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Midwestindy
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AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:31 pm

http://news.aa.com/news/news-details/20 ... fault.aspx

"Travelers will now have seamless access to both airlines’ domestic and international networks"


New and expanded routes: American intends to launch service between JFK and TLV and will introduce new seasonal service between JFK and ATH next summer" "American will also operate daily seasonal service to GIG beginning in winter 2021 during the peak summer travel period in Rio de Janeiro. And, once the coronavirus (COVID-19) pandemic has ended, the new partnership is certain to facilitate American adding new long-haul markets in Europe, Africa, India and South America.

JetBlue plans to increase flying out of New York’s three major airports, bringing its award-winning experience to more customers. Its growth at JFK will be aimed at offering even more connection opportunities to American’s growing international network of destinations

More choice and loyalty benefits: JetBlue and American will begin a new codeshare relationship, giving customers seamless access to more destinations, including international service

Seamless experience: JetBlue and American will offer customers more options on Transcon service from New York to the West Coast. American’s popular three-class service on the Airbus A321T will join JetBlue with its Mint premium experience and thoughtful core seating


WOW!!! Vasu Raja is the man! Northeast partnership with B6, West Coast partnership with AS....
Last edited by Midwestindy on Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Status for 2019/2020: AAdvantage Platinum, Delta Gold, Southwest A-List
 
catiii
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B6/AA Codeshare Announcement

Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:34 pm

Seems pretty substantial in the northeast. Smart move by both carriers to address the competitive landscape.


http://investor.jetblue.com/investor-re ... -133028188
 
catiii
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:36 pm

Why is Vasu the man? Who’s to say this wasn’t originated on the B6 side?
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:37 pm

catiii wrote:
Why is Vasu the man? Who’s to say this wasn’t originated on the B6 side?


Arguably the most respected network planning guy in the business... look what he has done in SEA, LAX, and now the northeast. Now with better feed, their int'l business will be much more viable
Status for 2019/2020: AAdvantage Platinum, Delta Gold, Southwest A-List
 
N757ST
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:44 pm

I'm sure this will benefit both airlines. Jetblue will be allowed to grow JFK and LGA using AA slots, and the trans atlantic ambitions remain in tact. American can utilize feed from jetblue to service destinations outside jetblue's current ambitions and aircraft range. American gets to benefit from additional services to the northeast that it couldn't serve profitably. How much will jetblue grow in JFK? Who knows, but it'll be much bigger then today IMO.
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:45 pm

Correct me if I am wrong, but with these partnerships AA+B6/AS will now be the largest carrier in NYC, BOS, LAX, SEA, South Florida, Dallas, DC, PHX, & CLT?
Status for 2019/2020: AAdvantage Platinum, Delta Gold, Southwest A-List
 
catiii
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:48 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
catiii wrote:
Why is Vasu the man? Who’s to say this wasn’t originated on the B6 side?


Arguably the most respected network planning guy in the business... look what he has done in SEA, LAX, and now the northeast. Now with better feed, their int'l business will be much more viable


Again, how do you know B6 didn’t originate this and go to AA with it?

Or Vasu is the man because he agreed to it?
 
catiii
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:51 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong, but with these partnerships AA+B6/AS will now be the largest carrier in NYC, BOS, LAX, SEA, South Florida, Dallas, DC, PHX, & CLT?


Since they all remain standalone carriers, no. AA isn’t the largest carrier in BOS.
 
bigb
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:52 pm

catiii wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
catiii wrote:
Why is Vasu the man? Who’s to say this wasn’t originated on the B6 side?


Arguably the most respected network planning guy in the business... look what he has done in SEA, LAX, and now the northeast. Now with better feed, their int'l business will be much more viable


Again, how do you know B6 didn’t originate this and go to AA with it?

Or Vasu is the man because he agreed to it?


This has been in the works for awhile now. Quite frankly it doesn’t matter who it originated from, Vasu is still well respect networking planning guy in the industry with a lack of filter.
 
Nicknuzzii
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 12:54 pm

Something that is brought up again and again in the announcement is how JetBlue plans to further expand at EWR and LGA, anyone have any ideas what this could look like?
 
United1
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:01 pm

catiii wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong, but with these partnerships AA+B6/AS will now be the largest carrier in NYC, BOS, LAX, SEA, South Florida, Dallas, DC, PHX, & CLT?


Since they all remain standalone carriers, no. AA isn’t the largest carrier in BOS.


I don't know about NYC either...UA and DL may still be larger. This could also be a sign that AA plans to shrink fairly significantly in the Northeast. B6's press release mentions AA plans to deploy larger 2-class RJs to the region next year. That implies AA is pulling mainline back and backfilling with Eagle.
I know the voices in my head aren't real but sometimes their ideas are just awesome!!!
 
codc10
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:08 pm

This certainly gives rise to strange bedfellows on the transcons, with AA+AS, AA+B6 “cooperating” but still competing with each other (by the letter of the law).

Nicknuzzii wrote:
Something that is brought up again and again in the announcement is how JetBlue plans to further expand at EWR and LGA, anyone have any ideas what this could look like?


AA has a fairly large and underutilized gate footprint at EWR. Consolidating operations with AA gives B6 access to additional gates for growth that is not restricted by slots.
Last edited by codc10 on Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:09 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong, but with these partnerships AA+B6/AS will now be the largest carrier in NYC, BOS, LAX, SEA, South Florida, Dallas, DC, PHX, & CLT?


Based on 2019 data, in NYC AA+B6 (34.7 million passengers) is marginally larger than DL (32.9 million) or UA (32.9 million).

There's a lot of excitement for a simple codeshare. Until they get antitrust immunity (doubtful, IMHO, and they didn't even declare intent to seek it) they can't coordinate pricing, schedules, or capacity.
 
lowfareair
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:11 pm

Hmm, I wonder what this means for PHL as a European gateway. I cannot see AA giving it up (as that would likely cause a downward spiral for other flights there) but not sure how having a stronger European gateway at JFK will do anything but hurt PHL in the long-term.
 
avek00
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:16 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong, but with these partnerships AA+B6/AS will now be the largest carrier in NYC, BOS, LAX, SEA, South Florida, Dallas, DC, PHX, & CLT?


Based on 2019 data, in NYC AA+B6 (34.7 million passengers) is marginally larger than DL (32.9 million) or UA (32.9 million).

There's a lot of excitement for a simple codeshare. Until they get antitrust immunity (doubtful, IMHO, and they didn't even declare intent to seek it) they can't coordinate pricing, schedules, or capacity.


Antitrust immunity is not allowed for airline services within the US domestic market.
Live life to the fullest.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:21 pm

AA appears to be doing now at SEA with AS and with B6 in the Northeast that DL originally had wanted to do with AS and SEA a decade ago.

Strange times indeed. Cooperate, partnership, but still competitors. And can't coordinate on pricing, scheduling, and capacity. They sure can signal each other though.

Kind of feels like the old Business Express set-up from decades gone by.
Last edited by PSU.DTW.SCE on Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
JeremyXWB
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:22 pm

Sounds like AA is trying to take on DL in Seattle, Boston and New York
 
BravoEcho757
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:24 pm

Perhaps also allowing B6 access to LHR?
 
RvA
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:24 pm

It’s a good thing AA has a lot of money spare to go and fight Delta in NYC with a partner they can’t legally coordinate very much with. Curious to see how this one will work out, should be interesting.
 
UpNAWAy
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:25 pm

lowfareair wrote:
Hmm, I wonder what this means for PHL as a European gateway. I cannot see AA giving it up (as that would likely cause a downward spiral for other flights there) but not sure how having a stronger European gateway at JFK will do anything but hurt PHL in the long-term.



It was worded right in Vasu's statement that this would not impact PHL as the TA gateway.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:25 pm

I honestly feel despite the industry literally burning to the ground that AA is taking the "go big or go home approach" for the future while DL and UA have turtled into their shell.

DL and UA seem focused on trying to navigate the next 9 months, meanwhile AA is like ah screw it who cares about the rest of 2020 and early 2021 we are focused on Summer 2021 and beyond at this point.
Last edited by PSU.DTW.SCE on Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
Ishrion
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:25 pm

BravoEcho757 wrote:
Perhaps also allowing B6 access to LHR?


Not really.

JetBlue is not joining oneworld® or the AA/IAG Atlantic Joint Business Agreement and will continue with plans to independently launch and operate trans-Atlantic flights to London in 2021.
 
Brickell305
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:26 pm

JeremyXWB wrote:
Sounds like AA is trying to take on DL in Seattle, Boston and New York

It sounds more like AA is weak on the West Coast and needed a partner to help them so went with AS who is strong domestically while AA brings international flights to the table. And the same occurred in NYC where AA has been struggling as of late and therefore sought out a partner who helps them significantly domestically while AA brings the international markets to the table.
 
