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Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Mon May 31, 2021 8:10 pm

Welcome to Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021. Please continue to add your comments below

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viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1460385&p=22811575#p22811575
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tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Mon May 31, 2021 10:29 pm

The privatised Australian airports are required to produce a master plan each 5 years as part of their lease agreements and they are typically full of long term development ideas that will probably never see the light of day.

It could be a race to see what happens first, the new BNE international terminal or the new MEL international terminal along with the corresponding development of a new T5 for VA south of the existing MEL terminal complex. Personally, I believe both of these are years away from ever happening particularly with Covid putting back international travel demand by up to a decade. I'm in my 50s and would be kind of surprised if I were alive to see either happen.
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jrfspa320
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 1:13 am

tullamarine wrote:
The privatised Australian airports are required to produce a master plan each 5 years as part of their lease agreements and they are typically full of long term development ideas that will probably never see the light of day.

It could be a race to see what happens first, the new BNE international terminal or the new MEL international terminal along with the corresponding development of a new T5 for VA south of the existing MEL terminal complex. Personally, I believe both of these are years away from ever happening particularly with Covid putting back international travel demand by up to a decade. I'm in my 50s and would be kind of surprised if I were alive to see either happen.


Yes good point, i heard that BNEs new runway has substantially increased charges at the airport, so i cant see any appetite to increase that further. If anything i wouldn't be surprised if it resulted in increase growth at OOL and MCY.
 
BNEFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 1:39 am

If the BNE redevelopment happens, we won't see the new terminal operating for at least 10 years, and from the article BAC have said that the existing terminal could still be in use until 2042 (in what capacity is anyone's guess). By that time the original building will be almost 50 years old, so certainly will need an update or replacement by then. But so will the domestic terminal that is already over 30 years old.

These long-term propositions are interesting to read about and see renditions of, but even if it does happen there's no point getting excited about it for another 10 years.
 
Fuling
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 2:36 am

Re New BNE Intl. I would have loved to see the domestic terminal circle shape be extended around, instead of this box shape. Though it might need to be wider and longer for the larger aircraft, it would be quite a building once done!
 
myki
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 2:36 am

Would the closure of the terminal in BNE impact any contractual agreements with Airtrain? Do they own it all, or is it that the state government owns the infrastructure (stations, escalators, trains, wires, etc.) and Airtrain just run the actual service?
 
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CraigAnderson
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 2:50 am

Am I the only person who's a bit surprised that despite having been in charge of Virgin Australia for 6+ months, depending on which date you count things from (eg knowing they'd own it due to administrator's nod, being approved as owners by vote of debtors, officially taking over and installed JH as CEO), Virgin is still dithering around on areas like WiFi and The Club?

These two articles this week:
https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... light-wifi
https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... vip-status

I appreciate that 'Jayne and Bain' have had plenty of other things to do but after all this time you'd also think that by now they'd have had plenty of time to work out where in the 'new' VA2 things like WiFi and The Club would sit.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 2:57 am

US, UK ‘travel bubbles’ appear on horizon

The Pacific Islands are firming as the site of Australia’s next travel bubble but flights to the US and Britain could follow because of the success of their Covid vaccination rollouts. Qantas boss Alan Joyce made the prediction as he continued his campaign to incentivise Australians to get the jab against Covid-19.


https://www.theaustralian.com.au/busine ... 69c822a214

I can see some Pacific islands following NZ, but it's really interesting to see how the focus seems to have shifted from countries like Singapore and Japan to the US and UK. Last year they were the basket cases, while several Asian countries were being held up as good examples of COVID being contained. Now their vaccination efforts seem to be going full steam ahead and they might open up sooner instead of later, well, as long as Australia's own vaccination program gets a move on.

Still, hard to imagine that we would quickly be back to daily services to London and the UK by Qantas, BA, SQ, CX and the Gulf carriers plus also QF and the big three American Airlines of AA, DL and UA for the USA. I think there'll be a bit of hesitation for some time.
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 3:17 am

CraigAnderson wrote:
Am I the only person who's a bit surprised that despite having been in charge of Virgin Australia for 6+ months, depending on which date you count things from (eg knowing they'd own it due to administrator's nod, being approved as owners by vote of debtors, officially taking over and installed JH as CEO), Virgin is still dithering around on areas like WiFi and The Club?

These two articles this week:
https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... light-wifi
https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... vip-status

I appreciate that 'Jayne and Bain' have had plenty of other things to do but after all this time you'd also think that by now they'd have had plenty of time to work out where in the 'new' VA2 things like WiFi and The Club would sit.

I assume lots of this is based on new agreements with airports and service providers. Some of the older agreements may have been judged as too expensive and the administration process is a great opportunity to walk away from these agreements and start again. This takes time but it will also accrue long term cost savings to the business.
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Kent350787
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 3:26 am

CraigAnderson wrote:
US, UK ‘travel bubbles’ appear on horizon

The Pacific Islands are firming as the site of Australia’s next travel bubble but flights to the US and Britain could follow because of the success of their Covid vaccination rollouts. Qantas boss Alan Joyce made the prediction as he continued his campaign to incentivise Australians to get the jab against Covid-19.


https://www.theaustralian.com.au/busine ... 69c822a214

I can see some Pacific islands following NZ, but it's really interesting to see how the focus seems to have shifted from countries like Singapore and Japan to the US and UK. Last year they were the basket cases, while several Asian countries were being held up as good examples of COVID being contained. Now their vaccination efforts seem to be going full steam ahead and they might open up sooner instead of later, well, as long as Australia's own vaccination program gets a move on.

