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Ishrion
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SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Wed Nov 25, 2020 10:09 pm

SpiceJet has applied for exemption authority and a foreign air carrier permit to conduct foreign scheduled and charter air transportation of persons, property, and mail between India and the United States.

Specifically, SpiceJet intends to start operating charters carrying PPE and repatriation passengers between Delhi and New York JFK

Notably, for its proposed U.S. operations, SpiceJet plans to operate Boeing 737-700/800BCFs and passenger Boeing 737-800s. SpiceJet may use other aircraft used for U.S. operations in the near future, including wet leases.

Image

Sounds like there will be stopovers on their DEL-JFK flight?

https://www.regulations.gov/document?D= ... -0240-0001
 
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TWA772LR
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Wed Nov 25, 2020 11:19 pm

Can a 738 make it DEL-KEF for a stop? Or at least SNN?
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ikolkyo
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Wed Nov 25, 2020 11:44 pm

No doubt there is gonna need to be a stopover, 15 hour flight.
 
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Vasu
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Wed Nov 25, 2020 11:54 pm

Surely it would be at least two stops each way...?
 
fromheretohere9
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 12:40 am

Very interesting news. I’d imagine it would stop three on both sections. Wouldn’t won’t to be a passenger on these. I’m gonna take a guess at the routing.
DEL-SAW-SNN-KEF-JFK Could make it empty SNN-JFK
JFK-KEF-LHR-SAW-DEL Again could make it empty from JFK to LHR
 
Antarius
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 12:59 am

This cannot possibly be efficient.
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Bricktop
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 1:28 am

Checks the calendar. Hmmm.

As a spotter, I would love for this to happen.
 
b747400erf
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 1:30 am

fromheretohere9 wrote:
Very interesting news. I’d imagine it would stop three on both sections. Wouldn’t won’t to be a passenger on these. I’m gonna take a guess at the routing.
DEL-SAW-SNN-KEF-JFK Could make it empty SNN-JFK
JFK-KEF-LHR-SAW-DEL Again could make it empty from JFK to LHR


Fly east to avoid strong headwinds. I say DEL-NRT-ANC-JFK
 
acavpics
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 1:38 am

So is this going to be an all business jet or something?
 
MIflyer12
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 2:18 am

Bricktop wrote:
Checks the calendar. Hmmm.

As a spotter, I would love for this to happen.


The April Fool's Day reference?

These are proposed as PPE freight and passenger repatriation flights so time-efficient non-stops really aren't required:

SpiceJet plans to start operating charters carrying COVID19 PPE cargo, and
repatriation passengers between Delhi, India and New York JFK International Airport as
soon as possible, thus contributing to the ongoing relief operations to combat the COVID 19
pandemic. It will further develop its cargo and passenger services once the Covid 19
epidemic subsides. SpiceJet may further expand the proposed services and use other
aircraft in the future.


From the DOT docket.
 
lijnden
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 3:21 am

Very ambitious plans... Did anybody tell them that a B777 or an A330 also has two engines? I remember that Braathens SAFE tried long distance with little planes as well. Actually the SAFE stood for South America Far East.
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dtw2hyd
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 3:29 am

SpiceJet is the unofficial(AI being official) state supported carrier of India and very sneaky. Very difficult to judge real reasons for its actions.

Could be to hold JFK slots, could be to capture bulk of vaccine transportation revenue. All I can say lot of others are going to lose.
All posts are just opinions.
 
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Antaras
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 3:42 am

I wonder if SpiceJet would actually have plan to formally acquire widebodies (not wet-leasing). Seems like it has gigantic plan to expand its network.
If you disagree with my statement, assume that it was just a joke :duck:
 
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trinidadeG
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 4:30 am

Ishrion wrote:
SpiceJet has applied for exemption authority and a foreign air carrier permit to conduct foreign scheduled and charter air transportation of persons, property, and mail between India and the United States.

Specifically, SpiceJet intends to start operating charters carrying PPE and repatriation passengers between Delhi and New York JFK

Notably, for its proposed U.S. operations, SpiceJet plans to operate Boeing 737-700/800BCFs and passenger Boeing 737-800s. SpiceJet may use other aircraft used for U.S. operations in the near future, including wet leases.

Image

Sounds like there will be stopovers on their DEL-JFK flight?

https://www.regulations.gov/document?D= ... -0240-0001


Looks like they were only listing some aircraft leased from notable lessors as a formality?? And since 737s and Q400s is all they've got, thats what they put in there, with the clause that they "may" use wet-leased planes to fly to the US.

