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raylee67
Topic Author
Posts: 934
Joined: Mon Oct 24, 2011 11:06 pm

Many strange flights on HKG pax arrival list - what are those flights?

Wed Apr 29, 2020 4:01 pm

Looking at the Apr 30 passenger flight arrival list on the airport's website ( https://www.hongkongairport.com/en/flig ... enger.page ), there are a lot of strange flights. Anyone know what flights are those? Are those repatriation flights or cargo flights operated with passenger aircraft? If they are cargo flights operating with passenger aircraft, why are they listed as "passenger arrival"? And they seem to be parked at passenger gates too.

These are the non-scheduled arrivals for Apr 30 on the passenger arrival list. I don't see these flights on the flight status or flight schedule pages on airlines' own websites too.
VN 6598 from SGN
VN 6560 from SGN
AA 9427 from LAX
GA 8764 from CGK
SQ 8252 from SIN
FJ 1391 from NAN
PK 8871 from ISB - this one I think is the repatriation flight chartered by HK gov to get HK citizens stuck in Pakistan
AC 7233 from YVR
NZ 6173 from AKL
UA 2865 from ORD
UA 2774 from LAX
AC 7231 from YYZ
CX 8126 from CHC

Many flights above are even flown daily, e.g. I see UA 2774 and 2865 on Flightradar for many days. They are definitely not bookable on UA website though.
Last edited by raylee67 on Wed Apr 29, 2020 4:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
319/20/21 332/33 342/43/45 359/51 388 707 717 732/36/3G/38/39 74R/42/43/44/4E/48 757 762/63 772/7L/73/7W 788/89 D10 M80 135/40/45 175/90 DH1/4 CRJ/R7 L10
AY LH OU SR BA FI LX
AA DL UA NW AC CP WS FL NK PD
CI NH SQ KA CX JL BR OZ TG KE CA CZ NZ JQ RS
 
x1234
Posts: 946
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2016 3:50 pm

Re: Many strange flights on HKG arrival list - what are those flights?

Wed Apr 29, 2020 4:08 pm

The UA thread indicated the UA flights are for cargo (PPE). They’re probably all cargo or repatriation flights.
 
dfw88
Posts: 130
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2018 6:25 pm

Re: Many strange flights on HKG arrival list - what are those flights?

Wed Apr 29, 2020 4:09 pm

raylee67 wrote:
AA 9427 from LAX


AA has been doing a number of cargo-only flights to HKG, so I would guess that's what that one is. It seems likely that some of the others are too.
 
blueflyer
Posts: 4352
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2006 4:17 am

Re: Many strange flights on HKG pax arrival list - what are those flights?

Wed Apr 29, 2020 4:36 pm

UA2xxx and AC7xxx are cargo flights operated by passenger aircraft.
 
raylee67
Topic Author
Posts: 934
Joined: Mon Oct 24, 2011 11:06 pm

Re: Many strange flights on HKG pax arrival list - what are those flights?

Wed Apr 29, 2020 5:03 pm

blueflyer wrote:
UA2xxx and AC7xxx are cargo flights operated by passenger aircraft.


Hm... Thanks for all the responses.

Interesting that the airport lists these as pax flights rather than cargo flights. And they are parked at pax gates with bridges rather than at the cargo aprons.
319/20/21 332/33 342/43/45 359/51 388 707 717 732/36/3G/38/39 74R/42/43/44/4E/48 757 762/63 772/7L/73/7W 788/89 D10 M80 135/40/45 175/90 DH1/4 CRJ/R7 L10
AY LH OU SR BA FI LX
AA DL UA NW AC CP WS FL NK PD
CI NH SQ KA CX JL BR OZ TG KE CA CZ NZ JQ RS
 
DTVG
Posts: 61
Joined: Sat Aug 17, 2019 10:06 pm

Re: Many strange flights on HKG pax arrival list - what are those flights?

Wed Apr 29, 2020 5:22 pm

raylee67 wrote:
blueflyer wrote:
UA2xxx and AC7xxx are cargo flights operated by passenger aircraft.


Hm... Thanks for all the responses.

Interesting that the airport lists these as pax flights rather than cargo flights. And they are parked at pax gates with bridges rather than at the cargo aprons.


Maybe no space at the cargo stands, I also assume some stands are also used to store aircraft, plus I passenger stand use is probably very low right now.
 
cltbna
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2016 12:00 am

Re: Many strange flights on HKG pax arrival list - what are those flights?

Wed Apr 29, 2020 5:37 pm

These are passenger planes. So prolly only unloading/loading the bellies? No?
 
ZK-NBT
Posts: 7537
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2000 5:42 pm

Re: Many strange flights on HKG pax arrival list - what are those flights?

Wed Apr 29, 2020 6:16 pm

NZ is freight, CX 8126 from CHC is repatriation people going home to the UK.
 
raylee67
Topic Author
Posts: 934
Joined: Mon Oct 24, 2011 11:06 pm

Re: Many strange flights on HKG pax arrival list - what are those flights?

Wed Apr 29, 2020 6:44 pm

DTVG wrote:
plus I passenger stand use is probably very low right now.


That's for sure. HKG is reporting about 200 to 500 arriving pax daily now, down from average daily pax of 196,000, i.e. a 99.75% reduction.

CX, which flies over 40% of flights normally at HKG, is only operating 3% of normal pax flight schedule.
319/20/21 332/33 342/43/45 359/51 388 707 717 732/36/3G/38/39 74R/42/43/44/4E/48 757 762/63 772/7L/73/7W 788/89 D10 M80 135/40/45 175/90 DH1/4 CRJ/R7 L10
AY LH OU SR BA FI LX
AA DL UA NW AC CP WS FL NK PD
CI NH SQ KA CX JL BR OZ TG KE CA CZ NZ JQ RS
 
raylee67
Topic Author
Posts: 934
Joined: Mon Oct 24, 2011 11:06 pm

Re: Many strange flights on HKG pax arrival list - what are those flights?

Wed Apr 29, 2020 6:48 pm

cltbna wrote:
These are passenger planes. So prolly only unloading/loading the bellies? No?


AC did remove all econ seats on their pax 77W that they use for cargo flights, so that cargo can be loaded on main deck, although there is no cargo door to the main deck so whatever loaded onto main deck will most likely be light and small boxes thru pax doors.
319/20/21 332/33 342/43/45 359/51 388 707 717 732/36/3G/38/39 74R/42/43/44/4E/48 757 762/63 772/7L/73/7W 788/89 D10 M80 135/40/45 175/90 DH1/4 CRJ/R7 L10
AY LH OU SR BA FI LX
AA DL UA NW AC CP WS FL NK PD
CI NH SQ KA CX JL BR OZ TG KE CA CZ NZ JQ RS
 
VRHNM
Posts: 123
Joined: Mon Mar 13, 2017 2:02 pm

Re: Many strange flights on HKG pax arrival list - what are those flights?

Wed Apr 29, 2020 6:55 pm

raylee67 wrote:
cltbna wrote:
These are passenger planes. So prolly only unloading/loading the bellies? No?


AC did remove all econ seats on their pax 77W that they use for cargo flights, so that cargo can be loaded on main deck, although there is no cargo door to the main deck so whatever loaded onto main deck will most likely be light and small boxes thru pax doors.


An airport worker at HKG noted that a VJ A321 carrying cargo in the pax cabin took 5+ hours to load by hand...
 
blueflyer
Posts: 4352
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2006 4:17 am

Re: Many strange flights on HKG pax arrival list - what are those flights?

Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:04 pm

raylee67 wrote:
Interesting that the airport lists these as pax flights rather than cargo flights. And they are parked at pax gates with bridges rather than at the cargo aprons.

Officially, most of these flights operate as passenger flights under the bilateral and multi-lateral treaties regulating air traffic between countries. There are no provision to stop airlines from operating passenger flights full of cargo in the hold and zero passengers in the cabin (and even if there were, I doubt any government would choose this crisis to enforce them). The grey area would be flights with cargo in the cabin. Perhaps if countries decided to be strict, they would have to be reclassified as cargo flights. With economies around the globe hurting as it is, I think very few countries would stand on principles if it would further hurt international trade or impede flights carrying medical freight.

As for parking at the gates, there are multiple possible reasons, depending on the airport. At some airports, different handlers work full-cargo and passenger flights, so the ground handler for a particular airline may not have the equipment, facilities, and/or authorization to operate out of the cargo apron. Even when the same company handles passengers and cargo aircraft, only the cargo apron has equipment to handle main deck cargo but every gate should be equipped for belly cargo, so might as well keep the cargo apron for aircraft that need the equipment already there (yes, you can move the equipment, but it takes less time and efforts to park the plane where the equipment is, than to move the equipment to where the plane is). Gates are not at a premium at any airport in the world, and sometimes are even closer to the cargo terminal (not every cargo warehouse has airside access to a cargo apron).
 
factsonly
Posts: 2997
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2012 3:08 pm

Re: Many strange flights on HKG pax arrival list - what are those flights?

Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:28 pm

Also air cargo rates for HKG are up, making pax cargo flights a financially attractive option.

Read Air Cargo News below:

- Air cargo rates from Hong Kong surge -
28 / 04 / 2020
By Damian Brett


Airfreight rates out of China continued to climb last week, while prices from Hong Kong were also on the up as shippers looked to tranship through the world’s largest air cargo hub.

The latest figures from TAC Index show that last week average air cargo rates from Shanghai to North America increased by 9.1% compared with a week earlier to a record for the index (starting March 2016) of $9.34 per kg. At the start of March, rates on the route stood at $3.01 per kg.

From Shanghai to Europe there was a 1.6% week-on-week increase — slower than recent weeks — to an index record of $8.93 per kg. At the start of March prices stood at $2.32 per kg.

While the rate of price increases appears to be slowing out of Shanghai, the opposite is true from Hong Kong. Average rates from Hong Kong to North America increased by 26.8% week on week to $6.67 per kg a new record for the route (for the first time this year).

To Europe there was a 13.9% increase to $5.31 per kg, also a record.

Airfreight derivatives broker Freight Investor Services (FIS) suggested that companies may be looking to tranship through Hong Kong to avoid the cost of Shanghai.

“It wouldn’t be too much of a stretch to suggest shippers moving non-medical goods might be using the spread between Hong Kong and Shanghai as a geographic arbitrage opportunity,” FIS said.

“Shanghai’s price rises remain meteoric however it remains quite clear that most of this is still atop the PPE price balloon. North America now sits relatively apart from the rest of the world in terms of virus cases, deaths and subsequently its relief effort.”

The broker also pointed out that automotive factories are beginning to re-open in Germany, which could add to market dynamics as they grapple with the higher rates while sourcing parts.

https://www.aircargonews.net/airlines/a ... ong-surge/

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