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NateGreat
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Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:18 pm

I know everything is kind of on hold at the moment with COVID, but what will become of DL’s A333 and A332 interiors once they go in for retrofits? The B777 fleet is being retired, and the B764 fleet definitely won’t be around for as long as the A333 and A332 fleets. Even though the the B777 and B764 fleets had much more outdated interiors before the retrofits began, than that of the A330s, you would think that the A330ceos should have interiors that match those of the A330neos.
 
jghealey
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:34 pm

They can't retrofit the suites from the just retired-777 onto the A330ceo, right? I'd guess that the A330 version would need to be much narrower.
 
trexel94
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:46 pm

I’ve wondered this too. Considering how the A330ceos are extensively used across the long haul network it always puzzled and irritated me that DL never retrofitted the A330ceo fleet but did so with the 767s. Could someone explain this?
 
Moosefire
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:47 pm

I honestly don’t think they’re gonna spend (non allocated) money on discretionary stuff like this until they’ve returned to sustained profitability
MD-11F/C-17A Pilot
 
NateGreat
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:59 pm

jghealey wrote:
They can't retrofit the suites from the just retired-777 onto the A330ceo, right? I'd guess that the A330 version would need to be much narrower.

The A330NEOs utilize a slightly narrower version of the Delta One Suites than those found on the A350 and B777.
 
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Polot
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:59 pm

trexel94 wrote:
I’ve wondered this too. Considering how the A330ceos are extensively used across the long haul network it always puzzled and irritated me that DL never retrofitted the A330ceo fleet but did so with the 767s. Could someone explain this?

The 767s were also extensively used across the long haul network (even more so than the A330ceo, since DL has more 767s than A330ceos) and had an interior even older than the A330’s. I’m puzzled that you are puzzled that DL would want to refresh the 767 interior.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:20 pm

TL/DR: Not in the near-term until recovery from the impact of COVID-19. There is going to be zero spend on interior refurbishment for at least 2-3+ years and its likely a that good portion of the A330 fleet remains in long term storage until demand for international travel recovers and also when DL is in a position and needs to perform heavy maintenance on any that are coming due for checks.

The original 21 A333 and 10 A332 were delivered to NW between 2003-2008. At the time NW took delivery of the A333 at put them into TATL service replacing DC-10-30s, NW arguably had the best hard and soft product in J & Y in that timeframe. NW didn't have first class, instead marketed front cabin at World Business Class (WBC) and was sold as J. This was in the era when most airlines were flying 3-class TATL and when corporate/business travel policies were increasingly prohibitting the purchase of First class but would still allow J/Business on long-haul. The A330 with nose-to-tail AVOD, new interiors, near-lie-flat seats in J / WBC, and free booze in Y was a lot better than the bulk of what AA, UA, DL, CO, and US were flying across the Atlantic in the early 2000s then which included a lot of 767s with 90's vintage interiors.

Post-merger, in 2009/2010 DL did a light refresh on the NW-delivered A330s which included new carpet, seat covers, and some other minor cosmetic enhancements but they retained the original seats, AVOD system, and everything else.

DL did a major interior mod in 2013/2014 on the A332 & A333s and at that time put in all new seats, including the lie-flats in J.
DL also took delivery of 10 additional A330-300 (CEO) in 2015-2017 delivered in the current interior.

So the current interiors on the A330-200/300 fleet range from 3-7 years old. It would typically be getting close to the timeframe to do a refresh or replacement on the J seats/product but obviously that is not happening for several years.

This fleet was obviously next in line for a refresh after the completion of the 764s since they would easily be in-service for another decade.

However with the eventual draw-down (and likely accelerated pace) of the B763 fleet sunsetting, the A330CEOs are going to increasing take over those route profiles, whereas the A339 (NEO) with better economics and onboard product would increasing be used on higher profile and longer range flying. There is a wide-swath of routes that don't need the suites in F that are fine with a Low J / non-suite product.
Last edited by PSU.DTW.SCE on Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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Boeing757100
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:23 pm

the reverse herringbones aren't that bad......................
 
