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CraigAnderson
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 6:15 am

Looks like the government subsidized international QF, VA flights are finished, not just on hold. Update to this story has govt spokesperson pointing out there are now commercial flights to the destinations flown by QF and VA, and QF statement seems pretty final in saying those flights are now ended.

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... os-angeles
 
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CraigAnderson
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 6:16 am

AirlineRatings suggests Perth could be the gateway for El Al flights to Sydney, Melbourne instead of those being non-stop services.

https://www.airlineratings.com/news/per ... ort-el-al/
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 6:48 am

CraigAnderson wrote:
AirlineRatings suggests Perth could be the gateway for El Al flights to Sydney, Melbourne instead of those being non-stop services.

https://www.airlineratings.com/news/per ... ort-el-al/

So Perth based Geoffrey Thomas suggests El Al will fly from Perth without any real evidence. Why do we listen to this guy? What does a stop and transfer offer that current Bangkok service doesn't? The reason El Al want to service MEL is for non-stop service for what it knows is a significant customer base. PER has a relatively small Jewish population.
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kriskim
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 7:48 am

CraigAnderson wrote:
AirlineRatings suggests Perth could be the gateway for El Al flights to Sydney, Melbourne instead of those being non-stop services.

https://www.airlineratings.com/news/per ... ort-el-al/


He is always writing articles glorifying Perth, he stretches the truth way too far.
A world built upon connectivity.
 
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Velocity7
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 8:18 am

EK413 wrote:
South African Airways A346 ZS-SNF on final for Rwy 01R operating a repatriation flight from Joburg.

https://www.instagram.com/p/CBH_mvsB_-_ ... 3l9x2d6sqq

Image

Image


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Geez I love these A346's! I had my best ride ever on a brand new Thai 346 in Business Class MEL-BKK-ZRH and return back in 2006. I remember it being the quietest and smoothest ride I'd ever had on an aircraft. Such a shame to see them become so rare now.
 
Fuling
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 11:29 am

kriskim wrote:
CraigAnderson wrote:
AirlineRatings suggests Perth could be the gateway for El Al flights to Sydney, Melbourne instead of those being non-stop services.

https://www.airlineratings.com/news/per ... ort-el-al/


He is always writing articles glorifying Perth, he stretches the truth way too far.


Does anyone know what his background is?
 
Aviator34ID
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 12:07 pm

He seems to be the go to talking head on aviation for both the ABC and commercial TV stations in Perth. He has a very important sounding organisation which is probably all the due diligence the media do. Perhaps he is very knowledgeable. On the occasions I have seen him though he hasn't said anything particularly incisive.
 
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eta unknown
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 1:54 pm

He's also blacklisted from one SE Asian airline.
 
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CraigAnderson
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 9:38 pm

I have to say, GT _does_ present very well on TV, he comes across as very confident and knowledgeable. I'm not saying that he IS all that BUT you can appreciate that media want somebody to talk to on airline issues and GT certainly comes over very well for that, certainly not as filled with hype as say CNN's Richard Quest that's for sure!
 
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CraigAnderson
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 9:47 pm

Article in The Australian this morning turns the spotlight away from the usual big shareholders and lenders who will be mostly wiped out through administration and puts the focus on smaller investors who they say are mainly 'mums and dads' with retirement savings in there. I'd question any financial advisor who told me to invest my retirement savings into an airline, especially Virgin Australia.

"Thousands of retail investors in Virgin Australia bonds, including mums and dads and retirees, are becoming “increasingly anxious” about their investment in the airline, according to stockbroker Morgans.
Morgans’ Brisbane-based director Steven Wright told The Australian on Monday that the retirement savings of many small investors in Virgin notes issued last November were now at risk after the airline went into administration on April 21 with debts of almost $7bn."
“Our clients are just a small proportion of the thousands of retail investors from right across Australia who invested in Virgin Australia notes,” Mr Wright said. “They are growing increasingly anxious. In most cases we are talking typical mums and dads with retirement savings at risk. We are watching this closely.”

Apparently most Morgans clients who bought into the Virgin fundraising last November have individual investments of up to $50,000. I would have very much questioned spending $50,000 or even $5,000 on Virgin Australia as recently as November, although of course Paul Scurrah had his plan for turning the airline around but with so much debt weighing it down from the Borghetti years it seems that just doing your basic homework on the company before handing over $50,000 would have resulted in big flashing red lights!

