I’ve always been intrigued by HND’s enormous passenger throughput given the relatively low number of gates. Take a look at the overall infrastructure of HND, which actually seems smaller than neighboring NRT. How on earth are they able to turn over 87 million passengers per year?

Sdmccray1984 wrote:

I’ve always been intrigued by HND’s enormous passenger throughput given the relatively low number of gates. Take a look at the overall infrastructure of HND, which actually seems smaller than neighboring NRT. How on earth are they able to turn over 87 million passengers per year?

How many narrowbody aircraft do you see at HND?

Also, according to OAG, FUK-HND was the fifth busiest domestic route in the world in 2019 with 39,406 flights, followed by CTS-HND in seventh place with 39,271 flights.

CTS-HND was mostly widebodies while FUK-HND still saw quite a few widebody aircraft.

Ishrion wrote:

Sdmccray1984 wrote:

I’ve always been intrigued by HND’s enormous passenger throughput given the relatively low number of gates. Take a look at the overall infrastructure of HND, which actually seems smaller than neighboring NRT. How on earth are they able to turn over 87 million passengers per year?

How many narrowbody aircraft do you see at HND?

Also, according to OAG, FUK-HND was the fifth busiest domestic route in the world in 2019 with 39,406 flights, followed by CTS-HND in seventh place with 39,271 flights.

CTS-HND was mostly widebodies while FUK-HND still saw quite a few widebody aircraft.

Not just wide bodies, but extremely high density Japanese domestic config aircraft. For reference, ANA seats 405 on its 777-200, 514 on its 777-300, 335 on its 787-8, and 395 on its 787-9 on domestically configured aircraft.

Remember that back when domestic flights were operated by 747s, those aircraft were also configured to seat over 500 passengers per flight.

In addition, they can turn an aircraft in about 40 minutes. 400 people off, 400 people on, and out it goes. And, they have 4 runways. What will be remarkable is how much the numbers increase now that the airspace restrictions have changed and they can utilize more runways throughout the day. We won't know the true effect of that until travel returns to pre-Covid19 levels.

Lots of high-density widebodies used on Domestic and short regional routes. It's closer to Downtown Tokyo area compared to Narita, so business people prefer this airport.

B777-200, B777-300 and B767 dominates the routes in this airport.

Tokyo777 wrote:

In addition, they can turn an aircraft in about 40 minutes. 400 people off, 400 people on, and out it goes. And, they have 4 runways. What will be remarkable is how much the numbers increase now that the airspace restrictions have changed and they can utilize more runways throughout the day. We won't know the true effect of that until travel returns to pre-Covid19 levels.

There is now a small but growing number of people in Shinjuku, Shibuya and Minato areas of Tokyo who don't want the new afternoon arrival approach and are petitioning the government not to finalize it. Since Corona, this arrival approach has not gone forward as there isn't as much traffic.

As for the total pax numbers.
HND 24hr operations on 4 runways vs NRT's 16hr operations on 2 runways
Two domestic terminals with many high density routes like HND-FUK, HND-ITM, HND-CTS
One international terminal with multiple flights per day in higher density configurations on HND-SEL and HND-SHA
NH is expanding their domestic terminal to handle international arrivals and departures (Star to move most operations there).
Delta moved their operations from NRT to HND (except NRT-HNL)
Many other airlines are moving operations from NRT to HND or adding flights to HND; BA, AY, LH, and more

Also, even though shinkansen is nice. It's not as affordable as people think. Non-reserved is around $90 or more for one way ticket. Sometimes you could get $50/$60 for flight instead.

centrair wrote:

Tokyo777 wrote:

In addition, they can turn an aircraft in about 40 minutes. 400 people off, 400 people on, and out it goes. And, they have 4 runways. What will be remarkable is how much the numbers increase now that the airspace restrictions have changed and they can utilize more runways throughout the day. We won't know the true effect of that until travel returns to pre-Covid19 levels.

There is now a small but growing number of people in Shinjuku, Shibuya and Minato areas of Tokyo who don't want the new afternoon arrival approach and are petitioning the government not to finalize it. Since Corona, this arrival approach has not gone forward as there isn't as much traffic.

As for the total pax numbers.
HND 24hr operations on 4 runways vs NRT's 16hr operations on 2 runways
Two domestic terminals with many high density routes like HND-FUK, HND-ITM, HND-CTS
One international terminal with multiple flights per day in higher density configurations on HND-SEL and HND-SHA
NH is expanding their domestic terminal to handle international arrivals and departures (Star to move most operations there).
Delta moved their operations from NRT to HND (except NRT-HNL)
Many other airlines are moving operations from NRT to HND or adding flights to HND; BA, AY, LH, and more

Both NH and JL use long-haul standard widebody to SHA/SEL

The most efficient turnaround I have ever seen in my life was an Air Do 767. And it took about 20 minutes to board the entire aircraft. HND-CTS. Also it was much cleaner and in better condition than any US3 767 I had been on in the last decade, despite having old seats and projectors still... it was like a museum. I think the Japanese are really on another level with domestic air travel.