Still, hard to imagine that we would quickly be back to daily services to London and the UK by Qantas, BA, SQ, CX and the Gulf carriers plus also QF and the big three American Airlines of AA, DL and UA for the USA. I think there'll be a bit of hesitation for some time.


It is interesting, but the fact is that the current daily new case numbers and deaths in the UK are better than Japan - not the rate of new cases (raw numbers only), but certainly deaths. It is likely that the UK will record zero daily deaths at least one day this week, although new cases are still around 3,000 per day. Japan has averaged almost 100 daily deaths this week.

The daily new case rate in the US is better than the UK, but still around 5,000 with around 500 deaths per day. I'd love to visit my fully vaccinated family in MA, but wouldn't want to take the return risk.

That said, I don't know why you would take your eyes off Singapore. Perhaps SIN as a stopover to LHR?
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PJ01
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 4:15 am

myki wrote:
Would the closure of the terminal in BNE impact any contractual agreements with Airtrain? Do they own it all, or is it that the state government owns the infrastructure (stations, escalators, trains, wires, etc.) and Airtrain just run the actual service?


Airtrain own the infrastructure until 2036(?), where it is then transferred to the State Gov. I believe there is also a seperate operating lease that runs for 99 years from the build date, but unsure of the details. With regards on Airtrain impact for International station, it would all depend on what ends up being built at the current International terminal I suppose. The current International station is probably better located for access to the new Automotive precinct being built currently, so likely would still have some sort of relevance.
 
FromCDGtoSYD
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 4:54 am

Australia had months to plan bubbles with Singapore, Taiwan and the likes. Even whilst Singapore allowed unilateral quarantine free access to Australians, nothing was done seemingly. The only thing we heard was AJ beating his drum and the government making "substantial progress". Sure they have had a flare up recently but here in SG we had almost no cases in February and March and still nothing was done.

The government just announced that the whole population should have their first jab buy the 9th of August so well on track for full vaccination by the end of Q3 beginning of Q4. Of the US and the UK make the cut, so will Singapore.

For BNE, it could be good to have the airport be a transit hub from Asia to a slew of domestic destinations. Much like Sydney, the current transfer experience is far from enjoyable. I really wish there were plans to rebuild the domestic terminal...
Funny how with this second runway BNE is the major airport with the most optimal runway layout capacity wise.
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 5:16 am

FromCDGtoSYD wrote:
Australia had months to plan bubbles with Singapore, Taiwan and the likes. Even whilst Singapore allowed unilateral quarantine free access to Australians, nothing was done seemingly. The only thing we heard was AJ beating his drum and the government making "substantial progress". Sure they have had a flare up recently but here in SG we had almost no cases in February and March and still nothing was done.

The government just announced that the whole population should have their first jab buy the 9th of August so well on track for full vaccination by the end of Q3 beginning of Q4. Of the US and the UK make the cut, so will Singapore.

For BNE, it could be good to have the airport be a transit hub from Asia to a slew of domestic destinations. Much like Sydney, the current transfer experience is far from enjoyable. I really wish there were plans to rebuild the domestic terminal...
Funny how with this second runway BNE is the major airport with the most optimal runway layout capacity wise.

I'd love to be able to travel internationally but politically there is just no pressure to reopen international borders, in fact the opposite, with many members of the Australian public wanting the existing international arrivals curtailed. The government know they are in a no-win situation if they open the borders even a little bit. The first case that gets in will be political poison hung around their neck. It is politically safer for the government to take an ultra-conservative approach and keep the borders shut. The election is still a year away and neither the government or the opposition will be pushing for a wide scale reopening before then. This means the chances of US, UK or SG being allowed in 2021 are somewhere between very slim and non-existent.

I do believe there may be chances for some Pacific countries to be added to the Tasman bubble once the most at-risk in countries like Vanuatu and Fiji are vaccinated. This is largely on compassionate grounds with these countries facing incredible economic hardship that cannot be begun to be addressed until tourism is restarted.
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BNEFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 5:23 am

CraigAnderson wrote:
Am I the only person who's a bit surprised that despite having been in charge of Virgin Australia for 6+ months, depending on which date you count things from (eg knowing they'd own it due to administrator's nod, being approved as owners by vote of debtors, officially taking over and installed JH as CEO), Virgin is still dithering around on areas like WiFi and The Club?

These two articles this week:
https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... light-wifi
https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... vip-status

I appreciate that 'Jayne and Bain' have had plenty of other things to do but after all this time you'd also think that by now they'd have had plenty of time to work out where in the 'new' VA2 things like WiFi and The Club would sit.

I think if there's a decision on wifi and The Club within 12 months of administration that's reasonable. There has been talk of The Club's becoming Business/Platinum lounges and Gold/lounge members/pass holders going to the existing lounges, that would take time to implement particularly with the MEL lounge being refurbished at the moment.

As for wifi, it could be down to contracts and services available. The system VA used had much better coverage than QF but no doubt was more expensive (there seemed to be a lot of excessive costs with anything technical at VA). Not only that, VA wouldn't want to spend time any money on it until it was going to be commercially viable, which may be soon as they get more aircraft on line again.
 
FL420FT
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 10:43 am

Have found out that QF has a charter from BNE to Colorado Springs (COS) on 4th June.
it is going to be QF6041 etd 1040 eta 0800, Scheduled rego is VH-ZNI
 
FromCDGtoSYD
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 3:47 pm

This talk about rebuilding BNE has had me going down memory lane.

Back when I was a kid growing up in Sydney, I remember how going to the airport was always an amazing experience. Most of my flights were to CDG so it was always the international terminal and there are a few distinct features I seem to remember from the time. The big mosaic frog, a toy shop with winged pigs that would fly around, the entrance to the immigration checkpoint which behind a (I think?) seethrough blue glass wall... I know it's not much and the regulars of the early 2000s will probably be the only ones that will even remotely know what I'm talking about.

