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JohanTally
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Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Sun Aug 08, 2021 6:23 pm

With AA having more than 140 A320 Series aircraft over 20 years old when will there be a noticeable retirement effort for the older tranches of aircraft? The A320 will likely go first but will AA keep 319/321s beyond 24-25 years?
 
ContinentalEWR
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Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 2:50 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Sun Aug 08, 2021 7:24 pm

JohanTally wrote:
With AA having more than 140 A320 Series aircraft over 20 years old when will there be a noticeable retirement effort for the older tranches of aircraft? The A320 will likely go first but will AA keep 319/321s beyond 24-25 years?


AA has 48 A320s, all ex-US and those would probably be the first to go, eventually. There are 133 A319s (including the newer, ETOPS certified ones which were built new for AA, plus a handful obtained from NK and other operators) and then there are 254 A321s. The A319s and A321s will likely be around for a long time.
 
WidebodyPTV
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Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Mon Aug 09, 2021 12:13 am

USAirALB wrote:
ahj2000 wrote:
N649DL wrote:

For years UA's DirectTV system was only available to people in Y for a fee (before that they were at CO). This was even to use the crappy moving map. Sometime within the last few years all features of the system became comped for Y passengers. This was a very smart move on UA's part as I recall the fee was not worth it unless you were on a longer flight. However, it was free in F. What I really didn't like was how there were no music channels via the DTV system inflight. The other funny thing about these DTV systems on UA is they are dated and old & were mostly installed a decade ago and no doubt are likely very heavy weight-wise.

AA's AVOD system has always been free, at least when I've flown with them domestically. There might have been some content which you had to pay for, but the moving map (which was awesome, the best I've witnessed from a UI perspective), movies, and music were in general free.

It seems the argument against AVOD is mainly by people who are tech savvy and know how to get pass the technical snags on certain platforms on their devices and/or are enthusiasts who care about weight limitations onboard the aircraft in order to save money. The vast majority of people (especially those with families) seem to appreciate IFE. There are space concerns while trying to multitask, but in general these streaming systems can be a giant headache if you don't have the right updates or releases on a tablet or laptop to connect to the system.

When UA decided to use the streaming-based 777s on the long flights to HNL and some Euro destinations out of EWR, I think that's when they realized they got carried away with it and decided to consider reinstallation of IFE. The technology simply isn't there yet. Delta can't even seem to get Wi-Fi right these days as it always seems to cut out and the prices seem to keep increasing on an hourly rate.

It wasn’t at the very very start. I remember being moved from US to an AA A319 (with the New American screens and all) on a CLT-DFW flight and you had to pay a little bit to unlock the full IFE. It wasn’t much though.

Indeed.

NBC Universal programming was free as was the moving map IIRC. Besides that, there was a couple of packages that you could choose from. A Disney/Kids pack, a Classic Movie pack, and then a package that essentially “unlocked” the entire system.

US/AA also charged for streaming video for a while.

Both streaming video and the PTV on domestic flights became free after the merger.

UA tried a similar thing on their IPTE 777s in Y for a while before the CO merger.


UA charged for access to the DirectTV system until 2019, although it was complimentary on internationally-configured aircraft.

DL charged for full access to its AVOD system until 2016. Previously, satellite TV and select program was complimentary. Like UA, complete access was free on long-haul configured aircraft, as well as international flights (e.g. on flights to CUN, the system was unlocked).

I’m not certain when AA unlocked full access. But I do recall flying a US A332 from PHL-PUJ-PHL circa 2013. On the outbound, the system was not activated. The inbound featured the first merged American Way magazine, and the PTV were activated. Programming carried the AA branding. So like DL and UA, AA offered complimentary access on long-haul configured aircraft. DL’s 2016 press release indicates it was the first airline to offer complete access for free, so I suspect AA followed suit shortly thereafter.

IIRC, HA is the last domestic airline to charge for full access to IFE.
 
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1337Delta764
Posts: 6085
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Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Mon Aug 09, 2021 12:16 am

WidebodyPTV wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
ahj2000 wrote:
It wasn’t at the very very start. I remember being moved from US to an AA A319 (with the New American screens and all) on a CLT-DFW flight and you had to pay a little bit to unlock the full IFE. It wasn’t much though.

Indeed.

NBC Universal programming was free as was the moving map IIRC. Besides that, there was a couple of packages that you could choose from. A Disney/Kids pack, a Classic Movie pack, and then a package that essentially “unlocked” the entire system.

US/AA also charged for streaming video for a while.

Both streaming video and the PTV on domestic flights became free after the merger.

UA tried a similar thing on their IPTE 777s in Y for a while before the CO merger.


UA charged for access to the DirectTV system until 2019, although it was complimentary on internationally-configured aircraft.

DL charged for full access to its AVOD system until 2016. Previously, satellite TV and select program was complimentary. Like UA, complete access was free on long-haul configured aircraft, as well as international flights (e.g. on flights to CUN, the system was unlocked).

I’m not certain when AA unlocked full access. But I do recall flying a US A332 from PHL-PUJ-PHL circa 2013. On the outbound, the system was not activated. The inbound featured the first merged American Way magazine, and the PTV were activated. Programming carried the AA branding. So like DL and UA, AA offered complimentary access on long-haul configured aircraft. DL’s 2016 press release indicates it was the first airline to offer complete access for free, so I suspect AA followed suit shortly thereafter.

IIRC, HA is the last domestic airline to charge for full access to IFE.


Also, on DL full access to the IFE system was free on Alaska/Hawaii and the Caribbean (I flew DL a few times to Puerto Rico and the movies were free of charge).
 