Article not linked due to rules which don't permit linking to paywalled websites.
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 10:25 pm

Article in The Australian this morning turns the spotlight away from the usual big shareholders and lenders who will be mostly wiped out through administration and puts the focus on smaller investors who they say are mainly 'mums and dads' with retirement savings in there. I'd question any financial advisor who told me to invest my retirement savings into an airline, especially Virgin Australia.

The question is more why retirees were recommended into unsecured bonds which are, by definition, risky investments not ideal for retirees. Undoubtedly they were chasing the higher interest rates these types of bonds offer but risk/reward is Economics 101.
717, 721/2, 732/3/4/5/7/8/9, 742/3/4, 752/3, 762/3, 772/E/W, 788/9, 300,310, 319,320/1, 332/3, 359, 388, DC9, DC10, F28, F100, 142,143, E75/90, CR2, D82/3/4, SF3, ATR
 
moa999
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Mon Jun 08, 2020 11:19 pm

Indeed. Chase high yield, expect to get burnt.
Equity is burnt as are I suspect the bulk of unsecured debt holders (including these retail notes).

Secured debt (which includes the loan from Velocity) is probably better off.
 
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qf2220
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 12:16 am

CraigAnderson wrote:

..mainly 'mums and dads' ....

most Morgans clients who bought into the Virgin fundraising last November have individual investments of up to $50,000..


I dont know many mums and dads that have 50k to drop into one investment, let alone an airline one.

I feel this is a biased beat up.
 
DavidByrne
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 1:05 am

qf2220 wrote:
CraigAnderson wrote:

..mainly 'mums and dads' ....

most Morgans clients who bought into the Virgin fundraising last November have individual investments of up to $50,000..


I dont know many mums and dads that have 50k to drop into one investment, let alone an airline one.

I feel this is a biased beat up.

Perfectly plausible. The article specifically states “up to” $50,000. Don’t dismiss the argument as a “biased beat-up” on the basis of a misreading! Besides, what’s to gain by the author anyway?
This is not my beautiful house . . . This is not my beautiful wife
 
DeltaB717
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 1:07 am

Currently, Delta plans A350 to take over LAX-SYD from 1 Dec 2021 (LAX departure) - first SYD arrival and departure will therefore be 3 Dec 2021. Obviously very much STC.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-07jun20/

DL online booking shows the same - B77L will operate LAX-SYD departing 31 Dec 2020, A359 to operate the following day.

For me personally, I think a drive up from CBR might be on the cards on 3 Jan!
 
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qf2220
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 1:10 am

DavidByrne wrote:
qf2220 wrote:
CraigAnderson wrote:

..mainly 'mums and dads' ....

most Morgans clients who bought into the Virgin fundraising last November have individual investments of up to $50,000..


I dont know many mums and dads that have 50k to drop into one investment, let alone an airline one.

I feel this is a biased beat up.

Perfectly plausible. The article specifically states “up to” $50,000. Don’t dismiss the argument as a “biased beat-up” on the basis of a misreading! Besides, what’s to gain by the author anyway?


Its the Australian that is well known to speak up for the wealthy (eg franking credits beneficiaries) who are far from the basic mum and dad tag that they try to apply
 
eamondzhang
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 1:57 am

DeltaB717 wrote:
Currently, Delta plans A350 to take over LAX-SYD from 1 Jan 2021 (LAX departure) - first SYD arrival and departure will therefore be 3 Jan 2021. Obviously very much STC.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-07jun20/

DL online booking shows the same - B77L will operate LAX-SYD departing 31 Dec 2020, A359 to operate the following day.

For me personally, I think a drive up from CBR might be on the cards on 3 Jan!

Fixed it for you ;)

Or otherwise it's 1.5 years away lol

Michael
 
DeltaB717
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 2:02 am

eamondzhang wrote:
DeltaB717 wrote:
Currently, Delta plans A350 to take over LAX-SYD from 1 Jan 2021 (LAX departure) - first SYD arrival and departure will therefore be 3 Jan 2021. Obviously very much STC.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... f-07jun20/

DL online booking shows the same - B77L will operate LAX-SYD departing 31 Dec 2020, A359 to operate the following day.

For me personally, I think a drive up from CBR might be on the cards on 3 Jan!

