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nine4nine
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Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Mon Apr 13, 2020 8:26 pm

Wanted to start this thread for updates on all Southern California Airports (BFL,SBA,BUR,LAX,LGB,ONT,PSP,SNA,SAN) and how they are being affected as Covid19 plays out. A few questions hopefully some can answer to start this discussion.

- does anybody know what aircraft and type are being stored at every airport in So-Cal?
*** I did see 2 AS 738’s at SNA today with engine cowl covers installed and all pitot tubes taped and sealed.

-updates on temporary service suspensions by airport.

-updates on complete service eliminations by airport.

-Terminal facility closures and consolidations.
717, 727-100, 727-200, 732, 733, 734, 735, 73G, 738, 739, 742, 748, 752, 753, 762, 763, 772, 77W, 787-10, DC9, MD80/88/90, DC10, 319, 220-300, 320, 321, 321n, 332, 333, CS100, CRJ200, Q400, E175, E190, ERJ145, EMB120
 
brabb12
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Tue Apr 14, 2020 1:02 am

Alaska is leaving those two at SNA to get maintenance done. They will be staying there for at least 30 days.
 
friendlyskies22
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Tue Apr 14, 2020 2:13 pm

nine4nine: If you wanted to know about SoCal aircraft storage, why did you leave off VCV, SBD & MHV?
 
PSAatSAN4Ever
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Tue Apr 14, 2020 2:59 pm

Surprisingly...err, no, sorry, that's not the right word...

Shockingly, Bakersfield is still open!

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/SKW5631/history/20200415/1340Z/KBFL/KSFO

It's one-and-only SFO flight is...well, sometimes operating.

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/SKW5278/history/20200415/1240Z/KBFL/KDEN

One daily BFL-DEN is still operating.

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/ASH5852/history/20200412/2337Z/KBFL/KPHX

One daily BFL-PHX is still going, although the flight number has been used for DFW-MGM on a couple of days...

https://flightaware.com/live/findflight?origin=KBFL&destination=KDFW

Oddly enough, the route that was only RE-STARTED after nearly 20+ years unserved (after 14 consecutive years with an MD80) is still operating twice a day.

Absolutely no logic is anywhere to be found; however, I'm going to give it over the airlines for their reasons why certain routes are continuing to operate...
 
nine4nine
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Tue Apr 14, 2020 3:41 pm

friendlyskies22 wrote:
nine4nine: If you wanted to know about SoCal aircraft storage, why did you leave off VCV, SBD & MHV?



I know there’s a plethora of a/c in storage at those airports but I’m more interested in the ones being stored at commercially serviced airports that never see stored planes.

But sure why not if there’s info on those as well might as well throw it in. 8-)
717, 727-100, 727-200, 732, 733, 734, 735, 73G, 738, 739, 742, 748, 752, 753, 762, 763, 772, 77W, 787-10, DC9, MD80/88/90, DC10, 319, 220-300, 320, 321, 321n, 332, 333, CS100, CRJ200, Q400, E175, E190, ERJ145, EMB120
 
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hawaiian717
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Tue Apr 14, 2020 3:45 pm

PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
Surprisingly...err, no, sorry, that's not the right word...

Shockingly, Bakersfield is still open!


Don't forget that the stimulus package for airlines requires an airline receiving money from the program maintain service to all cities served prior to the start of the crisus, unless a waiver is granted. So generally airlines are keeping service to all cities they served, but they don't have to keep all routes.
 
YVAMWB1900
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Tue Apr 14, 2020 5:05 pm

Currently there are seven Alaska aircraft parked and stored at ONT between Terminal 2 and Terminal 4, with more scheduled to arrive today.
 
PSAatSAN4Ever
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Tue Apr 14, 2020 6:27 pm

hawaiian717 wrote:
PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
Surprisingly...err, no, sorry, that's not the right word...

Shockingly, Bakersfield is still open!


Don't forget that the stimulus package for airlines requires an airline receiving money from the program maintain service to all cities served prior to the start of the crisus, unless a waiver is granted. So generally airlines are keeping service to all cities they served, but they don't have to keep all routes.


That's just insane. Maintaining two flights a day has to be a losing proposition...good grief.

I would assume, then, that Heathrow slots still have to be used or surrendered? How's that going to work out for the airlines?
 
nine4nine
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Tue Apr 14, 2020 7:23 pm

YVAMWB1900 wrote:
Currently there are seven Alaska aircraft parked and stored at ONT between Terminal 2 and Terminal 4, with more scheduled to arrive today.



