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Miami
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South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Mon Apr 13, 2020 3:01 am

It's been over 20+ years since SAA last landed in Miami. Today, an Airbus A350-900XWB ended the drought.

Due to the unfortunate circumstances of COVID-19, SAA came to the rescue of dozens of South Africans in Miami. Flight came in from JNB with a stop at DSS as SA4211. Flight back will depart MIA on Tuesday.

Image

https://www.facebook.com/FlySAAUSA/post ... 7550936033

Welcome back, SAA!

- Miami
Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible. - Eddie Rickenbacker
 
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Miami
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Tue Apr 14, 2020 2:46 pm

Leaves tonight with 310 pax to JNB. 7:30pm.
Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible. - Eddie Rickenbacker
 
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JetBuddy
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Tue Apr 14, 2020 4:14 pm

Love the picture.
 
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N62NA
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Tue Apr 14, 2020 4:44 pm

I hope one day they will return with scheduled flights. But in the meantime, this is nice!
 
bravotango75
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Tue Apr 14, 2020 4:59 pm

So, this is nothing more than a ” repatriation” flight? What is the big deal? I mean, almost every US city are seeing these in one form or another, we have seen a ton here in BOS, no big deal made out of it. Now had it been a new or a service re-start, then yeah, newsworthy, though given SAA’s current financials, that would be suicide. But for city of Miami's stature and prominence with commercial addition, to tout this as a big event, wow, that seems like something that they would do in Dallas or Houston.
 
x1234
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Tue Apr 14, 2020 5:19 pm

I am surprised the A359 can't do JNB-MIA non-stop.
 
DylanHarvey
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Tue Apr 14, 2020 5:50 pm

x1234 wrote:
I am surprised the A359 can't do JNB-MIA non-stop.

It can quite easily do it, I'm assuming there's a multitude of other reasons behind the stops. A350 flies plenty of longer routes around the world.
 
hpff
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Tue Apr 14, 2020 6:30 pm

DylanHarvey wrote:
x1234 wrote:
I am surprised the A359 can't do JNB-MIA non-stop.

It can quite easily do it, I'm assuming there's a multitude of other reasons behind the stops. A350 flies plenty of longer routes around the world.


JNB is hot-and-high, probably factors into it
 
DylanHarvey
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Tue Apr 14, 2020 6:36 pm

hpff wrote:
DylanHarvey wrote:
x1234 wrote:
I am surprised the A359 can't do JNB-MIA non-stop.

It can quite easily do it, I'm assuming there's a multitude of other reasons behind the stops. A350 flies plenty of longer routes around the world.


JNB is hot-and-high, probably factors into it

It was more than likely completely empty leaving JNB. The 359 can get out of JNB at 275t. Which they most definitely don't need completely empty.
 
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FLALEFTY
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Wed Apr 15, 2020 1:00 am

DylanHarvey wrote:
hpff wrote:
DylanHarvey wrote:
It can quite easily do it, I'm assuming there's a multitude of other reasons behind the stops. A350 flies plenty of longer routes around the world.


JNB is hot-and-high, probably factors into it

It was more than likely completely empty leaving JNB. The 359 can get out of JNB at 275t. Which they most definitely don't need completely empty.


All of SAA's A350's are leased and it is possible that the lessors put a takeoff weight limit clause into the leases? SAA is not in good financial health and perhaps the lessors are expecting to see these back in their inventories soon, hopefully in good shape. They probably don't want the landing gear, air frame and engines stressed just to make a one-off R/T non-stop flight between JNB-MIA. Stopping in DSS breaks the flights up into 2, roughly 4,200sm segments, rather than 1 segment of 8,100sm.
 
9252fly
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Wed Apr 15, 2020 2:08 am

FLALEFTY wrote:
DylanHarvey wrote:
hpff wrote:

JNB is hot-and-high, probably factors into it

It was more than likely completely empty leaving JNB. The 359 can get out of JNB at 275t. Which they most definitely don't need completely empty.


All of SAA's A350's are leased and it is possible that the lessors put a takeoff weight limit clause into the leases? SAA is not in good financial health and perhaps the lessors are expecting to see these back in their inventories soon, hopefully in good shape. They probably don't want the landing gear, air frame and engines stressed just to make a one-off R/T non-stop flight between JNB-MIA. Stopping in DSS breaks the flights up into 2, roughly 4,200sm segments, rather than 1 segment of 8,100sm.


In respect to your comment about the financial health of SAA, the South African government today said that they will not provide any further funding to the airline as they are broke for lack of a better way to put it. It would seem the business rescue partners will likely have no other option now than to put the airline into liquidation, truly a sad situation for all those that will be effected.
 
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chepos
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South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Wed Apr 15, 2020 3:56 am

9252fly wrote:
FLALEFTY wrote:
DylanHarvey wrote:
It was more than likely completely empty leaving JNB. The 359 can get out of JNB at 275t. Which they most definitely don't need completely empty.