Does anybody know where I can find photos of the intl terminal that predate the recent refresh, I'd love to remember what it was before.
 
LTEN11
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 9:00 pm

FromCDGtoSYD wrote:
This talk about rebuilding BNE has had me going down memory lane.

Back when I was a kid growing up in Sydney, I remember how going to the airport was always an amazing experience. Most of my flights were to CDG so it was always the international terminal and there are a few distinct features I seem to remember from the time. The big mosaic frog, a toy shop with winged pigs that would fly around, the entrance to the immigration checkpoint which behind a (I think?) seethrough blue glass wall... I know it's not much and the regulars of the early 2000s will probably be the only ones that will even remotely know what I'm talking about.

Does anybody know where I can find photos of the intl terminal that predate the recent refresh, I'd love to remember what it was before.


The only good thing about the international terminal through the 70's and 80's were the observation decks and there was lots of glass with views over the aprons, otherwise it was functional. All slowly disappeared in expansions and for office space. One thing I do remember as a kid, when it first opened, visitors could walk down the pier to the departure gates. Didn't last for long, but I can remember a Pan Am 707 taxing in and thought it was going to come straight through the building it was moving that fast.
 
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CraigAnderson
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 11:35 pm

Regional airline Rex steps up feud with Qantas after airfare refunds

The bitter feud between Qantas and Rex has stepped up a notch after Rex took out full page advertisements highlighting public discontent with the Flying Kangaroo over refunds.
The ad uses dozens of social media posts made about Qantas to emphasise problems with the refund process during the Covid crisis which has resulted in thousands of flight cancellations.
Rex deputy chairman John Sharp said in contrast, they had refunded every passenger who had requested their money back for an eligible fare bought before April 1,2021. The ad suggested Qantas could owe as much $1bn to passengers caught up in Covid-related flight cancellations.


https://www.theaustralian.com.au/busine ... df699d0fa0

Apart from the fact that Rex would no doubt have a MUCH smaller pool of refunds to cover, this seems to be yet another instance of Rex and specifically John Sharp slamming the competition instead of focussing on the passenger, and Sharp defaulting to his roots and second nature as a politician instead of acting like a businessman.

While I appreciate the competition which Rex has brought to several key routes, leading to price drops from Qantas and Virgin, it seems they spend more time complaining and criticising, and they're a bit heavy-handed on playing the 'underdog' card.
 
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qf2220
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 01, 2021 11:56 pm

It is a fair argument though. The Bank of Qantas has a bit of cash in it....
 
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CraigAnderson
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Wed Jun 02, 2021 12:43 am

SCMP reporting that Cathay Pacific will close its Australian pilot base, "putting 125 jobs at risk", although it's now hiring Hong Kong-based first and second officers.

https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/hon ... sed-pilots

CX would have had a big Aussie footprint as a pilot base given that pre-COVD they had, what 4x daily from SYD, 3x MEL and I think 2x for BNE, PER and maybe ADL? I really feel for those pilots, presume they've been mainly stood down since March 2020 anyway? Not a lot of future for them now in AU unless some of the A350 ones jump into QF for the Sunrise A350s and even then that's a few years away and surely QF will prioritise its own pilots for that.
 
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EK413
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Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Wed Jun 02, 2021 4:06 am

Jetstar have resumed B788 services on key leisure routes. The current schedule has only 1 B788 operating from the 1st June – 24th June which is MEL-OOL-MEL-OOL-MEL.

From the 25th June there’ll be a 2nd B788 introduced so 1 aircraft will operate MEL-CNS-MEL-OOL-MEL and the other will operate MEL-OOL-MEL-CNS-MEL.

From the 1st July there’ll be a 3rd aircraft introduced to operate SYD-CNS-SYD-OOL-SYD.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
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SCFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Wed Jun 02, 2021 4:43 am

CraigAnderson wrote:
Regional airline Rex steps up feud with Qantas after airfare refunds

The bitter feud between Qantas and Rex has stepped up a notch after Rex took out full page advertisements highlighting public discontent with the Flying Kangaroo over refunds.
The ad uses dozens of social media posts made about Qantas to emphasise problems with the refund process during the Covid crisis which has resulted in thousands of flight cancellations.
Rex deputy chairman John Sharp said in contrast, they had refunded every passenger who had requested their money back for an eligible fare bought before April 1,2021. The ad suggested Qantas could owe as much $1bn to passengers caught up in Covid-related flight cancellations.


https://www.theaustralian.com.au/busine ... df699d0fa0

Apart from the fact that Rex would no doubt have a MUCH smaller pool of refunds to cover, this seems to be yet another instance of Rex and specifically John Sharp slamming the competition instead of focussing on the passenger, and Sharp defaulting to his roots and second nature as a politician instead of acting like a businessman.

While I appreciate the competition which Rex has brought to several key routes, leading to price drops from Qantas and Virgin, it seems they spend more time complaining and criticising, and they're a bit heavy-handed on playing the 'underdog' card.


I do wonder if REX's Singaporean PE masters are wondering whether to step in to tell their chairman to put a sock in it. Considering his ongoing comments seem to have more of an negative effect to their jet ops than positives.
 
jrfspa320
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Wed Jun 02, 2021 4:47 am

EK413 wrote:
Jetstar have resumed B788 services on key leisure routes. The current schedule has only 1 B788 operating from the 1st June – 24th June which is MEL-OOL-MEL-OOL-MEL.

From the 25th June there’ll be a 2nd B788 introduced so 1 aircraft will operate MEL-CNS-MEL-OOL-MEL and the other will operate MEL-OOL-MEL-CNS-MEL.

From the 1st July there’ll be a 3rd aircraft introduced to operate SYD-CNS-SYD-OOL-SYD.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Surprised these flights are operating at the moment with the lockdown, i cant imagine the loads are great, even on the return sector.
 
OKCDCA
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Wed Jun 02, 2021 10:51 am

FL420FT wrote:
Have found out that QF has a charter from BNE to Colorado Springs (COS) on 4th June.
it is going to be QF6041 etd 1040 eta 0800, Scheduled rego is VH-ZNI

Coming to pick up the large group of Australian Army members that have been conducting training exercises at Fort Carson. Thanks for the heads up, will have to swing over to COS that morning!
 
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EK413
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Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Wed Jun 02, 2021 12:15 pm

Image

Image

Image

@16right_media It’s not every day that you see a Boeing 737 flying 3,428km across Australia at 9,000ft, however that’s exactly what Qantas B737-800 VH-VXQ “Retro Roo II” did this afternoon. After being damaged by a Baggage Loading vehicle in Perth on 22MAY2021, and having some temporary repairs completed (Speed Tape +), VH-VXQ departed Perth at 0843 AWST, for the 6hr 35min flight to Sydney (normally a 4hr flight). The aircraft arrived in SYD at 1716L, after cruising across the continent at only 284kts, and is seen here taxiing to Bay 85.


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Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. We are tonight’s entertainment!
 
JuniorVoyager
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Wed Jun 02, 2021 12:36 pm

LTEN11 wrote:
FromCDGtoSYD wrote:
This talk about rebuilding BNE has had me going down memory lane.

Back when I was a kid growing up in Sydney, I remember how going to the airport was always an amazing experience. Most of my flights were to CDG so it was always the international terminal and there are a few distinct features I seem to remember from the time. The big mosaic frog, a toy shop with winged pigs that would fly around, the entrance to the immigration checkpoint which behind a (I think?) seethrough blue glass wall... I know it's not much and the regulars of the early 2000s will probably be the only ones that will even remotely know what I'm talking about.

Does anybody know where I can find photos of the intl terminal that predate the recent refresh, I'd love to remember what it was before.


The only good thing about the international terminal through the 70's and 80's were the observation decks and there was lots of glass with views over the aprons, otherwise it was functional. All slowly disappeared in expansions and for office space. One thing I do remember as a kid, when it first opened, visitors could walk down the pier to the departure gates. Didn't last for long, but I can remember a Pan Am 707 taxing in and thought it was going to come straight through the building it was moving that fast.


It's funny how time distorts things, now the only things that come to mind when I think of SYD are the overpriced parking and worst of all wondering if I should waste half of my livelihood stuck on the M5 or sell an organ to take the train. The worst part has to be when you're stuck on Marsh street and you see the morning arrivals BA, QF, SQ, KE,TG....
 
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a36001
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Wed Jun 02, 2021 10:46 pm

SCFlyer wrote:
CraigAnderson wrote:
Regional airline Rex steps up feud with Qantas after airfare refunds

The bitter feud between Qantas and Rex has stepped up a notch after Rex took out full page advertisements highlighting public discontent with the Flying Kangaroo over refunds.
The ad uses dozens of social media posts made about Qantas to emphasise problems with the refund process during the Covid crisis which has resulted in thousands of flight cancellations.
Rex deputy chairman John Sharp said in contrast, they had refunded every passenger who had requested their money back for an eligible fare bought before April 1,2021. The ad suggested Qantas could owe as much $1bn to passengers caught up in Covid-related flight cancellations.


https://www.theaustralian.com.au/busine ... df699d0fa0

Apart from the fact that Rex would no doubt have a MUCH smaller pool of refunds to cover, this seems to be yet another instance of Rex and specifically John Sharp slamming the competition instead of focussing on the passenger, and Sharp defaulting to his roots and second nature as a politician instead of acting like a businessman.

While I appreciate the competition which Rex has brought to several key routes, leading to price drops from Qantas and Virgin, it seems they spend more time complaining and criticising, and they're a bit heavy-handed on playing the 'underdog' card.


I do wonder if REX's Singaporean PE masters are wondering whether to step in to tell their chairman to put a sock in it. Considering his ongoing comments seem to have more of an negative effect to their jet ops than positives.


REX could have gone into this with a cheeky, fun poking occasional dig at Qantas and Virgin, something like Southwest Airlines does to American and Delta etc, it gives them (WN) the underdog vibe to the public and their passengers love them to bits! But no, we had to have this idiot banging on and on acting like a petulant teenager, publicly attacking their biggest competitor with childish moronic jabs.

I'm sorry, but REX is nothing more than a boring has-been airline that had been ripping off their regional passengers for years and is struggling to accept Qantas (and Virgin) are not just laying down and giving them a share of the market with out a battle. As has been noted REX thinks competition is something that happens to other business except REX!

Qantas and Virgin are doing exactly what they should be doing! Getting on with running their businesses, REX might like to take note?
 
ben175
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Wed Jun 02, 2021 11:35 pm

EK413 wrote:
Jetstar have resumed B788 services on key leisure routes. The current schedule has only 1 B788 operating from the 1st June – 24th June which is MEL-OOL-MEL-OOL-MEL.

From the 25th June there’ll be a 2nd B788 introduced so 1 aircraft will operate MEL-CNS-MEL-OOL-MEL and the other will operate MEL-OOL-MEL-CNS-MEL.

From the 1st July there’ll be a 3rd aircraft introduced to operate SYD-CNS-SYD-OOL-SYD.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Does somebody have access to the loads? Surely they have been absolutely abysmal during lockdown considering it’s illegal to travel for leisure currently and anyone arriving would be shipped off to HQ.
 
BNEFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 1:41 am

ben175 wrote:
EK413 wrote:
Jetstar have resumed B788 services on key leisure routes. The current schedule has only 1 B788 operating from the 1st June – 24th June which is MEL-OOL-MEL-OOL-MEL.

From the 25th June there’ll be a 2nd B788 introduced so 1 aircraft will operate MEL-CNS-MEL-OOL-MEL and the other will operate MEL-OOL-MEL-CNS-MEL.

From the 1st July there’ll be a 3rd aircraft introduced to operate SYD-CNS-SYD-OOL-SYD.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Does somebody have access to the loads? Surely they have been absolutely abysmal during lockdown considering it’s illegal to travel for leisure currently and anyone arriving would be shipped off to HQ.

They could be using it as an opportunity to run some cargo to/from OOL/CNS, Victorians can return home and travellers from outside of Victoria can still transit MEL, though the numbers may be small.
 
qf763
Posts: 6
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 4:20 am

Does anyone know what QF48 TBU/BNE VH-EBP and QF6036 APW/ADL EBQ both currently inflight (on FR24) are for? Reparation or ad-hoc freight flights?? Or something else??
 
tullamarine
Posts: 2858
Joined: Thu Aug 05, 1999 1:14 pm

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 4:23 am

qf763 wrote:
Does anyone know what QF48 TBU/BNE VH-EBP and QF6036 APW/ADL EBQ both currently inflight (on FR24) are for? Reparation or ad-hoc freight flights?? Or something else??

I would assume they are part of the government's program to bring in pickers for the agriculture sector which remains very short of the numbers required.
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QuayWeeAir
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 5:51 am

qf763 wrote:
Does anyone know what QF48 TBU/BNE VH-EBP and QF6036 APW/ADL EBQ both currently inflight (on FR24) are for? Reparation or ad-hoc freight flights?? Or something else??


Both flights are operating as inbound flights for seasonal workers which have been set up in conjunction with the governments of both island nations and the Australian government.

These flights have been affectionately dubbed the "Fruit Picker Express"

Also noting that Qantas have now loaded flights to and from Tonga once every four weeks to bring additional workers to work here in Australia and to take Tongan residents back to Tonga (who's borders have been closed to all air traffic since early last year)
 
ben175
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 11:28 am

Realistically how far off could we be from bubbles with Fiji/New Caledonia etc? Surely they pose no more risk than New Zealand. I would imagine these island nations are keen to open up as soon as possible.

Edit: Had no idea Fiji was even experiencing an outbreak currently. Nevermind!
 
Tedjamvor
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Joined: Sat Dec 14, 2019 5:54 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 11:41 am

ben175 wrote:
Realistically how far off could we be from bubbles with Fiji/New Caledonia etc? Surely they pose no more risk than New Zealand. I would imagine these island nations are keen to open up as soon as possible.

Edit: Had no idea Fiji was even experiencing an outbreak currently. Nevermind!

The issue would be about the catastrophe if someone from Aus/NZ brought covid to them, would they be able to handle it? (Not very likely). Focus needs to be on keeping their economy going sans tourism, and getting the vaccine asap.
 
qf763
Posts: 6
Joined: Tue May 13, 2014 2:00 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 12:25 pm

ben175 wrote:
Realistically how far off could we be from bubbles with Fiji/New Caledonia etc? Surely they pose no more risk than New Zealand. I would imagine these island nations are keen to open up as soon as possible.

Edit: Had no idea Fiji was even experiencing an outbreak currently. Nevermind!


With the exception of Fiji (as you mentioned) the other South Pacific nations are largely covid free, so currently they’d carry all the risk with any travel to/from AUS or NZ. Although, interestingly and maybe surprisingly, Samoa, Tonga, New Caledonia, and even Fiji are out performing AUS and NZ in percentage of population having received any vaccine. If their roll-outs continue at the current rate a South Pacific travel bubble could well be on the agenda in the next 6 months.
 
TravelQ
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Apr 17, 2021 1:59 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 8:38 pm

BNEFlyer wrote:
If the BNE redevelopment happens, we won't see the new terminal operating for at least 10 years, and from the article BAC have said that the existing terminal could still be in use until 2042 (in what capacity is anyone's guess). By that time the original building will be almost 50 years old, so certainly will need an update or replacement by then. But so will the domestic terminal that is already over 30 years old.

These long-term propositions are interesting to read about and see renditions of, but even if it does happen there's no point getting excited about it for another 10 years.


I am going back into history here, but twenty plus years ago there was a proposal to build an airport at Yatala (between the Gold Coast and Brisbane) based around the hub and spoke model.

Originally there were two consortiums, eventually one (when they merged their efforts) and than none as the proposal lost favour with both the Queensland and federal governments.

The model for Yatala was based around the geographic location of Brisbane in relationship to major markets (Asia, the Americas), its attraction as a tourist destination and interestingly the ability of Sydney Airport to expand at a cost competitive rate (estimated at three times the cost of a new build airport twenty years ago) to take opportunity of growth in market. At the time Brisbane airport had the ideal mix between business and tourist passengers.

Since that time Brisbane Airport has expanded at a rate traditionally greater than its interstate rivals. It has had major upgrades to its road and rail network and more recently a new runway. If you look at that type of investment (previous / proposed), you will see themes of lifestyle (Hamilton cruise terminal - airport land and the proposed motor complex including a race track) and commercial type development.

Compared to other airports (on a world basis), Brisbane Airport has a unique mix of opportunities revolving around airport activities, commercial and retail, entertainment and tourism (people travelling to Brisbane Airport as a destination).

