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Boeing757100
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20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 2:10 am

On this day (not exactly), 20 years ago, the last MD-11 was delivered to Lufthansa Cargo. I wanted to post now because I might forget tommorrow and I felt like the MD-11 should get another thread of its own.

According to Boeing- https://www.boeing.com/history/products ... sport.page



Anyone else think it could have been produced for at least a few more years? There were a few customers who were interested in getting more according to an earlier thread I made....

viewtopic.php?t=1450291


And for anyone who cares, the last MD-11 built, D-ALCN, is now re-registered as N262UP for UPS.
Boeing is bringing back the 707 tomorrow, with Shinkai as the Chief Executive Officer and FLAIRPORT as the Chief Financial Officer.
 
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gunsontheroof
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 3:59 am

Does anyone know if this bird was delivered to LH by Boeing from PAE? I believe AY's final frame(s) were post-Boeing/MD merger.

Still love seeing the 11 from my deck. FX (and sometimes, 5X) still send them my way often enough, but they're sadly a species in decline these days.
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:51 am

I heard Inge & Claudia are transitioning to the 777 Interesting videos watching those 2 master the MD-11 freighter for LH.
 
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Polot
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:54 am

gunsontheroof wrote:
Does anyone know if this bird was delivered to LH by Boeing from PAE? I believe AY's final frame(s) were post-Boeing/MD merger.

Still love seeing the 11 from my deck. FX (and sometimes, 5X) still send them my way often enough, but they're sadly a species in decline these days.

I imagine they would have been delivered straight from Long Beach. Boeing still had the old McDD delivery center at the site.
 
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:49 pm

I think more freighters could have been sold. However keeping the line open for low rate freighter production probably wasn’t economical compared to converting passenger versions to freight. By 2001 passenger airlines were already dumping MD11s and replacing with 777s, which created the feedstock
 
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 1:54 pm

Boeing757100 wrote:
And for anyone who cares, the last MD-11 built, D-ALCN, is now re-registered as N262UP for UPS.

D-ALCN was the last MD-11 built and was delivered to Lufthansa Cargo on January 25, 2001.
However, D-ALCM was the last MD-11 delivered, on February 22, 2001 at Long Beach.

When looking at the images (and their corresponding dates) in the link below, it looks to me -ALCM's delivery flight was from Long Beach to Las Vegas and then onwards to Toronto: https://www.airliners.net/search?manufa ... lay=detail
Last edited by Iemand91 on Mon Feb 22, 2021 2:04 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Boeing757100
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 2:31 pm

gunsontheroof wrote:
Does anyone know if this bird was delivered to LH by Boeing from PAE? I believe AY's final frame(s) were post-Boeing/MD merger.

Still love seeing the 11 from my deck. FX (and sometimes, 5X) still send them my way often enough, but they're sadly a species in decline these days.




I don't think so, 5X is still picking up a few secondhand examples and FX was still getting some till last year or something. And I'd expect there to be some other MD-11F operator (startup) because acquisition cost is so low. If anything, the fleet should be increasing slightly.
Boeing is bringing back the 707 tomorrow, with Shinkai as the Chief Executive Officer and FLAIRPORT as the Chief Financial Officer.
 
TheSonntag
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 2:45 pm

Corona helped the extension of the MD-11 life. Apart from that, a rather questionable design which found a niche, but which certainly fell far behind the A340 and especially the B777.
 
744SPX
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 3:30 pm

MD-11 desperately needed the new 5200 sq ft wing they were were working on for the MD-XX version. Extremely high wing loading was the MD-11's biggest problem.
 
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Boeing757100
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 4:12 pm

TheSonntag wrote:
Corona helped the extension of the MD-11 life. Apart from that, a rather questionable design which found a niche, but which certainly fell far behind the A340 and especially the B777.




I wouldn't call the design questionable, rather neglected or malnourished. Since McDD was already running out of cash to innovate, they basically retained most of the DC-10 features and just improved avionics, added scimitar winglets, and lengthened the fuselage, which hindered its success. In addition to the whole small tailplane thing, the plane sadly became a starving disaster. Such a shame for such an otherwise beautiful plane.
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 4:20 pm

Boeing757100 wrote:
TheSonntag wrote:
Corona helped the extension of the MD-11 life. Apart from that, a rather questionable design which found a niche, but which certainly fell far behind the A340 and especially the B777.




I wouldn't call the design questionable, rather neglected or malnourished. Since McDD was already running out of cash to innovate, they basically retained most of the DC-10 features and just improved avionics, added scimitar winglets, and lengthened the fuselage, which hindered its success. In addition to the whole small tailplane thing, the plane sadly became a starving disaster. Such a shame for such an otherwise beautiful plane.


They should have collaborated with Airbus and used the A330 wing on the MD-11.
 
ContinentalEWR
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 4:41 pm

The MD11 worked out well as a cargo hauler. As a passenger plane, it was stymied by a few factors. The MD11 arrived just a few short years before the twin engine A330 and B777 rolled out. Cockpit commonality was becoming a thing and the MD11 fell short (far short) of the range capabilities McDonnell Douglas touted in developing it. Boeing's acquisition of MDC was the final nail in the coffin. The MD11 had a beautiful silhouette, but it was essentially a DC10 with wingtips, a slightly longer fuselage, tapered tail, and larger tail engine. The cost of overhauling its wings and other capabilities to extend the range and load weren't worth it by the time the program was shuttered.
 
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 4:42 pm

TheSonntag wrote:
Corona helped the extension of the MD-11 life. Apart from that, a rather questionable design which found a niche, but which certainly fell far behind the A340 and especially the B777.

Though the MD11 is more likely to fly for much longer than the A340 or original 772s due to that niche it has.
 
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Boeing757100
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 4:50 pm

ContinentalEWR wrote:
The MD11 worked out well as a cargo hauler. As a passenger plane, it was stymied by a few factors. The MD11 arrived just a few short years before the twin engine A330 and B777 rolled out. Cockpit commonality was becoming a thing and the MD11 fell short (far short) of the range capabilities McDonnell Douglas touted in developing it. Boeing's acquisition of MDC was the final nail in the coffin. The MD11 had a beautiful silhouette, but it was essentially a DC10 with wingtips, a slightly longer fuselage, tapered tail, and larger tail engine. The cost of overhauling its wings and other capabilities to extend the range and load weren't worth it by the time the program was shuttered.



Not only were the costs to make the super-11 a better plane not worth it, McDD simply couldn't afford it. That is why they merged with Boeing in 1997.
Boeing is bringing back the 707 tomorrow, with Shinkai as the Chief Executive Officer and FLAIRPORT as the Chief Financial Officer.
 
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Boeing757100
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 4:52 pm

flyingclrs727 wrote:
Boeing757100 wrote:
TheSonntag wrote:
Corona helped the extension of the MD-11 life. Apart from that, a rather questionable design which found a niche, but which certainly fell far behind the A340 and especially the B777.




I wouldn't call the design questionable, rather neglected or malnourished. Since McDD was already running out of cash to innovate, they basically retained most of the DC-10 features and just improved avionics, added scimitar winglets, and lengthened the fuselage, which hindered its success. In addition to the whole small tailplane thing, the plane sadly became a starving disaster. Such a shame for such an otherwise beautiful plane.


They should have collaborated with Airbus and used the A330 wing on the MD-11.




Why would they have collabed with Airbus?
Boeing is bringing back the 707 tomorrow, with Shinkai as the Chief Executive Officer and FLAIRPORT as the Chief Financial Officer.
 
CX747
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:04 pm

TheSonntag wrote:
Corona helped the extension of the MD-11 life. Apart from that, a rather questionable design which found a niche, but which certainly fell far behind the A340 and especially the B777.


The MD-11 straddled different "eras" if you will, much like the A340. A three engined legacy design, playing off of the DC-10 customer base. The A340 had 4 engines and played off the time when that was "king" for long haul.

Boeing went completely clean sheet and having learned/saw what the 767 was doing went forward with a twin. Notice Boeing was the last to market!!! The 777 ran away with the race and effectively killed MD's widebody program, along with the A340.
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:13 pm

Boeing757100 wrote:
flyingclrs727 wrote:
Boeing757100 wrote:



I wouldn't call the design questionable, rather neglected or malnourished. Since McDD was already running out of cash to innovate, they basically retained most of the DC-10 features and just improved avionics, added scimitar winglets, and lengthened the fuselage, which hindered its success. In addition to the whole small tailplane thing, the plane sadly became a starving disaster. Such a shame for such an otherwise beautiful plane.


They should have collaborated with Airbus and used the A330 wing on the MD-11.




Why would they have collabed with Airbus?

Didn't they discuss together about the MD-XX/MD-12?
 
TheWorm123
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:29 pm

Boeing757100 wrote:
TheSonntag wrote:
Corona helped the extension of the MD-11 life. Apart from that, a rather questionable design which found a niche, but which certainly fell far behind the A340 and especially the B777.




I wouldn't call the design questionable, rather neglected or malnourished. Since McDD was already running out of cash to innovate, they basically retained most of the DC-10 features and just improved avionics, added scimitar winglets, and lengthened the fuselage, which hindered its success. In addition to the whole small tailplane thing, the plane sadly became a starving disaster. Such a shame for such an otherwise beautiful plane.

I think they meant in terms of how easy it is to crash it if you flair slightly wrong on landing.
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Mon Feb 22, 2021 6:45 pm

Boeing757100 wrote:
gunsontheroof wrote:
Does anyone know if this bird was delivered to LH by Boeing from PAE? I believe AY's final frame(s) were post-Boeing/MD merger.

Still love seeing the 11 from my deck. FX (and sometimes, 5X) still send them my way often enough, but they're sadly a species in decline these days.




I don't think so, 5X is still picking up a few secondhand examples and FX was still getting some till last year or something. And I'd expect there to be some other MD-11F operator (startup) because acquisition cost is so low. If anything, the fleet should be increasing slightly.


Here's the status of the MD-11 fleet: https://www.planespotters.net/productio ... ort=status

Total Number Built: 200
Still Active: 98
Stored: 39
Scrapped: 33
Parked: 20
Written Off: 10

Carriers still flying the MD-11: FX, 5X, LH, KD
 
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flyingclrs727
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:28 am

Boeing757100 wrote:
flyingclrs727 wrote:
Boeing757100 wrote:



I wouldn't call the design questionable, rather neglected or malnourished. Since McDD was already running out of cash to innovate, they basically retained most of the DC-10 features and just improved avionics, added scimitar winglets, and lengthened the fuselage, which hindered its success. In addition to the whole small tailplane thing, the plane sadly became a starving disaster. Such a shame for such an otherwise beautiful plane.


They should have collaborated with Airbus and used the A330 wing on the MD-11.




Why would they have collabed with Airbus?


Airbus had a better wing, and the MD-11 had longer range. The DC-10 cross section was a better for larger capacity aircraft than the the A330/A340 fuselage. Imagine if instead of building the A340-600, Airbus and McDonnell Douglas had developed a plane based on the DC-10 cross section.
 
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Tue Feb 23, 2021 7:01 am

Good grief. I can remember the first ones being delivered. In fact, I can remember the MD-11 being launched.
 
ELBOB
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Tue Feb 23, 2021 7:51 am

flyingclrs727 wrote:

Airbus had a better wing, and the MD-11 had longer range. The DC-10 cross section was a better for larger capacity aircraft than the the A330/A340 fuselage. Imagine if instead of building the A340-600, Airbus and McDonnell Douglas had developed a plane based on the DC-10 cross section.


The original A300A cross-section was wider still at 6.4m, but Airbus lost their nerve and narrowed it because they didn't think there was enough demand to fill the wider body. A decision that hampered them until the A350.
 
Noshow
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Tue Feb 23, 2021 8:04 am

That was when they ended circular shapes in favor of steeper sidewalls. Made possible by CFRP.
 
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Tue Feb 23, 2021 8:05 am

ELBOB wrote:

The original A300A cross-section was wider still at 6.4m, but Airbus lost their nerve and narrowed it because they didn't think there was enough demand to fill the wider body. A decision that hampered them until the A350.

"Hampered them"?

2,700 A300/A310/A330/A340 built and delivered and another 300 ordered doesn't seem too shabby for their first foray into the widebody market. I'd almost say they hit the sweet spot with 2-4-2 seating.
 
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Tue Feb 23, 2021 8:20 am

Total Number Built: 200
Written Off: 10


That sounds like a high percentage of write-offs. Were these all fully fledged-accidents or also "mishaps" (like ground collision, hangar fire)
 
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Tue Feb 23, 2021 10:22 am

vfw614 wrote:
Total Number Built: 200
Written Off: 10


That sounds like a high percentage of write-offs. Were these all fully fledged-accidents or also "mishaps" (like ground collision, hangar fire)

According to https://aviation-safety.net/database/types/McDonnell-Douglas-MD-11/losses:

  • N611FE 31/07/1997 Newark International Airport - 0 (5) - PROBABLE CAUSE: "The captain’s overcontrol of the airplane during the landing and his failure to execute a go-around from a destabilized flare. Contributing to the accident was the captain’s concern with touching down early to ensure adequate stopping distance."
  • HB-IWF 02/09/1998 - near Peggy’s Cove, Nova Scotia - 229 (229) - FINDINGS AS TO CAUSES AND CONTRIBUTING FACTORS:
    1. Aircraft certification standards for material flammability were inadequate in that they allowed the use of materials that could be ignited and sustain or propagate fire. Consequently, flammable material propagated a fire that started above the ceiling on the right side of the cockpit near the cockpit rear wall. The fire spread and intensified rapidly to the extent that it degraded aircraft systems and the cockpit environment, and ultimately led to the loss of control of the aircraft.

    2. Metallized polyethylene terephthalate (MPET)-type cover material on the thermal acoustic insulation blankets used in the aircraft was flammable. The cover material was most likely the first material to ignite, and constituted the largest portion of the combustible materials that contributed to the propagation and intensity of the fire.

    3. Once ignited, other types of thermal acoustic insulation cover materials exhibit flame propagation characteristics similar to MPET-covered insulation blankets and do not meet the proposed revised flammability test criteria. Metallized polyvinyl fluoride–type cover material was installed in HB-IWF and was involved in the in-flight fire.

    4. Silicone elastomeric end caps, hook-and-loop fasteners, foams, adhesives, and thermal acoustic insulation splicing tapes contributed to the propagation and intensity of the fire.

    5. The type of circuit breakers (CB) used in the aircraft were similar to those in general aircraft use, and were not capable of protecting against all types of wire arcing events. The fire most likely started from a wire arcing event.

    6. A segment of in-flight entertainment network (IFEN) power supply unit cable (1-3791) exhibited a region of resolidified copper on one wire that was caused by an arcing event. This resolidified copper was determined to be located near manufacturing station 383, in the area where the fire most likely originated. This arc was likely associated with the fire initiation event; however, it could not be determined whether this arced wire was the lead event.

    7. There were no built-in smoke and fire detection and suppression devices in the area where the fire started and propagated, nor were they required by regulation. The lack of such devices delayed the identification of the existence of the fire, and allowed the fire to propagate unchecked until it became uncontrollable.

    8. There was a reliance on sight and smell to detect and differentiate between odour or smoke from different potential sources. This reliance resulted in the misidentification of the initial odour and smoke as originating from an air conditioning source.

    9. There was no integrated in-flight firefighting plan in place for the accident aircraft, nor was such a plan required by regulation. Therefore, the aircraft crew did not have procedures or training directing them to aggressively attempt to locate and eliminate the source of the smoke, and to expedite their preparations for a possible emergency landing. In the absence of such a firefighting plan, they concentrated on preparing the aircraft for the diversion and landing.

    10. There is no requirement that a fire-induced failure be considered when completing the system safety analysis required for certification. The fire-related failure of silicone elastomeric end caps installed on air conditioning ducts resulted in the addition of a continuous supply of conditioned air that contributed to the propagation and intensity of the fire.

    11. The loss of primary flight displays and lack of outside visual references forced the pilots to be reliant on the standby instruments for at least some portion of the last minutes of the flight. In the deteriorating cockpit environment, the positioning and small size of these instruments would have made it difficult for the pilots to transition to their use, and to continue to maintain the proper spatial orientation of the aircraft.
  • HL7373 15/04/1999 near Shanghai-Hongqiao Airport - 3 (3) +5 - PROBABLE CAUSE: The joint investigative team determines that the probable cause of the Korean Air flight KE 6316 accident was the flight crew's loss of altitude situational awareness resulting from altitude clearance wrongly relayed by the first officer and the crew's overreaction with abrupt flight control inputs.
  • B-150 22/08/1999 Hong Kong-Chek Lap Kok International Airport - 3 (315) - CAUSAL FACTORS:
    "The cause of the accident was the commander’s inability to arrest the high rate of descent existing at 50 ft RA.
    Probable contributory causes to the high rate of descent were:
    (i) The commander’s failure to appreciate the combination of a reducing airspeed, increasing rate of descent, and with the thrust decreasing to flight idle.
    (ii) The commander’s failure to apply power to counteract the high rate of descent prior to touchdown.
    (iii) Probable variations in wind direction and speed below 50 ft RA may have resulted in a momentary loss of headwind component and, in combination with the early retardation of the thrust levers, and at a weight only just below the maximum landing weight, led to a 20 kt loss in indicated airspeed just prior to touchdown.
    A possible contributory cause may have been a reduction in peripheral vision as the aircraft entered the area of the landing flare, resulting in the commander not appreciating the high rate of descent prior to touchdown."
  • N581FE 17/10/1999 Subic Bay International Airport - 0 (2) - PROBABLE CAUSE: "The failure of the flight crew to properly address an erroneous airspeed indication during descent and landing, their failure to verity and select the correct airspeed by checking the standby airspeed indicator, and their failure to execute a missed approach. These failures led to an excessive approach and landing speed that resulted in a runway overshoot. Contributing factors to the accident were clogged pitot tube drain holes, the MD-11's insufficient alerting system for airspeed anomalies, and the failure of the SEL ELEV FEEL MAN and SEL FLAP LIM OVR D checklists to refer the crew to the standby airspeed indicator."
  • N526FE 23/03/2009 Tokyo-Narita Airport - 2 (2) - PROBABLE CAUSES:
    In this accident, when the airplane landed on Runway 34L at Narita International Airport, it fell into porpoising. It is highly probable that the left wing fractured as the load transferred from the left MLG to the left wing structure on the third touchdown surpassed the design limit (ultimate load).
    It is highly probable that a fire broke out as the fuel spillage from the left wing caught fire, and the airplane swerved left off the runway rolling to the left and came to rest inverted on the grass area.
    The direct causes which the airplane fell into the porpoise phenomenon are as follows:
    a. Large nose-down elevator input at the first touchdown resulted in a rapid nose-down motion during the first bounce, followed by the second touchdown on the NLG with negative pitch attitude. Then the pitch angle rapidly increased by the ground reaction force, causing the larger second bounce, and
    b. The PF's large elevator input in an attempt to control the airplane without thrust during the second bounce.
    In addition, the indirect causes are as follows:
    a. Fluctuating airspeed, pitch attitude due to gusty wind resulted in an approach with a large sink rate,
    b. Late flare with large nose-up elevator input resulted in the first bounce and
    c. Large pitch attitude change during the bounce possibly made it difficult for the crewmembers to judge airplane pitch attitude and airplane height relative to the ground (MLG height above the runway).
    d. The PM's advice, override and takeover were not conducted adequately.
    It is somewhat likely that, if the fuse pin in the MLG support structure had failed and the MLG had been separated in the overload condition in which the vertical load is the primary component, the damage to the fuel tanks would have been reduced to prevent the fire from developing rapidly.
    It is probable that the fuse pin did not fail because the failure mode was not assumed under an overload condition in which the vertical load is the primary component due to the interpretation of the requirement at the time of type certification for the MD-11 series airplanes.
  • Z-BAV 28/11/2009 Shanghai-Pudong International Airport 3 (7) - A McDonnell Douglas MD-11F cargo plane, operated by Avient Aviation, was destroyed when crashed and burned on takeoff from Shanghai-Pudong International Airport (PVG), China. Three crew members were fatally injured and four survived the accident. Press reports indicate that the tail struck the runway before the airplane crashed past the runway end. Runway 17R/35L was briefly closed after the accident.
  • D-ALCQ 27/07/2010 Riyadh-King Khalid International Airport 0 (2) - CAUSE RELATED FINDINGS:
    1. The flight crew did not recognize the increasing sink rate on short final.
    2. The First officer delayed the flare prior to the initial touchdown, thus resulting in a bounce.
    3. The flight crew did not recognize the bounce.
    4. The Captain attempted to take control of the aircraft without alerting the First Officer resulting in both flight crews acting simultaneously on the control column.
    5. During the first bounce, the Captain made an inappropriate, large nose-down column input that resulted in the second bounce and a hard landing in a flat pitch attitude.
    6. The flight crew responded to the bounces by using exaggerated control inputs.
    7. The company bounced-landing procedure was not applied by the flight crew.
  • N988AR 23/10/2012 São Paulo/Campinas-Viracopos International Airport 0 (3) - Contributing factors.
    - Aircraft maintenance - undetermined.
    In the tasks that led to the restoration of the aircraft airworthiness after the accident in Uruguay in 2009 (Hard-Landing), and also in subsequent periodic inspections, the existence of pre-crack traces resulting from a previous overload condition may not have been identified, something that could have resulted in a point of stress concentration.
  • N277UP 6/06/2016 Seoul-Incheon International Airport 0 (4) - CAUSE (translated from Korean):
    After the take-off determination speed (V1), the high-speed takeoff abandonment is performed by the tire of the central landing gear and the drag brace defect, and the runway is separated.
    Contributing factor is "
    (1) For limited time and available information on the encountered situation,
    (2) Dynamic instability of dragging of central landing gear after tire failure.
    (3) Decrease in braking performance due to rupture of hydraulic pipe of brake system 1 ".

So that breaks down to:
  • Take off: 2
  • Departure: 1
  • En route: 1
  • Landing: 6

V/F
It is not for him to pride himself who loveth his own country, but rather for him who loveth the whole world. The earth is but one country, and mankind its citizens. —Bahá'u'lláh
 
TheSonntag
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Tue Feb 23, 2021 11:04 am

So yes, it IS a high number of accidents. However, also the A320 suffered from accidents in the beginning which were attributable to lack of experience with the design. Better training obviously helped the safety rate of the MD-11, which improved in the latest years.

Also, carriers like KLM flew the plane without issues for almost 20 years.

Nevertheless, the MD-11 had too many accidents for a plane of its era.
 
Weatherwatcher1
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Re: 20 Years ago- Last MD-11 delivered to Lufthansa Cargo

Tue Feb 23, 2021 1:23 pm

744SPX wrote:
MD-11 desperately needed the new 5200 sq ft wing they were were working on for the MD-XX version. Extremely high wing loading was the MD-11's biggest problem.


The smaller wing has turned into an asset as a freighter. The airplane fits in the same gate as a 767, which is extremely useful for freight operators who have tight ramps as they are rushing cargo through the overnight sorts. MEM and SDF don’t have the space for 30 more gates big enough for A330s or 777s.

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Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos