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FlyHossD
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Thu May 14, 2020 2:02 am

Revelation wrote:
Smisek would walk past a dollar to pick up a penny...


Truer words have never been spoken.

And how has he managed to avoid being charged?
My statements do not represent my former employer or my current employer and are my opinions only.
 
airzona11
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Thu May 14, 2020 2:18 am

Isn’t New York a bad example, JFK and LaGuardia service the same market? I would hazard a guess that United has other airports With less competition on the major routes, versus EWR.
 
strfyr51
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Thu May 14, 2020 3:52 am

max999 wrote:
pezzy669 wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:

That implies carriers at LGA and EWR don't compete for EWR passengers. You really want that to be your starting position?


Right!

I think even in "normal" times ~4-5 months ago I think DL was nipping at the heels of UA as far as market share even with their sub-optimal split LGA/JFK hub operation. With that said about the split hubs I would be curious about the yields between UA in its consolidated hub (with presumably higher number of connecting) and AA and DL with their split hubs (with presumably higher O&D).


I think it suits UA not to compete, they would rather just stick to their EWR fortress hub. Case in point: AA and DL have a presence in all three NYC area airports JFK, LGA, and EWR. While UA sticks out like a sore thumb because they have zero presence in JFK and they don't want to compete there.

Before the Merger UA had a sizeable operation at EWR. After the merger? Co-convinced UA to end the JFK operation and go all in at EWR. It made sense since we didn't own a terminal at JFK anyway. Many at UA doubted the move but chance favors he bold and EWR? was most definitely BOLD!! It's not Hub Fortress,
But it's close!! and with IAD right down the road? What can United complain about?
 
UA444
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Thu May 14, 2020 4:19 am

strfyr51 wrote:
max999 wrote:
pezzy669 wrote:

Right!

I think even in "normal" times ~4-5 months ago I think DL was nipping at the heels of UA as far as market share even with their sub-optimal split LGA/JFK hub operation. With that said about the split hubs I would be curious about the yields between UA in its consolidated hub (with presumably higher number of connecting) and AA and DL with their split hubs (with presumably higher O&D).


I think it suits UA not to compete, they would rather just stick to their EWR fortress hub. Case in point: AA and DL have a presence in all three NYC area airports JFK, LGA, and EWR. While UA sticks out like a sore thumb because they have zero presence in JFK and they don't want to compete there.

Before the Merger UA had a sizeable operation at EWR. After the merger? Co-convinced UA to end the JFK operation and go all in at EWR. It made sense since we didn't own a terminal at JFK anyway. Many at UA doubted the move but chance favors he bold and EWR? was most definitely BOLD!! It's not Hub Fortress,
But it's close!! and with IAD right down the road? What can United complain about?

They lost several corporate contracts with closing JFK and LAX suffered from loss of yield.

NYC isn’t like London or the Bay Area where serving LGW or OAK isn’t a huge deal. It’s still mind boggling Smisek thought it was a good idea.
 
dstblj52
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Thu May 14, 2020 4:25 am

UA444 wrote:
strfyr51 wrote:
max999 wrote:

I think it suits UA not to compete, they would rather just stick to their EWR fortress hub. Case in point: AA and DL have a presence in all three NYC area airports JFK, LGA, and EWR. While UA sticks out like a sore thumb because they have zero presence in JFK and they don't want to compete there.

Before the Merger UA had a sizeable operation at EWR. After the merger? Co-convinced UA to end the JFK operation and go all in at EWR. It made sense since we didn't own a terminal at JFK anyway. Many at UA doubted the move but chance favors he bold and EWR? was most definitely BOLD!! It's not Hub Fortress,
But it's close!! and with IAD right down the road? What can United complain about?

They lost several corporate contracts with closing JFK and LAX suffered from loss of yield.

NYC isn’t like London or the Bay Area where serving LGW or OAK isn’t a huge deal. It’s still mind boggling Smisek thought it was a good idea.

Well no LGW or OAK both have lower yields then LAX or LHR but there are advantages to having a fortress hub like EWR it certainly makes it easier to flow connections then it is for delta with its two hub situation between JFK and LGA which definitely creates a Chicago like situation cutting aircraft gauge
 
tpaewr
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Thu May 14, 2020 6:35 am

Cointrin330 wrote:
tpaewr wrote:
The EWR hub is completely from CO. I think Peoples flew LGW, maybe other.

