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New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Jan 01, 2021 11:47 am

Welcome to the New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread 2021. Please continue to post your news and your discussion here.

For EWR news and discussion please see:

NYC (JFK/EWR/LGA/SWF/HPN/ISP) Aviation Thread - 2021

Link to previous thread:

https://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1437973
 
Nicknuzzii
Posts: 1848
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Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri Jan 01, 2021 3:12 pm

Hopefully we can retain some of F9s TTN service this year! As for ACY, I hope we see Spirit hold strong. B6 joining either of the markets would nice as well.
 
savethemanuals
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Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat Jan 02, 2021 5:46 am

Anyone have insight into how F9 is doing at TTN right now? As they're a private company it's difficult to know how the operation is going.
 
Nicknuzzii
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Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat Jan 02, 2021 6:01 am

savethemanuals wrote:
Anyone have insight into how F9 is doing at TTN right now? As they're a private company it's difficult to know how the operation is going.


Based off their schedule, not good. Not good at all.
 
Jerseyguy
Posts: 2241
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Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri May 07, 2021 3:31 am

So two things going on at TTN right now.

1. The new paved overflow lot is finished. Its what the overflow lot should have been from the start. Its 800 spaces and is brand new. Its on Scotch Rd it's on the Southside of the curve near Rwy 6/24 on the 24 side. Its not open since there is no need for it. The lot right in front of the terminal now known as the Tuskegee lot was 75-80% full while the other lot near the terminal the Amelia Earhart lot had like 10-15% full. T
he gate was open so I drove in and there are signs that the rental cars are going to be over there hopefully that's for the general aviation rentals while a new terminal is being built for them. I saw time and time again reviews complaining about the muddy field that used to be the overflow lot.

2. New Terminal is estimated to be completed late 2023 early 2024. 4 gates with jetbridges, more concessions, room for up to 5 car rental companies and 3,TSA checkpoints (125,000 sq ft). Perhaps more airlines will be interested by that point.
 
gdavis003
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Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri May 07, 2021 4:22 am

Jerseyguy wrote:
So two things going on at TTN right now.

1. The new paved overflow lot is finished. Its what the overflow lot should have been from the start. Its 800 spaces and is brand new. Its on Scotch Rd it's on the Southside of the curve near Rwy 6/24 on the 24 side. Its not open since there is no need for it. The lot right in front of the terminal now known as the Tuskegee lot was 75-80% full while the other lot near the terminal the Amelia Earhart lot had like 10-15% full. T
he gate was open so I drove in and there are signs that the rental cars are going to be over there hopefully that's for the general aviation rentals while a new terminal is being built for them. I saw time and time again reviews complaining about the muddy field that used to be the overflow lot.

2. New Terminal is estimated to be completed late 2023 early 2024. 4 gates with jetbridges, more concessions, room for up to 5 car rental companies and 3,TSA checkpoints (125,000 sq ft). Perhaps more airlines will be interested by that point.


The new terminal will certainly be a draw. As a part-time resident of Mercer County, I have always hesitated to use F9 and fly out of TTN due to the small terminal. I tend to gravitate towards PHL, even though the SEPTA/NJ Transit journey is a bit more complex than the straight shot up to EWR. Once the terminal expands, they could hopefully capture some of the leisure traffic of the central NJ region and maybe some university/pharmaceutical related travel. I would imagine that they could capture traffic from as far north as Edison or so to as far south as around Burlington, and probably some PA traffic from Levittown/Bristol/Croydon area.
 
Jerseyguy
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Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri May 07, 2021 5:24 am

gdavis003 wrote:
The new terminal will certainly be a draw. As a part-time resident of Mercer County, I have always hesitated to use F9 and fly out of TTN due to the small terminal. I tend to gravitate towards PHL, even though the SEPTA/NJ Transit journey is a bit more complex than the straight shot up to EWR. Once the terminal expands, they could hopefully capture some of the leisure traffic of the central NJ region and maybe some university/pharmaceutical related travel. I would imagine that they could capture traffic from as far north as Edison or so to as far south as around Burlington, and probably some PA traffic from Levittown/Bristol/Croydon area.


I've been waiting for this terminal since around late 2013 is when they started talking about it. Our NIMBY friends have been putting so much pressure on Mercer county so they've had to make sure everything was in place before they pulled the trigger. It still could be delayed even further as I have a feeling they will sue to stop the EA from being final I figured out once the catchment could be as much as 2-2.5 million people where it is more convenient to fly from Trenton than PHL or EWR. Once this terminal is in, it will be a no brainer. On a flight several years ago in February, I once made it from my car in the parking lot in front of the building to the gate in less than 10 minutes (Including checking a bag).

