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RL757PVD
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Apr 06, 2021 12:28 pm

Looks like PVD and PWM both gain 3-4x weekly ATL and PHL on F9... the PWM-DEN doesn't seem top be showing up anymore though.

I guess that shows how F9 performed at BOS with PVD-ATL and PVD-MIA returning, and BOS-PHL never starting and reemerging at PVD and BOS-MIA being cut down from daily,

BDL-ATL 3x weekly showing up as well
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
jplatts
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Apr 06, 2021 2:03 pm

RL757PVD wrote:
Looks like PVD and PWM both gain 3-4x weekly ATL and PHL on F9... the PWM-DEN doesn't seem top be showing up anymore though.


WN adding PWM-DEN nonstop service might be a possibility with recent WN adds to DEN from other destinations inherited through the WN-FL merger such as CLT, DSM, RIC, and ICT.
 
PVD523
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Apr 06, 2021 4:12 pm

RL757PVD wrote:
Looks like PVD and PWM both gain 3-4x weekly ATL and PHL on F9... the PWM-DEN doesn't seem top be showing up anymore though.

I guess that shows how F9 performed at BOS with PVD-ATL and PVD-MIA returning, and BOS-PHL never starting and reemerging at PVD and BOS-MIA being cut down from daily,

BDL-ATL 3x weekly showing up as well

I'll be interested to see if there's any response from DL and AA. When F9 tried PVD-ATL a few years ago DL didn't bat an eye, and F9 was off the route soon after the start of service. Personally, I'm more interested in them trying PVD-PHL. That route was the fastest growing route in the country way back when WN added it. Obviously the dynamics of today's market are vastly different than 2003/2004, and this will only be 3x weekly vs the 4/5x daily WN did (+COVID) but I really hope this one succeeds.
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Apr 06, 2021 6:22 pm

PVD523 wrote:
Portlander wrote:
Speaking of runway length. I noticed that United is starting flights from John Wayne Airport (SNA) to Honolulu in May. Isn't that pushing the limits with a 2600 mile flight over water utilizing a 5700 foot runway? Would a 757 would be the appropriate aircraft to handle the short runway and distance?

757 is a good bet but the 73G is capable of that op too.


Correct its a 73G the (737-700). Uniteds 737-700s have excellent runway performance out of SNA and have the range. It makes sense to start smaller and see how it goes. Hawaiian is flying out of Long Beach now so it's not really unserved . Avoiding LAX is the win bit getting to long beach is pretty easy for OC people and an even less stress airport there. If it's a hit, they can always go to a 757 but that's a pretty big jump , so the 73G is better to start.

Uniteds 737-700s would probably work on HVN-Florida if they wanted to try it.
 
Portlander
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Apr 06, 2021 6:54 pm

Thanks, so is it a safe bet that a 737-700 could make it as far as PHX or LAS from PWM with a 7200 foot runway if United or any other airline wanted to extend beyond DEN?
 
PVD523
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Apr 06, 2021 7:08 pm

Portlander wrote:
Thanks, so is it a safe bet that a 737-700 could make it as far as PHX or LAS from PWM with a 7200 foot runway if United or any other airline wanted to extend beyond DEN?

Definitely. WN ran PVD-LAS/PHX for years off runways of 6,081 and 7,166 ft.
 
BlueBaller
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Tue Apr 06, 2021 9:30 pm

PVD523 wrote:
Portlander wrote:
Thanks, so is it a safe bet that a 737-700 could make it as far as PHX or LAS from PWM with a 7200 foot runway if United or any other airline wanted to extend beyond DEN?

Definitely. WN ran PVD-LAS/PHX for years off runways of 6,081 and 7,166 ft.


Albeit weight-restricted during the hot and humid summer months, pre-runway extension of course.
 
RL757PVD
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 12:47 pm

Looks like more F9 love for New England... i'm seeing PVD and PWM to MYR... PVD is Thurs/Sun and PWM is Sat only
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
Portlander
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:13 pm

Other than a utopia for golfers, not sure what would lure Mainers to the Myrtle Beach area in the summer. Maybe it's about getting South Carolinians up to Maine though Charleston might be a better draw. PVD and PWM have been getting a lot of love recently!
 
