a very bold and good move, and PDL-BOS must be doing well. From their GDS load, it seems:

a) PDL-YYZ, 2/week, ...4..7, 321-LR, eff. June 25
b) LIS-AGA, 4/week, 1...567, AT7, eff. October 26
c) LIS-CPT, 3/week, ..3.5.7, 339, eff. November 11
d) LIS-CUN, 3/week, .2.4.6., 339, eff. October 27

Great positive news.
 
Ishrion
Posts: 2556
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:17 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 1:00 am

Doesn’t TAP codeshare with Azores on PDL-YYZ? I remember seeing it bookable on TAP’s website.

Pretty ambitious given the conditions. Hoping to see these... survive.

PDL-YYZ on TAP appears to be bookable, LIS-CPT/CUN are not.
 
x1234
Posts: 799
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2016 3:50 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 1:28 am

Launching CPT was purely for tourism I guess as all the high yield traffic in Africa is in JNB. They should launch JNB ASAP. CUN is a leisure route as well but they should also launch MEX (yields on par with GRU).
 
User avatar
RWA380
Posts: 5697
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 10:51 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 1:56 am

x1234 wrote:
Launching CPT was purely for tourism I guess as all the high yield traffic in Africa is in JNB. They should launch JNB ASAP. CUN is a leisure route as well but they should also launch MEX (yields on par with GRU).


Not at all, there's a very good amount of premium travelers from CPT. I know some, they are in my immediate family. Several worked for DeBeers over the years & with a home in Capetown & another in Colorado, My one cousin is often transiting. My other cousin keeps a Capetown home & lives in Toronto. The UA add to EWR was very welcome & the service passed their muster with flying colors.

I guess what I am saying, there is a not very small demographic of wealthy in Capetown that are senior executives or retirees, that wanted to stay in one of the best places South Africa has to offer.
707 717 720 727-1/2 737-1/2/3/4/5/6/7/8/9 747-1/2/3/4 757-2/3 767-2/3/4 777-2/3 DC8 DC9 MD80/2/7/8 D10-1/3/4 M11 L10-1/2/5 A300/310/320
AA AC AQ AS BA BD BN CO CS DL EA EZ HA HG HP KL KN MP MW NK NW OZ PA PS QX RC RH RW SA TG TW UA US VS WA WC WN WP YS 8M
 
Williamsb747
Posts: 140
Joined: Fri May 17, 2019 9:14 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 6:34 am

Some good news in these grim times. Can’t wait to see TAP down here in CPT. Wonder how long they going to have their planes sit in CPT, anybody have the timetable for these flights I can’t seem to find it?
B747>A340>A350>B777>MD11>B767>B757>MD88/90>B787>A380>A330>A220>A320>B737.
CPT JNB
 
raylee67
Posts: 845
Joined: Mon Oct 24, 2011 11:06 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 6:54 am

Any new flights is good news nowadays. Congrats TAP!
319/20/21 332/33 342/43/45 359/51 388 707 717 732/36/3G/38/39 74R/42/43/44/4E/48 757 762/63 772/7L/73/7W 788/89 D10 M80 135/40/45 175/90 DH1/4 CRJ/R7 L10
AY LH OU SR BA FI
AA DL UA NW AC CP WS FL NK PD
CI NH SQ KA CX JL BR OZ TG KE CA CZ NZ JQ RS
 
MAH4546
Posts: 26123
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 7:13 am

Williamsb747 wrote:
Some good news in these grim times. Can’t wait to see TAP down here in CPT. Wonder how long they going to have their planes sit in CPT, anybody have the timetable for these flights I can’t seem to find it?


Not long its a turn-around. Daylight down, overnight back.
a.
 
Williamsb747
Posts: 140
Joined: Fri May 17, 2019 9:14 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 7:16 am

MAH4546 wrote:
Williamsb747 wrote:
Some good news in these grim times. Can’t wait to see TAP down here in CPT. Wonder how long they going to have their planes sit in CPT, anybody have the timetable for these flights I can’t seem to find it?


Not long its a turn-around. Daylight down, overnight back.