Fixed it for you ;)

Or otherwise it's 1.5 years away lol

Michael


And a very big gap in DL operations! Thanks for correcting ;)
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 4:48 am

Nepal Airlines A332 arrived into CBR this morning on a repatriation flight

Image

https://twitter.com/dfat/status/1270210 ... 69152?s=20
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tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 5:23 am

qf789 wrote:
Nepal Airlines A332 arrived into CBR this morning on a repatriation flight

Image

https://twitter.com/dfat/status/1270210 ... 69152?s=20

Visit Nepal 2020 is going to be a successful promotion.
717, 721/2, 732/3/4/5/7/8/9, 742/3/4, 752/3, 762/3, 772/E/W, 788/9, 300,310, 319,320/1, 332/3, 359, 388, DC9, DC10, F28, F100, 142,143, E75/90, CR2, D82/3/4, SF3, ATR
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 5:34 am

CraigAnderson wrote:

Article not linked due to rules which don't permit linking to paywalled websites.


The rules say no such thing.

Links are required to be included for 2 reasons.

Firstly so all users have access to the information so they can read for themselves and enter into a constructive discussion on the topic at hand. Obviously with paywall articles we had to make a compromise but also wanted to make it fair for all users whether they can access paywall articles or not. At one point it was proposed that paywalls should be banned and at the other extreme it was also proposed that if users want access they should pay for them. Neither of these were suitable options however after a long discussion and many emails back and forward we decided on a rule that was both fair to those who had access to paywall articles and those who didnt have access to paywalls.

Secondly links must be provided to any source whether that is a news article, photo, infographic, tweet etc to credit the source. A link is also requested to not only protect the site but each individual user from misuse of copyright violations which if not treated in the right manner could potentially become a legal issue
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Foopz
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 7:45 am

Fuling wrote:
kriskim wrote:
CraigAnderson wrote:
AirlineRatings suggests Perth could be the gateway for El Al flights to Sydney, Melbourne instead of those being non-stop services.

https://www.airlineratings.com/news/per ... ort-el-al/


He is always writing articles glorifying Perth, he stretches the truth way too far.


Does anyone know what his background is?

Was/is a SevenWest journo who handled aviation reporting, launched the Airlineratings site a few years ago (with SevenWest backing IIRC) and started pretending to be an expert in the field. Everything he writes should be treated with a grain of salt.

Although in this case the only thing he's written in the linked article is the headline, the rest is a cut and paste from a separate report that is just theorising the possibility. Of course, his headline doesn't state that and implies that it's something much bigger.
 
SYDSpotter
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 8:40 am

qf2220 wrote:
CraigAnderson wrote:

..mainly 'mums and dads' ....

most Morgans clients who bought into the Virgin fundraising last November have individual investments of up to $50,000..


I dont know many mums and dads that have 50k to drop into one investment, let alone an airline one.

I feel this is a biased beat up.


Mum and dad investor = Retail investor.

The financial markets distinguish between wholesale investors and retail investors. Wholesale investors are generally the institutional investors (banks, super funds etc) or high networth individuals ($250k income/$2.5m assets/can invest $500k in one go), anyone else is a 'retail investor'.
319_320_321_332_333_359_388 / 734_737_738_743_744_762_763_772_773_77W_788_789
 
QF744ER
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 12:51 pm

qf789,

Any idea why VA’s recently converted box/package freighter B738 -VUC isn’t flying? Would’ve expected it to be the highest utilised 737 in our skies with the current demand for freight.
 
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VCVSpotter
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 4:27 pm

Qantas has further removed 747-400ERs from its operating schedule. In addition, skyliners shows that the recent ones that flew to MHV are for part out/scrap.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... t-changes/
https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=3
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... edit#gid=0

Just a normal teenager juggling AP classes and airplanes. No biggie • Love the 747 & 777-9 • Farewell Qantas A380s/744s
 
VHPQA
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Tue Jun 09, 2020 11:48 pm

Was well publicised but A346 ZS-SNF departed BNE yesterday as SAA2983 back to JNB after two nights on the ground at BNE.
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 12:41 am

VCVSpotter wrote:
Qantas has further removed 747-400ERs from its operating schedule. In addition, skyliners shows that the recent ones that flew to MHV are for part out/scrap.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... t-changes/
https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=3

