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NWAESC
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DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:35 pm

https://www.startribune.com/delta-won-t-furlough-flight-attendants-ground-workers/572417442/

From the article:

"More than 40,000 employees from across work groups took voluntarily, unpaid leaves of absence over the past several months and about 17,000 employees — or about 20% of its workforce — took the company's early retirement offer. Ground-based employees have had their work hours reduced by 25% as air travel continues to be significantly depressed."

Notably excepted from this announcement is DL's pilot corps, who still face a layoff of ~2000 pilots after 10/1...
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
MIflyer12
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:45 pm

Anybody have Bastian's memo referenced in the Star-Tribune link? Is there a time frame or other qualification mentioned?
 
ordbosewr
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:45 pm

The article does not mention, are they cutting hours or other types of things that will reduce pay or cost to the company?
 
departedflights
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:57 pm

I didn't notice if the article mentioned how many flight attendants were being displaced to catering and reservations positions.

I know some are but I was wondering if you had an exact number or percentage. Again, I may have missed it in the article.
The opinions are expressed are my own and do not represent those of anyone else, including my coworkers or my employer.
 
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NWAESC
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:11 pm

ordbosewr wrote:
The article does not mention, are they cutting hours or other types of things that will reduce pay or cost to the company?


We have all been working under a 25% cut in hours, and that will continue through (at least) the end of the year.

departedflights wrote:
I didn't notice if the article mentioned how many flight attendants were being displaced to catering and reservations positions.

I know some are but I was wondering if you had an exact number or percentage. Again, I may have missed it in the article.


No idea who-went-where, but as of just 2-3 weeks ago, they mentioned being overstaffed by ~3000 FA's.
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
Flflyer83
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:13 pm

departedflights wrote:
I didn't notice if the article mentioned how many flight attendants were being displaced to catering and reservations positions. .


Oh, this is going to be interesting... I guess if you shuffle them in to positions they don’t like and they quit, you can still claim that you didn’t furlough any...
 
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NWAESC
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:17 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
Anybody have Bastian's memo referenced in the Star-Tribune link? Is there a time frame or other qualification mentioned?


It's still marked internal, so I can't cite it, but the article on Delta's News Hub states summer 2021..

EDITED to add this link: https://news.delta.com/how-culture-and- ... delta-jobs
Last edited by NWAESC on Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
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NWAESC
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:19 pm

Flflyer83 wrote:
Oh, this is going to be interesting... I guess if you shuffle them in to positions they don’t like and they quit, you can still claim that you didn’t furlough any...


Exactly.
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
ordbosewr
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:25 pm

NWAESC wrote:
ordbosewr wrote:
The article does not mention, are they cutting hours or other types of things that will reduce pay or cost to the company?


We have all been working under a 25% cut in hours, and that will continue through (at least) the end of the year.

departedflights wrote:
I didn't notice if the article mentioned how many flight attendants were being displaced to catering and reservations positions.

I know some are but I was wondering if you had an exact number or percentage. Again, I may have missed it in the article.


No idea who-went-where, but as of just 2-3 weeks ago, they mentioned being overstaffed by ~3000 FA's.


All the benefits of having a non-union workforce. (both UA and AA would dream to have this flexibility)

They can make a big claim but in reality many of the people in those positions are really in the same position as those at the other carriers. Maybe even worse...

How did DL have the ability to cut hours under CARES?
 
N312RC
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:25 pm

Flflyer83 wrote:
Oh, this is going to be interesting... I guess if you shuffle them in to positions they don’t like and they quit, you can still claim that you didn’t furlough any...


Or, you could have no job. In a pandemic as serious as 1918.

Keep your health insurance. Keep some income coming in the door.

I think most Americans would rather have a job right now guaranteeing some basic income. The US doesn’t have a generous social safety net like the rest of the world.

I’m sure the employees who can’t handle a 25 percent pay cut tied to 25 percent less working hours can make up that pay cut by getting a job somewhere else on their many days off, or tighten their belt. Sorry you blew all your money living above your means, these are extreme times.

It never ceases to amaze me how the people on airliners.net profess to love aviation... but hate everything to do with aviation.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:25 pm

This was the public press release that contains the memo:

https://news.delta.com/ed-bastian-memo- ... ployees-us
 
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NWAESC
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:29 pm

ordbosewr wrote:
How did DL have the ability to cut hours under CARES?