USAirALB
Posts: 2767
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 4:46 am

Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Mon Aug 09, 2021 12:56 am

WidebodyPTV wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
ahj2000 wrote:
It wasn’t at the very very start. I remember being moved from US to an AA A319 (with the New American screens and all) on a CLT-DFW flight and you had to pay a little bit to unlock the full IFE. It wasn’t much though.

Indeed.

NBC Universal programming was free as was the moving map IIRC. Besides that, there was a couple of packages that you could choose from. A Disney/Kids pack, a Classic Movie pack, and then a package that essentially “unlocked” the entire system.

US/AA also charged for streaming video for a while.

Both streaming video and the PTV on domestic flights became free after the merger.

UA tried a similar thing on their IPTE 777s in Y for a while before the CO merger.


UA charged for access to the DirectTV system until 2019, although it was complimentary on internationally-configured aircraft.

DL charged for full access to its AVOD system until 2016. Previously, satellite TV and select program was complimentary. Like UA, complete access was free on long-haul configured aircraft, as well as international flights (e.g. on flights to CUN, the system was unlocked).

I’m not certain when AA unlocked full access. But I do recall flying a US A332 from PHL-PUJ-PHL circa 2013. On the outbound, the system was not activated. The inbound featured the first merged American Way magazine, and the PTV were activated. Programming carried the AA branding. So like DL and UA, AA offered complimentary access on long-haul configured aircraft. DL’s 2016 press release indicates it was the first airline to offer complete access for free, so I suspect AA followed suit shortly thereafter.

IIRC, HA is the last domestic airline to charge for full access to IFE.

In 2013 US was still an independent airline and the merger was just recently announced.

US policy was that IFE was only offered on flights to Europe, Hawaii, and South America. B767s/757s that operated segments within the continental US or to the Caribbean used the overhead monitors for the safety video and video PAs only. A330s that operated within the continental US or to the Caribbean would have the individual monitors disabled in Y but were supposed to be enabled in F. The policy continued IIRC until the merger was complete.
 
UpNAWAy
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Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Thu Aug 12, 2021 3:25 pm

anymaninfc wrote:
UpNAWAy wrote:
anymaninfc wrote:
When are AAs B788 deliveries going to continue?


When Boeing can make them, they are currently some 10 deliveries behind schedule currently.


Three have been showing as ready for delivery for quite a while now, and 5 others have had test flights flown and painting accomplished.



They are not ready for delivery. The FAA has an issue with changes to the production process that Boeing has done and wants to see their documentation justifying the new procedures. Most likely no more deliveries this year.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Thu Aug 12, 2021 3:38 pm

JohanTally wrote:
With AA having more than 140 A320 Series aircraft over 20 years old when will there be a noticeable retirement effort for the older tranches of aircraft?


Why? AA wouldn't gain anything in fleet/parts/crew/schedulng simplification. Do you somehow think they have a hundred too many narrowbody mainline aircraft? Fly 'em until they're at end-of-life. MAX8s and 321neos aren't free.
 
JohanTally
Posts: 532
Joined: Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:44 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Thu Aug 12, 2021 4:46 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
JohanTally wrote:
With AA having more than 140 A320 Series aircraft over 20 years old when will there be a noticeable retirement effort for the older tranches of aircraft?


Why? AA wouldn't gain anything in fleet/parts/crew/schedulng simplification. Do you somehow think they have a hundred too many narrowbody mainline aircraft? Fly 'em until they're at end-of-life. MAX8s and 321neos aren't free.

I understand that they aren't going to retire planes just to retire them what I'm asking is over the next 4 to 5 years when 100-150 new narrowbody NEOs and MAXes arrive, which batches of aircraft are they likely to replace. AA has planned for some 738 retirements which is before their "end-of-life" so I wonder if some 319s and 321s will be retired before they reach 25 years old as well.
 
alasizon
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Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 8:57 pm

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Thu Aug 12, 2021 5:19 pm

JohanTally wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
JohanTally wrote:
With AA having more than 140 A320 Series aircraft over 20 years old when will there be a noticeable retirement effort for the older tranches of aircraft?


Why? AA wouldn't gain anything in fleet/parts/crew/schedulng simplification. Do you somehow think they have a hundred too many narrowbody mainline aircraft? Fly 'em until they're at end-of-life. MAX8s and 321neos aren't free.

I understand that they aren't going to retire planes just to retire them what I'm asking is over the next 4 to 5 years when 100-150 new narrowbody NEOs and MAXes arrive, which batches of aircraft are they likely to replace. AA has planned for some 738 retirements which is before their "end-of-life" so I wonder if some 319s and 321s will be retired before they reach 25 years old as well.


319s and 321s will fly on, no capital to replace them and nothing really fits the mission for the 319 currently sans a 319 NEO.
 
jbs2886
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Joined: Wed Apr 01, 2015 9:07 pm

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Thu Aug 12, 2021 5:26 pm

alasizon wrote:
JohanTally wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:

Why? AA wouldn't gain anything in fleet/parts/crew/schedulng simplification. Do you somehow think they have a hundred too many narrowbody mainline aircraft? Fly 'em until they're at end-of-life. MAX8s and 321neos aren't free.

I understand that they aren't going to retire planes just to retire them what I'm asking is over the next 4 to 5 years when 100-150 new narrowbody NEOs and MAXes arrive, which batches of aircraft are they likely to replace. AA has planned for some 738 retirements which is before their "end-of-life" so I wonder if some 319s and 321s will be retired before they reach 25 years old as well.


319s and 321s will fly on, no capital to replace them and nothing really fits the mission for the 319 currently sans a 319 NEO.