It sadly seems the 747 era at QF will end with a whimper not a roar. I'm kind of surprised they didn't keep one for a farewell lap of Australian cities especially if they are only going to the chopper anyway. Who would've thought the dreadful 100th livery of the 789 may turn out to be the highlight of QF's 100th birthday stinker though admittedly it isn't really their fault?
717, 721/2, 732/3/4/5/7/8/9, 742/3/4, 752/3, 762/3, 772/E/W, 788/9, 300,310, 319,320/1, 332/3, 359, 388, DC9, DC10, F28, F100, 142,143, E75/90, CR2, D82/3/4, SF3, ATR
 
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VCVSpotter
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 12:45 am

tullamarine wrote:
VCVSpotter wrote:
Qantas has further removed 747-400ERs from its operating schedule. In addition, skyliners shows that the recent ones that flew to MHV are for part out/scrap.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... t-changes/
https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=3

It sadly seems the 747 era at QF will end with a whimper not a roar. I'm kind of surprised they didn't keep one for a farewell lap of Australian cities especially if they are only going to the chopper anyway. Who would've thought the dreadful 100th livery of the 789 may turn out to be the highlight of QF's 100th birthday stinker though admittedly it isn't really their fault?


Yeah, same here. They said earlier in the year that they would have some celebratory flights, but that hasn't materialized. It seems that July 1 will be the last flight for the Queen of the Skies with Qantas. At least it will still have the full livery when it touches down at MHV. I'm sure that there'll be plenty of spotters at LAX and MHV that day.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... edit#gid=0

Just a normal teenager juggling AP classes and airplanes. No biggie • Love the 747 & 777-9 • Farewell Qantas A380s/744s
 
VH-BZF
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 1:44 am

I'm a little surprised they haven't been bought for conversion to BCF config. Relatively young aircraft, expertly maintained by QF engineering, you wouldn't find better examples to convert. Perhaps the whole COVID-19 has signed an early scrap notice for these magnificent Queens of the sky? Sad way to end their flying careers.
Ansett Australia - (was) One of the worlds great airlines!
 
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VCVSpotter
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 3:06 am

VH-BZF wrote:
I'm a little surprised they haven't been bought for conversion to BCF config. Relatively young aircraft, expertly maintained by QF engineering, you wouldn't find better examples to convert. Perhaps the whole COVID-19 has signed an early scrap notice for these magnificent Queens of the sky? Sad way to end their flying careers.


I've been reading up on the 777-300ER freight conversion thread, and some have speculated on there that the start of that program is pretty much the end of 747 freight conversions. And I agree. With no nose door to create a distinctive advantage, 747s are on pretty much even ground with a 77W. And with more 77Ws coming off of active service with passenger airlines, more people will likely convert those. This creates a greater abundance of parts and therefore a cheaper operating cost compared to the 747F. Also the obvious 4 engines vs 2 engines. There are a few (747F) in the desert at VCV, and I know there are a few more scattered across the globe. If freighter companies truly wanted/needed a 747F, I think they'd chase after one of those before converting one.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... edit#gid=0

Just a normal teenager juggling AP classes and airplanes. No biggie • Love the 747 & 777-9 • Farewell Qantas A380s/744s
 
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a36001
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 4:06 am

VCVSpotter wrote:
tullamarine wrote:
VCVSpotter wrote:
Qantas has further removed 747-400ERs from its operating schedule. In addition, skyliners shows that the recent ones that flew to MHV are for part out/scrap.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... t-changes/
https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=3

It sadly seems the 747 era at QF will end with a whimper not a roar. I'm kind of surprised they didn't keep one for a farewell lap of Australian cities especially if they are only going to the chopper anyway. Who would've thought the dreadful 100th livery of the 789 may turn out to be the highlight of QF's 100th birthday stinker though admittedly it isn't really their fault?


Yeah, same here. They said earlier in the year that they would have some celebratory flights, but that hasn't materialized. It seems that July 1 will be the last flight for the Queen of the Skies with Qantas. At least it will still have the full livery when it touches down at MHV. I'm sure that there'll be plenty of spotters at LAX and MHV that day.


No airline in the world has the spare cash to operate farewell flights at the moment if at all ever again, cash is king right now and Qantas is doing everything it can to preserve cash to avoid ending up like Virgin Australia. Spending a couple hundred thousand dollars flying an old 747 round the country to say goodbye (note the general public could not really care anyway) would be financially irresponsible, especially when you have crews on stand down and possible redundancies looming in the industry.

