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JBoy
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Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:38 pm

Seeking Alpha reports more MAX 9 from Alaska.

https://seekingalpha.com/news/3646620-b ... king_alpha
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:41 pm

ALK made an 8-K SEC filing today.

New agreement in principle adds 23 orders plus 15 options to airline’s overall order

Alaska is scheduled to receive 13 planes in 2021; 30 in 2022; 13 in 2023; and 12 in 2024. The delivery schedule will largely
replace Alaska’s Airbus fleet and moves the airline substantially toward a single, mainline fleet that’s more efficient, profitable
and environmentally friendly, and that will enhance the guest experience and support the company’s growth.

https://investor.alaskaair.com/financia ... ec-filings

The 737-9 will replace all A319 and A320 aircraft in Alaska’s fleet to improve the airline’s overall operational, financial and
environmental performance. With this plan, Alaska will reduce its Airbus fleet to 10 A321neos by the summer of 2023.


Let me be the first to assert that AS will not be keeping just ten 321neos amongst ~275 NGs and MAXs. Ten is not an economic quantity of narrowbodies to justify separate parts and pilot crew.
Last edited by MIflyer12 on Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:46 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
Weatherwatcher1
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:41 pm

It appears that 9 of the airplanes are white tails built for other airlines. The rest of the 36 airplanes will be newly build.

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/22/alaska- ... ashes.html

Alaska still hasn’t received its first 737-9 so they haven’t had to deal with parking and storage. Looks like they get their first in January
 
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Polot
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:45 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
ALK made an 8-K SEC filing today.

New agreement in principle adds 23 orders plus 15 options to airline’s overall order

Alaska is scheduled to receive 13 planes in 2021; 30 in 2022; 13 in 2023; and 12 in 2024. The delivery schedule will largely
replace Alaska’s Airbus fleet and moves the airline substantially toward a single, mainline fleet that’s more efficient, profitable
and environmentally friendly, and that will enhance the guest experience and support the company’s growth.

https://investor.alaskaair.com/financia ... ec-filings

Just so things are clear, based on the 8-K filing the 68 jets include the 13 leases AS announced late last month.
 
JBoy
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 2:49 pm

Just so things are clear, based on the 8-K filing the 68 jets include the 13 leases AS announced late last month.

That is correct.
 
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Momo1435
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:04 pm

Boeing press release for the order, confirming the numbers

https://boeing.mediaroom.com/2020-12-22 ... o-120-Jets


from the press release

Image
 
9Patch
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:08 pm

There is a short article in the Seattle Times by Dominic Gates. It says the new Boeing MAX jets will be 20% more efficient than the jets they replace:

The cheap Boeing MAXs will replace all of Alaska’s 51 Airbus A320s and 10 smaller A319s, most of which are on expensive leases inherited from Alaska’s acquisition of Virgin America. And since the MAXs are 20% more fuel efficient and new jets should require less maintenance, Alaska expects to reap big operational cost savings.

It also says:

The financial terms Boeing offered would have been difficult to pass up. In an interview, Alaska Air Group chief executive Brad Tilden said the airline will have to pay no additional money for the 13 MAXs it will take next year.

That’s because Alaska had already paid significant pre-delivery deposits on its pending orders of MAXs before the plane was grounded in March 2019. Boeing has now restructured the terms with discounts to compensate the airline and encourage the follow-on order.

https://www.seattletimes.com/business/b ... rbus-jets/
Last edited by 9Patch on Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:14 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
CX747
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:10 pm

Congratulations to Alaska Airlines & Boeing on the new order. Congrats to the pilots, new metal is on the way and that is something to be happy about a few days before Christmas!!!
 
FluidFlow
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:23 pm

9Patch wrote:
There is a short article in the Seattle Times by Dominic Gates. It says the new Boeing MAX jets will be 20% more efficient than the jets they replace:

The cheap Boeing MAXs will replace all of Alaska’s 51 Airbus A320s and 10 smaller A319s, most of which are on expensive leases inherited from Alaska’s acquisition of Virgin America. And since the MAXs are 20% more fuel efficient and new jets should require less maintenance, Alaska expects to reap big operational cost savings.