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airportugal310
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:24 pm

Just had a booked LAX-ATL flight in August upgauged from an A321 to an A333...that was a nice find. Will it hold? Who knows, but I'll take it
“They bought their tickets, they knew what they were getting into. I say, let 'em crash.”
 
deltaguy767
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:25 pm

The A330ceo interiors are not that old, in fact the refurb program was completed in 2014/2015, so about 5-6 years and while not suites, are far more comfortable than the legacy 764 and 76W products. Even pre-COVID, there was not much of appetite to launch a cabin refurbish program for the A330ceos, so given the cash situation of today, I doubt these interiors are going anywhere anytime soon.
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Boeing757100
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:27 pm

I think this will happen when the A330s reach like 22+ years old, which is also when most 767s will leave.
 
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Boeing757100
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Thu Jun 25, 2020 6:30 pm

Also N801NW-N811NW are at least 15 years old. Basically 3 year difference between those and most 764s.
 
Cointrin330
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Thu Jun 25, 2020 7:25 pm

trexel94 wrote:
I’ve wondered this too. Considering how the A330ceos are extensively used across the long haul network it always puzzled and irritated me that DL never retrofitted the A330ceo fleet but did so with the 767s. Could someone explain this?


The 767-300ERs were very much in need of cabin refreshes when that was undertaken in the late 2000s after DL emerged from Chapter 11 and post-merger with NW. There we retrofitted nose to tail, with 777 style cabin architecture. The A330-300s (and -200s) were all inherited from NW and were mostly newer than the 763s. The A330CEOs could use an update, notably in the premium cabin but the now discarded 777 Delta One suites cannot, as I understand it, be repurposed into the A330CEO fleet. All that said, the A330 fleet was always in less of a need to be redone as opposed to the 763s which were all in the old 80s interior architecture before being refitted.
 
NateGreat
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Thu Jun 25, 2020 8:01 pm

Boeing757100 wrote:
the reverse herringbones aren't that bad......................

But aren’t the reverse herringbone that DL uses on the A330s smaller and more basic than those used by AA, CX, and many others? I mean, Brian Kelly of The Points Guy said that the reverse herringbone on DL’s A333 isn’t as wide as that on AA’s B77W and others. The IFE also looks like it could be updated.
https://thepointsguy.com/2015/08/a330-delta-one-review/
 
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Boeing757100
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Thu Jun 25, 2020 8:07 pm

NateGreat wrote:
Boeing757100 wrote:
the reverse herringbones aren't that bad......................

But aren’t the reverse herringbone that DL uses on the A330s smaller and more basic than those used by AA, CX, and many others? I mean, Brian Kelly of The Points Guy said that the reverse herringbone on DL’s A333 isn’t as wide as that on AA’s B77W and others. The IFE also looks like it could be updated.
https://thepointsguy.com/2015/08/a330-delta-one-review/


True, but better than the China Eastern ones, am I right?
 
alfa164
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Thu Jun 25, 2020 9:58 pm

NateGreat wrote:
But aren’t the reverse herringbone that DL uses on the A330s smaller and more basic than those used by AA, CX, and many others? I mean, Brian Kelly of The Points Guy said that the reverse herringbone on DL’s A333 isn’t as wide as that on AA’s B77W and others. The IFE also looks like it could be updated.
https://thepointsguy.com/2015/08/a330-delta-one-review/


Reverse herringbones - or any other seat - will never be as wide on a 333 as on a 777 (unless you want to go to a 1-1-1 configuration, a la TK); the plane simply isn't as wide as a 777.