If the 747's are no longer financially viable and retiring them will help Qantas recover, they should be retired ASAP. No emotion whats so ever!
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 4:20 am

a36001 wrote:
VCVSpotter wrote:
tullamarine wrote:
It sadly seems the 747 era at QF will end with a whimper not a roar. I'm kind of surprised they didn't keep one for a farewell lap of Australian cities especially if they are only going to the chopper anyway. Who would've thought the dreadful 100th livery of the 789 may turn out to be the highlight of QF's 100th birthday stinker though admittedly it isn't really their fault?


Yeah, same here. They said earlier in the year that they would have some celebratory flights, but that hasn't materialized. It seems that July 1 will be the last flight for the Queen of the Skies with Qantas. At least it will still have the full livery when it touches down at MHV. I'm sure that there'll be plenty of spotters at LAX and MHV that day.


No airline in the world has the spare cash to operate farewell flights at the moment if at all ever again, cash is king right now and Qantas is doing everything it can to preserve cash to avoid ending up like Virgin Australia. Spending a couple hundred thousand dollars flying an old 747 round the country to say goodbye (note the general public could not really care anyway) would be financially irresponsible, especially when you have crews on stand down and possible redundancies looming in the industry.

If the 747's are no longer financially viable and retiring them will help Qantas recover, they should be retired ASAP. No emotion whats so ever!

On that basis, maybe they should get all future planes delivered in just matt white paint. It's obviously not worth spending the dollars on any form of branding.
717, 721/2, 732/3/4/5/7/8/9, 742/3/4, 752/3, 762/3, 772/E/W, 788/9, 300,310, 319,320/1, 332/3, 359, 388, DC9, DC10, F28, F100, 142,143, E75/90, CR2, D82/3/4, SF3, ATR
 
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CraigAnderson
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 4:21 am

a36001 wrote:
No airline in the world has the spare cash to operate farewell flights at the moment if at all ever again, cash is king right now and Qantas is doing everything it can to preserve cash to avoid ending up like Virgin Australia. Spending a couple hundred thousand dollars flying an old 747 round the country to say goodbye (note the general public could not really care anyway) would be financially irresponsible, especially when you have crews on stand down and possible redundancies looming in the industry.
If the 747's are no longer financially viable and retiring them will help Qantas recover, they should be retired ASAP. No emotion whats so ever!


I must sadly agree. It would be wonderful to have 1 x 747 remaining and do a 'victory lap' of major Australian airports, even flying passengers between them, eg B747 flights BNE-SYD, SYD-MEL, SYD-PER, even SYD-CBR integrated with a scenic flight would be amazing! But there is no way in the world that QF could do this, because no way could it recover the costs through ticket sales, and even if it could recover that cost there'd still be people especially in some media outlets screaming at Qantas for burning this cash when it's sacked so many workers etc. It's just fiscally irresponsible at a time like this. So, bye-bye to the Boeing 747, we'll miss you.
 
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CraigAnderson
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 4:28 am

"Virgin's administrator pleads for government support to stop bidders from walking away amid coronavirus crisis"

In a nutshell, Deloitte wants more financial airline for Virgin Australia, including an extension of JobKeeper for all Virgin Australia staff for at least another six months, and also "to guarantee Virgin tickets". Seems Deloitte is worried that the two shortlisted buyers might either back away or put less money on the table due to uncertainty over Virgin's short-term future.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-06-10/ ... d/12338760
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 4:47 am

CraigAnderson wrote:
"Virgin's administrator pleads for government support to stop bidders from walking away amid coronavirus crisis"

In a nutshell, Deloitte wants more financial airline for Virgin Australia, including an extension of JobKeeper for all Virgin Australia staff for at least another six months, and also "to guarantee Virgin tickets". Seems Deloitte is worried that the two shortlisted buyers might either back away or put less money on the table due to uncertainty over Virgin's short-term future.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-06-10/ ... d/12338760

The worry would be that the new owners would be forced to make more employees redundant as they will need to more drastically downsize the airline given the domestic market will recover slowly initially. Redundancies will get priority in creditor distribution so the greater the redundancies, the less available for unsecured creditors.
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Aviator34ID
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 5:18 am

Say 5,000 VA staff on Jobkeeper. This is about $175 million for 6 months. They would have to give Qantas $175 million as well to be even handed.
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 5:29 am

Aviator34ID wrote:
Say 5,000 VA staff on Jobkeeper. This is about $175 million for 6 months. They would have to give Qantas $175 million as well to be even handed.