RL757PVD
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:29 pm

Portlander wrote:
Other than a utopia for golfers, not sure what would lure Mainers to the Myrtle Beach area in the summer. Maybe it's about getting South Carolinians up to Maine though Charleston might be a better draw. PVD and PWM have been getting a lot of love recently!


After seeing what happened in Miami first hand this spring when airlines added all the capacity... if I lived in Maine, id plan to escape somewhere else this summer too! I hope the likely one-time massive influx doesn't grind things to a halt there this summer and ruin what makes it special and attractive.
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
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Revelation
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:39 pm

Portlander wrote:
Other than a utopia for golfers, not sure what would lure Mainers to the Myrtle Beach area in the summer. Maybe it's about getting South Carolinians up to Maine though Charleston might be a better draw. PVD and PWM have been getting a lot of love recently!

Clearly you are missing the fact that ChrisNH38 moved and is now commuting between Kennebunk and SC a couple times a year.

Frontier read this thread and immediately saw the market potential so they opened up the new route.
Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world
The heart has its beaches, its homeland and thoughts of its own
Wake now, discover that you are the song that the morning brings
The heart has its seasons, its evenings and songs of its own
 
Portlander
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 3:57 pm

Too funny, everything is falling into place for Chris!
 
PVD523
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:25 pm

June 10 start date for PVD-MYR and June 12 start date for PWM-MYR.
 
Cboyle
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:45 pm

RL757PVD wrote:
Looks like more F9 love for New England... i'm seeing PVD and PWM to MYR... PVD is Thurs/Sun and PWM is Sat only


Yeah... heading spotting at PWM tomorrow! Hour and a half from my house in southern NH
 
lat41
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:50 pm

slcdeltarumd11 wrote:
PVD523 wrote:
Portlander wrote:
Speaking of runway length. I noticed that United is starting flights from John Wayne Airport (SNA) to Honolulu in May. Isn't that pushing the limits with a 2600 mile flight over water utilizing a 5700 foot runway? Would a 757 would be the appropriate aircraft to handle the short runway and distance?

757 is a good bet but the 73G is capable of that op too.


Correct its a 73G the (737-700). Uniteds 737-700s have excellent runway performance out of SNA and have the range. It makes sense to start smaller and see how it goes. Hawaiian is flying out of Long Beach now so it's not really unserved . Avoiding LAX is the win bit getting to long beach is pretty easy for OC people and an even less stress airport there. If it's a hit, they can always go to a 757 but that's a pretty big jump , so the 73G is better to start.

Uniteds 737-700s would probably work on HVN-Florida if they wanted to try it.

Except the variety of weather at HVN is more challenging. More and changeable winds, contaminated runway surface and stormy weather that SNA doesn't get nearly as often. I don't know about the comparison of approaches and departures for the two so someone is welcome to comment.
 
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ChrisNH38
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:59 pm

I quickly dismissed Florida as a retirement destination cuz the whole ‘cold belt’ seems to want to go there. Charleston, not so much...but I view that as a personal advantage. I was down in North Port, FL two weeks ago and being there reaffirmed my choice. Route 75 :yuck: .

Now, Myrtle Beach seemed very Honky Tonk to me. A mix of OOB and Hampton. Again, :yuck:

So the Nexton community in Summerville, SC is where we will be. It will be interesting to see how airline route structures evolve post-COVID. In my own opinion, I think the planes being used for these new routes will be repositioned onto business markets once that side of the airline business rebounds.
https://my.flightradar24.com/ChrisNH
 
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Revelation
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:13 pm

ChrisNH38 wrote:
I quickly dismissed Florida as a retirement destination cuz the whole ‘cold belt’ seems to want to go there. Charleston, not so much...but I view that as a personal advantage. I was down in North Port, FL two weeks ago and being there reaffirmed my choice. Route 75 :yuck: .

Now, Myrtle Beach seemed very Honky Tonk to me. A mix of OOB and Hampton. Again, :yuck:

So the Nexton community in Summerville, SC is where we will be. It will be interesting to see how airline route structures evolve post-COVID. In my own opinion, I think the planes being used for these new routes will be repositioned onto business markets once that side of the airline business rebounds.

