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CPHGuard
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SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 9:07 am

Scandinavian Airlines has announced it will start a process to lay off 5.000 employees, which is approximately 50% of their total workforce.

1900 will be laid off in Sweden, 1.700 in Denmark and 1.300 in Norway.

The cause is directly related to Corona.

Link in danish:

https://www.bt.dk/erhverv/sas-vil-fyre-5000-ansatte
 
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Antaras
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 9:18 am

To be honest: those are common things nowadays.
It's hard to find a carrier which doesn't layoff staffs or telling staffs to stay at home in this pandemic. (I don't know if Air Koryo does....)
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Flyingsottsman
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 9:52 am

Antaras wrote:
To be honest: those are common things nowadays.
It's hard to find a carrier which doesn't layoff staffs or telling staffs to stay at home in this pandemic. (I don't know if Air Koryo does....)


I dont think Air Koryo would have a lot of staff, every time you see a trip report, there is one plane at the gate and half their fleet are parked up at remote stands or right out of the way taxi ways. SAS is like most airlines around the world at the moment with COVID 19, I know they were in trouble money wise before this, now we have to see if they can survive this, I hope they can fantastic airline.
 
minilinde
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 10:29 am

It says “up to” 5.000 is the press release
Types flown: A318, A319, A320, A321, A32N, A333, A343, A359, A380, AT42, AT72, B717, B733, B735, B736, B737, B738, B739, B744, B748, B763, B772, B773, B788, B789, C550, CRJ2, CRJ9, F50, ERJ190, MD80s/90, RJ100
 
Kilopond
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 11:08 am

The thing is: SAS has already temporarily furloughed 90% of the workforce. But now the company does not expect the aviation crisis to be over in a few years, so that there will be permanent lay-offs.

[...]Given the current [travel] restrictions, SAS expects limited activity in the important summer season. In addition, it will most likely take some years before demand returns to the levels seen before Covid-19. [...]


https://www.thelocal.se/20200428/sas-to ... rus-crisis

Half of the pilot jobs effected, says Swedish Aftonbladet:

https://www.aftonbladet.se/minekonomi/a ... r-tillbaka
 
VSMUT
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 11:24 am

https://check-in.dk/sas-vil-afskedige-5-000-ansatte/

1900 in Sweden, 1700 in Denmark and 1300 in Norway.
 
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Embajador3
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 11:28 am

So what happen to those bases in Spain and UK?
Flying Together
 
VSMUT
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 11:32 am

Embajador3 wrote:
So what happen to those bases in Spain and UK?


I haven't seen any news on them, but over in the Nordic aviation topic, posters are saying that SAS Ireland is finished.
 
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SASViking
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 11:37 am

Embajador3 wrote:
So what happen to those bases in Spain and UK?

There's nothing official about SAIL, but I would expect them to be gone and the A320Neos to be transfered to SAS mainline
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
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Embajador3
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 11:40 am

SASViking wrote:
Embajador3 wrote:
So what happen to those bases in Spain and UK?

There's nothing official about SAIL, but I would expect them to be gone and the A320Neos to be transfered to SAS mainline


Yeah, I think SAIL is a goner too. I could not find any links on google, though.
Flying Together
 
workhorse
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 12:16 pm

Any information on what part of the fleet will be cut? I suspect this spells the death knell of the 340s and possibly the 737s?
 
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SASViking
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 12:20 pm

workhorse wrote:
Any information on what part of the fleet will be cut? I suspect this spells the death knell of the 340s and possibly the 737s?

The A340's are very likely to be gone, I wouldn't be surprised if most of the 737's went, but not all as I believe that there's quite a bit of training on the A320Neos to be done for the Norwegian crews.
Some of the A319's and A320Ceos is also a possibility
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
Toinou
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 12:26 pm

workhorse wrote:
Any information on what part of the fleet will be cut? I suspect this spells the death knell of the 340s and possibly the 737s?

Are 737 the smaller planes they have?
I'm wondering what kind of aircraft they need to serve some small markets in northern Sweden.
 
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SASViking
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 12:31 pm

Toinou wrote:
workhorse wrote:
Any information on what part of the fleet will be cut? I suspect this spells the death knell of the 340s and possibly the 737s?

Are 737 the smaller planes they have?
I'm wondering what kind of aircraft they need to serve some small markets in northern Sweden.

The 737-700's and A319's are the smallest aircraft operated by SAS. Smaller markets are served by ATR 72-600's operated by Xfly and/or CRJ-900's operated by CityJet, Xfly or Air Nostrum
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
Toinou
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 12:43 pm

Thanks for the answer. So if they stop using 737, they still have something to those flights I mentioned, but with quite a downgauge.
 