If we delve back into the 2019 BAC accounts, we will find approximately 0.01% or 216,000 passengers travelled through the airport transiting to other destinations. Going back to the business model (Hub and Spoke) for the Yatala airport, it seems counter intuitive that an airport with such great organic opportunities (proximity to major markets) for transiting / transferring passengers performs so poorly in this space of the market. As such, there would have to be other factors affecting BACs ability to compete. I'd suggest, this simply comes down to current infrastructure and the logistics (and costs) associated with transferring passengers between the international and domestic terminals.

With continued investment in key infrastructure and the increasing size of the Queensland market, the airport is probably coming to a deflection point where the investment of the last fifteen years will start to earn considerable incomes. These incomes will stimulate further investment.

For argument sake (and I believe there is real opportunity here), if BAC could increase their share of transitioning passengers from the current 0.01% to 5% of operations, the airport would generate an additional $16 million in incomes from airport charges alone. If we add ancillary revenues (retail and land transport), this would see revenues increase an additional $23 million. If the amalgamation of the domestic and international terminals resulted in substantially lower costs for transferring passengers, it could become very attractive for airlines wanting a greater share of the Australian market. As such, the 5% number could be relatively conservative.

If we throw into the mix Brisbane and Brisbane Airport as a destination (Experience type investment - think Disneyland), growth of the Queensland market, (population - visiting friends and family, tourism and business), the opportunities for relatively low cost growth are enormous.

As such, once the airport reaches this deflection point, the ability to fund the construction of new terminals would be a lot more straight forward,

I think it's just a matter of 'watch this space'.
 
smi0006
Posts: 2622
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 9:16 pm

qf763 wrote:
ben175 wrote:
Realistically how far off could we be from bubbles with Fiji/New Caledonia etc? Surely they pose no more risk than New Zealand. I would imagine these island nations are keen to open up as soon as possible.

Edit: Had no idea Fiji was even experiencing an outbreak currently. Nevermind!


With the exception of Fiji (as you mentioned) the other South Pacific nations are largely covid free, so currently they’d carry all the risk with any travel to/from AUS or NZ. Although, interestingly and maybe surprisingly, Samoa, Tonga, New Caledonia, and even Fiji are out performing AUS and NZ in percentage of population having received any vaccine. If their roll-outs continue at the current rate a South Pacific travel bubble could well be on the agenda in the next 6 months.


This is what I have heard too my understanding is due to support from NZ a number of PI countries are steaming ahead with their vaccination program - Cook Islands is now 90% vaccinated and should be done in two months, Samoa isn’t too far behind. Can’t comment on Fiji or New Caledonia. Surely once everyone is vaccinated they could open up?
 
tullamarine
Posts: 2858
Joined: Thu Aug 05, 1999 1:14 pm

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 10:09 pm

For argument sake (and I believe there is real opportunity here), if BAC could increase their share of transitioning passengers from the current 0.01% to 5% of operations, the airport would generate an additional $16 million in incomes from airport charges alone. If we add ancillary revenues (retail and land transport), this would see revenues increase an additional $23 million. If the amalgamation of the domestic and international terminals resulted in substantially lower costs for transferring passengers, it could become very attractive for airlines wanting a greater share of the Australian market. As such, the 5% number could be relatively conservative.


Relying on transit pax is not a great strategy unless you have an amazing hub location such as DXB or SIN. Nowhere in Australia is a great hub for international travel because we are at the bottom of the world.

The issue is, on flights from Asia, BNE is a long way east. In fact, SIN is closer to MEL than it is BNE so opportunities for transitting to domestic is reduced. Likewise, transitting to domestic only makes sense when non-stop loads are insufficient. Both SYD and MEL can typically sustain non-stop services from major centres in Asia and USA; ULR planes such as A350s will further open opportunities for more non-stop services.
717, 721/2, 732/3/4/5/7/8/9, 742/3/4, 752/3, 762/3, 772/E/W, 788/9, 300,310, 319,320/1, 332/3, 359, 388, DC9, DC10, F28, F100, 142,143, E75/90, CR2, D82/3/4, SF3, ATR
 
tullamarine
Posts: 2858
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Thu Jun 03, 2021 10:19 pm

smi0006 wrote:
qf763 wrote:
ben175 wrote:
Realistically how far off could we be from bubbles with Fiji/New Caledonia etc? Surely they pose no more risk than New Zealand. I would imagine these island nations are keen to open up as soon as possible.

Edit: Had no idea Fiji was even experiencing an outbreak currently. Nevermind!


With the exception of Fiji (as you mentioned) the other South Pacific nations are largely covid free, so currently they’d carry all the risk with any travel to/from AUS or NZ. Although, interestingly and maybe surprisingly, Samoa, Tonga, New Caledonia, and even Fiji are out performing AUS and NZ in percentage of population having received any vaccine. If their roll-outs continue at the current rate a South Pacific travel bubble could well be on the agenda in the next 6 months.


This is what I have heard too my understanding is due to support from NZ a number of PI countries are steaming ahead with their vaccination program - Cook Islands is now 90% vaccinated and should be done in two months, Samoa isn’t too far behind. Can’t comment on Fiji or New Caledonia. Surely once everyone is vaccinated they could open up?