It also says:

The financial terms Boeing offered would have been difficult to pass up. In an interview, Alaska Air Group chief executive Brad Tilden said the airline will have to pay no additional money for the 13 MAXs it will take next year.

That’s because Alaska had already paid significant pre-delivery deposits on its pending orders of MAXs before the plane was grounded in March 2019. Boeing has now restructured the terms with discounts to compensate the airline and encourage the follow-on order.

https://www.seattletimes.com/business/b ... rbus-jets/


Congrats on the great deal, it is the right thing to do in the current environment and for long term planning to replace the Airbuses.

On the other side oh boy... Boeing will be in a world of pain next year if it becomes standard that they will not receive money for delivers MAX that were due over the last year. As I predicted in the equity raise thread, positive cash flow will not be reached for a while.
 
d8s
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:33 pm

Momo1435 wrote:
Boeing press release for the order, confirming the numbers

https://boeing.mediaroom.com/2020-12-22 ... o-120-Jets

from the press release

Image


I am waiting for an add on order of Max8's.
 
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Revelation
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:34 pm

FluidFlow wrote:
On the other side oh boy... Boeing will be in a world of pain next year if it becomes standard that they will not receive money for delivers MAX that were due over the last year. As I predicted in the equity raise thread, positive cash flow will not be reached for a while.

The way I read the comments above Boeing's choice was to pay cash compensation to AS due to missed delivery dates and thus lost revenue, or compensate them via white tails they could not sell in the next several years. I think it pencils out as a win in that Boeing is going to get future spares revenue and stop paying storage and inventory fees on the white tails while helping to push A319 and A320 out of a key account. It's good for AS in that they can still operate A321neo and pressure Boeing on future contracts.
 
Opus99
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:48 pm

Revelation wrote:
FluidFlow wrote:
On the other side oh boy... Boeing will be in a world of pain next year if it becomes standard that they will not receive money for delivers MAX that were due over the last year. As I predicted in the equity raise thread, positive cash flow will not be reached for a while.

The way I read the comments above Boeing's choice was to pay cash compensation to AS due to missed delivery dates and thus lost revenue, or compensate them via white tails they could not sell in the next several years. I think it pencils out as a win in that Boeing is going to get future spares revenue and stop paying storage and inventory fees on the white tails while helping to push A319 and A320 out of a key account. It's good for AS in that they can still operate A321neo and pressure Boeing on future contracts.

Yes I agree. Sell as many as you can. Let’s not forget, the MAX was already on the back foot pre-CRISES. Now Boeing should do what they can to sell the jet
 
Armadillo1
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 3:55 pm

why not -10 for new tails?
 
Jetport
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:06 pm

This is a win-win and a no-brainer for Alaska. Though it is not new news, it is still surprising how high Virgin America's lease rates were. I guess smaller, younger airlines like Virgin America are poor credit risks and have to pay through the nose for aircraft.
 
cledaybuck
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:10 pm

Armadillo1 wrote:
why not -10 for new tails?

Yeah, I am surprised to see new -9's ordered. I didn't think we would see any more after the launch of the -10. I am guessing AS doesn't want to add another subtype yet.
 
Noshow
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:20 pm

Or they might need the range of the -9?
 
Tack
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:29 pm

Revelation wrote:
The way I read the comments above Boeing's choice was to pay cash compensation to AS due to missed delivery dates and thus lost revenue, or compensate them via white tails they could not sell in the next several years. I think it pencils out as a win in that Boeing is going to get future spares revenue and stop paying storage and inventory fees on the white tails while helping to push A319 and A320 out of a key account. It's good for AS in that they can still operate A321neo and pressure Boeing on future contracts.