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SASViking
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 1:08 pm

Toinou wrote:
Thanks for the answer. So if they stop using 737, they still have something to those flights I mentioned, but with quite a downgauge.

Either that or upgauge them to A320's
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
IWMBH
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 1:27 pm

workhorse wrote:
Any information on what part of the fleet will be cut? I suspect this spells the death knell of the 340s and possibly the 737s?


Probably, the A340 and the 737 where already on their way out with replacements already being delivered.
Did SAS receive any government funds?
 
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JetBuddy
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 2:23 pm

I think the 737 phase out will be expedited. Same thing with A340.

There's something to be said for operating an older yet fully paid for fleet, especially for legacy airlines with a really good maintenance system like SAS Teknisk. And the low oil prices helps.

But the process of phasing out the 737s has already began. New A320 series are arriving, and cancelling orders is not a straight forward process. The oil prices will go back up again, like they always do.

With regards to long haul, I believe the A340s will be parked. But sooner than originally planned. The interesting part will be what to do with the A330 and A350 situation. The A350 has the highest second hand value of all airliners. They will remain valuable even in this crisis. So if SAS wanted to, they could keep the A330 Enhanced and return/cancel delivery of the A350s. That would leave an all A320 / A330 fleet which would be very economical. But I do believe SAS will keep and take delivery of the A350s. Maybe the remaining deliveries will be delayed somewhat.
 
workhorse
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 2:50 pm

SASViking wrote:
workhorse wrote:
Any information on what part of the fleet will be cut? I suspect this spells the death knell of the 340s and possibly the 737s?

The A340's are very likely to be gone, I wouldn't be surprised if most of the 737's went, but not all as I believe that there's quite a bit of training on the A320Neos to be done for the Norwegian crews.
Some of the A319's and A320Ceos is also a possibility


Yeah, the 319s are also relatively old (delivered in 2006-2007 if I remember well). There are also the 321s that are even older.

I guess the two big questions are: 1) what the traffic well look like? 2) what will be negotiated with Airbus and the financial stakeholders re: deliveries of new aircraft. In other words, will it be cheaper to retire older aircraft and continue flying with new deliveries or defer/cancel new deliveries and cling on the 319s and 321s a little bit longer.

There are obvious benefits of getting rid of the 340s and 737s (specific maintenance certifications, specific spare and consummable parts stocks, separate pilot pools), the 319s and the 321s less so.
 
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AAR
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 3:28 pm

A340 + A330 the old ones from 2003/2004 will go - agree both B737 and older A320 family can risk to be phased out A319/320/321 ... SAS might cut 2 to 3 routes Hong Kong is gone - Miami ? Los Angeles ? SAS will receive 3 new A321LR soon - one is almost ready for delivery
 
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SASViking
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 4:10 pm

AAR wrote:
A340 + A330 the old ones from 2003/2004 will go - agree both B737 and older A320 family can risk to be phased out A319/320/321 ... SAS might cut 2 to 3 routes Hong Kong is gone - Miami ? Los Angeles ? SAS will receive 3 new A321LR soon - one is almost ready for delivery

MIA is definately at risk as it's a seasonal leisure-heavy route, I don't believe that LAX is at risk. I find og likely that either CPH-PVG or CPH-PEK will be gone. I also think that CPH-BOS will be cancelled or perhaps summer seasonal, and that SAS will use the first A321LR on OSL-EWR, one of the ORD routes or CPH-IAD as a replacement for the A330/A340's
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
Amsterdam
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 4:19 pm

Why so many people.
Isn’t that almost 50% of the staff?
If Lufthansa does the same that would mean 70.000 people exit.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 4:32 pm

That's 4,900 of 10,445 full time equivalent employees reported January 2020. Don't overlook that LH Group has some other lines of business not heavily represented at SAS.
 
Someone83
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 4:40 pm

Amsterdam wrote:
Why so many people.
Isn’t that almost 50% of the staff?
If Lufthansa does the same that would mean 70.000 people exit.


Differnet rules regarding furloughs and temporarily lay offs, means that SAS actually has to do it this way, on order to shed costs
 
Someone83
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 4:42 pm

AAR wrote:
A340 + A330 the old ones from 2003/2004 will go - agree both B737 and older A320 family can risk to be phased out A319/320/321 ... SAS might cut 2 to 3 routes Hong Kong is gone - Miami ? Los Angeles ? SAS will receive 3 new A321LR soon - one is almost ready for delivery


SAS is only (or was supposed to) get one A321LR this year, the second one is not scheduled untill Summer 2021

