Spanish Aviation Thread - 2021

SQ22 · Thu Dec 31, 2020 2:56 pm

Welcome to the Spanish Aviation Thread 2021. Please continue to post your news and your discussion here.

Link to previous thread:

Spanish Aviation Thread - 2020

Embajador3 · Sat Jan 02, 2021 8:52 am

Now that 2020 is finally over, it is time to open a brand new tread about aviation in Spain. I believe that much of the topic will be IB's purchase of UX and how they will proceed after the purchase. Will they keep Air Europa Express, Level and Iberia Express brands?
Also, we have a list of new operators for 2021:

- Iberojet (previously Evelop).
- World2Fly.
- Aerolínea de Tenerife.
- One Airways (Canaries).

May 2021 be a year where the airline industry shall start its slow recovery process towards normality.

Welcome onboard!

Embajador3.

SIVB · Sat Jan 02, 2021 9:14 am

Thanks Embajador for starting a new thread.

I also think that the discussion will be dominated by the AEA acquisition by IAG. Many uncertainties remain, including:

- What are the final details on the buy offer?
- Will the deal be approved by EU authorities?
- Will Slot concessions happen at MAD?
- Which Brands will be kept?

It will be an interesting year for sure.

marcogr12 · Sat Jan 02, 2021 1:42 pm

Embajador3 wrote:
Now that 2020 is finally over, it is time to open a brand new tread about aviation in Spain. I believe that much of the topic will be IB's purchase of UX and how they will proceed after the purchase. Will they keep Air Europa Express, Level and Iberia Express brands?
Also, we have a list of new operators for 2021:

- Iberojet (previously Evelop).
- World2Fly.
- Aerolínea de Tenerife.
- One Airways (Canaries).

May 2021 be a year where the airline industry shall start its slow recovery process towards normality.

Welcome onboard!

Embajador3.

Is there really a need for two new Canarian airlines, with Binter and Canaryfly, and all the LCCs/Charters flying into TFS,LPA,ACE,FUE?

Embajador3 · Sat Jan 02, 2021 9:01 pm

Is there really a need for two new Canarian airlines, with Binter and Canaryfly, and all the LCCs/Charters flying into TFS,LPA,ACE,FUE?[/quote]

Competition is always good for customers and the local economy. As for Binter and CanaryFly, they share the same owners, so there really is no real competition in the canarian market. Previous attempts (Islas Airways and Air Europa Express) were not successful at competing against Binter/CanaryFly.

oldJoe · Sat Jan 02, 2021 9:55 pm

Embajador3 wrote:
Is there really a need for two new Canarian airlines, with Binter and Canaryfly, and all the LCCs/Charters flying into TFS,LPA,ACE,FUE?

Competition is always good for customers and the local economy. As for Binter and CanaryFly, they share the same owners, so there really is no real competition in the canarian market. Previous attempts (Islas Airways and Air Europa Express) were not successful at competing against Binter/CanaryFly.[/quote]

True ! And as I was thought : competition creates new business.
Is it not that three airlines are from the Canary Islands ( One airways - Aerolinea de Tenerife - World2Fly out of Palma ) ?
On a side note Iberojet will be formed out of Evelop and Orbit

Embajador3 · Sun Jan 03, 2021 8:31 am

True ! And as I was thought : competition creates new business.
Is it not that three airlines are from the Canary Islands ( One airways - Aerolinea de Tenerife - World2Fly out of Palma ) ?
On a side note Iberojet will be formed out of Evelop and Orbit[/quote]

One Airways and Aerolínea de Tenerife will be based at the Canaries but will not serve the interisland market. They will fly tourists in & out of LPA/TFS. As for World2fly, they will get A350s and be based at MAD, serving the usual destinations for young spanish people looking for a good time (CUN, HAV and PUJ).
Iberojet will be formed out of Evelop and Orbest.

jmmadrid · Sun Jan 03, 2021 9:31 am

Are you guys sure that One Airways and Aerolinea de Tenerife are not the same?
I've read about an airline owned by ASHOTEL (Tenerife) and Tenerife's "Cabildo".

On the other hand, it seems that WORLD2FLY will do pretty much what other airlines such as Evelop, Wamos and Iberworld have done in the recent past: Madrid to Dominican Republic, Mexico and Cuba. What will the difference be between Iberojet and World2Fly?

a350lover · Sun Jan 03, 2021 10:09 am

https://twitter.com/controladores/statu ... 05314?s=20

Looking at Flightradar yesterday and despite the travel restrictions imposed by most countries in Europe, one wouldn't think the Canaries are in urge need for a new airline to link the islands to the Continent.

tobsw · Sun Jan 03, 2021 11:49 am

The new Tenerife airline - remark: it's an airline created by the Cabildo of Tenerife and the hotel association of Tenerife/La Palma/El Hierro/La Gomera - will be operated by One Airways will operate, apparently, Mainland and Tenerife (not Gran Canaria, as the Gran Canaria hotel association refused to join the project).

it's a fantastic opportunity to waste public money. It will be a massive failure.

debonair · Sun Jan 03, 2021 12:20 pm

jmmadrid wrote:
What will the difference be between Iberojet and World2Fly?

There is only one difference, Iberojet is belonging to the Barceló Group and World2Fly to the IBEROSTAR Group. Both with the same mission, to fill their holiday resorts with Spanish tourist respectively.

Embajador3 · Sun Jan 03, 2021 2:55 pm

What will the difference be between Iberojet and World2Fly?[/quote]

They will compete for the same market.

nascar1 · Sun Jan 03, 2021 3:02 pm

Evelop (now Iberojet) announced last year, that they will start regular flights this year.

I think that they should try to start flights from BCN. Right now nobody is offering non-stop flights to HAV,CUN, or PUJ.

davidjohnson6 · Sun Jan 03, 2021 3:29 pm

I thought Evelop were offering scheduled flights in 2018 ? They were offering routes between LIS/OPO and PMI/MAH in summer 2018 without the need to go through a travel agent or buy any kind of long-haul connecting ticket

aviator2000 · Mon Jan 04, 2021 8:47 pm

CanaryFly just announced they will stop all operations until April, citing low demand due to the covid pandemic. From now untill April Binter will be the only carrier flying between the islands. Hard to imagine a year ago, when AirEuropa Express, Binter and CanaryFly where all fighting for the island traffic.

OA260 · Tue Jan 05, 2021 1:45 am

Canaryfly has decided to temporarily suspend its inter-island operative. The measure, which will affect all its flights between islands from 11 January to 21 March, is motivated by the current restrictions on mobility and above all because of the significant drop in the sale of tickets.

The current situation with regard to the Covid virus1 pandemic continues to require an extension of prevention and containment measures, including certain restrictions on inter-island transportation. ′′ There are many regular passengers who, because of the pandemic, have failed to fly. Canaries have stopped traveling for leisure or leisure and only move between islands when strictly necessary. This has generated a remarkable decline in the occupation of almost all our flights over the past few months ", says Regulo Andrade, director-general of the Canary Airline.

http://www.rtvc.es/noticias/canaryfly-s ... _NRaNjxKM8

debonair · Sun Jan 10, 2021 12:59 am

World2Fly first A330 EC-LXR ready for delivery and oh boy it's for sure not a beauty!

https://planespotters.net/photo/1143505 ... s-a330-343

Embajador3 · Sun Jan 10, 2021 10:29 am

[quote="debonair"]World2Fly first A330 EC-LXR ready for delivery and oh boy it's for sure not a beauty!

Sure it's u-g-l-y. I don't know what were they thinking when they came up with that livery!

debonair · Sun Jan 10, 2021 1:35 pm

True! I really can't understand why they didn't come a bit closer to their IBEROSTAR brand... Must be difficult in Spanish to pronounce the new airline World2Fly W2F "Aerolineas uve doble - dos- efe"! :crazy:

Even the '90 looks much better:

Embajador3 · Sun Jan 10, 2021 2:40 pm

[quote="debonair"]True! I really can't understand why they didn't come a bit closer to their IBEROSTAR brand...

They can not, since their competitor, Iberojet, owns the brand Iberostar.

aviator2000 · Tue Jan 12, 2021 8:16 pm

World2Fly ferried its first A333 to Barcelona today, after having been repainted in Dublin. I assume this could be because of the bad weather in MAD, although the airport has already opened for operations. Is there any chance the new airline will begin services from BCN to Latin America instead of from Madrid? Thanks.

debonair · Wed Jan 13, 2021 2:24 pm

aviator2000 wrote:
Is there any chance the new airline will begin services from BCN to Latin America instead of from Madrid? Thanks.

No! It will compete head on against Iberojet f.k.a. Evelop/Orbest with homebases at MAD & LIS:
https://www.ultimahora.es/noticias/loca ... d2fly.html

aviator2000 · Wed Jan 13, 2021 5:45 pm

debonair wrote:
aviator2000 wrote:
Is there any chance the new airline will begin services from BCN to Latin America instead of from Madrid? Thanks.

No! It will compete head on against Iberojet f.k.a. Evelop/Orbest with homebases at MAD & LIS:
https://www.ultimahora.es/noticias/loca ... d2fly.html

Okay, yeah, that's what I thought. Thanks!

himarhernandez · Thu Jan 14, 2021 3:24 pm

Dear all,
Does anyone know the delivery dates fro UX, IB and IB2 for this year?
Any updates on IB's purchase of UX?

Stay well

aviator2000 · Thu Jan 14, 2021 5:46 pm

Norwegian Air announced today that it will stop flying longhaul flights. This will have a very negative on Barcelona's long haul network as the airline flew to JFK,ORD,SFO,LAX & FLL from BCN. With this, online opinions are arising suggesting that LEVEL could be in danger as, looking in past events, IAG has only flown long haul out of BCN in order to stop competition from doing so (Spanair) and once the airline goes bankrupt, they stop their flights. Is this LEVEL's fate? What are your thoughts on the matter?

sfojvjets · Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:21 pm

aviator2000 wrote:
Norwegian Air announced today that it will stop flying longhaul flights. This will have a very negative on Barcelona's long haul network as the airline flew to JFK,ORD,SFO,LAX & FLL from BCN. With this, online opinions are arising suggesting that LEVEL could be in danger as, looking in past events, IAG has only flown long haul out of BCN in order to stop competition from doing so (Spanair) and once the airline goes bankrupt, they stop their flights. Is this LEVEL's fate? What are your thoughts on the matter?

I think that LEVEL as a brand is definitely in danger - long-haul low-cost is quite unsustainable apart from the TUI Group, for example, and especially since LEVEL's main competitor (DY) has been eliminated, I think we could see LEVEL integrated into Air Europa (or maybe they just return their planes to Iberia but Air Europa continues long haul services from BCN.) Either way, I believe that LEVEL is very likely to be finished. Barcelona is always going to be an important market, both for business and especially tourism, and I think Air Europa's Dreamliners could take the place of LEVEL for IAG out of BCN. But it'll only happen if, as you said, IAG is willing to take the risk of flying longhaul from BCN.

davidjohnson6 · Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:36 pm

IAG will prefer to coerce people flying between Barcelona and Latin America to change in Madrid - they will set up flights from BCN to the likes to the USA and Latin America only if there is another competitor airline offering (or credibly threatening to offer) non-stop flights on these routes

aviator2000 · Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:50 pm

davidjohnson6 wrote:
IAG will prefer to coerce people flying between Barcelona and Latin America to change in Madrid - they will set up flights from BCN to the likes to the USA and Latin America only if there is another competitor airline offering (or credibly threatening to offer) non-stop flights on these routes