Thank you. So it is similar to KL/OS/AF flight down to CPT then?
B747>A340>A350>B777>MD11>B767>B757>MD88/90>B787>A380>A330>A220>A320>B737.
CPT JNB
 
a350lover
Posts: 848
Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2017 11:21 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 7:48 am

TAP is heavily capitalized by public funds. They are trying hard to overtake IB as the South-West European hub towards America. They indeed have a remarkable presence in USA and Africas. South America won't be easy and I don't see them in MEX or EZE (high yield markets) for instance. They already tried BOG and failed. CUN is purely leisure, so is CPT and rest of the announcements.
 
abrelosojos
Posts: 4302
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 6:48 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 8:34 am

a350lover wrote:
TAP is heavily capitalized by public funds. They are trying hard to overtake IB as the South-West European hub towards America. They indeed have a remarkable presence in USA and Africas. South America won't be easy and I don't see them in MEX or EZE (high yield markets) for instance. They already tried BOG and failed. CUN is purely leisure, so is CPT and rest of the announcements.


= This is not true. TAP has not had any public funds, and cannot access it under EU rules. Happy to be proved wrong via facts. Post COVID, I am sure they will receive some form of government funds access like other airlines.

Smart move by a smart team. As I have said before, TAP has one of Europe's most diverse senior leadership, and they know how to take risks. As someone else has said, given Brazil going south, I like the diversity of approach. I think CUN and CPT are both dependant on broad origin markets and this shields them from risk. It is smart to start PDL-YYZ as this is a VFR market, and TAP probably calculated that VFR demand comes back before anything else.

Saludos,
Alex
Live, and let live.
 
Kadish
Posts: 369
Joined: Thu Aug 31, 2017 11:36 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 9:04 am

[threeid][/threeid]
a350lover wrote:
TAP is heavily capitalized by public funds. They are trying hard to overtake IB as the South-West European hub towards America. They indeed have a remarkable presence in USA and Africas. South America won't be easy and I don't see them in MEX or EZE (high yield markets) for instance. They already tried BOG and failed. CUN is purely leisure, so is CPT and rest of the announcements.


I dont think they can overtake IB specially id they finally buy UX.
The y will have multiple flights At very different hours throuhout the day so they may play with prices At their will
 
Kikko19
Posts: 676
Joined: Sat Apr 22, 2017 4:45 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 10:27 am

Kadish wrote:
[threeid][/threeid]
a350lover wrote:
TAP is heavily capitalized by public funds. They are trying hard to overtake IB as the South-West European hub towards America. They indeed have a remarkable presence in USA and Africas. South America won't be easy and I don't see them in MEX or EZE (high yield markets) for instance. They already tried BOG and failed. CUN is purely leisure, so is CPT and rest of the announcements.


I dont think they can overtake IB specially id they finally buy UX.
The y will have multiple flights At very different hours throuhout the day so they may play with prices At their will


the largest problem for TP is LIS airport.
 
Nicknuzzii
Posts: 995
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2018 5:57 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 11:51 am

Why have they never tried PDL-EWR?
 
jfk777
Posts: 7321
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 12:07 pm

Argentina has a basket case economy but there is demand there, the whose who of European airlines fly there. EZE is the second most important destination in South America, TAP should definitely be flying there. MEX is another one it should fly to & Panama since Copa can feed them and no conflict since Copa only flis 737's.
 
airbazar
Posts: 10083
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 12:45 pm

I'm not sure the A339 would be able to fly JNB-LIS. I could be wrong.
Dropping BOG was part of the new ownership's strategy to expand in North America first. There were some problems with BOG. IIRC they had to fly the return route via PTY because of the altitude of BOG. "Today" TAP does a lot of its Latin America connections via MIA.
 
asuflyer
Posts: 536
Joined: Mon Jan 01, 2007 12:48 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 12:59 pm

Nicknuzzii wrote:
Why have they never tried PDL-EWR?


PDL flights support the diaspora from the Azores which have sizable populations in YYZ, BOS/PVD area. The EWR flights target the overall NYC market and large Portuguese population in NJ that has their origins primarily in Porto and Lisbon. DL tried JFK-PDL and it lasted 2 summers only.
 
airbazar
Posts: 10083
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 1:25 pm

asuflyer wrote:
Nicknuzzii wrote:
Why have they never tried PDL-EWR?


PDL flights support the diaspora from the Azores which have sizable populations in YYZ, BOS/PVD area. The EWR flights target the overall NYC market and large Portuguese population in NJ that has their origins primarily in Porto and Lisbon. DL tried JFK-PDL and it lasted 2 summers only.