Would these be 737’s at ONT? That is only what I’ve seen parked so far. Saving the cycles on the 737’s and putting them on the leased 319/320 fleet during this? Or have they parked 320’s as well?
717, 727-100, 727-200, 732, 733, 734, 735, 73G, 738, 739, 742, 748, 752, 753, 762, 763, 772, 77W, 787-10, DC9, MD80/88/90, DC10, 319, 220-300, 320, 321, 321n, 332, 333, CS100, CRJ200, Q400, E175, E190, ERJ145, EMB120
 
phllax
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Tue Apr 14, 2020 7:34 pm

Burbank has closed Terminal B, and consolidated ops in Terminal A. United is using A5, Delta is using A6, Alaska is using A7, WN is using A8 & A9 right now, which allows them to bring in 800's.

JetBlue and Spirit have suspended operations. Delta has suspended the ATL flight, but has kept 3x SLC. AA has trimmed PHX down to 1 flight, but DFW still operates. AS has trimmed PDX and SEA down to 1 each on SkyWest.
 
YVAMWB1900
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Tue Apr 14, 2020 8:09 pm

nine4nine wrote:
YVAMWB1900 wrote:
Currently there are seven Alaska aircraft parked and stored at ONT between Terminal 2 and Terminal 4, with more scheduled to arrive today.



Would these be 737’s at ONT? That is only what I’ve seen parked so far. Saving the cycles on the 737’s and putting them on the leased 319/320 fleet during this? Or have they parked 320’s as well?


For the pics I've seen and info posted, there are only 737's right now. For more info, become a member of the Facebook group: ONT AvGeeks. It is managed by the Ontario International Airport. https://www.facebook.com/groups/ONTAvGeeks/
 
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hawaiian717
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Tue Apr 14, 2020 8:58 pm

PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
That's just insane. Maintaining two flights a day has to be a losing proposition...good grief.

I would assume, then, that Heathrow slots still have to be used or surrendered? How's that going to work out for the airlines?


Two flights a day is not the requirement. I think a city served daily needs to be served 5x/week. A single flight to one other city is enough. Note for example Spirit which is now serving SAN with just one flight, a daily to LAS. And the flight doesn’t have to be to a hub; Alaska for example is serving Houston now by having a SEA-DFW flight continue to IAH. And for cities with multiple airports, one is enough. So JetBlue stopping flights to BUR and ONT is allowed since they still serve LAX and LGB.

European airports have generally suspended slot usage requirements. Heathrow itself is temporarily closing Terminals 3 and 4 and consolidating all flight operations in Terminals 2 and 5.
 
PSAatSAN4Ever
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Wed Apr 15, 2020 1:14 am

hawaiian717 wrote:
PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
That's just insane. Maintaining two flights a day has to be a losing proposition...good grief.

I would assume, then, that Heathrow slots still have to be used or surrendered? How's that going to work out for the airlines?


Two flights a day is not the requirement. I think a city served daily needs to be served 5x/week. A single flight to one other city is enough. Note for example Spirit which is now serving SAN with just one flight, a daily to LAS. And the flight doesn’t have to be to a hub; Alaska for example is serving Houston now by having a SEA-DFW flight continue to IAH. And for cities with multiple airports, one is enough. So JetBlue stopping flights to BUR and ONT is allowed since they still serve LAX and LGB.

European airports have generally suspended slot usage requirements. Heathrow itself is temporarily closing Terminals 3 and 4 and consolidating all flight operations in Terminals 2 and 5.


Excellent points, thank you!

However, it is the oddity of this being the only route that has had no cutbacks. SFO has been cancelled frequently, DEN, formerly x3 daily, is down to one, PHX, formerly x4 daily, is down to one, but the last route added to BFL - and recipient of a grant to get started - is x2 daily, unaffected, and not being canceled frequently like other routes.

Something else is driving demand at this time.
 
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AAlaxfan
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Wed Apr 15, 2020 1:51 am

PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
hawaiian717 wrote:
PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
That's just insane. Maintaining two flights a day has to be a losing proposition...good grief.

I would assume, then, that Heathrow slots still have to be used or surrendered? How's that going to work out for the airlines?