It’s going to be hard to do that, in the employee news release they not only say they’re going to a single fleet type, but compare the MAX operating cost to the NEO and state that that the MAX beats it out for the type of flying AS will be doing. Shame, I really like the NEO.
Last edited by Tack on Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
Weatherwatcher1
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:30 pm

cledaybuck wrote:
Armadillo1 wrote:
why not -10 for new tails?

Yeah, I am surprised to see new -9's ordered. I didn't think we would see any more after the launch of the -10. I am guessing AS doesn't want to add another subtype yet.


Being interchangeable with the 79 737-900ERs may be desirable. It allows the airline to easily move planes around.
 
gmcc
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:37 pm

d8s wrote:
Momo1435 wrote:
Boeing press release for the order, confirming the numbers

https://boeing.mediaroom.com/2020-12-22 ... o-120-Jets

from the press release

Image


I am waiting for an add on order of Max8's.


You might be waiting for a long time. AS originally had -8s on order and converted all of them to -9s. I don't see them going back. It will be interesting to see what AS does once they start phasing out the -700 and -800. 76 to 178 seems like a really big gap in gauge.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:44 pm

There have been two common refrains regarding new aircraft orders shortly after the start of Covid:

1. Carriers won't be ordering/optioning new aircraft because they don't have money (money apparently narrowly defined as operating income or free cash flow, not the broader ability to finance).

2. Used aircraft will be so cheap it won't make sense to buy new.

Your meals of crow are now served. The better-capitalized U.S. carriers can still look 5-10 years down the road in fleet moves rather than being fixated on available liquidity (the government will let us borrow $5.5 Billion!) and running out of cash in 12-18 months.

No doubt AS could have achieved the same goal of replacing the 319/320s with Boeings by multiple transactions for 738/MAX 8 etc. lease returns and loan rejections. I mean, Norwegian and Aeromexico MAX 8s and 738s will wind up somewhere, and they won't be the only carriers to be dumping 737-family aircraft before this is done.

AS has frequently talked about virtues of fleet commonality. WN, too, so for AS to drop the far smaller fraction of the fleet shouldn't be a big surprise.

As for CARES Act 2 financing these purchases, I expect we will see (when the final legislation is available online in full form) that new monies have to go exclusively for payroll. Is CARES 2 funding effectively a subsidy that AS would otherwise have to pay out before March 1? Sure - but, again, they're looking farther down the road than that.
 
airlinepeanuts
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:44 pm

According to local news in SEA. Alaska is paying nothing more for the first 13 jets this year because Boeing is applying Pre-covid deposits that AS paid.
 
775899
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:47 pm

So is it confirmed all of the Airbuses going away at AS?
 
DLASFlyer
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:50 pm

BNAMealer wrote:
So is it confirmed all of the Airbuses going away at AS?


No. 10 A321neo are staying.
 
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ikolkyo
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:54 pm

DLASFlyer wrote:
BNAMealer wrote:
So is it confirmed all of the Airbuses going away at AS?


No. 10 A321neo are staying.


Probably until their lease is over, don’t think they can get out of those early.
 
jeffrey0032j
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:55 pm

BNAMealer wrote:
So is it confirmed all of the Airbuses going away at AS?

No, there will be 10 321neos left in the fleet.
 
Sokes
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 4:58 pm

If the deposits already paid for the 2021 planes are like 80% of the total, it's good news for Boeing.
If the deposits already paid are like 20%, it's good news for the airline.
 
FluidFlow
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 5:17 pm

Revelation wrote:
FluidFlow wrote:
On the other side oh boy... Boeing will be in a world of pain next year if it becomes standard that they will not receive money for delivers MAX that were due over the last year. As I predicted in the equity raise thread, positive cash flow will not be reached for a while.

The way I read the comments above Boeing's choice was to pay cash compensation to AS due to missed delivery dates and thus lost revenue, or compensate them via white tails they could not sell in the next several years. I think it pencils out as a win in that Boeing is going to get future spares revenue and stop paying storage and inventory fees on the white tails while helping to push A319 and A320 out of a key account. It's good for AS in that they can still operate A321neo and pressure Boeing on future contracts.


Long term it is for sure a win no doubt but the next 18 months will be dark times. No Problem of course, Boeing can weather this but as I said, the 30bn equity will melt away as cash burn will be negative. Not only for the 737 but 787 as well.

Now for the good news, AS made a killer deal and I guarantee FR did too and so will others. All the 737s leaving property right now will not costs anything for airlines and that is great news for them.
 
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NameOmitted
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 5:21 pm

Will the white-tails have different internal configurations from the rest of the fleet?
 
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JerseyFlyer
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 5:23 pm

I am surprised AS did not try to achieve lower lease rates on the Airbuses. The leasing companies would surely prefer them to stay at AS than re-market them in the present climate.

Either AS failed to sufficiently re-negotiate the leases or decided in principle to replace the Airbuses irrespective.
 
jeffrey0032j
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 5:24 pm

NameOmitted wrote:
Will the white-tails have different internal configurations from the rest of the fleet?

I would expect Boeing to have standardized it with the rest of the AS order.
 
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Polot
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 5:33 pm

JerseyFlyer wrote:
I am surprised AS did not try to achieve lower lease rates on the Airbuses. The leasing companies would surely prefer them to stay at AS than re-market them in the present climate.

Either AS failed to sufficiently re-negotiate the leases or decided in principle to replace the Airbuses irrespective.

AS decided they did not want the Airbuses pre-Covid. No point in keeping around planes you don’t want longer when you can get a screaming deal on some new next (current) gen planes and simplify your fleet.

It will be interesting to see what happens with the A321neos, a fleet of 10 doesn’t make sense. Will AS dump those later or convert their Airbus A320neo orders to the A321neo? AS management likes they A321neo, they just haven’t liked the price (both of the current plane’s expensive leases and Airbus’s offering price for new ones).
 
durangomac
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 5:41 pm

Polot wrote:
JerseyFlyer wrote:
I am surprised AS did not try to achieve lower lease rates on the Airbuses. The leasing companies would surely prefer them to stay at AS than re-market them in the present climate.

Either AS failed to sufficiently re-negotiate the leases or decided in principle to replace the Airbuses irrespective.

AS decided they did not want the Airbuses pre-Covid. No point in keeping around planes you don’t want longer when you can get a screaming deal on some new next (current) gen planes and simplify your fleet.

It will be interesting to see what happens with the A321neos, a fleet of 10 doesn’t make sense. Will AS dump those later or convert their Airbus A320neo orders to the A321neo? AS management likes they A321neo, they just haven’t liked the price (both of the current plane’s expensive leases and Airbus’s offering price for new ones).


AS stated multiple times they were working with lessors but some were not willing to change, some did but not enough so the fleet is just going to go away. If you look at the ownership of the leased A319/A320's you'll notice that almost every single one is leased from a different company, AS stated this has caused a lot of issues because they can't do multiple aircraft at a time.
 
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EA CO AS
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 5:46 pm

JerseyFlyer wrote:
I am surprised AS did not try to achieve lower lease rates on the Airbuses. The leasing companies would surely prefer them to stay at AS than re-market them in the present climate.

Either AS failed to sufficiently re-negotiate the leases or decided in principle to replace the Airbuses irrespective.


Because of the, shall we say, less-than-ideal financial state VX was in when obtaining these aircraft, there are literally dozens of lessors involved. One plane here, three there, and it made having re-negotiation very difficult, especially when there were other priorities.
 
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EA CO AS
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 5:49 pm

d8s wrote:
Momo1435 wrote:
Boeing press release for the order, confirming the numbers

https://boeing.mediaroom.com/2020-12-22 ... o-120-Jets

from the press release

Image


I am waiting for an add on order of Max8's.


Won't be happening; AS wants higher capacity, as it equals lower CASM. The MAX10 might make sense at some point, but even as I was told directly by Brad and Ben in a conversation on this very topic, they only see the MAX10 having a role in routes like SEALAX and SEAANC, and as a result it may not make sense to bring them to the property.
 
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NameOmitted
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:00 pm

EA CO AS wrote:
AS wants higher capacity, as it equals lower CASM.


What's the long term plan for thin intra-Alaska currently flown by the -700s?
 
CX747
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:03 pm

Fun to watch the world go round. NEW, FUEL EFFICIENT 737s are to replace OLD, FUEL GUZZLING A319/320s.

At any rate, as I said before a win for all around, especially the pilots. New aircraft, replacing old and no decrease in the fleet.
 
Strato2
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:03 pm

FluidFlow wrote:
On the other side oh boy... Boeing will be in a world of pain next year if it becomes standard that they will not receive money for delivers MAX that were due over the last year. As I predicted in the equity raise thread, positive cash flow will not be reached for a while.


Never has the term "pyrrhic victory" been more appropriate.
 
TranscendZac
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:05 pm

Will AS order any -10s to replace those 321neos? Would be a nice one for one replacement. I’m most excited about seeing the -10 enter service of all of the Max. I haven’t been on the forum in quite some time so it may have been addressed before but will the -10 get a thrust bump or is it the same rating as the -8/-9 (28,000lbs)?
 
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Revelation
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:17 pm

cledaybuck wrote:
Armadillo1 wrote:
why not -10 for new tails?

Yeah, I am surprised to see new -9's ordered. I didn't think we would see any more after the launch of the -10. I am guessing AS doesn't want to add another subtype yet.

The -10 is already launched. There's a price in the catalog and the first -10 has already been built.

OTOH I agree with others who say AS already owns a lot of 739 NGs and standardizing on one size makes sense to me at least.

Strato2 wrote:
FluidFlow wrote:
On the other side oh boy... Boeing will be in a world of pain next year if it becomes standard that they will not receive money for delivers MAX that were due over the last year. As I predicted in the equity raise thread, positive cash flow will not be reached for a while.

Never has the term "pyrrhic victory" been more appropriate.

Not very sensitive to the ET or JT crash victims though.

Bottom line: Boeing is paying in many different ways for the MCAS tragedy.
 
durangomac
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:27 pm

NameOmitted wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:
AS wants higher capacity, as it equals lower CASM.


What's the long term plan for thin intra-Alaska currently flown by the -700s?


I was looking at the performance data, the MAX 9 has very similar operating performance of the 700's. I was surprised abut that.
 
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Polot
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:34 pm

durangomac wrote:
NameOmitted wrote:
EA CO AS wrote:
AS wants higher capacity, as it equals lower CASM.


What's the long term plan for thin intra-Alaska currently flown by the -700s?


I was looking at the performance data, the MAX 9 has very similar operating performance of the 700's. I was surprised abut that.

I’m not. People here get so focused on the Max vs Neo that they tend to forget the Max, just like the Neo, is still a huge improvement over the NG and Ceo. I seem to recall a AC pilot here stating that their Max’s were taking similar or better fuel loads as E190s on the same route. There is a reason why airlines are eager to get them back in the air.
 
airlinepeanuts
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:37 pm

Look for ANC-NRT on a MAX with AS in the next 4 years
 
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EA CO AS
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:37 pm

The big question I have is whether or not AS will re-visit the mid-cabin lav discussion on the 7M9 fleet; it's a huge hit on the A321NEO fleet with both guests and crews alike, and would also help with CG issues on the ground even though tail stands are standard practice at every station.
 
smartplane
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:40 pm

Sokes wrote:
If the deposits already paid for the 2021 planes are like 80% of the total, it's good news for Boeing.
If the deposits already paid are like 20%, it's good news for the airline.

