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lightsaber
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 06, 2020 4:59 pm

wjcandee wrote:
One other aspect of Operation Warp Speed was to fast-track everything that would need to be produced to actually store and administer the shots.

You need billions of syringes.
You need hundreds of millions of glass vials -- and Corning apparently makes a special glass for certain types of vials.
You need tops and stoppers for the glass vials.
You need billions of alcohol wipes.

All of these are end products that require raw materials and partially-finished products to be transported to places that bring them together. All that has been going on, with zero media attention, for months.

You need a plan to get this stuff where it needs to be so there's no slowdown because somebody forgot to think of this stuff and/or nobody was manufacturing enough of it.

Operation Warp Speed was involved in all of this, and the US Gov't spent $$ to order a ton of this stuff so that it was worth it to manufacturers to make the investments in equipment and raw materials to blast them out quickly.

Agreed. One part of warp speed is to repurpose dry ice. The defense industry uses tons of it daily. It will (mostly) be repurposed.

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ThePointblank
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 06, 2020 8:17 pm

lightsaber wrote:
Agreed. One part of warp speed is to repurpose dry ice. The defense industry uses tons of it daily. It will (mostly) be repurposed.

Lightsaber

There's already a concern about a shortage of dry ice due to a shortage of liquid CO2, which is a byproduct of the production of ethanol and reformer by-product of CO2 raw gas. Indeed, in certain market areas, such as New England where there is a concentration of pharmaceutical and other medical industries, there's already a shortage.

I know for my company, we've just installed a dry ice machine earlier this year just prior to the pandemic (which was fortunate timing), which should cover the bulk of our pelletized dry ice needs moving forward. Just as well, as our normal distributor of dry ice sent us a warning about possible shortages once the vaccine starts rolling out.
 
gdavis003
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Fri Dec 11, 2020 2:17 am

Interesting NYT article regarding vaccine transport by airlines. Nothing terribly new from the article, in comparing it with other ones mentioned, except the discussion of American's new cold storage facility at PHL and a small bit of information on the DL end. https://www.nytimes.com/2020/12/10/busi ... ticleShare
 
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cjg225
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Fri Dec 11, 2020 12:57 pm

FlyingHonu001 wrote:
You cannot carry/move around unapproved stuff like that...if so, any airline doing so would actually be illegal drugrunners

What the hell are you talking about?

There are rules by which pharma companies need to abide, but there is nothing inherently illegal about transporting pharmaceutical product that is not yet approved for commercial use. How do you think clinical trial doses of these drugs got where they were supposed to go?
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TheSonntag
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Fri Dec 11, 2020 1:10 pm

For those of you speaking German, this episode of Mittendrin (a series showing behind the scenes work at Frankfurt airport) is showing the medical logistics center of FRA:

https://www.hr-fernsehen.de/sendungen-a ... 02932.html
 
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cjg225
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Fri Dec 11, 2020 1:40 pm

wjcandee wrote:
One other aspect of Operation Warp Speed was to fast-track everything that would need to be produced to actually store and administer the shots.

You need billions of syringes.
You need hundreds of millions of glass vials -- and Corning apparently makes a special glass for certain types of vials.
You need tops and stoppers for the glass vials.
You need billions of alcohol wipes.

All of these are end products that require raw materials and partially-finished products to be transported to places that bring them together. All that has been going on, with zero media attention, for months.

You need a plan to get this stuff where it needs to be so there's no slowdown because somebody forgot to think of this stuff and/or nobody was manufacturing enough of it.

Operation Warp Speed was involved in all of this, and the US Gov't spent $$ to order a ton of this stuff so that it was worth it to manufacturers to make the investments in equipment and raw materials to blast them out quickly.

Not to mention that COVID19 vaccines are not the only pharmaceuticals being produced right now.

This has been a huge concern for many companies for a long time, mine included. We're one of the largest vaccine manufacturers in the world. We're in the COVID19 vaccine race, but we're not as far as Pfizer. It has been... challenging... to ensure supply of packaging materials for quite some time.

The other thing to keep in mind is that there are strict quality requirements on all of these things. It is very easy to see huge amounts of material quarantined because of things like quality defects pending investigations. Pharma companies have extremely strict requirements, and seemingly little things can lead to the trashing of tons of supply if there's not a clear way to justify use of the material. Point being, it's not just producing "enough," it's about producing "enough that passes quality checks," which can be much more than is otherwise needed.
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yzfElite
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Fri Dec 11, 2020 2:43 pm

HPRamper wrote:
I was advised today that FX and UPS are preferred carriers and should be seeing shipments within the next week or so.


In the national news here in Canada earlier this week after the Pfizer vaccine was approved, it was announced the UPS was delivering the first doses from a factory/warehouse in Belgium. Apparently the vaccines were planned to travel Belgium-Germany-US (Memphis)-14 sites in Canada over the course of a ~36 hour period. I don't have a link, but it was a reputable newscast (CBC).
 
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 13, 2020 3:14 pm

 
MIflyer12
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 13, 2020 3:41 pm

Anybody have a theory why UPS is using LAN and not GRR? (Not AZO I understand - runway length.)
 
Boof02671
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 13, 2020 4:10 pm

First flight is airborne from Lansing to Memphis on FedEx
 
smokeybandit
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 13, 2020 4:18 pm

I'm surprised how publicized these flights are.
 
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 13, 2020 4:36 pm

 
ATCJesus
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 13, 2020 4:42 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
Anybody have a theory why UPS is using LAN and not GRR? (Not AZO I understand - runway length.)


Just speculation, but maybe for contingency/diversification reasons. If GRR goes down for whatever reason, LAN is equiped and capable.
 
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cjg225
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 13, 2020 4:43 pm

smokeybandit wrote:
I'm surprised how publicized these flights are.

In a sense, it may not be that bad. With so many eyes on them, it'll be hard to do something to them. Plus, the bigger threat is to the overland portion, which is why all of them will travel with armed security personnel in convoy.
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gdavis003
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 13, 2020 5:11 pm

ATCJesus wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
Anybody have a theory why UPS is using LAN and not GRR? (Not AZO I understand - runway length.)


Just speculation, but maybe for contingency/diversification reasons. If GRR goes down for whatever reason, LAN is equiped and capable.


I thought the answer would be more complex like this, but I actually think it’s pretty simple. FedEx operates scheduled flights out of GRR only, UPS operates scheduled flights out of LAN only. Choosing the airport where your own infrastructure is located
 
nine4nine
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 13, 2020 5:12 pm

Will these Vaccine delivery flights be given the highest priority for taxi, takeoff and landing since timing is crucial on the lifespan of the load?
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Boof02671
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 13, 2020 5:19 pm

nine4nine wrote:
Will these Vaccine delivery flights be given the highest priority for taxi, takeoff and landing since timing is crucial on the lifespan of the load?

Yes FAA has already stated so.

https://www.freightwaves.com/news/faa-g ... ccines/amp
 
smartplane
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 13, 2020 7:59 pm

cjg225 wrote:
The other thing to keep in mind is that there are strict quality requirements on all of these things. It is very easy to see huge amounts of material quarantined because of things like quality defects pending investigations. Pharma companies have extremely strict requirements, and seemingly little things can lead to the trashing of tons of supply if there's not a clear way to justify use of the material. Point being, it's not just producing "enough," it's about producing "enough that passes quality checks," which can be much more than is otherwise needed.

Isn't it a supply condition each Government must indemnify manufacturers right through to those who administer the vaccine, including the supply chain, because commercial liability insurers couldn't / wouldn't? All those involved have quality / ethical standards, but ultimately it's Governments (you and I) shouldering the financial and personal risks.
 
B777LRF
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 13, 2020 9:47 pm

andrew1996 wrote:
Are we expecting most vaccine to be transported by commercial airlines in belly capacity or will it be dominated by dedicated freighter airlines? Are couriers like UPS, Fedex better equip to handle vaccines in general etc?


The vast majority will be carried by cargo carriers and integrators. Integrators does have an advantage in that their businessmodel is door-to-door, whereas cargo airlines are usually airport-to-airport, albeit some of them may have an "express" door-to-door product.

