Moderators: jsumali2, richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
danipawa
Posts: 610
Joined: Sat Oct 01, 2016 1:18 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Mon Dec 06, 2021 1:03 am

caribny wrote:
wadadli wrote:
danipawa wrote:
DR updates:

Skycana is operating MIA-PUJ flights starting this 11/6 for a tour operator, A321 2 weekly every friday and saturdays until August.
Also operating Maracaibo and Valencia, Venezuela, from SDQ with 2 weekly each, for a tour operator too.
Several Colombia charters during this summer from SDQ, POP and PUJ.

RedAir is almost starting Ops with 3 MD80 from SDQ.

Sky High is operating schedule flights to BON, AUA, CUR, SXM, SKB and charters to BGI and GND.
EIS, AXA, ANU remain closed with DR.


Sky High has been operating back in ANU throughout November on Saturdays. Flights continue are bookable through March, 2022


Based on Flightradar24 they are also back in AXA.


Yes Sky is flying their entire network, BON AUA, CUR, SXM, PTP, FDF, SKB, AXA, EIS, ANU and charters to POS
 
wadadli
Posts: 56
Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2007 1:51 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Mon Dec 06, 2021 1:24 am

windian425 wrote:
https://barbadostoday.bb/2021/12/05/barbados-welcomes-three-inaugural-flights/
Barbadostoday Article on the 3 inaugural flights to BGI today!
Next up is JY service to GEO with their E145's..


Really challenging time for new route starts. Despite the RCCL homeport coinciding with the launch of UA, the LF's were in the 30's. VS inaugural EDI LF was also in the mid 30's. I am confident those numbers will pick up soon though.
 
windian425
Posts: 328
Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:22 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Mon Dec 06, 2021 1:58 am

wadadli wrote:
windian425 wrote:
https://barbadostoday.bb/2021/12/05/barbados-welcomes-three-inaugural-flights/
Barbadostoday Article on the 3 inaugural flights to BGI today!
Next up is JY service to GEO with their E145's..


Really challenging time for new route starts. Despite the RCCL homeport coinciding with the launch of UA, the LF's were in the 30's. VS inaugural EDI LF was also in the mid 30's. I am confident those numbers will pick up soon though.

Definitely hope these numbers pick up quickly, 30% LF is not sustainable.
 
baje427
Posts: 1023
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2011 12:42 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Mon Dec 06, 2021 11:22 am

wadadli wrote:
windian425 wrote:
https://barbadostoday.bb/2021/12/05/barbados-welcomes-three-inaugural-flights/
Barbadostoday Article on the 3 inaugural flights to BGI today!
Next up is JY service to GEO with their E145's..


Really challenging time for new route starts. Despite the RCCL homeport coinciding with the launch of UA, the LF's were in the 30's. VS inaugural EDI LF was also in the mid 30's. I am confident those numbers will pick up soon though.

I'm not as confident, given the new Covid restrictions more people are likely to cancel rather than book. In pre covid times these loads would have also been bolstered by Bajans travelling but given the decimation of the local economy this is not surprising. Its unlikely these flights will return next winter season.
 
embraer175e2
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:47 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Dec 07, 2021 4:48 pm

Spirit with 3 new caribbean routes out of philadelphia.

https://www.aviacionline.com/2021/12/fu ... el-caribe/
 
caribny
Posts: 858
Joined: Sat Mar 16, 2019 1:47 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Dec 07, 2021 5:04 pm

windian425 wrote:
wadadli wrote:
windian425 wrote:
https://barbadostoday.bb/2021/12/05/barbados-welcomes-three-inaugural-flights/
Barbadostoday Article on the 3 inaugural flights to BGI today!
Next up is JY service to GEO with their E145's..


Really challenging time for new route starts. Despite the RCCL homeport coinciding with the launch of UA, the LF's were in the 30's. VS inaugural EDI LF was also in the mid 30's. I am confident those numbers will pick up soon though.

Definitely hope these numbers pick up quickly, 30% LF is not sustainable.



Omnicon fears I assume. Plus with the new 24 hour testing to reenter the USA more will be headed to PR and the USVI, all of which are now back at pre pandemic levels.
 
embraer175e2
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:47 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Dec 07, 2021 9:07 pm

"Guyana's aviation sector continues to attract investors and the expectation is that modem facilities and services would be available to match their products. Hence, to make these facilities available, Government has continued its developmental agenda by expanding and modernizing aviation infrastructure such as the Cheddi Jagan International Airport terminal buildings, its runway and the newly commissioned instrument Landing System (ILS) to cater for increased flights, larger aircraft, improved safety for departures, and landings."

https://www.inewsguyana.com/guyana-pois ... t-edghill/
 
baje427
Posts: 1023
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2011 12:42 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Dec 08, 2021 8:38 pm

DOM welcomed their first direct flight from the US today with American Eagle out of MIA.
 
embraer175e2
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:47 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat Dec 11, 2021 5:51 pm

baje427 wrote:
DOM welcomed their first direct flight from the US today with American Eagle out of MIA.


E175 equipm.
 
maverick4002
Posts: 541
Joined: Sun Jul 12, 2015 2:14 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Mon Dec 13, 2021 5:00 pm

So looks like Trinidad got its first Omicron case. The chatter so far seems to indicate the person had a POSITIVE PCR test when they boarded the Copa Airlines flight at JFK (connecting in Panama City) and were found out at Piarco immigration. If true, what can be done here? Why would Copa allow a positive person to fly?
 
baje427
Posts: 1023
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2011 12:42 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Mon Dec 13, 2021 5:19 pm

maverick4002 wrote:
So looks like Trinidad got its first Omicron case. The chatter so far seems to indicate the person had a POSITIVE PCR test when they boarded the Copa Airlines flight at JFK (connecting in Panama City) and were found out at Piarco immigration. If true, what can be done here? Why would Copa allow a positive person to fly?