Boeing Tier 2 and 3 retrospective credits (MAX compensation) are worth more if transferred to existing or new aircraft deposits, and the least if taken as cash. The credits are probably worth even more if the airline executes an exclusivity agreement for the life of the order / deliveries.

No way that pre-Covid, Boeing held 80% deposits on any MAX. The combined acceptance and withheld (warranty) payment milestones are greater than 20%.

Interesting to see the financial reporting where these deals are incorporated, and if credit / discount pain is being shared by major sub-contractors and suppliers, as well as Boeing.

Perfect example of making lemon juice when life deals you lemons, but it will roll through into the used aircraft market, used parts, and Airbus new prices, none of which is good for those with a beneficial interest in existing NB aircraft. The other negative, is it increases the leap between NB and WB pricing, further depressing the new and used WB market (the only better deal than using Boeing compensation is to purchase new Max is to use for new 787's).
 
Lootess
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:47 pm

Moves like this isn’t that surprising, and being the hometown favorite doesn’t hurt either, they will have to stick with A321neo for awhile but at least that plane addresses certain markets for them until they grow the MAX fleet. I like the long term move to get out of the bad Virgin leases, that is the easiest sticking point. If terms were more favorable, or the planes were flat out owned we’d be talking a different story.
 
marcelh
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:51 pm

CX747 wrote:
Fun to watch the world go round. NEW, FUEL EFFICIENT 737s are to replace OLD, FUEL GUZZLING A319/320s.

At any rate, as I said before a win for all around, especially the pilots. New aircraft, replacing old and no decrease in the fleet.

They could have replaced the A319/320 with even more efficient and newer technology A321neo... :stirthepot:
 
Sokes
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 6:59 pm

smartplane wrote:
No way that pre-Covid, Boeing held 80% deposits on any MAX. The combined acceptance and withheld (warranty) payment milestones are greater than 20%.

The point is that we can't conclude anything from the given information.
Let's assume the airline so far has paid only 20% of the prize of the 2021 deliveries. Is the deal good for the airline?
Again, one can't conclude. If the airline in exchange agreed to pay list price for the newly ordered planes it's again no great deal for the airline.

Now I myself believe it's a good deal for the airline. But that's an assumption.
Logic doesn't provide such a conclusion.
 
Tack
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Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:25 pm

DLASFlyer wrote:
BNAMealer wrote:
So is it confirmed all of the Airbuses going away at AS?


No. 10 A321neo are staying.


Correct, the NEOS are in the fleet plan until 2026. Nothing after that. And based on the internal release to employees, AS said the MAX has better operating costs than the NEO for them, I’d expect they’ll begin the phase out of the NEO’s by that date or maybe before.
Last edited by Tack on Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
Tailwinds
Posts: 61
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2007 2:46 am

Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:31 pm

NameOmitted wrote:
Will the white-tails have different internal configurations from the rest of the fleet?


Management confirmed internally that they will be indistinguishable from the rest of the fleet.
 
CX747
Posts: 6649
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 2:54 am

Re: Alaska Airlines orders more Boeing MAX 9

Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:41 pm

marcelh wrote:
CX747 wrote:
Fun to watch the world go round. NEW, FUEL EFFICIENT 737s are to replace OLD, FUEL GUZZLING A319/320s.

At any rate, as I said before a win for all around, especially the pilots. New aircraft, replacing old and no decrease in the fleet.

They could have replaced the A319/320 with even more efficient and newer technology A321neo... :stirthepot:


The A321neo will always be old tech in comparison to the 737-9 Max. The 321 neo was launched first and flew first. 737-9 Max flew for the first time over a year plus after the 321neo.

I just can't state it enough. What a great Christmas present to the pilots, flight attendants, mechanics etc. New metal is coming in to replace old metal and there is no decrease in fleet size. Some guys just have to relearn how to use a yoke!
Last edited by CX747 on Tue Dec 22, 2020 7:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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