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jfklganyc
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:27 pm

All of a sudden everything makes sense:

-Gates at EWR
-More slots at JFK
-Gates at LAX

**ALSO...The pilot no furlough deal was part of this

We can now see the forest through the trees
Last edited by jfklganyc on Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
chonetsao
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:27 pm

Just to remind everyone here, AA and B6 used to have an on and off relationship. So this is NOT NEW, but a RESUME of past friendship. I welcome anyone who has the precise information on the previous AA+B6 cooperation. I can only vaguely remember before 2007 there was B6 earning and redemption availability in AA Advantage programme. I also vaguely remember the earning on B6 with AA was restricted to northeast market as well. Anyone here still remember the details?
 
wnflyguy
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:28 pm

Hey JetBlue it's AA wanna code share?
Sure But we need some of your gates also at LAX so we can finally ditch LGB! AA ok done!
We now know were all the JetBlue gates space is come from at LAX.
Flyguy
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Ciel
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:30 pm

I am quite impressed by AA' strong competitive spirit. I hope DL will bring an answer to this, despite their financial woes.
 
Brickell305
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:31 pm

I don’t see why AA people are viewing this as good news. It seems more to me like AA is giving up on competing in NYC on its own and is willing to outsource (not entirely obviously) domestic to B6 while it brings international to the table.

It did the same with AS where it realized it could not build a West Coast transpacific hub on its own and therefore partnered with AS in SEA.
 
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NWAESC
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:33 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
catiii wrote:
Why is Vasu the man? Who’s to say this wasn’t originated on the B6 side?


Arguably the most respected network planning guy in the business... look what he has done in SEA, LAX, and now the northeast. Now with better feed, their int'l business will be much more viable


Can you imagine a dinner party with him, Glen Hauenstein, and Scott Kirby all at the table?
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
wnflyguy
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:33 pm

jfklganyc wrote:
All of a sudden everything makes sense:

-Gates at EWR
-More slots at JFK
-Gates at LAX

We can now see the forest through the trees


Don't forget LHR JetBlue needs the main airport in London to be successful.
I see a British Airways code share with some Slots attached to it.

Flyguy
My Wings are clipped just another Retired Airline person. The Ultimate Armchair out of the loop airline industry geek. Aloha Mr Hand!
 
UpNAWAy
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:33 pm

PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
I honestly feel despite the industry literally burning to the ground that AA is taking the "go big or go home approach" for the future while DL and UA have turtled into their shell.

DL and UA seem focused on trying to navigate the next 9 months, meanwhile AA is like ah screw it who cares about the rest of 2020 and early 2021 we are focused on Summer 2021 and beyond at this point.



You are correct it will be a Grand Slam or a strike out swinging but as Vasu said just taking three strikes down the middle is a guaranteed strike out we have all seen before. BTW IMHO United , not AA is the airline in real deep trouble.
 
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jfklganyc
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:34 pm

chonetsao wrote:
Just to remind everyone here, AA and B6 used to have an on and off relationship. So this is NOT NEW, but a RESUME of past friendship. I welcome anyone who has the precise information on the previous AA+B6 cooperation. I can only vaguely remember before 2007 there was B6 earning and redemption availability in AA Advantage programme. I also vaguely remember the earning on B6 with AA was restricted to northeast market as well. Anyone here still remember the details?


It wasn’t to this extent

But yes they’ve toyed with this before. The US merger killed it
 
UpNAWAy
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:34 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
I don’t see why AA people are viewing this as good news. It seems more to me like AA is giving up on competing in NYC on its own and is willing to outsource (not entirely obviously) domestic to B6 while it brings international to the table.

It did the same with AS where it realized it could not build a West Coast transpacific hub on its own and therefore partnered with AS in SEA.



Because flying routes that always loose money even in boom times just to be in the market is a bad idea!
 
Miamiairport
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:40 pm

AA had a limited codeshare agreement with B6 about a decade or so ago. IIRC you could earn RDMs on certain routes. Also IIRC it was tied to mostly NE routes. For example I flew LGA/PBI on B6 around 2011/2012 and wasn't eligible for AAdvantage miles. However, I flew EWR/BOS several times and got RDMs for the trips.

You have to wonder where this might go long term.
 
Brickell305
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:40 pm

UpNAWAy wrote:
Brickell305 wrote:
I don’t see why AA people are viewing this as good news. It seems more to me like AA is giving up on competing in NYC on its own and is willing to outsource (not entirely obviously) domestic to B6 while it brings international to the table.

It did the same with AS where it realized it could not build a West Coast transpacific hub on its own and therefore partnered with AS in SEA.



Because flying routes that always loose money even in boom times just to be in the market is a bad idea!

And congrats to AA for reducing its costs in NYC but let’s treat this as what it is; a retreat. People are talking about AA “swinging for the fences” when this is the opposite of that.
 
Alias1024
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:41 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
I don’t see why AA people are viewing this as good news. It seems more to me like AA is giving up on competing in NYC on its own and is willing to outsource (not entirely obviously) domestic to B6 while it brings international to the table.

It did the same with AS where it realized it could not build a West Coast transpacific hub on its own and therefore partnered with AS in SEA.


This.

AA sends out over 24,000 WARN act notices and immediately announces a deal to farm out the northeast to B6. There have to be a lot of really miffed AA employees today.
It is a mistake to think you can solve any major problems with just potatoes.
 
tphuang
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:46 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong, but with these partnerships AA+B6/AS will now be the largest carrier in NYC, BOS, LAX, SEA, South Florida, Dallas, DC, PHX, & CLT?


Based on 2019 data, in NYC AA+B6 (34.7 million passengers) is marginally larger than DL (32.9 million) or UA (32.9 million).

There's a lot of excitement for a simple codeshare. Until they get antitrust immunity (doubtful, IMHO, and they didn't even declare intent to seek it) they can't coordinate pricing, schedules, or capacity.


codeshare is as far as they can go. Anything further would not work with B6's pilot contract.

As for the other part, I think it's quite clear that JetBlue is going to fast forward a very aggressive expansion in NY/NJ airports which will probably allow the combined B6/AA operation to be much larger than DL and UA. I would not be surprised if JetBlue's operation will end up carrying the most passengers by the time their expansion is done.
 
UpNAWAy
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:52 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
UpNAWAy wrote:
Brickell305 wrote:
I don’t see why AA people are viewing this as good news. It seems more to me like AA is giving up on competing in NYC on its own and is willing to outsource (not entirely obviously) domestic to B6 while it brings international to the table.

It did the same with AS where it realized it could not build a West Coast transpacific hub on its own and therefore partnered with AS in SEA.



Because flying routes that always loose money even in boom times just to be in the market is a bad idea!

And congrats to AA for reducing its costs in NYC but let’s treat this as what it is; a retreat. People are talking about AA “swinging for the fences” when this is the opposite of that.


In the end if AA only flies to JFK from Hubs with mainline, operates a bunch of regionals for the small NE cities and greatly increases international flying out of JFK all while making a profit is not retreating in any way, but a huge win and success. It is called smart and strategic business thinking! The airline business is not about market share, that has always been the dumbest idea ever! No other businesses have huge, never ending, guaranteed loss leaders just to say they sell to a certain area.
 
tphuang
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:54 pm

jfklganyc wrote:
All of a sudden everything makes sense:

-Gates at EWR
-More slots at JFK
-Gates at LAX

**ALSO...The pilot no furlough deal was part of this

We can now see the forest through the trees


Yep, everything makes sense. Jetblue is getting ready for a mass expansion in NY/NJ area next year. The puzzling part is AA. JetBlue pilots might be the biggest winner here.

JetBlue gets more slots at JFK, more slots at LGA, more gates at LAX, codeshare to give it a larger network, ability to put its passengers on AA during IRROPS. This gives JetBlue a clear path to be a real player in the largest corporate accounts in Northeast.

AA gets to keep its ff in northeast in short to medium term and help make it more attractive to customers in rest of country.

It seems like a lot more benefit to JetBlue here. In 5 years, we could see JetBlue with full blown networks in JFK/LGA/EWR/BOS and large presence in Florida and California. They will be doing a lot of European flights out of JFK. If you are liiving in the northeast, what's your reason for staying with AA rather than becoming a JetBlue ff?

big losers here are DL and UA.
 
KlimaBXsst
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:54 pm

Scratching my head on this one now?

JetBlue an AA codeshare alliance.
Alaska a member of OneWorld.

Did JetBlue not want to join OneWorld and why not?
Aesthetically the A 340 got it right!
 
UpNAWAy
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:54 pm

Alias1024 wrote:
Brickell305 wrote:
I don’t see why AA people are viewing this as good news. It seems more to me like AA is giving up on competing in NYC on its own and is willing to outsource (not entirely obviously) domestic to B6 while it brings international to the table.

It did the same with AS where it realized it could not build a West Coast transpacific hub on its own and therefore partnered with AS in SEA.


This.

AA sends out over 24,000 WARN act notices and immediately announces a deal to farm out the northeast to B6. There have to be a lot of really miffed AA employees today.



They are not related at all, and as AA itself has proven time and time again successful partnerships grow the mainline airline not shrink it.
 
Miamiairport
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:57 pm

If I'm remembering back to the first AA/B6 codeshare arrangement correctly there was talk about B6 possibly joining OW at some future point. As noted above the merger killed the codeshare. B6 joining OW? I could certainly see it.
 
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Polot
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:57 pm

UpNAWAy wrote:
Alias1024 wrote:
Brickell305 wrote:
I don’t see why AA people are viewing this as good news. It seems more to me like AA is giving up on competing in NYC on its own and is willing to outsource (not entirely obviously) domestic to B6 while it brings international to the table.

It did the same with AS where it realized it could not build a West Coast transpacific hub on its own and therefore partnered with AS in SEA.


This.

AA sends out over 24,000 WARN act notices and immediately announces a deal to farm out the northeast to B6. There have to be a lot of really miffed AA employees today.



They are not related at all, and as AA itself has proven time and time again successful partnerships grow the mainline airline not shrink it.

When has AA ever proven that? How many domestic partnerships has AA ever entered into in the past?
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 1:59 pm

UpNAWAy wrote:
The airline business is not about market share, that has always been the dumbest idea ever! No other businesses have huge, never ending, guaranteed loss leaders just to say they sell to a certain area.


You should read into retail & consumer goods, loss leaders are extremely common.

And market share is very important, at least to the US3. If you aren't the largest then your only real differentiators are better product & lower pricing.
Status for 2019/2020: AAdvantage Platinum, Delta Gold, Southwest A-List
 
JAMBOJET
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 2:03 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
UpNAWAy wrote:
Brickell305 wrote:
I don’t see why AA people are viewing this as good news. It seems more to me like AA is giving up on competing in NYC on its own and is willing to outsource (not entirely obviously) domestic to B6 while it brings international to the table.

It did the same with AS where it realized it could not build a West Coast transpacific hub on its own and therefore partnered with AS in SEA.



Because flying routes that always loose money even in boom times just to be in the market is a bad idea!

And congrats to AA for reducing its costs in NYC but let’s treat this as what it is; a retreat. People are talking about AA “swinging for the fences” when this is the opposite of that.

Was there a leprechaun with a chest full of LGA and JFK slots hiding at the Port Authority that AA should've used instead to swing for the fences?
 
tphuang
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Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 2:03 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong, but with these partnerships AA+B6/AS will now be the largest carrier in NYC, BOS, LAX, SEA, South Florida, Dallas, DC, PHX, & CLT?


Right, I think you are 100% right about this part. These deals help AA by making them more relevant in rest of the country where they are fight UA/DL for high yielding traffic. The biggest losers here are DL and UA.

Just taking your home airport as an example, I see JetBlue now entering IND from BOS/JFK and possible EWR. That would give people a lot more reason to pick AA ahead of DL.

codc10 wrote:
This certainly gives rise to strange bedfellows on the transcons, with AA+AS, AA+B6 “cooperating” but still competing with each other (by the letter of the law).

Nicknuzzii wrote:
Something that is brought up again and again in the announcement is how JetBlue plans to further expand at EWR and LGA, anyone have any ideas what this could look like?


AA has a fairly large and underutilized gate footprint at EWR. Consolidating operations with AA gives B6 access to additional gates for growth that is not restricted by slots.


Right, now you have AA saying openly they will help JetBlue get larger in all 3 airports. That will definitely hurt UA at EWR and DL at LGA/JFK.

on the UA angle. I'm really surprised they were slow here. When AA/AS deal first came out, I said UA should get on a phone and partner up with B6. Now, their NY/NJ operation is under serious attack. I see B6 easily getting to 100 flights a day at EWR if AA is willing to allow them to use their gates there.

Ishrion wrote:
BravoEcho757 wrote:
Perhaps also allowing B6 access to LHR?


Not really.

JetBlue is not joining oneworld® or the AA/IAG Atlantic Joint Business Agreement and will continue with plans to independently launch and operate trans-Atlantic flights to London in 2021.

yeah, AA is already bringing so much to the table on this deal. They would have to be certifiably insane to give more.

Brickell305 wrote:
I don’t see why AA people are viewing this as good news. It seems more to me like AA is giving up on competing in NYC on its own and is willing to outsource (not entirely obviously) domestic to B6 while it brings international to the table.

It did the same with AS where it realized it could not build a West Coast transpacific hub on its own and therefore partnered with AS in SEA.

Remember you were giving me a reality check in JetBlue thread a couple of months ago when I said they will grow at JFK/LGA/EWR/BOS/LAX?. Guess what, everything I predicted has already happened.

If you are in a large JetBlue focus city, I don't think this helps AA that much. It helps their competitiveness in rest of the country.
 
deltaffindfw
Posts: 1520
Joined: Tue Sep 02, 2003 7:42 am

Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 2:05 pm

I’m guessing DFW-TLV won’t happen now?
 
ShinyAndChrome
Posts: 280
Joined: Fri Aug 28, 2015 1:53 am

Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 2:08 pm

Well this is quite the coup. I'd love to have been a fly on the wall when they were negotiating codeshare revenue splits. I have an inkling it was very favorable to B6.

Agreed on the earlier point re: JFK vs PHL. When international travel does come back in appreciable numbers, it'll be interesting to see how AA manages flows through the NE to Europe.
 
User avatar
STT757
Posts: 14126
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 1:14 am

Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 2:15 pm

All the credit in the world to AA and B6, they're sure not taking this crisis laying down. Now they just need Florida, California, Arizona and Texas to get their heads out of the sand and tackle their growing cases. It hurts UA at EWR and LAX, but this definitely is a high and in fastball right at Delta. Seattle and LAX with AS and now BOS, JFK, LGA with B6.

Meanwhile WN just keeps doing their thing. I wonder what NK is doing, I drove past EWR on the way to work today and it's was looking like a mini NK hub with no less than six NK Airbuses parked at Terminal B.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
Brickell305
Posts: 1020
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 2:07 pm

Re: AA & B6 announce Northeast Partnership

Thu Jul 16, 2020 2:16 pm

tphuang wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
Correct me if I am wrong, but with these partnerships AA+B6/AS will now be the largest carrier in NYC, BOS, LAX, SEA, South Florida, Dallas, DC, PHX, & CLT?


Right, I think you are 100% right about this part. These deals help AA by making them more relevant in rest of the country where they are fight UA/DL for high yielding traffic. The biggest losers here are DL and UA.

Just taking your home airport as an example, I see JetBlue now entering IND from BOS/JFK and possible EWR. That would give people a lot more reason to pick AA ahead of DL.

codc10 wrote:
This certainly gives rise to strange bedfellows on the transcons, with AA+AS, AA+B6 “cooperating” but still competing with each other (by the letter of the law).

Nicknuzzii wrote:
Something that is brought up again and again in the announcement is how JetBlue plans to further expand at EWR and LGA, anyone have any ideas what this could look like?


AA has a fairly large and underutilized gate footprint at EWR. Consolidating operations with AA gives B6 access to additional gates for growth that is not restricted by slots.


Right, now you have AA saying openly they will help JetBlue get larger in all 3 airports. That will definitely hurt UA at EWR and DL at LGA/JFK.

on the UA angle. I'm really surprised they were slow here. When AA/AS deal first came out, I said UA should get on a phone and partner up with B6. Now, their NY/NJ operation is under serious attack. I see B6 easily getting to 100 flights a day at EWR if AA is willing to allow them to use their gates there.

Ishrion wrote:
BravoEcho757 wrote:
Perhaps also allowing B6 access to LHR?


Not really.

JetBlue is not joining oneworld® or the AA/IAG Atlantic Joint Business Agreement and will continue with plans to independently launch and operate trans-Atlantic flights to London in 2021.

yeah, AA is already bringing so much to the table on this deal. They would have to be certifiably insane to give more.

Brickell305 wrote:
I don’t see why AA people are viewing this as good news. It seems more to me like AA is giving up on competing in NYC on its own and is willing to outsource (not entirely obviously) domestic to B6 while it brings international to the table.

It did the same with AS where it realized it could not build a West Coast transpacific hub on its own and therefore partnered with AS in SEA.

Remember you were giving me a reality check in JetBlue thread a couple of months ago when I said they will grow at JFK/LGA/EWR/BOS/LAX?. Guess what, everything I predicted has already happened.

If you are in a large JetBlue focus city, I don't think this helps AA that much. It helps their competitiveness in rest of the country.

They've announced firm plans (announced schedule of expanded service) to grow in EWR. Outside of that, they haven't done any of that. In LAX, they shifted their current operations from LGB to LAX. They said they hoped to get the station to 70 flights a day within 5 years. Nothing firm announced. Re JFK/LGA/BOS, what firm plans have been announced?
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