So let's not get carried away with a few passenger airlines hauling a bit of vaccines; a dry ice limit of 7.500 kg is stupidly low compared to the fact there's no maximum on the main-deck of cargo carriers.

I'll wager the main reason passenger carriers are seeing a bit of vaccine transportation business these days is because it's peak season for the integrators and cargo carriers, who will have no spare capacity for this. But once we're into 2021, the passenger airlines without dedicated freighters will be outgunned by integrators and cargo carriers. Which is just the normal natural order of things.

If there's one company who stand to make a fortune out of this it's Envirotainer, who are and will be supplying the special ULDs to passenger and cargo carriers alike. RAP t2's and RKN t2's, to be exact, at least for the Biontech vaccine with its -70C requirement.

For the uninitiated: t2's are using a passive cooling agent, e.g dry ice, whereas e1's and e2's have battery powered refrigeration.

https://www.envirotainer.com
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andrew1996
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 13, 2020 10:39 pm

B777LRF wrote:
andrew1996 wrote:
Are we expecting most vaccine to be transported by commercial airlines in belly capacity or will it be dominated by dedicated freighter airlines? Are couriers like UPS, Fedex better equip to handle vaccines in general etc?


The vast majority will be carried by cargo carriers and integrators. Integrators does have an advantage in that their businessmodel is door-to-door, whereas cargo airlines are usually airport-to-airport, albeit some of them may have an "express" door-to-door product.

So let's not get carried away with a few passenger airlines hauling a bit of vaccines; a dry ice limit of 7.500 kg is stupidly low compared to the fact there's no maximum on the main-deck of cargo carriers.

I'll wager the main reason passenger carriers are seeing a bit of vaccine transportation business these days is because it's peak season for the integrators and cargo carriers, who will have no spare capacity for this. But once we're into 2021, the passenger airlines without dedicated freighters will be outgunned by integrators and cargo carriers. Which is just the normal natural order of things.

If there's one company who stand to make a fortune out of this it's Envirotainer, who are and will be supplying the special ULDs to passenger and cargo carriers alike. RAP t2's and RKN t2's, to be exact, at least for the Biontech vaccine with its -70C requirement.

For the uninitiated: t2's are using a passive cooling agent, e.g dry ice, whereas e1's and e2's have battery powered refrigeration.

https://www.envirotainer.com


I see thanks! Yes, I did read somewhere after I posted that the CO2 from too much dry ice can be an issue when space is constrained. I think integrators are also using commercial airlines though right? There was a vaccine video on YOutube filing Lufthansa cargo and part of the film in filming how they generally unload/load cargo I saw containers with DHL's logo. I also saw Sam Chui's recent video on DXB's phama storage for EK Sky Crago and there were DHL stickers on the pallet (not for the COVID vaccine but in general).

Hmm it seems like it may be most efficient if passenger airlines started taking some of the everyday cargo and mail that usually go with UPS/Fedex/DHL etc to make room for vaccine on the interogator's plane but not sure about how that impacts the profit. I wonder if UPS/Fedex can/will still maintain their 1-3 days world wide delivery standards
 
32andBelow
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 13, 2020 10:51 pm

B777LRF wrote:
andrew1996 wrote:
Are we expecting most vaccine to be transported by commercial airlines in belly capacity or will it be dominated by dedicated freighter airlines? Are couriers like UPS, Fedex better equip to handle vaccines in general etc?


The vast majority will be carried by cargo carriers and integrators. Integrators does have an advantage in that their businessmodel is door-to-door, whereas cargo airlines are usually airport-to-airport, albeit some of them may have an "express" door-to-door product.

So let's not get carried away with a few passenger airlines hauling a bit of vaccines; a dry ice limit of 7.500 kg is stupidly low compared to the fact there's no maximum on the main-deck of cargo carriers.

I'll wager the main reason passenger carriers are seeing a bit of vaccine transportation business these days is because it's peak season for the integrators and cargo carriers, who will have no spare capacity for this. But once we're into 2021, the passenger airlines without dedicated freighters will be outgunned by integrators and cargo carriers. Which is just the normal natural order of things.