EWR-PDL could work for an airline like Azores Airlines if - and this is a big 'if' - they could provide a decent, reliable service with onward connections to Madeira, Morocco, and Canarias.
However I suspect that with TP entering the PDL-BOS and PDL-YYZ market, that will spell the end of Azores Airlines because I don't think they have in them to think beyond their legacy core market. As they say in business, those that do not adapt to change....
 
ryan78
Posts: 355
Joined: Tue Mar 02, 2010 1:29 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 1:34 pm

Looks like they had a bit of an error fare when opening up the YYZ-PDL flights. Apparently some fares were going for as low as $137 CAD ($98 USD) round-trip. Looks like they've corrected it though as the fares are around $450-500 CAD now. Interesting adds, nice to see CUN get more European service as well. Those A339's are good looking birds.

https://www.secretflying.com/posts/toro ... roundtrip/
 
SCQ83
Posts: 5665
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 8:32 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 1:39 pm

LIS-AGA was a joke before Coronavirus, now it is simply unbelievable. The good news is that that means LIS-SCQ will be started no matter what :D (although I has been pushed back for about 3 weeks from early to late June).

jfk777 wrote:
Argentina has a basket case economy but there is demand there, the whose who of European airlines fly there. EZE is the second most important destination in South America, TAP should definitely be flying there. MEX is another one it should fly to & Panama since Copa can feed them and no conflict since Copa only flis 737's.


Indeed. Spain-EZE doesn't have many 1-stop options. Unless you connect via Western Europe (huge detour), or GRU (Latam) there are not many "logical" one stop options. LIS-EZE could connect with all the Spanish portfolio. BCN has a huge Argentinian diaspora and even SCQ-EZE is relatively important (at some point there were non-stop flights in summer), in addition to the obvious MAD-LIS-EZE connections. Also EZE is more varied that just a VFR place; it has leisure and VFR both directions and business.
 
boeingbus
Posts: 1542
Joined: Sat May 29, 2004 12:37 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 3:12 pm

I still don't understand why they don't offer BOS to OPO on the A321. It's a missed opportunity, offering service to Northern Portugal and Galicia.
Airbus or Boeing - it's all good to me!
 
danielribo
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2005 12:02 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 3:33 pm

Just booked a one-way LIS-CPT for November. $270USD so a total bargain. I can suffer economy for a civil daytime flight.
 
x1234
Posts: 799
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2016 3:50 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 3:37 pm

I'm also surprised TAP didn't launch LAX yet.
 
FSDan
Posts: 3186
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 5:48 pm

asuflyer wrote:
Nicknuzzii wrote:
Why have they never tried PDL-EWR?


PDL flights support the diaspora from the Azores which have sizable populations in YYZ, BOS/PVD area. The EWR flights target the overall NYC market and large Portuguese population in NJ that has their origins primarily in Porto and Lisbon. DL tried JFK-PDL and it lasted 2 summers only.


Actually, DL's JFK-PDL only lasted one summer - 2019.

The other significant Azorean diaspora I'm aware of is in Northern California (hence S4's 1x weekly OAK-TER flight that operated for years).
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
User avatar
chepos
Posts: 7274
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2000 9:40 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 6:54 pm

FSDan wrote:
asuflyer wrote:
Nicknuzzii wrote:
Why have they never tried PDL-EWR?


PDL flights support the diaspora from the Azores which have sizable populations in YYZ, BOS/PVD area. The EWR flights target the overall NYC market and large Portuguese population in NJ that has their origins primarily in Porto and Lisbon. DL tried JFK-PDL and it lasted 2 summers only.


Actually, DL's JFK-PDL only lasted one summer - 2019.

The other significant Azorean diaspora I'm aware of is in Northern California (hence S4's 1x weekly OAK-TER flight that operated for years).

JFK-PDL on DL was launched in 2018, returned in 2019 and was canned at the end of the season for summer 19.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Fly the Flag!!!!
 
FSDan
Posts: 3186
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2011 5:27 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 6:58 pm

chepos wrote:
FSDan wrote:
asuflyer wrote:

PDL flights support the diaspora from the Azores which have sizable populations in YYZ, BOS/PVD area. The EWR flights target the overall NYC market and large Portuguese population in NJ that has their origins primarily in Porto and Lisbon. DL tried JFK-PDL and it lasted 2 summers only.


Actually, DL's JFK-PDL only lasted one summer - 2019.

The other significant Azorean diaspora I'm aware of is in Northern California (hence S4's 1x weekly OAK-TER flight that operated for years).

