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CX747
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Sun Nov 14, 2021 4:06 am

There is a silver 747 in that photo. Looks to have a bird on the tail. Can anyone tell me who operated that?
 
wjcandee
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Sun Nov 14, 2021 4:54 am

CX747 wrote:
There is a silver 747 in that photo. Looks to have a bird on the tail. Can anyone tell me who operated that?


Norskfreight -- a fictional airline -- in the movie "Tenet". Former Cathay 747 used as a movie prop. Apparently, they fake-crash it into a fake hangar.

https://www.aviation24.be/airlines/cath ... vie-tenet/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVqNJRyxQTM
 
a2b7
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Sun Nov 14, 2021 10:03 am

DL757NYC wrote:
CX747 wrote:
a2b7 wrote:
Even if there still was an active B744 cargo conversion line, it would simply be too late for a number of DL B744s. There is a photo on airlines.net from Jun 2021 that shows 9 of them being parted out at MZJ:


Excellent find. -2 on my behalf for not doing further research on what state they were actually in. At least we know the parts are going to good use and will keep the active fleet going for quite some time. Amazing to think that jets in that age group are gone, meanwhile I passed some 1960s produced KC-135 tails a week or two back. They were just raring to go.


Those that are being scrapped are the 10-12 that were delivered between 89-90. They flew until 2019. The 99-03 builds are still intact last time I saw photos.

Well, what you see in the photo above is a mix of both, when you compare them to the photos from Jan 2021 below, where some registrations and fleet numbers are readable. It is true that there are still some newer builds that are in storage and intact.
 
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747classic
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Sun Nov 14, 2021 10:42 am

Seen the present strain at the workforce at IAI, it will be nearly impossible to order any 744 P-F conversion, perhaps a 744combi to 744BDSF seems a (remote) possibility, requiring less labour.

I even have some doubt if an IAI 744 P-F conversion is still offered at an acceptable price level.

Note : A P-F conversion of a full pax 744, (without a SCD and strengthend main deck beams), like all Delta 744's, will be nearly impossible and will be very expensive and with a long leadtime, especially for the side cargo door frame and the new floor beams.
 
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Revelation
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Sun Nov 14, 2021 3:24 pm

Boeing announcement at DAS:

To meet strong demand for our 737-800 Boeing Converted Freighter (BCF), we have announced plans to open new conversion lines at Boeing's London Gatwick MRO facility (Europe) and KF Aerospace (Canada).

Ref: https://twitter.com/BoeingMidEast/statu ... 2339262467

Hmmm, high touch work in relatively expensive locales such as UK (greater London) and Canada (greater Vancouver or Toronto)? This isn't China, Mexico, Indonesia, Philippines, etc.

Regardless, these birds are going to be EVERYWHERE in a few years!

Funny, I thought we'd see FX convert 738s back when they were looking at alternatives that eventually resulted in their 757 conversion program, but back then the feedstock was still too costly since 738s were still mainline pax aircraft. Now that literally thousands will be coming out of the fleet, there really will be nothing much else to do with them but convert them to freighters.
 
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Spacepope
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Sun Nov 14, 2021 4:46 pm

Revelation wrote:
Boeing announcement at DAS:

To meet strong demand for our 737-800 Boeing Converted Freighter (BCF), we have announced plans to open new conversion lines at Boeing's London Gatwick MRO facility (Europe) and KF Aerospace (Canada).

Ref: https://twitter.com/BoeingMidEast/statu ... 2339262467

Hmmm, high touch work in relatively expensive locales such as UK (greater London) and Canada (greater Vancouver or Toronto)? This isn't China, Mexico, Indonesia, Philippines, etc.

Regardless, these birds are going to be EVERYWHERE in a few years!

Funny, I thought we'd see FX convert 738s back when they were looking at alternatives that eventually resulted in their 757 conversion program, but back then the feedstock was still too costly since 738s were still mainline pax aircraft. Now that literally thousands will be coming out of the fleet, there really will be nothing much else to do with them but convert them to freighters.


This is really interesting with the other 738F conversions I mentioned a few days ago, noting that 738F deliveries are exceeding new MAX deliveries right now. Bedek doing conversions on them at TLV, MEX and in China, AEI at DHN, MIA and YLW, Boeing now adding all these lines including wrangling the YLW facility to do BCF in addition to their SF work.

It's interesting to see these 738s get a new lease on life, since the -700s were such a hot commodity for so long on the second hand market due to WN's buying spree. This is going to seriously screw with the used CFM market though, just like the WN buys did as well.

I think we're seeing part of the demand from the exhaustion of decent -400 feedstock. The European operators are in the middle of transitioning from the -400 to the -800, and we're seeing some of their old classic conversions get booted on to secondary markets like South America.

I'd still be interested to see if FX or UPS picks up something smaller than the 752, and I'm sure they are keeping an eye on numbers from Sun Country and ASL (the latter of which is operating 738Fs in FX colors). The recently retired early AA 738 fleet would be a good get for them, and AA tends to have surprisingly low fleet utilization compared to other operators (looking at SDRs they are in the 60k hour range, with UA's similar vintage ones almost 20,000 hours higher on the clock). We've seen LNs in the -3000s go for conversion, and one only 9 years old.

Expect to see some shift when the 7MAX comes online, WN will start dumping -700s as they come up for heavy MX (their oldest ones are slowly being ferried out of VCV to MIA for heavy checks and a new lease on life) but without a steady stream of aircraft for the scrappers (which till about 2 years ago was the early -800s), and with increased utilization of frames that would have otherwise been parked, the engines will start to be a bit of a concern.
 
CX747
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Sun Nov 14, 2021 5:57 pm

Spacepope wrote:
Revelation wrote:
Boeing announcement at DAS:

To meet strong demand for our 737-800 Boeing Converted Freighter (BCF), we have announced plans to open new conversion lines at Boeing's London Gatwick MRO facility (Europe) and KF Aerospace (Canada).

Ref: https://twitter.com/BoeingMidEast/statu ... 2339262467

Hmmm, high touch work in relatively expensive locales such as UK (greater London) and Canada (greater Vancouver or Toronto)? This isn't China, Mexico, Indonesia, Philippines, etc.

Regardless, these birds are going to be EVERYWHERE in a few years!

Funny, I thought we'd see FX convert 738s back when they were looking at alternatives that eventually resulted in their 757 conversion program, but back then the feedstock was still too costly since 738s were still mainline pax aircraft. Now that literally thousands will be coming out of the fleet, there really will be nothing much else to do with them but convert them to freighters.


This is really interesting with the other 738F conversions I mentioned a few days ago, noting that 738F deliveries are exceeding new MAX deliveries right now. Bedek doing conversions on them at TLV, MEX and in China, AEI at DHN, MIA and YLW, Boeing now adding all these lines including wrangling the YLW facility to do BCF in addition to their SF work.

It's interesting to see these 738s get a new lease on life, since the -700s were such a hot commodity for so long on the second hand market due to WN's buying spree. This is going to seriously screw with the used CFM market though, just like the WN buys did as well.

I think we're seeing part of the demand from the exhaustion of decent -400 feedstock. The European operators are in the middle of transitioning from the -400 to the -800, and we're seeing some of their old classic conversions get booted on to secondary markets like South America.

I'd still be interested to see if FX or UPS picks up something smaller than the 752, and I'm sure they are keeping an eye on numbers from Sun Country and ASL (the latter of which is operating 738Fs in FX colors). The recently retired early AA 738 fleet would be a good get for them, and AA tends to have surprisingly low fleet utilization compared to other operators (looking at SDRs they are in the 60k hour range, with UA's similar vintage ones almost 20,000 hours higher on the clock). We've seen LNs in the -3000s go for conversion, and one only 9 years old.

Expect to see some shift when the 7MAX comes online, WN will start dumping -700s as they come up for heavy MX (their oldest ones are slowly being ferried out of VCV to MIA for heavy checks and a new lease on life) but without a steady stream of aircraft for the scrappers (which till about 2 years ago was the early -800s), and with increased utilization of frames that would have otherwise been parked, the engines will start to be a bit of a concern.


Outstanding analysis. The second hand market for these jets and continued conversion/maintenance support will be a good revenue generator for all the manufacturers involved. Obviously, Boeing would like to capture as much of the "new" market as possible but their ability, while getting back up and running, to tackle this conversion market is only a plus for them when production levels are back to normal.

Your thoughts on the ex-AA 737-800s mimic my own. Consistent setup, well maintained and not used as much. I just don't know if either Purple or Brown have a need right now. Some at Purple will say the 757s are a little old but others completely disagree. On the Brown side, not a peep on that fleet other than operating like clock-work.

In other news, Boeing executives were discussing in the last 72 hours the future of the 767. Either exemptions for the 2027 guidelines and continuation of the 767-300F, or a re-engining of the 767-400 for freighter duties. A re-engined 767-400ER, as a freighter with 787 engines is very compelling. That would fit very nicely in for Purple and Brown.

Peak is upon us boys.....
 
aristoenigma
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Sun Nov 14, 2021 10:18 pm

747classic wrote:
Seen the present strain at the workforce at IAI, it will be nearly impossible to order any 744 P-F conversion, perhaps a 744combi to 744BDSF seems a (remote) possibility, requiring less labour.

I even have some doubt if an IAI 744 P-F conversion is still offered at an acceptable price level.

Note : A P-F conversion of a full pax 744, (without a SCD and strengthened main deck beams), like all Delta 744's, will be nearly impossible and will be very expensive and with a long leadtime, especially for the side cargo door frame and the new floor beams.


Does this mean all sitting stored Delta 744s can at best become parts donors for existing 744Fs and converted 744Fs?. And also engine sources for 767Fs and converted 767Fs? Does phreighter use make any economical sense for Delta 744s?
 
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Revelation
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Mon Nov 15, 2021 1:02 am

Re: 738 BCF: It's actually three new lines, two lines in Canada, one line in UK:

https://boeing.mediaroom.com/2021-11-14 ... 737-800BCF

Also: Icelease orders eleven 737-800BCF; will be launch customer for new conversion line at London Gatwick MRO facility

And a reminder: Earlier this year, Boeing announced it would create additional 737-800BCF conversion capacity at several sites, including a third conversion line at Guangzhou Aircraft Maintenance Engineering Company Limited (GAMECO), and two conversion lines in 2022 with a new supplier, Cooperativa Autogestionaria de Servicios Aeroindustriales (COOPESA) in Costa Rica.

Along with the other facilities mentioned in the last few posts, it's an amazing amount of conversion capacity.
 
wjcandee
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Mon Nov 15, 2021 3:33 am

Revelation wrote:
Along with the other facilities mentioned in the last few posts, it's an amazing amount of conversion capacity.


Enormous. Excellent point.

Interesting, too, that Boeing is adding KF, which AEI is already using for their 738 conversion. Well, I say AEI is "using" them, but I'm not sure they've been getting exactly a high volume yet. Most AEI 738 work seems to be being done at Commercial Jet still. KF is a good shop, and they deserve the opportunity to make some $$ from this touch work, regardless of what vendor orders it.
 
DLNZ
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Mon Nov 15, 2021 5:28 am

Looks like National may have picked up some work for Brown earlier than projected. N936CA has operated SDF-CGN at the tail end of a stock standard military west, civilian east TPAC pattern.
 
wjcandee
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Mon Nov 15, 2021 6:59 am

DLNZ wrote:
Looks like National may have picked up some work for Brown earlier than projected. N936CA has operated SDF-CGN at the tail end of a stock standard military west, civilian east TPAC pattern.


I noticed that, too. We'll see if it's a one-off or something regular.
 
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747classic
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Mon Nov 15, 2021 7:07 am

aristoenigma wrote:

Does this mean all sitting stored Delta 744s can at best become parts donors for existing 744Fs and converted 744Fs


Yes

aristoenigma wrote:
also engine sources for 767Fs and converted 767Fs?


Only for PW powered 744-BCF, -BDSF and -F, MD11F and converted 767's , no factory built 767-300F has PW power, all are GE powered.


aristoenigma wrote:
Does phreighter use make any economical sense for Delta 744s?


No, the costs for activating this birds are simply too high, they are used to the maintenance treshold : all require a HMV, incl all AD's and most engines are already removed and re-used and have to be sourced again, further increasing the costs.
Only full freighters have enough earning power to justify the reactivation costs from long-term storage.
 
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Mon Nov 15, 2021 4:03 pm

747classic wrote:
Only full freighters have enough earning power to justify the reactivation costs from long-term storage.

I think your post is excellent but just this bit confuses me, didn't we see a least one or two 744-BCFs reactivated from storage to help with the post-covid freighter boom? I agree it can't be done to unconverted 744s especially heavily cannibalized ones, but if an already converted 744BCF has not been cannibalized much, wouldn't it find a use in the current environment?
 
Newark727
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Mon Nov 15, 2021 4:06 pm

For all this thread's scholars of Western Global's fleet reliability, here's N344KD appearing to be in a bit of a pickle:
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/WGN ... /KLAX/KLAX
 
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747classic
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Mon Nov 15, 2021 4:35 pm

Revelation wrote:
747classic wrote:
Only full freighters have enough earning power to justify the reactivation costs from long-term storage.

I think your post is excellent but just this bit confuses me, didn't we see a least one or two 744-BCFs reactivated from storage to help with the post-covid freighter boom? I agree it can't be done to unconverted 744s especially heavily cannibalized ones, but if an already converted 744BCF has not been cannibalized much, wouldn't it find a use in the current environment?


A 744BCF or 744BDSF is also a full freighter, like a factory built 744F. All have approx the same payload/range.
All full P-F converted 744's or factory built 744F's are at the moment potential reactivation candidates.
Long-term stored all pax 744 are definite not fit for reactivation, the reactivation costs cannot be earned back.
The 744 combi's, used as a "half " freighter with some light cargo carried at the fwd maindeck, are a temporally solution, only profitable in the current high yield cargo environment.
 
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Revelation
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Mon Nov 15, 2021 4:57 pm

747classic wrote:
Revelation wrote:
747classic wrote:
Only full freighters have enough earning power to justify the reactivation costs from long-term storage.

I think your post is excellent but just this bit confuses me, didn't we see a least one or two 744-BCFs reactivated from storage to help with the post-covid freighter boom? I agree it can't be done to unconverted 744s especially heavily cannibalized ones, but if an already converted 744BCF has not been cannibalized much, wouldn't it find a use in the current environment?


A 744BCF or 744BDSF is also a full freighter, like a factory built 744F. All have approx the same payload/range.
All full P-F converted 744's or factory built 744F's are at the moment potential reactivation candidates.
Long-term stored all pax 744 are definite not fit for reactivation, the reactivation costs cannot be earned back.
The 744 combi's, used as a "half " freighter with some light cargo carried at the fwd maindeck, are a temporally solution, only profitable in the current high yield cargo environment.

Ahh, yep, I get it. I was confused by the terminology, I was reading "full freighter" as "factory freighter", my bad. Now we are in full agreement.
 
DLNZ
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Mon Nov 15, 2021 10:43 pm

wjcandee wrote:
DLNZ wrote:
Looks like National may have picked up some work for Brown earlier than projected. N936CA has operated SDF-CGN at the tail end of a stock standard military west, civilian east TPAC pattern.


I noticed that, too. We'll see if it's a one-off or something regular.


She did a quick turn again at SDF and is back across the pond, so it looks like Brown have called National in early. Great sign of confidence for NCR, I really like what they have done in the past couple years. Brown is still one 744 down of course due to the mishap at ICN.

Newark727 wrote:
For all this thread's scholars of Western Global's fleet reliability, here's N344KD appearing to be in a bit of a pickle:
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/WGN ... /KLAX/KLAX


Oh boy, and just when I was checking in on their fleet last night and it looked too good to be true. So back again to 1/4 747s serviceable. At least they had half a dozen MD11s in their air when I looked a few hours ago. I'm fairly certain that all three (excluding the new 452SN yet to enter service) 744s have now done air returns at LAX this year. An unwanted record.
 
MO11
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Tue Nov 16, 2021 12:05 am

wjcandee wrote:
DLNZ wrote:
Looks like National may have picked up some work for Brown earlier than projected. N936CA has operated SDF-CGN at the tail end of a stock standard military west, civilian east TPAC pattern.


I noticed that, too. We'll see if it's a one-off or something regular.


I think that is the airplane that I couldn't locate in the "peak" list above. It isn't shown flying in the schedule at all, but shows exiting the schedule from CGN on December 24.
 
FlapOperator
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Tue Nov 16, 2021 1:32 am

DLNZ wrote:
Oh boy, and just when I was checking in on their fleet last night and it looked too good to be true. So back again to 1/4 747s serviceable. At least they had half a dozen MD11s in their air when I looked a few hours ago. I'm fairly certain that all three (excluding the new 452SN yet to enter service) 744s have now done air returns at LAX this year. An unwanted record.


It's honestly somewhat troubling, and likely only allowed to exist since they are a cargo operation.
 
wjcandee
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Tue Nov 16, 2021 1:52 am

FlapOperator wrote:
DLNZ wrote:
Oh boy, and just when I was checking in on their fleet last night and it looked too good to be true. So back again to 1/4 747s serviceable. At least they had half a dozen MD11s in their air when I looked a few hours ago. I'm fairly certain that all three (excluding the new 452SN yet to enter service) 744s have now done air returns at LAX this year. An unwanted record.


It's honestly somewhat troubling, and likely only allowed to exist since they are a cargo operation.


I notice that they often make precautionary landings and try not to have the equipment come out or note it as an emergency. Just an observation. Today, doesn't sound like there was ARFF equipment out; they appear to have just landed in the ordinary course.
 
jbs2886
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Tue Nov 16, 2021 7:12 pm

Mammoth gets a customer for 777-200LR conversions - Cargojet will take 2, plus options for 2 more and 2 -300ER conversions.

https://newsroom.aviator.aero/mammoth-f ... rways-ltd/
Last edited by jbs2886 on Tue Nov 16, 2021 7:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Tue Nov 16, 2021 7:13 pm

Atlas deepened relations with Cainiao, the logistics arm of e-commerce giant Alibaba by adding a 5th aircraft to the lease.
Cainiao will use the frame to increase its service to Latin America and now be able to offer a daily link to Brazil and Chile.

https://ajot.com/news/atlas-air-teams-up-with-cainiao
 
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Boeing757100
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Tue Nov 16, 2021 10:05 pm

It's sad that the DL 747-400s will never fly again, even though a few of them are quite young. Anyone know the cycle numbers on them when they were retired?
 
jbs2886
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Tue Nov 16, 2021 10:52 pm

Another 13 737-800 conversions for AEI (total of 34). Deliveries of these 13 from March - December 2023. https://122aac7b-a8a1-400f-917a-a00bd63 ... 6890be.pdf

That's what 24 orders for 738 conversions announced this week? 11 Icelease (BCF) and now 13 Aero Capital Solutions?
 
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Spacepope
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Wed Nov 17, 2021 2:19 am

jbs2886 wrote:
Another 13 737-800 conversions for AEI (total of 34). Deliveries of these 13 from March - December 2023. https://122aac7b-a8a1-400f-917a-a00bd63 ... 6890be.pdf

That's what 24 orders for 738 conversions announced this week? 11 Icelease (BCF) and now 13 Aero Capital Solutions?


Don't forget Aircastle ordered 4 738SFs on the 12th. Worldstar ordered 10 738BDSF on the 12th too.
 
RoyalBrunei757
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Wed Nov 17, 2021 10:13 am

Latest movement by (courtesy of skyliner-aviation.de):
Boeing 737 -8AS 33814 1618 2-EZRA Tokyo Century Corporation Ferried 10-11 November 2021 DMK-KHV-ANC-DHN, for freighter conversion ex HS-TSC
Boeing 737 -8K5 34686 1903 EI-GWE BBAM Aircraft Leasing Ferried 12-13 November 2021 ILD-NQZ-CAN for freighter conversion ex D-ATUE

Boeing 747 -87UF 37562 1429 M-ABOV Xingqing (Tianjin Leasing) Ferried 11 November 2021JED-SHJ prior lease to AirBridgeCargo ex HZ-AI3

Boeing 757 -256(F) 26244 616 N9012S TVPX ARS Ferried 11 November 2021 XMN-PKC-GEG after conversion, for paint prior delivery to? ex TF-FIT
Boeing 757 -256(F) 29312 943 OE-LNE DHL Air Austria Registered 11 November 2021, posn 15 November 2021 BUD-LEJ after transfer ex G-DHKE
Boeing 757 -2G5 30394 922 G-OOBP TUI Airways Ferried 11-12 November 2021 DGX-BGR-GYR prior freighter conversion ex HB-IHS
Source: https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=2
 
Flying-Tiger
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Wed Nov 17, 2021 3:01 pm

Two quite interesting comments from ATR:

Vautier also identifies increased demand in the cargo segment. ”In the last 18 months we have seen the boom of e-commerce. It has been said the growth in e-commerce has been shifted five years by the crisis,” he says, noting this increases the demand for regional aircraft to serve the next day delivery requirements.


and

He sees ATR meeting that demand, both through its dedicated 72-600 freighter and through passenger to freighter conversions. ”We have had since the beginning of the year 16 conversions already done. That is more than the two previous years. That is a sign of the solidity of the market.”


https://www.flightglobal.com/dubai-2021/e-commerce-and-fleet-renewal-driving-atr-demand/146470.article

There´s a further remark that COVID as accelerated the E-commerce market by about five years.
 
wjcandee
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Thu Nov 18, 2021 12:48 am

DC8 alert! This MADE MY DAY:

OB2158P ran two round-trips today (MIA-MGA-MIA; MIA-SAL-MIA)...

AND OB2059P ran one! (MIA-SDQ-MIA)

Woo-hoo! Here we go! Peak!
 
bigb
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Thu Nov 18, 2021 1:19 am

As of today, Southern Air is no more as Atlas/Southern SOC is completed. It is now just Atlas Sir.
 
TriniA340
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Thu Nov 18, 2021 1:33 am

wjcandee wrote:
DC8 alert! This MADE MY DAY:

OB2158P ran two round-trips today (MIA-MGA-MIA; MIA-SAL-MIA)...

AND OB2059P ran one! (MIA-SDQ-MIA)

Woo-hoo! Here we go! Peak!


Awesome! Today we got the Titan A321F here at POS in the daytime. No telling for how much longer G-NIKO will be with us in the Caribbean. It hardly ever comes here anymore, with AJT opting to send 767s most of the time. The DC-8s and 727s don't visit anymore either. The IFL 727s seem to be deployed almost exclusively to SJU, and N216WE left MIA today, back to operating within the US I suspect.
 
USTraveler
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Thu Nov 18, 2021 10:46 am

wjcandee wrote:
DC8 alert! This MADE MY DAY:

OB2158P ran two round-trips today (MIA-MGA-MIA; MIA-SAL-MIA)...

AND OB2059P ran one! (MIA-SDQ-MIA)

Woo-hoo! Here we go! Peak!



Where's the LIKE button?
 
Cardude2
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Thu Nov 18, 2021 9:41 pm

I just received a good question in the non-boeing/airbus dubai chat:
JayinKitsap wrote:
Do you know how many in total IAI has received orders for, it feels like it is in the high teens already.
 
na
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Thu Nov 18, 2021 10:34 pm

Boeing757100 wrote:
It's sad that the DL 747-400s will never fly again, even though a few of them are quite young. Anyone know the cycle numbers on them when they were retired?

Indeed. I was a bit surprised to see that the youngest frames were among the first to be retired. 676NW is among the five 744s with the shortest service period - just above 12 years (c. 55.000 flight hours) - only half of what's average for a 747, while NMAs oldest 10 frames (N661 - 670US) had a long life of between 26 and 28 years (and up to 117.000 hours).
 
wjcandee
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:31 pm

Bigger article in The Loadstar this morning about Mammoth. https://theloadstar.com/cargojet-gears- ... programme/

"It will be inducting the first of 10 777-200LRs in Q2 22, with the 777-300ER following the conformity build phase of the -200LR. Mr McCarthy is hopeful of having the first 777-200LR ready to haul cargo by Q3 23, and he added: “Subject to regulatory authority start approval, we hope to be presenting the first -300ER to the launch operator by Q2 24.”"

In other words, the -300 isn't coming for at least 2.75 years. They're starting with the -200LR. The -200LR will have more payload capacity by weight than the -300ER, and the Mammoth -300ER will be aimed at the lightweight package market. Okey-dokey.

As far as certification goes, Mammoth's marketing director says that it "is using trusted, proven and globally accepted engineering tools and practices that will produce a substantial data set". Sounds like a plan. Actually sounds like meaningless drivel. Bottom line is they have a long way to go to finish the engineering, and even longer to be certified.
 
wjcandee
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:36 pm

DC8 update: OB2158P did two round trips again yesterday, and went out this morning on another. It looks like Amerijet may plan to use the DC8s more-extensively during Peak to handle some international routes while moving some of its own metal to domestic.
 
gdavis003
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Fri Nov 19, 2021 2:45 pm

2-EZRA, an -800 which most recently flew for NokAir but was originally delivered to Ryanair, is scheduled to head to DHN today. Flew up to ANC last Wednesday and went tech there instead of continuing onto DHN. Owned by Tokyo Century Corporation still, so this one could be headed back to Asia after a DHN conversion. Might still be in NokAir’s crazy livery too, although it was an NTU for Thai Summer recently

DHN has been relatively quiet recently except for the delivery of the newest MD to USA Jet, so we’ll see if they can crank anything else out soon
 
N965UW
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Fri Nov 19, 2021 3:28 pm

bigb wrote:
As of today, Southern Air is no more as Atlas/Southern SOC is completed. It is now just Atlas Sir.


The end of an era. I'm curious as to whether Atlas will keep "Southern Air" painted on the side of the 777s, or knowing Atlas, if they'll just keep them the way they are.

Speaking of Atlas, they started running 744s between SDF and EWR on the very same day. Looks like they're starting up peak season flying for UPS.

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/GTI ... /KSDF/KEWR
 
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LAXintl
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Fri Nov 19, 2021 6:50 pm

French CGM CMA to acquire 4 A350F.

Be quite a mixed fleet. A330, B777 due in 2022 and now the A350 freighters.

https://www.cma-cgm.com/news/3963/airfr ... -air-cargo

Image
 
bigb
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Fri Nov 19, 2021 7:28 pm

N965UW wrote:
bigb wrote:
As of today, Southern Air is no more as Atlas/Southern SOC is completed. It is now just Atlas Sir.


The end of an era. I'm curious as to whether Atlas will keep "Southern Air" painted on the side of the 777s, or knowing Atlas, if they'll just keep them the way they are.

Speaking of Atlas, they started running 744s between SDF and EWR on the very same day. Looks like they're starting up peak season flying for UPS.

https://flightaware.com/live/flight/GTI ... /KSDF/KEWR


Southern Air birds will get retitled to Atlas Air until they go in for heavy checks that require a repaint I am sure.

But yes, both FedEx and UPS peak season has started.
 
eightcone
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:54 pm

gdavis003 wrote:
2-EZRA, an -800 which most recently flew for NokAir but was originally delivered to Ryanair, is scheduled to head to DHN today. Flew up to ANC last Wednesday and went tech there instead of continuing onto DHN. Owned by Tokyo Century Corporation still, so this one could be headed back to Asia after a DHN conversion. Might still be in NokAir’s crazy livery too, although it was an NTU for Thai Summer recently

DHN has been relatively quiet recently except for the delivery of the newest MD to USA Jet, so we’ll see if they can crank anything else out soon



You prompted me to check it out. Interestingly, the big hanger that had had 3 737s and a T-tail in it only has one 737 now. Not sure where the ex-Ukraine tail went to.

None of the USA Jet birds seem to have moved.

A CRJ with green body work was out and about.

An ultra a319 was near what I think/though was the paint hanger.

Spied a “go jet” bird in a hanger with a red snowflake tail, last 4 of the reg are 23FF.

The compass cargo is new to the storage area. Couldn’t make out the reg.

Perhaps commercial jet is trying to waterfall their staff down on completing ongoing projects before the year end? Or parts acquisition might be delayed enough that there is a pointless reason to not keep the big hanger full of conversions? (The calendar doesn’t seem like enough reason to not keep the assembly line going?)

Image
Image
Image
Image
 
eightcone
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Fri Nov 19, 2021 11:04 pm

Image attempt number 2. Of note, and admittedly off topic, but I couldn't find a planespotters page or real life photos of Ultra. Is it possible that that is the first bird in the livery?

Image
Image
Image
Image
 
gdavis003
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Fri Nov 19, 2021 11:15 pm

eightcone wrote:
gdavis003 wrote:
2-EZRA, an -800 which most recently flew for NokAir but was originally delivered to Ryanair, is scheduled to head to DHN today. Flew up to ANC last Wednesday and went tech there instead of continuing onto DHN. Owned by Tokyo Century Corporation still, so this one could be headed back to Asia after a DHN conversion. Might still be in NokAir’s crazy livery too, although it was an NTU for Thai Summer recently

DHN has been relatively quiet recently except for the delivery of the newest MD to USA Jet, so we’ll see if they can crank anything else out soon



You prompted me to check it out. Interestingly, the big hanger that had had 3 737s and a T-tail in it only has one 737 now. Not sure where the ex-Ukraine tail went to.

None of the USA Jet birds seem to have moved.

A CRJ with green body work was out and about.

An ultra a319 was near what I think/though was the paint hanger.

Spied a “go jet” bird in a hanger with a red snowflake tail, last 4 of the reg are 23FF.

The compass cargo is new to the storage area. Couldn’t make out the reg.

Perhaps commercial jet is trying to waterfall their staff down on completing ongoing projects before the year end? Or parts acquisition might be delayed enough that there is a pointless reason to not keep the big hanger full of conversions? (The calendar doesn’t seem like enough reason to not keep the assembly line going?)

Image
Image
Image
Image


Great stuff! I don't think they've sent anything else out since you were last there, so I'm guessing those t-tails and the 737s are somewhere not visible, as I don't think they've left. As you note though, it's weird that they're not in the hangar, you would think they'd be getting work done. The facility tends to move at a good speed.

N684BR has been there since May, and it's due to Aeronaves. It looks like the door on the other side is probably done based on where the green is, so hopefully, they're able to send that one off to SLW relatively soon. N23FF is also due to Aeronaves, and it sounds like it's getting worked on now. Was only moved to DHN in October so should be a while.

The Ultra Air A319 is really interesting. They're a new Columbian start up, it seems like, and that's probably their first aircraft. I first thought that it was one of the Avianca Ecuador A319s, which I had down on my list as the only two A319s at DHN, stored in February 2021. I went to check the status of those though, and I must have missed that they left back in May to go to Cote d'Ivoire. So, those aren't them. I have no clue what A319 that is, must have missed that movement, as I can't find anything.

In a weird twist of fate, the Compass Cargo looks to be N858AM, which is the second of the two Aeromexico 738s which were started at MIA and transferred to DHN. N859AM went to iAero for DHL a few months back, so I expected that one to go there too.

N444HE looks to have had no changes, wonder if it will be receiving a conversion. Haven't seen any ownership changes.

The one sitting next to N444HE appears to be 2-GATE, the sister ship of Tokyo Capital Corp to 2-EZRA, which is in the air from ANC to DHN now. Arrived in early October and doesn't appear to have any work done on it yet.

I'll have to look through my notes to see if I can make out what the all-white 737 is next to the one with the red tail in front of the CJ hangar in your last pic. Looks to have a door cut in.
 
jbs2886
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Fri Nov 19, 2021 11:29 pm

gdavis003 wrote:
eightcone wrote:
gdavis003 wrote:
2-EZRA, an -800 which most recently flew for NokAir but was originally delivered to Ryanair, is scheduled to head to DHN today. Flew up to ANC last Wednesday and went tech there instead of continuing onto DHN. Owned by Tokyo Century Corporation still, so this one could be headed back to Asia after a DHN conversion. Might still be in NokAir’s crazy livery too, although it was an NTU for Thai Summer recently

DHN has been relatively quiet recently except for the delivery of the newest MD to USA Jet, so we’ll see if they can crank anything else out soon



You prompted me to check it out. Interestingly, the big hanger that had had 3 737s and a T-tail in it only has one 737 now. Not sure where the ex-Ukraine tail went to.

None of the USA Jet birds seem to have moved.

A CRJ with green body work was out and about.

An ultra a319 was near what I think/though was the paint hanger.