If there's one company who stand to make a fortune out of this it's Envirotainer, who are and will be supplying the special ULDs to passenger and cargo carriers alike. RAP t2's and RKN t2's, to be exact, at least for the Biontech vaccine with its -70C requirement.

For the uninitiated: t2's are using a passive cooling agent, e.g dry ice, whereas e1's and e2's have battery powered refrigeration.

https://www.envirotainer.com

If they have some ready for delivery. Any bought now would probably come too late to matter. Dry ice is cheap and simple.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Sun Dec 13, 2020 11:02 pm

gdavis003 wrote:
ATCJesus wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
Anybody have a theory why UPS is using LAN and not GRR? (Not AZO I understand - runway length.)


Just speculation, but maybe for contingency/diversification reasons. If GRR goes down for whatever reason, LAN is equiped and capable.


I thought the answer would be more complex like this, but I actually think it’s pretty simple. FedEx operates scheduled flights out of GRR only, UPS operates scheduled flights out of LAN only. Choosing the airport where your own infrastructure is located


Thanks for that reply. It just wouldn't have occurred to me that FedEx or UPS would not operate out of both airports.
 
B777LRF
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Mon Dec 14, 2020 12:49 am

andrew1996 wrote:
I think integrators are also using commercial airlines though right?


Yes, it happens on a daily basis. One example is freight which, for whatever reason, failed to connect to the integrators flight gets transported on a passenger airline, which usually departs later in the morning.

andrew1996 wrote:
Hmm it seems like it may be most efficient if passenger airlines started taking some of the everyday cargo and mail that usually go with UPS/Fedex/DHL etc to make room for vaccine on the interogator's plane but not sure about how that impacts the profit. I wonder if UPS/Fedex can/will still maintain their 1-3 days world wide delivery standards


No that wouldn't be efficient at all, mainly because a) integrators mainly carry their own express cargo not general cargo and mail, and b) passenger airlines don't fly at the times which suits the integrators, and c) don't always service the same city pairs. Passenger airlines will have a role to play, but it'll be minor compared to cargo carriers and integrators. DHL, which is the 800lbs gorilla in the room when it comes to international express freight, and it's American cousins will not jeopardise their normal schedule which is, in fact, the reason why they're so attractive to the express movement of vaccine between continents. They may be perfectly willing to charter out excess capacity in the weekends, when integrator business is low, but they will first and foremost protect their own network integrity.
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cjg225
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Mon Dec 14, 2020 1:44 am

smartplane wrote:
Isn't it a supply condition each Government must indemnify manufacturers right through to those who administer the vaccine, including the supply chain, because commercial liability insurers couldn't / wouldn't? All those involved have quality / ethical standards, but ultimately it's Governments (you and I) shouldering the financial and personal risks.

You mean for the COVID19 vaccines or vaccines in general?
B777LRF wrote:
If there's one company who stand to make a fortune out of this it's Envirotainer, who are and will be supplying the special ULDs to passenger and cargo carriers alike. RAP t2's and RKN t2's, to be exact, at least for the Biontech vaccine with its -70C requirement.

For the uninitiated: t2's are using a passive cooling agent, e.g dry ice, whereas e1's and e2's have battery powered refrigeration.

https://www.envirotainer.com

t2s (either the RKN or RAP model) can't maintain -70C. They can reliably maintain -20C, but not really colder than that.

What it conceivably can do is be used as second-level protection. Internal overpack being held at -70C with dry ice, but then the t2 unit holding at -20C around that internal overpack to extend the lifespan of the internal overpack.

Moderna's vaccine, though, could be well-served by t2 units.
B777LRF wrote:
No that wouldn't be efficient at all, mainly because a) integrators mainly carry their own express cargo not general cargo and mail, and b) passenger airlines don't fly at the times which suits the integrators, and c) don't always service the same city pairs. Passenger airlines will have a role to play, but it'll be minor compared to cargo carriers and integrators. DHL, which is the 800lbs gorilla in the room when it comes to international express freight, and it's American cousins will not jeopardise their normal schedule which is, in fact, the reason why they're so attractive to the express movement of vaccine between continents. They may be perfectly willing to charter out excess capacity in the weekends, when integrator business is low, but they will first and foremost protect their own network integrity.