But at some point CO from EWR serviced LGW LHR STN BHX BRS MAN EDI GLA BFS DUB SNN LIS MAD BCN CDG ORY BRU AMS STR DUS CGN FRA MUC TXL ZRH GVA CPH ARN OSL MXP FCO ATH TLV DEL BOM , CAI SVO were out for sale but never launched ACC and JNB flew with WO M11. That is just TATL.

Since the merger UA added some seasonal service such as KEF and OPO but nothing has grown to S America or Asia. All of that came from CO.


With COVID now we won’t see anything but cuts for sometime now :(


The EWR hub's origins are the PeoplEXPRESS operation, though I don't recall PE operating as a true hub and spoke carrier per se, but its largest base was EWR which at the time of PE's launch, EWR was underutilized. PE flew TATL to LGW, BRU using 747s (I think ORY too but could be wrong). The CO TATL route map from EWR was cumulatively LGW (then LHR from 2008), MAN, EDI, SNN, DUB, BFS, BRS, AMS, BRU, OSL, CPH, ARN, ORY (then CDG), BCN, MAD, FCO, MXP, LIS, FRA, MUC, CGN, TXL, ZRH, GVA, ATH (on and off, seasonally), TLV, STR, DUS, DEL, BOM, GLA, BHX, STN. CAI was announced, but was never launched due to the Arab Spring events in Egypt. SVO was planned, but never launched. ACC and JNB were never operated by CO metal from EWR. To Asia, CO flew to NRT, PVG, PEK, HKG. To South America, CO had GIG and GRU (GIG was axed after 9/11), LIM, BOG, and for a brief time, operated EWR-LIM-SCL, then flew SCL nonstop briefly, but dropped the route ( I may be wrong in that SCL became a tag of the EWR-LIM route). Believe CO may have had CCS and perhaps GYE and Quito or maybe not, Those last two, I do not remember.






Great recap! I was too lazy cover the whole system.

Just a few random thoughts. Before Copa CO used PTY as a scissor hub. Like wise with LIM when both IAH & EWR landed am so they tagged on VVI & a struggling SCL.


CNF was another tag off GIG using a767-424
 
Cointrin330
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Thu May 14, 2020 11:23 am

tpaewr wrote:
Cointrin330 wrote:
tpaewr wrote:
The EWR hub is completely from CO. I think Peoples flew LGW, maybe other.

But at some point CO from EWR serviced LGW LHR STN BHX BRS MAN EDI GLA BFS DUB SNN LIS MAD BCN CDG ORY BRU AMS STR DUS CGN FRA MUC TXL ZRH GVA CPH ARN OSL MXP FCO ATH TLV DEL BOM , CAI SVO were out for sale but never launched ACC and JNB flew with WO M11. That is just TATL.

Since the merger UA added some seasonal service such as KEF and OPO but nothing has grown to S America or Asia. All of that came from CO.


With COVID now we won’t see anything but cuts for sometime now :(


The EWR hub's origins are the PeoplEXPRESS operation, though I don't recall PE operating as a true hub and spoke carrier per se, but its largest base was EWR which at the time of PE's launch, EWR was underutilized. PE flew TATL to LGW, BRU using 747s (I think ORY too but could be wrong). The CO TATL route map from EWR was cumulatively LGW (then LHR from 2008), MAN, EDI, SNN, DUB, BFS, BRS, AMS, BRU, OSL, CPH, ARN, ORY (then CDG), BCN, MAD, FCO, MXP, LIS, FRA, MUC, CGN, TXL, ZRH, GVA, ATH (on and off, seasonally), TLV, STR, DUS, DEL, BOM, GLA, BHX, STN. CAI was announced, but was never launched due to the Arab Spring events in Egypt. SVO was planned, but never launched. ACC and JNB were never operated by CO metal from EWR. To Asia, CO flew to NRT, PVG, PEK, HKG. To South America, CO had GIG and GRU (GIG was axed after 9/11), LIM, BOG, and for a brief time, operated EWR-LIM-SCL, then flew SCL nonstop briefly, but dropped the route ( I may be wrong in that SCL became a tag of the EWR-LIM route). Believe CO may have had CCS and perhaps GYE and Quito or maybe not, Those last two, I do not remember.






