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ChrisPBacon
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 30, 2021 4:42 pm

DeltaRules wrote:
What specific career fields are we searching? They're looking for cargo agents at CMH, for example, but I don't know if that's for below-wing work for existing airlines or a harbinger of things to come (and doesn't indicate if CSR positions already exist and have been filled, aren't being sought, etc.).


I've also found a General Manager posting for a "confidential" employer at CMH.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 30, 2021 5:05 pm

FLYBY72 wrote:
Well, guess we can cross an April start off the list....

LoL. I obsessively check this thread to see if the AOC has been issued.

On another topic:
I assume October is still 1st A220 delivery. I look forward to that, but it is a long time until 4Q2021.
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/1-breeze ... 28593.html

Lightsaber
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nine4nine
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 30, 2021 6:59 pm

seat1a wrote:
Does Wilmington fit into Breeze's criteria? Curious if ILG-LAX/SFO/LAS would be viable. Just a thought.


LAX/SFO/LAS would not fit their stated “secondary to secondary markets.
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DeltaRules
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 30, 2021 8:28 pm

ChrisPBacon wrote:
DeltaRules wrote:
What specific career fields are we searching? They're looking for cargo agents at CMH, for example, but I don't know if that's for below-wing work for existing airlines or a harbinger of things to come (and doesn't indicate if CSR positions already exist and have been filled, aren't being sought, etc.).


I've also found a General Manager posting for a "confidential" employer at CMH.


I wonder if that's another way of saying Base/Station Manager.
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TexasAirCorp
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:08 pm

dabpit wrote:
To add some more context to the FAs just being college students.... Breeze is also hiring part-time FAs that are not college students and a number of corporate (non IT jobs) are required to maintain a FA license. This means that some full-time corporate staff will fill the gaps for flights.


Staff with little-to-no aviation experience, staff working multiple positions, low salaries, if I'm reading this all correctly, this sounds a lot like the original People Express.
 
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lesfalls
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:15 pm

TexasAirCorp wrote:
dabpit wrote:
To add some more context to the FAs just being college students.... Breeze is also hiring part-time FAs that are not college students and a number of corporate (non IT jobs) are required to maintain a FA license. This means that some full-time corporate staff will fill the gaps for flights.


Staff with little-to-no aviation experience, staff working multiple positions, low salaries, if I'm reading this all correctly, this sounds a lot like the original People Express.


Which permitted their low cost structure correct? What were the pros and cons of the following operation? Breeze being possible a copy of it from the past?
Lufthansa: Einfach ein bisschen besser.
 
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dabpit
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:29 pm

DeltaRules wrote:
ChrisPBacon wrote:
DeltaRules wrote:
What specific career fields are we searching? They're looking for cargo agents at CMH, for example, but I don't know if that's for below-wing work for existing airlines or a harbinger of things to come (and doesn't indicate if CSR positions already exist and have been filled, aren't being sought, etc.).


I've also found a General Manager posting for a "confidential" employer at CMH.


I wonder if that's another way of saying Base/Station Manager.

They will be hiring a combination of above and below wing agents and supervisors and possibly a General Manager.
Carpe Diem
 
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dabpit
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 30, 2021 9:32 pm

lesfalls wrote:
TexasAirCorp wrote:
dabpit wrote:
To add some more context to the FAs just being college students.... Breeze is also hiring part-time FAs that are not college students and a number of corporate (non IT jobs) are required to maintain a FA license. This means that some full-time corporate staff will fill the gaps for flights.


Staff with little-to-no aviation experience, staff working multiple positions, low salaries, if I'm reading this all correctly, this sounds a lot like the original People Express.


Which permitted their low cost structure correct? What were the pros and cons of the following operation? Breeze being possible a copy of it from the past?

I’d say most of the folks at Breeze have a lot of experience. Cannot speak to how much they are paid but there is nothing wrong with being cross utilized at the beginning. They have one goal right now and that is to launch a new airline which is no walk in the park.
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dabpit
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 30, 2021 10:03 pm

So I noticed that N190BZ flew from ISP-CWF (Lake Charles, LA) and N192BZ flew CWF-ISP. Is there contracted work being done in Lake Charles?
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FLALEFTY
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 30, 2021 10:27 pm

dabpit wrote:
So I noticed that N190BZ flew from ISP-CWF (Lake Charles, LA) and N192BZ flew CWF-ISP. Is there contracted work being done in Lake Charles?


AAR Corp. has a large MRO facility at CWF (and no scheduled airline service) so that would be a good assumption.

Northrup Grumman also has a MRO facility at CWF that does depot-level maintenance for the USAF's E-8C JSTARS and KC-10 Extender aircraft.
 
TexasAirCorp
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sat May 01, 2021 1:01 pm

lesfalls wrote:
TexasAirCorp wrote:
dabpit wrote:
To add some more context to the FAs just being college students.... Breeze is also hiring part-time FAs that are not college students and a number of corporate (non IT jobs) are required to maintain a FA license. This means that some full-time corporate staff will fill the gaps for flights.


Staff with little-to-no aviation experience, staff working multiple positions, low salaries, if I'm reading this all correctly, this sounds a lot like the original People Express.


Which permitted their low cost structure correct? What were the pros and cons of the following operation? Breeze being possible a copy of it from the past?


Correct. PE's labor costs were almost half what the major carrier's were at the time.

The pros were simply that it enabled PE's low cost structure, and it allowed them to expand relatively quickly and build a stronghold in the areas it served. When it first launched, PE also focused on serving secondary cities from destinations with decent leisure demand (mainly New York and smaller airports in Florida). Since its overhead costs were so low, and demand in its markets was mostly orientated by price, the majors simply couldn't compete. At that time PE was the only proper low-cost carrier on the East Coast, so it's hard to say whether another low-cost carrier could've come in and shaken things up, but if Breeze can stick to markets that aren't served by other LCCs, it may be able to replicate that PE stronghold.

What killed PE off is when they deviated from serving secondary cities and tried to serve major cities (ORD, DEN, MSP to name a few) from EWR. Considering Breeze won't (I assume) try to build a central hub, it will be kind-of hard for Breeze to go down the same path.
 
FLYBY72
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sat May 01, 2021 1:30 pm

It’s going to be hard for a breeze to go down any path unless they start selling tickets. Right now all they have done is hire people, buy planes, and update their web site with a lot of hype.

Any day now......

