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freakyrat
Posts: 2214
Joined: Fri Aug 22, 2008 1:04 pm

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Mon Apr 19, 2021 4:15 pm

CALMSP wrote:
aklrno wrote:
I’ve been looking at the UA travel ready center to see how vaccination data is uploaded, but haven’t been able to find it. The vaccine card that you get normally is not a very reliable indicator. It is easily forged. Does UA have some way to check a government database? I know that in Nevada I can see my vaccination status on a state web page and I presume that since the federal government paid for it that they also have the records. Can UA access something like that? I am ready to go somewhere. Anywhere.


There will be plenty of forgery if governments mandate this, and I'm sure there will easily be a link tied to your account for airlines to verify or even immigration officers. As for going somewhere, you can hop on a plane to a lot of locations today without a VC, so nothing is holding you back from going anywhere if that destination allows.


When you get your vaccinations you can voluntarily register them with the CDC on an app called v-Safe where they check up on your health for any side effects etc. Each person gets a unique registration code for their account. You register what company and vaccine you received and the dates. They text you with an access code to sign in etc.However v-safe is not an official record like the vaccination card is. I'm sure the travel companies are going to work on something like it just to get things started up again.
 
BHMNONREV
Posts: 1247
Joined: Thu Aug 28, 2003 9:17 am

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Mon Apr 19, 2021 4:26 pm

ContinentalEWR wrote:
IFlyVeryLittle wrote:
Hey kids, we're going to Bosnia for summer vacation!


Well, Dubrovnik is in Croatia, so maybe take a look at a map first?

And Bosnia has some beautiful places to visit too. Seriously, pick up a book.


Absolutely! The Missus is from Bosnia, and we get over there as often as we can and explore Sarajevo, Mostar, Medjugorje, etc. Although this particular routing does not do us a lot of good as we normally go thru BEG/SJJ, this opens up the Adriatic Coast to Americans who might not otherwise have much interest. The entire coast from Split to Dubrovnik is some of the most beautiful you will ever see.

Gonna be a tough sell though, as most Americans would not be able to find any of the ex-YU countries on a map...
 
slcdeltarumd11
Posts: 5061
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2004 7:30 am

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Mon Apr 19, 2021 4:40 pm

[*]
Tyroneguy wrote:
ABEguy wrote:
Wonder if AA will restart the PHL-DBV now as a response.


Did they actually start PHL-DBV? I know they announced it.


Yes and it over performed all estimates. Was set to go daily seasonal pre pandemic even. AA must have decided it's not the summer for long expensive vacations to europe so they are holding off. Most are planned by now anyway. I think summer travel is going to explode but more domestic/caribbean type flights then far off once in a lifetime europe type destinations.

Different strategies, we won't know which was correct until after summer is over. United might have more planes or have gotten an incentive , could be different situation for them. Not necessary an apples to apples comparison.
 
OlympicATH
Posts: 248
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2001 8:43 am

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Mon Apr 19, 2021 4:49 pm

fun2fly wrote:
ABEguy wrote:
Wonder if AA will restart the PHL-DBV now as a response.


Not only that jab at AA from UA, but AA drops PHL>ATH the same week UA announces IAD>ATH.


AA is not "dropping" PHL-ATH. As far as I understand they are now meant to start mid-August and this includes many transatlantic routes (incl. CDG and FCO from PHL). Let's not forget AA is launching JFK-ATH on June 2 and ORD-ATH is operating normally as well (and with healthy loads apparently).
 
WaGuy69
Posts: 16
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2016 6:14 pm

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Mon Apr 19, 2021 5:13 pm

Here's the announcement my travel agency just got from United Airlines

New flights to Croatia, Greece and Iceland
We’re adding three new flights to our international network, giving you and your travelers more options for summer travel by flying direct to countries that are starting to reopen to vaccinated visitors.
Starting in July, we will offer new direct flights between*:
• New York/Newark and Dubrovnik, Croatia
• Washington Dulles and Athens, Greece
• Chicago O'Hare and Reykjavik, Iceland

https://isolate.menlosecurity.com/https ... 31758.html
 
Detroit313
Posts: 636
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2017 2:56 pm

Re: Updated: UA adding seasonal IAD-ATH, EWR-DBV and ORD-KEF

Mon Apr 19, 2021 5:32 pm

Very happy for Athens! It is becoming the new hot spot for US airlines!
 
alitis
Posts: 252
Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2000 11:20 pm

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Mon Apr 19, 2021 7:41 pm

Blerg wrote:
Ishrion wrote:
Just a random thought - do secondary airports in Greece, such as Thessaloniki, have the necessary infrastructure to support widebody aircraft and customs?


From what I know SKG doesn't have any widebody aircraft on a regular basis but they can service them if there is such a need. I think SkyGreece planned long-haul flights from there some years ago.
Many island airports like Rhodes, Heraklion... have many widebodies especially operated by airlines such as Thomas Cook, Rossiya...


Thessaloniki (SKG) completed extension of runway 10-28 and is nearing a massive terminal renovation and expansion including the addition of new landside access. OA used to operate their A300's there back in the day.

-Alitis
 
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lesfalls
Posts: 3484
Joined: Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Updated: UA adding seasonal IAD-ATH, EWR-DBV and ORD-KEF

Mon Apr 19, 2021 9:42 pm

Detroit313 wrote:
Very happy for Athens! It is becoming the new hot spot for US airlines!


Like the old times when TWA used to fly up to 2x a day 747.
Lufthansa: Einfach ein bisschen besser.
 
SCQ83
Posts: 5853
Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 8:32 pm

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Mon Apr 19, 2021 9:48 pm

It really shows how powerful of a brand Dubrovnik is. A metro area of only 65,000. The jewel of the Balkans.

UA hasn't had 2nd thoughts in taking AA's place.

PSU.DTW.SCE wrote:
I have a feeling just like how we saw the airlines "chasing" domestic outdoor leisure markets, we are going to see a gold-rush of airlines chasing international leisure markets open to vaccinated passengers.


I hope if the trend continues, we will see some new markets in 2022. UA's 767-300ER could make EWR-IBZ I guess. Too bad Mykonos or Santorini have such short runways, otherwise those would be great routes. Seasonal EWR-SCQ for 2022 would be nice too :)
 
jordanh
Posts: 332
Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2017 11:56 pm

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Mon Apr 19, 2021 9:55 pm

ContinentalEWR wrote:
IFlyVeryLittle wrote:
Hey kids, we're going to Bosnia for summer vacation!


Well, Dubrovnik is in Croatia, so maybe take a look at a map first? And Bosnia has some beautiful places to visit too. Seriously, pick up a book.


In all fairness, Dubrovnik is in an isolated sliver of Croatia, surrounded by Bosnia an all land sides. You can't get very far out of the city - or get to anywhere else in Croatia - without going through parts of Bosnia.

That's not really a drawback; coastal Bosnia has some very interesting castles, fortresses, and old villages near Dubrovnik; they are worth exploring.
 
SurlyBonds
Posts: 422
Joined: Mon Nov 02, 2015 10:24 am

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Mon Apr 19, 2021 10:47 pm

BHMNONREV wrote:
The entire coast from Split to Dubrovnik is some of the most beautiful you will ever see.

Gonna be a tough sell though, as most Americans would not be able to find any of the ex-YU countries on a map...


It's not going to a be tough sell any more than the Amalfi Coast or Cinque Terre is -- indeed, thanks to GAME OF THRONES, it's probably an easier sell.

The fact that two US carriers have seen fit to serve Dubrovnik recently illustrates this point.
 
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Jamake1
Posts: 1013
Joined: Mon May 17, 2004 2:30 pm

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Mon Apr 19, 2021 11:34 pm

Midwestindy wrote:

UA has the best social media team out of the Big 3

Looks like widebody routes:

I'd put these out as options, assuming they are all widebody routes, I'm not sure whether they'd put a widebody on a new route to the Caribbean

ORD or IAD-ATH
ORD or IAD-KEF

I'd be surprised to see any India


Very good call. (Wrong hub for ATH, but good call).
Come fly the sun.
 
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adamh8297
Posts: 3264
Joined: Sat Dec 15, 2012 6:28 pm

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:53 am

jordanh wrote:
ContinentalEWR wrote:
IFlyVeryLittle wrote:
Hey kids, we're going to Bosnia for summer vacation!


Well, Dubrovnik is in Croatia, so maybe take a look at a map first? And Bosnia has some beautiful places to visit too. Seriously, pick up a book.


In all fairness, Dubrovnik is in an isolated sliver of Croatia, surrounded by Bosnia an all land sides. You can't get very far out of the city - or get to anywhere else in Croatia - without going through parts of Bosnia.

That's not really a drawback; coastal Bosnia has some very interesting castles, fortresses, and old villages near Dubrovnik; they are worth exploring.


Dubrovnik area actually borders Montenegro too. Many use DBV for Bay of Kotor and Budva beach areas. Jet2 sells vacation packages for UK residents to Montenegro using DBV as the primary airport. Finally, there are tour operators that will bring you to Shkroder Albania for the day too. You can visit 4 countries in one vacation going to DBV.

OU should be able to connect to SPU, ZAG, and other places too.
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USAirALB
Posts: 2522
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 4:46 am

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Tue Apr 20, 2021 1:13 am

ContinentalEWR wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
IIRC PHL-DBV performed well but its traffic was heavily skewed towards catering to the cruise market, which obviously hasn't returned.


Not exactly. DBV is a stop on cruises in the region, not a starting or ending point for cruises, and it grew to be a very popular destination on its own thanks to Game of Thrones (a lot of it filmed there).

I should have clarified.

There was a ton of traffic for cruise tours and small-ship crusing/river cruising into/out of DBV. Not your everyday Carnival/Princess type.
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Tiredofhumanity
Posts: 147
Joined: Sat Sep 19, 2020 9:27 pm

Re: Updated: UA adding seasonal IAD-ATH, EWR-DBV and ORD-KEF

Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:24 am

So... I'm assuming UA had absolutely no idea about the latest State Department decision when this came out?

The timing seems like something from a movie :tombstone: .
 
Pinto
Posts: 90
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2018 11:30 pm

Re: Updated: UA adding seasonal IAD-ATH, EWR-DBV and ORD-KEF

Tue Apr 20, 2021 5:48 am

Tiredofhumanity wrote:
So... I'm assuming UA had absolutely no idea about the latest State Department decision when this came out?

The timing seems like something from a movie :tombstone: .


What was it?
 
Tiredofhumanity
Posts: 147
Joined: Sat Sep 19, 2020 9:27 pm

Re: Updated: UA adding seasonal IAD-ATH, EWR-DBV and ORD-KEF

Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:07 am

Pinto wrote:
Tiredofhumanity wrote:
So... I'm assuming UA had absolutely no idea about the latest State Department decision when this came out?

The timing seems like something from a movie :tombstone: .


What was it?


They're adding approximately 130 countries to the Level 4 "Do not Travel" list. It's the current rage in the US bookings thread right now.

It's unknown which countries will not fall under this, but I'd be shocked if Iceland gets tossed into this pile.
 
LH658
Posts: 1279
Joined: Thu Oct 13, 2016 7:35 am

Re: Updated: UA adding seasonal IAD-ATH, EWR-DBV and ORD-KEF

Tue Apr 20, 2021 7:14 am

Curious to know if they have anything planned for IAH?
 
fun2fly
Posts: 1665
Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2006 8:44 am

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:45 am

OlympicATH wrote:
fun2fly wrote:
ABEguy wrote:
Wonder if AA will restart the PHL-DBV now as a response.


Not only that jab at AA from UA, but AA drops PHL>ATH the same week UA announces IAD>ATH.


AA is not "dropping" PHL-ATH. As far as I understand they are now meant to start mid-August and this includes many transatlantic routes (incl. CDG and FCO from PHL). Let's not forget AA is launching JFK-ATH on June 2 and ORD-ATH is operating normally as well (and with healthy loads apparently).


Well, that's not true of AA on ORD. I was on CLE>PHL>ATH and it's cancelled in July. I was rerouted via ORD. However on the return, there is no direct on Sat July 31 so it's a 3 stop home journey. Thus, ORD>ATH is not daily or at least that week. AA has no evening flights after 4PM from ORD to CLE or from JFK or LGA to CLE after 4PM either, so the JFK option is not great. For a company that announced 100% domestic travel or whatever it was, they sure are not doing the favors. We are cancelling and going on UA via IAD on the 788.
 
Ishrion
Posts: 3581
Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:17 am

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Tue Apr 20, 2021 2:17 pm

fun2fly wrote:
Well, that's not true of AA on ORD. I was on CLE>PHL>ATH and it's cancelled in July. I was rerouted via ORD. However on the return, there is no direct on Sat July 31 so it's a 3 stop home journey. Thus, ORD>ATH is not daily or at least that week.


Might need someone to correct me, but ORD-ATH-ORD is still daily. However, for ATH-ORD specifically on aa.com for July 17, 24, and 31, the flight isn't bookable, potentially because it's oversold.

AA's route map, which uses Cirium data currently updated with the schedule changes from over the weekend, shows ORD-ATH-ORD operates daily throughout July.

I believe Detroit313 mentioned something about a few of these flights being oversold.
 
AA94
Posts: 776
Joined: Fri Aug 19, 2011 1:37 am

Re: Updated: UA adding seasonal IAD-ATH, EWR-DBV and ORD-KEF

Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:06 pm

Tiredofhumanity wrote:
Pinto wrote:
Tiredofhumanity wrote:
So... I'm assuming UA had absolutely no idea about the latest State Department decision when this came out?

The timing seems like something from a movie :tombstone: .


What was it?


They're adding approximately 130 countries to the Level 4 "Do not Travel" list. It's the current rage in the US bookings thread right now.

It's unknown which countries will not fall under this, but I'd be shocked if Iceland gets tossed into this pile.


The State Department advisory is just that: an advisory. Lots of people -- especially those who are vaccinated or who are happy to participate in testing programs as dictated by specific governments -- will ignore it. Even the United States is on the CDC's level 4 list, and many Americans are traveling domestically.
Last edited by AA94 on Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
panamair
Posts: 4407
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2001 2:24 am

Re: Updated: UA adding seasonal IAD-ATH, EWR-DBV and ORD-KEF

Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:10 pm

Tiredofhumanity wrote:
Pinto wrote:
Tiredofhumanity wrote:
So... I'm assuming UA had absolutely no idea about the latest State Department decision when this came out?

The timing seems like something from a movie :tombstone: .


What was it?


They're adding approximately 130 countries to the Level 4 "Do not Travel" list. It's the current rage in the US bookings thread right now.

It's unknown which countries will not fall under this, but I'd be shocked if Iceland gets tossed into this pile.


Iceland is Level 2 - Covid-19 Moderate.

But Level 4 contains so many countries that are open for travel today anyway like Mexico, Bahamas, Bermuda, Aruba, Dominican Republic, etc,. As long as the other country is willing to accept Americans, and as long as the US government does not impose any sort of quarantine on return from these countries etc., people are still going to go...
The funny thing of course is the US itself is shown as the same color as a Level 4 - Do Not Travel country....

Full list is here:
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-nc ... l#travel-1
 
rjbesikof
Posts: 225
Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2020 4:21 am

Re: Updated: UA adding seasonal IAD-ATH, EWR-DBV and ORD-KEF

Tue Apr 20, 2021 5:27 pm

Good call on Newark-Dubrovnik. Going from U.S. to DBV often requires a stop in FRA or MUC and then onto ZAG in some instances. This flight will eliminate the need to stop in a 3rd country.
 
fun2fly
Posts: 1665
Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2006 8:44 am

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Tue Apr 20, 2021 7:52 pm

Ishrion wrote:
fun2fly wrote:
Well, that's not true of AA on ORD. I was on CLE>PHL>ATH and it's cancelled in July. I was rerouted via ORD. However on the return, there is no direct on Sat July 31 so it's a 3 stop home journey. Thus, ORD>ATH is not daily or at least that week.


Might need someone to correct me, but ORD-ATH-ORD is still daily. However, for ATH-ORD specifically on aa.com for July 17, 24, and 31, the flight isn't bookable, potentially because it's oversold.

AA's route map, which uses Cirium data currently updated with the schedule changes from over the weekend, shows ORD-ATH-ORD operates daily throughout July.

I believe Detroit313 mentioned something about a few of these flights being oversold.
Makes me feel even more special on AA...we have 5 Prem Econ tix and we didn't get the direct flight love.

Anyhow, when you factor in the TATL adds still being relatively meager for core summer, perhaps everyone has been to optimistic about vaccine adoption levels in the USA and other countries? Maybe the true TATL volume won't return until fall?
 
dmurray
Posts: 6
Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2017 12:59 am

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Tue Apr 20, 2021 7:57 pm

United1 wrote:
IFlyVeryLittle wrote:
Hey kids, we're going to Bosnia for summer vacation!


Croatia actually mate :)

Dubrovnik is a rather popular Mediterranean tourist spot but it skews towards European travelers. Americans are just sort of starting to discover it.

My wife and I visited Dubrovnik in 1981 as the first stop in a 3 week trip through Yughslavia. Dubrovnik is a great city to visit. But most of Yugoslavia was NOT ready for tourism for Americans. This was 3 years before the Olympics
; in Sarajevo and subsequent devastating civil war. We enjoyed a lot of the tourist sites including Zagreb, Split, Sarajevo and other towns/cities. When we tried to stay in Pristina in Kosovo, the person at the checkin noted our US passport and said we should leave town IMMEDIATELY. Perhaps we should have gotten a hint when we entered Kosovo and were met by military guys with significant hardware. We ended up driving to Skopje. The rest of the trip was okay until we tried to get home and got hung up by a significant air traffic controller strike which delayed our return by three days.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 9316
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Updated: UA adding seasonal IAD-ATH, EWR-DBV and ORD-KEF

Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:27 pm

Tiredofhumanity wrote:
So... I'm assuming UA had absolutely no idea about the latest State Department decision when this came out?

The timing seems like something from a movie :tombstone: .


I don't expect the State Department to consult with carriers. U.S. air carriers aren't staffed with dozens of epidemiologists or political safety specialists. They have nothing to contribute. NOTHING.

There are State Department warnings for all kinds of things. They make for very dry reading. They may warn of yellow fever risk in XXX while 99% of American travelers spend their time in urban areas where the disease poses no threat. This announcement by the State Department probably won't change the international travel behaviors of very many travelers. Now, contrast that to the CDC's No Sail Order in March 2020 for cruise ships...
 
Nicknuzzii
Topic Author
Posts: 1758
Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2018 5:57 pm

Re: Updated: UA adding seasonal IAD-ATH, EWR-DBV and ORD-KEF

Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:38 pm

3200 tickets sold on the first day!
 
aklrno
Posts: 1595
Joined: Sat Dec 04, 2010 11:18 pm

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:11 pm

freakyrat wrote:
CALMSP wrote:
aklrno wrote:
I’ve been looking at the UA travel ready center to see how vaccination data is uploaded, but haven’t been able to find it. The vaccine card that you get normally is not a very reliable indicator. It is easily forged. Does UA have some way to check a government database? I know that in Nevada I can see my vaccination status on a state web page and I presume that since the federal government paid for it that they also have the records. Can UA access something like that? I am ready to go somewhere. Anywhere.


There will be plenty of forgery if governments mandate this, and I'm sure there will easily be a link tied to your account for airlines to verify or even immigration officers. As for going somewhere, you can hop on a plane to a lot of locations today without a VC, so nothing is holding you back from going anywhere if that destination allows.


When you get your vaccinations you can voluntarily register them with the CDC on an app called v-Safe where they check up on your health for any side effects etc. Each person gets a unique registration code for their account. You register what company and vaccine you received and the dates. They text you with an access code to sign in etc.However v-safe is not an official record like the vaccination card is. I'm sure the travel companies are going to work on something like it just to get things started up again.

V-Safe is even less of a proof of vaccination than the CDC card that you are given to fill out yourself. It is a voluntary system designed to track side effects. Sign up and you get daily, then weekly requests to enter some survey information. Anyone can sign up, even if you had no vaccination at all! Call it a vaccine passport or just proof of vaccination, we need a government certified document or an app that can access the government records. If you don't like the idea of a governmental certification, then get used to not traveling internationally. You still need a passport from the government and everyone seems to have gotten used to that. Most countries I have been to recently have passport readers that read your biometric data and can access home government records. Not much different.
 
ContinentalEWR
Posts: 4216
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 2:50 am

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Wed Apr 21, 2021 11:27 am

fun2fly wrote:
Ishrion wrote:
fun2fly wrote:
Well, that's not true of AA on ORD. I was on CLE>PHL>ATH and it's cancelled in July. I was rerouted via ORD. However on the return, there is no direct on Sat July 31 so it's a 3 stop home journey. Thus, ORD>ATH is not daily or at least that week.


Might need someone to correct me, but ORD-ATH-ORD is still daily. However, for ATH-ORD specifically on aa.com for July 17, 24, and 31, the flight isn't bookable, potentially because it's oversold.

AA's route map, which uses Cirium data currently updated with the schedule changes from over the weekend, shows ORD-ATH-ORD operates daily throughout July.

I believe Detroit313 mentioned something about a few of these flights being oversold.
Makes me feel even more special on AA...we have 5 Prem Econ tix and we didn't get the direct flight love.

Anyhow, when you factor in the TATL adds still being relatively meager for core summer, perhaps everyone has been to optimistic about vaccine adoption levels in the USA and other countries? Maybe the true TATL volume won't return until fall?


A TATL surge isn't going to happen. Those that typically book their trips some time in advance have already done so, to destinations other than Europe. Vaccination rates in Europe are picking up steam but nowhere near where they ought to be for travel to resume meaningfully. Airlines are scaling back frequencies on core routes. The routes announced in and around the edges, like ATH, DBV, KEF are going to see stronger bookings, sure, but COVID is like a game of whak-a-mole. All it takes is a rise in positivity rates in one place to trigger mass cancellations and the airlines will need to provide refunds/credits. Summer in Europe is more likely in 2022.
 
freakyrat
Posts: 2214
Joined: Fri Aug 22, 2008 1:04 pm

Re: United intl route announcement Monday 4/19

Wed Apr 21, 2021 2:14 pm

aklrno wrote:
freakyrat wrote:
CALMSP wrote:


V-Safe is even less of a proof of vaccination than the CDC card that you are given to fill out yourself. It is a voluntary system designed to track side effects. Sign up and you get daily, then weekly requests to enter some survey information. Anyone can sign up, even if you had no vaccination at all! Call it a vaccine passport or just proof of vaccination, we need a government certified document or an app that can access the government records. If you don't like the idea of a governmental certification, then get used to not traveling internationally. You still need a passport from the government and everyone seems to have gotten used to that. Most countries I have been to recently have passport readers that read your biometric data and can access home government records. Not much different.


I mentioned that V-safe was not official. Anyway I say record the vaccine in a government app similar to the International Record Of Vaccination shot card that I had when I was in the military. The one that had the Yellow Fever, Plague, Cholera and other vaccinations on it but make it digital.

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