Great recap! I was too lazy cover the whole system.

Just a few random thoughts. Before Copa CO used PTY as a scissor hub. Like wise with LIM when both IAH & EWR landed am so they tagged on VVI & a struggling SCL.


CNF was another tag off GIG using a767-424


Awesome. Yes, you're right. Not random at all. Thanks.
 
Cointrin330
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Thu May 14, 2020 11:28 am

FSDan wrote:
Cointrin330 wrote:
tpaewr wrote:
The EWR hub is completely from CO. I think Peoples flew LGW, maybe other.

But at some point CO from EWR serviced LGW LHR STN BHX BRS MAN EDI GLA BFS DUB SNN LIS MAD BCN CDG ORY BRU AMS STR DUS CGN FRA MUC TXL ZRH GVA CPH ARN OSL MXP FCO ATH TLV DEL BOM , CAI SVO were out for sale but never launched ACC and JNB flew with WO M11. That is just TATL.

Since the merger UA added some seasonal service such as KEF and OPO but nothing has grown to S America or Asia. All of that came from CO.


With COVID now we won’t see anything but cuts for sometime now :(


The EWR hub's origins are the PeoplEXPRESS operation, though I don't recall PE operating as a true hub and spoke carrier per se, but its largest base was EWR which at the time of PE's launch, EWR was underutilized. PE flew TATL to LGW, BRU using 747s (I think ORY too but could be wrong). The CO TATL route map from EWR was cumulatively LGW (then LHR from 2008), MAN, EDI, SNN, DUB, BFS, BRS, AMS, BRU, OSL, CPH, ARN, ORY (then CDG), BCN, MAD, FCO, MXP, LIS, FRA, MUC, CGN, TXL, ZRH, GVA, ATH (on and off, seasonally), TLV, STR, DUS, DEL, BOM, GLA, BHX, STN. CAI was announced, but was never launched due to the Arab Spring events in Egypt. SVO was planned, but never launched. ACC and JNB were never operated by CO metal from EWR. To Asia, CO flew to NRT, PVG, PEK, HKG. To South America, CO had GIG and GRU (GIG was axed after 9/11), LIM, BOG, and for a brief time, operated EWR-LIM-SCL, then flew SCL nonstop briefly, but dropped the route ( I may be wrong in that SCL became a tag of the EWR-LIM route). Believe CO may have had CCS and perhaps GYE and Quito or maybe not, Those last two, I do not remember.


Don't forget that CO flew to HAM as well! The brief addition of STR wasn't until after the UA merger, was it?


Yes, I think CO operated EWR-HAM and STR as well. I think HAM was axed by UA after the 2018 summer season. STR was cut earlier but not sure when.
 
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Polot
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Thu May 14, 2020 11:43 am

Cointrin330 wrote:
FSDan wrote:
Cointrin330 wrote:

The EWR hub's origins are the PeoplEXPRESS operation, though I don't recall PE operating as a true hub and spoke carrier per se, but its largest base was EWR which at the time of PE's launch, EWR was underutilized. PE flew TATL to LGW, BRU using 747s (I think ORY too but could be wrong). The CO TATL route map from EWR was cumulatively LGW (then LHR from 2008), MAN, EDI, SNN, DUB, BFS, BRS, AMS, BRU, OSL, CPH, ARN, ORY (then CDG), BCN, MAD, FCO, MXP, LIS, FRA, MUC, CGN, TXL, ZRH, GVA, ATH (on and off, seasonally), TLV, STR, DUS, DEL, BOM, GLA, BHX, STN. CAI was announced, but was never launched due to the Arab Spring events in Egypt. SVO was planned, but never launched. ACC and JNB were never operated by CO metal from EWR. To Asia, CO flew to NRT, PVG, PEK, HKG. To South America, CO had GIG and GRU (GIG was axed after 9/11), LIM, BOG, and for a brief time, operated EWR-LIM-SCL, then flew SCL nonstop briefly, but dropped the route ( I may be wrong in that SCL became a tag of the EWR-LIM route). Believe CO may have had CCS and perhaps GYE and Quito or maybe not, Those last two, I do not remember.


Don't forget that CO flew to HAM as well! The brief addition of STR wasn't until after the UA merger, was it?