JFK-PDL on DL was launched in 2018, returned in 2019 and was canned at the end of the season for summer 19.


I stand corrected - how time flies!
This is my signature until I think of a better one.
 
Galwayman
Posts: 884
Joined: Fri Mar 10, 2017 10:20 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 10:49 pm

a350lover wrote:
TAP is heavily capitalized by public funds. They are trying hard to overtake IB as the South-West European hub towards America. They indeed have a remarkable presence in USA and Africas. South America won't be easy and I don't see them in MEX or EZE (high yield markets) for instance. They already tried BOG and failed. CUN is purely leisure, so is CPT and rest of the announcements.



- Mex (North America) > Spain via Lis is a no brainier at some stage
- yields on CPT with connections onwards are probably as good as JNB , perfectly explains the short time on the ground
- PTY with codeshares on Copa possibly JV would be very very interesting
- CUN is clearly aimed at connections from Spain

Wish TP every success , they’re one of the most interesting airlines to watch
 
User avatar
qf789
Moderator
Posts: 10933
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2015 3:42 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 11:18 pm

Could we please just discuss the topic and keep personal comments towards other users out of the discussion
Forum Moderator
 
Sancho
Posts: 18
Joined: Fri Apr 05, 2019 5:26 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Tue Apr 07, 2020 11:19 pm

flyingqueen wrote:
I could not find the topic anywhere, and cannot seem to paste the GDS upload, but seems like TAP loaded new destinations over the weekend. I think this is a very bold and good move, and PDL-BOS must be doing well. From their GDS load, it seems:

a) PDL-YYZ, 2/week, ...4..7, 321-LR, eff. June 25
b) LIS-AGA, 4/week, 1...567, AT7, eff. October 26
c) LIS-CPT, 3/week, ..3.5.7, 339, eff. November 11
d) LIS-CUN, 3/week, .2.4.6., 339, eff. October 27

Great positive news.


Congrats to TP and great news for both countries, they should look to interline with a mexican ULCC to boost the route, Viva might be a good option, they offer more than 20 destinations from CUN and mexicans are very used to connect in crappy MEX or USA so this could be an interesting option on their way to Europe.
 
SCQ83
Posts: 5665
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 8:32 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Wed Apr 08, 2020 7:55 am

a350lover wrote:
TAP is heavily capitalized by public funds. They are trying hard to overtake IB as the South-West European hub towards America. They indeed have a remarkable presence in USA and Africas. South America won't be easy and I don't see them in MEX or EZE (high yield markets) for instance. They already tried BOG and failed. CUN is purely leisure, so is CPT and rest of the announcements.


Galwayman wrote:
CUN is clearly aimed at connections from Spain


IMO CPT and CUN are hardly comparable. CUN is middle class Europeans going for 1-week of sun. CPT has a more varied mix. Local VFR and higher-end tourism, specially from the US (they could connect people flying NYC-LIS-CPT)

The issue with AGA and CUN is that those destinations in the post-COVID world will be very affected. I have a hard time seeing middle class Europeans (which by the end of 2020 will be unemployed or fearful of being fired) flying 5 (to AGA) or 10 (to CUN) hours for some sun in countries with poor health infrastructure. Those are the kind of trips that will be more affected by the upcoming economic/health fears. I can't see a worst moment in history to launch those flights. Unless TAP thinks they can give away tickets and connect whoever is still flying there.
 
Kadish
Posts: 369
Joined: Thu Aug 31, 2017 11:36 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Wed Apr 08, 2020 8:42 am

Galwayman wrote:
a350lover wrote:
TAP is heavily capitalized by public funds. They are trying hard to overtake IB as the South-West European hub towards America. They indeed have a remarkable presence in USA and Africas. South America won't be easy and I don't see them in MEX or EZE (high yield markets) for instance. They already tried BOG and failed. CUN is purely leisure, so is CPT and rest of the announcements.