Where passenger flights may be useful is Next Flight Out needs.
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VCVSpotter
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Mon Dec 14, 2020 5:15 am

FedEx A300-600F N675FE flew MEM-LAX as FX990 with the first covid vaccines bound for LA. Touched down just under 30 minutes ago. Glad to see the covid vaccine distribution ops in full force.

https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/n675fe
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... edit#gid=0

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RDUDDJI
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Mon Dec 14, 2020 1:47 pm

andrew1996 wrote:
B777LRF wrote:
andrew1996 wrote:
Are we expecting most vaccine to be transported by commercial airlines in belly capacity or will it be dominated by dedicated freighter airlines? Are couriers like UPS, Fedex better equip to handle vaccines in general etc?


The vast majority will be carried by cargo carriers and integrators. Integrators does have an advantage in that their businessmodel is door-to-door, whereas cargo airlines are usually airport-to-airport, albeit some of them may have an "express" door-to-door product.

So let's not get carried away with a few passenger airlines hauling a bit of vaccines; a dry ice limit of 7.500 kg is stupidly low compared to the fact there's no maximum on the main-deck of cargo carriers.

I'll wager the main reason passenger carriers are seeing a bit of vaccine transportation business these days is because it's peak season for the integrators and cargo carriers, who will have no spare capacity for this. But once we're into 2021, the passenger airlines without dedicated freighters will be outgunned by integrators and cargo carriers. Which is just the normal natural order of things.

If there's one company who stand to make a fortune out of this it's Envirotainer, who are and will be supplying the special ULDs to passenger and cargo carriers alike. RAP t2's and RKN t2's, to be exact, at least for the Biontech vaccine with its -70C requirement.

For the uninitiated: t2's are using a passive cooling agent, e.g dry ice, whereas e1's and e2's have battery powered refrigeration.

https://www.envirotainer.com


I see thanks! Yes, I did read somewhere after I posted that the CO2 from too much dry ice can be an issue when space is constrained. I think integrators are also using commercial airlines though right? There was a vaccine video on YOutube filing Lufthansa cargo and part of the film in filming how they generally unload/load cargo I saw containers with DHL's logo. I also saw Sam Chui's recent video on DXB's phama storage for EK Sky Crago and there were DHL stickers on the pallet (not for the COVID vaccine but in general).

Hmm it seems like it may be most efficient if passenger airlines started taking some of the everyday cargo and mail that usually go with UPS/Fedex/DHL etc to make room for vaccine on the interogator's plane but not sure about how that impacts the profit. I wonder if UPS/Fedex can/will still maintain their 1-3 days world wide delivery standards


I heard the other day on NPR (US Nat'l Public Radio), that UPS/FDX worked together on a delivery plan to most efficiently use resources for Covid19 vax distribution. UPS is taking the Eastern US and FDX the West. I found that pretty interesting.
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Boof02671
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Mon Dec 14, 2020 6:07 pm

AA flies it’s first shipments of vaccine ORD-MIA

https://news.aa.com/news/news-details/2 ... yUF4EeTRfk
 
Western727
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Mon Dec 14, 2020 7:28 pm

Boof02671 wrote:
AA flies it’s first shipments of vaccine ORD-MIA

https://news.aa.com/news/news-details/2 ... yUF4EeTRfk


Thanks for this. For anyone else who clicks this, be sure to click the video within, which I personally almost overlooked, thinking it was just a picture.
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iamlucky13
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Tue Dec 15, 2020 1:35 am

Boof02671 wrote:
nine4nine wrote:
Will these Vaccine delivery flights be given the highest priority for taxi, takeoff and landing since timing is crucial on the lifespan of the load?

Yes FAA has already stated so.

https://www.freightwaves.com/news/faa-g ... ccines/amp


I'm sure those involved in planning the shipping appreciate that convenience, and at current traffic levels it certainly should not be a significant issue for regular flights, but it does not appear to be necessary from a standpoint of stability of the vaccine.