Yes, I think CO operated EWR-HAM and STR as well. I think HAM was axed by UA after the 2018 summer season. STR was cut earlier but not sure when.

UA cut STR after summer 2014. It started in 2011.
 
FSDan
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Thu May 14, 2020 3:26 pm

Polot wrote:
Cointrin330 wrote:
FSDan wrote:

Don't forget that CO flew to HAM as well! The brief addition of STR wasn't until after the UA merger, was it?


Yes, I think CO operated EWR-HAM and STR as well. I think HAM was axed by UA after the 2018 summer season. STR was cut earlier but not sure when.

UA cut STR after summer 2014. It started in 2011.


Huh, STR operated longer than I remembered, then. I had been thinking it just flew for one or two seasons...
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hohd
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Thu May 14, 2020 8:43 pm

Still think dropping JFK was a bad idea. Especially the flights were operating from SFO and LAX, where they have hub operations and some connections, and also they have other Star carriers operating at JFK which some passengers could possibly connect, this is in addition to the huge O & D. With this they have become even smaller in LAX, while DL and AA have become stronger. This move was penny wise, pound foolish.
 
KlimaBXsst
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Thu May 14, 2020 11:49 pm

My outside impression was,
EWR and New Jersey were and is still substantially more “business friendly” than New York State / City airports.

I am not sure this is still the case after Covid-19.
Aesthetically the A 340 got it right!
 
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jfklganyc
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Fri May 15, 2020 11:52 am

It really doesnt matter what we think of dropping JFK

It is on record from an Officer of United: United thinks it was a bad a idea. A mistake

Let’s stop rehashing it already. It was a mistake.

I am sure down the road, we will see UA back at JFK (likely operating from 2 or 3 gates in T8 or T5 with minimal staff) with 10 or so total flights a day to their west coast hubs. A token presence to make up for precious revenue
 
avek00
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Fri May 15, 2020 12:25 pm

jfklganyc wrote:
It really doesnt matter what we think of dropping JFK

It is on record from an Officer of United: United thinks it was a bad a idea. A mistake

Let’s stop rehashing it already. It was a mistake.

I am sure down the road, we will see UA back at JFK (likely operating from 2 or 3 gates in T8 or T5 with minimal staff) with 10 or so total flights a day to their west coast hubs. A token presence to make up for precious revenue


Or, wait for AA to go under and take T8 :P
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jfklganyc
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Fri May 15, 2020 9:36 pm

No need to wait for that.

AA will be around 40 flights IMO

They will lose exclusive use of the terminal
 
Cointrin330
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Sat May 16, 2020 12:31 am

jfklganyc wrote:
No need to wait for that.

AA will be around 40 flights IMO

They will lose exclusive use of the terminal


AA has the lease on T8 through 2036 so not sure how they could lose exclusive use of the terminal?
 
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jfklganyc
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Sat May 16, 2020 1:08 am

Cointrin330 wrote:
jfklganyc wrote:
No need to wait for that.

AA will be around 40 flights IMO

They will lose exclusive use of the terminal


AA has the lease on T8 through 2036 so not sure how they could lose exclusive use of the terminal?



Because they cant sit on a 40 gate terminal with no flights at a space constrained airport.

Time to get real boys. Things are changing fast
 
wn676
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Sat May 16, 2020 2:12 am

Cointrin330 wrote:
jfklganyc wrote:
No need to wait for that.

AA will be around 40 flights IMO

They will lose exclusive use of the terminal


AA has the lease on T8 through 2036 so not sure how they could lose exclusive use of the terminal?


It would be surprising if the T8 lease did not contain a provision for reallocating gates if AA falls below a certain use threshold. There’s usually a way for the airport to do this even for exclusive-use facilities.
Tiny, unreadable text leaves ample room for interpretation.
 
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Revelation
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Sat May 16, 2020 2:19 am

avek00 wrote:
jfklganyc wrote:
I am sure down the road, we will see UA back at JFK (likely operating from 2 or 3 gates in T8 or T5 with minimal staff) with 10 or so total flights a day to their west coast hubs. A token presence to make up for precious revenue


Or, wait for AA to go under and take T8 :P

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evank516
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Sat May 16, 2020 4:28 am

PA815 wrote:
Fuling wrote:
By that reasoning, EWR would have a lower average fare.