All of SAA's A350's are leased and it is possible that the lessors put a takeoff weight limit clause into the leases? SAA is not in good financial health and perhaps the lessors are expecting to see these back in their inventories soon, hopefully in good shape. They probably don't want the landing gear, air frame and engines stressed just to make a one-off R/T non-stop flight between JNB-MIA. Stopping in DSS breaks the flights up into 2, roughly 4,200sm segments, rather than 1 segment of 8,100sm.


In respect to your comment about the financial health of SAA, the South African government today said that they will not provide any further funding to the airline as they are broke for lack of a better way to put it. It would seem the business rescue partners will likely have no other option now than to put the airline into liquidation, truly a sad situation for all those that will be effected.

A eulogy for SAA has been written in these forums far too many times (along with AZ). I’ll believe that when I se it


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blacksoviet
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Wed Apr 15, 2020 5:02 am

Did they use a hardstand or a gate?
 
trees
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Wed Apr 15, 2020 7:14 am

FLALEFTY wrote:
DylanHarvey wrote:
hpff wrote:

JNB is hot-and-high, probably factors into it

It was more than likely completely empty leaving JNB. The 359 can get out of JNB at 275t. Which they most definitely don't need completely empty.


All of SAA's A350's are leased and it is possible that the lessors put a takeoff weight limit clause into the leases? SAA is not in good financial health and perhaps the lessors are expecting to see these back in their inventories soon, hopefully in good shape. They probably don't want the landing gear, air frame and engines stressed just to make a one-off R/T non-stop flight between JNB-MIA. Stopping in DSS breaks the flights up into 2, roughly 4,200sm segments, rather than 1 segment of 8,100sm.


Those A350’s are used on the JNB-JFK route. By your logic those frames are ready to be scrapped.
 
trees
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Wed Apr 15, 2020 7:15 am

blacksoviet wrote:
Did they use a hardstand or a gate?


Gate J11A
 
evanb
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Wed Apr 15, 2020 8:20 am

x1234 wrote:
I am surprised the A359 can't do JNB-MIA non-stop.


It can do it non-stop (they fly JNB-JFK-JNB non-stop with the A350s). It's just a lot more expensive to do it non-stop and without a high yield revenue it's not necessary.

Also, the return leg is operating MIA-DDS-JNB, so the outbound gave the chance to position the second crew for the DDS-JNB leg.
 
TWA902fly
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Sat Apr 18, 2020 5:50 am

evanb wrote:
x1234 wrote:
I am surprised the A359 can't do JNB-MIA non-stop.


It can do it non-stop (they fly JNB-JFK-JNB non-stop with the A350s). It's just a lot more expensive to do it non-stop and without a high yield revenue it's not necessary.

Also, the return leg is operating MIA-DDS-JNB, so the outbound gave the chance to position the second crew for the DDS-JNB leg.


Not that it makes a big difference, but JNB-MIA is actually about 100sm longer than JNB-JFK.

'902
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dfwjim1
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Sat Apr 18, 2020 5:59 am

bravotango75 wrote:
So, this is nothing more than a ” repatriation” flight? What is the big deal? I mean, almost every US city are seeing these in one form or another, we have seen a ton here in BOS, no big deal made out of it. Now had it been a new or a service re-start, then yeah, newsworthy, though given SAA’s current financials, that would be suicide. But for city of Miami's stature and prominence with commercial addition, to tout this as a big event, wow, that seems like something that they would do in Dallas or Houston.


I was thinking the same thing...why make such a big deal over a one time flight?
 
smokeybandit
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Sat Apr 18, 2020 1:06 pm

20 years? That has to be a record for longest flight then.
 
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PatrickZ80
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Sat Apr 18, 2020 1:12 pm

N62NA wrote:
I hope one day they will return with scheduled flights. But in the meantime, this is nice!


Zero chance. Today they announced they will fire all of their staff and sell their assets. South African Airways is no more.
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Sat Apr 18, 2020 7:04 pm

bravotango75 wrote:
So, this is nothing more than a ” repatriation” flight? What is the big deal? I mean, almost every US city are seeing these in one form or another, we have seen a ton here in BOS, no big deal made out of it. Now had it been a new or a service re-start, then yeah, newsworthy, though given SAA’s current financials, that would be suicide.

:checkmark: :checkmark: :checkmark:



bravotango75 wrote:
But for city of Miami's stature and prominence with commercial addition, to tout this as a big event, wow, that seems like something that they would do in Dallas or Houston.

Not really sure the point of digging at DFW and IAH; seeing as they both have plenty of longhaul routes/services that MIA has failed to attain, and in some cases could never even dream of. Strange.



x1234 wrote:
I am surprised the A359 can't do JNB-MIA non-stop.

Could a generic 280T A359 in premium configuration do JNB-MIA? ...with no problem.