The CARES Act only mentions wages, not hours worked. Delta kept everyone's base rates at 100%, and just cut their hours. It's semantics/parsing the language, but...
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
codc10
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:33 pm

NWAESC wrote:
ordbosewr wrote:
How did DL have the ability to cut hours under CARES?


The CARES Act only mentions wages, not hours worked. Delta kept everyone's base rates at 100%, and just cut their hours. It's semantics/parsing the language, but...


And United was roundly blasted for doing the same thing to its (unionized) workforce, which it walked back.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:36 pm

codc10 wrote:
NWAESC wrote:
ordbosewr wrote:
How did DL have the ability to cut hours under CARES?


The CARES Act only mentions wages, not hours worked. Delta kept everyone's base rates at 100%, and just cut their hours. It's semantics/parsing the language, but...


And United was roundly blasted for doing the same thing to its (unionized) workforce, which it walked back.

The difference between discussing options and just implimenting. Delta also has a history of keeping promises that UA doesn't.

The costs must be cut, there are only a few options...

Lightsaber
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N312RC
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:38 pm

NWAESC wrote:
ordbosewr wrote:
How did DL have the ability to cut hours under CARES?


The CARES Act only mentions wages, not hours worked. Delta kept everyone's base rates at 100%, and just cut their hours. It's semantics/parsing the language, but...


As someone who’s been furloughed twice in my airline career, it’s nice to have a job... and healthcare insurance, which means god forbid I ever get Covid and end up on a ventilator, I won’t end up with some outrageous $750,000 hospital bill.
 
AY104
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:45 pm

Well said. Although it would not apply to everyone's situation.
Last edited by AY104 on Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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departedflights
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:45 pm

N312RC wrote:
Sorry you blew all your money living above your means, these are extreme times.


I know you weren't addressing me but I don't think that's fair of you to say.

When I started in this industry, I most certainly did not live above my means but I definitely lived paycheck to paycheck.

It was almost thirty years ago, the cost of living was a lot less than it is today but my starting rate at the ticket counter was $6.00/hr.

I was able to survive because I loved my job, but there was definitely no saving for a rainy day.... let alone a pandemic.

The people we are talking about are probably the people in their first few years of this their careers, too.

I may agree with a lot of the remainder of your post.... but I don't agree with that statement.
The opinions are expressed are my own and do not represent those of anyone else, including my coworkers or my employer.
 
LCDFlight
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:49 pm

departedflights wrote:
N312RC wrote:
Sorry you blew all your money living above your means, these are extreme times.


I know you weren't addressing me but I don't think that's fair of you to say.

When I started in this industry, I most certainly did not live above my means but I definitely lived paycheck to paycheck.

It was almost thirty years ago, the cost of living was a lot less than it is today but my starting rate at the ticket counter was $6.00/hr.

I was able to survive because I loved my job, but there was definitely no saving for a rainy day.... let alone a pandemic.

The people we are talking about are probably the people in their first few years of this their careers, too.


It is a solid thing for DL to do, to the extent that they can with their capital structure. Good community citizenship.

The pilots have a different bargain. They know the rewards are great in good times, and in bad times, they will be expected to bear a significant share of the burden to keep the company going.
 
IPFreely
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:51 pm

Flflyer83 wrote:
Oh, this is going to be interesting... I guess if you shuffle them in to positions they don’t like and they quit, you can still claim that you didn’t furlough any...


And no unemployment claims get filed by employees who quit.
 
departedflights
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:53 pm

LCDFlight wrote:
It is a solid thing for DL to do, to the extent that they can with their capital structure. Good community citizenship.


I'm not sure why you quoted me. I never said it wasn't. My issue, as I said, was the comment that these people don't have savings because they are all choosing to live above their means.
The opinions are expressed are my own and do not represent those of anyone else, including my coworkers or my employer.
 
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:07 pm

Flflyer83 wrote:
Oh, this is going to be interesting... I guess if you shuffle them in to positions they don’t like and they quit, you can still claim that you didn’t furlough any...



Why would many quit? It is unlikely that they can find a job that pays better with better benefits than what they will get at Delta even at 3/4 normal hours. Not a lot of companies with well paid employees are hiring at this time.

Of course, a few may find something that is better for them.

The other note is that this promise to not furlough any of these employees is only good to the end of the year. What happens after that is unknown. At some point Delta may be forced to significantly downsize so they are essentially meeting demand and not burning huge amounts of cash supporting a bloated infrastructure. If and when that occurs is yet unknown. Next spring is a likely time in my mind if things do not turn around by then.

Have a great day,
 
FSDan
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:17 pm

NWAESC wrote:
departedflights wrote:
I didn't notice if the article mentioned how many flight attendants were being displaced to catering and reservations positions.

I know some are but I was wondering if you had an exact number or percentage. Again, I may have missed it in the article.


No idea who-went-where, but as of just 2-3 weeks ago, they mentioned being overstaffed by ~3000 FA's.


As long as there is some sort of recall provision for displaced FAs to be able to come back to the FA role when conditions improve and hiring restarts, this seems like a better outcome for them than if they were furloughed.
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departedflights
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:22 pm

FSDan wrote:
NWAESC wrote:
departedflights wrote:
I didn't notice if the article mentioned how many flight attendants were being displaced to catering and reservations positions.

I know some are but I was wondering if you had an exact number or percentage. Again, I may have missed it in the article.


No idea who-went-where, but as of just 2-3 weeks ago, they mentioned being overstaffed by ~3000 FA's.


As long as there is some sort of recall provision for displaced FAs to be able to come back to the FA role when conditions improve and hiring restarts, this seems like a better outcome for them than if they were furloughed.


I agree. Again, I was just curious how many flight attendants it affected.
The opinions are expressed are my own and do not represent those of anyone else, including my coworkers or my employer.
 
panamair
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:28 pm

departedflights wrote:
I didn't notice if the article mentioned how many flight attendants were being displaced to catering and reservations positions.


For the FA group of over 25000, 4100 took the voluntary separation package, just under 4000 are taking the various voluntary leaves of absence (ranging from 4 to 12 months), about 1000 are in the one-month-on/one-month-off program, and about 1000 have temporarily switched to other departments.
 
kiowa
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:30 pm

Interesting commitment. All commitments disappear in a bankruptcy though.
 
panamair
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:32 pm

Flflyer83 wrote:

Oh, this is going to be interesting... I guess if you shuffle them in to positions they don’t like and they quit, you can still claim that you didn’t furlough any...


I don’t believe anyone was forced to switch departments; all these measures and options were voluntary.
 
maverick4002
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:35 pm

N312RC wrote:
Flflyer83 wrote:
Oh, this is going to be interesting... I guess if you shuffle them in to positions they don’t like and they quit, you can still claim that you didn’t furlough any...


Or, you could have no job. In a pandemic as serious as 1918.

Keep your health insurance. Keep some income coming in the door.

I think most Americans would rather have a job right now guaranteeing some basic income. The US doesn’t have a generous social safety net like the rest of the world.

I’m sure the employees who can’t handle a 25 percent pay cut tied to 25 percent less working hours can make up that pay cut by getting a job somewhere else on their many days off, or tighten their belt. Sorry you blew all your money living above your means, these are extreme times.

It never ceases to amaze me how the people on airliners.net profess to love aviation... but hate everything to do with aviation.


I agree with everything you were saying but then you had to ruin with that comment about people living above their means. I hope you are keeping that same energy as regards Delta and all these other corporations not living within their means as well.
 
AA94
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:37 pm

N312RC wrote:
I’m sure the employees who can’t handle a 25 percent pay cut tied to 25 percent less working hours can make up that pay cut by getting a job somewhere else on their many days off, or tighten their belt. Sorry you blew all your money living above your means, these are extreme times.


Yikes. Taking a 25% pay cut is substantial, especially if you live in a city with a high cost of living and/or are early in your career with less of a nest egg. I understand the company's rationale, but the idea that anyone who *isn't* able to shoulder that substantial a cut must be living above their means is absurd.
 
panamair
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:42 pm

kiowa wrote:
Interesting commitment. All commitments disappear in a bankruptcy though.


Never say never in the airline business, but with yesterday’s announcement of another $6.5B of financing (backed by SkyMiles), Delta should have just under $20B of liquidity by the end of Q3; they would be hard pressed to convince anyone they need to be in bankruptcy court with that cash balance.
 
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NWAESC
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:44 pm

For those that might not know, that 25% cut has been in effect for months now.
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
MIflyer12
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:46 pm

IPFreely wrote:
Flflyer83 wrote:
Oh, this is going to be interesting... I guess if you shuffle them in to positions they don’t like and they quit, you can still claim that you didn’t furlough any...


And no unemployment claims get filed by employees who quit.


You don't seem to be familiar with the phrase 'constructive discharge.' Significant pay cuts or changes in duties can mean such termination and qualification for UI benefits.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:49 pm

kiowa wrote:
Interesting commitment. All commitments disappear in a bankruptcy though.


Lots of things disappear in Chapter 11 - that's the point. Ch 11 does not give the firm power to change labor agreements (for those work groups that have them) - that is left to the judge.
 
jayunited
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 9:12 pm

lightsaber wrote:
codc10 wrote:
NWAESC wrote:

The CARES Act only mentions wages, not hours worked. Delta kept everyone's base rates at 100%, and just cut their hours. It's semantics/parsing the language, but...


And United was roundly blasted for doing the same thing to its (unionized) workforce, which it walked back.

The difference between discussing options and just implimenting. Delta also has a history of keeping promises that UA doesn't.

The costs must be cut, there are only a few options...

Lightsaber


UA does have a history of breaking promises, however the reality is no airline has faced a crisis of this magnitude. The difference between discussing options and implementing them is huge. If push comes to shove and things take a turn in the wrong direction I do wonder what does Delta value more, keeping a promise or the survival of the airline? Seeing how quickly Delta moved to reduced all nonunion employees hours including their FA's, that action lets me know Delta management will not hesitate to do whatever they deem necessary to keep the airline moving in the right direction.

It is great news there will be no involuntary furloughs at Delta, but people have to understand this is by no means over. There is nothing after October 1st stopping Delta management from making further changes either to their nonunion employees hourly pay (actually reducing hourly pay), further reduction in hours, reduction in benefits, among other things.

Having been in the union for 18 years, and now in management at UA I see both the benefits and the pitfalls of both sides.
 
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klm617
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 9:33 pm

panamair wrote:
Flflyer83 wrote:

Oh, this is going to be interesting... I guess if you shuffle them in to positions they don’t like and they quit, you can still claim that you didn’t furlough any...


I don’t believe anyone was forced to switch departments; all these measures and options were voluntary.


Yeah voluntary switch or we don't have a position for you at the moment.
the truth does matter, guys. too bad it's often quite subjective. the truth is beyond the mere facts and figures. it's beyond good and bad, right and wrong...
 
codc10
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 9:42 pm

What created all of these vacancies (catering, res, etc.) where these FAs are being temporarily assigned? Retirements and early-outs?
 
williaminsd
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 9:54 pm

NWAESC wrote:
Flflyer83 wrote:
Oh, this is going to be interesting... I guess if you shuffle them in to positions they don’t like and they quit, you can still claim that you didn’t furlough any...


Exactly.


We're in a global pandemic that has cut revenues 70% and more. Sorry if you have to slum it in catering for awhile to keep a paycheck coming and benefits in effect.
 
Pi7472000
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 10:40 pm

This is great news! Love to see junior people being saved. It is gross how junior people seem to have to sacrifice themselves for others just because they worked at the airline longer. Good job Delta putting people first!! Really impressed.
 
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NWAESC
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 11:18 pm

codc10 wrote:
What created all of these vacancies (catering, res, etc.) where these FAs are being temporarily assigned? Retirements and early-outs?

A little bit of everything, really. Increased workload in Res (plus early outs), insourcing some work, etc.
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
kiowa
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Tue Sep 15, 2020 11:46 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
kiowa wrote:
Interesting commitment. All commitments disappear in a bankruptcy though.


Lots of things disappear in Chapter 11 - that's the point. Ch 11 does not give the firm power to change labor agreements (for those work groups that have them) - that is left to the judge.


True, that was my point. A verbal commitment doesn’t mean much in bankruptcy when the judge controls everything. I hope several airlines don’t go through bankruptcy, but it is always a possibility. As someone above said, never say never.
 
jayunited
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:06 am

williaminsd wrote:
NWAESC wrote:
Flflyer83 wrote:
Oh, this is going to be interesting... I guess if you shuffle them in to positions they don’t like and they quit, you can still claim that you didn’t furlough any...


Exactly.


We're in a global pandemic that has cut revenues 70% and more. Sorry if you have to slum it in catering for awhile to keep a paycheck coming and benefits in effect.


Has Delta said what the FA's assigned to the kitchen will be doing? Will they be taking over food preparation replacing the cooks, will they handle food packaging and plating, or stocking the galley carts? I know in some states as long as you are on airport property you don't need a CDL so could FA's drive the catering trucks to the aircraft and provision the aircraft? Or will they be assigned cleaning duties? I have to admit it is and intriguing solution to place flight attendants in the flight kitchens to avoid layoffs.

Secondly there are not several articles that have been given insight into how Delta was able to avoid FA's furloughs and now several of those articles are now stating Delta FA's will begin working one month on and on month off. During the month an FA is off are they being paid? Also does seniority determine which FA's are awarded an actual flight line which has them flying for a month and/or which FA's are stuck on kitchen duty for the month?
 
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NWAESC
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:08 am

Flying 1 on/1 off is a separate program from going to catering/Res/etc. I’m not sure what specifically those that are going to the Flight Kitchens will be doing.
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
williaminsd
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:20 am

jayunited wrote:
williaminsd wrote:
NWAESC wrote:

Exactly.


We're in a global pandemic that has cut revenues 70% and more. Sorry if you have to slum it in catering for awhile to keep a paycheck coming and benefits in effect.


Has Delta said what the FA's assigned to the kitchen will be doing? Will they be taking over food preparation replacing the cooks, will they handle food packaging and plating, or stocking the galley carts? I know in some states as long as you are on airport property you don't need a CDL so could FA's drive the catering trucks to the aircraft and provision the aircraft? Or will they be assigned cleaning duties? I have to admit it is and intriguing solution to place flight attendants in the flight kitchens to avoid layoffs.

Secondly there are not several articles that have been given insight into how Delta was able to avoid FA's furloughs and now several of those articles are now stating Delta FA's will begin working one month on and on month off. During the month an FA is off are they being paid? Also does seniority determine which FA's are awarded an actual flight line which has them flying for a month and/or which FA's are stuck on kitchen duty for the month?


Couldn't tell ya, but they will be getting paid in a time when millions aren't...
 
Judge1310
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Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:24 am

williaminsd wrote:
jayunited wrote:
williaminsd wrote:

We're in a global pandemic that has cut revenues 70% and more. Sorry if you have to slum it in catering for awhile to keep a paycheck coming and benefits in effect.


Has Delta said what the FA's assigned to the kitchen will be doing? Will they be taking over food preparation replacing the cooks, will they handle food packaging and plating, or stocking the galley carts? I know in some states as long as you are on airport property you don't need a CDL so could FA's drive the catering trucks to the aircraft and provision the aircraft? Or will they be assigned cleaning duties? I have to admit it is and intriguing solution to place flight attendants in the flight kitchens to avoid layoffs.

Secondly there are not several articles that have been given insight into how Delta was able to avoid FA's furloughs and now several of those articles are now stating Delta FA's will begin working one month on and on month off. During the month an FA is off are they being paid? Also does seniority determine which FA's are awarded an actual flight line which has them flying for a month and/or which FA's are stuck on kitchen duty for the month?


Couldn't tell ya, but they will be getting paid in a time when millions aren't...


But the ones who would have been furloughed aren't the senior ones making decent salaries. The ones that would have been furloughed would be the ones making from below-poverty line wages (at the US level) to barely middle class. Unless some other external options exist for these individuals, potentially working in the kitchens or with provisioning/catering whilst donning smocks, gloves, and hairnets for $21k/yr does not come close to flying around the network and then laying over in 4-5 star hotels (in most cases). This sounds exactly like a case of "We can say we're not furloughing anyone as we're offering job displacements -- if the employee doesn't it take it then it isn't our fault. Sorry, not sorry."
 
dalmit
Posts: 13
Joined: Sat Aug 22, 2020 1:25 pm

Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:21 am

Does Delta do their own catering? Or meal preparations? I thought it was always contracted out. I found this article about ATL Catering. https://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/new ... rport.html so I'm not sure if you people are talking about other airports or if you're talking about stocking the meals on the planes. But I also thought the stocking was contracted out.
 
fly4ever78
Posts: 78
Joined: Tue Mar 07, 2017 10:17 pm

Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Wed Sep 16, 2020 3:18 am

LCDFlight wrote:
[

It is a solid thing for DL to do, to the extent that they can with their capital structure. Good community citizenship.

The pilots have a different bargain. They know the rewards are great in good times, and in bad times, they will be expected to bear a significant share of the burden to keep the company going.


The pilots could work for free and it would not impact the airline's ability to operate going forward... 26 million a day loss is not going to be mitigated by pilot wage cuts. It's always amazing to me that people,(including pilots), think they are going to save an airline with their pay cuts.
 