Pfizer reported their vaccine has a shelf life of 6 months at the indicated normal storage temperature (-80 to -60 Celsius). The shipping container will keep it at that temperature for 10 days, and can be refilled with dry ice if needed. It can also be stored at conventional freezer temperatures (-8 to -2 Celsius) for up to 5 days before use.

I guess the most likely benefit is if it prevents a flight from getting diverted, it would help people receive the vaccine earlier, which in turn could mean some lives saved.
 
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cjg225
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Tue Dec 15, 2020 1:53 am

iamlucky13 wrote:
Pfizer reported their vaccine has a shelf life of 6 months at the indicated normal storage temperature (-80 to -60 Celsius). The shipping container will keep it at that temperature for 10 days, and can be refilled with dry ice if needed. It can also be stored at conventional freezer temperatures (-8 to -2 Celsius) for up to 5 days before use.

I guess the most likely benefit is if it prevents a flight from getting diverted, it would help people receive the vaccine earlier, which in turn could mean some lives saved.

The Pfizer vaccine has stability data for 5 days at 2-8C, not -8C to -2C. That temp range is basically a refrigerator.
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iamlucky13
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Tue Dec 15, 2020 2:56 am

cjg225 wrote:
iamlucky13 wrote:
Pfizer reported their vaccine has a shelf life of 6 months at the indicated normal storage temperature (-80 to -60 Celsius). The shipping container will keep it at that temperature for 10 days, and can be refilled with dry ice if needed. It can also be stored at conventional freezer temperatures (-8 to -2 Celsius) for up to 5 days before use.

I guess the most likely benefit is if it prevents a flight from getting diverted, it would help people receive the vaccine earlier, which in turn could mean some lives saved.

The Pfizer vaccine has stability data for 5 days at 2-8C, not -8C to -2C. That temp range is basically a refrigerator.


Thanks for the correction. You are right. I misread the first time.
 
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stl07
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Tue Dec 15, 2020 3:25 am

Big inaccuracies in this thread I would like to address. --Pfizer was NOT a part of operation warp speed apart from the US buying vaccines from them, so almost everything said about warp speed and Pfizer is incorrect.
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gdavis003
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Tue Dec 15, 2020 4:31 am

Why don't we just focus on the planes instead of scrutinizing and criticizing every detail of a post about the operation? Would be nice to not have this thread devolve from the topic due to people pointing out every technicality of the non-aviation related parts of this operation. We're lucky enough to even be able to talk about this topic in 2020, let's not make a mess of it.
 
andrew1996
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Tue Dec 15, 2020 4:56 pm

Is UA flying vaccines behalf of Fedex/UPS or is UA Cargo also indepently involved? I am a bit confused on who is transporting the vaccine because I thought UPS/Fedex said something that they are managing it but you also have passenger airlines flying them but how are the passenger airlines like UA delivering the cargo once it reaches ORD from BRU?
 
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cjg225
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Tue Dec 15, 2020 5:18 pm

andrew1996 wrote:
Is UA flying vaccines behalf of Fedex/UPS or is UA Cargo also indepently involved? I am a bit confused on who is transporting the vaccine because I thought UPS/Fedex said something that they are managing it but you also have passenger airlines flying them but how are the passenger airlines like UA delivering the cargo once it reaches ORD from BRU?

I know my counterparts at Pfizer have a relationship with UA, but I don't know if they procure capacity directly with UA. They might be procuring through a forwarder... which may be UPS. Could be anyone, but UPS Supply Chain Services is a pretty big player in the pharma forwarding world even if they're not the top of the forwarding pile (though the two top dogs in forwarding, Kuehne + Nagel and DHL, are also major players in pharma forwarding).