And maybe I am the only one, but I don't find "suites" to be any more comfortable than the traditional herringbone J lie-flats... although "We give you a Suite!" is a good marketing gimmick.
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n7371f
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Fri Jun 26, 2020 3:10 am

This is pipe dream stuff folks...Going to be years until the 330 non NEO fleet is addressed.
 
Yahnih
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:17 am

The china eastern a330s are going through retrofits similar to the seats found on PAL.
 
FlyGuyNash
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Fri Jun 26, 2020 8:19 am

Pre covid there was plans for the 330 to start interior work I believe late 2020 into 2021. D1 would stay the same but it would get DPS and new main cabin seats. Also they were going to add DPS on the international 757s but again that was all pre covid and probably not something that needs to be worried about since the interior on the 330s aren't that bad.
 
eamondzhang
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Fri Jun 26, 2020 12:44 pm

Yahnih wrote:
The china eastern a330s are going through retrofits similar to the seats found on PAL.

I have never heard such news - where did you get this from?

When they're losing A$10m a day I seriously doubt this is real.

Michael
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Fri Jun 26, 2020 1:00 pm

FlyGuyNash wrote:
Pre covid there was plans for the 330 to start interior work I believe late 2020 into 2021. D1 would stay the same but it would get DPS and new main cabin seats. Also they were going to add DPS on the international 757s but again that was all pre covid and probably not something that needs to be worried about since the interior on the 330s aren't that bad.


AA/DL/UA have all announced severe cuts to capital spending (and new aircraft deferments as part of that). It isn't going to matter if interiors get a little ratty or not - large $cale refurb projects will be put on hold. Replacing interiors just for commonality is going to be so far down the list of priorities that you can't even see that far.
 
deltairlines
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:02 pm

I will gladly take the A330 reverse herringbone seat over the reconfigured 767-400 any day of the week, especially on a window seat. The footwells (outside of the bulkhead) remain way too narrow on the 767-400, which is a pain for sleeping.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Fri Jun 26, 2020 2:32 pm

The next few years have the potential to feel like the 2001 - 2010 era where almost no investment in onboard product was made......
 
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Boeing757100
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Fri Jun 26, 2020 6:32 pm

PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
The next few years have the potential to feel like the 2001 - 2010 era where almost no investment in onboard product was made......



U know, that does not seem as wild as it may sound.
 
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Polot
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Fri Jun 26, 2020 6:44 pm

Boeing757100 wrote:
PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
The next few years have the potential to feel like the 2001 - 2010 era where almost no investment in onboard product was made......



U know, that does not seem as wild as it may sound.

It wouldn’t be as big of a deal though. 2000-2010 was a transformative time in aircraft interiors, with J moving from angled seats to lieflats, and PTVs introduced and moving from looping systems to AVOD. Failure to invest was noticeable in terms of passenger experience.

Innovation in terms of onboard product experience has largely stalled though (the biggest new thing in J is just a partition you slide across seat opening) as focus as turned on just making things lighter/more space efficient for operators.
 
Yahnih
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Sat Jun 27, 2020 12:44 am

eamondzhang wrote:
Yahnih wrote:
The china eastern a330s are going through retrofits similar to the seats found on PAL.

I have never heard such news - where did you get this from?

When they're losing A$10m a day I seriously doubt this is real.

Michael


Since almost 2 years ago. I’ve rode them a couple times from ICN- PVG.

See link https://youtu.be/jkLOdM19Iwg
 
eamondzhang
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Re: Delta A333 and A332 New Interiors?

Sat Jun 27, 2020 11:37 am

Yahnih wrote:
eamondzhang wrote:
Yahnih wrote:
The china eastern a330s are going through retrofits similar to the seats found on PAL.

I have never heard such news - where did you get this from?

When they're losing A$10m a day I seriously doubt this is real.

Michael


Since almost 2 years ago. I’ve rode them a couple times from ICN- PVG.

See link https://youtu.be/jkLOdM19Iwg

That's not a retrofit. Only for new A333s (coded 33L).

Michael

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