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FGITD
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue May 11, 2021 8:37 pm

For those into spotting planes in unusual places, there’s a Lufthansa crj parked by signature right now.
 
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pitbosflyer
Posts: 394
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue May 11, 2021 9:31 pm

So apparently AA is adding a temporary fuel stop for all CLT-LHR flights in Bos. Strange times.

"American Airlines adds stops due to fuel shortage, pipeline shutdown" https://thepointsguy.com/news/pipeline-hack/amp/
A:320/21, 333, 343, 346 || B:717, 735, 737, 738, 739, 752, 753, 763, 772 || MD80, MD90 || E:145, 170, 175, 190, 195 || CR200, 700, 900
 
OMGcat
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue May 11, 2021 10:48 pm

FGITD wrote:
For those into spotting planes in unusual places, there’s a Lufthansa crj parked by signature right now.


Spotted it landing. WFU on Jan 14 and probably sent to storage.
 
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mikegigs
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri May 14, 2021 3:52 pm

In addition to the 3 new rotes DL is launching out of BOS (already another thread going for that), it looks like they will be launching their "VIP Select" program at Logan.

"This service, offered at an undisclosed cost, includes a host of day-of-departure benefits, including Porsche Cayenne tarmac transfers, curbside meet-and-greet with baggage porters, access to the Sky Club, discreet boarding at your preferred time, flight monitoring and rebooking services and more."


per https://thepointsguy.com/news/delta-new ... ny-boston/
Airports: BOS, JAX, JFK, EWR, LGA, CVG, ATL, CLT, DCA, IAD, STT, PVD, ALB, MCO
Aircraft: 733, 735, 73G, 738, 752, 717, A319, A320, MD-88, E190, E175, E145, CRJ-200, CRJ-700, Q400
Airlines: B6, CO, DL, US, NW, WN, DH
...a good start but a long way to go!
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri May 14, 2021 7:03 pm

I was off by just a year on BOS-DFW.. not bad if you consider the pandemic

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1437899&hilit=Boston+Aviation+2020#p21895639

Will DL try BOS-DEN with A220 someday - probably the next largest market from BOS they do not serve.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN
 
EADSYABSOB73857
Posts: 85
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat May 15, 2021 2:37 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
I was off by just a year on BOS-DFW.. not bad if you consider the pandemic

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1437899&hilit=Boston+Aviation+2020#p21895639

Will DL try BOS-DEN with A220 someday - probably the next largest market from BOS they do not serve.


This is great news, and I’ve called this all along. In order for DL to become relevant in BOS, they have to be relevant in large markets. Hopefully we’ll see cities like BAL, DEN, PHX, and IAH come online next. I have called this, I even posted an article to this forum 1 year ago and some people bashed me and invalidated the written article I wrote- funny, because they quote articles all the time about a particular airline. Love this growth at BOS, it was gonna happen all along, and DL has been committed to the BOS growth, and not gonna downsize or, like some people projected.
 
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ChrisNH38
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat May 15, 2021 8:29 pm

With weakened lift to Asia (CX and HU gone), DL might be wise to bring A350s to BOS and start things up. Gate space isn’t an issue now or in the future with the expansion at E.
https://my.flightradar24.com/ChrisNH
 
B752OS
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun May 16, 2021 12:06 am

ChrisNH38 wrote:
With weakened lift to Asia (CX and HU gone), DL might be wise to bring A350s to BOS and start things up. Gate space isn’t an issue now or in the future with the expansion at E.


At what point will HU and CX make their returns? 2022?
 
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ChrisNH38
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun May 16, 2021 12:49 am

B752OS wrote:
ChrisNH38 wrote:
With weakened lift to Asia (CX and HU gone), DL might be wise to bring A350s to BOS and start things up. Gate space isn’t an issue now or in the future with the expansion at E.


At what point will HU and CX make their returns? 2022?


CX has shed a lot of long-haul frames, and HU isn’t on the best financial footing. I wasn’t overly sure either would be back…ever. That sounds dire, so maybe I’m being overly pessimistic.
https://my.flightradar24.com/ChrisNH
 
Ishrion
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun May 16, 2021 1:15 am

B752OS wrote:
ChrisNH38 wrote:
With weakened lift to Asia (CX and HU gone), DL might be wise to bring A350s to BOS and start things up. Gate space isn’t an issue now or in the future with the expansion at E.


At what point will HU and CX make their returns? 2022?


CX HKG-BOS scheduled daily from August 1 with 777-300ER. Highly likely will change.

HU, I have no idea when.
Leaving the forums. You may know where to find me.
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun May 16, 2021 12:52 pm

EADSYABSOB73857 wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
I was off by just a year on BOS-DFW.. not bad if you consider the pandemic

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1437899&hilit=Boston+Aviation+2020#p21895639

Will DL try BOS-DEN with A220 someday - probably the next largest market from BOS they do not serve.


This is great news, and I’ve called this all along. In order for DL to become relevant in BOS, they have to be relevant in large markets. Hopefully we’ll see cities like BAL, DEN, PHX, and IAH come online next. I have called this, I even posted an article to this forum 1 year ago and some people bashed me and invalidated the written article I wrote- funny, because they quote articles all the time about a particular airline. Love this growth at BOS, it was gonna happen all along, and DL has been committed to the BOS growth, and not gonna downsize or, like some people projected.


For some reason DL has shown tepid interest at best when it comes to going against UA. Are they even planning to resume EWR and ORD?
 
C777ER
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun May 16, 2021 2:54 pm

CX isn’t pulling out of BOS, that 77W was going out full just about every night, I believe they pulled out of EWR & IAD & kept BOS, could be wrong
 
kavok
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun May 16, 2021 3:13 pm

airbazar wrote:
EADSYABSOB73857 wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
I was off by just a year on BOS-DFW.. not bad if you consider the pandemic

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1437899&hilit=Boston+Aviation+2020#p21895639

Will DL try BOS-DEN with A220 someday - probably the next largest market from BOS they do not serve.


This is great news, and I’ve called this all along. In order for DL to become relevant in BOS, they have to be relevant in large markets. Hopefully we’ll see cities like BAL, DEN, PHX, and IAH come online next. I have called this, I even posted an article to this forum 1 year ago and some people bashed me and invalidated the written article I wrote- funny, because they quote articles all the time about a particular airline. Love this growth at BOS, it was gonna happen all along, and DL has been committed to the BOS growth, and not gonna downsize or, like some people projected.


For some reason DL has shown tepid interest at best when it comes to going against UA. Are they even planning to resume EWR and ORD?


EWR just seems like it would be far lower priority, especially since BOS-JFK/LGA covers a significant portion of the NYC cachement. Yes, by not serving EWR, DL is missing out on suburban New Jersey. But that is not likely to be a dealbreaker for most Boston based corporate flyers, and it seems the benefits to service EWR are not worth the cost. A similar argument could be made about why DL doesn’t serve IAD.

ORD was and will just be a money pit due to AA/UA/B6 (and WN at MDW), but one DL may have to serve from BOS eventually. In the interim, the BOS-DTW-ORD/MDW provides a reasonably direct route (albeit with a cx) if someone from BOS is required to fly DL.

I would guess DEN, IAH, and even SFO show up on DL metal from BOS before ORD or EWR come back. I do think ORD will happen again eventually. Less sure about EWR.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun May 16, 2021 7:51 pm

kavok wrote:
airbazar wrote:
EADSYABSOB73857 wrote:

This is great news, and I’ve called this all along. In order for DL to become relevant in BOS, they have to be relevant in large markets. Hopefully we’ll see cities like BAL, DEN, PHX, and IAH come online next. I have called this, I even posted an article to this forum 1 year ago and some people bashed me and invalidated the written article I wrote- funny, because they quote articles all the time about a particular airline. Love this growth at BOS, it was gonna happen all along, and DL has been committed to the BOS growth, and not gonna downsize or, like some people projected.


For some reason DL has shown tepid interest at best when it comes to going against UA. Are they even planning to resume EWR and ORD?


EWR just seems like it would be far lower priority, especially since BOS-JFK/LGA covers a significant portion of the NYC cachement. Yes, by not serving EWR, DL is missing out on suburban New Jersey. But that is not likely to be a dealbreaker for most Boston based corporate flyers, and it seems the benefits to service EWR are not worth the cost. A similar argument could be made about why DL doesn’t serve IAD.

ORD was and will just be a money pit due to AA/UA/B6 (and WN at MDW), but one DL may have to serve from BOS eventually. In the interim, the BOS-DTW-ORD/MDW provides a reasonably direct route (albeit with a cx) if someone from BOS is required to fly DL.

I would guess DEN, IAH, and even SFO show up on DL metal from BOS before ORD or EWR come back. I do think ORD will happen again eventually. Less sure about EWR.



As of right now.....
ORD resumes 6/5/2021 3 daily E-170/175
EWR and SFO resume 9/8/2021 5 daily E-170/175 for EWR, 1 daily 757 SFO
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN
 
kavok
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Joined: Wed May 11, 2016 10:12 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun May 16, 2021 8:17 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
kavok wrote:
airbazar wrote:

For some reason DL has shown tepid interest at best when it comes to going against UA. Are they even planning to resume EWR and ORD?


EWR just seems like it would be far lower priority, especially since BOS-JFK/LGA covers a significant portion of the NYC cachement. Yes, by not serving EWR, DL is missing out on suburban New Jersey. But that is not likely to be a dealbreaker for most Boston based corporate flyers, and it seems the benefits to service EWR are not worth the cost. A similar argument could be made about why DL doesn’t serve IAD.

ORD was and will just be a money pit due to AA/UA/B6 (and WN at MDW), but one DL may have to serve from BOS eventually. In the interim, the BOS-DTW-ORD/MDW provides a reasonably direct route (albeit with a cx) if someone from BOS is required to fly DL.

I would guess DEN, IAH, and even SFO show up on DL metal from BOS before ORD or EWR come back. I do think ORD will happen again eventually. Less sure about EWR.



As of right now.....
ORD resumes 6/5/2021 3 daily E-170/175
EWR and SFO resume 9/8/2021 5 daily E-170/175 for EWR, 1 daily 757 SFO


Fair enough. Maybe it’s because BOS-ORD/EWR can both be served by RJs that DL is less concerned about the (likely) cash loss from those routes. I would group those two with CLT, as routes DL feels they need to serve from BOS, but obviously are at a significant disadvantage to the competition. But if the loss is just a few RJ flights a day, that is something DL is willing to write off for their greater good.

