Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
DenverTed
Posts: 828
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2019 11:12 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Oct 26, 2021 6:07 pm

cosyr wrote:
DenverTed wrote:
My longterm solution would be to move runway 35L 2000' to the East. Then they should build a new linear train line to the East ends of all the concourses and a second terminal 2000' East of the current one that lines up with the train line. Then they would have enough room to extend A,B,and C another 1000' East. At the new terminal they could have gates directly off the terminal facing A, and a connected concourse running North-South. Since the alleys are so wide, I assume they could close 1/2 the alley and build it open trench style, and still have one or two taxi lanes open in the alley. I believe the original train lines were dug open trench, and not tunneled.

I'm not sure that moving the runway would be cheaper than just digging trenches under existing taxiways and adding a new train loop, similar to IAD. If you made A, B and C any wider than they are, then you would also have to consider adding trains within each concourse, similar to DTW.

Now that concourse D and E are off the table, they have to fit new terminal, new curbside, and new gates all in the middle. I think they will have to move that runway to fit all of that stuff in the futue. How it all gets configured has lots of options.
I think they will definitely need a new train system from the terminal to rental cars and remote parking lots. From the beginning, I always thought they should have built a parking lot and drop off lot at I-70, and avoid putting all that traffic on Pena Blvd.
 
DenverTed
Posts: 828
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2019 11:12 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Oct 26, 2021 6:13 pm

Now back to a bridge between A and B... It wouldn't have to span all four taxi lanes as I believe two of those are for aircraft backing out of the gate. The two in the center would require maybe an 800' freespan. This could be build with a cable stayed structure with 200' towers on each end. Since the terminal is a post and tension roof structure, it would kind of go with that theme.
 
jetmatt777
Posts: 4823
Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2005 2:16 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Oct 26, 2021 6:17 pm

The purple and green lanes are used for east/west movements as well and not just for pushing back onto. There will be no bridge across. It would have to be like the Golden Gate Bridge.
 
mcg
Posts: 1178
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2003 11:49 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Oct 26, 2021 6:23 pm

jetmatt777 wrote:
^ Transportation center under the hotel.


Thank you very much. One of us is recovering from knee surgery and the distance from the transportation center to the wheel chair is prolly a no go. Thanks again.
 
ScottB
Posts: 7614
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2000 1:25 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Oct 26, 2021 6:56 pm

DenverTed wrote:
Now that concourse D and E are off the table, they have to fit new terminal, new curbside, and new gates all in the middle. I think they will have to move that runway to fit all of that stuff in the futue. How it all gets configured has lots of options.


I don't know that concourses D & E are off the table forever; they're just not a useful option for the next decade or two. Expanding A & C to their full available length would allow additional growth for the hub carriers (UA, WN, F9) as well as space for modest expansion by others. A new concourse probably wouldn't be necessary unless some carrier other than UA/WN/F9 were to want to commit to a much larger presence at DEN -- i.e. a hub or focus city with 15 to 20 gates or more.

I don't think a new terminal is necessary. The Jeppesen Terminal has an enormous quantity of space, especially in light of how passenger flows have changed since the airport opened. There's no need for large ticketing areas since many passengers never interact with an airline employee until they reach their departure gate. The changes in security post-9/11 mean that concessions should be out in the concourses, rather than in the terminal.
 
werba
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2018 2:35 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Oct 26, 2021 7:43 pm

CALMSP wrote:
swapping ticket counters wouldn't do anything. F9 is actually in a great spot, as is DL/AA who can simply advise anyone they check-in to walk around the corner and take the bridge.


This is not needed as both Southwest and United will be moving into the new ticketing areas in the center of both west and east side in November. When there last week saw the WN kiosks were in and all of the signage was on and looked nice and spacious.
 
B6BOSfan
Posts: 119
Joined: Fri Apr 19, 2019 5:11 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Oct 27, 2021 1:20 am

This really says all you need to know about why the internal workings of DEN look like disaster:
https://news.yahoo.com/denver-airport-held-job-fair-102837536.html

Only about 100 people turned up to a job fair on Saturday aimed at plugging Denver International Airport's huge labor shortage, Denver's ABC affiliate reported.

Dennis Deslongchamp, the president of the Denver Concessionaires Association, told KMGH that organizers had hoped for about 5,000 people at the fair, which he called a "very lofty goal."

Organizers had wanted to fill about 1,000 jobs at the airport, but only about 100 people came to the four-hour fair, Deslongchamp told the outlet.



AaronPGH wrote:
Went through DEN this past weekend and was thinking to myself that a tunnel a level below the trains might make sense.