Two flights a day is not the requirement. I think a city served daily needs to be served 5x/week. A single flight to one other city is enough. Note for example Spirit which is now serving SAN with just one flight, a daily to LAS. And the flight doesn’t have to be to a hub; Alaska for example is serving Houston now by having a SEA-DFW flight continue to IAH. And for cities with multiple airports, one is enough. So JetBlue stopping flights to BUR and ONT is allowed since they still serve LAX and LGB.

European airports have generally suspended slot usage requirements. Heathrow itself is temporarily closing Terminals 3 and 4 and consolidating all flight operations in Terminals 2 and 5.


Excellent points, thank you!

However, it is the oddity of this being the only route that has had no cutbacks. SFO has been cancelled frequently, DEN, formerly x3 daily, is down to one, PHX, formerly x4 daily, is down to one, but the last route added to BFL - and recipient of a grant to get started - is x2 daily, unaffected, and not being canceled frequently like other routes.

Something else is driving demand at this time.


I highlighted the important part of this post.
In all likelihood, in order to receive the grant money, AA must have to keep the two daily flights for a certain period before cutting frequency.
Grumpy. Not a dwarf, not an attitude. It's a lifestyle.
 
MDGLongBeach
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Wed Apr 15, 2020 5:52 am

First of all, JetBlue still flying to LGB (and LAX) is kind of ironic considering the supposed desperation that they have to leave the LGB market for ONT and Bur. Secondly and best for last?, B6 has stored 3x a320 on the Virgin orbit ramp here (N805JB, N594JB, N663JB) until further notice (though they’ve been cycling between LGB and MZJ recently for some reason).
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Wed Apr 15, 2020 6:57 am

Went spotting twice last week at Imperial Hill, from approx 7:30pm to 9:30pm.

Though I realize it's anecdotal, on the first night, we counted an average span between departures (from any of the four runways) of 4min38sec, for both 2hr periods combined.

If you don't count cargo-only ops off of 25L, then that average span between departures jumps to 9min12sec! Wild! :eek:

Also, took a pic that didn't really come out well with a cell phone; but there was a period after about 8pm where you couldn't see a single set of approach lights over Inglewood. Not one. At only 8 at night! For the second busiest airport on this side of the planet!
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
PSAatSAN4Ever
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Wed Apr 15, 2020 3:30 pm

LAX772LR wrote:
Went spotting twice last week at Imperial Hill, from approx 7:30pm to 9:30pm.

Though I realize it's anecdotal, on the first night, we counted an average span between departures (from any of the four runways) of 4min38sec, for both 2hr periods combined.

If you don't count cargo-only ops off of 25L, then that average span between departures jumps to 9min12sec! Wild! :eek:

Also, took a pic that didn't really come out well with a cell phone; but there was a period after about 8pm where you couldn't see a single set of approach lights over Inglewood. Not one. At only 8 at night! For the second busiest airport on this side of the planet!


Second busiest? Who is the first?
 
Aceskywalker
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Wed Apr 15, 2020 4:09 pm

PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
LAX772LR wrote:
Went spotting twice last week at Imperial Hill, from approx 7:30pm to 9:30pm.

Though I realize it's anecdotal, on the first night, we counted an average span between departures (from any of the four runways) of 4min38sec, for both 2hr periods combined.

If you don't count cargo-only ops off of 25L, then that average span between departures jumps to 9min12sec! Wild! :eek:

Also, took a pic that didn't really come out well with a cell phone; but there was a period after about 8pm where you couldn't see a single set of approach lights over Inglewood. Not one. At only 8 at night! For the second busiest airport on this side of the planet!


Second busiest? Who is the first?


The Delta mega uber hub at ATL.
 
WNagent310
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Wed Apr 15, 2020 6:53 pm

I can give an update from the WN side at LAX. Currently running 42 daily flights outta LAX Monday-Friday. 27 on Saturday and Sunday I believe is 34. Quite a big drop from the normal 115-120 we do on a normal operating day pre-COVID19
 
MDW22L31C
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Wed Apr 15, 2020 9:48 pm

Kind of a odd JetBlue flight today. MZJ-LGB

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/JBU ... /KMZJ/KLGB
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Thu Apr 16, 2020 12:26 am

MDW22L31C wrote:
Kind of a odd JetBlue flight today. MZJ-LGB

I'm guessing either pulling a plane from storage, or (more likely) dropping one off there, then returning the crew?
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
TW870
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Thu Apr 16, 2020 3:47 am

LAX772LR wrote:
Went spotting twice last week at Imperial Hill, from approx 7:30pm to 9:30pm.