Also, if there are all of there lucrative secondary markets out there why isn’t Allegiant taking advantage of it? Or Spirit?
 
iAvgeek737
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sat May 01, 2021 1:55 pm

FLYBY72 wrote:
It’s going to be hard for a breeze to go down any path unless they start selling tickets. Right now all they have done is hire people, buy planes, and update their web site with a lot of hype.

Any day now......

Also, if there are all of there lucrative secondary markets out there why isn’t Allegiant taking advantage of it? Or Spirit?



many reasons. Allegiant is very much so a lesiure carrier and is mostly adds places with strong O/D. Spirit is mainly focused on the larger population base as we have seen in the past few year (CLT, BNA, STL, etc)

Breezes whole purpose is to connect places that would otherwise be served by regional jets or are just not served at all. That model doesnt fit into Spirit or Allegiants model
 
TexasAirCorp
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sat May 01, 2021 2:14 pm

FLYBY72 wrote:
It’s going to be hard for a breeze to go down any path unless they start selling tickets. Right now all they have done is hire people, buy planes, and update their web site with a lot of hype.

Any day now......

Also, if there are all of there lucrative secondary markets out there why isn’t Allegiant taking advantage of it? Or Spirit?


Spirit (and Frontier) have traditionally focused on serving main cities. It mainly competes with the legacy carriers by offering a low-cost product in high density markets. It tends to seek routes with enough demand for multiple weekly/daily frequencies, which is rarely present in the kind of markets Breeze intends to target. It also has most of its bases in major airports (DFW, ORD, DTW etc), so adjusting its focus to serve secondary cities will require quite a sizeable amount of restructuring. Spirit has a product and strategy that works, so it doesn't really make sense from them to deviate from that and compete with a tiny startup carrier.

Allegiant has only really just started going all-in on secondary cities. It's traditionally focused purely on serving small regional airports from major tourist destinations (Las Vegas, Orlando etc), however it now serves almost every possible market from these areas. It needs something new to do in order to keep expanding, and it already has the market presence in those lucrative secondary cities and smaller airports (the same ones Breeze wants to operate from), so it makes sense for them to roughly follow Breeze's network strategy. They're almost in the same position as Breeze; they're obviously further ahead operations wise, however they're also only beginning to explore lucrative secondary cities and not just tourist hotspots. In time, Allegiant and Breeze (and others) will fully take advantage of all the lucrative secondary markets they can find.

With so many carriers now trying to target secondary cities (Allegiant, Avelo, Breeze, Sun Country, plus Frontier and Southwest to a lesser extent), it also makes sense for Spirit in particular to try and stay out of them (except if there's clear demand).
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sat May 01, 2021 2:44 pm

FLYBY72 wrote:
It’s going to be hard for a breeze to go down any path unless they start selling tickets. Right now all they have done is hire people, buy planes, and update their web site with a lot of hype.

Any day now......

Also, if there are all of there lucrative secondary markets out there why isn’t Allegiant taking advantage of it? Or Spirit?

Planned launch was May of 2021 as noted in July of 2020. So they seem to be right on track.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/grantmartin/2020/07/11/new-air-carrier-breeze-airways-sets-launch-for-may-of-2021/?sh=19c509491bcf

Breeze has their AOC, so that makes this a question of when, not if and my this seems right on schedule.
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/breeze-airways-gets-feds-ok-164341804.html

Bummer the airline tried to move that up to March. It looks like the government liked the original schedule. ;)
https://www.routesonline.com/news/29/breaking-news/294063/breeze-to-launch-next-march-with-scheduled-routes/

Now to consider the opportunity:
Considering how fast Allegiant plans to expand (125 routes in 2 years), I would say there is an opportunity. Spirit hunkered down during the downturn. Now they need to ramp back up.
https://simpleflying.com/allegiant-huge-expansion/

Allegiant notes in their full year 2020 conference call (at 5 min in) that their new app is helping with sales. Breeze has the advantage of a much more advanced app (theoretically). My opinion on airline apps is they are way behind where they should be. I have hope. As per the conference call, Allegiant has the aircraft and crews to expand rapidly, so I fully expect a fast expansion. This call notes airlines will struggle for years. The call at 7 minutes in goes into the low utilization model of Allegiant that Breeze is copying (7 minutes into the call). "Not flying on off peak days." That is a key part of the model of Breeze. (Allegiant averages 6 to 7 hours per day.) Stop flying on low (almost no demand on Tuesdays or Wednesdays per call). Also at about 19 minutes, the call notes that Allegiants new app/website "conversion/attachment" rates are up (more ancillary sales). Wow "not a single scheduled Tuesday flight this year (2020)".
https://edge.media-server.com/mmc/p/3kynams9

Right now Breeze is preparing to launch. When the DOT allows them to sell tickets they will; since it is the weekend, we know the next few days will have no new information.



What Neeleman's airlines bring to the table is customer service. My opinion is his staff are far friendlier than Allegiant, Spirit, or Frontier. The customer satisfaction ratings are certainly poor
https://captainjetson.com/featured/best-airline-rankings-passenger-satisfaction-rankings-for-10-us-airlines/#:~:text=%20Best%20Airline%20Rankings%3A%20Passenger%20Satisfaction%20Rankings%20for,Air.%20Nevada-based%20Allegiant%20is%20a%20budget...%20More%20
#10 Frontier
#9 Spirit
#8 Allegiant
...
#4 JetBlue: Hit by delays, as I don't fly to/from JFK very often, not of concern to myself, so I would rank them higher, but I respect their delays bring down their score.
...
We are all anticipating the Breeze airways launch.

I personally think the Allegiant model of low frequency (2x to 5x per week) service is under-utilized.
Breeze bought E-jets so cheap that they'll fly them relatively little. They'll expand on the Allegiant model of not wasting money flying on days few fly (Tuesdays/Wednesdays).

Breeze airways notes they identified 500+ underserved routes:
https://www.anna.aero/2020/08/07/breeze-sees-500-unserved-routes-we-explore-66-possibilities-from-4-underserved-midsized-us-cities/

I think Neeleman and team have thought through far more of the "nuts and bolts" of launching an airline than before. My opinion is far better cost control, realization that current airline apps and web sites are 2nd rate (e.g., Delta, when I move a flight, don't announce the prior time flights as that is just distracting making me think I forgot to finalize the move or something).