An E195-E2, A220, or 737 MAX 7 also can replace? I imagine A321neoXLR will have capabilities that can replace, too. Further, doesn't have to be a 1-for-1 replacement. A mix of MAX 8 and E175s can cover a lot. Finally, AA can access capital.
 
UpNAWAy
Posts: 794
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2016 12:42 pm

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Thu Aug 12, 2021 7:16 pm

The LUS A319/320 where supposed to be mostly retired between 2022-2026. Not sure if that is still the plain since some new deliveries have been deferred.
 
Vctony
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Joined: Sun Aug 01, 1999 10:51 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Thu Aug 12, 2021 7:21 pm

UpNAWAy wrote:
The LUS A319/320 where supposed to be mostly retired between 2022-2026. Not sure if that is still the plain since some new deliveries have been deferred.


LUS A319s make up about 3/4 of the total A319 fleet.
 
USAirKid
Posts: 973
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2016 5:42 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Fri Aug 13, 2021 12:12 am

jbs2886 wrote:
alasizon wrote:
JohanTally wrote:
I understand that they aren't going to retire planes just to retire them what I'm asking is over the next 4 to 5 years when 100-150 new narrowbody NEOs and MAXes arrive, which batches of aircraft are they likely to replace. AA has planned for some 738 retirements which is before their "end-of-life" so I wonder if some 319s and 321s will be retired before they reach 25 years old as well.


319s and 321s will fly on, no capital to replace them and nothing really fits the mission for the 319 currently sans a 319 NEO.


An E195-E2, A220, or 737 MAX 7 also can replace? I imagine A321neoXLR will have capabilities that can replace, too. Further, doesn't have to be a 1-for-1 replacement. A mix of MAX 8 and E175s can cover a lot. Finally, AA can access capital.


Sure. They could replace it that way, but AA has been pushing toward fleet simplification. L-AA decided on a narrowbody mainline fleet of A319/A321 (CEO&NEO) and 738 (NG&Max).

Afaik AA hasn’t really refitted the A320s which earmarks them for being replaced by the 38M.

I don’t see AA picking up the 37M. Maybe the A220, but given the mediocre experience with the E190s I don’t see them getting the E195.
 
ContinentalEWR
Posts: 5098
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 2:50 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Fri Aug 13, 2021 12:19 am

USAirKid wrote:
jbs2886 wrote:
alasizon wrote:

319s and 321s will fly on, no capital to replace them and nothing really fits the mission for the 319 currently sans a 319 NEO.


An E195-E2, A220, or 737 MAX 7 also can replace? I imagine A321neoXLR will have capabilities that can replace, too. Further, doesn't have to be a 1-for-1 replacement. A mix of MAX 8 and E175s can cover a lot. Finally, AA can access capital.


Sure. They could replace it that way, but AA has been pushing toward fleet simplification. L-AA decided on a narrowbody mainline fleet of A319/A321 (CEO&NEO) and 738 (NG&Max).

Afaik AA hasn’t really refitted the A320s which earmarks them for being replaced by the 38M.

I don’t see AA picking up the 37M. Maybe the A220, but given the mediocre experience with the E190s I don’t see them getting the E195.


AA did retrofit the 320s, of which there are fewer than 50, with the post-merger cabin, but these planes are likely on their way out eventually, and likely to be replaced with the MAX8 for the most part, with some tweaking of 319s and 321s in some places. The E190 was withdrawn not because of a mediocre experience, but because of pilot scope clauses and it was also a mainline aircraft, throwing costs out of wack. It was also a pretty small fleet in a domestic, short- and medium haul fleet type that is heavy 737 and 319/321. It just didn't fit and was an oddball. I'd agree, no E195. A220s? Doubtful unless they can get a very good deal on a very significant volume order, which is generally how AA purchases planes (volume focused).
 
jbs2886
Posts: 3664
Joined: Wed Apr 01, 2015 9:07 pm

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Fri Aug 13, 2021 1:25 am

USAirKid wrote:
jbs2886 wrote:
alasizon wrote:

319s and 321s will fly on, no capital to replace them and nothing really fits the mission for the 319 currently sans a 319 NEO.


An E195-E2, A220, or 737 MAX 7 also can replace? I imagine A321neoXLR will have capabilities that can replace, too. Further, doesn't have to be a 1-for-1 replacement. A mix of MAX 8 and E175s can cover a lot. Finally, AA can access capital.


Sure. They could replace it that way, but AA has been pushing toward fleet simplification. L-AA decided on a narrowbody mainline fleet of A319/A321 (CEO&NEO) and 738 (NG&Max).

Afaik AA hasn’t really refitted the A320s which earmarks them for being replaced by the 38M.

I don’t see AA picking up the 37M. Maybe the A220, but given the mediocre experience with the E190s I don’t see them getting the E195.


Huh? I didn’t suggest AA replace the 319 in any way. My point was a response to the comment that there is not an available aircraft to replace it other than the 319neo, which is not true. In fact, if anything, I suggested using existing aircraft planned (321neo, MAX 8) and just adjusting accordingly.
 
USAirALB
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Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 4:46 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Fri Aug 13, 2021 1:45 am

ContinentalEWR wrote:
AA did retrofit the 320s

They did not retrofit the 320s.

The 320s got in-seat power and new seat covers in both cabins but that's it. They are still flying around with the same pre-merger seats, some of which date to around 2000 (many still have the old EmPower ports and IFE controls in the arm rests). Other than the exit seats and bulkheads, 320s lack MCE, which is fine IMO given Y has a 32 inch pitch.
 
ContinentalEWR
Posts: 5098
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 2:50 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Fri Aug 13, 2021 2:03 am

USAirALB wrote:
ContinentalEWR wrote:
AA did retrofit the 320s

They did not retrofit the 320s.