Suffice to say, though, as I think you were talking about the integrator portions of those two companies, no, UA is not flying BRU-ORD on behalf of UPS or FedEx.
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frmrCapCadet
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Tue Dec 15, 2020 6:25 pm

https://www.defense.gov/Explore/News/Ar ... ve-monday/
Gen Perna's overview of vaccine delivery

https://www.defense.gov/Explore/News/Ar ... eral-says/
Gen Perna discussions some of the technical details and problems in delivering the vaccines

You may have heard the comment, arm chair generals discuss strategy, generals discuss logistics. This is one of the main reasons the military is often charged with management of emergency relief. Typically civilian political leaders from the national, state, and local areas remain in charge and the military provides coordination. A general such as Perna is likely politically astute, a master of details but even more of the overview. He has authority to cut through regulations and interjurisdictional disputes. In a sense he and his staff are every political leader's 'best friend'. He is the arbitrator who enables them to do their job. The logistics that are involved with the research, production, intermediate delivery, and that final shot in the arm are complex, nationally and even world wide. Everything from who will do what, what price they will charge, how things are allocated is negotiated but overseen by him.

It is unfortunate that the federal government did not appoint such a person to oversee personal protective equipment, medical equipment, and medicines that were in short supply. (had it been done we would likely see someone else inaugurated next month)
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sunking737
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Wed Dec 16, 2020 4:39 am

From CAP National Headquarters....
The South Dakota Wing delivered Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine Dec. 15 to Prairie Lakes Hospital in Watertown on behalf of the South Dakota Department of Health. At the Health Department's request, the wing is flying the vaccine to certain smaller communities in the state without regular air service. Other wing members will assist with mission planning and logistical support.

Making the inaugural delivery flight were Lt. Col. Jeremy Langrock, Maj. Karla West and Capt. Matt Meert, mission pilot.
"This is truly a turning point in the battle against COVID-19,” said Col. Nick Gengler, wing commander. “Our professional volunteers stepped up today to provide a service to the local communities. We will continue to be of service and look forward to ways we can continue to contribute."

CAP is assisting with vaccine distribution in its role as the U.S. Air Force auxiliary, part of the Air Force Total Force. In addition to South Dakota Wing, CAP's Great Lakes Region and the Wisconsin Wing will soon conduct similar missions.
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frmrCapCadet
Posts: 4797
Joined: Thu May 29, 2008 8:24 pm

Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Wed Dec 16, 2020 4:50 pm

sunking737 wrote:
From CAP National Headquarters....
The South Dakota Wing delivered Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine Dec. 15 to Prairie Lakes Hospital in Watertown on behalf of the South Dakota Department of Health. At the Health Department's request, the wing is flying the vaccine to certain smaller communities in the state without regular air service. Other wing members will assist with mission planning and logistical support.

Making the inaugural delivery flight were Lt. Col. Jeremy Langrock, Maj. Karla West and Capt. Matt Meert, mission pilot.
"This is truly a turning point in the battle against COVID-19,” said Col. Nick Gengler, wing commander. “Our professional volunteers stepped up today to provide a service to the local communities. We will continue to be of service and look forward to ways we can continue to contribute."

CAP is assisting with vaccine distribution in its role as the U.S. Air Force auxiliary, part of the Air Force Total Force. In addition to South Dakota Wing, CAP's Great Lakes Region and the Wisconsin Wing will soon conduct similar missions.


Nice to hear. Those little propeller machines and the people who fly them can do certain jobs like no other transport equipment.
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smokeybandit
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Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2014 3:24 pm

Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Wed Dec 16, 2020 9:33 pm

Any reports of the Moderna vaccine being shipped yet throughout the USA? It's going to get its EUA on Friday
 
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cjg225
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Fri Dec 18, 2020 5:50 pm

One of our vendors officially announced their -60C to -80C passive pallet shipper: https://apps.skycell.ch/skycell-introdu ... er-1500df/

SkyCell has been a pretty hot topic in the pharma industry the last few years. Since SkyCell went down the non-ULD route (compared to competitors like C-Safe and Envirotainer), they can do research, development, and fielding a lot more quickly and roll out something like this pallet shipper already.

Could be a significant help with bulk-level shipments of the Pfizer-level-cold vaccines. Interestingly, SkyCell skipped over the -20C level, which Envirotainer has covered.
Restoring Penn State's transportation heritage...
 
andrew1996
Posts: 154
Joined: Sat Aug 08, 2020 6:41 pm

Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Mon Dec 21, 2020 11:58 pm

On the Singapore press release for vaccine in Singapore a photo was taken of a pallet being offloaded from SQ 747 Cargo but when you zoom into the picture the pallet has DHL stickers/labels all over it? Who was transporting the vaccine or does DHL handle the ground handling aspect and rented space out of SQ Cargo to fly it down to Singaopre from BRU?
 