I believe 2021 and 2022 will be leisure flying. If the costs are truly well controlled and the app has a good conversion rate, Breeze should succeed.

Lightsaber
6 months without TV. The best decision of my life.
 
danipawa
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sat May 01, 2021 3:01 pm

Embraer 190 AR 190.00101 N101NA Nordic Aviation Capital ferried 30apr21TUS-SJO prior delivery to Breeze Airways ex C-FHOS
Embraer 190 AR 190.00092 N92NB Nordic Aviation Capital ferried 28apr21 TUS-SJO prior delivery to Breeze Airways ex C-FLWE

https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=4
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sat May 01, 2021 3:28 pm

lightsaber wrote:
FLYBY72 wrote:
It’s going to be hard for a breeze to go down any path unless they start selling tickets. Right now all they have done is hire people, buy planes, and update their web site with a lot of hype.

Any day now......

Also, if there are all of there lucrative secondary markets out there why isn’t Allegiant taking advantage of it? Or Spirit?

Planned launch was May of 2021 as noted in July of 2020. So they seem to be right on track.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/grantmartin/2020/07/11/new-air-carrier-breeze-airways-sets-launch-for-may-of-2021/?sh=19c509491bcf

Breeze has their AOC, so that makes this a question of when, not if and my this seems right on schedule.
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/breeze-a ... 41804.html

Bummer the airline tried to move that up to March. It looks like the government liked the original schedule. ;)
https://www.routesonline.com/news/29/br ... ed-routes/


Right now Breeze is preparing to launch. When the DOT allows them to sell tickets they will; since it is the weekend, we know the next few days will have no new information.



This seems slightly behind schedule to me, if you are launching in May you'd most likely want to be selling tickets before May if you'd actually want any sort of reasonable LF. Especially if you are targeting smaller O&Ds.

Avelo announced and launched in the same month, & even ignoring the bookings outage, their loads are very low & they can tap into the larger LA basin.
ORD & IND

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alohashirts
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sat May 01, 2021 5:17 pm

I was able to see the list of airports that’ll be announced as part of the first slate of new routes by Breeze. I’ll just say many of you are going to be shocked to see what they are. They also plan to add about 10-12 additional airports later in the summer months and there are somewhat surprising routes and markets they will enter. Stay tuned!
 
flightsimer
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sat May 01, 2021 5:31 pm

lightsaber wrote:
FLYBY72 wrote:
It’s going to be hard for a breeze to go down any path unless they start selling tickets. Right now all they have done is hire people, buy planes, and update their web site with a lot of hype.

Any day now......

Also, if there are all of there lucrative secondary markets out there why isn’t Allegiant taking advantage of it? Or Spirit?

Planned launch was May of 2021 as noted in July of 2020. So they seem to be right on track.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/grantmarti ... c509491bcf

Breeze has their AOC, so that makes this a question of when, not if and my this seems right on schedule.
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/breeze-a ... 41804.html

Bummer the airline tried to move that up to March. It looks like the government liked the original schedule. ;)
https://www.routesonline.com/news/29/br ... ed-routes/

Now to consider the opportunity:
Considering how fast Allegiant plans to expand (125 routes in 2 years), I would say there is an opportunity. Spirit hunkered down during the downturn. Now they need to ramp back up.
https://simpleflying.com/allegiant-huge-expansion/

Allegiant notes in their full year 2020 conference call (at 5 min in) that their new app is helping with sales. Breeze has the advantage of a much more advanced app (theoretically). My opinion on airline apps is they are way behind where they should be. I have hope. As per the conference call, Allegiant has the aircraft and crews to expand rapidly, so I fully expect a fast expansion. This call notes airlines will struggle for years. The call at 7 minutes in goes into the low utilization model of Allegiant that Breeze is copying (7 minutes into the call). "Not flying on off peak days." That is a key part of the model of Breeze. (Allegiant averages 6 to 7 hours per day.) Stop flying on low (almost no demand on Tuesdays or Wednesdays per call). Also at about 19 minutes, the call notes that Allegiants new app/website "conversion/attachment" rates are up (more ancillary sales). Wow "not a single scheduled Tuesday flight this year (2020)".
https://edge.media-server.com/mmc/p/3kynams9

Right now Breeze is preparing to launch. When the DOT allows them to sell tickets they will; since it is the weekend, we know the next few days will have no new information.



What Neeleman's airlines bring to the table is customer service. My opinion is his staff are far friendlier than Allegiant, Spirit, or Frontier. The customer satisfaction ratings are certainly poor
https://captainjetson.com/featured/best ... %20More%20
#10 Frontier
#9 Spirit
#8 Allegiant
...
#4 JetBlue: Hit by delays, as I don't fly to/from JFK very often, not of concern to myself, so I would rank them higher, but I respect their delays bring down their score.
...
We are all anticipating the Breeze airways launch.

I personally think the Allegiant model of low frequency (2x to 5x per week) service is under-utilized.
Breeze bought E-jets so cheap that they'll fly them relatively little. They'll expand on the Allegiant model of not wasting money flying on days few fly (Tuesdays/Wednesdays).

Breeze airways notes they identified 500+ underserved routes:
https://www.anna.aero/2020/08/07/breeze ... us-cities/

I think Neeleman and team have thought through far more of the "nuts and bolts" of launching an airline than before. My opinion is far better cost control, realization that current airline apps and web sites are 2nd rate (e.g., Delta, when I move a flight, don't announce the prior time flights as that is just distracting making me think I forgot to finalize the move or something).

I believe 2021 and 2022 will be leisure flying. If the costs are truly well controlled and the app has a good conversion rate, Breeze should succeed.

Lightsaber

That article is wrong. AOC has not been issued. That was in reference to the DOT approval which multiple news outlets incorrectly reported as being the AOC. Unfortunately, due to the slowdown that occurred with certification, the announcement will likely not be occurring next week either. Expect launch to occur within the first two weeks of May with a very quick turn around period between announcements and first flight.

They are up to 6 aircraft in the fleet with 2 more in pre-delivery phases.
Commercial / Airline Pilot
 
Nicknuzzii
Posts: 1836
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sat May 01, 2021 6:01 pm

alohashirts wrote:
I was able to see the list of airports that’ll be announced as part of the first slate of new routes by Breeze. I’ll just say many of you are going to be shocked to see what they are. They also plan to add about 10-12 additional airports later in the summer months and there are somewhat surprising routes and markets they will enter. Stay tuned!