That's exactly how IAG operates. However, the BCN-EZE route has proven to be very profitable for the group. Some BCN-EZE flights are even getting 100% load factor during the pandemic, and tickets on this route are being sold at a much higher price than the rest of the routes in the airline's network (non low cost prices for a low cost product). Is IAG really going to let go of this "goldmine"?

himarhernandez · Thu Jan 14, 2021 8:11 pm

davidjohnson6 wrote:
IAG will prefer to coerce people flying between Barcelona and Latin America to change in Madrid - they will set up flights from BCN to the likes to the USA and Latin America only if there is another competitor airline offering (or credibly threatening to offer) non-stop flights on these routes

If you look at the history of IB in BCN that is exactly how it will work. They wild card this time is UX

debonair · Thu Jan 14, 2021 11:40 pm

aviator2000 wrote:
Norwegian Air announced today that it will stop flying longhaul flights. This will have a very negative on Barcelona's long haul network as the airline flew to JFK,ORD,SFO,LAX & FLL from BCN. With this, online opinions are arising suggesting that LEVEL could be in danger as, looking in past events, IAG has only flown long haul out of BCN in order to stop competition from doing so (Spanair) and once the airline goes bankrupt, they stop their flights. Is this LEVEL's fate? What are your thoughts on the matter?

Very black day for the Spanish Economy:
https://www.hosteltur.com/141655_norweg ... spana.html

davidjohnson6 · Thu Jan 14, 2021 11:54 pm

debonair wrote:
aviator2000 wrote:
Norwegian Air announced today that it will stop flying longhaul flights. This will have a very negative on Barcelona's long haul network as the airline flew to JFK,ORD,SFO,LAX & FLL from BCN. With this, online opinions are arising suggesting that LEVEL could be in danger as, looking in past events, IAG has only flown long haul out of BCN in order to stop competition from doing so (Spanair) and once the airline goes bankrupt, they stop their flights. Is this LEVEL's fate? What are your thoughts on the matter?

Very black day for the Spanish Economy:
https://www.hosteltur.com/141655_norweg ... spana.html

Spanish economy is more than capable of handling this. When the pandemic is over, the routes with good profit potential will be filled by other airlines

himarhernandez · Wed Jan 20, 2021 10:31 pm

In Spanish
https://grupo.iberia.es/news/20012021/i ... n?ref=Home

In English
https://grupo.iberia.es/news/20012021/i ... purchasing

Pending government approval. Iberia buys UX for 500m Euros to be paid six years after the closing

danipawa · Wed Jan 20, 2021 11:27 pm

Volotea is adding A320, any photos ?

Aceme · Thu Jan 21, 2021 12:17 am

I just can't see how Iberia and Air Europa integrating into one will be good for the consumer!? Many smaller airports in Spain are operated by both these two airlines, in the same route. Making it just the one company will surely decrease competition and increasing prices!?

davidjohnson6 · Thu Jan 21, 2021 12:43 am

Aceme wrote:
Making it just the one company will surely decrease competition and increasing prices!?

Almost certainly, yes

Kadish · Thu Jan 21, 2021 8:36 am

aviator2000 wrote:
davidjohnson6 wrote:
IAG will prefer to coerce people flying between Barcelona and Latin America to change in Madrid - they will set up flights from BCN to the likes to the USA and Latin America only if there is another competitor airline offering (or credibly threatening to offer) non-stop flights on these routes

That's exactly how IAG operates. However, the BCN-EZE route has proven to be very profitable for the group. Some BCN-EZE flights are even getting 100% load factor during the pandemic, and tickets on this route are being sold at a much higher price than the rest of the routes in the airline's network (non low cost prices for a low cost product). Is IAG really going to let go of this "goldmine"?

Having a load factor of 100% does not proove to be profitable. It helps a lot but there are many more factors.

tobsw · Thu Jan 21, 2021 9:38 am

Kadish wrote:
aviator2000 wrote:
davidjohnson6 wrote:
IAG will prefer to coerce people flying between Barcelona and Latin America to change in Madrid - they will set up flights from BCN to the likes to the USA and Latin America only if there is another competitor airline offering (or credibly threatening to offer) non-stop flights on these routes

That's exactly how IAG operates. However, the BCN-EZE route has proven to be very profitable for the group. Some BCN-EZE flights are even getting 100% load factor during the pandemic, and tickets on this route are being sold at a much higher price than the rest of the routes in the airline's network (non low cost prices for a low cost product). Is IAG really going to let go of this "goldmine"?

Having a load factor of 100% does not proove to be profitable. It helps a lot but there are many more factors.

Based on WW, the EZE route was profitable. There was a time when they operated 9-10 weekly flights.

Kadish · Thu Jan 21, 2021 11:25 am

tobsw wrote:
Kadish wrote:
aviator2000 wrote:
That's exactly how IAG operates. However, the BCN-EZE route has proven to be very profitable for the group. Some BCN-EZE flights are even getting 100% load factor during the pandemic, and tickets on this route are being sold at a much higher price than the rest of the routes in the airline's network (non low cost prices for a low cost product). Is IAG really going to let go of this "goldmine"?

Having a load factor of 100% does not proove to be profitable. It helps a lot but there are many more factors.

Based on WW, the EZE route was profitable. There was a time when they operated 9-10 weekly flights.

I didnt say that having 100% of load factor wasnt profitable. I said there are many more factors....Im not sure about Norweigan factors overall, but they must have been really close to 100% pre covid times and they have been losing ton of cash.

And prove me wrong but there were times in which IB flew 14/17 weekly flights

debonair · Thu Jan 21, 2021 11:33 am

himarhernandez wrote:
In Spanish
https://grupo.iberia.es/news/20012021/i ... n?ref=Home

In English
https://grupo.iberia.es/news/20012021/i ... purchasing

Pending government approval. Iberia buys UX for 500m Euros to be paid six years after the closing

Any more information available regarding the effect on SWIFTAIR and AERONOVA, operating as Air Europa EXPRESS? Will IAG take over the ATR72 and ERJ195 business/contracts as well? Or will it be obsolete and IAG will concentrate on AirNostrum CRJ and ATR72 operations?

aviator2000 · Thu Jan 21, 2021 5:06 pm

Kadish wrote:
aviator2000 wrote:
davidjohnson6 wrote:
IAG will prefer to coerce people flying between Barcelona and Latin America to change in Madrid - they will set up flights from BCN to the likes to the USA and Latin America only if there is another competitor airline offering (or credibly threatening to offer) non-stop flights on these routes

That's exactly how IAG operates. However, the BCN-EZE route has proven to be very profitable for the group. Some BCN-EZE flights are even getting 100% load factor during the pandemic, and tickets on this route are being sold at a much higher price than the rest of the routes in the airline's network (non low cost prices for a low cost product). Is IAG really going to let go of this "goldmine"?

Having a load factor of 100% does not proove to be profitable. It helps a lot but there are many more factors.

I know, but the fact that they are charging non-low cost prices for a low cost product should give them quite an operational margin.

Embajador3 · Fri Jan 22, 2021 10:17 am

Aura Airlines (formerly known as Gowair Vacation Airlines) poised to renew its entire fleet with 2 newer A320CEOs and a single A330.

link in Spanish:
https://www.preferente.com/noticias-de- ... 06587.html

debonair · Fri Jan 22, 2021 2:59 pm

Embajador3 wrote:
Aura Airlines (formerly known as Gowair Vacation Airlines) poised to renew its entire fleet with 2 newer A320CEOs and a single A330.

link in Spanish:
https://www.preferente.com/noticias-de- ... 06587.html

Any more information about the future routes? Will the join W2F, Iberojet & Co with more leisure destinations (like HAV,SDQ) or South America (SCL,EZE)?

Embajador3 · Fri Jan 22, 2021 4:32 pm

Any more information about the future routes? Will the join W2F, Iberojet & Co with more leisure destinations (like HAV,SDQ) or South America (SCL,EZE)?[/quote]

Aura is an ACMI operator. They will use its fleet whenever an airline client requires its services. Right now, they are carrying cargo on their planes and they intend to keep doing that, as well as passenger work.

debonair · Wed Feb 10, 2021 6:58 pm

Embajador3 wrote:
Also, we have a list of new operators for 2021:

- One Airways (Canaries).