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cjg225
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:56 am

andrew1996 wrote:
On the Singapore press release for vaccine in Singapore a photo was taken of a pallet being offloaded from SQ 747 Cargo but when you zoom into the picture the pallet has DHL stickers/labels all over it? Who was transporting the vaccine or does DHL handle the ground handling aspect and rented space out of SQ Cargo to fly it down to Singaopre from BRU?

DHL probably was the freight forwarder.

I'm guessing you're talking about one of these photos?
Image
Restoring Penn State's transportation heritage...
 
andrew1996
Posts: 154
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:11 am

cjg225 wrote:
andrew1996 wrote:
On the Singapore press release for vaccine in Singapore a photo was taken of a pallet being offloaded from SQ 747 Cargo but when you zoom into the picture the pallet has DHL stickers/labels all over it? Who was transporting the vaccine or does DHL handle the ground handling aspect and rented space out of SQ Cargo to fly it down to Singaopre from BRU?

DHL probably was the freight forwarder.

I'm guessing you're talking about one of these photos?
Image


Yup talking about that photo. There was another photo I saw afterwards of it being loaded onto a DHL branded truck at the airport so I guess they were the forwarders and they rented space on SQ Cargo instead of using their plane? They seem to have taken the credit that they successfully transported the vaccine but Singaoore Airlines claim the same thing lol. It seems like only one pallet of vaccine was loaded on the flight so I guess it doesn’t warrant a dedicated charter flight but I also would have thought they would use their own planes not least for marketing purposes where when the media captures the unloading it’s a DHL branded plane.
 
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cjg225
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Re: COVID-19 vaccine transport flights.

Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:31 pm

andrew1996 wrote:
Yup talking about that photo. There was another photo I saw afterwards of it being loaded onto a DHL branded truck at the airport so I guess they were the forwarders and they rented space on SQ Cargo instead of using their plane? They seem to have taken the credit that they successfully transported the vaccine but Singaoore Airlines claim the same thing lol. It seems like only one pallet of vaccine was loaded on the flight so I guess it doesn’t warrant a dedicated charter flight but I also would have thought they would use their own planes not least for marketing purposes where when the media captures the unloading it’s a DHL branded plane.

The major global integrators (DHL, FedEx, and UPS) rarely use their own aircraft for large shipments like this. They can and do, but it's not their preference, especially in the present environment with eCommerce activity through the proverbial roof. They'd rather stuff their aircraft with as much small parcel volume as they can. They do have "freight" (read: palletized shipments) offerings, but you wouldn't run something sensitive like these vaccines through the freight service on DHL-branded (or FedEx or UPS) aircraft. I mean, you could, but you just wouldn't largely because their processes and procedures typically don't involve sensitive cargo (to be fair, FedEx sort of does, but I'll try to avoid getting too far into the weeds with how they're different).

So, yeah, I strongly suspect that DHL was acting as freight forwarder here. Or, more properly, DGF: DHL Global Forwarding, a different division from DHL Express, which is to what I believe you're referring when bringing up their branded aircraft. DGF is one of the major pharma forwarders in the world along with companies like UPS Supply Chain Services, Kuehne + Nagel, Expeditors, etc. FedEx Trade Networks is a comparatively minor player in freight forwarding in general, let alone pharma.

Both take can take credit, as they should. DGF would've likely arranged the pre-carriage from the origin facility to the airport. They may have even built up the ULD considering there's a lot of DHL either tape or strapping (hard to tell from that photo) underneath the cargo net. They'd get it delivered to the SQ at the origin airport. Then SQ would do the airport-to-airport piece, obviously. Depending on a variety of local requirements, DGF either may be done at this point or may be involved in arranging the final mile from the airport to the consignee (amongst a few other things).
Restoring Penn State's transportation heritage...

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