If you “saw” it, don’t be shy and post it. Doesn’t seem like your connected to the company at all nor are you identifiable with your username.
 
CMHtraveler
Posts: 307
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sat May 01, 2021 6:31 pm

TexasAirCorp wrote:
dabpit wrote:
To add some more context to the FAs just being college students.... Breeze is also hiring part-time FAs that are not college students and a number of corporate (non IT jobs) are required to maintain a FA license. This means that some full-time corporate staff will fill the gaps for flights.


Staff with little-to-no aviation experience, staff working multiple positions, low salaries, if I'm reading this all correctly, this sounds a lot like the original People Express.


I, for one, hope this start-up fails even more swiftly than PE and this low-road labor model is relegated to the dustbin of history where it belongs. Anyone with an interest in the industry rooting for Neeleman’s race to the bottom ought to be careful what they’re wishing for. Happy May Day.
 
CALMSP
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sat May 01, 2021 6:47 pm

I was talking to my friend JT about the start date and he told me its gonna be May
 
iAvgeek737
Posts: 64
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sat May 01, 2021 8:25 pm

CMHtraveler wrote:
TexasAirCorp wrote:
dabpit wrote:
To add some more context to the FAs just being college students.... Breeze is also hiring part-time FAs that are not college students and a number of corporate (non IT jobs) are required to maintain a FA license. This means that some full-time corporate staff will fill the gaps for flights.


Staff with little-to-no aviation experience, staff working multiple positions, low salaries, if I'm reading this all correctly, this sounds a lot like the original People Express.


I, for one, hope this start-up fails even more swiftly than PE and this low-road labor model is relegated to the dustbin of history where it belongs. Anyone with an interest in the industry rooting for Neeleman’s race to the bottom ought to be careful what they’re wishing for. Happy May Day.


Thats the thing though, they dont think its the race to the bottom. They are thinking its Allegiant but JetBlue. Its far from that, sure they are going to have free wifi but they are still charging for everything else just like Spirit.
 
clrd4t8koff
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sat May 01, 2021 8:48 pm

CALMSP wrote:
I was talking to my friend JT about the start date and he told me its gonna be May


It’s already May. If they don’t even have their AOC how do they plan to start operations in the same month?
 
JoseSalazar
Posts: 452
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sat May 01, 2021 9:24 pm

clrd4t8koff wrote:
CALMSP wrote:
I was talking to my friend JT about the start date and he told me its gonna be May


It’s already May. If they don’t even have their AOC how do they plan to start operations in the same month?

It was a pop culture joke (now a meme) that he was playing off of. https://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/202 ... 873185001/
 
flightsimer
Posts: 1134
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sat May 01, 2021 11:58 pm

clrd4t8koff wrote:
CALMSP wrote:
I was talking to my friend JT about the start date and he told me its gonna be May


It’s already May. If they don’t even have their AOC how do they plan to start operations in the same month?

It’s not that hard. Everything is done for certification on Breeze’s part. The FAA is going through the final, 5th stage which is making sure everything that was supposed to be done was and at completion of that we are certified.

Breeze is already approved by the DOT to sell tickets. That authorization is effective as soon as AOC is in hand. So they could fly as soon as the next day if they really wanted to...
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TerminalD
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sun May 02, 2021 12:12 am

flightsimer wrote:
clrd4t8koff wrote:
CALMSP wrote:
I was talking to my friend JT about the start date and he told me its gonna be May


It’s already May. If they don’t even have their AOC how do they plan to start operations in the same month?

It’s not that hard. Everything is done for certification on Breeze’s part. The FAA is going through the final, 5th stage which is making sure everything that was supposed to be done was and at completion of that we are certified.

Breeze is already approved by the DOT to sell tickets. That authorization is effective as soon as AOC is in hand. So they could fly as soon as the next day if they really wanted to...

Breeze does not have an IATA code assigned from what I see. That means something remains.
 
rbavfan
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sun May 02, 2021 3:22 am

GSPSPOT wrote:
MKE is neither east nor west, but is underserved, and has a history of being quite well-stimulated by now-gone players.


Carriers have started service in MKE for years. It goes well at first (New service syndrome) but long term they cannot keep minimums up to keep service running. The big C takes their flyers do to much larger single flight service offerings. Not everyone form MKE want to do multiple connections all the time.
 
flightsimer
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sun May 02, 2021 5:52 am

TerminalD wrote:
flightsimer wrote:
clrd4t8koff wrote:

It’s already May. If they don’t even have their AOC how do they plan to start operations in the same month?

It’s not that hard. Everything is done for certification on Breeze’s part. The FAA is going through the final, 5th stage which is making sure everything that was supposed to be done was and at completion of that we are certified.

Breeze is already approved by the DOT to sell tickets. That authorization is effective as soon as AOC is in hand. So they could fly as soon as the next day if they really wanted to...

Breeze does not have an IATA code assigned from what I see. That means something remains.

You realize that IATA is an independent organization from the FAA right? And there is nothing requiring an airline to be a part of IATA as well...
Commercial / Airline Pilot
 
rbavfan
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sun May 02, 2021 6:13 am

flightsimer wrote:
TerminalD wrote:
flightsimer wrote:
It’s not that hard. Everything is done for certification on Breeze’s part. The FAA is going through the final, 5th stage which is making sure everything that was supposed to be done was and at completion of that we are certified.

Breeze is already approved by the DOT to sell tickets. That authorization is effective as soon as AOC is in hand. So they could fly as soon as the next day if they really wanted to...

Breeze does not have an IATA code assigned from what I see. That means something remains.

You realize that IATA is an independent organization from the FAA right? And there is nothing requiring an airline to be a part of IATA as well...


True and Breeze does have an ICAO code.
 
TerminalD
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sun May 02, 2021 1:50 pm

flightsimer wrote:
TerminalD wrote:
flightsimer wrote:
It’s not that hard. Everything is done for certification on Breeze’s part. The FAA is going through the final, 5th stage which is making sure everything that was supposed to be done was and at completion of that we are certified.

Breeze is already approved by the DOT to sell tickets. That authorization is effective as soon as AOC is in hand. So they could fly as soon as the next day if they really wanted to...

Breeze does not have an IATA code assigned from what I see. That means something remains.

You realize that IATA is an independent organization from the FAA right? And there is nothing requiring an airline to be a part of IATA as well...