- Mex (North America) > Spain via Lis is a no brainier at some stage
- yields on CPT with connections onwards are probably as good as JNB , perfectly explains the short time on the ground
- PTY with codeshares on Copa possibly JV would be very very interesting
- CUN is clearly aimed at connections from Spain

Wish TP every success , they’re one of the most interesting airlines to watch


Spanish people flying to CUN do it with a package tour..flights,hotel....I dont think this Is aimed for connections...
 
evanb
Posts: 905
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2016 3:26 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Wed Apr 08, 2020 9:20 am

I think there is often a misnomer about CPT being low yield simply because it's a tourist destination while JNB is high yield because it's a business destination. I would agree that JNB is higher yielding than CPT, and probably because of business links, but it doesn't mean CPT is low yielding. A strong portion of South African inbound tourism is targeted towards at older and higher income market. It isn't a backpacker and family destination in the same vein as Thailand.
 
abrelosojos
Posts: 4302
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 6:48 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Wed Apr 08, 2020 10:52 am

SCQ83 wrote:
a350lover wrote:
The issue with AGA and CUN is that those destinations in the post-COVID world will be very affected. I have a hard time seeing middle class Europeans (which by the end of 2020 will be unemployed or fearful of being fired) flying 5 (to AGA) or 10 (to CUN) hours for some sun in countries with poor health infrastructure. Those are the kind of trips that will be more affected by the upcoming economic/health fears. I can't see a worst moment in history to launch those flights. Unless TAP thinks they can give away tickets and connect whoever is still flying there.


= I disagree with your analysis, and time will tell. I think both are brilliant additions. As I said before, AGA is a low impact aircraft utilization play. An AT7, especially given fuel prices, is probably something needed for network contribution revenue. In the terms of CUN, let's see. If many middle-class Europeans switch away from flying, they will likely avoid non-stop expensive options, and fly 1-stop via LIS on TP whose cost structure is significantly below other European majors.

Every crisis presents an opportunity, and kudos to TAP and their management team to look at the crisis as an opportunity. Time will tell.

Saludos,
Alex
Live, and let live.
 
Kikko19
Posts: 676
Joined: Sat Apr 22, 2017 4:45 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Wed Apr 08, 2020 12:00 pm

abrelosojos wrote:
SCQ83 wrote:
a350lover wrote:
The issue with AGA and CUN is that those destinations in the post-COVID world will be very affected. I have a hard time seeing middle class Europeans (which by the end of 2020 will be unemployed or fearful of being fired) flying 5 (to AGA) or 10 (to CUN) hours for some sun in countries with poor health infrastructure. Those are the kind of trips that will be more affected by the upcoming economic/health fears. I can't see a worst moment in history to launch those flights. Unless TAP thinks they can give away tickets and connect whoever is still flying there.


= I disagree with your analysis, and time will tell. I think both are brilliant additions. As I said before, AGA is a low impact aircraft utilization play. An AT7, especially given fuel prices, is probably something needed for network contribution revenue. In the terms of CUN, let's see. If many middle-class Europeans switch away from flying, they will likely avoid non-stop expensive options, and fly 1-stop via LIS on TP whose cost structure is significantly below other European majors.

Every crisis presents an opportunity, and kudos to TAP and their management team to look at the crisis as an opportunity. Time will tell.

Saludos,
Alex

agree with you, TP will receive funds from the govt and will be able to operate almost immediately after the crisis (tourism is seen as strategic in portugal, even if they are not investing in the LIS airport :( ), while many other airlines operating charters might be gone for good along with many low cost: DY, and EZ first.
 
airbazar
Posts: 10083
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Wed Apr 08, 2020 1:10 pm

abrelosojos wrote:
Every crisis presents an opportunity, and kudos to TAP and their management team to look at the crisis as an opportunity. Time will tell.

To be fair, these destinations were all rumored before the Pandemic started.
I do agree that CUN might be good addition. The reason I think this could be a good addition is two fold:
First, in an economic downturn people search for cheaper alternatives and Cancun is cheap, very cheap compared to the likes of Maldives and Seychelles, or even the Canary Islands. Second, TAP needs to find utilization for their A339's during the winter season when N.America traffic drops significantly.
AGA is just a logical, low cost addition in a market where TAP has been expanding rapidly. Before the Pandemic Morocco's tourism was experiencing fast growth and TAP was capitalizing on it. Whether or when tourism will return to Morocco is anybody's guess.
 
Duartelmatos
Posts: 54
Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2018 11:33 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Wed Apr 08, 2020 3:02 pm

LIM, BEY and MCO are also on the plan. Let’s see if they will still go forward with this situation.
 
SCQ83
Posts: 5665
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 8:32 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Wed Apr 08, 2020 3:47 pm

airbazar wrote:
First, in an economic downturn people search for cheaper alternatives and Cancun is cheap, very cheap compared to the likes of Maldives and Seychelles, or even the Canary Islands. Second, TAP needs to find utilization for their A339's during the winter season when N.America traffic drops significantly.


That goes both ways. In a global economic downturn, other destinations will lower their prices to attract those tourists. Specially hotels which are the highest cost (other than flights). So Maldives or Seychelles (or other more more reasonably priced places like Thailand or Sri Lanka) might lower their prices. Pure offer and demand.

In any case, at least from Spain, Cancún or Punta Cana do not compete with Maldives/Seychelles (a niche market) but with Thailand or Bali, and the increasingly growing demand for SE Asia, and are already as cheap as those places in the Caribbean.

airbazar wrote:
AGA is just a logical, low cost addition in a market where TAP has been expanding rapidly. Before the Pandemic Morocco's tourism was experiencing fast growth and TAP was capitalizing on it. Whether or when tourism will return to Morocco is anybody's guess.


Agadir is a destination of its own which is basically beach & sun for Northern Europeans. Nothing else. Not even VFR. It is nothing like Marrakech which also has high-end tourism and events and people from all over the world, and some VFR. That is why no one flies mainland Spain - Agadir (despite Spain have infinite more relations with Morocco - for starters like 1 million Moroccans live in Spain -).
 
airbazar
Posts: 10083
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Wed Apr 08, 2020 5:03 pm

SCQ83 wrote:
airbazar wrote:
First, in an economic downturn people search for cheaper alternatives and Cancun is cheap, very cheap compared to the likes of Maldives and Seychelles, or even the Canary Islands. Second, TAP needs to find utilization for their A339's during the winter season when N.America traffic drops significantly.


That goes both ways. In a global economic downturn, other destinations will lower their prices to attract those tourists. Specially hotels which are the highest cost (other than flights). So Maldives or Seychelles (or other more more reasonably priced places like Thailand or Sri Lanka) might lower their prices. Pure offer and demand.

In any case, at least from Spain, Cancún or Punta Cana do not compete with Maldives/Seychelles (a niche market) but with Thailand or Bali, and the increasingly growing demand for SE Asia, and are already as cheap as those places in the Caribbean.


TAP doesn't cater just to Spanish or Portuguese passengers. Cancún or Punta Cana DID NOT compete with Maldives/Seychelles in a good economy. But you can bet they will now and that's my point. Lowering prices is not really as easy as you make it sound. And Southeast Asia has priced itself too high because of Chinese tourists. There's been a huge drop in demand from European visitors because prices have gone up and after this Pandemic, if we learned anything from SARS and MERS is that it will be a while until European tourists return in large numbers.
https://thethaiger.com/hot-news/tourism ... rts-report
 
abrelosojos
Posts: 4302
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 6:48 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Wed Apr 08, 2020 8:43 pm

airbazar wrote:

TAP doesn't cater just to Spanish or Portuguese passengers. Cancún or Punta Cana DID NOT compete with Maldives/Seychelles in a good economy. But you can bet they will now and that's my point. Lowering prices is not really as easy as you make it sound. And Southeast Asia has priced itself too high because of Chinese tourists. There's been a huge drop in demand from European visitors because prices have gone up and after this Pandemic, if we learned anything from SARS and MERS is that it will be a while until European tourists return in large numbers.
https://thethaiger.com/hot-news/tourism ... rts-report


= That is absolutely right. From their map, seems like they fly to around 75 destinations in Europe, so I think CUN will work just fine for them. Now, of course, if Coronavirus remains, who knows ... but the strategy of going after flows like CUN, CPT, and AGA seems like a nice way for TAP to diversify their portfolio. The management team is top notch, and so it is pretty big kudo for them to take a risk.

Saludos,
Alex
Live, and let live.
 
LightChop2Chop
Posts: 137
Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 3:33 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Wed Apr 08, 2020 11:48 pm

Galwayman wrote:
- Mex (North America) > Spain via Lis is a no brainier at some stage
- yields on CPT with connections onwards are probably as good as JNB , perfectly explains the short time on the ground
- PTY with codeshares on Copa possibly JV would be very very interesting
- CUN is clearly aimed at connections from Spain

Wish TP every success , they’re one of the most interesting airlines to watch


PTY was already tried as a triangle with BOG and failed miserably.
 