So how were they allowed to travel with a positive test? That being said it's an inevitable fact that this variant would spread, for the region it's especially bad given the uncertainty involved with international travel.
 
Caymanair
Posts: 541
Joined: Mon Apr 05, 2004 4:53 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Mon Dec 13, 2021 9:02 pm

baje427 wrote:
maverick4002 wrote:
So looks like Trinidad got its first Omicron case. The chatter so far seems to indicate the person had a POSITIVE PCR test when they boarded the Copa Airlines flight at JFK (connecting in Panama City) and were found out at Piarco immigration. If true, what can be done here? Why would Copa allow a positive person to fly?

So how were they allowed to travel with a positive test? That being said it's an inevitable fact that this variant would spread, for the region it's especially bad given the uncertainty involved with international travel.


They and their travel companions should go to prison. The airline should be fined through their backside.

The disregard you have to have for others to get a positive result and still go to airport and board a flight is astounding.
 
caribbean484
Posts: 1041
Joined: Sat Jan 06, 2007 1:57 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Dec 14, 2021 2:03 am

Caymanair wrote:
baje427 wrote:
maverick4002 wrote:
So looks like Trinidad got its first Omicron case. The chatter so far seems to indicate the person had a POSITIVE PCR test when they boarded the Copa Airlines flight at JFK (connecting in Panama City) and were found out at Piarco immigration. If true, what can be done here? Why would Copa allow a positive person to fly?

So how were they allowed to travel with a positive test? That being said it's an inevitable fact that this variant would spread, for the region it's especially bad given the uncertainty involved with international travel.


They and their travel companions should go to prison. The airline should be fined through their backside.

The disregard you have to have for others to get a positive result and still go to the airport and board a flight is astounding.


From the information that was shared, the person traveled JFK-PTY-POS. The person first traveled to PTY with a positive test and since Panama only requires you to be vaccinated she was not checked when transferring to POS. The traveler also had an antigen test that is not accepted in POS so Immigration caught up with her and sent her to quarantine, along with those 2 rows before and after her.

It was really stupid of this person to do such a thing and knew she was COVID positive, and as such should be charged and COPA fined for this recklessness.
 
caribbean484
Posts: 1041
Joined: Sat Jan 06, 2007 1:57 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Dec 14, 2021 2:19 am

baje427 wrote:
DOM welcomed their first direct flight from the US today with American Eagle out of MIA.


Welcome to DOM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2BS88Zkj-k

A shift of their DOM-SJU into MIA.

aa1818 wrote:
CAL's 2nd Max8 9Y-GUY has arrived in POS.


Heard it may start POS-MIA first or GEO-JFK depending on the heavy loads on the first week of January. Also, BW seems to be recalling some people laid off as demand is returning.
 
Brickell305
Posts: 1655
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 2:07 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Dec 14, 2021 3:07 am

caribbean484 wrote:
Caymanair wrote:
baje427 wrote:
So how were they allowed to travel with a positive test? That being said it's an inevitable fact that this variant would spread, for the region it's especially bad given the uncertainty involved with international travel.


They and their travel companions should go to prison. The airline should be fined through their backside.

The disregard you have to have for others to get a positive result and still go to the airport and board a flight is astounding.


From the information that was shared, the person traveled JFK-PTY-POS. The person first traveled to PTY with a positive test and since Panama only requires you to be vaccinated she was not checked when transferring to POS. The traveler also had an antigen test that is not accepted in POS so Immigration caught up with her and sent her to quarantine, along with those 2 rows before and after her.

It was really stupid of this person to do such a thing and knew she was COVID positive, and as such should be charged and COPA fined for this recklessness.

Re COPA being fined, is the airline required to review the test results for travel to Trinidad or are they just required to ensure that the customer has a TT Travel Pass (the health form you get once you upload your COVID documentation to the GoRTT)? Anecdotally, I've heard that people have only had to show the TT Travel Pass. If that's officially the case, then isn't the real issue that the passenger should never have been able to obtain the Pass in the first place? And how were they able to get one with a positive test?
 
trini81
Posts: 49
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2018 8:26 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Dec 14, 2021 2:11 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
caribbean484 wrote:
Caymanair wrote:

They and their travel companions should go to prison. The airline should be fined through their backside.

The disregard you have to have for others to get a positive result and still go to the airport and board a flight is astounding.


From the information that was shared, the person traveled JFK-PTY-POS. The person first traveled to PTY with a positive test and since Panama only requires you to be vaccinated she was not checked when transferring to POS. The traveler also had an antigen test that is not accepted in POS so Immigration caught up with her and sent her to quarantine, along with those 2 rows before and after her.

It was really stupid of this person to do such a thing and knew she was COVID positive, and as such should be charged and COPA fined for this recklessness.

Re COPA being fined, is the airline required to review the test results for travel to Trinidad or are they just required to ensure that the customer has a TT Travel Pass (the health form you get once you upload your COVID documentation to the GoRTT)? Anecdotally, I've heard that people have only had to show the TT Travel Pass. If that's officially the case, then isn't the real issue that the passenger should never have been able to obtain the Pass in the first place? And how were they able to get one with a positive test?