I realize you cannot sell tickets in GDS without an IATA code. Do you realize that?
 
RJNUT
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sun May 02, 2021 3:01 pm

TerminalD wrote:
flightsimer wrote:
TerminalD wrote:
Breeze does not have an IATA code assigned from what I see. That means something remains.

You realize that IATA is an independent organization from the FAA right? And there is nothing requiring an airline to be a part of IATA as well...

I realize you cannot sell tickets in GDS without an IATA code. Do you realize that?


Actually you can sell thru GDS without a code by piggy backing on Hahn Air's code and using their electronic ticketing platform! They have built an entire business around such arrangements for "off beat" airlines all over the world!
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sun May 02, 2021 5:08 pm

What interests me about Breeze the most is how they will grow routes. Let us take a hypothetical situation a year from now.
1. I predict high seasonality in flying, so any discussion will be by the season, which might be as little as 6 to 12 weeks long, or it could be a summer/winter pattern, but that will be very variable.
2. I expect the vast majority of routes to be started with the E-jets (80%+).
3. I expect most routes to start at 2x to 4x per week.

I know some enthusiast sites (I cannot call this a news site) speculates longer routes will be with the A220, I see most routes being within E-jet range the first two years. The obvious exception might be SLC, to connect corporate offices to the network.
https://www.ch-aviation.com/portal/news ... s-for-long

Now here is what fascinates me. Routes will grow. Breeze will "stumble across" routes with far higher P2P demand than demand at legacy pricing through hubs. Ok, while just an opinion of mine, bear with me as that hypothesis is central to my thoughts. These routes will quickly grow to 8X to 14X per week (I doubt there are any gems left untouched with higher latent demand, that just seems too unlikely).

With the lower variable costs of the A220, I would expect any daily service to be on those aircraft. However, I wouldn't expect many routes exclusive to the A220 for the first 2 years. I look forward to seeing the new routes that emerge. I'd bet on a bunch being 8X to 10X in peak season dropping to 2X to 4X in low season.

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iAvgeek737
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sun May 02, 2021 6:34 pm

Someone on the Breeze APC forum is saying they got 2 gates from DL in ATL and are leasing or took gates from JetBlue in MCO and FLL?

I can understand MCO. FLL also makes sense...but ATL? Now I really cant wait to see their what their startup plans are. If it includes ATL I will def be surprised.
 
alohashirts
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sun May 02, 2021 7:44 pm

iAvgeek737 wrote:
Someone on the Breeze APC forum is saying they got 2 gates from DL in ATL and are leasing or took gates from JetBlue in MCO and FLL?

I can understand MCO. FLL also makes sense...but ATL? Now I really cant wait to see their what their startup plans are. If it includes ATL I will def be surprised.

Like I said in a previous post, many of you will be surprised to see Breeze’s first routes. As far as ATL goes routes such as ATL-ISP/SWF/New Haven/CAK/ILG/Worcester/Portsmouth, etc all make sense when you think of Breeze’s business model. Just sayin’.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sun May 02, 2021 8:09 pm

alohashirts wrote:
iAvgeek737 wrote:
Someone on the Breeze APC forum is saying they got 2 gates from DL in ATL and are leasing or took gates from JetBlue in MCO and FLL?

I can understand MCO. FLL also makes sense...but ATL? Now I really cant wait to see their what their startup plans are. If it includes ATL I will def be surprised.

Like I said in a previous post, many of you will be surprised to see Breeze’s first routes. As far as ATL goes routes such as ATL-ISP/SWF/New Haven/CAK/ILG/Worcester/Portsmouth, etc all make sense when you think of Breeze’s business model. Just sayin’.

The reality is, frequent fliers are most common in large cities. Breeze must tap into some of that market.

Considering Breeze can work 2x to 4x per week, they can be far under the viable for a regional jet, much less a competing narrowbody. In my opinion, DL will respond with more partial weekly frequency on narrowbodies. e.g., a larger hub wave on Monday, Thursday, Friday, and perhaps Saturday (or Sunday, I'll let the market decide). But they haven't, yet. That means a startup opportunity. I also see ATL as needed as one of the lowest cost expansion strategies is "connecting the dots" and whatever other routes Breeze flies, they will need a few large cities to stretch out the route network.

Take CAK (Akron-Canton regional airport). I could see a few flights to whatever other Breeze destinations, perhaps a few to Florida. I'm going to use Wikipedia for destinations (I know the limitations, but a better than nothing start):

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akron%E2% ... stinations

In Florida, Spirit owns Orlando, Ft. Meyers, and Tampa. With flights to Atlanta cut, that leaves the smaller airports of Florida as possibilities as well as Atlanta, but by offering far fewer seats per week.

I do wonder if Breeze will offer one stop itineraries. e.g., CAK-ATL-??? Actually, ATL to Florida looks very well served by DL, did I miss an obvious airport? It might be thinner pickings at ATL than many other possible airports... As an airline needs repeat customers, the advantage comes when you serve more destinations than the competition. Since many of the majors just funnel to hubs, Breeze will have to create an interesting new route map by new P2P routes. Although lookking at the CAK wikipedia page, the airport was serving in 2019 half the peak demand. I'm afraid it is past its prime.

Breeze will eventually need to expand where they compete (in big cities), but they should avoid head to head competition as much as possible the first few years. I see bypassing ATL and CLT for the SouthEast being the most lucrative.

Lightsaber
6 months without TV. The best decision of my life.
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sun May 02, 2021 8:28 pm

alohashirts wrote:
iAvgeek737 wrote:
Someone on the Breeze APC forum is saying they got 2 gates from DL in ATL and are leasing or took gates from JetBlue in MCO and FLL?

I can understand MCO. FLL also makes sense...but ATL? Now I really cant wait to see their what their startup plans are. If it includes ATL I will def be surprised.

Like I said in a previous post, many of you will be surprised to see Breeze’s first routes. As far as ATL goes routes such as ATL-ISP/SWF/New Haven/CAK/ILG/Worcester/Portsmouth, etc all make sense when you think of Breeze’s business model. Just sayin’.


Not disagreeing with what might happen, but going into ATL doesn't seem like an ideal starting strategy.

Rapid expansion of routes is bound to be met with resistance from DL, especially if Breeze ends up stimulating these markets.

