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YYZORD
Posts: 495
Joined: Thu Jan 31, 2019 5:26 pm

Re: SQ flights to LAS, YYZ & ORD and JFK via BRU

Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:15 pm

If SQ can make SIN-SEA work, how can they not make SIN-YVR work with AC being there? AC codeshares with SQ unlike UA so I think its very possible with a A359 since that can fly to YVR direct from SIN.
 
Airlinerdude
Posts: 182
Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2010 3:07 am

Re: SQ flights to LAS, YYZ & ORD and JFK via BRU

Fri Jul 31, 2020 9:07 pm

YYZORD wrote:
If SQ can make SIN-SEA work, how can they not make SIN-YVR work with AC being there? AC codeshares with SQ unlike UA so I think its very possible with a A359 since that can fly to YVR direct from SIN.


I would suspect that this has something to do with the pretty extensive codeshare SQ has with AS.

https://www.routesonline.com/news/38/ai ... -sep-2019/

That codeshare seems to cover most of the major Western Canadian destinations, albeit if I recall, the timings of some arrivals into SEA don’t connect well with SQ’s departure from SEA. Canadians in YVR and the like are increasingly familiar with connecting in SEA due to the wide array of destinations served, and sometimes more favourable prices.

It’s too bad that SQ couldn’t retain operating to YVR, even if it was via a middle point. Extra competition, particularly that from a world class airline, is much needed competition in Canada.
 
Dominion301
Posts: 2809
Joined: Wed Jul 20, 2016 1:48 pm

Re: SQ flights to LAS, YYZ & ORD and JFK via BRU

Fri Jul 31, 2020 11:04 pm

CrewBunk wrote:
airbazar wrote:
It wasn't affected at that time but the story repeated itself. 3x weekly wasn't attractive enough to premium, business fliers and for that reason SQ wanted daily service. When Canada wouldn't give them daily service, they withdrew.


You have to go a bit further than that to see history repeating itself.

In 1985, with a newly amended air service agreement, two new routes emerged. AC started YYZ-LHR-BOM-SIN. At the same time SQ started SIN-ICN-YVR.

AC’s new route was a success, SQ’s was not.

When AC requested expanded capacity, Singapore refused. The L-1011-500 became a 747-200 Combi, but passenger capacity was capped at L-1011 loads. Then cargo came under scrutiny and Singapore would not allow both the 747 Combi from the west and the DC-8F from the east, even though not disallowed in the agreement.

AC had fifth freedom rights on all sectors between all cities. They accurately realized that a daily frequency would be successful. It was allowed by both the UK and Indian Governments ..... but Singapore still refused as their SIN-ICN-YVR was not doing well. AC then stopped the BOM-SIN sector and increased capacity as far as BOM. Reading an editorial in the Toronto Globe and Mail, it was suggested that pricing by SQ made the route less viable than just stopping in BOM and returning to Canada.

So ..... move ahead a few years. SQ now wants increased service as well as access to Canada from both the east and the west. Is Canada’s and AC’s response any surprise?

The air service agreement between Canada and Singapore still exists, unchanged. It allows full open skies between the two countries. If wanted, SQ could fly daily from Singapore to Canada. But ..... they don’t. And why? Because the business is simply not there.

If their business model requires fifth freedom rights to “poach” other country’s traffic to ensure a success, then maybe there is a flaw somewhere.


I remember attending a Canadian Airports Council meeting/conference in Ottawa in 2006. The then-SQ VP for Canada was a guest speaker. He said without daily, the YVR-ICN-SIN route wasn’t viable long-term, even though the route had 90% loads. What SQ really wanted was YVR-ICN daily. YVR-SIN was the secondary interest. Neither Canada, nor South Korea wanted SQ daily on YVR-ICN.

The fact nowadays like you said SQ could launch YVR-SIN nonstops but haven’t is very telling as to where the $ we’re to be made for SQ at YVR.
 
x1234
Topic Author
Posts: 875
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2016 3:50 pm

Re: SQ flights to LAS, YYZ & ORD and JFK via BRU

Fri Jul 31, 2020 11:24 pm

SQ can easily launch SIN-YVR but the reason they settled upon SEA was due to the corporate Fortune 500 in the Seattle area requiring business travel (T-Mobile, Microsoft, Amazon, Nintendo, etc.) YVR is purely VFR.
 
User avatar
LAX772LR
Posts: 13278
Joined: Sun Nov 09, 2014 11:06 pm

Re: SQ flights to LAS, YYZ & ORD and JFK via BRU

Sat Aug 01, 2020 2:11 am

Airlinerdude wrote:
Extra competition, particularly that from a world class airline, is much needed competition in Canada.

What real competition would they bring though?

SIN is by geography, literally the worst place on the planet for N.American-originating traffic to connect to just about anywhere.
Even routes like KUL, CGK, and BKK are quicker (both by distance and by number of cnnx on each side) via HKG, TPE, etc.

Granted, that won't stop some folk from flying them. And SQ could of course compete on price point in order to encourage; but that's generally not the thing that "a world class airline" flying 15hr+ flights, wants to do.

For the Americas, if there's not a rather significant organic market for O&D to SIN, then SQ isn't all that interested.
Hence not seeing them do YVR anymore, even in the previous best of times.
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil

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