I believe the issue is the TT Travel pass doesnt verify your negative result/answer. At check in, the agent is suppose to verify your result is negative and vaccination status.
 
caribbean484
Posts: 1041
Joined: Sat Jan 06, 2007 1:57 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Dec 14, 2021 2:26 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
caribbean484 wrote:
Caymanair wrote:

They and their travel companions should go to prison. The airline should be fined through their backside.

The disregard you have to have for others to get a positive result and still go to the airport and board a flight is astounding.


From the information that was shared, the person traveled JFK-PTY-POS. The person first traveled to PTY with a positive test and since Panama only requires you to be vaccinated she was not checked when transferring to POS. The traveler also had an antigen test that is not accepted in POS so Immigration caught up with her and sent her to quarantine, along with those 2 rows before and after her.

It was really stupid of this person to do such a thing and knew she was COVID positive, and as such should be charged and COPA fined for this recklessness.

Re COPA being fined, is the airline required to review the test results for travel to Trinidad or are they just required to ensure that the customer has a TT Travel Pass (the health form you get once you upload your COVID documentation to the GoRTT)? Anecdotally, I've heard that people have only had to show the TT Travel Pass. If that's officially the case, then isn't the real issue that the passenger should never have been able to obtain the Pass in the first place? And how were they able to get one with a positive test?


The airline is required to verify that the pax has a negative COVID PCR test; the travelpass is just an automated app to upload documents and answer truthfully questions about symptoms and travel history.
The reporting says passenger will be charged for uploading false information and the airline sanctioned.
https://guardian.co.tt/news/minister-sy ... 8cd7b0ba55
 
fowlr29
Posts: 92
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2020 1:29 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Dec 14, 2021 4:42 pm

Winair receives an additional $1.5 million USD mortgage loan from the Dutch government.

Also GDS has SKB flights restarting twice a week, starting on the 21st of December leaving SXM at 8:35am and SKB at 9:20am. Flights operate 2x a week until 3rd week of January when freq goes up to 5x a week.
 
trini81
Posts: 49
Joined: Tue Sep 04, 2018 8:26 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Dec 15, 2021 9:18 pm

CARIBBEAN AIRLINES INCREASES FLIGHTS BETWEEN TRINIDAD AND BARBADOS


From December 17, Caribbean Airlines will offer increased flights between Trinidad and Barbados.



The additional services will see flights operating to/from Barbados on Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday and Friday. The additional and existing flights together, mean that there is now daily service out of Trinidad to Barbados and six (6) weekly return flights to Trinidad.

https://www.caribbean-airlines.com/#/ca ... a-releases
 
caribny
Posts: 858
Joined: Sat Mar 16, 2019 1:47 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Dec 15, 2021 11:54 pm

caribbean484 wrote:
Caymanair wrote:
baje427 wrote:
So how were they allowed to travel with a positive test? That being said it's an inevitable fact that this variant would spread, for the region it's especially bad given the uncertainty involved with international travel.


They and their travel companions should go to prison. The airline should be fined through their backside.

The disregard you have to have for others to get a positive result and still go to the airport and board a flight is astounding.


From the information that was shared, the person traveled JFK-PTY-POS. The person first traveled to PTY with a positive test and since Panama only requires you to be vaccinated she was not checked when transferring to POS. The traveler also had an antigen test that is not accepted in POS so Immigration caught up with her and sent her to quarantine, along with those 2 rows before and after her.

It was really stupid of this person to do such a thing and knew she was COVID positive, and as such should be charged and COPA fined for this recklessness.



Question. Do those in the 4 surrounding rows have to pay for quarantine? Bad enough that they lose 14 days of their lives. They should sue this passenger for damages if that person's arrogance resulted in this. A positive test should lead such a person to cancel their trip with cause and then self quarantine.

I also thought that the last destination on a trip should determine the travel protocols so unless the passenger stopped off at POS instead of being intransit their boarding protocol's should have been that of POS.
 
caribny
Posts: 858
Joined: Sat Mar 16, 2019 1:47 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Dec 15, 2021 11:58 pm

fowlr29 wrote:
Winair receives an additional $1.5 million USD mortgage loan from the Dutch government.

Also GDS has SKB flights restarting twice a week, starting on the 21st of December leaving SXM at 8:35am and SKB at 9:20am. Flights operate 2x a week until 3rd week of January when freq goes up to 5x a week.



I was wondering when those services would restart. Now someone has to take LI via EIS with only 1x weekly available. With no quarantine for vaccinated passengers travel should resume. The Jamaicans in SKB need this service to return home with connections to BW at SXM. WM used to coordinate their schedules with BW so there must be a good few using this service.
 
fowlr29
Posts: 92
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2020 1:29 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Dec 16, 2021 1:14 am

A Helidosa G4, HI1050 has uncomfortably crashed in Santo Domingo. Aircraft was apparently headed up to Florida.
 
embraer175e2
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:47 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Dec 16, 2021 1:08 pm

fowlr29 wrote:
Winair receives an additional $1.5 million USD mortgage loan from the Dutch government.

Also GDS has SKB flights restarting twice a week, starting on the 21st of December leaving SXM at 8:35am and SKB at 9:20am. Flights operate 2x a week until 3rd week of January when freq goes up to 5x a week.


Did the dutch government change their mind?

Because they said no first.
 
User avatar
novarupta
Posts: 123
Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2006 10:32 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Dec 16, 2021 1:21 pm

embraer175e2 wrote:
fowlr29 wrote:
Winair receives an additional $1.5 million USD mortgage loan from the Dutch government.

Also GDS has SKB flights restarting twice a week, starting on the 21st of December leaving SXM at 8:35am and SKB at 9:20am. Flights operate 2x a week until 3rd week of January when freq goes up to 5x a week.


Did the dutch government change their mind?

Because they said no first.

I don’t recall them saying no, but rather “hold on for further evaluation of the situation, terms of repayment et E” (to make a long story short)
 
caribbean484
Posts: 1041
Joined: Sat Jan 06, 2007 1:57 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Dec 16, 2021 2:29 pm

caribny wrote:
caribbean484 wrote:
Caymanair wrote:

They and their travel companions should go to prison. The airline should be fined through their backside.

The disregard you have to have for others to get a positive result and still go to the airport and board a flight is astounding.


From the information that was shared, the person traveled JFK-PTY-POS. The person first traveled to PTY with a positive test and since Panama only requires you to be vaccinated she was not checked when transferring to POS. The traveler also had an antigen test that is not accepted in POS so Immigration caught up with her and sent her to quarantine, along with those 2 rows before and after her.

It was really stupid of this person to do such a thing and knew she was COVID positive, and as such should be charged and COPA fined for this recklessness.



Question. Do those in the 4 surrounding rows have to pay for quarantine? Bad enough that they lose 14 days of their lives. They should sue this passenger for damages if that person's arrogance resulted in this. A positive test should lead such a person to cancel their trip with cause and then self quarantine.

I also thought that the last destination on a trip should determine the travel protocols so unless the passenger stopped off at POS instead of being intransit their boarding protocol's should have been that of POS.


Not sure if they have to pay out of pocket, but they should not and the state should compensate them since it is no fault of theirs.
I also thought that the last connecting trip determines protocols just as Visa restricted country travel on in-transit flights.

windian425 wrote:
wadadli wrote:
windian425 wrote:
https://barbadostoday.bb/2021/12/05/barbados-welcomes-three-inaugural-flights/
Barbadostoday Article on the 3 inaugural flights to BGI today!
Next up is JY service to GEO with their E145's..


Really challenging time for new route starts. Despite the RCCL homeport coinciding with the launch of UA, the LF's were in the 30's. VS inaugural EDI LF was also in the mid 30's. I am confident those numbers will pick up soon though.

Definitely hope these numbers pick up quickly, 30% LF is not sustainable.


Question have loads picked up yet on these routes?

trini81 wrote:
CARIBBEAN AIRLINES INCREASES FLIGHTS BETWEEN TRINIDAD AND BARBADOS


From December 17, Caribbean Airlines will offer increased flights between Trinidad and Barbados.



The additional services will see flights operating to/from Barbados on Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday and Friday. The additional and existing flights together, mean that there is now daily service out of Trinidad to Barbados and six (6) weekly return flights to Trinidad.

https://www.caribbean-airlines.com/#/ca ... a-releases


Still a way from the 21-28 weekly flights between both countries but loads have been improving significantly in the past few months. Hopefully they will reintroduce the daily 738 soon instead of the current ATR only services.
 
baje427
Posts: 1023
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2011 12:42 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Dec 16, 2021 3:48 pm

caribbean484 wrote:
caribny wrote:
caribbean484 wrote:

From the information that was shared, the person traveled JFK-PTY-POS. The person first traveled to PTY with a positive test and since Panama only requires you to be vaccinated she was not checked when transferring to POS. The traveler also had an antigen test that is not accepted in POS so Immigration caught up with her and sent her to quarantine, along with those 2 rows before and after her.

It was really stupid of this person to do such a thing and knew she was COVID positive, and as such should be charged and COPA fined for this recklessness.



Question. Do those in the 4 surrounding rows have to pay for quarantine? Bad enough that they lose 14 days of their lives. They should sue this passenger for damages if that person's arrogance resulted in this. A positive test should lead such a person to cancel their trip with cause and then self quarantine.

I also thought that the last destination on a trip should determine the travel protocols so unless the passenger stopped off at POS instead of being intransit their boarding protocol's should have been that of POS.


Not sure if they have to pay out of pocket, but they should not and the state should compensate them since it is no fault of theirs.
I also thought that the last connecting trip determines protocols just as Visa restricted country travel on in-transit flights.

windian425 wrote:
wadadli wrote:

Really challenging time for new route starts. Despite the RCCL homeport coinciding with the launch of UA, the LF's were in the 30's. VS inaugural EDI LF was also in the mid 30's. I am confident those numbers will pick up soon though.

Definitely hope these numbers pick up quickly, 30% LF is not sustainable.


Question have loads picked up yet on these routes?

trini81 wrote:
CARIBBEAN AIRLINES INCREASES FLIGHTS BETWEEN TRINIDAD AND BARBADOS


From December 17, Caribbean Airlines will offer increased flights between Trinidad and Barbados.



The additional services will see flights operating to/from Barbados on Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday and Friday. The additional and existing flights together, mean that there is now daily service out of Trinidad to Barbados and six (6) weekly return flights to Trinidad.

https://www.caribbean-airlines.com/#/ca ... a-releases


Still a way from the 21-28 weekly flights between both countries but loads have been improving significantly in the past few months. Hopefully they will reintroduce the daily 738 soon instead of the current ATR only services.

With fetes and parties now being allowed in Bim things might pick up a bit more.
 
embraer175e2
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:47 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Dec 16, 2021 7:49 pm

novarupta wrote:
embraer175e2 wrote:
fowlr29 wrote:
Winair receives an additional $1.5 million USD mortgage loan from the Dutch government.

Also GDS has SKB flights restarting twice a week, starting on the 21st of December leaving SXM at 8:35am and SKB at 9:20am. Flights operate 2x a week until 3rd week of January when freq goes up to 5x a week.


Did the dutch government change their mind?

Because they said no first.

I don’t recall them saying no, but rather “hold on for further evaluation of the situation, terms of repayment et E” (to make a long story short)


Novarupta, the dutch government is selling its shares in winair on long term.
Means in the future, they wont keep up giving winair loans to survive. (Current loans 4.5million usd)

https://www.thedailyherald.sx/islands/d ... for-winair
 
fowlr29
Posts: 92
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2020 1:29 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Dec 16, 2021 10:20 pm

embraer175e2 wrote:
novarupta wrote:
embraer175e2 wrote:

Did the dutch government change their mind?

Because they said no first.

I don’t recall them saying no, but rather “hold on for further evaluation of the situation, terms of repayment et E” (to make a long story short)


Novarupta, the dutch government is selling its shares in winair on long term.
Means in the future, they wont keep up giving winair loans to survive. (Current loans 4.5million usd)

https://www.thedailyherald.sx/islands/d ... for-winair


Comments made by a current Dutch politician who in her address also said they wanted to move towards electric and hybrid flying within the Dutch Caribbean. I wouldn't take her statement seriously. Winair is the only way the Dutch can safegaurd connection to Saba and Statia. The ferry, which has received 2.5 million USD for a two year pilot program would have been much better served being given as a subsidy for Winair to operate those routes. Even so because the ferry isn't a Dutch company, it's based out of Anguilla, and has been yet to launch their operation.

The Dutch government were talking about making Saba and Statia a PSO, and hence providing the subsidy, but nothing has come of this as yet.

Glad to see frequency returning to BGI from POS. Any news on when the MAX'S first revenue flight would be?
 
maverick4002
Posts: 541
Joined: Sun Jul 12, 2015 2:14 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Dec 16, 2021 10:59 pm

https://www.cnc3.co.tt/united-returns-t ... tuesday-2/

Pretty good information re: POS in this article. Looks like United resumes Houston 12/16, West Jet starts Toronto on 12/17, Jetblue starts FLL 12/21.

Interesting is that it looks like KLM will continue Port of Spain year round, as opposed to being a winter only service. From the summer schedule the flight will be paired with SXM. Likely seeing nice demand.
 
embraer175e2
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:47 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Dec 17, 2021 12:03 am

fowlr29 wrote:
embraer175e2 wrote:
novarupta wrote:
I don’t recall them saying no, but rather “hold on for further evaluation of the situation, terms of repayment et E” (to make a long story short)


Novarupta, the dutch government is selling its shares in winair on long term.
Means in the future, they wont keep up giving winair loans to survive. (Current loans 4.5million usd)

https://www.thedailyherald.sx/islands/d ... for-winair


Comments made by a current Dutch politician who in her address also said they wanted to move towards electric and hybrid flying within the Dutch Caribbean. I wouldn't take her statement seriously. Winair is the only way the Dutch can safegaurd connection to Saba and Statia. The ferry, which has received 2.5 million USD for a two year pilot program would have been much better served being given as a subsidy for Winair to operate those routes. Even so because the ferry isn't a Dutch company, it's based out of Anguilla, and has been yet to launch their operation.

The Dutch government were talking about making Saba and Statia a PSO, and hence providing the subsidy, but nothing has come of this as yet.

Glad to see frequency returning to BGI from POS. Any news on when the MAX'S first revenue flight would be?


The Dutch said they have found a solution for if Winair cannot operate anymore due to bankrupcy. Why not take them seriously?
 
fowlr29
Posts: 92
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2020 1:29 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Dec 17, 2021 1:49 am

embraer175e2 wrote:
fowlr29 wrote:
embraer175e2 wrote:

Novarupta, the dutch government is selling its shares in winair on long term.
Means in the future, they wont keep up giving winair loans to survive. (Current loans 4.5million usd)

https://www.thedailyherald.sx/islands/d ... for-winair


Comments made by a current Dutch politician who in her address also said they wanted to move towards electric and hybrid flying within the Dutch Caribbean. I wouldn't take her statement seriously. Winair is the only way the Dutch can safegaurd connection to Saba and Statia. The ferry, which has received 2.5 million USD for a two year pilot program would have been much better served being given as a subsidy for Winair to operate those routes. Even so because the ferry isn't a Dutch company, it's based out of Anguilla, and has been yet to launch their operation.

The Dutch government were talking about making Saba and Statia a PSO, and hence providing the subsidy, but nothing has come of this as yet.

Glad to see frequency returning to BGI from POS. Any news on when the MAX'S first revenue flight would be?


The Dutch said they have found a solution for if Winair cannot operate anymore due to bankrupcy. Why not take them seriously?


Because what politicans say in Holland is sometimes completely different to the facts in the Antilles. There is nobody else who can operate the service. Literally nobody. Winair is the only one who can operate the DHC6 into SAB as they have been given grandfather rights to operate the type into there. The aircraft on paper doesn't have the performance to land there, but because they have been for so long, they are allowed. If another operator wants to operate the type into there, they will not get approval. There's also no other airline in SXM that has a scheduled AOC, nor will another scheduled AOC be granted at this time. Winair is the only, and will be the only scheduled carrier in SXM for the foreseeable future.

The only "solution" they could possibly have is a ferry, and I can assure you that an hour and half on that ferry in any day of the week when the water isn't completely calm and you'll be sick. Doubt tourists want to leave the airport, get a taxi, and get on an hour and half vomit inducing boat ride either. Day trips to Saba/Sint Maarten would also no longer be possible with the ferry.

The only way to get from one end of the Dutch Caribbean on one ticket is Winair. There's no other way to get from Bonaire to Saba, from Aruba to Statia etc.

Winair isn't going bankrupt, that I can assure you. The politicians are doing what they do best, politicking
 
Brickell305
Posts: 1655
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 2:07 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Dec 17, 2021 2:47 am

maverick4002 wrote:
https://www.cnc3.co.tt/united-returns-to-tt-today-jetblue-to-resume-fort-lauderdale-flights-next-tuesday-2/

Pretty good information re: POS in this article. Looks like United resumes Houston 12/16, West Jet starts Toronto on 12/17, Jetblue starts FLL 12/21.

Interesting is that it looks like KLM will continue Port of Spain year round, as opposed to being a winter only service. From the summer schedule the flight will be paired with SXM. Likely seeing nice demand.

The year round for KLM makes sense. Trinidad isn’t a leisure destination in the traditional sense the way BGI is and as such, I’m sure a lot of the demand for the POS leg of the flight originated in Trinidad. No real reason for it to be winter seasonal. BGI as a winter seasonal makes sense.

Also somewhat surprising that B6 is daily ex FLL to POS for the holiday period but only 4x weekly out of JFK. I expected especially for Christmas when the traffic mix becomes heavily VFR, that New York would see more demand than So. Florida.
 
caribny
Posts: 858
Joined: Sat Mar 16, 2019 1:47 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Dec 17, 2021 5:37 am

Brickell305 wrote:
maverick4002 wrote:
https://www.cnc3.co.tt/united-returns-to-tt-today-jetblue-to-resume-fort-lauderdale-flights-next-tuesday-2/

Pretty good information re: POS in this article. Looks like United resumes Houston 12/16, West Jet starts Toronto on 12/17, Jetblue starts FLL 12/21.

Interesting is that it looks like KLM will continue Port of Spain year round, as opposed to being a winter only service. From the summer schedule the flight will be paired with SXM. Likely seeing nice demand.

The year round for KLM makes sense. Trinidad isn’t a leisure destination in the traditional sense the way BGI is and as such, I’m sure a lot of the demand for the POS leg of the flight originated in Trinidad. No real reason for it to be winter seasonal. BGI as a winter seasonal makes sense.

Also somewhat surprising that B6 is daily ex FLL to POS for the holiday period but only 4x weekly out of JFK. I expected especially for Christmas when the traffic mix becomes heavily VFR, that New York would see more demand than So. Florida.



Frequencies from JFK POS are low given that travel was closed for almost 1 1/2 years. Maybe TT folks in NYC no longer want to see their relatives back home. That doesnt augur well for BW as they do better on the JFK POS than on the SoFL POS.

I assume that KL will pair SXM with POS instead of CUR, opening up more seats for the latter as I assume more nonstops from AMS to replace this.
 
User avatar
novarupta
Posts: 123
Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2006 10:32 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Dec 17, 2021 11:24 am

embraer175e2 wrote:
fowlr29 wrote:
embraer175e2 wrote:

Novarupta, the dutch government is selling its shares in winair on long term.
Means in the future, they wont keep up giving winair loans to survive. (Current loans 4.5million usd)

https://www.thedailyherald.sx/islands/d ... for-winair


Comments made by a current Dutch politician who in her address also said they wanted to move towards electric and hybrid flying within the Dutch Caribbean. I wouldn't take her statement seriously. Winair is the only way the Dutch can safegaurd connection to Saba and Statia. The ferry, which has received 2.5 million USD for a two year pilot program would have been much better served being given as a subsidy for Winair to operate those routes. Even so because the ferry isn't a Dutch company, it's based out of Anguilla, and has been yet to launch their operation.

The Dutch government were talking about making Saba and Statia a PSO, and hence providing the subsidy, but nothing has come of this as yet.

Glad to see frequency returning to BGI from POS. Any news on when the MAX'S first revenue flight would be?


The Dutch said they have found a solution for if Winair cannot operate anymore due to bankrupcy. Why not take them seriously?

Newsflash - those politicians have been saying that (among other things) since the mid-90s…..nothing new in that regard.
 
embraer175e2
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:47 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Dec 17, 2021 3:25 pm

fowlr29 wrote:
embraer175e2 wrote:
fowlr29 wrote:

Comments made by a current Dutch politician who in her address also said they wanted to move towards electric and hybrid flying within the Dutch Caribbean. I wouldn't take her statement seriously. Winair is the only way the Dutch can safegaurd connection to Saba and Statia. The ferry, which has received 2.5 million USD for a two year pilot program would have been much better served being given as a subsidy for Winair to operate those routes. Even so because the ferry isn't a Dutch company, it's based out of Anguilla, and has been yet to launch their operation.

The Dutch government were talking about making Saba and Statia a PSO, and hence providing the subsidy, but nothing has come of this as yet.

Glad to see frequency returning to BGI from POS. Any news on when the MAX'S first revenue flight would be?


The Dutch said they have found a solution for if Winair cannot operate anymore due to bankrupcy. Why not take them seriously?


Because what politicans say in Holland is sometimes completely different to the facts in the Antilles. There is nobody else who can operate the service. Literally nobody. Winair is the only one who can operate the DHC6 into SAB as they have been given grandfather rights to operate the type into there. The aircraft on paper doesn't have the performance to land there, but because they have been for so long, they are allowed. If another operator wants to operate the type into there, they will not get approval. There's also no other airline in SXM that has a scheduled AOC, nor will another scheduled AOC be granted at this time. Winair is the only, and will be the only scheduled carrier in SXM for the foreseeable future.