Obviously ATL would be one piece of a larger network, but still an odd spot for an initial set of routes.
ORD & IND

AA & DL
 
MohawkWeekend
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Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

Sun May 02, 2021 8:58 pm

One of the benefits of the first workers at People Express were stock options. One paper they we quite well off and it didn't really cost PE anything. It's the same thing that happens with tech companies all the time. And who does this appeal to? Young people who see friends working for tech companies hoping for that big payoff. And it has made millionaires out of a lot of them.

If Breeze does that AND the market rewards the stock price (which they are doing in spades now), the major airlines will have one more competitive problem.
    300 319 320 321 707 717 720 727 72S 737 73S 734 735 73G 738 739 747 757 762 ARJ B11 C212 CRJ CR2 CR7 CR9 CV5 D8S DC9 D9S D94 D95 D10 DH8 DTO EMB EM2 E135 E145 E190 FH7 F28 F100 FTRIMTR HRN L10 L15 M80 M90 SF3 SWM YS11
     
    ChrisPBacon
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    Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

    Sun May 02, 2021 9:08 pm

    DeltaRules wrote:

    I've also found a General Manager posting for a "confidential" employer at CMH.


    I wonder if that's another way of saying Base/Station Manager.[/quote]

    Not by the job description. It's clearly ground ops, and "working with an airline partner". My contact there did not "apply" for a job off the street. They reached out to him because of the skill set he/she possessed and had worked at Neeleman carrier in the past. Base managers have probably been in place for months.
     
    Manderson12
    Posts: 1
    Joined: Sun May 02, 2021 10:16 pm

    Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

    Sun May 02, 2021 11:10 pm

    lightsaber wrote:
    alohashirts wrote:
    iAvgeek737 wrote:
    Someone on the Breeze APC forum is saying they got 2 gates from DL in ATL and are leasing or took gates from JetBlue in MCO and FLL?

    I can understand MCO. FLL also makes sense...but ATL? Now I really cant wait to see their what their startup plans are. If it includes ATL I will def be surprised.

    Like I said in a previous post, many of you will be surprised to see Breeze’s first routes. As far as ATL goes routes such as ATL-ISP/SWF/New Haven/CAK/ILG/Worcester/Portsmouth, etc all make sense when you think of Breeze’s business model. Just sayin’.

    The reality is, frequent fliers are most common in large cities. Breeze must tap into some of that market.

    Considering Breeze can work 2x to 4x per week, they can be far under the viable for a regional jet, much less a competing narrowbody. In my opinion, DL will respond with more partial weekly frequency on narrowbodies. e.g., a larger hub wave on Monday, Thursday, Friday, and perhaps Saturday (or Sunday, I'll let the market decide). But they haven't, yet. That means a startup opportunity. I also see ATL as needed as one of the lowest cost expansion strategies is "connecting the dots" and whatever other routes Breeze flies, they will need a few large cities to stretch out the route network.

    Take CAK (Akron-Canton regional airport). I could see a few flights to whatever other Breeze destinations, perhaps a few to Florida. I'm going to use Wikipedia for destinations (I know the limitations, but a better than nothing start):

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akron%E2% ... stinations

    In Florida, Spirit owns Orlando, Ft. Meyers, and Tampa. With flights to Atlanta cut, that leaves the smaller airports of Florida as possibilities as well as Atlanta, but by offering far fewer seats per week.

    I do wonder if Breeze will offer one stop itineraries. e.g., CAK-ATL-??? Actually, ATL to Florida looks very well served by DL, did I miss an obvious airport? It might be thinner pickings at ATL than many other possible airports... As an airline needs repeat customers, the advantage comes when you serve more destinations than the competition. Since many of the majors just funnel to hubs, Breeze will have to create an interesting new route map by new P2P routes. Although lookking at the CAK wikipedia page, the airport was serving in 2019 half the peak demand. I'm afraid it is past its prime.

    Breeze will eventually need to expand where they compete (in big cities), but they should avoid head to head competition as much as possible the first few years. I see bypassing ATL and CLT for the SouthEast being the most lucrative.

    Lightsaber
    No way is CAK past its prime. CAK passenger numbers were increasing in JAN and FEB of 2020, plus they had built a new concourse and then came the pandemic. CAK and DAY airports thrived under Airtran, and then Airtran was bought out by SWA. These two airports were successful because of the type and seating capacities of Airtrans aircraft. This is why the aircraft that Breeze will fly is perfect for airports like CAK and DAY, and airports of similar size with about 1 million in their Metro areas.
     
    airlineworker
    Posts: 304
    Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2019 1:20 am

    Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

    Mon May 03, 2021 1:13 am

    Midwestindy wrote:
    alohashirts wrote:
    iAvgeek737 wrote:
    Someone on the Breeze APC forum is saying they got 2 gates from DL in ATL and are leasing or took gates from JetBlue in MCO and FLL?

    I can understand MCO. FLL also makes sense...but ATL? Now I really cant wait to see their what their startup plans are. If it includes ATL I will def be surprised.

    Like I said in a previous post, many of you will be surprised to see Breeze’s first routes. As far as ATL goes routes such as ATL-ISP/SWF/New Haven/CAK/ILG/Worcester/Portsmouth, etc all make sense when you think of Breeze’s business model. Just sayin’.


    Not disagreeing with what might happen, but going into ATL doesn't seem like an ideal starting strategy.

    Rapid expansion of routes is bound to be met with resistance from DL, especially if Breeze ends up stimulating these markets.

    Obviously ATL would be one piece of a larger network, but still an odd spot for an initial set of routes.


    Not if Breeze flies to cities not served by DL. ORH, HVN, ISP and SWF should all do well. LCC are the fastest growing airlines and these airports are fertile ground.
     
    Jerseyguy
    Posts: 2239
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    Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

    Mon May 03, 2021 4:30 am

    airlineworker wrote:
    Midwestindy wrote:
    alohashirts wrote:
    Like I said in a previous post, many of you will be surprised to see Breeze’s first routes. As far as ATL goes routes such as ATL-ISP/SWF/New Haven/CAK/ILG/Worcester/Portsmouth, etc all make sense when you think of Breeze’s business model. Just sayin’.


    Not disagreeing with what might happen, but going into ATL doesn't seem like an ideal starting strategy.

    Rapid expansion of routes is bound to be met with resistance from DL, especially if Breeze ends up stimulating these markets.

    Obviously ATL would be one piece of a larger network, but still an odd spot for an initial set of routes.


    Not if Breeze flies to cities not served by DL. ORH, HVN, ISP and SWF should all do well. LCC are the fastest growing airlines and these airports are fertile ground.


    Breeze also has opportunities at airports like TTN where the a220s short field performance would allow it to serve destinations where other airlines (ie Frontier) can not. I doubt Frontier is going to want to have a pissing match on something like TTN-DFW or TTN-DEN when Breeze can have a profitable flight with a 50 passenger load factor. While Trenton may be a couple years away (new Terminal opens in late 2023), there might be other opportunities that would be available starting in 2022 when the 220s are available. STS perhaps?
     
    11C
    Posts: 244
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    Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

    Mon May 03, 2021 4:55 am

    CMHtraveler wrote:
    TexasAirCorp wrote:
    dabpit wrote:
    To add some more context to the FAs just being college students.... Breeze is also hiring part-time FAs that are not college students and a number of corporate (non IT jobs) are required to maintain a FA license. This means that some full-time corporate staff will fill the gaps for flights.


    Staff with little-to-no aviation experience, staff working multiple positions, low salaries, if I'm reading this all correctly, this sounds a lot like the original People Express.


    I, for one, hope this start-up fails even more swiftly than PE and this low-road labor model is relegated to the dustbin of history where it belongs. Anyone with an interest in the industry rooting for Neeleman’s race to the bottom ought to be careful what they’re wishing for. Happy May Day.


    While I totally understand where you’re coming from, I can’t really imagine how you start an airline in the U.S. without being very creative at inception. To start with a legacy cost structure would be incredibly expensive, so it’s natural to expect lots of creativity in the startup of an airline (in my opinion). I still have questions about how this low utilization model works when you are paying leases on your airframes. Having a leased airplane sitting on the ground is also expensive. Is there any information available on how the Azul aircraft are financed, and how the A-220’s will be financed? I recall lots of criticism about B6’s financing in the early days, and I don’t know how much of it was warranted, but those leases were eventually satisfied, and after the ‘08 financial crisis, B6 eventually got to a very solid financial position (ignoring the current crisis).
     
    airplaneboy
    Posts: 784
    Joined: Sat May 15, 2004 11:59 am

    Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

    Mon May 03, 2021 5:31 am

    lightsaber wrote:
    alohashirts wrote:
    iAvgeek737 wrote:
    Someone on the Breeze APC forum is saying they got 2 gates from DL in ATL and are leasing or took gates from JetBlue in MCO and FLL?

    I can understand MCO. FLL also makes sense...but ATL? Now I really cant wait to see their what their startup plans are. If it includes ATL I will def be surprised.

    Like I said in a previous post, many of you will be surprised to see Breeze’s first routes. As far as ATL goes routes such as ATL-ISP/SWF/New Haven/CAK/ILG/Worcester/Portsmouth, etc all make sense when you think of Breeze’s business model. Just sayin’.

    The reality is, frequent fliers are most common in large cities. Breeze must tap into some of that market.

    Considering Breeze can work 2x to 4x per week, they can be far under the viable for a regional jet, much less a competing narrowbody. In my opinion, DL will respond with more partial weekly frequency on narrowbodies. e.g., a larger hub wave on Monday, Thursday, Friday, and perhaps Saturday (or Sunday, I'll let the market decide). But they haven't, yet. That means a startup opportunity. I also see ATL as needed as one of the lowest cost expansion strategies is "connecting the dots" and whatever other routes Breeze flies, they will need a few large cities to stretch out the route network.

    Take CAK (Akron-Canton regional airport). I could see a few flights to whatever other Breeze destinations, perhaps a few to Florida. I'm going to use Wikipedia for destinations (I know the limitations, but a better than nothing start):

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akron%E2% ... stinations

    In Florida, Spirit owns Orlando, Ft. Meyers, and Tampa. With flights to Atlanta cut, that leaves the smaller airports of Florida as possibilities as well as Atlanta, but by offering far fewer seats per week.

    I do wonder if Breeze will offer one stop itineraries. e.g., CAK-ATL-??? Actually, ATL to Florida looks very well served by DL, did I miss an obvious airport? It might be thinner pickings at ATL than many other possible airports... As an airline needs repeat customers, the advantage comes when you serve more destinations than the competition. Since many of the majors just funnel to hubs, Breeze will have to create an interesting new route map by new P2P routes. Although lookking at the CAK wikipedia page, the airport was serving in 2019 half the peak demand. I'm afraid it is past its prime.

    Breeze will eventually need to expand where they compete (in big cities), but they should avoid head to head competition as much as possible the first few years. I see bypassing ATL and CLT for the SouthEast being the most lucrative.

    Lightsaber


    In Florida, WN owns TPA, MCO and RSW. Spirit is largest in FLL only I believe. But still has a sizable presence in MCO and RSW. B6 is number 1 or 2 in FLL I believe and also has a sizable presence in MCO. And F9 has really grown MCO as well. But WN still leads in MCO in terms of seats flown and marketshare.
     
    alohashirts
    Posts: 163
    Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2021 8:45 pm

    Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

    Mon May 03, 2021 6:20 am

    airplaneboy wrote:
    lightsaber wrote:
    alohashirts wrote:
    Like I said in a previous post, many of you will be surprised to see Breeze’s first routes. As far as ATL goes routes such as ATL-ISP/SWF/New Haven/CAK/ILG/Worcester/Portsmouth, etc all make sense when you think of Breeze’s business model. Just sayin’.

    The reality is, frequent fliers are most common in large cities. Breeze must tap into some of that market.

    Considering Breeze can work 2x to 4x per week, they can be far under the viable for a regional jet, much less a competing narrowbody. In my opinion, DL will respond with more partial weekly frequency on narrowbodies. e.g., a larger hub wave on Monday, Thursday, Friday, and perhaps Saturday (or Sunday, I'll let the market decide). But they haven't, yet. That means a startup opportunity. I also see ATL as needed as one of the lowest cost expansion strategies is "connecting the dots" and whatever other routes Breeze flies, they will need a few large cities to stretch out the route network.

    Take CAK (Akron-Canton regional airport). I could see a few flights to whatever other Breeze destinations, perhaps a few to Florida. I'm going to use Wikipedia for destinations (I know the limitations, but a better than nothing start):

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akron%E2% ... stinations

    In Florida, Spirit owns Orlando, Ft. Meyers, and Tampa. With flights to Atlanta cut, that leaves the smaller airports of Florida as possibilities as well as Atlanta, but by offering far fewer seats per week.

    I do wonder if Breeze will offer one stop itineraries. e.g., CAK-ATL-??? Actually, ATL to Florida looks very well served by DL, did I miss an obvious airport? It might be thinner pickings at ATL than many other possible airports... As an airline needs repeat customers, the advantage comes when you serve more destinations than the competition. Since many of the majors just funnel to hubs, Breeze will have to create an interesting new route map by new P2P routes. Although lookking at the CAK wikipedia page, the airport was serving in 2019 half the peak demand. I'm afraid it is past its prime.

    Breeze will eventually need to expand where they compete (in big cities), but they should avoid head to head competition as much as possible the first few years. I see bypassing ATL and CLT for the SouthEast being the most lucrative.

    Lightsaber


    In Florida, WN owns TPA, MCO and RSW. Spirit is largest in FLL only I believe. But still has a sizable presence in MCO and RSW. B6 is number 1 or 2 in FLL I believe and also has a sizable presence in MCO. And F9 has really grown MCO as well. But WN still leads in MCO in terms of seats flown and marketshare.

    You can’t forget G4 up the road at SFB. That’ll be stiff competition for Breeze as well, even if they don’t fly directly into SFB.
     
    CMHtraveler
    Posts: 307
    Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2019 4:48 pm

    Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

    Mon May 03, 2021 11:06 am

    11C wrote:
    CMHtraveler wrote:
    TexasAirCorp wrote:

    Staff with little-to-no aviation experience, staff working multiple positions, low salaries, if I'm reading this all correctly, this sounds a lot like the original People Express.


    I, for one, hope this start-up fails even more swiftly than PE and this low-road labor model is relegated to the dustbin of history where it belongs. Anyone with an interest in the industry rooting for Neeleman’s race to the bottom ought to be careful what they’re wishing for. Happy May Day.


    While I totally understand where you’re coming from, I can’t really imagine how you start an airline in the U.S. without being very creative at inception. To start with a legacy cost structure would be incredibly expensive, so it’s natural to expect lots of creativity in the startup of an airline (in my opinion). I still have questions about how this low utilization model works when you are paying leases on your airframes. Having a leased airplane sitting on the ground is also expensive. Is there any information available on how the Azul aircraft are financed, and how the A-220’s will be financed? I recall lots of criticism about B6’s financing in the early days, and I don’t know how much of it was warranted, but those leases were eventually satisfied, and after the ‘08 financial crisis, B6 eventually got to a very solid financial position (ignoring the current crisis).


    Creativity, absolutely. But there is a large gap between exploitative wages/working conditions and legacy wages/working conditions, which is already quite full of “creative” airlines (G4 for example). Even before G4 workers were organized and had contracts, they were never treated quite as poorly as is being proposed by Neeleman. IMO, if the sustainability of your business model relies on poverty wages, it shouldn’t exist.
     
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    Midwestindy
    Posts: 6073
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    Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

    Mon May 03, 2021 11:20 am

    airlineworker wrote:
    Midwestindy wrote:
    alohashirts wrote:
    Like I said in a previous post, many of you will be surprised to see Breeze’s first routes. As far as ATL goes routes such as ATL-ISP/SWF/New Haven/CAK/ILG/Worcester/Portsmouth, etc all make sense when you think of Breeze’s business model. Just sayin’.


    Not disagreeing with what might happen, but going into ATL doesn't seem like an ideal starting strategy.

    Rapid expansion of routes is bound to be met with resistance from DL, especially if Breeze ends up stimulating these markets.

    Obviously ATL would be one piece of a larger network, but still an odd spot for an initial set of routes.


    Not if Breeze flies to cities not served by DL. ORH, HVN, ISP and SWF should all do well. LCC are the fastest growing airlines and these airports are fertile ground.


    That's my point, if Breeze adds those cities from ATL, DL will more than likely add them as well.
    ORD & IND

    AA & DL
     
    airlineworker
    Posts: 304
    Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2019 1:20 am

    Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

    Mon May 03, 2021 11:45 am

    Midwestindy wrote:
    airlineworker wrote:
    Midwestindy wrote:

    Not disagreeing with what might happen, but going into ATL doesn't seem like an ideal starting strategy.

    Rapid expansion of routes is bound to be met with resistance from DL, especially if Breeze ends up stimulating these markets.

    Obviously ATL would be one piece of a larger network, but still an odd spot for an initial set of routes.


    Not if Breeze flies to cities not served by DL. ORH, HVN, ISP and SWF should all do well. LCC are the fastest growing airlines and these airports are fertile ground.


    That's my point, if Breeze adds those cities from ATL, DL will more than likely add them as well.


    I don't see DL going into ORH and SWF just to oppose Breeze. HVN maybe as it is ripe for more service than AA provides. Breeze seems to taking a long time to announce new cities. They must have a short list,but waiting just causes them to miss out on local talk and local TV news spots regarding a new airline coming to town.
     
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    lightsaber
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    Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

    Mon May 03, 2021 1:29 pm

    While individual cities are dominated by Spirit, Southwest, or Allegiant in Florida, I see enough unserved that will not support daily flights for Breeze to thrive.

    Midwestindy wrote:
    airlineworker wrote:
    Midwestindy wrote:

    Not disagreeing with what might happen, but going into ATL doesn't seem like an ideal starting strategy.

    Rapid expansion of routes is bound to be met with resistance from DL, especially if Breeze ends up stimulating these markets.

    Obviously ATL would be one piece of a larger network, but still an odd spot for an initial set of routes.


    Not if Breeze flies to cities not served by DL. ORH, HVN, ISP and SWF should all do well. LCC are the fastest growing airlines and these airports are fertile ground.


    That's my point, if Breeze adds those cities from ATL, DL will more than likely add them as well.

    The point is, those cities do not support daily flights. That is where the Breeze and Allegiant model of flying 2X to 5X per week has an advantage.

    Lightsaber
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    Bluegrass60
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    Re: Breeze - News and Discussion Thread - 2021

    Mon May 03, 2021 1:35 pm

    If DL is giving up 2 gates at ATL to Breeze....does that portend possible connections in ATL from/to Breeze flights? DL benefits from feed to/fr cities its partners do not go to and/or economics are bad? Can't imagine DL doing anything that would not benefit DL.

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