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Ziyulu
Posts: 1146
Joined: Thu Oct 13, 2016 10:35 am

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 11:37 am

I don't see anything wrong or illegal about this since they are asking for volunteers. They are not forcing people to do such work.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 10185
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 11:55 am

casperCA wrote:
I am in Canada, so I don't understand these US labour law details. Up here your either in a salaried position or your paid by the hour. If it is an inter-provincial railway or airline it operates under federal labour law instead of provincial law. But there is no master list of the positioned that are salaried and positions that are hourly. That is a function of how your paid not the work you do. I would have though the same in the US. No?


The U.S. doesn't have a master list of hourly and salaried positions, either, but it has the law (as cornerstone, the Fair Labor Standards Act, as amended, dating back to 1938), Dept. of Labor interpretations, and court precedents. The word 'exempt' appears above - exempt meaning exempt from the provisions of the FLSA that requires a record of hours worked, and overtime pay (1.5x the base hourly rate) for people working more than 40 hours a week (not more than 8 hours a day). Very generally, exempt jobs are managerial positions, professional positions, and technical positions.

Non-managerial food service positions - SkyClub attendants, bar tenders, restaurant servers, fast food workers - are going to be hourly workers without a doubt.

Employers don't have the freedom to say 'We're just going to make that a salaried position' in order to squeeze out a few more hours of unpaid work.

Salaried position descriptions will typically list job duties and close with something like 'and other duties as assigned,' but they can't make the head of network planning spend four hours a day cleaning toilets. The Bloomberg piece in the OP's link noted the work is limited to 3 days a month, with no incremental pay, and the request went out to salaried workers. I've studied labor law (as an economist, not a lawyer). Making it voluntary, limiting the hours worked at the activity, and seeking just salaried staff means, IMHO, it fits legal requirements.

Delta sent the request through internal channels to Atlanta salaried and management employees -- or headquarters workers -- who make up the pool of eligible volunteers, the airline said.

While volunteers are needed “at all times,” there is a limit of three days per person per month, the carrier said. “Ideally we’ll be working each week to fill volunteer slots for the following week.”

The employees won’t receive any pay or compensation for helping out at the loyalty lounges.


It should be noted that the regular SkyClub positions are staffed by a contractor, not Delta, according to Bloomberg. Lots of U.S. firms subcontract labor in lots of ways - not just service positions, but tech/engineering/finance, too.
 
User avatar
TVNWZ
Posts: 2343
Joined: Fri Feb 17, 2006 9:28 am

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 12:57 pm

Delta: We appreciate your hard work and here is your outsized profit sharing check to show our gratitude.
Employees: This is a great company to work for.
Delta: We got this problem. We need some volunteers to work the Sky Clubs..for whatever reason.. it would really help us. And it’s volunteer
Employees: Hard no. And you’re a jerk for asking to do that type of work
Delta: Hmmm. Duly noted.
 
Mat1776
Posts: 32
Joined: Sun Apr 22, 2012 5:21 pm

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 1:13 pm

Just what-if questions.

1) If a pilot volunteers his time to, for example, do the dishes at the lounge, does it count as an "on duty" time?
2) If a store-room clerk at Delta HQ volunteers to do the dishes, does he/she get a security ID badge at the airport?
Last edited by Mat1776 on Fri May 14, 2021 1:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
LCDFlight
Posts: 1359
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2020 9:22 pm

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 1:14 pm

TVNWZ wrote:
Delta: We appreciate your hard work and here is your outsized profit sharing check to show our gratitude.
Employees: This is a great company to work for.
Delta: We got this problem. We need some volunteers to work the Sky Clubs..for whatever reason.. it would really help us. And it’s volunteer
Employees: Hard no. And you’re a jerk for asking to do that type of work
Delta: Hmmm. Duly noted.


:rotfl: Yeah honestly Delta employees ARE treated pretty well. Free flights and a HUGE chunk of company profits. That's as good as you are going to get here on Earth.

Mat1776 wrote:
Just what-if questions.

1) If a pilot volunteers his time to, for example, do the dishes at the lounge, does it count as an "on duty" time?
2) If a store-room clerk at Delta HQ volunteers to do the dishes, does he/she get a security ID badge at the airport?


Let's keep in mind that corporate HQ staff are FAA cleared airline employees, so yes, DL can say they have business purpose to be in the secure area. IIRC, HQ employees can even get airside with company permission, although I don't know the legal details. I did both things in the 2000s when I was an HQ employee.
 
trueblew
Posts: 315
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2018 10:16 pm

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 1:25 pm

Ziyulu wrote:
I don't see anything wrong or illegal about this since they are asking for volunteers. They are not forcing people to do such work.


Of course it's not illegal, it's just plain tacky/trashy. Especially from an airline with such an over-inflated sense of self-worth (propagated by management and eagerly bought into by many employees).
 
User avatar
TVNWZ
Posts: 2343
Joined: Fri Feb 17, 2006 9:28 am

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 1:33 pm

trueblew wrote:
Ziyulu wrote:
I don't see anything wrong or illegal about this since they are asking for volunteers. They are not forcing people to do such work.


Of course it's not illegal, it's just plain tacky/trashy. Especially from an airline with such an over-inflated sense of self-worth (propagated by management and eagerly bought into by many employees).


Their profit sharing checks say otherwise.
 
User avatar
AerJamaica
Posts: 3
Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2010 10:30 pm

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 1:35 pm

Quick question : If NOT ONE Delta employee volunteers for any of these jobs - what does DL do then?
 
trueblew
Posts: 315
Joined: Thu Nov 15, 2018 10:16 pm

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 1:59 pm

TVNWZ wrote:
trueblew wrote:
Ziyulu wrote:
I don't see anything wrong or illegal about this since they are asking for volunteers. They are not forcing people to do such work.


Of course it's not illegal, it's just plain tacky/trashy. Especially from an airline with such an over-inflated sense of self-worth (propagated by management and eagerly bought into by many employees).


Their profit sharing checks say otherwise.


If (one's perception of oneself) taking home more money than someone else doing the same job makes one think more highly of oneself, well.... one might work at Delta.
 
AWACSooner
Posts: 2643
Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2008 12:35 am

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 2:14 pm

AerJamaica wrote:
Quick question : If NOT ONE Delta employee volunteers for any of these jobs - what does DL do then?

My guess: shut down some lounges and consolidate (terminal D would be the first, IMO).
 
FCOTSTW
Posts: 294
Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2018 8:14 pm

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 3:05 pm

There is a little detail: when you are requested to volunteer, you are not a volunteer anymore...
 
BC77008
Posts: 473
Joined: Tue Sep 06, 2011 11:48 pm

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 3:11 pm

Offer customers flying on the most discounted of tickets in economy complimentary SkyClub lounge access passes. When they walk into the club, hand them gloves, Comet, and a toilet brush...
 
mech24
Posts: 48
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2001 1:15 am

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 3:31 pm

ASFlyer wrote:
this is ridiculous, yet there will be no shortage of people lining up to "save their Delta". If it works for them - great. It's not a good look, asking your other employees to volunteer on their off time to cover what would, otherwise be a paid employee that they can't attract because they don't pay enough. Also, did I read that the SkyClub employees are contract employees? Do they even work for Delta???


The kool-aid drinkers will line up to volunteer. They don't know any better.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 10185
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 4:02 pm

Mat1776 wrote:
Just what-if questions.

1) If a pilot volunteers his time to, for example, do the dishes at the lounge, does it count as an "on duty" time?
2) If a store-room clerk at Delta HQ volunteers to do the dishes, does he/she get a security ID badge at the airport?


Pilots aren't salaried employees. They're not eligible to volunteer.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 10185
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 4:03 pm

FCOTSTW wrote:
There is a little detail: when you are requested to volunteer, you are not a volunteer anymore...


So how does anybody get volunteers for anything? It's called soliciting volunteers.

The idea that every employer/employee interaction involves coercion is twisted.
 
32andBelow
Posts: 5729
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 4:09 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
Mat1776 wrote:
Just what-if questions.

1) If a pilot volunteers his time to, for example, do the dishes at the lounge, does it count as an "on duty" time?
2) If a store-room clerk at Delta HQ volunteers to do the dishes, does he/she get a security ID badge at the airport?


Pilots aren't salaried employees. They're not eligible to volunteer.

What about management pilots
 
Lootess
Posts: 734
Joined: Sun May 13, 2018 6:15 am

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 6:54 pm

Feel like some have no clue with that they think happens, and don’t even work a salaried job.

I work salaried, and they asked us for volunteer to help the COVID phone bank for a day or less. I was able to, as I had no deadlines that week, so it’s not like I had to do double duty. You work to get tasks done, not to a time clock.
 
User avatar
usdcaguy
Posts: 1665
Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2004 12:41 pm

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 8:22 pm

Honestly, I have no idea why Delta does this. If they need someone to work the lounge, they could easily pay for it, clear and simple. It would cost them next to nothing. At least pay management a bonus to do it. Otherwise, they likely need to consolidate lounges anyway and build one that is much bigger than the ones they have.
 
WkndWanderer
Posts: 355
Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2017 6:36 pm

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 8:41 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
casperCA wrote:
I am in Canada, so I don't understand these US labour law details. Up here your either in a salaried position or your paid by the hour. If it is an inter-provincial railway or airline it operates under federal labour law instead of provincial law. But there is no master list of the positioned that are salaried and positions that are hourly. That is a function of how your paid not the work you do. I would have though the same in the US. No?


The U.S. doesn't have a master list of hourly and salaried positions, either, but it has the law (as cornerstone, the Fair Labor Standards Act, as amended, dating back to 1938), Dept. of Labor interpretations, and court precedents. The word 'exempt' appears above - exempt meaning exempt from the provisions of the FLSA that requires a record of hours worked, and overtime pay (1.5x the base hourly rate) for people working more than 40 hours a week (not more than 8 hours a day). Very generally, exempt jobs are managerial positions, professional positions, and technical positions.

Non-managerial food service positions - SkyClub attendants, bar tenders, restaurant servers, fast food workers - are going to be hourly workers without a doubt.

Employers don't have the freedom to say 'We're just going to make that a salaried position' in order to squeeze out a few more hours of unpaid work.

Salaried position descriptions will typically list job duties and close with something like 'and other duties as assigned,' but they can't make the head of network planning spend four hours a day cleaning toilets. The Bloomberg piece in the OP's link noted the work is limited to 3 days a month, with no incremental pay, and the request went out to salaried workers. I've studied labor law (as an economist, not a lawyer). Making it voluntary, limiting the hours worked at the activity, and seeking just salaried staff means, IMHO, it fits legal requirements.

Delta sent the request through internal channels to Atlanta salaried and management employees -- or headquarters workers -- who make up the pool of eligible volunteers, the airline said.

While volunteers are needed “at all times,” there is a limit of three days per person per month, the carrier said. “Ideally we’ll be working each week to fill volunteer slots for the following week.”

The employees won’t receive any pay or compensation for helping out at the loyalty lounges.


It should be noted that the regular SkyClub positions are staffed by a contractor, not Delta, according to Bloomberg. Lots of U.S. firms subcontract labor in lots of ways - not just service positions, but tech/engineering/finance, too.


:checkmark: that 3 day per month cap is how they’re ensuring none of their exempt workers cross the line into doing too much non-exempt work to screw up their classifications.
 
roadrunner165
Posts: 895
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2000 6:28 am

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 8:58 pm

Come work at the Airport!! Sodexo is hiring for the DELTA SKY CLUB !! Earn up to a **$2,000 SIGN ON BONUS** * Other Great Benefits • Paid Parking or MARTA card • Attendance Bonus paid out, up to an extra $2,000 • Earn an employee referral bonus up to $1,000 • Medical/Dental/Vision/401k • Tuition Reimbursment Hours of operation range from 5:30 AM- 10:30 PM Sunday- Saturday (including holidays) Come join our FAMILY!! Position Summary The Banquet Support – Wait Staff will provide prompt and courteous service to all customers. Provide customers with efficient and attentive service while exceeding the customer’s expectations. The general responsibilities of the position include those listed below, but Sodexo may identify other responsibilities of the position. These responsibilities may differ among accounts, depending on business necessities and client requirements. General Responsibilities • Greets and seats customers. • Presents customers with menus. • Serves food to customers at a limited number of tables, using proper rules of etiquette. • Makes appropriate meal and beverage suggestions and answers questions regarding food preparation. • Writes a food check and/or memorizes the order. • Relays the order to the kitchen. • Accepts payment, refers customers to the cashier or operates the cash register. • Cleans and sanitizes workstations and equipment and assists in clearing and resetting tables. • May carve meat, fish or poultry and/or prepare flaming dishes and desserts. • May carry and distribute supplies and equipment. • May assist others in the preparation of foods and properly store food. • May total bills and may be asked to respond to complaints regarding food or service. • May operate dishwasher or assist with washing dishes, glassware, silverware, utensils, pots and pans. • May assist with stocking food inventory. • Attends all allergy and foodborne illness in-service training. • Complies with all Sodexo HACCP policies and procedures. • Reports all accidents and injuries in a timely manner. • Complies with all company safety and risk management policies and procedures. • Participates in regular safety meetings, safety training and hazard assessments. • Attends training programs (classroom and virtual) as designated. • May perform other duties and responsibilities as assigned. Qualifications & Requirements • Willingness to be open to learning and growing. • Maturity of judgment and behavior. • Maintains high standards for work areas and appearance. • Maintains a positive attitude. • Ability to work a flexible schedule helpful. • Must comply with any dress code requirements. • Must be able to work nights, weekends and some holidays. • Attends work and shows up for scheduled shift on time with satisfactory regularity. Experience /Knowledge • High School diploma, GED, or equivalent experience. • 0 to 1 year related experience. Skills /Aptitude • Presents self in a highly professional manner to others and understands that honesty and ethics are essential. • Ability to maintain a positive attitude. • Ability to communicate with co-workers and other departments with professionalism and respect. • Maintains a professional relationship with all coworkers, vendor representatives, supervisors, managers, customers, and client representatives. • Ability to us e a computer. • Ability to listen carefully to their customers’ orders, explain drink and food items and make menu recommendations. • Ability to provide clear directions and respond accordingly to employees. Physical Requirements • Close vision, distance vision, peripheral vision, depth perception and the ability to adjust focus, with or without corrective lenses. • Significant walking or other means of mobility. • Ability to work in a standing position for long periods of time (up to 8 hours). • Ability to reach, bend, stoop, push and/or pull, and frequently lift up to 35 pounds and occasionally lift/move 40 pounds. Working Conditions (may add additional conditions specific to defined work location): • Generally in an indoor setting; however, may supervise outside activities and events. • Varying schedule to include evenings, holidays, weekends and extended hours as business dictates. • While performing the duties of this job, the employee is primarily in a controlled, temperate environment; however, may be exposed to heat/cold during support of outside activities. • The noise level in the work environment is usually moderate to loud. Sodexo is an EEO/AA/Minority/Female/Disability/Veteran employer

All of this and more could be yours, if the price is right!
 
roadrunner165
Posts: 895
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2000 6:28 am

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 9:02 pm

My guess is the sign on bonus is prorated and paid out over a years time and required to be paid back if you quit.

Perfect attendance is likely required to earn attendance bonus after some length of time which is next to impossible since you probably don’t earn vacation days until after 1 year.

And the best part, other duties as assigned! So now even you can volunteer doing the job of the guy who skipped his shift; I mean, you have the privilege to show you’re really part of the Sodexo family by sharing job duties for the day!
Hmmm, I wonder if you can volunteer to work for Delta on the ramp during Thanksgiving rush; or is that a one way street?

And they’ll pay for your parking so You can go to work, is that honestly even a perk?

Where do I sign up?
Last edited by roadrunner165 on Fri May 14, 2021 9:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
ASFlyer
Posts: 1908
Joined: Sat May 28, 2005 1:25 pm

Re: Delta Wants Sky Club Volunteer Work

Fri May 14, 2021 9:07 pm

TVNWZ wrote:
trueblew wrote:
Ziyulu wrote:
I don't see anything wrong or illegal about this since they are asking for volunteers. They are not forcing people to do such work.


Of course it's not illegal, it's just plain tacky/trashy. Especially from an airline with such an over-inflated sense of self-worth (propagated by management and eagerly bought into by many employees).


Their profit sharing checks say otherwise.


how much profit sharing did they take home last year?

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