Spied a “go jet” bird in a hanger with a red snowflake tail, last 4 of the reg are 23FF.

The compass cargo is new to the storage area. Couldn’t make out the reg.

Perhaps commercial jet is trying to waterfall their staff down on completing ongoing projects before the year end? Or parts acquisition might be delayed enough that there is a pointless reason to not keep the big hanger full of conversions? (The calendar doesn’t seem like enough reason to not keep the assembly line going?)

Image
Image
Image
Image


Great stuff! I don't think they've sent anything else out since you were last there, so I'm guessing those t-tails and the 737s are somewhere not visible, as I don't think they've left. As you note though, it's weird that they're not in the hangar, you would think they'd be getting work done. The facility tends to move at a good speed.

N684BR has been there since May, and it's due to Aeronaves. It looks like the door on the other side is probably done based on where the green is, so hopefully, they're able to send that one off to SLW relatively soon. N23FF is also due to Aeronaves, and it sounds like it's getting worked on now. Was only moved to DHN in October so should be a while.

The Ultra Air A319 is really interesting. They're a new Columbian start up, it seems like, and that's probably their first aircraft. I first thought that it was one of the Avianca Ecuador A319s, which I had down on my list as the only two A319s at DHN, stored in February 2021. I went to check the status of those though, and I must have missed that they left back in May to go to Cote d'Ivoire. So, those aren't them. I have no clue what A319 that is, must have missed that movement, as I can't find anything.

In a weird twist of fate, the Compass Cargo looks to be N858AM, which is the second of the two Aeromexico 738s which were started at MIA and transferred to DHN. N859AM went to iAero for DHL a few months back, so I expected that one to go there too.

N444HE looks to have had no changes, wonder if it will be receiving a conversion. Haven't seen any ownership changes.

The one sitting next to N444HE appears to be 2-GATE, the sister ship of Tokyo Capital Corp to 2-EZRA, which is in the air from ANC to DHN now. Arrived in early October and doesn't appear to have any work done on it yet.

I'll have to look through my notes to see if I can make out what the all-white 737 is next to the one with the red tail in front of the CJ hangar in your last pic. Looks to have a door cut in.


Why would the Compass Air Cargo go to iAero instead of Compass?

Also, what are the two red tails (one in the hangar and one outside)?
 
gdavis003
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Fri Nov 19, 2021 11:33 pm

jbs2886 wrote:
gdavis003 wrote:
eightcone wrote:


You prompted me to check it out. Interestingly, the big hanger that had had 3 737s and a T-tail in it only has one 737 now. Not sure where the ex-Ukraine tail went to.

None of the USA Jet birds seem to have moved.

A CRJ with green body work was out and about.

An ultra a319 was near what I think/though was the paint hanger.

Spied a “go jet” bird in a hanger with a red snowflake tail, last 4 of the reg are 23FF.

The compass cargo is new to the storage area. Couldn’t make out the reg.

Perhaps commercial jet is trying to waterfall their staff down on completing ongoing projects before the year end? Or parts acquisition might be delayed enough that there is a pointless reason to not keep the big hanger full of conversions? (The calendar doesn’t seem like enough reason to not keep the assembly line going?)

Image
Image
Image
Image


Great stuff! I don't think they've sent anything else out since you were last there, so I'm guessing those t-tails and the 737s are somewhere not visible, as I don't think they've left. As you note though, it's weird that they're not in the hangar, you would think they'd be getting work done. The facility tends to move at a good speed.

N684BR has been there since May, and it's due to Aeronaves. It looks like the door on the other side is probably done based on where the green is, so hopefully, they're able to send that one off to SLW relatively soon. N23FF is also due to Aeronaves, and it sounds like it's getting worked on now. Was only moved to DHN in October so should be a while.

The Ultra Air A319 is really interesting. They're a new Columbian start up, it seems like, and that's probably their first aircraft. I first thought that it was one of the Avianca Ecuador A319s, which I had down on my list as the only two A319s at DHN, stored in February 2021. I went to check the status of those though, and I must have missed that they left back in May to go to Cote d'Ivoire. So, those aren't them. I have no clue what A319 that is, must have missed that movement, as I can't find anything.

In a weird twist of fate, the Compass Cargo looks to be N858AM, which is the second of the two Aeromexico 738s which were started at MIA and transferred to DHN. N859AM went to iAero for DHL a few months back, so I expected that one to go there too.

N444HE looks to have had no changes, wonder if it will be receiving a conversion. Haven't seen any ownership changes.

The one sitting next to N444HE appears to be 2-GATE, the sister ship of Tokyo Capital Corp to 2-EZRA, which is in the air from ANC to DHN now. Arrived in early October and doesn't appear to have any work done on it yet.

I'll have to look through my notes to see if I can make out what the all-white 737 is next to the one with the red tail in front of the CJ hangar in your last pic. Looks to have a door cut in.


Why would the Compass Air Cargo go to iAero instead of Compass?

Also, what are the two red tails (one in the hangar and one outside)?


Before it was painted into Compass colors, I expected it to go to iAero with the sister ship. Both were Blackrock owned, former AM 738s with neighboring reg numbers.

And the name of the airline with the red tails was escaping me, but I now remember that it’s Regent Airways
 
gdavis003
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Sat Nov 20, 2021 12:39 am

I've done some investigating, and it looks like it's actually an A320 in the Ultra Air colors. It looks to be OE-LMM, owned by Avolon currently, and seems to have operated for a whole host of operators (https://www.planespotters.net/airframe/ ... lon/ej47gp). Ultra's social media mentions an A320 at TUS headed to paint, and that would line up with when this one was supposedly sent to DHN (https://www.instagram.com/p/CUtBt1rpWBD ... gn=loading).
 
gdavis003
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Sat Nov 20, 2021 1:37 am

Here’s my current list of the aircraft stored at DHN, if anyone is interested. I am pretty sure that this is now updated after seeing eightcone’s pictures from today, but if there’s anything else, just let me know:

2-EZRA, B737-800, unknown livery, std at DHN 19 Nov 2021, due ?

OE-LMM, A320-200, Ultra Air livery, std at DHN 26 Oct 2021, due Ultra Air Colombia

N291CS, B737-800, possibly all-white, former Air Europa, std at DHN 26 Oct 2021 for paint, due ?

N23FF, B737-400, GetJet livery, std at DHN 11 Oct 2021, due Aeronaves TSM

2-GATE, B737-800, Thai Summer livery, std at DHN 9 Oct 2021, due ?

N858AM, B737-800, currently in Compass livery, std at DHN 30 Sep 2021 for paint, due Compass Air Cargo

N680BR, CRJ-200, Delta Connection livery, std at DHN 7 Sep 2021, due Aeronaves TSM

N616AJ, B737-800, SunExpress livery?, std at DHN 15 Aug 2021

N245GE, B737-800, possibly all-white, former Andalou Jet, std at DHN 14 Aug 2021, due ?

N290BR, B737-800, Ukraine International livery, std at DHN 1 Jul 2021, due ?

N251AU, B737-400, Flair old livery, std at DHN 28 Jun 2021, due Transair as N388TM

N539RL, B737-800, Regent Airways livery, std at DHN 12 Jun 2021, due ?

N684BR, CRJ-200, Delta Connection livery, std at DHN 17 May 2021, due Aeronaves TSM

N705BR, B737-800, Regent Airways livery, std at DHN 5 May 2021, due ?

N444HE, B737-300, former Jim Baroni, std at DHN ?

----------------

I’ve been busy on some other things lately, but I did just notice that N782TW of Ameristar left BYH on November 5th and is back on the auto parts circuit now. N785TW is back at BYH and has been there for two weeks. 783 and 785 have been repainted, and I’m not sure about 782 and 784. Very unlikely that 782 has, given how long it was at BYH and when they stared repainting the fleet.

Also, Frontera Flight Holdings acquired N915CK, N916CK, and N917CK, former Kalitta Charters II DC-9s, all stored at Oscoda since late 2019. We’ll see if they’re just for parts, or if they’re going to get back into the air
 
wjcandee
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Sat Nov 20, 2021 3:33 am

Gdavis003: BRAVO, Sir!! An excellent job summarizing a very-interesting area that we otherwise wouldn't really know much about! Thank you!
 
eightcone
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Sat Nov 20, 2021 6:23 am

gdavis003 wrote:
Here’s my current list of the aircraft stored at DHN, if anyone is interested. I am pretty sure that this is now updated after seeing eightcone’s pictures from today, but if there’s anything else, just let me know:

2-EZRA, B737-800, unknown livery, std at DHN 19 Nov 2021, due ?

OE-LMM, A320-200, Ultra Air livery, std at DHN 26 Oct 2021, due Ultra Air Colombia

N291CS, B737-800, possibly all-white, former Air Europa, std at DHN 26 Oct 2021 for paint, due ?

N23FF, B737-400, GetJet livery, std at DHN 11 Oct 2021, due Aeronaves TSM

2-GATE, B737-800, Thai Summer livery, std at DHN 9 Oct 2021, due ?

N858AM, B737-800, currently in Compass livery, std at DHN 30 Sep 2021 for paint, due Compass Air Cargo

N680BR, CRJ-200, Delta Connection livery, std at DHN 7 Sep 2021, due Aeronaves TSM

N616AJ, B737-800, SunExpress livery?, std at DHN 15 Aug 2021

N245GE, B737-800, possibly all-white, former Andalou Jet, std at DHN 14 Aug 2021, due ?

N290BR, B737-800, Ukraine International livery, std at DHN 1 Jul 2021, due ?

N251AU, B737-400, Flair old livery, std at DHN 28 Jun 2021, due Transair as N388TM

N539RL, B737-800, Regent Airways livery, std at DHN 12 Jun 2021, due ?

N684BR, CRJ-200, Delta Connection livery, std at DHN 17 May 2021, due Aeronaves TSM

N705BR, B737-800, Regent Airways livery, std at DHN 5 May 2021, due ?

N444HE, B737-300, former Jim Baroni, std at DHN ?

----------------

I’ve been busy on some other things lately, but I did just notice that N782TW of Ameristar left BYH on November 5th and is back on the auto parts circuit now. N785TW is back at BYH and has been there for two weeks. 783 and 785 have been repainted, and I’m not sure about 782 and 784. Very unlikely that 782 has, given how long it was at BYH and when they stared repainting the fleet.

Also, Frontera Flight Holdings acquired N915CK, N916CK, and N917CK, former Kalitta Charters II DC-9s, all stored at Oscoda since late 2019. We’ll see if they’re just for parts, or if they’re going to get back into the air



Excellent, thank you. I would only add the mad dogs. N833US-N837US
 
MCOflyer
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Re: Air Cargo (non-Amazon/DHL) Thread - 2021

Sat Nov 20, 2021 8:38 am

According to Wikipedia which I know is not a reliable source, it says that Aero Naves TSM has five Boeing 737 400 freighters, and three remaining MD 82 freighters on order. Interesting enough it says that it has a couple of DC 915 freighters on order as well as some DC 930 freighter on order.

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