NW
Posts: 90
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2008 9:37 pm

Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Wed Sep 16, 2020 4:19 am

NWAESC wrote:
https://www.startribune.com/delta-won-t-furlough-flight-attendants-ground-workers/572417442/

From the article:

"More than 40,000 employees from across work groups took voluntarily, unpaid leaves of absence over the past several months and about 17,000 employees — or about 20% of its workforce — took the company's early retirement offer. Ground-based employees have had their work hours reduced by 25% as air travel continues to be significantly depressed."

Notably excepted from this announcement is DL's pilot corps, who still face a layoff of ~2000 pilots after 10/1...


Ground employees, only frontline ground employees for now. More than likely there will be merit furloughs outside of frontline. And I believe, last I heard, the pilot furloughs were down to about 1,700, but that's changing every day.
 
DLFA
Posts: 4
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2019 11:06 pm

Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Wed Sep 16, 2020 5:13 am

I can give some insight as to what FAs transitioned into catering are doing (it’s in effect for a few months now).

Basically they are assembling bags with a bottle of Dasani, two snacks, purell and napkins. And then they bring it to the AC.
 
Cactusjuba
Posts: 242
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2017 8:06 am

Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:09 am

Before mass furloughs or layoffs, the WARN Act requires employers to notify effected individuals of a potential job loss. Delta only sent 2,558 of these notices to pilots, no other employees. It's been apparent for weeks that come OCT 1, all non-contract Delta front-line workers would still be employed. Consider the timing of these two "no furlough through winter" announcements, weeks before a potential CARES II passage. Should that occur, brilliant labor relations PR stunt to end the pre-COVID union drives. Management wins employee loyalty today, but Uncle Sugar ends up paying the bill. Say CARES II doesn't happen, still a relatively small investment if it keeps out unions. Either a big win or a small win I'd say, great strategy by the BOD.

Just curious, DL received $5.4B solely for wages. They obviously didn't use it all with the reductions in hours+overtime+leaves, and the reduced earning of retirement & profit sharing. How much of that $5.4B is left to stretch beyond OCT 1st? The oft quoted $25M daily cash burn number includes labor costs, but conveniently leaves out CARES dollars that offset them. What's the full transparent cash burn?
 
User avatar
NWAESC
Topic Author
Posts: 1579
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2007 1:02 pm

Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:58 am

Cactusjuba wrote:
Before mass furloughs or layoffs, the WARN Act requires employers to notify effected individuals of a potential job loss. Delta only sent 2,558 of these notices to pilots, no other employees. It's been apparent for weeks that come OCT 1, all non-contract Delta front-line workers would still be employed. Consider the timing of these two "no furlough through winter" announcements, weeks before a potential CARES II passage. Should that occur, brilliant labor relations PR stunt to end the pre-COVID union drives. Management wins employee loyalty today, but Uncle Sugar ends up paying the bill. Say CARES II doesn't happen, still a relatively small investment if it keeps out unions. Either a big win or a small win I'd say, great strategy by the BOD.


I don't know how apparent it was that all non-contract employees would still be employed-and we still don't know about possible displacements-but your points about labor PR/strategy are dead on.
"Nothing ever happens here, " I said. "I just wait."
 
cvsirls
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 9:49 pm

Re: DL commits to no furloughs for F/As & ground employees

Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:13 am

jayunited wrote:
williaminsd wrote:
NWAESC wrote:

Exactly.


We're in a global pandemic that has cut revenues 70% and more. Sorry if you have to slum it in catering for awhile to keep a paycheck coming and benefits in effect.


Has Delta said what the FA's assigned to the kitchen will be doing? Will they be taking over food preparation replacing the cooks, will they handle food packaging and plating, or stocking the galley carts? I know in some states as long as you are on airport property you don't need a CDL so could FA's drive the catering trucks to the aircraft and provision the aircraft? Or will they be assigned cleaning duties? I have to admit it is and intriguing solution to place flight attendants in the flight kitchens to avoid layoffs.

Secondly there are not several articles that have been given insight into how Delta was able to avoid FA's furloughs and now several of those articles are now stating Delta FA's will begin working one month on and on month off. During the month an FA is off are they being paid? Also does seniority determine which FA's are awarded an actual flight line which has them flying for a month and/or which FA's are stuck on kitchen duty for the month?


Just a reminder, no one was forced into a different role. They were offered as alternatives to flying. They were released as a bid, and those that were interested in temporarily trying a different department were awarded that role based on seniority.

The one month on, and one month off worked the same way. You had the option to fly one on and one off, no one was forced. If you don't want to fly a one on and one off, then you don't bid that option. You keep to your normal schedule. These were options that people were asking for so they could go back to school and pursue other avenues if they so wished.

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