The 320s got in-seat power and new seat covers in both cabins but that's it. They are still flying around with the same pre-merger seats, some of which date to around 2000 (many still have the old EmPower ports and IFE controls in the arm rests). Other than the exit seats and bulkheads, 320s lack MCE, which is fine IMO given Y has a 32 inch pitch.


Maybe then that's why my ride on one from PBI to DCA last year was so comfy! I noticed the seat coverings and the darker wall panels and assumed the whole cabin had been redone. It was a pretty nice ride.
 
JohanTally
Posts: 532
Joined: Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:44 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Fri Aug 13, 2021 3:53 am

ContinentalEWR wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
ContinentalEWR wrote:
AA did retrofit the 320s

They did not retrofit the 320s.

The 320s got in-seat power and new seat covers in both cabins but that's it. They are still flying around with the same pre-merger seats, some of which date to around 2000 (many still have the old EmPower ports and IFE controls in the arm rests). Other than the exit seats and bulkheads, 320s lack MCE, which is fine IMO given Y has a 32 inch pitch.


Maybe then that's why my ride on one from PBI to DCA last year was so comfy! I noticed the seat coverings and the darker wall panels and assumed the whole cabin had been redone. It was a pretty nice ride.

The seats on the 320s have significantly more padding in them as compared to the new norm slimline seats.
 
Boof02671
Posts: 2900
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Fri Aug 13, 2021 4:17 am

ContinentalEWR wrote:
JohanTally wrote:
With AA having more than 140 A320 Series aircraft over 20 years old when will there be a noticeable retirement effort for the older tranches of aircraft? The A320 will likely go first but will AA keep 319/321s beyond 24-25 years?


AA has 48 A320s, all ex-US and those would probably be the first to go, eventually. There are 133 A319s (including the newer, ETOPS certified ones which were built new for AA, plus a handful obtained from NK and other operators) and then there are 254 A321s. The A319s and A321s will likely be around for a long time.

AA didn’t acquire A319s from NK, they got 10 A319s from F9.
 
ContinentalEWR
Posts: 5098
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 2:50 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Fri Aug 13, 2021 10:52 am

Boof02671 wrote:
ContinentalEWR wrote:
JohanTally wrote:
With AA having more than 140 A320 Series aircraft over 20 years old when will there be a noticeable retirement effort for the older tranches of aircraft? The A320 will likely go first but will AA keep 319/321s beyond 24-25 years?


AA has 48 A320s, all ex-US and those would probably be the first to go, eventually. There are 133 A319s (including the newer, ETOPS certified ones which were built new for AA, plus a handful obtained from NK and other operators) and then there are 254 A321s. The A319s and A321s will likely be around for a long time.

AA didn’t acquire A319s from NK, they got 10 A319s from F9.


My mistake. I knew it was F9 and just put the wrong airline code in the comment.
 
miaami
Posts: 989
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2007 2:27 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Sat Aug 14, 2021 5:12 pm

This site has been updated today. Lots of 321 updates
https://sites.google.com/site/newamericanfleet/
 
Detroit313
Posts: 715
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Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Sat Aug 14, 2021 7:31 pm

More than 2/3rds of LUS 321s are done. Only around 35-40 left and they have been doing 15 airplanes at a time so they should finish by November.

At this point, 95% of AA's fleet has power at every seat.

It should be at 100% in November when they are done with the LUS 321s.
 
jetwet1
Posts: 3445
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2007 4:42 am

Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Thu Aug 19, 2021 1:04 am

Well, I just got off an AA flight (on a 321s) that had the Thales seatback system. While the system itself was fine, the immediate advantage of the wireless system was not having to sit through 20 minutes of Hyatt, AA Barclay card, more Hyatt, AA cleaning, more Hyatt, the same AA cleaning video, then repeated in Spanish.......

Sorry folks, it's no contest, the wireless system wins.......

Though with that said, they both had Kong v Godzilla on them, so maybe they both lose.
 
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1337Delta764
Posts: 6085
Joined: Mon Oct 31, 2005 4:02 am

Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Thu Aug 19, 2021 1:29 am

USAirALB wrote:
WidebodyPTV wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
Indeed.

NBC Universal programming was free as was the moving map IIRC. Besides that, there was a couple of packages that you could choose from. A Disney/Kids pack, a Classic Movie pack, and then a package that essentially “unlocked” the entire system.

US/AA also charged for streaming video for a while.

Both streaming video and the PTV on domestic flights became free after the merger.

UA tried a similar thing on their IPTE 777s in Y for a while before the CO merger.


UA charged for access to the DirectTV system until 2019, although it was complimentary on internationally-configured aircraft.

DL charged for full access to its AVOD system until 2016. Previously, satellite TV and select program was complimentary. Like UA, complete access was free on long-haul configured aircraft, as well as international flights (e.g. on flights to CUN, the system was unlocked).

I’m not certain when AA unlocked full access. But I do recall flying a US A332 from PHL-PUJ-PHL circa 2013. On the outbound, the system was not activated. The inbound featured the first merged American Way magazine, and the PTV were activated. Programming carried the AA branding. So like DL and UA, AA offered complimentary access on long-haul configured aircraft. DL’s 2016 press release indicates it was the first airline to offer complete access for free, so I suspect AA followed suit shortly thereafter.

IIRC, HA is the last domestic airline to charge for full access to IFE.

In 2013 US was still an independent airline and the merger was just recently announced.

US policy was that IFE was only offered on flights to Europe, Hawaii, and South America. B767s/757s that operated segments within the continental US or to the Caribbean used the overhead monitors for the safety video and video PAs only. A330s that operated within the continental US or to the Caribbean would have the individual monitors disabled in Y but were supposed to be enabled in F. The policy continued IIRC until the merger was complete.


On my last flight on an ex-US 757 in early 2020, the overhead system wasn't used at all, not even for a safety video.
 
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N62NA
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Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Thu Aug 19, 2021 1:48 am

onwFan wrote:
CarlosSi wrote:
Personally AA should just stick to its guns of offering streaming on all its aircraft (with power on all seats of course) and then reflecting having one less service by having the lower/lowest cost consistently more than its competitors. I don't recall (me personally) booking a flight based on available IFE since most of the time you have to pay for it, but in one instance they had some stuff streaming for all viewers, unlocking more features if paying for it.

On a long-haul flight I might be more tempted to not go with the airline lacking IFE, so you got me there, but can be made up for it so long as streaming is available and my electronics don't overheat or drain on power (having it connected really heats up the device anyways).

On the other hand if they deem its more profitable to have IFE on select aircraft types, better bite the bullet, swallow their pride and apologize, and do what one thinks is going to make more money.


AA has seat back entertainment on all long haul planes.


But unfortunately, AA flies non-long haul planes on routes of around 6 hours or even more (MIA-SEA, MIA-SFO, ORD-ANC, DFW-ANC, LAX-Hawaii, CLT-SEA) and those do not have seat back entertainment.
 
USAirALB
Posts: 2767
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 4:46 am

Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Thu Aug 19, 2021 1:49 am

jetwet1 wrote:
Well, I just got off an AA flight (on a 321s) that had the Thales seatback system. While the system itself was fine, the immediate advantage of the wireless system was not having to sit through 20 minutes of Hyatt, AA Barclay card, more Hyatt, AA cleaning, more Hyatt, the same AA cleaning video, then repeated in Spanish.......

Sorry folks, it's no contest, the wireless system wins.......

Though with that said, they both had Kong v Godzilla on them, so maybe they both lose.

20 minutes is a bit of the stretch....

The wireless streaming system also features at least two ads that play before each program so it is about the same. Both UA/DL (as do most international carriers, CX is notorious for their lengthy ads that precede their programming) feature ads on their PTV system.

The only thing (yet) the wireless system doesn't feature are the sterile cockpit video PA (that includes a Barclaycard ad) and the "what's playing on American Airlines" clip that immediately follows the sterile cockpit video PA.
 
jetwet1
Posts: 3445
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2007 4:42 am

Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Thu Aug 19, 2021 2:18 am

Time it, being in English and Spanish it was insane, as I've been saying, I like the AA wireless system and with the exception of AA leaving my luggage in Dallas (despite the 3 hour delay) service was great.
 
BarrenLucidity
Posts: 30
Joined: Sun Jun 28, 2020 10:29 am

Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Thu Aug 19, 2021 10:25 am

N62NA wrote:
onwFan wrote:
CarlosSi wrote:
Personally AA should just stick to its guns of offering streaming on all its aircraft (with power on all seats of course) and then reflecting having one less service by having the lower/lowest cost consistently more than its competitors. I don't recall (me personally) booking a flight based on available IFE since most of the time you have to pay for it, but in one instance they had some stuff streaming for all viewers, unlocking more features if paying for it.

On a long-haul flight I might be more tempted to not go with the airline lacking IFE, so you got me there, but can be made up for it so long as streaming is available and my electronics don't overheat or drain on power (having it connected really heats up the device anyways).

On the other hand if they deem its more profitable to have IFE on select aircraft types, better bite the bullet, swallow their pride and apologize, and do what one thinks is going to make more money.


AA has seat back entertainment on all long haul planes.


But unfortunately, AA flies non-long haul planes on routes of around 6 hours or even more (MIA-SEA, MIA-SFO, ORD-ANC, DFW-ANC, LAX-Hawaii, CLT-SEA) and those do not have seat back entertainment.


I am eagerly awaiting the day that CLT-LAX, CLT-SEA, CLT-SFO have enough traffic, and CLT has enough wide body gates, to justify wide-bodies. The 5.5+ hours in the 321s can wear on you, especially if it's a red eye. Would also take 321T, just saying!
 
luckyone
Posts: 4170
Joined: Thu Aug 21, 2008 1:50 pm

Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Thu Aug 19, 2021 11:02 am

Speaking only for myself, I much prefer the seatback screen. Using my own device means that I have to deal with either the battery, a cord while it charges, finding some place to put the device because most aircraft do NOT have a seatback holder still, and ultimately it means having to buy something I don’t regularly use. The only tablet I have is my smartphone, and looking at that for more than a few minutes is less pleasant than a larger screen. I’ve basically no other use for an iPad so why shell out for it? And if I have more than one kid then it’s either no iPad or multiple…Also, the new products all have a bespoke headphone jack and on many of them now you can’t charge and use headphones simultaneously, or you can buy Bluetooth headphones which is one more thing to pay for, break, or lose. On a flight under two hours fine, but longer than that — give me a large seat back screen.
 
MIflyer12
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Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Thu Aug 19, 2021 1:06 pm

BarrenLucidity wrote:
I am eagerly awaiting the day that CLT-LAX, CLT-SEA, CLT-SFO have enough traffic, and CLT has enough wide body gates, to justify wide-bodies. The 5.5+ hours in the 321s can wear on you, especially if it's a red eye. Would also take 321T, just saying!


You probably have a better chance of seeing AVOD on AA narrowbodies than on getting widebodies across the frequencies for those CLT routes. AA's hub ops at CLT aren't built on O&D. Among the 30 largest U.S. airports for domestic O&D, CLT has the largest fraction of connecting passengers (more than DFW or ATL). It's not even close: CLT was only 24% O&D for 12 mos ending 12/2020. Connecting traffic requires frequency. If AA has 1200 passengers/day on CLT-LAX it will run eight 321s, not four 77Ws.
 
Moosefire
Posts: 196
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2018 12:47 pm

Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Thu Aug 19, 2021 1:28 pm

USAirALB wrote:
jetwet1 wrote:
Well, I just got off an AA flight (on a 321s) that had the Thales seatback system. While the system itself was fine, the immediate advantage of the wireless system was not having to sit through 20 minutes of Hyatt, AA Barclay card, more Hyatt, AA cleaning, more Hyatt, the same AA cleaning video, then repeated in Spanish.......

Sorry folks, it's no contest, the wireless system wins.......

Though with that said, they both had Kong v Godzilla on them, so maybe they both lose.

20 minutes is a bit of the stretch....

The wireless streaming system also features at least two ads that play before each program so it is about the same. Both UA/DL (as do most international carriers, CX is notorious for their lengthy ads that precede their programming) feature ads on their PTV system.

The only thing (yet) the wireless system doesn't feature are the sterile cockpit video PA (that includes a Barclaycard ad) and the "what's playing on American Airlines" clip that immediately follows the sterile cockpit video PA.


It’s much closer to 20 min that 0 minutes lol. Every once in a while you get an FA that’ll mute it after the relevant safety stuff. Otherwise the video is brutal.
 
BarrenLucidity
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Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Thu Aug 19, 2021 2:08 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
BarrenLucidity wrote:
I am eagerly awaiting the day that CLT-LAX, CLT-SEA, CLT-SFO have enough traffic, and CLT has enough wide body gates, to justify wide-bodies. The 5.5+ hours in the 321s can wear on you, especially if it's a red eye. Would also take 321T, just saying!


You probably have a better chance of seeing AVOD on AA narrowbodies than on getting widebodies across the frequencies for those CLT routes. AA's hub ops at CLT aren't built on O&D. Among the 30 largest U.S. airports for domestic O&D, CLT has the largest fraction of connecting passengers (more than DFW or ATL). It's not even close: CLT was only 24% O&D for 12 mos ending 12/2020. Connecting traffic requires frequency. If AA has 1200 passengers/day on CLT-LAX it will run eight 321s, not four 77Ws.


Yeah, I might get rescued by the XLRs but I'm not holding my breath. We don't even have enough gates to handle more wide body routes (2019 levels) at the moment.
 
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1337Delta764
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Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Thu Aug 19, 2021 3:01 pm

I bought a tablet (Samsung Galaxy Tab A7) since I most frequently fly AA since I am based in Phoenix. However, it is much more comfortable to have a built-in monitor and I would much rather have the choice. The moving map is a bonus in case there are no movies that I like, where I can watch my purchased movies (currently Tooth Fairy 1 and 2, A Beautiful Day in the Neighborhood, and Thumbelina) on my tablet as a backup while leaving the built-in monitor on the moving map.
 
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connorc
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Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Thu Aug 19, 2021 3:08 pm

Image

The Envoy E170 retro jet (N760MQ) has been officially revealed.
 
F9Animal
Posts: 4670
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Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Thu Aug 19, 2021 4:38 pm

How bout when the WIFI works and the plugin to charge your device doesn't? And I can't tell you how many times the WIFI was not working.

From a passenger standpoint, I love the seatback IFE. Even if it is just staring at a map. Heck, they don't even stock inflight magazines anymore. That at least gave me something to look at to kill the boredom. And really, if AA and Delta had the same fares, and almost identical schedule that works for me..... I would likely book Delta. The "What's in it for me" is a big deal. I want to get the most bang for my buck.
 
acavpics
Posts: 632
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2018 2:54 am

Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Thu Aug 19, 2021 5:32 pm

Chapmads wrote:
I understand not wanting to feel left behind, but honestly, don’t most people these days have a device phone or otherwise, that can stream entertainment just fine? Sure, I love the map, but I’m ok without that (heck, you could give access to that on aainflight if you really wanted to). I question many of Parker’s decisions as much as the next guy, but this one seem to be a good way to save weight while minimizing disruption.


I would not want to be staring at my small phone screen for thé duration of a movie or set of TV episodes. And I don’t usually bring my tablet with me unless I’m on a trip for more than a week or two.

So for me personally, it’s either IFE or day dreaming on the flight.
 
ContinentalEWR
Posts: 5098
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 2:50 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Thu Aug 19, 2021 6:11 pm

Seems a bit soon for a retro jet in the former AE livery, even if the current livery was introduced in January 2013. I look at that American Eagle livery and all I can think of are sardine can sized E140s.
 
mikeyp224
Posts: 61
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2015 6:52 pm

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Thu Aug 19, 2021 6:26 pm

ContinentalEWR wrote:
Seems a bit soon for a retro jet in the former AE livery, even if the current livery was introduced in January 2013. I look at that American Eagle livery and all I can think of are sardine can sized E140s.


Do you think it's too soon for the retro jet in the former polished chrome AA livery too? They were both changed at the same time after all.
 
ContinentalEWR
Posts: 5098
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 2:50 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Thu Aug 19, 2021 6:44 pm

mikeyp224 wrote:
ContinentalEWR wrote:
Seems a bit soon for a retro jet in the former AE livery, even if the current livery was introduced in January 2013. I look at that American Eagle livery and all I can think of are sardine can sized E140s.


Do you think it's too soon for the retro jet in the former polished chrome AA livery too? They were both changed at the same time after all.