QF will have the same issue. It has 80% of its staff currently on JobKeeper. Unless International fully reopens in October, which is highly unlikely given current border restrictions, and can return its entire domestic fleet to service (also unlikely) it will have to stand down or retrench a significant portion of its staff. From the government point of view, these staff will move onto JobSeeker so they will still be a cost to the public purse in addition to now appearing as unemployed in statistics which may lengthen the recession and have a political cost.

It is highly likely the government will finesse JobKeeper over the next few months, removing it from some sectors (already happening to childcare next month) and extending it for severely affected sectors such as airlines and tourism past the current 27/9 deadline.
717, 721/2, 732/3/4/5/7/8/9, 742/3/4, 752/3, 762/3, 772/E/W, 788/9, 300,310, 319,320/1, 332/3, 359, 388, DC9, DC10, F28, F100, 142,143, E75/90, CR2, D82/3/4, SF3, ATR
 
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a36001
Posts: 351
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 6:02 am

tullamarine wrote:
a36001 wrote:
VCVSpotter wrote:

Yeah, same here. They said earlier in the year that they would have some celebratory flights, but that hasn't materialized. It seems that July 1 will be the last flight for the Queen of the Skies with Qantas. At least it will still have the full livery when it touches down at MHV. I'm sure that there'll be plenty of spotters at LAX and MHV that day.


No airline in the world has the spare cash to operate farewell flights at the moment if at all ever again, cash is king right now and Qantas is doing everything it can to preserve cash to avoid ending up like Virgin Australia. Spending a couple hundred thousand dollars flying an old 747 round the country to say goodbye (note the general public could not really care anyway) would be financially irresponsible, especially when you have crews on stand down and possible redundancies looming in the industry.

If the 747's are no longer financially viable and retiring them will help Qantas recover, they should be retired ASAP. No emotion whats so ever!

On that basis, maybe they should get all future planes delivered in just matt white paint. It's obviously not worth spending the dollars on any form of branding.


haha don't give the secret away! shhhh :-)
 
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Chipmunk1973
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 7:30 am

CraigAnderson wrote:

I must sadly agree. It would be wonderful to have 1 x 747 remaining and do a 'victory lap' of major Australian airports, even flying passengers between them, eg B747 flights BNE-SYD, SYD-MEL, SYD-PER, even SYD-CBR integrated with a scenic flight would be amazing! But there is no way in the world that QF could do this, because no way could it recover the costs through ticket sales, and even if it could recover that cost there'd still be people especially in some media outlets screaming at Qantas for burning this cash when it's sacked so many workers etc. It's just fiscally irresponsible at a time like this. So, bye-bye to the Boeing 747, we'll miss you.


What about the Qantas Antarctica Flights? Yeah I am aware that this is not the time of the year to be flying that far south with the absolutely minimal daylight hours down there. But given that passengers who board also disembark in the same city should mean minimal quarantining. You could request that paying passengers get CoVid tested a month before and a week before the flight.

Also, if memory serves, those flights weren’t particularly cheap. Perhaps they could retain one in service till Oct-Nov for a “Southern Explorer Farewell” flights.

That’s my thought bubble for today.
Cheers,
C1973
 
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Chipmunk1973
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 7:38 am

VH-BZF wrote:
I'm a little surprised they haven't been bought for conversion to BCF config. Relatively young aircraft, expertly maintained by QF engineering, you wouldn't find better examples to convert. Perhaps the whole COVID-19 has signed an early scrap notice for these magnificent Queens of the sky? Sad way to end their flying careers.


What about other engine manufacturers needing flight test frames? I think it’s common knowledge by now that RR recently acquired an ex QF 747-400 to be used as an engine test bed. But what about the likes of GE & PW? I could be completely misinformed and happy to be corrected, but I thought P&W still operated a 747-100?
Cheers,
C1973
 
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Velocity7
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 9:29 am

I've never taken much notice of Alliance Airlines but with the lack of flights, have found myself focussing in on them on FR24.

Have been really surprised at the depth and breadth of their services in QLD. Seems a lot are likely FIFO but the volume of them has really surprised me. I know there is a codeshare with Virgin but it seems fairly limited?

I've never travelled with them. What's the forums view of Alliance? Well run business? Service? Covid aside, nifty little business to be integrated into one of the majors at some point?
 
anstar
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 11:03 am

Velocity7 wrote:
I've never travelled with them. What's the forums view of Alliance? Well run business? Service? Covid aside, nifty little business to be integrated into one of the majors at some point?


Qantas own 20% I think... which is subject to a current ACCC investigation. All that said they seem to be good at what they do.
 
F100Flyer
Posts: 88
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Wed Jun 10, 2020 11:15 am

Velocity7 wrote:
I've never taken much notice of Alliance Airlines but with the lack of flights, have found myself focussing in on them on FR24.

Have been really surprised at the depth and breadth of their services in QLD. Seems a lot are likely FIFO but the volume of them has really surprised me. I know there is a codeshare with Virgin but it seems fairly limited?

I've never travelled with them. What's the forums view of Alliance? Well run business? Service? Covid aside, nifty little business to be integrated into one of the majors at some point?


I use them on a weekly basis. Punctuality is excellent. In about 450 flights I’ve had 1 cancelled due to going-tech, whilst maybe 6 flights of about a ~4hr delay.

As you can imagine they’re pretty basic inside with an almost retro-feel to their Fokker 100s.

Seeing that they are mostly contracted by resource companies, it tends to be the resource companies that dictate the level of service, of which over the years we’ve gone from breakfast services and sandwich services to a drinks service, and in the last year just a water service to save costs.

On a corporate level they’ve recently provided a business update claiming that requests for their business has actually increased due to social distancing on flights and mining companies chartering extra aircraft to get the same number of staff to the sites.
 
VH-BZF
Posts: 768
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Thu Jun 11, 2020 6:31 am

Chipmunk1973 wrote:
VH-BZF wrote:
I'm a little surprised they haven't been bought for conversion to BCF config. Relatively young aircraft, expertly maintained by QF engineering, you wouldn't find better examples to convert. Perhaps the whole COVID-19 has signed an early scrap notice for these magnificent Queens of the sky? Sad way to end their flying careers.


What about other engine manufacturers needing flight test frames? I think it’s common knowledge by now that RR recently acquired an ex QF 747-400 to be used as an engine test bed. But what about the likes of GE & PW? I could be completely misinformed and happy to be corrected, but I thought P&W still operated a 747-100?


I think GE operate an old B747 test bed for their engine development. In fact it was used to fly the latest iteration of the GE90 for the B777X.
Ansett Australia - (was) One of the worlds great airlines!
 
VH-BZF
Posts: 768
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Thu Jun 11, 2020 6:32 am

Chipmunk1973 wrote:
CraigAnderson wrote:

I must sadly agree. It would be wonderful to have 1 x 747 remaining and do a 'victory lap' of major Australian airports, even flying passengers between them, eg B747 flights BNE-SYD, SYD-MEL, SYD-PER, even SYD-CBR integrated with a scenic flight would be amazing! But there is no way in the world that QF could do this, because no way could it recover the costs through ticket sales, and even if it could recover that cost there'd still be people especially in some media outlets screaming at Qantas for burning this cash when it's sacked so many workers etc. It's just fiscally irresponsible at a time like this. So, bye-bye to the Boeing 747, we'll miss you.


What about the Qantas Antarctica Flights? Yeah I am aware that this is not the time of the year to be flying that far south with the absolutely minimal daylight hours down there. But given that passengers who board also disembark in the same city should mean minimal quarantining. You could request that paying passengers get CoVid tested a month before and a week before the flight.

Also, if memory serves, those flights weren’t particularly cheap. Perhaps they could retain one in service till Oct-Nov for a “Southern Explorer Farewell” flights.

That’s my thought bubble for today.


Good thought, QF I understand are planning to use the B787 for the Antarctica flights, as long as CASA give them ETOPS clearance.

BZF
Ansett Australia - (was) One of the worlds great airlines!
 
Qantas737
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Thu Jun 11, 2020 7:42 am

F100Flyer wrote:
Velocity7 wrote:
I've never taken much notice of Alliance Airlines but with the lack of flights, have found myself focussing in on them on FR24.

Have been really surprised at the depth and breadth of their services in QLD. Seems a lot are likely FIFO but the volume of them has really surprised me. I know there is a codeshare with Virgin but it seems fairly limited?

I've never travelled with them. What's the forums view of Alliance? Well run business? Service? Covid aside, nifty little business to be integrated into one of the majors at some point?


I use them on a weekly basis. Punctuality is excellent. In about 450 flights I’ve had 1 cancelled due to going-tech, whilst maybe 6 flights of about a ~4hr delay.

As you can imagine they’re pretty basic inside with an almost retro-feel to their Fokker 100s.

Seeing that they are mostly contracted by resource companies, it tends to be the resource companies that dictate the level of service, of which over the years we’ve gone from breakfast services and sandwich services to a drinks service, and in the last year just a water service to save costs.

On a corporate level they’ve recently provided a business update claiming that requests for their business has actually increased due to social distancing on flights and mining companies chartering extra aircraft to get the same number of staff to the sites.


Up until the impacts of COVID-19, I'd regularly travel with Alliance on their F100 service between BNE and ROK operated on behalf of Virgin Australia. I actually really like the F100 and the service which I found was pretty much on par with Virgin itself (which I would fly TSV to BNE on regularly too). Food was limited to a water and either a sandwich (afternoon) or muffin (morning). Seats are far more spacious than the VA/QF 737s and most still retain their Austrian Airlines interior. Exit rows were freely available regardless of frequent flyer level too. Likewise I can't recall ever having an aircraft go tech and the worst delay might have been an hour or so. To be fair though, their schedule is a bit more relaxed than say QF/VA and they have a bit more time on the ground to make up for any delays.

They're definitely doing well on the back of COVID-19 with increased revenue and are I've noticed they are now operating all the NRL charters flying the teams around for the games.
 
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vhqpa
Posts: 1692
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Thu Jun 11, 2020 9:38 am

I've flown Alliance on the odd occasion with QF/VA marketed RPT flights. As the posters said above, reliability has never been an issue. Cabins are kept in fairly good condition for their age. On board product for these contracted RPT flights are usually inline with what you would expect from a VA/QF Link flight. I'm quite fond of the old Fokkers so it's always a treat flying on one.

I'm looking forward to flying BNE-PPP and return on a QQ marketed RPT service in August. The website states there will only be a bottled water service.
"There you go ladies and gentleman we're through Mach 1 the speed of sound no bumps no bangs... CONCORDE"
 
benjjk
Posts: 385
Joined: Fri Aug 08, 2014 4:29 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Fri Jun 12, 2020 4:51 am

Only a rumour, and not a particularly surprising one at that, but apparently Qantas are planning on sending at least half of their A380s to Victorville for long-term storage (2 years). The other half may be kept in a more airworthy state for when demand returns, but they’re planning on that being a slow process.
 
Whatsaptudo
Posts: 108
Joined: Tue Jan 24, 2017 11:54 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Fri Jun 12, 2020 5:05 am

benjjk wrote:
Only a rumour, and not a particularly surprising one at that, but apparently Qantas are planning on sending at least half of their A380s to Victorville for long-term storage (2 years). The other half may be kept in a more airworthy state for when demand returns, but they’re planning on that being a slow process.


As you say, not surprising. Only rumours at this stage, but it’s being circulated that the A380 and the 787 are not included in any flying plan for the entirety of the next financial year (July to June) and the A380 may go beyond that.
 
ArtV
Posts: 140
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2016 2:29 pm

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2020

Fri Jun 12, 2020 5:40 am

Whatsaptudo wrote:
benjjk wrote:
Only a rumour, and not a particularly surprising one at that, but apparently Qantas are planning on sending at least half of their A380s to Victorville for long-term storage (2 years). The other half may be kept in a more airworthy state for when demand returns, but they’re planning on that being a slow process.


As you say, not surprising. Only rumours at this stage, but it’s being circulated that the A380 and the 787 are not included in any flying plan for the entirety of the next financial year (July to June) and the A380 may go beyond that.


With the 747 gone, and if you are suggesting that there is no 787 or 380 flying for the next 12 months, this would then suggest that there will be no LAX or LHR flights for over a year from QF.....something I find a little hard to believe, as these were the base of QF's feed, and borders will open at some stage.
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