Don't they though? EWR is always cheaper to fly from than JFK when I look for flights. If EWR was actually feasible for me I'd consider flying from there.
 
UA444
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Sat May 16, 2020 6:54 am

KlimaBXsst wrote:
My outside impression was,
EWR and New Jersey were and is still substantially more “business friendly” than New York State / City airports.

I am not sure this is still the case after Covid-19.

EWR, JFK, and LGA are all ran by the Port Authority of NY and NJ
 
strfyr51
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Sat May 16, 2020 11:06 am

UA444 wrote:
strfyr51 wrote:
max999 wrote:

I think it suits UA not to compete, they would rather just stick to their EWR fortress hub. Case in point: AA and DL have a presence in all three NYC area airports JFK, LGA, and EWR. While UA sticks out like a sore thumb because they have zero presence in JFK and they don't want to compete there.

Before the Merger UA had a sizeable operation at EWR. After the merger? Co-convinced UA to end the JFK operation and go all in at EWR. It made sense since we didn't own a terminal at JFK anyway. Many at UA doubted the move but chance favors he bold and EWR? was most definitely BOLD!! It's not Hub Fortress,
But it's close!! and with IAD right down the road? What can United complain about?

They lost several corporate contracts with closing JFK and LAX suffered from loss of yield.

NYC isn’t like London or the Bay Area where serving LGW or OAK isn’t a huge deal. It’s still mind boggling Smisek thought it was a good idea.

Smisek thought quite a few bad ideas were good and he eventually paid the price For those Ideas. He got rid of quite a few senior managers with guys who were later shown the door because they didn't have any Moxie to stay, It seemed that they had a run on things at first but later? The CO management team seemed to be leaving as fast as they came and Northwest and American managers came in the door. And they managed like they had a chip on their shoulders, They treated us well though so I never had a problem with them except for some Underling's who were more politically motivated than mindful of the FAA.. Once they got the Right mindset? They seemed to be OK..
 
strfyr51
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Sat May 16, 2020 11:20 am

hohd wrote:
Still think dropping JFK was a bad idea. Especially the flights were operating from SFO and LAX, where they have hub operations and some connections, and also they have other Star carriers operating at JFK which some passengers could possibly connect, this is in addition to the huge O & D. With this they have become even smaller in LAX, while DL and AA have become stronger. This move was penny wise, pound foolish.

Dropping JFK might have been a bad move in retrospect. But? since we only flew PS service from there west? It wasn't like we were losing anything. I had friends and family in the NYC area and flying into EWR wasn't any harder or worse than flying into JFK. Suffice to say that I could have flown into LGA as well. I actually worked at JFK before my time at United and I know the airport well. But that was before Jet Blue's time 1980-1983
 
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jfklganyc
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Sat May 16, 2020 11:29 am

[twoid][/twoid]
UA444 wrote:
KlimaBXsst wrote:
My outside impression was,
EWR and New Jersey were and is still substantially more “business friendly” than New York State / City airports.

I am not sure this is still the case after Covid-19.

EWR, JFK, and LGA are all ran by the Port Authority of NY and NJ



Yes. This agency is equivalent to a lead weight when you are struggling to stay afloat.


They compete for worst airport operator in America...perhaps Massport takes that crown. A tossup. Both uber liberal states. Both bloated bureaucracies accountable to no one.

George Washington Bridge
Holland and Lincoln Tunnels
JFK LGA EWR
The unfinished WTC
The Port Authority Bus Terminal
The Staten Island Bridges
The Port of NY/NJ itself
Path Train

All facilities operated by the PA. All in a state of perpetual disrepair, endless construction, mired in corruption and all over capacity. All have the highest costs in the nation for usage in their respective category.

They have one new shining star: the Goethals Bridge. Took decades and privatization to get it done.

I will wait for the port authority employee above to dispute all this...as he always does from 4 WTC (PA HQ)

Yes, they have a HQ in Some of the most expensive real estate in the world.
 
PA815
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Sat May 16, 2020 2:37 pm

evank516 wrote:
Don't they though? EWR is always cheaper to fly from than JFK when I look for flights.

The OP mentions EWR having $25 higher average domestic fares than JFK. Since this is on average, it doesn’t apply to every flight so it might not come up in your searches.
 
evank516
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Sat May 16, 2020 2:40 pm

PA815 wrote:
evank516 wrote:
Don't they though? EWR is always cheaper to fly from than JFK when I look for flights.