The only "solution" they could possibly have is a ferry, and I can assure you that an hour and half on that ferry in any day of the week when the water isn't completely calm and you'll be sick. Doubt tourists want to leave the airport, get a taxi, and get on an hour and half vomit inducing boat ride either. Day trips to Saba/Sint Maarten would also no longer be possible with the ferry.

The only way to get from one end of the Dutch Caribbean on one ticket is Winair. There's no other way to get from Bonaire to Saba, from Aruba to Statia etc.

Winair isn't going bankrupt, that I can assure you. The politicians are doing what they do best, politicking


What about a helicopter taxi service ta SABA?
IF winair goes bankrupt. Solution?
 
embraer175e2
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:47 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Dec 17, 2021 7:16 pm

 
embraer175e2
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:47 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat Dec 18, 2021 12:55 pm

Cayman islands celebrating resumption of the jfk route with their new max8.

https://www.facebook.com/88792229424/po ... 977839425/
 
embraer175e2
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:47 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat Dec 18, 2021 7:24 pm

French bee and air caraibes taking delivery of a350-1000

https://www.facebook.com/21122998557602 ... 598388005/
 
embraer175e2
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:47 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat Dec 18, 2021 7:32 pm

novarupta wrote:
embraer175e2 wrote:
fowlr29 wrote:

Comments made by a current Dutch politician who in her address also said they wanted to move towards electric and hybrid flying within the Dutch Caribbean. I wouldn't take her statement seriously. Winair is the only way the Dutch can safegaurd connection to Saba and Statia. The ferry, which has received 2.5 million USD for a two year pilot program would have been much better served being given as a subsidy for Winair to operate those routes. Even so because the ferry isn't a Dutch company, it's based out of Anguilla, and has been yet to launch their operation.

The Dutch government were talking about making Saba and Statia a PSO, and hence providing the subsidy, but nothing has come of this as yet.

Glad to see frequency returning to BGI from POS. Any news on when the MAX'S first revenue flight would be?


The Dutch said they have found a solution for if Winair cannot operate anymore due to bankrupcy. Why not take them seriously?

Newsflash - those politicians have been saying that (among other things) since the mid-90s…..nothing new in that regard.


So you think winair can keep surviving this pandemic ( we dont know for how long this pandemic will last) without external help ?
 
fowlr29
Posts: 92
Joined: Sat Jun 27, 2020 1:29 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat Dec 18, 2021 8:32 pm

embraer175e2 wrote:
novarupta wrote:
embraer175e2 wrote:

The Dutch said they have found a solution for if Winair cannot operate anymore due to bankrupcy. Why not take them seriously?

Newsflash - those politicians have been saying that (among other things) since the mid-90s…..nothing new in that regard.


So you think winair can keep surviving this pandemic ( we dont know for how long this pandemic will last) without external help ?


Yes. Without the external help earlier this year with the 3 million USD? Who knows for sure, but the company would have had to downsize significantly.

Winair will always exist unless for some existential reason people no longer want to travel to St. Barths. Even during the height of the pandemic, tourists were still going to St. Barths, not in the numbers they are now, but they were still going. Annual passenger numbers to St. Barths are well over 60,000, with margins I imagine being extremely high. The company charges double the ticket cost for St. Barths than it does for Saba and Statia, not including charters etc.

Anyway, enough on this topic. The company isn't going bankrupt, and I'm also not sure why the Dutch are complaining about having to give money to Winair. The money isn't free. It's a mortgage that is being paid back. The Dutch are making money off of the loan...

Any news on how LIAT is doing these days? Being very quiet recently. Are the ATRs still sat down in ANU, or have those that aren't being used been returned?
 
Brickell305
Posts: 1655
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2017 2:07 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat Dec 18, 2021 8:37 pm

fowlr29 wrote:
embraer175e2 wrote:
novarupta wrote:
Newsflash - those politicians have been saying that (among other things) since the mid-90s…..nothing new in that regard.


So you think winair can keep surviving this pandemic ( we dont know for how long this pandemic will last) without external help ?


Yes. Without the external help earlier this year with the 3 million USD? Who knows for sure, but the company would have had to downsize significantly.

Winair will always exist unless for some existential reason people no longer want to travel to St. Barths. Even during the height of the pandemic, tourists were still going to St. Barths, not in the numbers they are now, but they were still going. Annual passenger numbers to St. Barths are well over 60,000, with margins I imagine being extremely high. The company charges double the ticket cost for St. Barths than it does for Saba and Statia, not including charters etc.

Anyway, enough on this topic. The company isn't going bankrupt, and I'm also not sure why the Dutch are complaining about having to give money to Winair. The money isn't free. It's a mortgage that is being paid back. The Dutch are making money off of the loan...

Any news on how LIAT is doing these days? Being very quiet recently. Are the ATRs still sat down in ANU, or have those that aren't being used been returned?

Agreed. SBH is a golden goose for WM. As long as there is demand for it, WM will survive even if it means downsizing just to that one route.
 
User avatar
novarupta
Posts: 123
Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2006 10:32 am

Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat Dec 18, 2021 9:41 pm

fowlr29 wrote:
embraer175e2 wrote:
novarupta wrote:
Newsflash - those politicians have been saying that (among other things) since the mid-90s…..nothing new in that regard.


So you think winair can keep surviving this pandemic ( we dont know for how long this pandemic will last) without external help ?


Yes. Without the external help earlier this year with the 3 million USD? Who knows for sure, but the company would have had to downsize significantly.

Winair will always exist unless for some existential reason people no longer want to travel to St. Barths. Even during the height of the pandemic, tourists were still going to St. Barths, not in the numbers they are now, but they were still going. Annual passenger numbers to St. Barths are well over 60,000, with margins I imagine being extremely high. The company charges double the ticket cost for St. Barths than it does for Saba and Statia, not including charters etc.

Anyway, enough on this topic. The company isn't going bankrupt, and I'm also not sure why the Dutch are complaining about having to give money to Winair. The money isn't free. It's a mortgage that is being paid back. The Dutch are making money off of the loan...

Any news on how LIAT is doing these days? Being very quiet recently. Are the ATRs still sat down in ANU, or have those that aren't being used been returned?

LIAT is pretty much still treading water - a lot of uncertainty and legal wranglings still abound. Currently they have three ATR42s (two active, one undergoing heavy check) on premises, all others in Canada with the lessor.
 
User avatar
novarupta
Posts: 123
Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2006 10:32 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat Dec 18, 2021 9:46 pm

embraer175e2 wrote:
novarupta wrote:
embraer175e2 wrote:

The Dutch said they have found a solution for if Winair cannot operate anymore due to bankrupcy. Why not take them seriously?

Newsflash - those politicians have been saying that (among other things) since the mid-90s…..nothing new in that regard.


So you think winair can keep surviving this pandemic ( we dont know for how long this pandemic will last) without external help ?

If you look around - there is not a single air carrier who hasn’t been struggling to some degree from the pandemic - traffic has begun to pick back up so they’ll be fine. It’s not Winair’a first rodeo, won’t be their last.
 
gunnerman
Posts: 1281
Joined: Fri May 19, 2017 7:55 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun Dec 19, 2021 6:43 pm

interCaribbean Airways (JY) launched its inaugural BGI-GEO flights on 17 December using the 50-seat E145. Flights are daily on Wednesdays and Saturdays and double-daily on the other days of the week. The ground handling agent at GEO is Roraima. The airline says it plans to train Guyanese cabin crew and open an office in Georgetown.

The only other scheduled flights between the two countries is BW with BGI-OGL five times a week using the ATR72.
 
embraer175e2
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:47 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun Dec 19, 2021 7:21 pm

Southwest soon resuming Aruba Orlando flights.

https://www.facebook.com/10150312484370 ... 103570001/
 
embraer175e2
Posts: 491
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 12:47 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun Dec 19, 2021 7:26 pm

gunnerman wrote:
interCaribbean Airways (JY) launched its inaugural BGI-GEO flights on 17 December using the 50-seat E145. Flights are daily on Wednesdays and Saturdays and double-daily on the other days of the week. The ground handling agent at GEO is Roraima. The airline says it plans to train Guyanese cabin crew and open an office in Georgetown.

The only other scheduled flights between the two countries is BW with BGI-OGL five times a week using the ATR72.


In terms of flight time the Embraer beats the ATR on this route.
 
windian425
Posts: 328
Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:22 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun Dec 19, 2021 7:41 pm

gunnerman wrote:
interCaribbean Airways (JY) launched its inaugural BGI-GEO flights on 17 December using the 50-seat E145. Flights are daily on Wednesdays and Saturdays and double-daily on the other days of the week. The ground handling agent at GEO is Roraima. The airline says it plans to train Guyanese cabin crew and open an office in Georgetown.

The only other scheduled flights between the two countries is BW with BGI-OGL five times a week using the ATR72.


https://www.linkedin.com/feed/update/ur ... 874092032/
BTMI Post on inaugural JY flights to BGI.
 
baje427
Posts: 1023
Joined: Mon Aug 01, 2011 12:42 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun Dec 19, 2021 9:09 pm

embraer175e2 wrote:
gunnerman wrote:
interCaribbean Airways (JY) launched its inaugural BGI-GEO flights on 17 December using the 50-seat E145. Flights are daily on Wednesdays and Saturdays and double-daily on the other days of the week. The ground handling agent at GEO is Roraima. The airline says it plans to train Guyanese cabin crew and open an office in Georgetown.

The only other scheduled flights between the two countries is BW with BGI-OGL five times a week using the ATR72.


In terms of flight time the Embraer beats the ATR on this route.

However OGL is more convenient for most customers.
 
LimaFoxTango
Posts: 1065
Joined: Wed Jun 16, 2004 11:33 pm

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun Dec 19, 2021 9:59 pm

embraer175e2 wrote:
gunnerman wrote:
interCaribbean Airways (JY) launched its inaugural BGI-GEO flights on 17 December using the 50-seat E145. Flights are daily on Wednesdays and Saturdays and double-daily on the other days of the week. The ground handling agent at GEO is Roraima. The airline says it plans to train Guyanese cabin crew and open an office in Georgetown.

The only other scheduled flights between the two countries is BW with BGI-OGL five times a week using the ATR72.


In terms of flight time the Embraer beats the ATR on this route.


The time gained by the E145 is now lost having to drive 45 mins from GEO to Georgetown.
 
windian425
Posts: 328
Joined: Sat Dec 30, 2006 9:22 am

Re: Caribbean Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun Dec 19, 2021 11:20 pm

LimaFoxTango wrote:
embraer175e2 wrote:
gunnerman wrote:
interCaribbean Airways (JY) launched its inaugural BGI-GEO flights on 17 December using the 50-seat E145. Flights are daily on Wednesdays and Saturdays and double-daily on the other days of the week. The ground handling agent at GEO is Roraima. The airline says it plans to train Guyanese cabin crew and open an office in Georgetown.

The only other scheduled flights between the two countries is BW with BGI-OGL five times a week using the ATR72.


In terms of flight time the Embraer beats the ATR on this route.


The time gained by the E145 is now lost having to drive 45 mins from GEO to Georgetown.

Better option for JY would have been the E120's into OGL twice daily like how LI did it.

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