Going by the number of HiFly aircraft operating charters out of India on behalf of SpiceJet currently, I wouldn't be surprised if their proposed India-US flights are operated by an A340 'preighter' or an A330neo.
 
toltommy
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 4:50 am

MIflyer12 wrote:
These are proposed as PPE freight and passenger repatriation flights so time-efficient non-stops really aren't required:

SpiceJet plans to start operating charters carrying COVID19 PPE cargo, and
repatriation passengers between Delhi, India and New York JFK International Airport as
soon as possible, thus contributing to the ongoing relief operations to combat the COVID 19
pandemic. It will further develop its cargo and passenger services once the Covid 19
epidemic subsides. SpiceJet may further expand the proposed services and use other
aircraft in the future.


From the DOT docket.


Thank you for taking the time to read the actual filing for everyone. Reading is fundamental.

Makes more sense now.
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avier
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 4:53 am

trinidadeG wrote:

Looks like they were only listing some aircraft leased from notable lessors as a formality?? And since 737s and Q400s is all they've got, thats what they put in there, with the clause that they "may" use wet-leased planes to fly to the US.

Going by the number of HiFly aircraft operating charters out of India on behalf of SpiceJet currently, I wouldn't be surprised if their proposed India-US flights are operated by an A340 'preighter' or an A330neo.

That's what it seems like mostly. Probably the US regulator requires an airline to specify for formality what aircraft/reg the airline will utilise from it's own fleet. In this case the wet leased aircrafts wouldn't be in the books of SG, so they just mention these cargo/pax aircraft from their fleet while applying for permission, but would eventually operate HiFly wet leased WB's.
 
Blerg
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 4:58 am

I know Air India had repatriation flights but I thought all those who needed to be repratriated were back home. Who are they carrying now?

Also, I am sure they are going to lease a widebody jet for this purpose, lots of extra capacity sitting around and I am sure leasing companies or airlines would be more than willing to give them a good rate.
 
NotDengXiaoping
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 5:09 am

Sounds like a potential route to transport vaccines and other COVID-related materials from India to the US. India is likely to be the main production center for a number of COVID vaccines-cheaper production costs coupled with large existing pharma production centers.
 
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Antaras
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 5:18 am

b747400erf wrote:
I say DEL-NRT-ANC-JFK

Can those 738F make each sector of DEL-NRT-ANC-JFK. All four of them seem too long for the 738F range (remember those are the 738F which have the range of just 3690km, significantly shorter than the pax 738)
Image
http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=del-nrt-an ... HR-SAW-DEL
If you disagree with my statement, assume that it was just a joke :duck:
 
jreeves96
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 6:10 am

Would it not be cheaper to charter?

Just throwing Atlas Air out there. JFK-ANC-ICN-DEL-ANC-JFK.
Atlas could very well carry ICN bound freight, ferry to DEL.
 
DIJKKIJK
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 8:25 am

According to some youtubers, the three ex-9W 77W stored at DEL have been getting some engine runs and taxi tests. AI engineering is working to get them airborne, apparently. Is it 9W planning on re-starting or is SpiceJet planning on leasing them??
Never argue with idiots. They will bring you down to their level, and beat you with experience.
 
avier
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 8:30 am

DIJKKIJK wrote:
According to some youtubers, the three ex-9W 77W stored at DEL have been getting some engine runs and taxi tests. AI engineering is working to get them airborne, apparently. Is it 9W planning on re-starting or is SpiceJet planning on leasing them??

Neither. The new owners of 9W are keeping the 77W active & airworthy to have them sold and be able to fly them off.

SG would mostly wet-lease WB from foreign charter carriers- mostly HiFly.

9W doesn't have any active staff that would be able to operate those said WB's for charter/wet leases.
 
b747400erf
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 1:50 pm

Antaras wrote:
b747400erf wrote:
I say DEL-NRT-ANC-JFK

Can those 738F make each sector of DEL-NRT-ANC-JFK. All four of them seem too long for the 738F range (remember those are the 738F which have the range of just 3690km, significantly shorter than the pax 738)
Image
http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=del-nrt-an ... HR-SAW-DEL

Shorter range because of more payload. But the cargo is light and the benefit of 100kt average tailwind helps. It could make a stop in HKG before NRT and ANC
 
ZazuPIT
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 3:17 pm

trinidadeG wrote:
Ishrion wrote:

Looks like they were only listing some aircraft leased from notable lessors as a formality?? And since 737s and Q400s is all they've got, thats what they put in there, with the clause that they "may" use wet-leased planes to fly to the US.