XRadar98
Posts: 74
Joined: Sun May 01, 2016 4:23 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Thu Apr 09, 2020 12:39 am

Does anyone else question this? Now that Northern hemisphere is warming up and the pandemic should be receding a bit, is it wise to start flights south where Winter is approaching?
 
efpmeneses
Posts: 43
Joined: Sat Mar 29, 2014 12:39 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Thu Apr 09, 2020 12:42 am

From what I realized, the new flight PDL-YYZ, which will be flown 2x weekly, is being started at the expense or reducing PDL-BOS from 5x to 3x weekly..

But If anyone can confirm the reducing of the number of PDL-BOS flights operated by TP Portugal.

Thanks

Enviado do meu ASUS_I01WD através do Tapatalk
 
abrelosojos
Posts: 4302
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 6:48 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Thu Apr 09, 2020 12:50 am

LightChop2Chop wrote:
Galwayman wrote:
- Mex (North America) > Spain via Lis is a no brainier at some stage
- yields on CPT with connections onwards are probably as good as JNB , perfectly explains the short time on the ground
- PTY with codeshares on Copa possibly JV would be very very interesting
- CUN is clearly aimed at connections from Spain

Wish TP every success , they’re one of the most interesting airlines to watch


PTY was already tried as a triangle with BOG and failed miserably.


= Ya, tagging PTY with BOG always seemed like a dumb idea to me. New management though, and so far they don't seem to do these silly things.

XRadar98 wrote:
Does anyone else question this? Now that Northern hemisphere is warming up and the pandemic should be receding a bit, is it wise to start flights south where Winter is approaching?


= Actually, it is brilliant. If COVID is your logic. I mean, these flights begin in the South in November ... where it would be summer.

Saludos,
Alex
Live, and let live.
 
XRadar98
Posts: 74
Joined: Sun May 01, 2016 4:23 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Thu Apr 09, 2020 1:13 am

Thanks Alex, I missed the start dates.
 
SCQ83
Posts: 5665
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 8:32 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Thu Apr 09, 2020 8:30 am

abrelosojos wrote:
XRadar98 wrote:
Does anyone else question this? Now that Northern hemisphere is warming up and the pandemic should be receding a bit, is it wise to start flights south where Winter is approaching?


= Actually, it is brilliant. If COVID is your logic. I mean, these flights begin in the South in November ... where it would be summer


Nothing has proven that. Guayaquil has probably the worst Coronavirus-related situation in LatAm and has a warm and humid climate, with temperatures over +30 degrees during the last month.
 
abrelosojos
Posts: 4302
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 6:48 am

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Thu Apr 09, 2020 10:37 am

SCQ83 wrote:
abrelosojos wrote:
XRadar98 wrote:
Does anyone else question this? Now that Northern hemisphere is warming up and the pandemic should be receding a bit, is it wise to start flights south where Winter is approaching?


= Actually, it is brilliant. If COVID is your logic. I mean, these flights begin in the South in November ... where it would be summer


Nothing has proven that. Guayaquil has probably the worst Coronavirus-related situation in LatAm and has a warm and humid climate, with temperatures over +30 degrees during the last month.


= I was responding to a very specific question, and not commenting on Coronavirus, for which none of us are qualified.

Saludos,
Alex
Live, and let live.
 
airbazar
Posts: 10083
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: TAP launches PDL-YYZ, AGA, CPT, and CUN

Thu Apr 09, 2020 1:14 pm

abrelosojos wrote:
PTY was already tried as a triangle with BOG and failed miserably.


= Ya, tagging PTY with BOG always seemed like a dumb idea to me. New management though, and so far they don't seem to do these silly things.


Not really dumb. IIRC they couldn't fly BOG-LIS because of the altitude and PTY just by itself doesn't have enough demand so PTY by itself just wouldn't work. Panama was also providing incentives so we don't know for sure if or how much money they actually lost. TP also had a long history of triangle/tagged routes in Brazil and Africa so it was something they had been doing for a long time. They tried, it didn't work. It happens.

abrelosojos wrote:
XRadar98 wrote:
Does anyone else question this? Now that Northern hemisphere is warming up and the pandemic should be receding a bit, is it wise to start flights south where Winter is approaching?


= Actually, it is brilliant. If COVID is your logic. I mean, these flights begin in the South in November ... where it would be summer.

There is no evidence that weather by itself impacts the virus spread.
Also, these routes were in the works long before the Pandemic started. The routes may or may not work but at this time, I don't think anyone is really sure about what the aviation industry will be like in 3 months let alone in November.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos