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DL717
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue May 11, 2021 3:33 pm

A couple of changes were beneficial (Airfield Enhancements that are always good regardless). Gate builds is probably the most disappointing sunk cost.
 
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Beedo46
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue May 11, 2021 3:37 pm

USAirALB wrote:
ZK-NBT wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
How many airports that saw A380s are unlikely to ever see them again?

In the US, ATL/BOS/ORD/DFW/HNL/IAH/LAX/MIA/JFK/SFO/IAD all saw regular A380 operations. ATL will probably never see regular A380 ops again, and I would say the same is likely true for IAH/DFW/MIA/BOS.


ATL depends on KE if they keep them then maybe.
IAH EK at some point
DFW EK at some point, QF if things go well
MIA big market for BA who had 2 daily at times
BOS BA sent them there, did EK? Not sure on BOS for future A380 operations

Were DFW/IAH that big of stations for EK? They were off/on between A380 and 77W for the past couple of years.

KE's ATL route was primarily an 747-8I route IIRC, and was only occasionally operated by the A380.


Didn't ATL only upgrade on the South side since the A380 gate was on the south end of the concourse?
 
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par13del
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue May 11, 2021 3:45 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
ikramerica wrote:
There were many of us for years lambasting US Airports for overdoing A380 accommodations at great expense when it was never necessary.


Many of us? You mean U.S. carriers that didn't want the competition? U.S. airports are mandated to be non-discriminatory, public-use facilities. The DOT is charged with encouraging competition as a public benefit.

Back more directly to the OP's assertion (framed as a question): There's no point in regrets in public spending once the $ is sunk in illiquid, immoveable assets.

Unless the current and future travelling public continue incurring higher fees to pay off the expense. We do know that if the airport does not get A380's the fees will never be lowered even after the debt is somehow paid off.
 
alasizon
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue May 11, 2021 3:55 pm

par13del wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
ikramerica wrote:
There were many of us for years lambasting US Airports for overdoing A380 accommodations at great expense when it was never necessary.


Many of us? You mean U.S. carriers that didn't want the competition? U.S. airports are mandated to be non-discriminatory, public-use facilities. The DOT is charged with encouraging competition as a public benefit.

Back more directly to the OP's assertion (framed as a question): There's no point in regrets in public spending once the $ is sunk in illiquid, immoveable assets.

Unless the current and future travelling public continue incurring higher fees to pay off the expense. We do know that if the airport does not get A380's the fees will never be lowered even after the debt is somehow paid off.


CPEs fluctuate all the time. Even if the Passenger Facility Charge doesn't change, other lease, rent and landing fees do change. Airports that constantly charge high fees without doing any work don't end up succeeding as it becomes more efficient to fly people elsewhere.
 
StarAC17
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue May 11, 2021 4:09 pm

Excuse my ignorance but wasn't the A380 designed that any airport that accommodated the 744 could operate the A380. It was designed to fit in the same gates as other widebodies and maneuver on existing taxiways with the same or lesser load on the pavements and take off and land on an 11,000 ft runway.

Sure some upgrades were needed but I always thought they were minimal.

lightsaber wrote:
LAXdenizen wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
Most of the improvements improve the speed other aircraft may operate. The large gates will be consolidated. In my opinion, airports fell into three categories:
1. Minimal accomodation. A gate or two modified for the A380 and maybe a taxiway intersection.
2. Moderate improvement where a few gates were added that were needed anyway and perhaps an early runway rebuild.
3. An excuse to perform needed runway work including building a heavier duty runway and some extra terminal or concourse space.

I cannot think of one airport that couldn't economically repurpose the A380 stuff. Well, perhaps excluding over expansion at the ME3...



Ok, so what I'm hearing is that while the a380 was arguably a bust for Airbus, the improvements to accommodate its unique size isn't necessarily a loss for the major airports as the upgrades help them in the long run (77X) and the a380 may have accelerated improvements that airports would otherwise have done someday later. The only thing then I can think of not transferable from an infrastructure standpoint would be the elevated jetway to service the upper deck.

The elevated jetways can be lowered to serve an A35K or 77W/779.

There is some loss, but not nearly what airlines took on the airframes.

I look at LAX, the heavier duty runway was needed, but that was so beat up by freighters it had to be done before the A380 arrived.

They spent $121 million early. I don't really see not recouping other ways.

https://www.latimes.com/travel/la-trw-a ... story.html

Lightsaber


LAX definitely needed the upgrades to begin with so I don't think the investment was to bad considering the condition of the airport say in 2010. I was last there in 2018 and noticed the improvements form 2016 and 2010 respectively.

Again again excuse my ignorance but LAX upgraded and widened 25L/7R IIRC. Why then do the A380's tend to land on 24R/6L which is the shortest runway on the field?
 
airbazar
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue May 11, 2021 4:13 pm

In this country our airport infrastructure, especially in regards to terminals was so beat-up and old that improvements for the A380 were a blessing in disguise. It was rare to see gates with 2 jetways even at major airports like LAX and JFK. The holding areas were small, cramped and lacked amenities. All of those improvements were rolled into the big folder titled "A380 improvements", and I like it.
 
USAirALB
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue May 11, 2021 4:20 pm

airbazar wrote:
In this country our airport infrastructure, especially in regards to terminals was so beat-up and old that improvements for the A380 were a blessing in disguise. It was rare to see gates with 2 jetways even at major airports like LAX and JFK. The holding areas were small, cramped and lacked amenities. All of those improvements were rolled into the big folder titled "A380 improvements", and I like it.

This.

IAD, for example, expanded their International Arrivals Building (IAB), widening gate holding areas, and did some other enhancement projects along the taxiways.

Most other airports in the US did the same.
 
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zkojq
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue May 11, 2021 5:25 pm

People are being way too dramatic about this. Believe it or not a new gate built for an A380 can be used instead for a 777, 787, or A350. Thus the "loss" to the airport isn't the cost of the new gate, it's the cost differential between building a gate that has space for an A380 vs the cost of one that can only take a 777/A350.

At Auckland there's four new gates that were built to be A380 capable. Even during the time when AKL had five daily A380 services (SIN, DXB, MEL, SYD and BNE) the gates spent more time being occupied with A330/777/787s than they did with A380s. A380s on long turns were wheeled across onto a hard stand. So they're hardly White Elephants.


Jet-lagged wrote:
That's a interesting question. Pieces will be written for decades showcasing the A380 as a prime example of a horrible business decision, and many of those pieces will estimate how much money Airbus lost on the adventure. But I never thought of its financial impact on the flying public. As airports spread those A380 directed expenses over landing fees, when people buy tickets to or from those airports that spent that A380 money those people are still subsidising the idea of A380 operations even as the airplanes disappear. Funny!


What specific A380 infrastructure are you implying hasn't been amortized yet?

One could argue the opposite: that an A380 bringing in more passengers (than a 747/77W/77L/A333 etc) who pay airport charges means that the A380 passengers are subsiding other areas of the airport.
 
ikramerica
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue May 11, 2021 5:48 pm

zkojq wrote:
People are being way too dramatic about this. Believe it or not a new gate built for an A380 can be used instead for a 777, 787, or A350. Thus the "loss" to the airport isn't the cost of the new gate, it's the cost differential between building a gate that has space for an A380 vs the cost of one that can only take a 777/A350.

At Auckland there's four new gates that were built to be A380 capable. Even during the time when AKL had five daily A380 services (SIN, DXB, MEL, SYD and BNE) the gates spent more time being occupied with A330/777/787s than they did with A380s. A380s on long turns were wheeled across onto a hard stand. So they're hardly White Elephants.


Jet-lagged wrote:
That's a interesting question. Pieces will be written for decades showcasing the A380 as a prime example of a horrible business decision, and many of those pieces will estimate how much money Airbus lost on the adventure. But I never thought of its financial impact on the flying public. As airports spread those A380 directed expenses over landing fees, when people buy tickets to or from those airports that spent that A380 money those people are still subsidising the idea of A380 operations even as the airplanes disappear. Funny!


What specific A380 infrastructure are you implying hasn't been amortized yet?

One could argue the opposite: that an A380 bringing in more passengers (than a 747/77W/77L/A333 etc) who pay airport charges means that the A380 passengers are subsiding other areas of the airport.

The third jetway is a sunk cost. And that third jetway was EXPENSIVE based on how it need to work with the other two.

While I agree that if the accommodations were to add a second jetway for airports that were using only 1 to fill up 747s and 777s, good. Much improved.

But the third was costly and pointless. Why? So that you could fill through door 1 only for F, for a few dozen people at most? So the elite doesn’t have to even see the rabble? Turning left after early boarding isn’t exclusive enough?

The LAX south runway complex overbuild was also an A380 project that, while some claim was “necessary,” was not worth the cost and years of inconvenience. LAX has always been an airport with plenty of runways for the prevailing conditions. Departure delays were rare. Arrival delays were due to gate space or rare fog, not congestion. Even if LAX were to see 50 A380s a day, the north complex could easily handle all of them considering how they would be spaced throughout the day based on origin and destination curfews.
 
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zkojq
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue May 11, 2021 7:38 pm

ikramerica wrote:

But the third was costly and pointless. Why? So that you could fill through door 1 only for F, for a few dozen people at most? So the elite doesn’t have to even see the rabble? Turning left after early boarding isn’t exclusive enough?


Speaking from experience at HKG, using the third jetway greatly inflated my ego and made me feel very smug. Had me in a good mood for the rest of the day. :lol:
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Wed May 12, 2021 12:22 am

Its life we all spend money on things that don't happen. Some people spend $200,000 on a private college degree and go into a totally different field. Life happens. No one could have seen these events.

If someone does rebuild another large plane when airports become over crowded again they will be more ready. Go out ten or fifteen years airports will probably face the over crowding the a380 was suppose to prevent. It was a plane just too early , they were too dramatic of the over crowding potential but it will happen. We don't know those improvements won't help in the future when in 2040 they make more fuel efficient a380 type plane. Not ideal but I don't think the airports are mad at all, it's just life and the improvements might be needed far down the road
 
32andBelow
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Wed May 12, 2021 12:43 am

A new 3rd Jetway could be moved and reused on another gate no?
 
DC8FanJet
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Wed May 12, 2021 1:13 am

kordcj wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
How many airports that saw A380s are unlikely to ever see them again?

In the US, ATL/BOS/ORD/DFW/HNL/IAH/LAX/MIA/JFK/SFO/IAD all saw regular A380 operations. ATL will probably never see regular A380 ops again, and I would say the same is likely true for IAH/DFW/MIA/BOS.


ORD didn’t have regular A380 service. If I’m not mistaken, EK sent an A380 to ORD twice and on the last visit they ran a gate or vehicle into the craft. LH didn’t want to give up T1 departures for A380 service. BA had seasonal summer service only.


BA operated 380 on their summer schedules for a few years
 
alasizon
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Wed May 12, 2021 3:34 am

32andBelow wrote:
A new 3rd Jetway could be moved and reused on another gate no?


Depends on the work that has been done with it - the tunnels certainly could be re-used but the vertical supports and motors may not be able to.
 
airbazar
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Wed May 12, 2021 11:46 am

alasizon wrote:
32andBelow wrote:
A new 3rd Jetway could be moved and reused on another gate no?


Depends on the work that has been done with it - the tunnels certainly could be re-used but the vertical supports and motors may not be able to.


The A380 piers at BOS appear to have been designed and built with an extra lower level "entrance" to accommodate re-attaching the upper jetway to the lower level when the upper boarding is no longer needed. You can see this entrance clearly boarded up, next to the lower level jetway entrance. In addition the new gates being build right now for the terminal expansion are flex use gates giving the option to park 1 A380 or 2 narrowbody planes. These are just 2 examples of the many ways in which "A380 improvements" are being leveraged towards other types of operations. It's not all a total sunk cost.
 
Uspurs
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Wed May 12, 2021 4:37 pm

USAirALB wrote:
How many airports that saw A380s are unlikely to ever see them again?

In the US, ATL/BOS/ORD/DFW/HNL/IAH/LAX/MIA/JFK/SFO/IAD all saw regular A380 operations. ATL will probably never see regular A380 ops again, and I would say the same is likely true for IAH/DFW/MIA/BOS.


AUH and, in particular, the still-yet-to-open midfield terminal, with its 8 A380 gates
 
mxaxai
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Wed May 12, 2021 4:45 pm

StarAC17 wrote:
Excuse my ignorance but wasn't the A380 designed that any airport that accommodated the 744 could operate the A380. It was designed to fit in the same gates as other widebodies and maneuver on existing taxiways with the same or lesser load on the pavements and take off and land on an 11,000 ft runway.

The A380 is a code F aircraft (wingspan <80m) while the 747-400 and all other previous passenger aircraft are code E aircraft (wingspan <65m) or even smaller (767, DC-10, ...). If a terminal was designed 50 years ago for a mix of 747 and DC-10 traffic, it would need to rearrange its gates to accommodate the A380. Most recent terminals allow for a more flexible setup to better work with multiple different aircraft sizes.

Same for runways and taxiways. The A380 requires more spacing between parallel taxiways. Floodlights, buildings and parked aircraft need to be further away. That's why some old airports needed to move some taxiways, or had to restrict the A380 to certain paths to and from the runway.

Most of these issues were at US airports, since these grew to their current size long ago and were optimized for smaller jets. Any new large airport, runway or terminal built since 1990 anticipated the eventual introduction of code F aircraft and can deal with the A380 fairly easily.
 
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eurotrader85
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Thu May 13, 2021 9:19 am

wingflex744 wrote:
Apart from the US, which other airport around the world do you think will probably not see the 380 again?


MEX given AF have dropped the aircraft. But this is a good point, sure we are in bad times and a lot of the smaller users of the aircraft are dropping it from their fleet, but once we get back to the real normal how many destinations who did pre-covid, will actually never see an A380 again? Answer is probably not many when EK, BA, SQ, QF etc remain committed fully or at least to some degree.
 
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lesfalls
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Thu May 13, 2021 1:09 pm

Not all airports paid for the A380 gates. EK paid 1 million out of pocket for the gate at T4S in MAD with AENA just giving them all the permissions required.
 
Cardude2
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Mon Sep 20, 2021 11:53 pm

can the 747-8 even use the third jetway? I know the 747-400 cannot, its top door is an emergency door.
 
aaway
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue Sep 21, 2021 1:19 am

LAXdenizen wrote:
lightsaber wrote:
Most of the improvements improve the speed other aircraft may operate. The large gates will be consolidated. In my opinion, airports fell into three categories:
1. Minimal accomodation. A gate or two modified for the A380 and maybe a taxiway intersection.
2. Moderate improvement where a few gates were added that were needed anyway and perhaps an early runway rebuild.
3. An excuse to perform needed runway work including building a heavier duty runway and some extra terminal or concourse space.

I cannot think of one airport that couldn't economically repurpose the A380 stuff. Well, perhaps excluding over expansion at the ME3...



Ok, so what I'm hearing is that while the a380 was arguably a bust for Airbus, the improvements to accommodate its unique size isn't necessarily a loss for the major airports as the upgrades help them in the long run (77X) and the a380 may have accelerated improvements that airports would otherwise have done someday later. The only thing then I can think of not transferable from an infrastructure standpoint would be the elevated jetway to service the upper deck.


Bear in mind at LAX, the second level of all of the A380 capable gates also serve as arrivals access to the FIS sterile corridor. Regardless of aircraft gauge, or boarding process (narrow-body, single level, single jetway boarding), international arriving passengers have to ascend to access the sterile corridor. That was a design element of what was ultimately constructed at the TBIT. No loss from a terminal facilities standpoint. So, you're looking at equipment cost and O & M expense for the second level jetbridges.
 
AwysBSB
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue Sep 21, 2021 5:17 am

The deal of construction firms and real estate funds never needed a really plausible reason to get done.
In aviation, their game is to pressure the community for the demolition and construction of airports even if that has no consistent ROI.
Considering that, the A380 infrastrutucture should not be judged as the most controversial intervention ever taken place at airports.
Unjustified airport modifications are underway and new ones will emerge while construction and real estate business keep power over aviation.
 
cedarjet
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue Sep 21, 2021 6:39 am

They’ve had a decade to recoup costs so I doubt anyone’s still underwater anyway
 
BrianDromey
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:16 am

I’m not sure “upset” is the correct phrase. But I think they might be disappointed that Airlines have quickly pivoted from what looked like “the future” to a different vision of the future, with smaller gauges than anticipated.

The sad reality is that airlines just can’t sell enough seats at the same time to fill the A380 reliably, year-round. The 77X might suffer from the same issues. Let’s revisit in 10 years, but I suspect the gauge of the A380/779 are a bigger issue than the specific frame.
 
FlyingHonu001
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:18 am

CZ also still operates 5x A380's... So if they are still planning on expanding internationally , it might not be a total loss..
 
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scbriml
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue Sep 21, 2021 7:48 am

cedarjet wrote:
They’ve had a decade to recoup costs so I doubt anyone’s still underwater anyway


There you go, spoiling a damned good rant-thread by being reasonable! SMH :wink2:
 
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zeke
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:58 am

LAXdenizen wrote:
Am wondering how upset airports are (such as my hometown LAX) that spent tens (if not hundreds) of millions of dollars on a380 infrastructure upgrades to terminals, runways to accommodate the now-shuttered a380 program? At least there will be a380 service returning to LAX for the foreseeable future (although in diminished quantities), but are there other airports around the globe that will never see another a380 again?


LAX was, and still is in my opinion a substandard international gateway. For many people it is the first experience people have with the US.

LAX was built with the 707 in mind, it was broken well before the A380 turned up.
 
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jfklganyc
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue Sep 21, 2021 11:23 am

These gates will be like the old IAB 3 jetway gates at JFK that were built and used briefly in the 70s as the 747 craze swept the industry

The difference then vs now is simple. The 747 was the plane. Everyone had them and a competing twin or trijet widebody was a decade out. The 747 enjoyed 25 years of widespread use, another 15 years of good use, and is still in operation today on a much smaller level

The 380 and VLA aircraft were controversial from the get go because they went against the grain and trends of the industry: smaller twins, more flights. This trend was particularly true in the United States where airlines have so many hubs, they dont need VLA aircraft at all. In that sense Boeing was right.

The VLA push was made for congested airports. Yet, ironically, airlines with high frequency service to slot constrained airports continued to use smaller twins with more flights to avoid giving up slots. JFK never saw 380 service on BA and saw limited service from AF and LH. Those airlines have since slashed their 380 fleets meaning airports like CDG LHR and FRA will have their hub airline moving away from VLA aircraft in constrained Europe.

The plane became a niche aircraft for Asian carriers.

In America, being a 380 airport became a bandwagon to jump on. Beyond LAX and SFO, no one really needed anything beyond a gate or two.

The investments that many posters above are touting are completely unnecessary for the 787/350s of the future and the decade of use that others are touting was nothing more than sporadic, low frequency service in the grand scheme of things.

Did EK ever really need to send a 380 to places like MCO and ATL? Hell no. A resounding no.
 
ContinentalEWR
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue Sep 21, 2021 3:08 pm

jfklganyc wrote:
These gates will be like the old IAB 3 jetway gates at JFK that were built and used briefly in the 70s as the 747 craze swept the industry

The difference then vs now is simple. The 747 was the plane. Everyone had them and a competing twin or trijet widebody was a decade out. The 747 enjoyed 25 years of widespread use, another 15 years of good use, and is still in operation today on a much smaller level

The 380 and VLA aircraft were controversial from the get go because they went against the grain and trends of the industry: smaller twins, more flights. This trend was particularly true in the United States where airlines have so many hubs, they dont need VLA aircraft at all. In that sense Boeing was right.

The VLA push was made for congested airports. Yet, ironically, airlines with high frequency service to slot constrained airports continued to use smaller twins with more flights to avoid giving up slots. JFK never saw 380 service on BA and saw limited service from AF and LH. Those airlines have since slashed their 380 fleets meaning airports like CDG LHR and FRA will have their hub airline moving away from VLA aircraft in constrained Europe.

The plane became a niche aircraft for Asian carriers.

In America, being a 380 airport became a bandwagon to jump on. Beyond LAX and SFO, no one really needed anything beyond a gate or two.

The investments that many posters above are touting are completely unnecessary for the 787/350s of the future and the decade of use that others are touting was nothing more than sporadic, low frequency service in the grand scheme of things.

Did EK ever really need to send a 380 to places like MCO and ATL? Hell no. A resounding no.


All of this. Very accurate. The A380 was a white elephant from the get go, and never really was used for its true intention, to reduce congestion and challenging airports by reducing frequency. The problem is the buyers of premium seats crave frequency. The A380 really only works for BA among the non-Asia based carriers, given the slot limits at LHR. It will work well for QF again when it resumes flying, given the huge pent up demand for travel to/from Australia when borders reopen there, but long term, the plane will be phased out and replaced by a twin jet. There is absolutely no need for A380 service to most of the places EK flies to.
 
Prost
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue Sep 21, 2021 3:27 pm

zeke wrote:
LAX was, and still is in my opinion a substandard international gateway. For many people it is the first experience people have with the US.

LAX was built with the 707 in mind, it was broken well before the A380 turned up.

I think LAX is the perfect introduction to America, worn, pieced together infrastructure without longterm planning.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue Sep 21, 2021 4:02 pm

zeke wrote:
LAXdenizen wrote:
Am wondering how upset airports are (such as my hometown LAX) that spent tens (if not hundreds) of millions of dollars on a380 infrastructure upgrades to terminals, runways to accommodate the now-shuttered a380 program? At least there will be a380 service returning to LAX for the foreseeable future (although in diminished quantities), but are there other airports around the globe that will never see another a380 again?


LAX was, and still is in my opinion a substandard international gateway. For many people it is the first experience people have with the US.

LAX was built with the 707 in mind, it was broken well before the A380 turned up.


Lots of a.net posters love airport palaces. You just need to convince the ~25 U.S. cities and counties responsible for the airports that serve 90+% of arriving international passengers that they should each spend an extra $ Billion (or $5 Billion), in competition with funds for local schools, parks, and law enforcement. Or, the Federal government could lift the cap on Passenger Facility Charges (XF) from its current $4.50/segment to maybe $50 in a 'users pay' model. Think U.S. carriers would be happy with that? I don't think so...
 
Cdydatzigs
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue Sep 21, 2021 4:25 pm

You're also investing in a future you're not yet aware of. Though the days of the 747 and A380 are numbered, there might be some noise-pollution friendly supersonic airliner or flying wing design that will happen in the next 20-50 years to where those A380 improvements will have been a good thing.
 
Cdydatzigs
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue Sep 21, 2021 4:29 pm

vhtje wrote:
With the last built airframe only just recently had its maiden flight, the A380 will continue to utilize airports around the world for 20+ years to come.


I think that's a pretty generous estimate. There are dozens of planes in boneyards right now that have plenty of service life in them, but today's market demands have rendered them obsolete.
 
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HowardDGA
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Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue Sep 21, 2021 5:33 pm

zeke wrote:
LAX was, and still is in my opinion a substandard international gateway. For many people it is the first experience people have with the US.

LAX was built with the 707 in mind, it was broken well before the A380 turned up.


So, what is a good international gateway? And when was it built?
 
CMA727
Posts: 114
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2016 7:52 pm

Re: How upset are airports that spent massive $$$ on a380 infrastructure?

Tue Sep 21, 2021 6:35 pm

https://www.eleconomista.com.mx/empresa ... -0081.html

According to this report MEX spent $ 320 million pesos (that´s around $ 16 million USD) getting ready for A380 operations.
MEX has seen only AF A380 operations, for a while those were dialy. Sometimes due to delays on AOG MEX saw 2 AF 380´s parked at the same time.
LH considered using A380´s on its FRA-MEX route but that came to nothing due to several reasons, among them IIRC alternate airport issues.
Nowadays the only chance MEX has to use its A380 gates for the type is related on whether EK decides to upgrade its DXB-BCN-MEX service, otherwise IMHO those gates will be another waste at MEX.

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