I do....but others may not. The 1967 era Vignelli livery is a classic, but by the time it was retired it got very dated. AA's brand equity is continuously evolving so I feel like this is all premature and not quite in the same league as Piedmont, Allegheny, Air Cal, Reno Air, TWA heritage liveries, but maybe they are.
 
WidebodyPTV
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Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Thu Aug 19, 2021 8:22 pm

BarrenLucidity wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
BarrenLucidity wrote:
I am eagerly awaiting the day that CLT-LAX, CLT-SEA, CLT-SFO have enough traffic, and CLT has enough wide body gates, to justify wide-bodies. The 5.5+ hours in the 321s can wear on you, especially if it's a red eye. Would also take 321T, just saying!


You probably have a better chance of seeing AVOD on AA narrowbodies than on getting widebodies across the frequencies for those CLT routes. AA's hub ops at CLT aren't built on O&D. Among the 30 largest U.S. airports for domestic O&D, CLT has the largest fraction of connecting passengers (more than DFW or ATL). It's not even close: CLT was only 24% O&D for 12 mos ending 12/2020. Connecting traffic requires frequency. If AA has 1200 passengers/day on CLT-LAX it will run eight 321s, not four 77Ws.


Yeah, I might get rescued by the XLRs but I'm not holding my breath. We don't even have enough gates to handle more wide body routes (2019 levels) at the moment.


It's not a lack of widebody gates -- it's the concept that it's incredibly challenging to turn a profit operating a premium-configured widebody in the domestic system, without the long-haul revenues. Hence why -- sans the dedicated domestic-configured widebody fleet of UA & formerly DL -- domestic widebody flights have been rare over the past decade. And most (pre-COVID) domestic widebody flights to do are for strategic (e.g. positioning) purposes.

Even ORD-LAX is only occasionally operated with widebodies by UA/AA, just as CLT-LAX has been (e.g. 777 earlier this year, the occasional 330 in the past).
 
dredgy
Posts: 534
Joined: Fri Jun 16, 2017 5:13 am

Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Thu Aug 19, 2021 11:42 pm

AirKevin wrote:
Chapmads wrote:
I understand not wanting to feel left behind, but honestly, don’t most people these days have a device phone or otherwise, that can stream entertainment just fine? Sure, I love the map, but I’m ok without that (heck, you could give access to that on aainflight if you really wanted to). I question many of Parker’s decisions as much as the next guy, but this one seem to be a good way to save weight while minimizing disruption.

Most devices also aren't going to last more than two hours if you're lucky. What do you do on a 6-hour flight or a 10-hour flight.


What? Most mobile devices will last much longer than 2 hours. My iPad will get me through a 6-10 hour flight with battery to spare. On flights of that length you usually have some form of in seat power anyway.

I’m fine with a good streaming app - Virgin Australia’s and Qantas’ are both fine. In general I usually only require IFE on shorter flights - on longer flights I’m more likely to take the effort to download some things I want to watch/play, for a short flight I won’t usually bother.
 
anymaninfc
Posts: 309
Joined: Sat May 07, 2016 7:13 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Fri Aug 27, 2021 7:50 pm

Anyone know what's going on with 8BA, aka N872AN, which ferried back from SCL to TUL on 8-10-21, and hasn't flown since?
 
Boof02671
Posts: 2900
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Fri Aug 27, 2021 8:35 pm

anymaninfc wrote:
Anyone know what's going on with 8BA, aka N872AN, which ferried back from SCL to TUL on 8-10-21, and hasn't flown since?

TUL is a heavy maintenance base.
 
anymaninfc
Posts: 309
Joined: Sat May 07, 2016 7:13 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Sat Aug 28, 2021 12:28 am

Boof02671 wrote:
anymaninfc wrote:
Anyone know what's going on with 8BA, aka N872AN, which ferried back from SCL to TUL on 8-10-21, and hasn't flown since?

TUL is a heavy maintenance base.


Well aware of that, but, 8BA is too new to require heavy maintenance unless it was damaged in some way. After all, it was taken out of service in Chile.
 
Boof02671
Posts: 2900
Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2016 12:15 am

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Sat Aug 28, 2021 3:53 am

anymaninfc wrote:
Boof02671 wrote:
anymaninfc wrote:
Anyone know what's going on with 8BA, aka N872AN, which ferried back from SCL to TUL on 8-10-21, and hasn't flown since?

TUL is a heavy maintenance base.


Well aware of that, but, 8BA is too new to require heavy maintenance unless it was damaged in some way. After all, it was taken out of service in Chile.

Could be a mod or just a spare. They do Mods too not just heavy.

Could be a parts shortage also.
 
alasizon
Posts: 3110
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2007 8:57 pm

Re: American Airlines Fleet Thread - 2021

Sat Aug 28, 2021 4:20 am

Boof02671 wrote:
anymaninfc wrote:
Boof02671 wrote:
TUL is a heavy maintenance base.


Well aware of that, but, 8BA is too new to require heavy maintenance unless it was damaged in some way. After all, it was taken out of service in Chile.

Could be a mod or just a spare. They do Mods too not just heavy.

Could be a parts shortage also.


It's pretty clear you don't know. You are smart enough to know though they don't repo planes halfway across the world in a middle of a trip for planned MX.

8BA is OOS for fuselage damage from a towbar.
 
N649DL
Posts: 1228
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2018 10:21 pm

Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Sat Aug 28, 2021 6:29 am

WidebodyPTV wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
ahj2000 wrote:
It wasn’t at the very very start. I remember being moved from US to an AA A319 (with the New American screens and all) on a CLT-DFW flight and you had to pay a little bit to unlock the full IFE. It wasn’t much though.

Indeed.

NBC Universal programming was free as was the moving map IIRC. Besides that, there was a couple of packages that you could choose from. A Disney/Kids pack, a Classic Movie pack, and then a package that essentially “unlocked” the entire system.

US/AA also charged for streaming video for a while.

Both streaming video and the PTV on domestic flights became free after the merger.

UA tried a similar thing on their IPTE 777s in Y for a while before the CO merger.


UA charged for access to the DirectTV system until 2019, although it was complimentary on internationally-configured aircraft.

DL charged for full access to its AVOD system until 2016. Previously, satellite TV and select program was complimentary. Like UA, complete access was free on long-haul configured aircraft, as well as international flights (e.g. on flights to CUN, the system was unlocked).

I’m not certain when AA unlocked full access. But I do recall flying a US A332 from PHL-PUJ-PHL circa 2013. On the outbound, the system was not activated. The inbound featured the first merged American Way magazine, and the PTV were activated. Programming carried the AA branding. So like DL and UA, AA offered complimentary access on long-haul configured aircraft. DL’s 2016 press release indicates it was the first airline to offer complete access for free, so I suspect AA followed suit shortly thereafter.

IIRC, HA is the last domestic airline to charge for full access to IFE.


Stop being a contrarian. DL *DID NOT* charge for full access to it's AVOD system through 2016. I definitely remember free movies in Y going back to 2009-2010. This is simply not correct.
 
WidebodyPTV
Posts: 785
Joined: Fri Sep 20, 2019 9:06 pm

Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Sat Aug 28, 2021 7:01 am

N649DL wrote:
WidebodyPTV wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
Indeed.

NBC Universal programming was free as was the moving map IIRC. Besides that, there was a couple of packages that you could choose from. A Disney/Kids pack, a Classic Movie pack, and then a package that essentially “unlocked” the entire system.

US/AA also charged for streaming video for a while.

Both streaming video and the PTV on domestic flights became free after the merger.

UA tried a similar thing on their IPTE 777s in Y for a while before the CO merger.


UA charged for access to the DirectTV system until 2019, although it was complimentary on internationally-configured aircraft.

DL charged for full access to its AVOD system until 2016. Previously, satellite TV and select program was complimentary. Like UA, complete access was free on long-haul configured aircraft, as well as international flights (e.g. on flights to CUN, the system was unlocked).

I’m not certain when AA unlocked full access. But I do recall flying a US A332 from PHL-PUJ-PHL circa 2013. On the outbound, the system was not activated. The inbound featured the first merged American Way magazine, and the PTV were activated. Programming carried the AA branding. So like DL and UA, AA offered complimentary access on long-haul configured aircraft. DL’s 2016 press release indicates it was the first airline to offer complete access for free, so I suspect AA followed suit shortly thereafter.

IIRC, HA is the last domestic airline to charge for full access to IFE.


Stop being a contrarian. DL *DID NOT* charge for full access to it's AVOD system through 2016. I definitely remember free movies in Y going back to 2009-2010. This is simply not correct.


My recollection is correct, and a quick Google search confirms it:

https://onemileatatime.com/delta-inflig ... ment-free/
 
N649DL
Posts: 1228
Joined: Sat Aug 25, 2018 10:21 pm

Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Sat Aug 28, 2021 9:21 am

WidebodyPTV wrote:
N649DL wrote:
WidebodyPTV wrote:

UA charged for access to the DirectTV system until 2019, although it was complimentary on internationally-configured aircraft.

DL charged for full access to its AVOD system until 2016. Previously, satellite TV and select program was complimentary. Like UA, complete access was free on long-haul configured aircraft, as well as international flights (e.g. on flights to CUN, the system was unlocked).

I’m not certain when AA unlocked full access. But I do recall flying a US A332 from PHL-PUJ-PHL circa 2013. On the outbound, the system was not activated. The inbound featured the first merged American Way magazine, and the PTV were activated. Programming carried the AA branding. So like DL and UA, AA offered complimentary access on long-haul configured aircraft. DL’s 2016 press release indicates it was the first airline to offer complete access for free, so I suspect AA followed suit shortly thereafter.

IIRC, HA is the last domestic airline to charge for full access to IFE.


Stop being a contrarian. DL *DID NOT* charge for full access to it's AVOD system through 2016. I definitely remember free movies in Y going back to 2009-2010. This is simply not correct.


My recollection is correct, and a quick Google search confirms it:

https://onemileatatime.com/delta-inflig ... ment-free/


Your recollection is completely incorrect. I recall flying the DL domestic 763s and yes, DISH, movies, music on AVOD were free between 2009-2015 when I was an initial Silver Elite Member.
 
USAirALB
Posts: 2767
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 4:46 am

Re: AA: Possible seatback entertainment return.

Sat Aug 28, 2021 12:22 pm

N649DL wrote:
WidebodyPTV wrote:
N649DL wrote:

Stop being a contrarian. DL *DID NOT* charge for full access to it's AVOD system through 2016. I definitely remember free movies in Y going back to 2009-2010. This is simply not correct.


My recollection is correct, and a quick Google search confirms it:

https://onemileatatime.com/delta-inflig ... ment-free/


Your recollection is completely incorrect. I recall flying the DL domestic 763s and yes, DISH, movies, music on AVOD were free between 2009-2015 when I was an initial Silver Elite Member.

DISH, select movies, and music were always free, in addition to games.

Premium programing, HBO, and new-release movies had a charge.

The complete package on the IFE became free on 1 July 2016 according to this press release: https://news.delta.com/delta-becomes-on ... nment-free.

AA followed almost immediately after IIRC.

This press release (https://news.delta.com/delta-offer-awar ... ent-system) states it was $5/HBO movie and $2/HBO TV series.

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