Though I realize it's anecdotal, on the first night, we counted an average span between departures (from any of the four runways) of 4min38sec, for both 2hr periods combined.

If you don't count cargo-only ops off of 25L, then that average span between departures jumps to 9min12sec! Wild! :eek:

Also, took a pic that didn't really come out well with a cell phone; but there was a period after about 8pm where you couldn't see a single set of approach lights over Inglewood. Not one. At only 8 at night! For the second busiest airport on this side of the planet!


Thanks for this update. Details like this give you a real sense of how much of a crisis this is. 8pm and no lights of aircraft on approach to LAX - like I cannot wrap my head around that. I am reminded of a couple years back flying into LAX from ATL on a DL 767-300 and everyone groaned as we flew over the 405 on final approach and it was bumper to bumper traffic both ways. It was about 8pm. Long waits for Uber, long rides downtown, everyone knew it was going to be a pain in the as*, that they would be late for dinner, etc. Now - not so much.

I am MSP-based. I went out for a run around lake Bde Maka Ska, which is under the approach to 12R/L. Its a 3ish mile run, and I did it at 5pm. Usually solid, stacked approaches on both sides with absolute minimum spacing, and you get great variety of long and short haul arrivals. I saw one aircraft on the entire run, an AA 320. Just bizarre.
 
ixemctdca
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Thu Apr 16, 2020 4:46 am

TW870 wrote:
I went out for a run around lake Bde Maka Ska, which is under the approach to 12R/L. Its a 3ish mile run, and I did it at 5pm. Usually solid, stacked approaches on both sides with absolute minimum spacing, and you get great variety of long and short haul arrivals. I saw one aircraft on the entire run, an AA 320. Just bizarre.

1. I had no idea that they'd changed the name of the lake (lived there until 2011)
2. 1 plane during that run at that time of the day is pretty hard to imagine!
-ixemctdca
 
PSAatSAN4Ever
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Thu Apr 16, 2020 2:46 pm

Aceskywalker wrote:
PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:
LAX772LR wrote:
Went spotting twice last week at Imperial Hill, from approx 7:30pm to 9:30pm.

Though I realize it's anecdotal, on the first night, we counted an average span between departures (from any of the four runways) of 4min38sec, for both 2hr periods combined.

If you don't count cargo-only ops off of 25L, then that average span between departures jumps to 9min12sec! Wild! :eek:

Also, took a pic that didn't really come out well with a cell phone; but there was a period after about 8pm where you couldn't see a single set of approach lights over Inglewood. Not one. At only 8 at night! For the second busiest airport on this side of the planet!


Second busiest? Who is the first?


The Delta mega uber hub at ATL.


Good answer - my thought on "this side of the planet" went to the Pacific Coast, not North America in general. Make sense now.
 
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ojjunior
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Sat Apr 18, 2020 4:59 am

Does anyone know why is DL flying LAX-GRU tonight?

DL3303 from Los Angeles to Sao Paulo https://fr24.com/DAL3303/245fc037

Usually an AA route.
 
MDW22L31C
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Sat Apr 18, 2020 6:53 pm

Looks like AS has 13 737’s stored at ONT.

The new FedEx cargo ramp and sorting facilities are coming along nicely at ONT.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Sun Apr 19, 2020 2:14 am

ojjunior wrote:
Does anyone know why is DL flying LAX-GRU tonight?

DL3303 from Los Angeles to Sao Paulo https://fr24.com/DAL3303/245fc037

Usually an AA route.


Cargo. Returning from GRU on 19th to LAX.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
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FlyThiz
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Sun Apr 19, 2020 2:41 am

MDW22L31C wrote:
The new FedEx cargo ramp and sorting facilities are coming along nicely at ONT.


Is that the construction taking place off East Airport Drive, the northern “ring road?”
Is mayonnaise an instrument?
 
FX1816
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Sun Apr 19, 2020 6:07 am

FlyThiz wrote:
MDW22L31C wrote:
The new FedEx cargo ramp and sorting facilities are coming along nicely at ONT.


Is that the construction taking place off East Airport Drive, the northern “ring road?”


Yes, it is on the northwest end of the airport, the old west cargo ramp. It also is part of the old Lockheed facility. For PSP, the only aircraft there are a couple of American Eagle CRJ7's at the SkyWest hangar.
 
CO953
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Sun Apr 19, 2020 7:20 am

LAX772LR wrote:
Went spotting twice last week at Imperial Hill, from approx 7:30pm to 9:30pm.

Though I realize it's anecdotal, on the first night, we counted an average span between departures (from any of the four runways) of 4min38sec, for both 2hr periods combined.

If you don't count cargo-only ops off of 25L, then that average span between departures jumps to 9min12sec! Wild! :eek:

Also, took a pic that didn't really come out well with a cell phone; but there was a period after about 8pm where you couldn't see a single set of approach lights over Inglewood. Not one. At only 8 at night! For the second busiest airport on this side of the planet!


I flew MSY-LAX on a late SWA nonstop flight on Monday, arriving about 11pm. About 30 passengers. I can vouch for how quiet everything was at LAX. For the first time ever, when flying over the 110 and 405 freeways they were actually not easy to spot, because the usual river of headlights/taillights was not there! Some traffic, but very light.

The baggage arrived immediately. In the time it took to walk from the gate to baggage claim, my bags arrived at the second I approached the carousel - actually had to double-time it so they didn't pass me up. Stepping out of baggage claim and waiting for my ride was also surreal .... so quiet, instead of the usual LAX bustle and noise.

One thing that struck me as odd was that I did pause at the gate for a few seconds to look at the arrival/departure board, and I would estimate that over 50% of the flights were listed as cancelled! I'm not understanding why the flights would even be listed on the screen?
 
phllax
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Sun Apr 19, 2020 4:50 pm

CO953 wrote:
I flew MSY-LAX on a late SWA nonstop flight on Monday, arriving about 11pm. About 30 passengers.


What was the onboard service and experience like?
 
ericm2031
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Sun Apr 19, 2020 5:47 pm

CO953 wrote:
LAX772LR wrote:
One thing that struck me as odd was that I did pause at the gate for a few seconds to look at the arrival/departure board, and I would estimate that over 50% of the flights were listed as cancelled! I'm not understanding why the flights would even be listed on the screen?


Because they were canceled after the schedule was loaded and instead of doing a schedule change and removing the flight, they do cancellations.
 
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LAX772LR
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Mon Apr 20, 2020 6:38 am

ericm2031 wrote:
CO953 wrote:
LAX772LR wrote:
One thing that struck me as odd was that I did pause at the gate for a few seconds to look at the arrival/departure board, and I would estimate that over 50% of the flights were listed as cancelled! I'm not understanding why the flights would even be listed on the screen?


Because they were canceled after the schedule was loaded and instead of doing a schedule change and removing the flight, they do cancellations.

Huh? I never asked anything about this.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
MDW22L31C
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Wed Apr 22, 2020 6:36 pm

Looks like SWA Illinois One Theme jet has been parked at Long Beach for 3 to 4 days now at gate 1.

B6 has a A321 stored at the north side of the airport and 2 A320's where moved to the old C17 ramp area on the westside of the airport.
 
MDW22L31C
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Wed Apr 22, 2020 7:18 pm

Looks like Illinois one left this morning.
 
ericm2031
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Wed Apr 22, 2020 8:19 pm

LAX772LR wrote:
ericm2031 wrote:
CO953 wrote:


Because they were canceled after the schedule was loaded and instead of doing a schedule change and removing the flight, they do cancellations.

Huh? I never asked anything about this.


Sorry, I edited it wrong
 
MrBretz
Posts: 548
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Thu Apr 23, 2020 1:00 am

Here’s an interesting story with pictures of how empty LAX is. It is shocking. It says it may take 2 or 3 years for traffic to return to preCOVID levels.

https://www.latimes.com/california/stor ... ghost-town
 
cynlb
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Fri Apr 24, 2020 2:13 am

The Startling Stats From The SoCal Airports That Aren't LAX

https://laist.com/latest/post/20200423/ ... c-plummets
 
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VCVSpotter
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Re: Southern California Airports Covid19 Thread

Mon May 04, 2020 7:43 am

For LAX spotters/fans, here is a list that I created of some of the special charters, repatriation, and cargo-only flights that have passed through since the COVID-19 pandemic started. It will be the last spreadsheet, titled 'LAX Charter Flights.'

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... sp=sharing
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... edit#gid=0

Just a normal teenager juggling AP classes and airplanes. No biggie • Love the 747 & 777-9 • Farewell BA/KL 744s

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