After my experience, going to be avoiding booking any connections here going forwards. Been a huge fan of the place for years but it's clear that it's all being pushed to the brink. Everything was hanging on by a thread, creating a pretty miserable experience. Food lines were insane at literally every spot (we tried at least 6 places), closed UA clubs, one bathroom I was in had SIX sinks broken before I found one that worked, two of which were wrapped in trash bags. Some stuff I understand (staffing is tough right now), but how can an airport this successful be letting basics like bathrooms fall apart so much?

I always lament the dehubbing and loss of flights at my home airport PIT, but I gotta say I breathed a sigh of relief upon returning home. Even with the loss of traffic, they have managed to replace...you know...25 year old sinks. Parts of DEN were legit giving me Greyhound station vibes. Hopefully some of these things can be solved soon. It used to be such a dependable and pleasant connection, far preferable to Chicago.
 
jetmatt777
Posts: 4823
Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2005 2:16 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Oct 27, 2021 2:45 am

Turns out no one wants to go all the way out to the airport and be unpaid for parking, shuttle service, and security screening; all for bad wages with no progression. You can avoid the hassle completely and make better money literally anywhere, and probably be a lot closer to home. I hate going to DIA and dealing with all of its hassles and I make really good money with excellent benefits. Can't imagine how it feels for someone making half or less; with a fly-by-night concession vendor. Maybe the airport can provide rent relief with the benefit going to increased wages. If the airport charges $28/day for parking in a garage, I can't imagine the exorbitant rents they take from their vendors.
 
panam330
Posts: 2282
Joined: Sun Mar 14, 2004 11:58 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Oct 27, 2021 8:39 am

DenverTed wrote:
Now back to a bridge between A and B... It wouldn't have to span all four taxi lanes as I believe two of those are for aircraft backing out of the gate. The two in the center would require maybe an 800' freespan. This could be build with a cable stayed structure with 200' towers on each end. Since the terminal is a post and tension roof structure, it would kind of go with that theme.

Don’t know where you got that info. All 4 lanes (AN, BS, purple and green) between A and B are active.
Long story short, there will not be a bridge built; to say it would impede the operation is an understatement.
 
DenverTed
Posts: 828
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2019 11:12 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Oct 27, 2021 2:15 pm

panam330 wrote:
DenverTed wrote:
Now back to a bridge between A and B... It wouldn't have to span all four taxi lanes as I believe two of those are for aircraft backing out of the gate. The two in the center would require maybe an 800' freespan. This could be build with a cable stayed structure with 200' towers on each end. Since the terminal is a post and tension roof structure, it would kind of go with that theme.

Don’t know where you got that info. All 4 lanes (AN, BS, purple and green) between A and B are active.
Long story short, there will not be a bridge built; to say it would impede the operation is an understatement.

In terms of airport design, how many paths do they need at the center of the alley? How many times are three aircraft passing each other at the center? I'm sure they could get by with two, but yes, that bridge is not going to happen. How many taxiways does the bridge cross from terminal to A? How many taxiways in similar design US airports like Atlanta or the Chicago United terminal? Chicago is planning 4 parallel satellites, I wonder how many taxiways they are planning between them?
 
jetmatt777
Posts: 4823
Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2005 2:16 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Oct 27, 2021 2:30 pm

Have you seen the traffic jams that form in the alley?

BS will have a line 20 aircraft deep leaving the alley, while AN will be handling arrivals. green is used to organize the departure line on BS and snake some arrivals in to the B concourse. Purple gets used for the same reason. All 4 are used extensively in heavy banks.
 
DEN2021
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Jul 01, 2021 2:58 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Oct 27, 2021 5:01 pm

Not to mention how crucial the purple and green lines are to allowing traffic to taxi simultaneously with pushbacks (except widebody pushes) from both concourses. If traffic had to stop on BS/AN every time there was a pushback, nothing would ever move. This helps the DEN ramp be very efficient; in fact the biggest bottlenecks seem to be with Ground not being able to get aircraft off the ramp quick enough, which results in the long backups on BS eastbound and AN westbound at the ramp exit points. The green and purple lines allow controllers to “sneak” aircraft to their gates via those lanes if BS/AN are backed up.

Also the green and purple lines are very helpful for holding gate hold aircraft, since apparently the master plan for the airport never took into account the fact that airplanes might actually have to wait for their gate. The only good places to hold gate holds are the deice pads which fill up quick. The purple and green lines allow aircraft to hold for gates and be relatively out of the way.
 
DenverTed
Posts: 828
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2019 11:12 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Oct 27, 2021 6:18 pm

DEN2021 wrote:
Not to mention how crucial the purple and green lines are to allowing traffic to taxi simultaneously with pushbacks (except widebody pushes) from both concourses. If traffic had to stop on BS/AN every time there was a pushback, nothing would ever move. This helps the DEN ramp be very efficient; in fact the biggest bottlenecks seem to be with Ground not being able to get aircraft off the ramp quick enough, which results in the long backups on BS eastbound and AN westbound at the ramp exit points. The green and purple lines allow controllers to “sneak” aircraft to their gates via those lanes if BS/AN are backed up.

Also the green and purple lines are very helpful for holding gate hold aircraft, since apparently the master plan for the airport never took into account the fact that airplanes might actually have to wait for their gate. The only good places to hold gate holds are the deice pads which fill up quick. The purple and green lines allow aircraft to hold for gates and be relatively out of the way.

Are the purple and green lanes the ones nearest the gates, is there a map of this?
So at some points, aircraft exiting the alley back up in the center lanes past the center of the concourse? Now, I'm always out on C, which never looks to busy to me. If there were a bridge from A to B, I could have been observing all of this for the past 25 years, instead of stuck in a train looking at people holding on to balance. :)
 
DenverTed
Posts: 828
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2019 11:12 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Oct 27, 2021 6:26 pm

jetmatt777 wrote:
Turns out no one wants to go all the way out to the airport and be unpaid for parking, shuttle service, and security screening; all for bad wages with no progression. You can avoid the hassle completely and make better money literally anywhere, and probably be a lot closer to home. I hate going to DIA and dealing with all of its hassles and I make really good money with excellent benefits. Can't imagine how it feels for someone making half or less; with a fly-by-night concession vendor. Maybe the airport can provide rent relief with the benefit going to increased wages. If the airport charges $28/day for parking in a garage, I can't imagine the exorbitant rents they take from their vendors.

It's kind of strange economics. It's almost as if the airport were running as a ULCC airline model. Personally I think they should just charge more to the airlines and improve the airport and partially subsidize worker pay. It's amazing that funding was available to build the airport in 1989 which was not the best of economic times in Denver, but now that the economy is booming they can't keep it functioning and are behind the curve on expansion. If they raise the rates, I don't think United and Southwest will cut back.
 
jetmatt777
Posts: 4823
Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2005 2:16 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Oct 27, 2021 6:29 pm

DenverTed wrote:
DEN2021 wrote:
Not to mention how crucial the purple and green lines are to allowing traffic to taxi simultaneously with pushbacks (except widebody pushes) from both concourses. If traffic had to stop on BS/AN every time there was a pushback, nothing would ever move. This helps the DEN ramp be very efficient; in fact the biggest bottlenecks seem to be with Ground not being able to get aircraft off the ramp quick enough, which results in the long backups on BS eastbound and AN westbound at the ramp exit points. The green and purple lines allow controllers to “sneak” aircraft to their gates via those lanes if BS/AN are backed up.

Also the green and purple lines are very helpful for holding gate hold aircraft, since apparently the master plan for the airport never took into account the fact that airplanes might actually have to wait for their gate. The only good places to hold gate holds are the deice pads which fill up quick. The purple and green lines allow aircraft to hold for gates and be relatively out of the way.

Are the purple and green lanes the ones nearest the gates, is there a map of this?
So at some points, aircraft exiting the alley back up in the center lanes past the center of the concourse? Now, I'm always out on C, which never looks to busy to me. If there were a bridge from A to B, I could have been observing all of this for the past 25 years, instead of stuck in a train looking at people holding on to balance. :)


Here is a photo I took a few months ago of the afternoon traffic jam. This is looking west from B80. Green line is on the right, BS is on the left.

Image
 
werba
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2018 2:35 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Oct 27, 2021 9:54 pm

Phase 1 of DENs ticketing areas are finished:
https://www.9news.com/article/travel/gr ... beda2d84ba

Southwest and United will start using the new areas over the next few weeks.

https://www.flydenver.com/sites/default ... utting.pdf
 
AndoAv8R
Posts: 191
Joined: Thu Feb 06, 2020 4:29 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Oct 27, 2021 10:14 pm

I had heard that Lufthansa was scheduled to being back the 747-400 for LH446/447 for the Frankfurt flight starting Sunday, however Lufthansa and flightradar are showing it as an A340-300. I assume this isnt a typo? either way I'll be heading down to catch photos of it on approach (and will just be cool to see a 4 engine Lufthansa flight returning), I still remember being there for the inaugural flight which was an A343
 
DenverTed
Posts: 828
Joined: Wed Mar 27, 2019 11:12 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Oct 27, 2021 11:26 pm

jetmatt777 wrote:
DenverTed wrote:
DEN2021 wrote:
Not to mention how crucial the purple and green lines are to allowing traffic to taxi simultaneously with pushbacks (except widebody pushes) from both concourses. If traffic had to stop on BS/AN every time there was a pushback, nothing would ever move. This helps the DEN ramp be very efficient; in fact the biggest bottlenecks seem to be with Ground not being able to get aircraft off the ramp quick enough, which results in the long backups on BS eastbound and AN westbound at the ramp exit points. The green and purple lines allow controllers to “sneak” aircraft to their gates via those lanes if BS/AN are backed up.

Also the green and purple lines are very helpful for holding gate hold aircraft, since apparently the master plan for the airport never took into account the fact that airplanes might actually have to wait for their gate. The only good places to hold gate holds are the deice pads which fill up quick. The purple and green lines allow aircraft to hold for gates and be relatively out of the way.

Are the purple and green lanes the ones nearest the gates, is there a map of this?
So at some points, aircraft exiting the alley back up in the center lanes past the center of the concourse? Now, I'm always out on C, which never looks to busy to me. If there were a bridge from A to B, I could have been observing all of this for the past 25 years, instead of stuck in a train looking at people holding on to balance. :)


Here is a photo I took a few months ago of the afternoon traffic jam. This is looking west from B80. Green line is on the right, BS is on the left.

Image

Thanks for that pic. I guess that would have to be one of the things that the designers got right was leaving enough room everywhere for aircraft circulation. I remember at the old airport sitting in the penalty boxes a few times for a 1/2 hour waiting for a gate to open up in the 80's. Flew into SeaTac a few weeks ago and same thing. Flight deck says stay seated or we can't move. Two people go to the bathroom and finally the cabin crew is pounding on the door trying to get them out. That was new for me, and I remember flying out of Denver on a DC-7 and being excited about sitting in the rear lounge.
 
DEN2021
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Jul 01, 2021 2:58 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Oct 27, 2021 11:53 pm

DenverTed wrote:
DEN2021 wrote:
Not to mention how crucial the purple and green lines are to allowing traffic to taxi simultaneously with pushbacks (except widebody pushes) from both concourses. If traffic had to stop on BS/AN every time there was a pushback, nothing would ever move. This helps the DEN ramp be very efficient; in fact the biggest bottlenecks seem to be with Ground not being able to get aircraft off the ramp quick enough, which results in the long backups on BS eastbound and AN westbound at the ramp exit points. The green and purple lines allow controllers to “sneak” aircraft to their gates via those lanes if BS/AN are backed up.

Also the green and purple lines are very helpful for holding gate hold aircraft, since apparently the master plan for the airport never took into account the fact that airplanes might actually have to wait for their gate. The only good places to hold gate holds are the deice pads which fill up quick. The purple and green lines allow aircraft to hold for gates and be relatively out of the way.

Are the purple and green lanes the ones nearest the gates, is there a map of this?
So at some points, aircraft exiting the alley back up in the center lanes past the center of the concourse? Now, I'm always out on C, which never looks to busy to me. If there were a bridge from A to B, I could have been observing all of this for the past 25 years, instead of stuck in a train looking at people holding on to balance. :)


Oh yeah absolutely during the busy banks the outbound traffic can get so backed up at the exit points, waiting for sequencing by Ground, that the entire BS/AN taxiways will be backed up with aircraft well past the center cores. There are times the entire line is backed up all the way across the ramp and aircraft just have to sit and wait to join the line outbound once it starts to move.

And yes the purple lines (A and C concourse) and green lines (B concourse) are the ones closest to the gates.
 
FlyHossD
Posts: 2266
Joined: Mon Nov 02, 2009 3:45 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Oct 28, 2021 2:51 am

intotheair wrote:
The terminal redevelopment is supposed to increase the number of TSA lanes. Security will have a much bigger footprint on level 6 than on the current level 5. I know the redevelopment is controversial, and there are parts of it that I don't like either, but if you look at the level 5 and level 6 floorplans before and after, it's clear that moving security up top will be the right move.


Last I'd heard, the TSA still hasn't committed to staffing the additional security lanes on Level 6. Given their current staffing problems on Level 5, I'm quite worried about this.
 
User avatar
intotheair
Posts: 2104
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2014 12:49 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Oct 28, 2021 4:23 am

AndoAv8R wrote:
I had heard that Lufthansa was scheduled to being back the 747-400 for LH446/447 for the Frankfurt flight starting Sunday, however Lufthansa and flightradar are showing it as an A340-300. I assume this isnt a typo? either way I'll be heading down to catch photos of it on approach (and will just be cool to see a 4 engine Lufthansa flight returning), I still remember being there for the inaugural flight which was an A343


Good times! I was there that day as well. My dad really got me into aviation, and I'd then beg him to drive me all the way out to DIA on weekends back when you didn't need a boarding pass to clear security. That LH inaugural was definitely one we didn't want to miss. I remember asking him what sort of plane that was because I don't think I'd ever seen one before, and I knew it definitely wasn't a 747 or 777.

 
DEN1895
Posts: 371
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:21 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Oct 28, 2021 3:12 pm

A few photos from the ribbon cutting ceremony for phase 1 of the Great Hall. Some walls will come down on the 11/1, East side level 6 walls should come down on 11/4 when Southwest moves into their new ticket counters, West side level 6 walls will come down on 11/10 when United moves into their new space. One detail that was confirmed yesterday is the Frontier will be moving into the East side ticketing area with Southwest in the beginning of 2022.

Image
Image
Image
Image

And photo of phase 2 where demolition is still underway.
Image
 
CALMSP
Posts: 3781
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 3:18 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Oct 28, 2021 3:42 pm

FlyHossD wrote:
intotheair wrote:
The terminal redevelopment is supposed to increase the number of TSA lanes. Security will have a much bigger footprint on level 6 than on the current level 5. I know the redevelopment is controversial, and there are parts of it that I don't like either, but if you look at the level 5 and level 6 floorplans before and after, it's clear that moving security up top will be the right move.


Last I'd heard, the TSA still hasn't committed to staffing the additional security lanes on Level 6. Given their current staffing problems on Level 5, I'm quite worried about this.


the new CEO of the airport was on radio this morning and specifically said "TSA has committed to staffing additional lanes"........we shall see.

But, he's also convinced that the new passenger experienced is going to be greatly enhanced with the new ticket counters..............yeah, ok bud.
 
JohnBergless
Posts: 1
Joined: Wed Aug 11, 2021 4:57 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Oct 28, 2021 8:04 pm

Will FNL or CYS ever get point to point air service again? The folks in NoCo and WY are getting screwed. I know about Avelo and the UA bus. Waiting for F9 or WN to start something up north. Maybe Allegiant?
 
manny
Posts: 571
Joined: Sat Sep 09, 2006 8:59 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Oct 29, 2021 2:44 am

UA adds a second daily flight to LHR.
 
AmericanAir88
Posts: 321
Joined: Wed May 27, 2020 8:59 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Oct 29, 2021 8:01 am

DEN1895 wrote:
A few photos from the ribbon cutting ceremony for phase 1 of the Great Hall. Some walls will come down on the 11/1, East side level 6 walls should come down on 11/4 when Southwest moves into their new ticket counters, West side level 6 walls will come down on 11/10 when United moves into their new space. One detail that was confirmed yesterday is the Frontier will be moving into the East side ticketing area with Southwest in the beginning of 2022.

Image
Image
Image
Image

And photo of phase 2 where demolition is still underway.
Image


Wait, are WN and UA completely moving from the Level 6 check-in area?

What about the rest of the airlines. Also, what would occupy that big chunk WN has on lvl6.

DEN really needs to fix the baggage claim area imo.
 
werba
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2018 2:35 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Oct 29, 2021 6:21 pm

AmericanAir88 wrote:
DEN1895 wrote:
A few photos from the ribbon cutting ceremony for phase 1 of the Great Hall. Some walls will come down on the 11/1, East side level 6 walls should come down on 11/4 when Southwest moves into their new ticket counters, West side level 6 walls will come down on 11/10 when United moves into their new space. One detail that was confirmed yesterday is the Frontier will be moving into the East side ticketing area with Southwest in the beginning of 2022.

Image
Image
Image
Image

And photo of phase 2 where demolition is still underway.
Image


Wait, are WN and UA completely moving from the Level 6 check-in area?

What about the rest of the airlines. Also, what would occupy that big chunk WN has on lvl6.

DEN really needs to fix the baggage claim area imo.


WN and UA are staying on the 6th level just moving to the newly remodeled areas in the center of level 6.
 
AmericanAir88
Posts: 321
Joined: Wed May 27, 2020 8:59 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Oct 29, 2021 6:58 pm

werba wrote:
AmericanAir88 wrote:
DEN1895 wrote:
A few photos from the ribbon cutting ceremony for phase 1 of the Great Hall. Some walls will come down on the 11/1, East side level 6 walls should come down on 11/4 when Southwest moves into their new ticket counters, West side level 6 walls will come down on 11/10 when United moves into their new space. One detail that was confirmed yesterday is the Frontier will be moving into the East side ticketing area with Southwest in the beginning of 2022.

Image
Image
Image
Image

And photo of phase 2 where demolition is still underway.
Image


Wait, are WN and UA completely moving from the Level 6 check-in area?

What about the rest of the airlines. Also, what would occupy that big chunk WN has on lvl6.

DEN really needs to fix the baggage claim area imo.


WN and UA are staying on the 6th level just moving to the newly remodeled areas in the center of level 6.


Oh I got it. So UA and WN were previously on the West and East terminals respectively. Are the current counters on LVL6 gone? Or are they being supplemented with this new self check in area. I was at DIA three weeks ago and the WN/UA counters will still full and operating. So they just put this in the middle area im guessing.

I fly out of DIA on NK in 2 weeks so I should be able to see the locations
 
User avatar
intotheair
Posts: 2104
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2014 12:49 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Oct 29, 2021 7:35 pm

My guess is that UA is still staying on the west and WN on the east but that they put up both of their logos on the screens for the media day. That seems to be the best explanation?
 
DEN1895
Posts: 371
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:21 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Oct 29, 2021 10:10 pm

AmericanAir88 wrote:
werba wrote:
AmericanAir88 wrote:

Wait, are WN and UA completely moving from the Level 6 check-in area?

What about the rest of the airlines. Also, what would occupy that big chunk WN has on lvl6.

DEN really needs to fix the baggage claim area imo.


WN and UA are staying on the 6th level just moving to the newly remodeled areas in the center of level 6.


Oh I got it. So UA and WN were previously on the West and East terminals respectively. Are the current counters on LVL6 gone? Or are they being supplemented with this new self check in area. I was at DIA three weeks ago and the WN/UA counters will still full and operating. So they just put this in the middle area im guessing.

I fly out of DIA on NK in 2 weeks so I should be able to see the locations


Currently WN and UA are in the southern 1/3rd of the terminal, they will move to the center 1/3rd, and the airlines in the northern 1/3rd will eventually move to where UA and WN are today. This will allow the new security checkpoints to be built in the northern 1/3rd. It all sounds slightly confusing but everyone will remain on level 6, they will just move around to make room for the new checkpoints on the north side.
 
AndoAv8R
Posts: 191
Joined: Thu Feb 06, 2020 4:29 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun Oct 31, 2021 8:11 pm

Confirmed Lufthansa 446 starting today is an A 340-300 (D-AIGU for today) unfortunately I have prior obligations and won't be able to get down to catch it.
 
GSP psgr
Posts: 806
Joined: Thu Mar 30, 2000 7:09 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Mon Nov 01, 2021 9:22 pm

AaronPGH wrote:
Went through DEN this past weekend and was thinking to myself that a tunnel a level below the trains might make sense.

After my experience, going to be avoiding booking any connections here going forwards. Been a huge fan of the place for years but it's clear that it's all being pushed to the brink. Everything was hanging on by a thread, creating a pretty miserable experience. Food lines were insane at literally every spot (we tried at least 6 places), closed UA clubs, one bathroom I was in had SIX sinks broken before I found one that worked, two of which were wrapped in trash bags. Some stuff I understand (staffing is tough right now), but how can an airport this successful be letting basics like bathrooms fall apart so much?

I always lament the dehubbing and loss of flights at my home airport PIT, but I gotta say I breathed a sigh of relief upon returning home. Even with the loss of traffic, they have managed to replace...you know...25 year old sinks. Parts of DEN were legit giving me Greyhound station vibes. Hopefully some of these things can be solved soon. It used to be such a dependable and pleasant connection, far preferable to Chicago.


DEN is going through the same sort of thing CLT has gone through-where it went from being a much preferable alternative to ATL to something that's to be half avoided when I fly AA (although within that system, the other alternatives are all deeply flawed). Doubling flights while relying on the same landside facilities without upgrades is a bad mix.

IMHO, there are a relative few hubs for the majors that are still pleasant and not stretched in some ways: PHX, DTW, MSP, and SLC (once it's finished); IAH does okay although I have never liked the terminal layout there, IAD isn't stretched but everything else there is terribad on the UA side of things, everyone hates on ORD but with OMP that has quietly become a much more reliable operation. The only hubs I actively avoid are EWR, MIA, and ATL.

In a larger sense, the consolidation of flying to fewer hubs, rise of 739/A321 sized narrowbodies, and post 9/11 security requirements mated to facilities designed pre-1995 has made flying a lot less pleasant. I'd argue that PHL, ATL, IAD C/D, and ORD T3 need to be demolished and rebuilt. CLT needs a complete rethink airside, as does DEN.
 
DEN1895
Posts: 371
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:21 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Nov 04, 2021 10:13 pm

Southwest from yesterday:
Image

Southwest today:
Image


United next week.
 
AndoAv8R
Posts: 191
Joined: Thu Feb 06, 2020 4:29 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Nov 04, 2021 11:47 pm

Am I seeing things or does the new layout have the ticket counters rotate 90 degrees going east-west instead of north-south?
 
CALMSP
Posts: 3781
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 3:18 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Nov 05, 2021 12:06 am

AndoAv8R wrote:
Am I seeing things or does the new layout have the ticket counters rotate 90 degrees going east-west instead of north-south?


yes, that is correct
 
DEN1895
Posts: 371
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:21 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Nov 05, 2021 12:08 am

AndoAv8R wrote:
Am I seeing things or does the new layout have the ticket counters rotate 90 degrees going east-west instead of north-south?


The ticket counters are 2 L shapes that face each other. This allows for more ticket counters in the same amount of space. Map below.

Image
 
DEN1895
Posts: 371
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:21 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Nov 10, 2021 8:02 pm

United's old ticket counters:
Image

United's new check in area:
Image
Image

For both UA and SW the biggest difference is the amount of space both carriers have, neither airline is using their full allotment of ticket counters yet and this should hopefully allow them to expand into the future.

And a overview photo now that most everything in the center of the terminal has reopened:
Image

Still to come is the other ticket counter moves which will probably begin in the start of the new year.
 
User avatar
intotheair
Posts: 2104
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2014 12:49 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Nov 10, 2021 8:15 pm

Looks nice, though I'm going to miss those granite floors. Those were unique and probably would have still looked great with just a little polish.
 
airbazar
Posts: 10622
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Nov 10, 2021 9:37 pm

DEN1895 wrote:
For both UA and SW the biggest difference is the amount of space both carriers have, neither airline is using their full allotment of ticket counters yet and this should hopefully allow them to expand into the future.


Ticket counter space is becoming mostly useless as more people use electronic boarding passes and fewer people check bags and need to go to the counter. With the amount of space that DIA has in and around its parking lots they should make remote bag drop a permanent fixture so that passengers with checked bags who park in the car lots don't even have to bring their bags to the terminal and can go straight to security, thus freeing up even more space in the terminal. Space which could be used to improve passenger flow.
 
manny
Posts: 571
Joined: Sat Sep 09, 2006 8:59 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Nov 10, 2021 9:39 pm

We went from phenomenal flooring to run of the mill flooring.

But there is no money to be made in keeping the old flooring. So we spend more and get a downgrade. This will look awful after few months of usage. What a waste of public money.
 
DEN1895
Posts: 371
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:21 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Nov 10, 2021 10:08 pm

manny wrote:
We went from phenomenal flooring to run of the mill flooring.

But there is no money to be made in keeping the old flooring. So we spend more and get a downgrade. This will look awful after few months of usage. What a waste of public money.


While the pure white floor is not my favorite, the old floor was going to need to be replaced at some point soon. In the high traffic areas the floor is falling apart and has been patched together, if you look at the floor in front of South screening you can see this. The one plus side of the white tile is it brightens up the entire terminal. When walking through at night there is a huge difference between the new and the old areas. The existing areas look like they are stuck in the 90s, the new areas look very modern. While the floor does show more dirt, the area in the last picture has been open for 5 months and does not look awful.

And just a reminder that airports do not use public funds, only those generated at the airport.
 
dia77
Posts: 697
Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2000 3:49 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Nov 11, 2021 12:01 am

Any new updates/rumors on TK at DEN? DFW is bookable, but no news about DEN.

https://onemileatatime.com/news/turkish ... r-flights/
 
User avatar
intotheair
Posts: 2104
Joined: Sun Aug 31, 2014 12:49 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Nov 11, 2021 12:34 am

dia77 wrote:
Any new updates/rumors on TK at DEN? DFW is bookable, but no news about DEN.

https://onemileatatime.com/news/turkish ... r-flights/


This is 100% speculation, but I wonder if TK crunched the numbers and realized it’d be pretty difficult to take off from DEN in the summer with a full load.
 
AmericanAir88
Posts: 321
Joined: Wed May 27, 2020 8:59 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Nov 11, 2021 2:11 am

DEN is a ghost town today. Never seen it like this besides the early covid days.
 
User avatar
ramprat74
Posts: 1400
Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2003 6:01 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Nov 11, 2021 3:07 pm

airbazar wrote:
DEN1895 wrote:
For both UA and SW the biggest difference is the amount of space both carriers have, neither airline is using their full allotment of ticket counters yet and this should hopefully allow them to expand into the future.


Ticket counter space is becoming mostly useless as more people use electronic boarding passes and fewer people check bags and need to go to the counter. With the amount of space that DIA has in and around its parking lots they should make remote bag drop a permanent fixture so that passengers with checked bags who park in the car lots don't even have to bring their bags to the terminal and can go straight to security, thus freeing up even more space in the terminal. Space which could be used to improve passenger flow.


I remember when working at Stapleton that Continental had small ticket counters where you could drop your bag in the bridges between the parking garage and the terminal.
 
atlflyer
Posts: 775
Joined: Wed Jan 11, 2006 11:13 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Nov 11, 2021 4:40 pm

Will the old ticket counters now be renovated as well?
 
airbazar
Posts: 10622
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Nov 11, 2021 4:47 pm

ramprat74 wrote:
airbazar wrote:
DEN1895 wrote:
For both UA and SW the biggest difference is the amount of space both carriers have, neither airline is using their full allotment of ticket counters yet and this should hopefully allow them to expand into the future.


Ticket counter space is becoming mostly useless as more people use electronic boarding passes and fewer people check bags and need to go to the counter. With the amount of space that DIA has in and around its parking lots they should make remote bag drop a permanent fixture so that passengers with checked bags who park in the car lots don't even have to bring their bags to the terminal and can go straight to security, thus freeing up even more space in the terminal. Space which could be used to improve passenger flow.


I remember when working at Stapleton that Continental had small ticket counters where you could drop your bag in the bridges between the parking garage and the terminal.


DEN has the drive-up bag drop near one of the parking lots which is awesome, but it's not a permanent fixture (it's just a trailer), and it's closed right now. And even when it was opened I don't think it was well advertised. Most airports have curbside that requires me to drive up to the terminal to drop-off the bags and then go park my car. Not only does it waste some time, it also clogs the roadways near the terminals.
 
DEN1895
Posts: 371
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2018 5:21 am

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Nov 11, 2021 5:17 pm

airbazar wrote:
DEN1895 wrote:
For both UA and SW the biggest difference is the amount of space both carriers have, neither airline is using their full allotment of ticket counters yet and this should hopefully allow them to expand into the future.


Ticket counter space is becoming mostly useless as more people use electronic boarding passes and fewer people check bags and need to go to the counter. With the amount of space that DIA has in and around its parking lots they should make remote bag drop a permanent fixture so that passengers with checked bags who park in the car lots don't even have to bring their bags to the terminal and can go straight to security, thus freeing up even more space in the terminal. Space which could be used to improve passenger flow.


You have pretty much described the purpose of the Great Hall project, the project was designed to reduce the amount of ticket counter space. With the opened up space it would allow for the security moves, and allowing for better passenger flow. There is currently one remote bag check by the A Line, and the 2nd should be returning for passengers arriving by car once staffing allows.
 
User avatar
cosyr
Posts: 1717
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2012 3:23 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Nov 11, 2021 11:05 pm

ramprat74 wrote:
airbazar wrote:
DEN1895 wrote:
For both UA and SW the biggest difference is the amount of space both carriers have, neither airline is using their full allotment of ticket counters yet and this should hopefully allow them to expand into the future.


Ticket counter space is becoming mostly useless as more people use electronic boarding passes and fewer people check bags and need to go to the counter. With the amount of space that DIA has in and around its parking lots they should make remote bag drop a permanent fixture so that passengers with checked bags who park in the car lots don't even have to bring their bags to the terminal and can go straight to security, thus freeing up even more space in the terminal. Space which could be used to improve passenger flow.


I remember when working at Stapleton that Continental had small ticket counters where you could drop your bag in the bridges between the parking garage and the terminal.

What years did you work at Stapleton? Continental had a huge 3D brass route map sign (with red meatballs) somewhere in the airport that I have never found a picture of, and I'm trying to figure out where it was from... ticketing, check in, club, etc. Do you or anyone else remember seeing it?
 
User avatar
ramprat74
Posts: 1400
Joined: Wed Dec 17, 2003 6:01 pm

Re: Denver Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Nov 12, 2021 4:45 am

I transferred in right before it closed. But I was sent to Denver for training in early 94. I use to walk around the whole airport after class each day. I don’t remember a sign like that but do remember all the old defunct airline signs that were above the doors to the main terminal ticket counters. They just left them up there for some reason.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos