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Ishrion
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Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 2:36 pm

Delta finally responds to AA.

- 3x daily BOS-CLT from October 4 with E175
- 2x daily BOS-DFW from October 4 with A220-100
- 3x daily BOS-YYZ from October 4 with E175
- 2x daily LGA-YYZ from August 5, increase to six daily in the Fall operated with E175

https://news.delta.com/delta-expands-bo ... stinations
Last edited by Ishrion on Fri May 14, 2021 2:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 2:39 pm

But but but........I thought the B6 & AA alliance was suppose to reduce competition :spin:

AA will try and smother DL on BOS-CLT/DFW I wager.
ORD & IND

AA & DL
 
cledaybuck
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 2:43 pm

Things must be getting back to normal. Airlines are willing to burn money on retaliatory routes again.
As we celebrate mediocrity, all the boys upstairs want to see, how much you'll pay for what you used to get for free.
 
BigGSFO
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 2:46 pm

cledaybuck wrote:
Things must be getting back to normal. Airlines are willing to burn money on retaliatory routes again.

Indeed, the earth is healing.

Fascinating move, definitely aimed at AA obviously. But also these are missing destination from DL's BOS network which are probably in demand from corporate flyers.
 
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ChrisNH38
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 2:55 pm

How does Air Canada respond? At the moment, their government has them hamstrung, I think.
https://my.flightradar24.com/ChrisNH
 
rjbesikof
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:03 pm

LAX-BOS will also go all 757.
 
hollywoodcory
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:11 pm

ChrisNH38 wrote:
How does Air Canada respond? At the moment, their government has them hamstrung, I think.


How would they respond when AC already serves those routes? They are also scheduled to resume both June 1st.
 
ContinentalEWR
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:12 pm

cledaybuck wrote:
Things must be getting back to normal. Airlines are willing to burn money on retaliatory routes again.


Exactly. BOS-CLT, 3 x daily, on DL seems like a waste. There is corporate traffic but much of that, has to be with AA.
 
jplatts
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:13 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
AA will try and smother DL on BOS-CLT/DFW I wager.


cledaybuck wrote:
Things must be getting back to normal. Airlines are willing to burn money on retaliatory routes again.


BigGSFO wrote:
Fascinating move, definitely aimed at AA obviously. But also these are missing destination from DL's BOS network which are probably in demand from corporate flyers.


BOS can likely support additional nonstop service to DFW once demand recovers with the significant cuts that both AA and B6 have made on the BOS-DFW route due to the pandemic. WN has also already dropped BOS-DAL nonstop service due to the COVID-19 pandemic.

There are also some DL FF's in Greater Boston who would avoid other airlines such as AA, B6, and WN whenever possible.

B6 might be able to get more DFW point-of-sale traffic on its DFW-BOS nonstop flights due to the AA-B6 partnership, even though most AA FF's in the DFW market who are traveling domestically would prefer an AA-operated flight over a flight operated by an AA partner airline.

There are also some transatlantic connecting opportunities available at BOS on DL, AF, and KL to support the return of DFW-BOS nonstop service on DL.
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:14 pm

hollywoodcory wrote:
ChrisNH38 wrote:
How does Air Canada respond? At the moment, their government has them hamstrung, I think.


How would they respond when AC already serves those routes? They are also scheduled to resume both June 1st.


???

-Different times
-More capacity
-Better aircraft
-Lower fares

Them already being on the route makes it more likely that they would respond....
ORD & IND

AA & DL
 
thaiaggie
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:18 pm

What about DFW-SEA? :hissyfit:
Barrow, Alaska in Feb. It was Cold!
 
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psa1011
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:24 pm

Is BOS-SFO going to return?
 
Ishrion
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:24 pm

thaiaggie wrote:
What about DFW-SEA? :hissyfit:


I suppose this announcement is specifically focused on routes out of BOS/NYC.

DL intended to launch SEA-DFW last August but pulled the route. I'm still hoping they start it.
 
Ishrion
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:26 pm

psa1011 wrote:
Is BOS-SFO going to return?


Currently scheduled daily from August 5. Changes are highly possible.
 
tphuang
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:29 pm

lol, 2 US carriers on BOS-YYZ. AC will crush both airlines here.

As for LGA-YYZ add, is DL declaring war on WS also?
 
jplatts
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:32 pm

thaiaggie wrote:
What about DFW-SEA?


DL was originally planning on resuming DFW-SEA nonstop service last year, but scrapped those plans due to the COVID-19 pandemic.

Another big difference between the BOS and SEA markets is that AS is bigger in SEA than B6 is in BOS. AS also already has partnerships with other oneworld airlines that serve SEA such as AA, BA, and JL, and there are some AS nonstop routes out SEA that don't currently have any nonstop competition.
 
drdisque
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:35 pm

tphuang wrote:
lol, 2 US carriers on BOS-YYZ. AC will crush both airlines here.

As for LGA-YYZ add, is DL declaring war on WS also?


DL has a JV with WS.

This is an opportunity to fly the route with the lower cost E-175 compared to WS's 737's while demand recovers.

Right now WS is scheduled to fly LGA-YYZ 10x 737 in August. I imagine that some of those will be pulled with these DL flights acting as replacements.
 
hollywoodcory
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:36 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
hollywoodcory wrote:
ChrisNH38 wrote:
How does Air Canada respond? At the moment, their government has them hamstrung, I think.


How would they respond when AC already serves those routes? They are also scheduled to resume both June 1st.


???

-Different times
-More capacity
-Better aircraft
-Lower fares

Them already being on the route makes it more likely that they would respond....


AC is already well established on both of those routes. They didn't respond to AA adding BOS-YYZ a few weeks ago, so why now? They may offer lower fares, but otherwise I wouldn't expect much.
 
ScottB
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:38 pm

drdisque wrote:
DL has a JV with WS.


No, the JV application was withdrawn late last year because DL/WS were unwilling to divest slots at LGA as required by DOT to gain approval.

drdisque wrote:
Right now WS is scheduled to fly LGA-YYZ 10x 737 in August. I imagine that some of those will be pulled with these DL flights acting as replacements.


I'm going to assume you mean 5x in each direction? WS only has 8 slot pairs, so they don't have enough of their own slots to operate 10x each way. Plus that's a crazy amount of capacity in a time of border restrictions, especially considering the 736 was their preferred aircraft for LGA-YYZ pre-Covid.
 
drdisque
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:49 pm

ScottB wrote:
drdisque wrote:
DL has a JV with WS.


No, the JV application was withdrawn late last year because DL/WS were unwilling to divest slots at LGA as required by DOT to gain approval.

drdisque wrote:
Right now WS is scheduled to fly LGA-YYZ 10x 737 in August. I imagine that some of those will be pulled with these DL flights acting as replacements.


I'm going to assume you mean 5x in each direction? WS only has 8 slot pairs, so they don't have enough of their own slots to operate 10x each way. Plus that's a crazy amount of capacity in a time of border restrictions, especially considering the 736 was their preferred aircraft for LGA-YYZ pre-Covid.


Sorry it is indeed 8, I miscounted. Sorry I missed the withdrawal of the application.
 
Pi7472000
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:52 pm

Will be nice to have a choice of a premier airline on BOS to DFW/CLT!! Was not fun having to fly AA with their service levels. Nice adds Delta!!
 
jplatts
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:57 pm

There are a few more adds such as BOS-BHM/DSM/SDF/OKC/OMA that could be made by DL once demand recovers with BHM, DSM, SDF, OKC, and OMA being top remaining domestic destinations that aren't currently served nonstop from BOS.
 
YYZORD
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:59 pm

Personally I'd fly DL or AA over AC anyday, many people out there that want options from other carriers compared to AC monopoly on these important business routes. Glad DL finally added LGA-YYZ, always wondered why BUF has LGA-BUF on DL or why YUL got LGA-YUL from DL but not LGA-YYZ.
Last edited by YYZORD on Fri May 14, 2021 4:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.
 
MIflyer12
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 3:59 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
But but but........I thought the B6 & AA alliance was suppose to reduce competition :spin:

AA will try and smother DL on BOS-CLT/DFW I wager.


I don't expect DL to have an easy time of it but there's meaningful traffic volume on those pairs.

It's not as if AA owns BOS. If every route never had more than one carrier on it, a.net's thread count would drop precipitously. Remember when the UA guys mocked DL for starting LAX-SFO? Who's number 1 at LAX today, and who's a distant number 3? https://www.lawa.org/-/media/lawa-web/s ... -2021.ashx
 
rjbesikof
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 4:08 pm

rjbesikof wrote:
LAX-BOS will also go all 757.

On DL
 
tphuang
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 4:25 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
But but but........I thought the B6 & AA alliance was suppose to reduce competition :spin:

AA will try and smother DL on BOS-CLT/DFW I wager.


I think you might be onto something here. B6/AA should definitely use this to swat away that NK complaint.
 
Cubsrule
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 4:39 pm

YYZORD wrote:
Personally I'd fly DL or AA over AC anyday, many people out there that want options from other carriers compared to AC monopoly on these important business routes. Glad DL finally added LGA-YYZ, always wondered why BUF has LGA-BUF on DL or why YUL got LGA-YUL from DL but not LGA-YYZ.


I don't know. It's a short flight so the onboard experience doesn't matter, and the passenger experience at Terminal 3 at YYZ is pretty bad (especially for DL - at least AA has a lounge).
I can't decide whether I miss the tulip or the bowling shoe more
 
tphuang
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 4:52 pm

If I were AA, I'd take this opportunity to talk to WS and see if a JV is possible.
 
slcdeltarumd11
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 5:11 pm

At 357 miles delta doesn't even need to use a 175 on LGA-YYZ they could go even smaller if the border remains an issue etc etc. Frequency will be important when business travel returns, but for now the priority i bet is the best sized plane and flexibility to adjust. This is a business heavy route pre covid. Frequency matters more then equipment type on a shuttle route like this(pre covid). Super short time in the air, but time options are super important to the heavy flyers on this route. Not sure when demand will return but delta does have alot more aircraft types to better fit the demand then WS, so this makes sense to me. Delta can adjust based on the border situation which no one knows. We could see demand skyrocket when it finally opens. Lots of family/friends between NY and Canada who haven't seen each other in a long time. Cant even drive crossed the border or anything. Until the border opens demand will be low as only essential travel and people returning home can fly and thats a pretty small group these days
 
casperCA
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 5:18 pm

slcdeltarumd11 wrote:
At 357 miles delta doesn't even need to use a 175 on LGA-YYZ they could go even smaller if the border remains an issue etc etc. Frequency will be important when business travel returns, but for now the priority i bet is the best sized plane and flexibility to adjust. This is a business heavy route pre covid. Frequency matters more then equipment type on a shuttle route like this(pre covid). Super short time in the air, but time options are super important to the heavy flyers on this route. Not sure when demand will return but delta does have alot more aircraft types to better fit the demand then WS, so this makes sense to me. Delta can adjust based on the border situation which no one knows. We could see demand skyrocket when it finally opens. Lots of family/friends between NY and Canada who haven't seen each other in a long time. Cant even drive crossed the border or anything. Until the border opens demand will be low as only essential travel and people returning home can fly and thats a pretty small group these days


I think the issue is WS has slots that they will at some point need to start using or lose. The only reasonable thing for them to use on the route is the 737-600. The only thing smaller they have are the Q400. DL would have a codeshare on whatever WS operates on the route.
 
jplatts
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 5:28 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
I don't expect DL to have an easy time of it but there's meaningful traffic volume on those pairs.


Here was the number of passengers, number of seats, and load factor for WN BOS-DAL nonstop service in 2019:
108167 passengers, 127432 seats, 84.88% load factor

The average PDEW of BOS-DAL on WN was 109 passengers/day in 2019, but that number includes passengers that were connecting between BOS and DAL on WN in addition to the number of O&D passengers on WN BOS-DAL nonstop flights. WN also had connecting feed onto BOS-DAL from other destinations in Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, Nevada, and California to support BOS-DAL nonstop service.