Going by the number of HiFly aircraft operating charters out of India on behalf of SpiceJet currently, I wouldn't be surprised if their proposed India-US flights are operated by an A340 'preighter' or an A330neo.


They were supposed to start LHR with the 339 from Hi-Fly. Wonder why they aren't going the leasing route on this? I cannot imagine anyone wanting to fly on a 747 that far/long with multiple stops.
 
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flyingclrs727
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 3:33 pm

TWA772LR wrote:
Can a 738 make it DEL-KEF for a stop? Or at least SNN?


How about OSL? It's about equally distant from both JFK and DEL but is about 1,000 miles closer to DEL than KEF.
 
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trinidadeG
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 3:33 pm

ZazuPIT wrote:
trinidadeG wrote:
Ishrion wrote:

Looks like they were only listing some aircraft leased from notable lessors as a formality?? And since 737s and Q400s is all they've got, thats what they put in there, with the clause that they "may" use wet-leased planes to fly to the US.

Going by the number of HiFly aircraft operating charters out of India on behalf of SpiceJet currently, I wouldn't be surprised if their proposed India-US flights are operated by an A340 'preighter' or an A330neo.


They were supposed to start LHR with the 339 from Hi-Fly. Wonder why they aren't going the leasing route on this? I cannot imagine anyone wanting to fly on a 747 that far/long with multiple stops.


They have deferred their plans because of the second lockdown in the UK.

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/bus ... 327086.cms


DIJKKIJK wrote:
According to some youtubers, the three ex-9W 77W stored at DEL have been getting some engine runs and taxi tests. AI engineering is working to get them airborne, apparently. Is it 9W planning on re-starting or is SpiceJet planning on leasing them??

I had posted about it on the Jet Airways thread.

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1420603&start=1900#p22487319

one B777 was seen being towed to an isolation bay for engine runs. This airframe VT-JEH - 35166 - Stored as 2-TJEH at DEL doesn't belong to Jet Airways. Most likely being prepared to fly out by its owners.
The other two are 9W property, I don't expect them to be of any use until the courts approve of the new owners' plans.
 
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Chasensfo
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 3:37 pm

2020 just keeps getting weirder, great news for NYC spotters. Who would have ever guessed this?
 
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aemoreira1981
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 4:00 pm

I'm having trouble figuring out even a good 2-stopover routing for this without a restriction, on the first segment (presuming KEF would be the second stopover). In segments under 2500 nmi, I can think so far of: DEL-VOG-KEF-JFK or DEL-AER-KEF-JFK. SG would likely need to have 6 pilots on board.

Set A flies to the Russian fueling point.
Set B flies to KEF.
Sets A and B get off and go to a hotel in KEF.
Set C flies to JFK, taking a 10-hour layover in NYC.
Set C returns to KEF. Sets A and B get back on. (Set C is deadheading at this point.)
Set B flies to the Russian fueling point.
Set A brings the plane back home.
 
VSMUT
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 9:26 pm

flyingclrs727 wrote:
TWA772LR wrote:
Can a 738 make it DEL-KEF for a stop? Or at least SNN?


How about OSL? It's about equally distant from both JFK and DEL but is about 1,000 miles closer to DEL than KEF.


Norwegian flew the 737-800 from Oslo to Dubai, that was on the edge of what the type could do. They will need to stop for fuel somewhere between Europe and India.

Moscow would actually be pretty close to an ideal stopover point between Keflavik and Delhi. It isn't far south of the great circle line between Delhi and Keflavik. In still air it is roughly 6 hours between Delhi and Moscow, another 5 hours to Keflavik and 5 hours to New York.
 