Cheers to you, glad you are finding situations you are happy with.

I feel a pull to FL due to family considerations, but am far from committing to that situation.

I'll do a visit in a month or two, see if I'm more or less inclined to make that my eventual landing spot, or if I feel OK with kicking the can down the road some more.

There are lots of advantages to the FL situation but if that did not exist I think I'd end up somewhere in the Mid-Atlantic states, probably DE.
Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world
The heart has its beaches, its homeland and thoughts of its own
Wake now, discover that you are the song that the morning brings
The heart has its seasons, its evenings and songs of its own
 
BlueBaller
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:16 pm

ChrisNH38 wrote:

So the Nexton community in Summerville, SC is where we will be. It will be interesting to see how airline route structures evolve post-COVID. In my own opinion, I think the planes being used for these new routes will be repositioned onto business markets once that side of the airline business rebounds.


My family has had a residence in the Isle of Palms, SC near CHS since the 1980s. It's been a great investment and a place we've enjoyed returning to for decades. As much as Charleston has grown it's still maintains its palmetto charm.
 
Fex180
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:46 pm

Is AA PWM-DFW daily for the summer? It seems to be based on the few sample bookings I've done.
 
Portlander
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:46 pm

It is daily and continues until early November. PWM is also in the process of securing funding for it's long overdue FIS station along with the addition of two new jetways for future gates 12 and 14.
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:53 pm

ChrisNH38 wrote:
I quickly dismissed Florida as a retirement destination cuz the whole ‘cold belt’ seems to want to go there. Charleston, not so much...but I view that as a personal advantage. I was down in North Port, FL two weeks ago and being there reaffirmed my choice. Route 75 :yuck: .

Now, Myrtle Beach seemed very Honky Tonk to me. A mix of OOB and Hampton. Again, :yuck:

So the Nexton community in Summerville, SC is where we will be. It will be interesting to see how airline route structures evolve post-COVID. In my own opinion, I think the planes being used for these new routes will be repositioned onto business markets once that side of the airline business rebounds.


I 100% agree with you there will be a leisure boom until business travel returns. It may never hit the numbers we saw , but major route will have traffic again. The airlines are using leisure as a way to use the planes. International will also use planes again soon.
 
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YQBexYHZBGM
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 9:03 pm

RL757PVD wrote:
Portlander wrote:
Other than a utopia for golfers, not sure what would lure Mainers to the Myrtle Beach area in the summer. Maybe it's about getting South Carolinians up to Maine though Charleston might be a better draw. PVD and PWM have been getting a lot of love recently!


After seeing what happened in Miami first hand this spring when airlines added all the capacity... if I lived in Maine, id plan to escape somewhere else this summer too! I hope the likely one-time massive influx doesn't grind things to a halt there this summer and ruin what makes it special and attractive.

Under other circumstances, I'd extend the invitation to both tourists and airlines to consider YHZ, YYG, YQM, YFC, YSJ, YQY if they find Maine destinations getting too crowded or overbooked. Unfortunately, until COVID related restrictions are lifted, that won't be possible. So, I hope the extra flights to Maine are successful.
 
RL757PVD
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 9:33 pm

YQBexYHZBGM wrote:
RL757PVD wrote:
Portlander wrote:
Other than a utopia for golfers, not sure what would lure Mainers to the Myrtle Beach area in the summer. Maybe it's about getting South Carolinians up to Maine though Charleston might be a better draw. PVD and PWM have been getting a lot of love recently!


After seeing what happened in Miami first hand this spring when airlines added all the capacity... if I lived in Maine, id plan to escape somewhere else this summer too! I hope the likely one-time massive influx doesn't grind things to a halt there this summer and ruin what makes it special and attractive.

Under other circumstances, I'd extend the invitation to both tourists and airlines to consider YHZ, YYG, YQM, YFC, YSJ, YQY if they find Maine destinations getting too crowded or overbooked. Unfortunately, until COVID related restrictions are lifted, that won't be possible. So, I hope the extra flights to Maine are successful.