The situation is different on BOS-DFW/DAL with WN no longer serving DAL nonstop from BOS, even though the return of WN BOS-DAL nonstop service might be a possibility once demand recovers with the strong demand that was there for WN BOS-DAL nonstop service prior to the pandemic along with the connecting feed that would be there on the DAL end of the route.

DL is more reliant on O&D to make the return of BOS-DFW nonstop service work than WN was on BOS-DAL prior to COVID-19 due to (a) DL no longer having a hub at DFW and (b) transatlantic demand being weaker due to the COVID-19 pandemic. However, DL is planning on operating BOS-DFW using 109-seat A220-100 planes and DL does not have to fill as many seats on BOS-DFW as WN did on BOS-DAL to make the return of DL BOS-DFW nonstop service work.
 
phatfarmlines
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 5:35 pm

Nice to see DL has finally awoken up from its slumber.

Ishrion wrote:
Delta finally responds to AA.

- 3x daily BOS-CLT from October 4 with E175
- 2x daily BOS-DFW from October 4 with A220-100
- 3x daily BOS-YYZ from October 4 with E175
- 2x daily LGA-YYZ from August 5, increase to six daily in the Fall operated with E175

https://news.delta.com/delta-expands-bo ... stinations


The true economic test of the A220 begins.

tphuang wrote:
If I were AA, I'd take this opportunity to talk to WS and see if a JV is possible.


Wouldn't that be the irony, though would AA also have to give up a commensurate amount of slots at LGA (recognizing AA has fewer slots than DL)?
 
B752OS
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 5:51 pm

At this point, the only meaningful markets they do not service from Boston have to be DEN and SAN.
 
AC4500
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 5:54 pm

tphuang wrote:
If I were AA, I'd take this opportunity to talk to WS and see if a JV is possible.

Has DL ever tried to form a JV with WS?
 
AC4500
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 5:55 pm

B752OS wrote:
At this point, the only meaningful markets they do not service from Boston have to be DEN and SAN.

There's a lot more than just DEN and SAN, lol.
 
Ishrion
Topic Author
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 6:06 pm

AC4500 wrote:
tphuang wrote:
If I were AA, I'd take this opportunity to talk to WS and see if a JV is possible.

Has DL ever tried to form a JV with WS?


DL/WS did. They applied in 2018 and received tentative approval from the DOT in 2020 with specific conditions (divest some LGA slots, exclude ULCC Swoop) that led them to withdrawing the application.
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 6:16 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
But but but........I thought the B6 & AA alliance was suppose to reduce competition :spin:

AA will try and smother DL on BOS-CLT/DFW I wager.


I don't expect DL to have an easy time of it but there's meaningful traffic volume on those pairs.

It's not as if AA owns BOS. If every route never had more than one carrier on it, a.net's thread count would drop precipitously. Remember when the UA guys mocked DL for starting LAX-SFO? Who's number 1 at LAX today, and who's a distant number 3? https://www.lawa.org/-/media/lawa-web/s ... -2021.ashx


I don't see DL cutting either route long-term, but AA could make DL's life a living hell on the BOS-CLT/DFW routes.

CLT & DFW are two of the largest hubs in the US, and DL has no real feed on either end, so they'll be relying on O&D traffic of which on CLT-BOS there was only ~900 PDEW at peak in 2019. AA is already operating 1,500 seats/day on that route, plus B6's 200 seats, and now DL's 228 seats.

I'd expect the this route to be very low yielding.

BOS-DFW should probably do better, given it is a much larger market, and DL actually has some strength from DFW.
ORD & IND

AA & DL
 
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Midwestindy
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 6:21 pm

AC4500 wrote:
B752OS wrote:
At this point, the only meaningful markets they do not service from Boston have to be DEN and SAN.

There's a lot more than just DEN and SAN, lol.


IAH & PHX deserve a mention
ORD & IND

AA & DL
 
ScottB
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 6:21 pm

phatfarmlines wrote:
Wouldn't that be the irony, though would AA also have to give up a commensurate amount of slots at LGA (recognizing AA has fewer slots than DL)?