AirbusOnly
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 10:05 pm

For some time now, spiceJet has been using the A 340 9H-SOL chartered by HiFly for various destinations that can also be reached with a 737, but also for non-stop flights from Delhi to Chicago, e.g. Sometimes with a stopover in Istanbul or Frankfurt
 
L0VE2FLY
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Thu Nov 26, 2020 10:42 pm

b747400erf wrote:
fromheretohere9 wrote:
Very interesting news. I’d imagine it would stop three on both sections. Wouldn’t won’t to be a passenger on these. I’m gonna take a guess at the routing.
DEL-SAW-SNN-KEF-JFK Could make it empty SNN-JFK
JFK-KEF-LHR-SAW-DEL Again could make it empty from JFK to LHR


Fly east to avoid strong headwinds. I say DEL-NRT-ANC-JFK


That'd definitely help them avoid strong headwinds but would also make the flight 40+% longer.
 
b747400erf
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Fri Nov 27, 2020 12:16 am

L0VE2FLY wrote:
b747400erf wrote:
fromheretohere9 wrote:
Very interesting news. I’d imagine it would stop three on both sections. Wouldn’t won’t to be a passenger on these. I’m gonna take a guess at the routing.
DEL-SAW-SNN-KEF-JFK Could make it empty SNN-JFK
JFK-KEF-LHR-SAW-DEL Again could make it empty from JFK to LHR


Fly east to avoid strong headwinds. I say DEL-NRT-ANC-JFK


That'd definitely help them avoid strong headwinds but would also make the flight 40+% longer.


Huh???
DEL-NRT-ANC-JFK is 3 6 hr legs
Traveling westbound is 3 6 hour legs if you plan Moscow then Keflavik and the last KEF-JFK requires more fuel due to etops rules
 
TC957
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Fri Nov 27, 2020 5:23 pm

True - via NRT & ANC is indeed further in miles but winds could make the difference up as opposed to via IST & KEF.
 
YYZatcboy
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Fri Nov 27, 2020 5:56 pm

b747400erf wrote:
L0VE2FLY wrote:
b747400erf wrote:

Fly east to avoid strong headwinds. I say DEL-NRT-ANC-JFK


That'd definitely help them avoid strong headwinds but would also make the flight 40+% longer.


Huh???
DEL-NRT-ANC-JFK is 3 6 hr legs
Traveling westbound is 3 6 hour legs if you plan Moscow then Keflavik and the last KEF-JFK requires more fuel due to etops rules


KEF-JFK doesn't necessarily require ETOPS, and on most days wouldn't (presuming BGBW can be used as an adequate airport). SNN-YYT/YQX could also be a viable option westbound if the jetstream is north.
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L0VE2FLY
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Fri Nov 27, 2020 10:38 pm

b747400erf wrote:
L0VE2FLY wrote:
b747400erf wrote:

Fly east to avoid strong headwinds. I say DEL-NRT-ANC-JFK


That'd definitely help them avoid strong headwinds but would also make the flight 40+% longer.


Huh???
DEL-NRT-ANC-JFK is 3 6 hr legs
Traveling westbound is 3 6 hour legs if you plan Moscow then Keflavik and the last KEF-JFK requires more fuel due to etops rules


The difference is indeed over 40% as I said earlier...

http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=DEL-JFK,DE ... VO-KEF-JFK
 
eamondzhang
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Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Fri Nov 27, 2020 11:53 pm

b747400erf wrote:
fromheretohere9 wrote:
Very interesting news. I’d imagine it would stop three on both sections. Wouldn’t won’t to be a passenger on these. I’m gonna take a guess at the routing.
DEL-SAW-SNN-KEF-JFK Could make it empty SNN-JFK
JFK-KEF-LHR-SAW-DEL Again could make it empty from JFK to LHR


Fly east to avoid strong headwinds. I say DEL-NRT-ANC-JFK

From DEL 738 can barely make it to PVG, let alone NRT.

And no forget about NRT-ANC with a meaningful payload.

And that routing can only be used during winter - wind's only strong during that time.

Michael
 
eamondzhang
Posts: 1885
Joined: Thu Sep 23, 2010 8:23 am

Re: SpiceJet Applies For U.S. Flights - DEL-JFK With 737s

Sat Nov 28, 2020 12:02 am

b747400erf wrote:
L0VE2FLY wrote:
b747400erf wrote:

Fly east to avoid strong headwinds. I say DEL-NRT-ANC-JFK


That'd definitely help them avoid strong headwinds but would also make the flight 40+% longer.


Huh???
DEL-NRT-ANC-JFK is 3 6 hr legs
Traveling westbound is 3 6 hour legs if you plan Moscow then Keflavik and the last KEF-JFK requires more fuel due to etops rules

DEL-NRT is more like 7-7.5h leg given 737 flies slower than 787 by quite a margin. And again it's winter.

I might have got it wrong with length of NRT-ANC though - but I don't think 737 can make ANC-JFK without significant penalties.

Michael

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