I think EVERYONE should be looking at other destinations this summer and less traditional vacations that offer the same vibe, because these places getting all the new service are going to be completely mobbed. Think places like the finger lakes of New York, the shores of Lake Erie and Ontario, Central PA west of the Poconos etc that are less popular and arguably not as nice as Northern New England, but if you double the tourists, all of a sudden, become better in comparison.
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:54 pm

Looks like BTV finally got it's link to BOS. Daily on boutique air. Afternoon flights. Not sure the timing is good. Business would want morning out if btv and evening return.
 
mjgbtv
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:55 pm

Just saw that Boutique Air is starting a daily scheduled flight from BTV to BOS: https://www.wcax.com/2021/04/07/commute ... onnection/

It might go against the conventional wisdom, but it does seem like there is at least a small group of people who have wanted this.
 
EricBTV
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Wed Apr 07, 2021 11:50 pm

I'm interested to see how the Boutique Air service works out. I for one had wanted a BOS flight for international connections. I shouldn't complain about any new service at BTV, but I'm not sure this is that great of an option, even with the UA codeshare and AA interline agreement. My real question is whether or not they will operate out of the main terminal and in theory take the last remaining counter. Yes, dreams of a certain other carrier may just be dreams, but I'm still holding out hope.
 
B595
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Apr 08, 2021 12:04 am

slcdeltarumd11 wrote:
Looks like BTV finally got it's link to BOS. Daily on boutique air. Afternoon flights. Not sure the timing is good. Business would want morning out if btv and evening return.

Well, now is everyone’s chance to fly on a PC-12. Might be worth booking a trip just on that count.
 
mjgbtv
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Apr 08, 2021 1:30 am

EricBTV wrote:
I'm interested to see how the Boutique Air service works out. I for one had wanted a BOS flight for international connections. I shouldn't complain about any new service at BTV, but I'm not sure this is that great of an option, even with the UA codeshare and AA interline agreement. My real question is whether or not they will operate out of the main terminal and in theory take the last remaining counter. Yes, dreams of a certain other carrier may just be dreams, but I'm still holding out hope.


I have to believe that the airport would not let counter space stop a new carrier from coming.
 
airlineworker
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Apr 08, 2021 2:18 am

lat41 wrote:
slcdeltarumd11 wrote:
PVD523 wrote:
757 is a good bet but the 73G is capable of that op too.


Correct its a 73G the (737-700). Uniteds 737-700s have excellent runway performance out of SNA and have the range. It makes sense to start smaller and see how it goes. Hawaiian is flying out of Long Beach now so it's not really unserved . Avoiding LAX is the win bit getting to long beach is pretty easy for OC people and an even less stress airport there. If it's a hit, they can always go to a 757 but that's a pretty big jump , so the 73G is better to start.

Uniteds 737-700s would probably work on HVN-Florida if they wanted to try it.

Except the variety of weather at HVN is more challenging. More and changeable winds, contaminated runway surface and stormy weather that SNA doesn't get nearly as often. I don't know about the comparison of approaches and departures for the two so someone is welcome to comment.


Landings on runway 2 are good, mostly over water and not steep at all. Runway 20 landings have a much steeper approach, but recently trees were cut down that will enable the displaced threshold to be moved back. Waiting for the FAA to approve the change. Still waiting on an announcement soon regarding, quote, "We will have some exciting news to share in a few weeks." That's all I have and for some time G4 has been in contact with airport management. Looking at the level of service EYW and HHH have, both with much shorter runways and HHH with displaced thresholds at both ends, HVN should attract some new service. In the past, UA was mentioned as being interested. The New Haven metro area is quite large and could support much more service than it presently has, AA with 5 weekly flights to a second rate hub PHL. CLT generates much more in passenger numbers and destinations. Don't see UA doing N/S to Florida, mostly a hub operation, but HVN-ORD would do very well.
Hope to hear some good news soon that will make air travel for the coastline much easier having a nearby airport.
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Apr 08, 2021 5:25 am

EricBTV wrote:
I'm interested to see how the Boutique Air service works out. I for one had wanted a BOS flight for international connections. I shouldn't complain about any new service at BTV, but I'm not sure this is that great of an option, even with the UA codeshare and AA interline agreement. My real question is whether or not they will operate out of the main terminal and in theory take the last remaining counter. Yes, dreams of a certain other carrier may just be dreams, but I'm still holding out hope.


If a certain other carrier did start service I think we would see them put somewhere else. 737s would be too many people for what's left. Where the vending machines/pay phones are now I think could be reworked or move a car rental company or two over to near greyhound temporarily. I think they would need to get creative for WN.

A BOS link is really the missing business northeast city. I will definitely take the flight at some time.
 
EricBTV
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Apr 08, 2021 12:26 pm

mjgbtv & slcdeltarumd11 - You both are likely very right and I apologize for the negativity.

Starting in June the flights are bookable through United so I'm interested to see where I can go from BOS!
 
lat41
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Apr 08, 2021 12:26 pm

BlueBaller wrote:
PVD523 wrote:
Portlander wrote:
Thanks, so is it a safe bet that a 737-700 could make it as far as PHX or LAS from PWM with a 7200 foot runway if United or any other airline wanted to extend beyond DEN?

Definitely. WN ran PVD-LAS/PHX for years off runways of 6,081 and 7,166 ft.


Albeit weight-restricted during the hot and humid summer months, pre-runway extension of course.

Bucking the Winter jet stream presents a problem for Westbound cross country flights from shorter runways. On those days when the sole PWM runway is also contaminated during those months, it adds a bit more challenge.
 
BTVB6Flyer
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Apr 08, 2021 2:00 pm

Is the BTV-BOS an EAS route? If not seems kind of out of place, given the current environment. I know BTV has been begging for a BOS link for years, but if it didn't get it pre-COVID when any business PAX would have used the route, who is going to be flying the route post-COVID, when by and large, business demand is not there?

As for ticket space, they could easily do a joint B6/Boutique Air/F9 counter...or do what a lot of airports are starting to do, which is multi-use counters. Digital signage that can change to match outgoing flights.
 
RL757PVD
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Apr 08, 2021 2:40 pm

BTVB6Flyer wrote:
Is the BTV-BOS an EAS route? If not seems kind of out of place, given the current environment. I know BTV has been begging for a BOS link for years, but if it didn't get it pre-COVID when any business PAX would have used the route, who is going to be flying the route post-COVID, when by and large, business demand is not there?

As for ticket space, they could easily do a joint B6/Boutique Air/F9 counter...or do what a lot of airports are starting to do, which is multi-use counters. Digital signage that can change to match outgoing flights.


Its not EAS and I would expect the fares to be significantly higher than those seen on an EAS market, probably along the lines of $199 e/w

If B6 had something smaller than the E190 they'd already fly it, the PC-12 is way to small for what that market should be... should be something 3-4x daily in the 50-76 seat range
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
BTVB6Flyer
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Apr 08, 2021 2:47 pm

RL757PVD wrote:
BTVB6Flyer wrote:
Is the BTV-BOS an EAS route? If not seems kind of out of place, given the current environment. I know BTV has been begging for a BOS link for years, but if it didn't get it pre-COVID when any business PAX would have used the route, who is going to be flying the route post-COVID, when by and large, business demand is not there?

As for ticket space, they could easily do a joint B6/Boutique Air/F9 counter...or do what a lot of airports are starting to do, which is multi-use counters. Digital signage that can change to match outgoing flights.


Its not EAS and I would expect the fares to be significantly higher than those seen on an EAS market, probably along the lines of $199 e/w

If B6 had something smaller than the E190 they'd already fly it, the PC-12 is way to small for what that market should be... should be something 3-4x daily in the 50-76 seat range



If that was the case why hasn't anyone major tried flying the route, since it was last flown by a airline in 2008?
 
RL757PVD
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Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Apr 08, 2021 3:37 pm

BTVB6Flyer wrote:
RL757PVD wrote:
BTVB6Flyer wrote:
Is the BTV-BOS an EAS route? If not seems kind of out of place, given the current environment. I know BTV has been begging for a BOS link for years, but if it didn't get it pre-COVID when any business PAX would have used the route, who is going to be flying the route post-COVID, when by and large, business demand is not there?

As for ticket space, they could easily do a joint B6/Boutique Air/F9 counter...or do what a lot of airports are starting to do, which is multi-use counters. Digital signage that can change to match outgoing flights.


Its not EAS and I would expect the fares to be significantly higher than those seen on an EAS market, probably along the lines of $199 e/w

If B6 had something smaller than the E190 they'd already fly it, the PC-12 is way to small for what that market should be... should be something 3-4x daily in the 50-76 seat range



If that was the case why hasn't anyone major tried flying the route, since it was last flown by a airline in 2008?


I think it has to do with gate space at BOS... the two airlines that are most likely to do it, DL and B6, are the most gate constrained, especially at key banks that they'd aim to feed.
Experience is what you get when what you thought would work out didn't!
 
mernest
Posts: 17
Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2016 7:51 pm

Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Apr 08, 2021 4:53 pm

BTVB6Flyer wrote:
who is going to be flying the route post-COVID, when by and large, business demand is not there?


Amtrak to NYC is cancelled; Greyhound to Boston is cancelled; Vermont Translines to Albany is cancelled; Megabus to Bostons is Friday/Sunday only.

The only daily alternative to driving yourself in/out of Burlington is flying.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 9599
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Apr 08, 2021 5:07 pm

BTVB6Flyer wrote:
RL757PVD wrote:
BTVB6Flyer wrote:
Is the BTV-BOS an EAS route? If not seems kind of out of place, given the current environment. I know BTV has been begging for a BOS link for years, but if it didn't get it pre-COVID when any business PAX would have used the route, who is going to be flying the route post-COVID, when by and large, business demand is not there?

As for ticket space, they could easily do a joint B6/Boutique Air/F9 counter...or do what a lot of airports are starting to do, which is multi-use counters. Digital signage that can change to match outgoing flights.


Its not EAS and I would expect the fares to be significantly higher than those seen on an EAS market, probably along the lines of $199 e/w

If B6 had something smaller than the E190 they'd already fly it, the PC-12 is way to small for what that market should be... should be something 3-4x daily in the 50-76 seat range



If that was the case why hasn't anyone major tried flying the route, since it was last flown by a airline in 2008?


That's a good question. My answer is that it's 3:15 by toll-free interstate with little elevation change, and most everyone in BOS or BTV with the money to fly already has a vehicle with AWD and heated seats. The schedule flexibility with driving yourself is valuable. This crowd was never going to consider Greyhound, Megabus, or Vermont Translines.
 
airbazar
Posts: 10377
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Apr 08, 2021 5:45 pm

RL757PVD wrote:
Its not EAS and I would expect the fares to be significantly higher than those seen on an EAS market, probably along the lines of $199 e/w

It says fares starting at $79 one way.
https://www.wcax.com/2021/04/07/commute ... onnection/
I'm sure there will be some number of people who value time and will use it for a day trip to Boston however I think by and large it will be just another connection option. Seems to be priced just high enough to make people consider it vs. driving to Boston and paying Logan parking costs.
 
slcdeltarumd11
Posts: 5155
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2004 7:30 am

Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Apr 08, 2021 9:55 pm

Businesses can't ask people to drive 3.5 hours in what can be alot more with traffic. You can't do a today trip to your regional office. This has made the burlington area rely alot more on nyc and nj then boston for business connections. The mass transit to boston stinks. No Amtrak, no flights.
Some boston area businesses and Vermont businesses have wanted this for a long time. The airport had a list of companies who said they would use the flight in their pitch. If your regional office is in boston your driving or trying to get territories shifted.

The problem is the timing stinks. It's still easier to fly out of btv on a morning departure and fly home in the evening to phl, dc, ewr or lga to do business. All those can be true day trips. The bos flight timing I know is not what the airport wanted. In the end the timing wasn't their choice. Can't complain though still good for connections. Since there is no train to boston either there will be takers. It's not EAS if people don't use this service it's going to leave. True use it or lose it. They partner with both AA and I think will send bags to United. That offers a pretty good set of connections. Any additional optionals help.
 
debonair
Posts: 4235
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2004 10:50 pm

Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Apr 08, 2021 11:10 pm

Sorry, if discussed before...
Elite Airways Announces Daily Nonstops to Martha’s Vineyard and Nantucket from White Plains, with one-way fares as low as $129*


https://res.eliteairways.net/Media
 
slcdeltarumd11
Posts: 5155
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2004 7:30 am

Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Thu Apr 08, 2021 11:56 pm

White plains is the perfect airport. They have a shot
 
HVNandrew
Posts: 575
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2006 1:05 am

Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 09, 2021 12:47 am

debonair wrote:
Sorry, if discussed before...
Elite Airways Announces Daily Nonstops to Martha’s Vineyard and Nantucket from White Plains, with one-way fares as low as $129*


https://res.eliteairways.net/Media

That should do well. ACK and MVY are extremely popular for Westchester and Fairfield County residents over the summer, and they aren't the easiest places to get to. ACK will have quite a bit of lift this summer with B6 and 9K also on the route.
 
madg
Posts: 11
Joined: Mon Jun 10, 2013 5:30 am

Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:06 am

HVNandrew wrote:
debonair wrote:
Sorry, if discussed before...
Elite Airways Announces Daily Nonstops to Martha’s Vineyard and Nantucket from White Plains, with one-way fares as low as $129*


https://res.eliteairways.net/Media

That should do well. ACK and MVY are extremely popular for Westchester and Fairfield County residents over the summer, and they aren't the easiest places to get to. ACK will have quite a bit of lift this summer with B6 and 9K also on the route.


I give it a 50/50 if Elite actually markets the route it might do well. Elite has a LONG HISTORY of starting routes and ending them. A few years back they promised New Bedford, MA the moon and only did a few flights from VRB-EWB. The EWB flights only got a few people.
 
airlineworker
Posts: 344
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2019 1:20 am

Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 09, 2021 2:35 am

In June AA will have better flight times on the PHL-HVN route, early AM departure to PHL and late night arrival from PHL allowing a much better selection of connections. Still hoping for AA to switch to CLT, much better hub that PHL.
 
PVD523
Posts: 73
Joined: Tue Jan 14, 2020 8:01 am

Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 09, 2021 8:42 am

AA's schedule from June 3 onward hasn't been finalized yet, it's still just a placeholder. Keep an eye out for changes.
 
Ishrion
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Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:17 am

Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 09, 2021 12:10 pm

Has BTV ever had a flight to Fort Lauderdale?
Leaving the forums. You may know where to find me.
 
EFA2014
Posts: 23
Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2016 1:42 pm

Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 09, 2021 12:11 pm

Portlander wrote:
It is daily and continues until early November. PWM is also in the process of securing funding for it's long overdue FIS station along with the addition of two new jetways for future gates 12 and 14.

Do you have some more information on this? Is the FIS a buildout of the nonjetway gate 1? Are there any posted plans on what the expansion will look like for gate 12/14?
 
Portlander
Posts: 174
Joined: Mon May 28, 2018 12:57 am

Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:26 pm

The latest information I have received places the FIS in the "hidden" space across from Gate 5, where it was completely built out for Customs but never had the opportunity to be utilized just prior to 9/11. The TSA then arrived and gutted everything and turned the area into their current offices where I was actually working at the time. It appears that the TSA has signed off and will move to the upper level mechanical offices/former restaurant on the far eastern part of the terminal to accommodate the FIS. The jetport is waiting for funding to commence this project and is optimistic it will come through in the near future.

As much as I was hoping that the terminal would be physically extended beyond Gate 11, it appears that the two new jetways will be connected to an elevated enclosed walkway similar to Gate 1. This approach is becoming more common with airports in order to save money and it has been determined that there is ample passenger holding space at that end of the concourse. The apron has already been fortified and painted and once the funds are available the transition should be effortless. When completed, it will give PWM 12 jetways for larger aircraft and 2 additional smaller loading bridges (Gate 1A/B) for regional jets.

Hope that answers your questions and I'll give any updates as they come along.
 
B595
Posts: 262
Joined: Wed Mar 18, 2009 4:52 am

Re: The Rest of New England (BDL/PVD/MHT/PWM/ORH/BTV/HVN/BGR) Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:43 pm

Ishrion wrote:
Has BTV ever had a flight to Fort Lauderdale?

Not that I can recall. B6 flew to MCO and G4 to SFB. Historically, I don’t think there were any nonstop Florida flights prior to those. But I’m happy to be corrected.
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