RvA wrote:bfitzflyer wrote:onwFan wrote:JFK and LAX are pretty much everyone's hubs. And to the crux of this thread, most foreign carrier partners will already be flying to JFK and LAX irrespective of DL having a hub there, and they all want to make money on the O/D there. SEA and BOS are barely budding hubs, and everything seems to suggest that they are not even profitable yet. The truth is that DL has seriously been attempting to bolster SEA & BOS to compensate for their lack of presence in bigger premium markets, which is where the business demand is. We are still to see how COVID impacts BOS & SEA. And by the way, ATL & DTW are what they are only because DL has a hub there.
AA has nothing at PHL & DFW? Not have a clue what you mean, but whatever... ORD may not have become as big of a hub as UA's, but AA's partners (BA, JL, CX, QR, RJ, FY) have all had great success at ORD with AA's feed. By the way, I would really love to know which are those foreign carriers who have heard about Atlanta, Minneapolis, Detroit and Salt Lake City before Dallas & Philly.
That's brand new information. The last time I heard, AS had double the market share of DL.
No contesting there.
How is JFK a hub for AA, down to what 50 flights pre covid.. PHL and DFW are huge for AA, just insignificant to international travelers. ATL world's largest airport, enough said. MSP, DTW and SLC are domestic hubs as I stated. SEA, let's see how many overseas flights does AS have, oh, that would be zero. Glad we agree on UA
Not sure I agree with your remarks here. PHL and DFW are insignificant for international travellers? Given they are two big gateways connecting many international destinations to many domestic and international destinations how is that insignificant? MSP/DTW do a similar job for DL albeit at a smaller scale, mostly to AMS/MSP but I wouldn’t say that’s insignificant, how many transatlantic flights are flying there for the main purpose of connecting people onwards into the Domestic network. Similar to what DFW and PHL do for AA except at a smaller scale.
You can basically break the US down in a series of tiers:
Tier 1: LAX/NYC(JFK+EWR). Everyone has a hub, lots of partner flights.
Tier 2: ORD/IAD/SFO. Very significant international demand from many airlines for both TATL and TPAC.
Tier 3: MIA/BOS/SEA. Significant international destinations and demand from both domestic and abroad, with heavy international focus on a certain region. Natural geographic hubs because of being in their “corner” of the USA. (Ie MIA to Latin America, BOS to Europe, SEA to Asia).
Tier 4: DFW/ATL/IAH/PHL/DTW. Major hub for one airline, in major market, with good international demand. The hub airline serves many destinations, and there are a few other international flights from non-alliance carriers. The hub airline, while providing more international service than could be supported on its own, likely also keeps away a few international flights from other alliances. (i.e., if not for AA then AF would probably serve PHL, if not for DL then BA would probably serve DTW, etc.)
Tier 5: DEN/CLT/MSP/PHX/SLC. Large domestic hub that attracts some international service, mostly on the hub carrier’s alliance. Less local international O/D than Tier 4.
Wildcard Tier: MCO/LAS/HNL/FLL. Large leisure markets that attract service from many carriers and LCC because of local leisure attractions.