The OP mentions EWR having $25 higher average domestic fares than JFK. Since this is on average, it doesn’t apply to every flight so it might not come up in your searches.


Ah okay that's interesting because I almost never see higher fares out of EWR than JFK and even LGA.
 
Nicknuzzii
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Sat May 16, 2020 2:43 pm

evank516 wrote:
PA815 wrote:
evank516 wrote:
Don't they though? EWR is always cheaper to fly from than JFK when I look for flights.

The OP mentions EWR having $25 higher average domestic fares than JFK. Since this is on average, it doesn’t apply to every flight so it might not come up in your searches.


Ah okay that's interesting because I almost never see higher fares out of EWR than JFK and even LGA.


I do all the time except on leisure routes such as MCO and FLL.
 
KlimaBXsst
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Sat May 16, 2020 3:36 pm

jfklganyc wrote:
[twoid][/twoid]
UA444 wrote:
KlimaBXsst wrote:
My outside impression was,
EWR and New Jersey were and is still substantially more “business friendly” than New York State / City airports.

I am not sure this is still the case after Covid-19.

EWR, JFK, and LGA are all ran by the Port Authority of NY and NJ



Yes. This agency is equivalent to a lead weight when you are struggling to stay afloat.


They compete for worst airport operator in America...perhaps Massport takes that crown. A tossup. Both uber liberal states. Both bloated bureaucracies accountable to no one.

George Washington Bridge
Holland and Lincoln Tunnels
JFK LGA EWR
The unfinished WTC
The Port Authority Bus Terminal
The Staten Island Bridges
The Port of NY/NJ itself
Path Train

All facilities operated by the PA. All in a state of perpetual disrepair, endless construction, mired in corruption and all over capacity. All have the highest costs in the nation for usage in their respective category.

They have one new shining star: the Goethals Bridge. Took decades and privatization to get it done.

I will wait for the port authority employee above to dispute all this...as he always does from 4 WTC (PA HQ)

Yes, they have a HQ in Some of the most expensive real estate in the world.


Wow, the tentacles of New York bureaucracy are far reaching. Never realized how much of a Duchy New Jersey was of New York other than the airports.
Aesthetically the A 340 got it right!
 
tphuang
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Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Sat May 16, 2020 11:22 pm

PA815 wrote:
evank516 wrote:
Don't they though? EWR is always cheaper to fly from than JFK when I look for flights.

The OP mentions EWR having $25 higher average domestic fares than JFK. Since this is on average, it doesn’t apply to every flight so it might not come up in your searches.

That doesn’t mean much until you account for connection percentage, capacity per flight and distance of flight.

Jfk is a very high o&d airport.
 
airhansa
Posts: 380
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2020 3:18 pm

Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Sun May 17, 2020 10:14 am

Is it not because UA has more domestic operations than the other two airlines (i.e. more focused on domestic air travel)?

The premium payed by passengers on business class flights is usually far more than the actual cost of the flight for the airline, so often little things like the "brand" of the airport plays a big role, it's likely that AA and DL felt that keeping JFK operations was more worthwhile.

Does UA have a "lesser" brand image than DL or AA?
 
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Polot
Posts: 10633
Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2011 3:01 pm

Re: Why did UA have a monopoly at EWR?

Sun May 17, 2020 10:32 am

airhansa wrote:
Is it not because UA has more domestic operations than the other two airlines (i.e. more focused on domestic air travel)?

The premium payed by passengers on business class flights is usually far more than the actual cost of the flight for the airline, so often little things like the "brand" of the airport plays a big role, it's likely that AA and DL felt that keeping JFK operations was more worthwhile.

Does UA have a "lesser" brand image than DL or AA?

I don’t have the exact numbers on hand but I believe UA is larger international than DL/AA and smaller domestic. That is certainly true with the their brand image. For historical reasons UA is seen as a very international airline.

DL probably has the best image now due to it’s good, reliable, and consistent product for the past decade but UA is still fairly well known for its extensive TPAC/TATL operations, long standing presence at LHR, things like PS (although thats not a thing anymore), etc and UA operates the most premium heavy fleets in the US.


Remember though EWR was inherited from CO, not built up by UA.

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