Oh and one thing I cant believe I forgot to mention is they are putting in a 4 story 1000 space parking garage as well. Parking has always been an issue during peak periods and this is going to change it. Once this happens I see a second airline like Jetblue, Breeze or someone coming. I don't see a major coming as a connection in a hub defeats the convenience.

I found this rendering that was placed in the recent EA release of the new terminal and parking garage. Its going to be very nice when its done
http://trentonairportinfo.com/files/resized/132886/1170;600;d00686f01b06009c9c5667c8035077c8e7bf5ceb.jpg
 
savethemanuals
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Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri May 07, 2021 6:50 am

Renderings look great, I hope it goes through.

Maybe some noise abatement procedures could quell the NIMBYs? I flew out of TTN in early 2020 on a 6am flight, we rocketed to 2000ft, then the engines were throttled back to near silence until we had cleared residential areas in Lower Makefield. This procedure plus being on an A320neo must be about as good as it gets in commercial ops.

A pretty fun ride with the short runway and sudden slowdown, too
 
Nicknuzzii
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Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri May 07, 2021 11:25 am

As far as destinations and expansion goes, I think F9 will obviously expand next year. Pretty late in the game for this summer they threw MYR/CHS back on the schedule which is good. I’m not anticipating DTW/MSP coming back so hopefully those flights shift towards MIA/PBI/TPA/MCO. Down the road both Avelo and Breeze have mentioned TTN but are also both scared off by F9. AA to CLT would work great and they could run it up to 3x a day and it still be full. TTN has to take advantage of this leisure market like ACY has.
 
Jerseyguy
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Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Fri May 07, 2021 11:32 pm

Nicknuzzii wrote:
As far as destinations and expansion goes, I think F9 will obviously expand next year. Pretty late in the game for this summer they threw MYR/CHS back on the schedule which is good. I’m not anticipating DTW/MSP coming back so hopefully those flights shift towards MIA/PBI/TPA/MCO. Down the road both Avelo and Breeze have mentioned TTN but are also both scared off by F9. AA to CLT would work great and they could run it up to 3x a day and it still be full. TTN has to take advantage of this leisure market like ACY has.

I don't see it being easy to have another airline get into TTN until the new terminal is finished. F9 will do what they need to (change schedules, add flights) in order to make it difficult for either of them. Breeze has the edge because it won't have as many pax and will fit better in the waiting area than Avelo. If Breeze decides to do longer flights in a year or so, it can fly to a destination that F9 can't without a big weight penalty. The a220 or even the E190 is better for the 6,006ft runway. In the new terminal plans mercer county talks about the possibility of regional planes, so perhaps they are thinking an express carrier.
 
andrikACY
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Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:30 am

 
phluser
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Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:44 am

gdavis003 wrote:
. I would imagine that they could capture traffic from as far north as Edison or so to as far south as around Burlington, and probably some PA traffic from Levittown/Bristol/Croydon area.


I'd say as far south as Cherry Hill area. It's not a difficult or long drive up 295/ NJ 29.
 
Jerseyguy
Posts: 2241
Joined: Sun Oct 30, 2005 12:05 pm

Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat Jun 19, 2021 8:47 am

savethemanuals wrote:
Renderings look great, I hope it goes through.

Maybe some noise abatement procedures could quell the NIMBYs? I flew out of TTN in early 2020 on a 6am flight, we rocketed to 2000ft, then the engines were throttled back to near silence until we had cleared residential areas in Lower Makefield. This procedure plus being on an A320neo must be about as good as it gets in commercial ops.

A pretty fun ride with the short runway and sudden slowdown, too

Oops, I totally missed the nose abatement part of your post earlier. I didn't know they were doing that, this takes a little wind out of the NIMBYs argument atleast the ones in Bucks County. It seems like 2 things are happening

1. BRRAM (the Bucks County, PA nimby group) seems to be quieter and are letting Trenton Threatened Skies (TTS) which is the group from NJ (primarily Ewing, Hopewell and Pennington) provide most of the argument. I'll assume this is likely due to PA traffic having those noise abatement procedures in place. while the takeoffs towards NJ (Rwy 6) not having those in place

2. They have moved further away from the noise complaints probably due to the new procedures and have started in on possible ground water contamination from the former GM plant which is located on the other side of the airport. Trees were removed and some where replanted in order to comply with RPZ projects. They doing all they can to disrupt the terminal EA even though it is a separate project. Luckily NJ politicans have gone on the record during the public comment period.