SASViking wrote:
MIA is definately at risk as it's a seasonal leisure-heavy route, I don't believe that LAX is at risk. I find og likely that either CPH-PVG or CPH-PEK will be gone. I also think that CPH-BOS will be cancelled or perhaps summer seasonal, and that SAS will use the first A321LR on OSL-EWR, one of the ORD routes or CPH-IAD as a replacement for the A330/A340's


The passenger number on OSL-EWR has for the last few years been good, and not lower load factors that CPH/ARN. In addition the cargo capacity on the widebodies are needed
 
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SASViking
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Tue Apr 28, 2020 5:41 pm

Someone83 wrote:
AAR wrote:
A340 + A330 the old ones from 2003/2004 will go - agree both B737 and older A320 family can risk to be phased out A319/320/321 ... SAS might cut 2 to 3 routes Hong Kong is gone - Miami ? Los Angeles ? SAS will receive 3 new A321LR soon - one is almost ready for delivery


SAS is only (or was supposed to) get one A321LR this year, the second one is not scheduled untill Summer 2021

SASViking wrote:
MIA is definately at risk as it's a seasonal leisure-heavy route, I don't believe that LAX is at risk. I find og likely that either CPH-PVG or CPH-PEK will be gone. I also think that CPH-BOS will be cancelled or perhaps summer seasonal, and that SAS will use the first A321LR on OSL-EWR, one of the ORD routes or CPH-IAD as a replacement for the A330/A340's


The passenger number on OSL-EWR has for the last few years been good, and not lower load factors that CPH/ARN. In addition the cargo capacity on the widebodies are needed

Sure, the loads on OSL-EWR have improved but OSL is still the smallest/least important LH market (perhaps even international in general) for SAS compared to CPH and ARN. We also saw this with the cuts when the lockdown began. OSL-EWR was cut whilst CPH-EWR and ARN-EWR remained.
Types flown: A319, A320, A32N, A321, A332, A333, A343, AT43, AT75, AT76, B717, B732, B735, B736, B737, B738, B752, B753, CRJ9, DC10, DH4D, DHC3, E135, E145, E175, E190, E195, F100, MD11, MD81, MD82, MD87, RJ1H
 
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JetBuddy
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Wed Apr 29, 2020 3:06 am

SASViking wrote:
Someone83 wrote:
AAR wrote:
A340 + A330 the old ones from 2003/2004 will go - agree both B737 and older A320 family can risk to be phased out A319/320/321 ... SAS might cut 2 to 3 routes Hong Kong is gone - Miami ? Los Angeles ? SAS will receive 3 new A321LR soon - one is almost ready for delivery


SAS is only (or was supposed to) get one A321LR this year, the second one is not scheduled untill Summer 2021

SASViking wrote:
MIA is definately at risk as it's a seasonal leisure-heavy route, I don't believe that LAX is at risk. I find og likely that either CPH-PVG or CPH-PEK will be gone. I also think that CPH-BOS will be cancelled or perhaps summer seasonal, and that SAS will use the first A321LR on OSL-EWR, one of the ORD routes or CPH-IAD as a replacement for the A330/A340's


The passenger number on OSL-EWR has for the last few years been good, and not lower load factors that CPH/ARN. In addition the cargo capacity on the widebodies are needed

Sure, the loads on OSL-EWR have improved but OSL is still the smallest/least important LH market (perhaps even international in general) for SAS compared to CPH and ARN. We also saw this with the cuts when the lockdown began. OSL-EWR was cut whilst CPH-EWR and ARN-EWR remained.


The market from Oslo to New York is one that you either capture with a direct route, or you don't capture much of it all. There's zero incentive to fly to the US via CPH or ARN. It's usually shorter and more convenient to fly via AMS or LHR.

With regards to cargo, OSL is by far the largest cargo hub in the Nordic countries. Half of all air cargo moving through the Nordics is to and from Norway.
 
davidjohnson6
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:18 am

If SAS is to significantly reduce headcount, when will flight schedules be adjusted to reflect this ?
 
a350lover
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:32 am

Has the airline internally showed to those affected any level of compromise to "readmit" them in their positions if at any time their positions are back needed?
 
Toinou
Posts: 257
Joined: Sun Apr 14, 2019 8:21 am

Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:36 am

There is also the possibility to offer people part-time job. Some may prefer to earn less rather than to earn nothing. I guess this would be doable for most jobs in an airline but I don't know how common it is in that part of the world.
 
CPHGuard
Topic Author
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Re: SAS to layoff half of their staff

Wed Apr 29, 2020 1:48 pm

a350lover wrote:
Has the airline internally showed to those affected any level of compromise to "readmit" them in their positions if at any time their positions are back needed?


There are talks in place, about "loaning out" part of the danish staff to the government, to help with the Covid-19 testing.

I've also read that unions are open to discuss part time employment for some staff, in order to reduce the number of layoffs.

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