Current stats on at least one dose:
Australia 15.1%
NZ 9.0%
New Caledonia 17.5%
Fiji 12%
Vanuatu - No stats available
https://ourworldindata.org/covid-vaccinations

On this basis, it will still be a while until these countries are able to receive tourists and, even then, they will have to mandate only fully vaccinated tourists will be able to enter. These countries do not have health systems that could survive a major outbreak and the high incidence of diabetes amongst Polynesian races means there are significant at-risk people in these countries due to the long-term damage Covid appears to do to people with comorbidities such as Diabetes.
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zkncj
Posts: 4277
Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 4:57 pm

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Fri Jun 04, 2021 12:36 am

smi0006 wrote:
qf763 wrote:
ben175 wrote:
Realistically how far off could we be from bubbles with Fiji/New Caledonia etc? Surely they pose no more risk than New Zealand. I would imagine these island nations are keen to open up as soon as possible.

Edit: Had no idea Fiji was even experiencing an outbreak currently. Nevermind!


With the exception of Fiji (as you mentioned) the other South Pacific nations are largely covid free, so currently they’d carry all the risk with any travel to/from AUS or NZ. Although, interestingly and maybe surprisingly, Samoa, Tonga, New Caledonia, and even Fiji are out performing AUS and NZ in percentage of population having received any vaccine. If their roll-outs continue at the current rate a South Pacific travel bubble could well be on the agenda in the next 6 months.


This is what I have heard too my understanding is due to support from NZ a number of PI countries are steaming ahead with their vaccination program - Cook Islands is now 90% vaccinated and should be done in two months, Samoa isn’t too far behind. Can’t comment on Fiji or New Caledonia. Surely once everyone is vaccinated they could open up?


The New Zealand Government, offered to purchase vaccine any of the non EU Pacific Islands and support them in the roll out if they choose to take up the option.

Two-way travel is now open between New Zealand and the Cook Islands (Rarotonga), Australians can now travel onto the Cook Islands although this requires them to stay in New Zealand for 14days before traveling onto the Cook Islands. So wouldn't really call that very piratical at the moment.

I could see the issue with opening up to New Caledonia and Tahiti at the moment, would then effectively being like opening the backdoor to the EU....
 
RoyalBrunei757
Posts: 519
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2021 6:18 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Fri Jun 04, 2021 3:37 am

AirAsia X to provide flights between Kuala Lumpur and Sydney in June

KUALA LUMPUR (June 3): AirAsia X Bhd will be providing special services for repatriation purposes between Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia and Sydney, Australia in June.

https://www.theedgemarkets.com/article/ ... ydney-june

Currently Malaysia is in movement control order whereby only essential services and supporting industry are working. Foreigners are required to undego PCR test 72 hours before flight and mandatory quaratine for 7-day at designated quarantine centres at their point of arrival in Malaysia.

Those traveling into Malaysia without the RT-PCR will undergo a 10-day mandatory quarantine.

Passengers must hold valid MYTravel Pass (MTP) before entering Malaysia.

The cost for quarantine that includes COVID 19 screening test, transport, accommodation, meal, and handling cost as determined are to be borne by passengers.
 
jrfspa320
Posts: 717
Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2005 12:18 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Mon Jun 07, 2021 3:05 am

Yesterday's (6 June) QF1003 HBA-PER flight diverted to KGI, eventually arriving into PER over 2 hours late. Anyone know if it was medical related or fuel?
 
BNEFlyer
Posts: 293
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Mon Jun 07, 2021 4:19 am

jrfspa320 wrote:
Yesterday's (6 June) QF1003 HBA-PER flight diverted to KGI, eventually arriving into PER over 2 hours late. Anyone know if it was medical related or fuel?

Weather (fog in PER). Flights from BNE/OOL/SYD/CBR also diverted to KGI.
 
jrfspa320
Posts: 717
Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2005 12:18 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Mon Jun 07, 2021 4:36 am

BNEFlyer wrote:
jrfspa320 wrote:
Yesterday's (6 June) QF1003 HBA-PER flight diverted to KGI, eventually arriving into PER over 2 hours late. Anyone know if it was medical related or fuel?

Weather (fog in PER). Flights from BNE/OOL/SYD/CBR also diverted to KGI.


Ahh thanks! Would have been interesting to see the ramp at KGI! I see JQ978 diverted to ADL too!

I see QF653 which had a similar arrival time from SYD (A330) was not diverted and flew straight in (presumably they had more fuel for holding unlike the 737s & A320s?)
 
Scanorama
Posts: 149
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Mon Jun 07, 2021 2:41 pm

zkncj wrote:
I could see the issue with opening up to New Caledonia and Tahiti at the moment, would then effectively being like opening the backdoor to the EU....

AFAIK New Caledonia requires 14 days hotel quarantine for all overseas arrivals, their border is closed to all overseas countries including France. They have been able to pretty much eliminate COVID-19 except for a small outbreak in March which the country was in lockdown for 28 days. They would be a good candidate for a travel bubble with Australia/New Zealand as they pursuit similar elimination strategy. Vaccination rate is on par with us too.

Tahiti is more complicated with their border open to the US and other countries (daily cases are higher too).

Until recently Fiji was looking good but they are now getting around 50 cases a day with clusters in Suva.
 
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CraigAnderson
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 08, 2021 12:19 am

Could Qantas’ Project Sunrise flights be Sydney-only for many years?

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... ey-flights

The NSW Government promised Qantas $50 million to keep its HQ in Sydney, but with several conditions, one of which was for the Project Sunrise flights to be Sydney-only for the first five years. Worth noting that Qantas has since said that Sunrise, if it goes ahead, will launch from Sydney.

Surely though, an extensive period of "exclusivity" for Sydney for those Sunrise flights would weaken the business case as a whole? I can see Joyce maybe allowing 1-2 years to get his $50m but would many people want to fly MEL-SYD and BNE-SYD, have to add that extra time and hassle, and the headache of doing a domestic-international terminal transfer at SYD, just to then fly non-stop to London instead of just flying QF via Singapore or even via PER?

That said, I could see New York being worth it because you could totally skip over the hassle of LAX, and Paris because you don't have to transfer to BA at LHR and double-back to CDG.
 
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EK413
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 08, 2021 1:57 am

CraigAnderson wrote:
Could Qantas’ Project Sunrise flights be Sydney-only for many years?

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... ey-flights

The NSW Government promised Qantas $50 million to keep its HQ in Sydney, but with several conditions, one of which was for the Project Sunrise flights to be Sydney-only for the first five years. Worth noting that Qantas has since said that Sunrise, if it goes ahead, will launch from Sydney.

Surely though, an extensive period of "exclusivity" for Sydney for those Sunrise flights would weaken the business case as a whole? I can see Joyce maybe allowing 1-2 years to get his $50m but would many people want to fly MEL-SYD and BNE-SYD, have to add that extra time and hassle, and the headache of doing a domestic-international terminal transfer at SYD, just to then fly non-stop to London instead of just flying QF via Singapore or even via PER?

That said, I could see New York being worth it because you could totally skip over the hassle of LAX, and Paris because you don't have to transfer to BA at LHR and double-back to CDG.

I don’t see Project Sunrise flights going exclusively Sydney only, even if this was the case it would warrant QF arranging the flights to depart from T3 as an incentive for passenger similar to MEL-PER-LHR.

1 flight 1 terminal...


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tullamarine
Posts: 2858
Joined: Thu Aug 05, 1999 1:14 pm

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 08, 2021 1:59 am

CraigAnderson wrote:
Could Qantas’ Project Sunrise flights be Sydney-only for many years?

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... ey-flights

The NSW Government promised Qantas $50 million to keep its HQ in Sydney, but with several conditions, one of which was for the Project Sunrise flights to be Sydney-only for the first five years. Worth noting that Qantas has since said that Sunrise, if it goes ahead, will launch from Sydney.

Surely though, an extensive period of "exclusivity" for Sydney for those Sunrise flights would weaken the business case as a whole? I can see Joyce maybe allowing 1-2 years to get his $50m but would many people want to fly MEL-SYD and BNE-SYD, have to add that extra time and hassle, and the headache of doing a domestic-international terminal transfer at SYD, just to then fly non-stop to London instead of just flying QF via Singapore or even via PER?

That said, I could see New York being worth it because you could totally skip over the hassle of LAX, and Paris because you don't have to transfer to BA at LHR and double-back to CDG.

..because QF wasn't Sydney-centric enough already!!!

Seriously, you have to wonder about strategy at QF. It's ULH strategy is now being driven by payroll tax concessions from the NSW Government; that is bizarre.

As far as Paris is concerned, this would make it marginal at best. Assuming the EK JSA remains in place, for people from everywhere except SYD, it would be quicker to fly non-stop to DXB and connect to CDG from there. The same applies for LHR but PER, SIN and DXB will all be the quicker options for everyone except those originating in SYD.
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jrfspa320
Posts: 717
Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2005 12:18 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 08, 2021 2:08 am

CraigAnderson wrote:
Could Qantas’ Project Sunrise flights be Sydney-only for many years?

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... ey-flights

The NSW Government promised Qantas $50 million to keep its HQ in Sydney, but with several conditions, one of which was for the Project Sunrise flights to be Sydney-only for the first five years. Worth noting that Qantas has since said that Sunrise, if it goes ahead, will launch from Sydney.

Surely though, an extensive period of "exclusivity" for Sydney for those Sunrise flights would weaken the business case as a whole? I can see Joyce maybe allowing 1-2 years to get his $50m but would many people want to fly MEL-SYD and BNE-SYD, have to add that extra time and hassle, and the headache of doing a domestic-international terminal transfer at SYD, just to then fly non-stop to London instead of just flying QF via Singapore or even via PER?

That said, I could see New York being worth it because you could totally skip over the hassle of LAX, and Paris because you don't have to transfer to BA at LHR and double-back to CDG.


I mean realistically how many routes will there be sufficient demand for a premium non stop service anyhow. I think we'll eventually see a MEL - LHR and DFW service but thats all. Even CDG and AMS is offered on the codeshare via SIN, and realistically both are below yield compared to LHR (and FRA).

Lots of people in Y would rather break their journey in LAX anyway. While the US border is painful in LAX, JFK aint exactly great either.
 
User avatar
qf2220
Posts: 2087
Joined: Fri Aug 16, 2013 9:16 pm

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - June 2021

Tue Jun 08, 2021 2:35 am

CraigAnderson wrote:
Could Qantas’ Project Sunrise flights be Sydney-only for many years?

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... ey-flights

The NSW Government promised Qantas $50 million to keep its HQ in Sydney, but with several conditions, one of which was for the Project Sunrise flights to be Sydney-only for the first five years. Worth noting that Qantas has since said that Sunrise, if it goes ahead, will launch from Sydney.

Surely though, an extensive period of "exclusivity" for Sydney for those Sunrise flights would weaken the business case as a whole? I can see Joyce maybe allowing 1-2 years to get his $50m but would many people want to fly MEL-SYD and BNE-SYD, have to add that extra time and hassle, and the headache of doing a domestic-international terminal transfer at SYD, just to then fly non-stop to London instead of just flying QF via Singapore or even via PER?

That said, I could see New York being worth it because you could totally skip over the hassle of LAX, and Paris because you don't have to transfer to BA at LHR and double-back to CDG.


Perhaps the NSW Govt is playing a bit of hardball of its own. QF is saying they'll leave Sydney, the NSW Govt is saying ok dont, but if you take the money you need to make it worth our while too? The NSW Govt isnt seen to be kowtowing to a petulant corporate/CEO in this?

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