Likely so for a JV, given that AA & US were required to divest LGA slots for their merger and the AA/B6 alliance further increases AA's footprint via B6 codeshare at LGA and NYC in general. For just a codeshare and/or alliance agreement, probably not.

B752OS wrote:
At this point, the only meaningful markets they do not service from Boston have to be DEN and SAN.


PHX as well and that would be another obvious jab at AA. Going further down, IAH and MSY; the former would probably require an A220 but MSY would work on the E175. I would not be surprised to see all three of these within five years if air traffic continues to recover.

Midwestindy wrote:
I don't see DL cutting either route long-term, but AA could make DL's life a living hell on the BOS-CLT/DFW routes.


I think DL will lose money hand-over-fist in these markets, but it's probably worth it if the increased breadth of network at BOS improves their aggregate revenue on the other routes they offer. If AA chooses to respond aggressively to the DL incursion, they probably lose more revenue than DL will spend on operating those flights.
Last edited by ScottB on Fri May 14, 2021 6:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
PITFlyer330
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 6:31 pm

maybe delta is doing lga yyz because they think WestJet might break up their partnership after the joint venture fallout? https://twitter.com/WandrMe/status/1393 ... 05861?s=20
 
AC4500
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 6:35 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
AC4500 wrote:
B752OS wrote:
At this point, the only meaningful markets they do not service from Boston have to be DEN and SAN.

There's a lot more than just DEN and SAN, lol.


IAH & PHX deserve a mention

Also CLE, JAX, PDX, STL (STL is long overdue IMO).
 
AC4500
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 6:38 pm

Ishrion wrote:
AC4500 wrote:
tphuang wrote:
If I were AA, I'd take this opportunity to talk to WS and see if a JV is possible.

Has DL ever tried to form a JV with WS?


DL/WS did. They applied in 2018 and received tentative approval from the DOT in 2020 with specific conditions (divest some LGA slots, exclude ULCC Swoop) that led them to withdrawing the application.

Thanks. I seem to remember that now.

Just goes to show how important LGA is even with business traffic at all-time lows...
 
onwFan
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 6:47 pm

PITFlyer330 wrote:
maybe delta is doing lga yyz because they think WestJet might break up their partnership after the joint venture fallout? https://twitter.com/WandrMe/status/1393 ... 05861?s=20

True - DL adding both LGA-YYZ and BOS-YYZ doesn’t smell good for WS.
 
jbs2886
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Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 6:58 pm

Midwestindy wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
But but but........I thought the B6 & AA alliance was suppose to reduce competition :spin:

AA will try and smother DL on BOS-CLT/DFW I wager.


I don't expect DL to have an easy time of it but there's meaningful traffic volume on those pairs.

It's not as if AA owns BOS. If every route never had more than one carrier on it, a.net's thread count would drop precipitously. Remember when the UA guys mocked DL for starting LAX-SFO? Who's number 1 at LAX today, and who's a distant number 3? https://www.lawa.org/-/media/lawa-web/s ... -2021.ashx


I don't see DL cutting either route long-term, but AA could make DL's life a living hell on the BOS-CLT/DFW routes.

CLT & DFW are two of the largest hubs in the US, and DL has no real feed on either end, so they'll be relying on O&D traffic of which on CLT-BOS there was only ~900 PDEW at peak in 2019. AA is already operating 1,500 seats/day on that route, plus B6's 200 seats, and now DL's 228 seats.

I'd expect the this route to be very low yielding.

BOS-DFW should probably do better, given it is a much larger market, and DL actually has some strength from DFW.


This reads to me, in part, as a belated response to AA adds. Other than YYZ, which does make sense given the WestJet JV application withdrawal, DL is launching BOS to to two AA hubs. I highly doubt DL expects this to be high yielding or that AA will not respond. That being said, I do think these adds all serve a strategic purpose as well to DL's corporate traffic in BOS and NYC.

Edit re: LAX, wow did not know DL was up to #1 by a decent margin.
Last edited by jbs2886 on Fri May 14, 2021 7:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
kavok
Posts: 936
Joined: Wed May 11, 2016 10:12 pm

Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 6:59 pm

When speaking about BOS, the most telling sign is this:

DL is willing to fly BOS-CLT/DFW. As of yet, AA is not willing to enter BOS-DTW/ATL.
 
EdmFlyBoi
Posts: 45
Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2020 5:58 pm

Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 7:04 pm

ChrisNH38 wrote:
How does Air Canada respond? At the moment, their government has them hamstrung, I think.


AC already serves these routes as has been pointed out. Government travel restrictions are not carrier specific. Carriers are free to fly whatever routes are allowed by the government and is not based on the home country of the airline. Travel restrictions also apply equally - you can't enter Canada unless you are an essential traveller or you are Canadian, in which case you have to quarantine based on the present requirements.
 
tphuang
Posts: 6302
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:04 pm

Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 7:05 pm

kavok wrote:
When speaking about BOS, the most telling sign is this:

DL is willing to fly BOS-CLT/DFW. As of yet, AA is not willing to enter BOS-DTW/ATL.


AA doesn't need to. It's got full coverage out of BOS with its B6 partnership. There is very few wholes in AA's BOS network when you factor in the codeshares.
 
kavok
Posts: 936
Joined: Wed May 11, 2016 10:12 pm

Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 7:07 pm

onwFan wrote:
PITFlyer330 wrote:
maybe delta is doing lga yyz because they think WestJet might break up their partnership after the joint venture fallout? https://twitter.com/WandrMe/status/1393 ... 05861?s=20

True - DL adding both LGA-YYZ and BOS-YYZ doesn’t smell good for WS.


PreCovid at least, I am sure there were several strategic new routes or frequency additions that DL/WS would have added should the JV have been approved. In fact, many of us long suspected that DL/WS were deliberately holding off on adding some frequencies/routes between their respective hubs, so that once the JV is approved, the documented JV promise of increased service could be fulfilled with routes that were probably going to be added anyway.

I suspect that this is the case with the YYZ adds. DL was going to add these JV or not, and was just holding off until a verdict on the JV was announced (and obviously until postCovid demand returned at least somewhat). I also wouldn’t be surprised to see WS add some combination of flying between YYZ/YUL/YOW and BOS/NYC/DTW/ATL once demand between Canada and the US picks back up again.

I do find it interesting that some people think the B6/AA partnership can work, but somehow the DL/WS partnership can’t without a JV. Honestly, both partnerships are kind of one and the same.
 
jplatts
Posts: 4394
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2017 6:42 pm

Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 7:24 pm

tphuang wrote:
kavok wrote:
When speaking about BOS, the most telling sign is this:

DL is willing to fly BOS-CLT/DFW. As of yet, AA is not willing to enter BOS-DTW/ATL.


AA doesn't need to. It's got full coverage out of BOS with its B6 partnership. There is very few wholes in AA's BOS network when you factor in the codeshares.


I agree with your point as AA already has its code on B6's BOS-DTW/ATL nonstop flights and AA offers B6's BOS-DTW/ATL nonstop flights for sale (under the AA code) through aa.com.

There are also plenty of 1-stop connecting options between BOS and ATL on AA through LGA, PHL, DCA, and CLT.

AA also already has 1-stop connecting service between BOS and DTW through LGA, PHL, and DCA.

Any AA FF's in Greater Boston who insist on flying on AA-operated flights instead of flying on DL or B6 are also likely willing to connect to ATL or DTW through an AA East Coast hub.
 
N983AN
Posts: 125
Joined: Fri Nov 04, 2016 10:15 am

Re: Delta Adds BOS-DFW/CLT/YYZ, LGA-YYZ

Fri May 14, 2021 7:37 pm

AC4500 wrote:
Midwestindy wrote:
AC4500 wrote:
There's a lot more than just DEN and SAN, lol.


IAH & PHX deserve a mention

Also CLE, JAX, PDX, STL (STL is long overdue IMO).


1) CLE-operating 2x E175s today

2) JAX-operating 2x E175s today

3) PDX-long and thin route over flying multiple hubs.

4) STL-WN stronghold, former AA hub resuming service in November. Given the crime, economic trends in STL region DL has bigger fish to fry. Besides DL has never been a major force in STL.

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