I am moving late this year so the terminal doesn't affect me as much anymore, but it will be nice to possibly have an option to fly into NJ for my VFR travel. The people of Central Jersey deserve this airport, its time for them to realize its potential in both convenience and economic opportunity for the area
 
nkops
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Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat Jun 19, 2021 11:45 am

[photoid][/photoid]
andrikACY wrote:


Good for ACY.. with Swift doing the Caesar charters and NK back to full strength (and even a little more with the addition of MIA coming up) , hopefully they can surpass their pre-covid numbers. ACY always struck me as a city G4 would try with their less than daily flights, although Florida is pretty much covered by NK.
Turn left heading 080 contact departure
 
NJFlyer27
Posts: 36
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Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat Jun 19, 2021 12:01 pm

In regards to ACY, does anyone know if or when
GlobalX plans to start operating from here?

https://www.globalairlinesgroup.com/about.html
 
Nicknuzzii
Posts: 1848
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Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Sat Jun 19, 2021 12:23 pm

nkops wrote:
[photoid][/photoid]
andrikACY wrote:


Good for ACY.. with Swift doing the Caesar charters and NK back to full strength (and even a little more with the addition of MIA coming up) , hopefully they can surpass their pre-covid numbers. ACY always struck me as a city G4 would try with their less than daily flights, although Florida is pretty much covered by NK.


Read that Hardrock was doing something similar in addition to this.
 
nkops
Posts: 2263
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Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun Jun 20, 2021 11:58 am

NJFlyer27 wrote:
In regards to ACY, does anyone know if or when
GlobalX plans to start operating from here?

https://www.globalairlinesgroup.com/about.html


Never even heard of these guys until now.. how long has this been planned?

Unless they get a contract with a casino (assuming this even gets off the ground), not sure what other charter opportunities there are out of ACY
Turn left heading 080 contact departure
 
slcdeltarumd11
Posts: 5123
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Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Sun Jun 20, 2021 1:13 pm

Yeah I would imagine any charter to AC would have to work with a casino. They often offer free or very reduced prices to their higher tiered rewards members so that pulls people in. Basically an investment to get people there on weekdays. Seems to work , not sure the cost vs benefits but getting people from the east coast shouldn't be too hard with a direct flight and deals.
 
andrikACY
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2018 12:07 am

Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Mon Jun 21, 2021 1:30 pm

nkops wrote:
[photoid][/photoid]
andrikACY wrote:


Good for ACY.. with Swift doing the Caesar charters and NK back to full strength (and even a little more with the addition of MIA coming up) , hopefully they can surpass their pre-covid numbers. ACY always struck me as a city G4 would try with their less than daily flights, although Florida is pretty much covered by NK.


I would think G4 would do well at ACY with some different destination, but NK does have Florida covered (with MIA pending). You would think though with all of these casino's operating their "charters" they would work together and try to establish consistent air service to ACY.
 
nkops
Posts: 2263
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 10:09 am

Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Mon Jun 21, 2021 6:02 pm

andrikACY wrote:
nkops wrote:
[photoid][/photoid]
andrikACY wrote:


Good for ACY.. with Swift doing the Caesar charters and NK back to full strength (and even a little more with the addition of MIA coming up) , hopefully they can surpass their pre-covid numbers. ACY always struck me as a city G4 would try with their less than daily flights, although Florida is pretty much covered by NK.


I would think G4 would do well at ACY with some different destination, but NK does have Florida covered (with MIA pending). You would think though with all of these casino's operating their "charters" they would work together and try to establish consistent air service to ACY.


When NK operated BOS, DTW and ORD out of ACY thats exactly what it was.. majority of the passengers were on junkets and usually about 4 or 5 different casinos on each flight.
Turn left heading 080 contact departure
 
NJFlyer27
Posts: 36
Joined: Sun Feb 14, 2021 7:19 pm

Re: New Jersey (ACY, TTN) Aviation Thread - 2021

Mon Jun 21, 2021 7:06 pm

nkops wrote:
andrikACY wrote:
nkops wrote:
[photoid][/photoid]

Good for ACY.. with Swift doing the Caesar charters and NK back to full strength (and even a little more with the addition of MIA coming up) , hopefully they can surpass their pre-covid numbers. ACY always struck me as a city G4 would try with their less than daily flights, although Florida is pretty much covered by NK.


I would think G4 would do well at ACY with some different destination, but NK does have Florida covered (with MIA pending). You would think though with all of these casino's operating their "charters" they would work together and try to establish consistent air service to ACY.


When NK operated BOS, DTW and ORD out of ACY thats exactly what it was.. majority of the passengers were on junkets and usually about 4 or 5 different casinos on each flight.


Seasonal flights from BOS, DTW and ORD should be added again. Other Midwestern cities CLE, PIT, and could work well too.

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