Is that cost efficient for a 1time repatriation flight, for an airline who otherwise has little reason to rate its aircraft at that kind of gross weight? ...clearly not.


chepos wrote:
A eulogy for SAA has been written in these forums far too many times (along with AZ). I’ll believe that when I se it

Looks like today you're getting your wish :(

https://onemileatatime.com/south-africa ... ing-staff/
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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Miami
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Sat Apr 18, 2020 7:34 pm

PatrickZ80 wrote:
N62NA wrote:
I hope one day they will return with scheduled flights. But in the meantime, this is nice!


Zero chance. Today they announced they will fire all of their staff and sell their assets. South African Airways is no more.

False. Not official.

dfwjim1 wrote:
I was thinking the same thing...why make such a big deal over a one time flight?

Who said this was a big deal?

LAX772LR wrote:
Not really sure the point of digging at DFW and IAH; seeing as they both have plenty of longhaul routes/services that MIA has failed to attain, and in some cases could never even dream of. Strange.

Stopped after 9/11.. Not failed.

Also, name a few routes for me.
Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible. - Eddie Rickenbacker
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Sat Apr 18, 2020 8:22 pm

Miami wrote:
LAX772LR wrote:
Not really sure the point of digging at DFW and IAH; seeing as they both have plenty of longhaul routes/services that MIA has failed to attain, and in some cases could never even dream of. Strange.

Stopped after 9/11.. Not failed.

Can you kindly point out to me what 9/11 has to do with anything I just mentioned.

Because that appears to be quite the irrelevant non sequitur....




Miami wrote:
Also, name a few routes for me.

Oh, I dunno, nonstops to just about anywhere in east Asia perhaps? Tokyo, Hong Kong, Beijing, Shanghai, Seoul.

...and Polynesia.
...and Australia.
...and New Zealand.
...and western Africa.

Pre-shutdown, DFW and/or IAH had achieved and sustained nonstops to all of the above.
MIA didn't, couldn't, and for most of them: likely won't ever--- in even the furthest and most optimistic stretch of foreseeable future.

Which is why it's exceedingly strange to take a dig at either of them in the manner put forth.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
evanb
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Sat Apr 18, 2020 8:53 pm

Miami wrote:
Stopped after 9/11.. Not failed.


Not quite. SAA exited MIA in 1999 when it switched to ATL. MIA didn't fail for them but they switched their US partner from AA to DL in 1999.
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Sat Apr 18, 2020 9:02 pm

evanb wrote:
Miami wrote:
Stopped after 9/11.. Not failed.

Not quite. SAA exited MIA in 1999 when it switched to ATL. MIA didn't fail for them but they switched their US partner from AA to DL in 1999.

And even then, they still flew JNB-CPT-FLL-ATL-JNB for nearly 3yrs after that, with ability to both enplane and deplane passengers there until 2001.

But that said, I'm still at loss as to WTH 9/11 has to do with DFW/IAH having plenty of longhaul routes that MIA doesn't and likely won't ever. :confused:
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
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DarkSnowyNight
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Sat Apr 18, 2020 9:58 pm

FLALEFTY wrote:
All of SAA's A350's are leased and it is possible that the lessors put a takeoff weight limit clause into the leases? SAA is not in good financial health and perhaps the lessors are expecting to see these back in their inventories soon, hopefully in good shape.


Not for an A350. There are weight limit groupings, but these follow OEM guidelines.

FLALEFTY wrote:
They probably don't want the landing gear, air frame and engines stressed just to make a one-off R/T non-stop flight between JNB-MIA. Stopping in DSS breaks the flights up into 2, roughly 4,200sm segments, rather than 1 segment of 8,100sm.


None of the composite or metallic components listed above will show any outside-of-limit wear for normal use and/or extra segments. And if they were made out butter, extra cycles would be worse than one longer trip.

LAX772LR wrote:
And even then, they still flew JNB-CPT-FLL-ATL-JNB for nearly 3yrs after that, with ability to both enplane and deplane passengers there until 2001.

But that said, I'm still at loss as to WTH 9/11 has to do with DFW/IAH having plenty of longhaul routes that MIA doesn't and likely won't ever. :confused:


Well, at least they managed to snag EK...

Oh, never mind...
"Nous ne sommes pas infectés. Il n'y a pas d'infection ici..."
 
mwhcvt
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Sat Apr 18, 2020 10:44 pm

I’d say from the wording it’s fairly clear why the stops to repatriate citizens from each on the way rather than the cost and delays sending an aircraft to each and then back to SA
Must think up a new one soon, slow moving brain trying to get into gear ;)
 
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Miami
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Sun Apr 19, 2020 12:39 am

Aviation is proof that given, the will, we have the capacity to achieve the impossible. - Eddie Rickenbacker
 
bravotango75
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Re: South African Airways lands in Miami after 20+ years

Sun Apr 19, 2020 1:19 am

Miami wrote:


The guys from 'Airplane Repo' are no doubt, chomping at the bit to get a hold of that beauty!

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