Obviously DEN/IAH would need mainline service, which might be the differential in the cost being too high to justify (for the time being).
 
jplatts
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun May 16, 2021 8:54 pm

EADSYABSOB73857 wrote:
This is great news, and I’ve called this all along. In order for DL to become relevant in BOS, they have to be relevant in large markets. Hopefully we’ll see cities like BAL, DEN, PHX, and IAH come online next.


Here were the number of passengers and load factors on the WN BOS-PHX nonstop route back when WN was last operating BOS-PHX nonstop service:
2011 - 91911 passengers, 92.79% load factor
2012 - 57921 passengers, 94.07% load factor

WN re-adding BOS-PHX nonstop service might be a possibility once demand recovers with the strong demand that was there for WN BOS-PHX nonstop service back when WN operated BOS-PHX nonstop service 9 years ago.

WN probably should have not dropped BOS-PHX nonstop service 9 years ago as the demand was there and as WN had a FF base in Greater Phoenix, Vegas, and Southern California to support BOS-PHX nonstop service on WN.

WN also had stronger load factors on BOS-PHX in 2011 and 2012 than it did on any of its nonstop routes out of BOS in the last 2 years, but WN's 737-300 and 737-700 planes had 137 seats prior to the reconfiguration of its 737-700's and some of its 737-300's to 143 seats starting in March 2012.
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Mon May 17, 2021 12:17 pm

kavok wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
As of right now.....
ORD resumes 6/5/2021 3 daily E-170/175
EWR and SFO resume 9/8/2021 5 daily E-170/175 for EWR, 1 daily 757 SFO


Fair enough. Maybe it’s because BOS-ORD/EWR can both be served by RJs that DL is less concerned about the (likely) cash loss from those routes.


Or maybe the fact that EWR and ORD are huge business markets from Boston.
People often forget that EWR is much more than just another way to get to NYC. There are a lot of businesses established in New Jersey.
I don't see DL starting IAH any time soon. DEN has a good mix of business and leisure traffic and would have a better chance if it wasn't for SLC next door. As much as I would love more competition on the DEN route I also don't see that happening. DL avoided DEN even in the best of times, I don't see them returning in the worst of times. They're probably satisfied serving the rest of the rockies via SLC.
 
AvGeekBOS
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 12:51 pm

JetBlue isn’t launching Boston-London service until 2022 due to aircraft deferrals due to COVID

https://thepointsguy.com/news/jetblue-l ... ssion=true
 
aaflyer777
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 1:33 pm

AvGeekBOS wrote:
JetBlue isn’t launching Boston-London service until 2022 due to aircraft deferrals due to COVID

https://thepointsguy.com/news/jetblue-l ... ssion=true


Wow, all that hype about launching BOS-LON this summer and now it’s been pushed back a year.
 
airbazar
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 2:38 pm

aaflyer777 wrote:
AvGeekBOS wrote:
JetBlue isn’t launching Boston-London service until 2022 due to aircraft deferrals due to COVID

https://thepointsguy.com/news/jetblue-l ... ssion=true


Wow, all that hype about launching BOS-LON this summer and now it’s been pushed back a year.


It's not a bad plan. I think TATL traffic is still going to be very limited this year and if LHR reinstates the "use it or lose it" slot policy, B6 could pick up some slots on the cheap from airlines that might not recover.
 
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ChrisNH38
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 2:46 pm

Hopefully now UA announces their own plans to LHR now that B6 has done so.
https://my.flightradar24.com/ChrisNH
 
B6BOSfan
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 3:11 pm

airbazar wrote:
aaflyer777 wrote:
AvGeekBOS wrote:
JetBlue isn’t launching Boston-London service until 2022 due to aircraft deferrals due to COVID

https://thepointsguy.com/news/jetblue-l ... ssion=true


Wow, all that hype about launching BOS-LON this summer and now it’s been pushed back a year.


It's not a bad plan. I think TATL traffic is still going to be very limited this year and if LHR reinstates the "use it or lose it" slot policy, B6 could pick up some slots on the cheap from airlines that might not recover.


I agree, delaying BOS launch is probably smart, but why would they launch this route, and not make connections from BOS to JFK timed perfectly for connecting service? You can fly from FLL and LAX, but not BOS, your second biggest base?

I suspect part of this is their reliance now to use AA flights, and those flights don't allow connections.

Huge misstep on B6's part IMHO.

I'd also agree, that I'd expect the competition they'll face up here in Boston to be significant when they do launch. Aside from product, the others will beat them on fare.
 
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tlecam
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 3:47 pm

airbazar wrote:
kavok wrote:
adamh8297 wrote:
As of right now.....
ORD resumes 6/5/2021 3 daily E-170/175
EWR and SFO resume 9/8/2021 5 daily E-170/175 for EWR, 1 daily 757 SFO


Fair enough. Maybe it’s because BOS-ORD/EWR can both be served by RJs that DL is less concerned about the (likely) cash loss from those routes.


Or maybe the fact that EWR and ORD are huge business markets from Boston.
People often forget that EWR is much more than just another way to get to NYC. There are a lot of businesses established in New Jersey.
I don't see DL starting IAH any time soon. DEN has a good mix of business and leisure traffic and would have a better chance if it wasn't for SLC next door. As much as I would love more competition on the DEN route I also don't see that happening. DL avoided DEN even in the best of times, I don't see them returning in the worst of times. They're probably satisfied serving the rest of the rockies via SLC.


My understanding is that DL was pleased with the performance of ORD. Fares in the route are brutal for everyone given the competition, but I understood that the load factors exceeded expectations. I think that on some days (monday, thursday or friday) they added flights as well.

I was flying to Chicago several times a month at the time; the flights were typically sold out, although I typically fly at peak business times - Monday or Teusday AM; WEdnesday or Thursday PM.
BOS-LGA-JFK | A:319/20/21, 332/3, 346 || B:717, 735, 737, 738, 739, 752, 753, 762, 763, 764, 787, 772, 744 || MD80, MD90
 
tphuang
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 4:25 pm

B6BOSfan wrote:
airbazar wrote:
aaflyer777 wrote:

Wow, all that hype about launching BOS-LON this summer and now it’s been pushed back a year.


It's not a bad plan. I think TATL traffic is still going to be very limited this year and if LHR reinstates the "use it or lose it" slot policy, B6 could pick up some slots on the cheap from airlines that might not recover.


I agree, delaying BOS launch is probably smart, but why would they launch this route, and not make connections from BOS to JFK timed perfectly for connecting service? You can fly from FLL and LAX, but not BOS, your second biggest base?

I suspect part of this is their reliance now to use AA flights, and those flights don't allow connections.

Huge misstep on B6's part IMHO.

I'd also agree, that I'd expect the competition they'll face up here in Boston to be significant when they do launch. Aside from product, the others will beat them on fare.


Unfortunately, JetBlue not having their stuff together on anything new is kind of normal. They will iron out these connection issues over time. I'm expecting a series of announcement/changes in the next few weeks that will allow for more connections to their London flights. They are also probably more generally just chasing O&D here.

Also, nobody will beat them on fare. Let's not kid ourselves here. Legacies aren't going to be able to sustain $2000 to 2500 R/T in Business class.
 
RL757PVD
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 4:35 pm

tphuang wrote:

Also, nobody will beat them on fare. Let's not kid ourselves here. Legacies aren't going to be able to sustain $2000 to 2500 R/T in Business class.


Sure they can.... MIA-EZE/GIG pre covid you could buy J fares for half of what you could for Europe and its twice as much flying. Plus if they can run flights on cargo alone and make it worth their while, they have the room to compete on fares in all cabins and have aircraft with better economics to do so as well.
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
tphuang
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 4:48 pm

RL757PVD wrote:
tphuang wrote:

Also, nobody will beat them on fare. Let's not kid ourselves here. Legacies aren't going to be able to sustain $2000 to 2500 R/T in Business class.


Sure they can.... MIA-EZE/GIG pre covid you could buy J fares for half of what you could for Europe and its twice as much flying. Plus if they can run flights on cargo alone and make it worth their while, they have the room to compete on fares in all cabins and have aircraft with better economics to do so as well.


I'd be very surprised if airlines that used to charge up to 4 to 5k R/T in J and up to 8K O/W on close-in J are going to be undercutting an airline pricing 1500 O/W up close in J and 2 to 2.5 k R/T. I guess we will find out. Based on how profitable mint has been, I know JetBlue can sustain that level of pricing. There is a lot of economic advantages in single aisles vs widebodies since you only 1 aisle and very little wasted space in the 1-1 J cabin layout.
 
ScottB
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 5:17 pm

B6BOSfan wrote:
I agree, delaying BOS launch is probably smart, but why would they launch this route, and not make connections from BOS to JFK timed perfectly for connecting service? You can fly from FLL and LAX, but not BOS, your second biggest base?

I suspect part of this is their reliance now to use AA flights, and those flights don't allow connections.


The westbound LHR-JFK flight will connect to nothing (apart from perhaps a few red-eye Caribbean routes, if those are running) with an arrival at JFK of 2143. If you're asking why the connections to JFK-LGW are poorly-timed, well, you are chasing bottom-of-the-barrel junk fares if you're sending passengers on BOS-JFK-LGW for BOS-LON traffic.
 
BOSGeek
Posts: 2
Joined: Mon Nov 18, 2019 3:37 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 5:30 pm

airbazar wrote:
aaflyer777 wrote:
AvGeekBOS wrote:
JetBlue isn’t launching Boston-London service until 2022 due to aircraft deferrals due to COVID

https://thepointsguy.com/news/jetblue-l ... ssion=true


Wow, all that hype about launching BOS-LON this summer and now it’s been pushed back a year.


It's not a bad plan. I think TATL traffic is still going to be very limited this year and if LHR reinstates the "use it or lose it" slot policy, B6 could pick up some slots on the cheap from airlines that might not recover.


Do we know if B6 will get to hold on to the LHR slots it was assigned this year? Do these slots get automatically renewed for 2022?
 
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tlecam
Posts: 1525
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Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 5:51 pm

tphuang wrote:
RL757PVD wrote:
tphuang wrote:

Also, nobody will beat them on fare. Let's not kid ourselves here. Legacies aren't going to be able to sustain $2000 to 2500 R/T in Business class.


Sure they can.... MIA-EZE/GIG pre covid you could buy J fares for half of what you could for Europe and its twice as much flying. Plus if they can run flights on cargo alone and make it worth their while, they have the room to compete on fares in all cabins and have aircraft with better economics to do so as well.


I'd be very surprised if airlines that used to charge up to 4 to 5k R/T in J and up to 8K O/W on close-in J are going to be undercutting an airline pricing 1500 O/W up close in J and 2 to 2.5 k R/T. I guess we will find out. Based on how profitable mint has been, I know JetBlue can sustain that level of pricing. There is a lot of economic advantages in single aisles vs widebodies since you only 1 aisle and very little wasted space in the 1-1 J cabin layout.


It will be interesting, won't it? Without access to internal data, it's hard to understand market/demand based pricing vs. costs and route profitability vs. network profitability. I think that B6 is going to change the dynamics of BOS-LHR in a bunch of ways. It will be interesting to see how the others respond. DL certainly could look at using their 321s or 757s for TATL to compete on a cost basis. But that would be a departure from their strategy and their marketing (e.g. all aisle access for J).
BOS-LGA-JFK | A:319/20/21, 332/3, 346 || B:717, 735, 737, 738, 739, 752, 753, 762, 763, 764, 787, 772, 744 || MD80, MD90
 
B6BOSfan
Posts: 105
Joined: Fri Apr 19, 2019 5:11 am

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 6:04 pm

ScottB wrote:
B6BOSfan wrote:
I agree, delaying BOS launch is probably smart, but why would they launch this route, and not make connections from BOS to JFK timed perfectly for connecting service? You can fly from FLL and LAX, but not BOS, your second biggest base?

I suspect part of this is their reliance now to use AA flights, and those flights don't allow connections.


The westbound LHR-JFK flight will connect to nothing (apart from perhaps a few red-eye Caribbean routes, if those are running) with an arrival at JFK of 2143. If you're asking why the connections to JFK-LGW are poorly-timed, well, you are chasing bottom-of-the-barrel junk fares if you're sending passengers on BOS-JFK-LGW for BOS-LON traffic.


You're correct, the return flights to virtually any destination from LHR is impossible. So, what's the point? They're marketing this as a huge moment in B6 history, when in fact, the only real passengers who can use this service, are NYC passengers.

All the talk on ANet about "feeds" from cities -- is completely moot. Call me a skeptic on this launch, I feel like they're gonna have issues, and that's just with NYC. Perhaps they don't want people flying, or just really care about selling the Mint seats?
 
airbazar
Posts: 10377
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 6:28 pm

RL757PVD wrote:
tphuang wrote:

Also, nobody will beat them on fare. Let's not kid ourselves here. Legacies aren't going to be able to sustain $2000 to 2500 R/T in Business class.


Sure they can.... MIA-EZE/GIG pre covid you could buy J fares for half of what you could for Europe and its twice as much flying. Plus if they can run flights on cargo alone and make it worth their while, they have the room to compete on fares in all cabins and have aircraft with better economics to do so as well.

Oh come on, you cannot even compare markets. I flew BOS-BLR with BA in J for $2900. I would never expect to pay that on BOS-LHR with BA. Some markets subsidize the others. That's how it works. The legacies are not built to offer cheap J fares across their entire network.

As for the schedule, B6 is making lemonade. Those are the slots they got so that's what they'll start with but I don't think they'll complain. That schedule is great for O&D and besides I don't think there's much room in an A321 to sell discounted conx fares.
 
ScottB
Posts: 7402
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2000 1:25 am

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 6:38 pm

B6BOSfan wrote:
You're correct, the return flights to virtually any destination from LHR is impossible. So, what's the point? They're marketing this as a huge moment in B6 history, when in fact, the only real passengers who can use this service, are NYC passengers.


Their first scheduled transatlantic flights do make for a huge moment in B6's history, even if the schedule for LHR is crap. And they have always marketed themselves as NYC's hometown airline, even as they have grown to a leading market position in Boston. The corporate HQ is in NYC (for now) and the market out of NYC is much larger so yeah, even if you're borrowing janky slots at LHR, you have a better shot of making it work there than at BOS.
 
BlueBaller
Posts: 132
Joined: Sun Sep 01, 2019 8:07 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 7:20 pm

B6BOSfan wrote:
ScottB wrote:
B6BOSfan wrote:
I agree, delaying BOS launch is probably smart, but why would they launch this route, and not make connections from BOS to JFK timed perfectly for connecting service? You can fly from FLL and LAX, but not BOS, your second biggest base?

I suspect part of this is their reliance now to use AA flights, and those flights don't allow connections.


The westbound LHR-JFK flight will connect to nothing (apart from perhaps a few red-eye Caribbean routes, if those are running) with an arrival at JFK of 2143. If you're asking why the connections to JFK-LGW are poorly-timed, well, you are chasing bottom-of-the-barrel junk fares if you're sending passengers on BOS-JFK-LGW for BOS-LON traffic.


You're correct, the return flights to virtually any destination from LHR is impossible. So, what's the point? They're marketing this as a huge moment in B6 history, when in fact, the only real passengers who can use this service, are NYC passengers.

All the talk on ANet about "feeds" from cities -- is completely moot. Call me a skeptic on this launch, I feel like they're gonna have issues, and that's just with NYC. Perhaps they don't want people flying, or just really care about selling the Mint seats?


You don’t think that in a metro area of nearly 20 million people, an airline with the brand, loyalty and following of JetBlue can’t get 130 people a day to sign up for a transatlantic crossing on a brand new aircraft with an entirely new onboard product to the most popular, lucrative, and sought after airport in the European Union? Fresh of the heels of a global pandemic?? After hyping this up for 2 1/2 years???

The BOS B6 connection didn’t quite work out to Heathrow for Day 1, but it did for a lot of other Blue cities in addition to FLL and LAX. 2 other focus cities they’re putting a lot of emphasis into. London will go on just fine
 
B6BOSfan
Posts: 105
Joined: Fri Apr 19, 2019 5:11 am

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 7:49 pm

BlueBaller wrote:
B6BOSfan wrote:
ScottB wrote:

The westbound LHR-JFK flight will connect to nothing (apart from perhaps a few red-eye Caribbean routes, if those are running) with an arrival at JFK of 2143. If you're asking why the connections to JFK-LGW are poorly-timed, well, you are chasing bottom-of-the-barrel junk fares if you're sending passengers on BOS-JFK-LGW for BOS-LON traffic.


You're correct, the return flights to virtually any destination from LHR is impossible. So, what's the point? They're marketing this as a huge moment in B6 history, when in fact, the only real passengers who can use this service, are NYC passengers.

All the talk on ANet about "feeds" from cities -- is completely moot. Call me a skeptic on this launch, I feel like they're gonna have issues, and that's just with NYC. Perhaps they don't want people flying, or just really care about selling the Mint seats?


You don’t think that in a metro area of nearly 20 million people, an airline with the brand, loyalty and following of JetBlue can’t get 130 people a day to sign up for a transatlantic crossing on a brand new aircraft with an entirely new onboard product to the most popular, lucrative, and sought after airport in the European Union? Fresh of the heels of a global pandemic?? After hyping this up for 2 1/2 years???

The BOS B6 connection didn’t quite work out to Heathrow for Day 1, but it did for a lot of other Blue cities in addition to FLL and LAX. 2 other focus cities they’re putting a lot of emphasis into. London will go on just fine


I hope for their sake, they can. NYC is the ONLY city that will be able to utilize the LHR flights with their current timing.

Do this. Try booking a return flight to one of those Blue cities. FLL or LAX or MCO from LHR.

You can't. So, for this to work, this will purely need to be JetBlue's New York network that makes it work.

When LGW enters the picture, London flying will become possible to/from other Blue cities. So, effectively what they have (for now) is service from America to Gatwick.
 
User avatar
adamh8297
Posts: 3277
Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2012 6:28 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 8:53 pm

B6BOSfan wrote:
BlueBaller wrote:
B6BOSfan wrote:

You're correct, the return flights to virtually any destination from LHR is impossible. So, what's the point? They're marketing this as a huge moment in B6 history, when in fact, the only real passengers who can use this service, are NYC passengers.

All the talk on ANet about "feeds" from cities -- is completely moot. Call me a skeptic on this launch, I feel like they're gonna have issues, and that's just with NYC. Perhaps they don't want people flying, or just really care about selling the Mint seats?


You don’t think that in a metro area of nearly 20 million people, an airline with the brand, loyalty and following of JetBlue can’t get 130 people a day to sign up for a transatlantic crossing on a brand new aircraft with an entirely new onboard product to the most popular, lucrative, and sought after airport in the European Union? Fresh of the heels of a global pandemic?? After hyping this up for 2 1/2 years???

The BOS B6 connection didn’t quite work out to Heathrow for Day 1, but it did for a lot of other Blue cities in addition to FLL and LAX. 2 other focus cities they’re putting a lot of emphasis into. London will go on just fine


I hope for their sake, they can. NYC is the ONLY city that will be able to utilize the LHR flights with their current timing.

Do this. Try booking a return flight to one of those Blue cities. FLL or LAX or MCO from LHR.

You can't. So, for this to work, this will purely need to be JetBlue's New York network that makes it work.

When LGW enters the picture, London flying will become possible to/from other Blue cities. So, effectively what they have (for now) is service from America to Gatwick.


Are you aware NYC-LON is far and away the largest Transatlantic market? For some perspective, it is larger than NYC to every single US metro area except Los Angeles, Orlando, Miami/Ft. Lauderdale, SF Bay Area, Chicago, and Atlanta.
Airlines flown: A3, AA, AC, AF, AM, BA, B6, CA, CO, CX, DL, EA, EL, IB, LH, MI, MQ, NH, NW, NZ, OU, PE, QF, S4, SQ, TP, UA, US, VS, WE, WN
 
RobertS975
Posts: 997
Joined: Sun Aug 14, 2005 2:17 am

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed May 19, 2021 9:06 pm

B6BOSfan wrote:
BlueBaller wrote:
B6BOSfan wrote:

You're correct, the return flights to virtually any destination from LHR is impossible. So, what's the point? They're marketing this as a huge moment in B6 history, when in fact, the only real passengers who can use this service, are NYC passengers.

All the talk on ANet about "feeds" from cities -- is completely moot. Call me a skeptic on this launch, I feel like they're gonna have issues, and that's just with NYC. Perhaps they don't want people flying, or just really care about selling the Mint seats?


You don’t think that in a metro area of nearly 20 million people, an airline with the brand, loyalty and following of JetBlue can’t get 130 people a day to sign up for a transatlantic crossing on a brand new aircraft with an entirely new onboard product to the most popular, lucrative, and sought after airport in the European Union? Fresh of the heels of a global pandemic?? After hyping this up for 2 1/2 years???


LHR is no longer in the European Union!
 
iyerhari
Posts: 1106
Joined: Sat Jun 01, 2013 4:25 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue May 25, 2021 5:24 pm

BOS April-2021 numbers are out. Realized I hadn't posted March-2021 numbers. Definitely numbers drifting in positive direction compared to the complete collapse that started last year from March-2020.

YTD total pax: 1,427,287
YTD total pax 2020: 95,352
AAGR: 1396.9% WOW!

YTD total international pax: 142,054
YTD total international pax 2020: 5,843
AAGR: 2,331.2%

Detailed numbers:

Domestic Apr-21 Apr-20 Mar-21 Mar-20 Feb-21 Feb-20
Domestic Charter Passenger 2,010 2 1,260 442 825 776
Domestic Commuter Passenger 93,446 4,101 73,136 104,919 44,312 216,953
Domestic Jet Passenger 1,184,571 84,144 875,351 1,248,805 605,612 2,178,646
Total Domestic 1,280,027 88,247 949,747 1,354,166 650,749 2,396,375

International
Bermuda/Bahamas/Caribbean 99,091 3,049 79,737 85,287 50,549 131,714
Canada - 385 - 24,484 518 52,392
Central America 10,245 9 10,926 16,731 7,146 28,819
Europe 17,624 1,751 12,172 100,020 10,973 194,098
Middle East 13,478 - 11,242 33,206 7,939 47,758
South America - 277 - 5,336 - 7,972
Trans-Pacific 1,616 372 1,755 8,061 1,442 22,349
Australia - - - - - -
North Africa - - - 1,490 - 2,340
Other International - - - - - -
Total International Passengers 142,054 5,843 115,832 274,615 78,567 487,442

General Aviation 5,206 1,262 4,592 5,320 3,532 6,696

Total Airport passengers 1,427,287 95,352 1,070,171 1,634,101 732,848 2,890,513
 
User avatar
pitbosflyer
Posts: 394
Joined: Tue Oct 25, 2016 6:18 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 5:29 pm

Cape Air is cozying up to DL it seems. People could already connect from 9K to B6 in BOS but another option with DL opens up additional destination possibilities.

https://www.boston.com/travel/travel/20 ... -cape-air/
A:320/21, 333, 343, 346 || B:717, 735, 737, 738, 739, 752, 753, 763, 772 || MD80, MD90 || E:145, 170, 175, 190, 195 || CR200, 700, 900
 
User avatar
tlecam
Posts: 1525
Joined: Tue Jul 23, 2013 1:38 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Jun 02, 2021 11:34 am

I bit the bullet and took my first flight over the long weekend for a wedding in the Outer Banks. Was nice to rip the band aid off. BOS-ORF on DL. Easy flights. Logan and DL have smooth operations wrt the covid measures.

I still find the CRJ 900s to be amongst my least favorite. Much prefer the Embraers, at least as far as seat comfort goes.

Next up, possibly long haul in the fall.
BOS-LGA-JFK | A:319/20/21, 332/3, 346 || B:717, 735, 737, 738, 739, 752, 753, 762, 763, 764, 787, 772, 744 || MD80, MD90
 
B752OS
Posts: 1319
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2005 4:05 am

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 1:23 am

Massport released the deck from their March board meeting. They note the terminal E expansion project to be completed by July 2023. They also, as of March, are projecting a 3-5 year timeline for Logan to return to pre-COVID numbers. The deck also highlighted space for a 12,000 sqf lounge in the B to C connector. Looks like a Chase Sapphire lounge will be filling the space. They received proposals from Chase, AMEX and Capital One.
 
dtremit
Posts: 169
Joined: Thu Oct 21, 2004 1:08 am

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Jun 08, 2021 4:16 pm

B752OS wrote:
Massport released the deck from their March board meeting. They note the terminal E expansion project to be completed by July 2023. They also, as of March, are projecting a 3-5 year timeline for Logan to return to pre-COVID numbers. The deck also highlighted space for a 12,000 sqf lounge in the B to C connector. Looks like a Chase Sapphire lounge will be filling the space. They received proposals from Chase, AMEX and Capital One.


Interesting and a very positive development for that space. The deck also specifically notes that it would be available to Priority Pass members in addition to Chase Sapphire members.

The lounge would be developed and operated on behalf of Chase by Airport Dimensions, which operates the existing "The Lounge" in terminal C and "The Club" in terminal E.

I wonder if this paves the way for the existing Terminal C lounge to be used by JetBlue for transatlantic passengers? A lounge announcement has been heavily rumored, and the timing would line up pretty well with them beginning BOS-LHR service.
 
aaflyer777
Posts: 307
Joined: Wed Feb 05, 2014 6:37 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Mon Jun 14, 2021 3:13 pm

Delta is resuming BOS-MSY in February. They ran this a few years ago Saturday only on an E175. This time it’ll be daily and on an A319
 
User avatar
tlecam
Posts: 1525
Joined: Tue Jul 23, 2013 1:38 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Mon Jun 14, 2021 9:46 pm

aaflyer777 wrote:
Delta is resuming BOS-MSY in February. They ran this a few years ago Saturday only on an E175. This time it’ll be daily and on an A319



The redrawing of the route maps after the pandemic is fascinating to observe.
BOS-LGA-JFK | A:319/20/21, 332/3, 346 || B:717, 735, 737, 738, 739, 752, 753, 762, 763, 764, 787, 772, 744 || MD80, MD90
 
User avatar
chrisnh
Posts: 4155
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 1999 3:59 am

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:19 pm

Cathay will return to Boston with the A350-1000 in August, but days of operation are quite sparse.
 
FGITD
Posts: 1578
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 1:44 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Jun 15, 2021 3:06 am

tlecam wrote:
aaflyer777 wrote:
Delta is resuming BOS-MSY in February. They ran this a few years ago Saturday only on an E175. This time it’ll be daily and on an A319



The redrawing of the route maps after the pandemic is fascinating to observe.


It’s certainly been interesting, especially on the international side

Monday morning- we’re coming back! 5x a week starting on xx

2 hours later-update, 3x a week now, starting on yy

Another 2 hours later- update #2, now daily starting zz

And then a week later, everyone is notified that the plan has been scrapped and carrier xyz has no plan to resume flights for the foreseeable future
 
airbazar
Posts: 10377
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Jun 15, 2021 12:25 pm

FGITD wrote:
tlecam wrote:
aaflyer777 wrote:
Delta is resuming BOS-MSY in February. They ran this a few years ago Saturday only on an E175. This time it’ll be daily and on an A319



The redrawing of the route maps after the pandemic is fascinating to observe.


It’s certainly been interesting, especially on the international side

Monday morning- we’re coming back! 5x a week starting on xx

2 hours later-update, 3x a week now, starting on yy

Another 2 hours later- update #2, now daily starting zz

And then a week later, everyone is notified that the plan has been scrapped and carrier xyz has no plan to resume flights for the foreseeable future


And then we have this, the clearest sign yet that things are getting back to normal and all those "weird" routes added during the Pandemic were just temporary.
https://thepointsguy.com/news/jetblue-m ... oute-cuts/
 
tphuang
Posts: 6408
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:04 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Jun 15, 2021 12:43 pm

airbazar wrote:
FGITD wrote:
tlecam wrote:


The redrawing of the route maps after the pandemic is fascinating to observe.


It’s certainly been interesting, especially on the international side

Monday morning- we’re coming back! 5x a week starting on xx

2 hours later-update, 3x a week now, starting on yy

Another 2 hours later- update #2, now daily starting zz

And then a week later, everyone is notified that the plan has been scrapped and carrier xyz has no plan to resume flights for the foreseeable future


And then we have this, the clearest sign yet that things are getting back to normal and all those "weird" routes added during the Pandemic were just temporary.
https://thepointsguy.com/news/jetblue-m ... oute-cuts/


Well, at least domestically.

The clearest sign for me was when JetBlue announced it will start flying to ORH again.
 
S0Y
Posts: 154
Joined: Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:25 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Jun 15, 2021 1:52 pm

TK are back to daily as of June 14th
 
jworks158
Posts: 403
Joined: Mon Jun 26, 2017 5:02 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Jun 15, 2021 2:21 pm

FGITD wrote:
tlecam wrote:
aaflyer777 wrote:
Delta is resuming BOS-MSY in February. They ran this a few years ago Saturday only on an E175. This time it’ll be daily and on an A319



The redrawing of the route maps after the pandemic is fascinating to observe.


It’s certainly been interesting, especially on the international side

Monday morning- we’re coming back! 5x a week starting on xx

2 hours later-update, 3x a week now, starting on yy

Another 2 hours later- update #2, now daily starting zz

And then a week later, everyone is notified that the plan has been scrapped and carrier xyz has no plan to resume flights for the foreseeable future


Anyone know what the latest is from LH on MUC A359 service? Last I heard it was returning in July.

Looks like TAP will bring their A330-900 back for the first time since the beginning of the pandemic this week, and Swiss increases service this week.

Cabo Verde has filed a tentative return at the end of the month https://twitter.com/theaeronetwork/status/1400549206020943873?s=21
(A359,A343/A346,A332,A319/320/321,A220-100)(B788,B772,B762,B752,B744/B748,B732/B737/B738,B717)(E190,E145)(CRJ100/200, Dash 8-200)(MD-83)
JB,UA(C5,EV,CHQ,AX),AA(EGF,ZW,AX,PT),DL(OH,YX),FL,WN,LH,BA,AF,AZ,IB,VX,CO
https://my.flightradar24.com/theorangetechie
 
ram789
Posts: 9
Joined: Fri May 31, 2019 7:58 pm

Re: Boston Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Jun 15, 2021 2:29 pm

jworks158 wrote:
FGITD wrote:
tlecam wrote:


The redrawing of the route maps after the pandemic is fascinating to observe.


It’s certainly been interesting, especially on the international side

Monday morning- we’re coming back! 5x a week starting on xx

2 hours later-update, 3x a week now, starting on yy

Another 2 hours later- update #2, now daily starting zz

And then a week later, everyone is notified that the plan has been scrapped and carrier xyz has no plan to resume flights for the foreseeable future


Anyone know what the latest is from LH on MUC A359 service? Last I heard it was returning in July.

Looks like TAP will bring their A330-900 back for the first time since the beginning of the pandemic this week, and Swiss increases service this week.

Cabo Verde has filed a tentative return at the end of the month https://twitter.com/theaeronetwork/status/1400549206020943873?s=21



MUC on LH looks to be starting on July 2nd

TAP has brought their a330neo once here during the winter holidays, then stopped. A330neo service seems to be running on Thursdays and Saturdays til the end of this month
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