The official name will be CANARIAN AIRWAYS, not only the name is very creative, the branding as well! :duck:

http://canarianairways.com/

https://www.canarianweekly.com/posts/ca ... e-born#ath

https://www.hosteltur.com/142209_canari ... arias.html

...and AURA AIRLINES with their first "new" A320, ex IndiGo:
http://www.auraairlines.com/ec-nmy/

davidjohnson6 · Wed Feb 10, 2021 7:09 pm

I've asked elsewhere on the web, but nobody seems to have a good answer. Why does Canarian Airways need to exist ? There's talk that they'll be flying routes that are already well served to TFS - I cannot understand how this start-up airline will be able to compete against the likes of Easyjet, Ryanair, TUI, or why it would want to pick such a fight

The only rationale I can see is that as an airline funded by Canarian hotel companies and also the Tenerife Govt, maybe demonstrate that there is demand on routes not currently served - namely operate routes as a modest loss leader for a couple of years and encourage more people to spend 7 nights in Tenerife, and then exit the route when a bigger airline decides to start the route

E.g. from TFS to:
UK - Humberside / Inverness / Derry / Newquay
Ireland - Kerry / Knock
Germany - Bremen / Dresden / Dortmund / Paderborn / Rostock
Norway - Stavanger / Trondheim

Anyone else understand why Canarian Airways should exist ?

OA260 · Wed Feb 10, 2021 9:15 pm

debonair wrote:
Embajador3 wrote:
Also, we have a list of new operators for 2021:

- One Airways (Canaries).

The official name will be CANARIAN AIRWAYS, not only the name is very creative, the branding as well!

http://canarianairways.com/

https://www.canarianweekly.com/posts/ca ... e-born#ath

https://www.hosteltur.com/142209_canari ... arias.html

...and AURA AIRLINES with their first "new" A320, ex IndiGo:
http://www.auraairlines.com/ec-nmy/

Ive seen better liveries and Ive seen worse. Will be interesting to see if they are around this time next year although there maybe a small gap in the market for them backed directly by the hoteliers. A lot of hoteliers on the Islands got stung by Thomas Cooks collapse and the recent invoking of force majeure by large bedbanks and tour operators like TUI.

debonair · Thu Feb 11, 2021 12:03 am

Delete

debonair · Thu Feb 11, 2021 12:07 am

debonair wrote:
davidjohnson6 wrote:
Anyone else understand why Canarian Airways should exist ?

It's all explained in the link I posted, but you have to read it...
"not have to depend on third parties (mainly tour operators), to attract tourists to the Islands and improve the connectivity of the Canaries as a destination"
https://www.canarianweekly.com/posts/ca ... rline-born

davidjohnson6 · Thu Feb 11, 2021 12:19 am

I read the article.... and Thomas Cook going bankrupt was (by the logic of the article) probably a good thing. Previously there was a large tour operator that controlled how customers bought holidays, controlled the bulk purchasing of rooms, had staff on site in all the hotels, and had its own airline to prevent other airlines getting much power over the Thomas Cook customers. Now that dominant company has disappeared, meaning hotels are not required to do whatever this big tour operator wanted. Instead, the market is much more fragmented with customers buying hotel rooms independently as holidays are now so much easier to put together on the Internet yourself compared to 20 years ago

I really don't understand however how Tenerife hoteliers think they can compete long term with the likes of Easyjet, Ryanair, Wizzair, Norwegian, TUI, etc at flying people to TFS. Connectivity between Europe and the Canaries in 2019 was already extremely good

debonair · Sat Feb 27, 2021 1:48 am

uep airways, new independent brand of swiftair, ex UX Express feeder service:

https://www.defensa.com/aeronautica-y-e ... la-operara

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