HND is actually the bigger airport - more runways, more gates, bigger terminals and I think it occupies a greater area. NRT really isn’t all that big. Japanese airports also have tight slot restrictions because of the surrounding airspace and noise abatement. Because of the massive travel demand and tight restrictions, airlines are inclined to use large aircraft for their domestic routes, despite of the short distances flown. That runs up the numbers at HND.

chunhimlai wrote:

centrair wrote:

Tokyo777 wrote:

In addition, they can turn an aircraft in about 40 minutes. 400 people off, 400 people on, and out it goes. And, they have 4 runways. What will be remarkable is how much the numbers increase now that the airspace restrictions have changed and they can utilize more runways throughout the day. We won't know the true effect of that until travel returns to pre-Covid19 levels.

There is now a small but growing number of people in Shinjuku, Shibuya and Minato areas of Tokyo who don't want the new afternoon arrival approach and are petitioning the government not to finalize it. Since Corona, this arrival approach has not gone forward as there isn't as much traffic.

As for the total pax numbers.
HND 24hr operations on 4 runways vs NRT's 16hr operations on 2 runways
Two domestic terminals with many high density routes like HND-FUK, HND-ITM, HND-CTS
One international terminal with multiple flights per day in higher density configurations on HND-SEL and HND-SHA
NH is expanding their domestic terminal to handle international arrivals and departures (Star to move most operations there).
Delta moved their operations from NRT to HND (except NRT-HNL)
Many other airlines are moving operations from NRT to HND or adding flights to HND; BA, AY, LH, and more

Both NH and JL use long-haul standard widebody to SHA/SEL

Not 100% true either as NH and JL has some very low density (i.e. 212 seats 77W) for some "premium" long-haul routes. But yes, JL and NH has a completely separate Domestic and Intl fleet, down to their 738s.

Sdmccray1984 wrote:

I’ve always been intrigued by HND’s enormous passenger throughput given the relatively low number of gates. Take a look at the overall infrastructure of HND, which actually seems smaller than neighboring NRT. How on earth are they able to turn over 87 million passengers per year?

Remote stands are the answer - that adds something like 10-12 gates easily per terminal.

Remember the Tokyo metro area is the largest city by population in the world , lots of people in and out

zakuivcustom wrote:

chunhimlai wrote:

centrair wrote:

There is now a small but growing number of people in Shinjuku, Shibuya and Minato areas of Tokyo who don't want the new afternoon arrival approach and are petitioning the government not to finalize it. Since Corona, this arrival approach has not gone forward as there isn't as much traffic.

As for the total pax numbers.
HND 24hr operations on 4 runways vs NRT's 16hr operations on 2 runways
Two domestic terminals with many high density routes like HND-FUK, HND-ITM, HND-CTS
One international terminal with multiple flights per day in higher density configurations on HND-SEL and HND-SHA
NH is expanding their domestic terminal to handle international arrivals and departures (Star to move most operations there).
Delta moved their operations from NRT to HND (except NRT-HNL)
Many other airlines are moving operations from NRT to HND or adding flights to HND; BA, AY, LH, and more

Both NH and JL use long-haul standard widebody to SHA/SEL

Not 100% true either as NH and JL has some very low density (i.e. 212 seats 77W) for some "premium" long-haul routes. But yes, JL and NH has a completely separate Domestic and Intl fleet, down to their 738s.

Sdmccray1984 wrote:

I’ve always been intrigued by HND’s enormous passenger throughput given the relatively low number of gates. Take a look at the overall infrastructure of HND, which actually seems smaller than neighboring NRT. How on earth are they able to turn over 87 million passengers per year?

Remote stands are the answer - that adds something like 10-12 gates easily per terminal.

Not always. JL 777s are long-haul configured, JL 788s flying to GMP and SHA are usually regionally configured (with angle-flat business class). NH 788/789s flying HND to East Asia are usually regionally configured.

MLIT (DOT of Japan) consider building 5th runway of HND after Olympic

somehow HND doesn't look like it (at least T1 and T2) but it is a massive place

Demand flying among big cities in Japan is huge. After all most population is concentrated in metropolitan areas like Tokyo, Osaka and Nagoya etc.

In addition Japanese government has been notorious for putting too much resources in Tokyo and ignoring the development of rural Japan hence it makes HND even more prominent than ever.

chunhimlai wrote:

MLIT (DOT of Japan) consider building 5th runway of HND after Olympic

Where did you find that? I’ve been looking for that graphic for ages.