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hervebkk
Topic Author
Posts: 37
Joined: Fri Jul 30, 2010 12:01 pm

SQ23 JFK-SIN detours over Pakistan

Tue Jun 08, 2021 11:10 am

I observed a few times that SQ23 (currently the longest commercial flight) makes detours over Pakistan / India between Lahore and Dehli instead of flying straignt after passing the city of Jhang towards Dehli like other SQ flights like SQ377 or SQ317 (made a screenshot yesterday but I can't find out how to attach a picture here...).

Anyone knows why? If it would be a bloked area for safety or military reasons, other SQ flights would have to make the same detours. As if SQ23 is not already long enough....

SQ23.JPG
 
hervebkk
Topic Author
Posts: 37
Joined: Fri Jul 30, 2010 12:01 pm

Re: SQ23 JFK-SIN detours over Pakistan

Tue Jun 08, 2021 11:11 am

SQ23.JPG


Anyone knows how to attach a picture....?
 
airbazar
Posts: 10380
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: SQ23 JFK-SIN detours over Pakistan

Tue Jun 08, 2021 12:29 pm

I believe it is to avoid northern Afghanistan. All SQ flights avoid that area. Here's SQ 17 from LHR doing the same thing:
https://flightaware.com/live/flight/SIA ... /EGLL/WSSS

As far as attaching picture, that is the feature I miss the most from the old forum. I don't think it's possible. You must upload it to an external site and then link it. Or for something like this you can use a Flightaware link like I did above, or FR24.
 
VSMUT
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Re: SQ23 JFK-SIN detours over Pakistan

Tue Jun 08, 2021 12:33 pm

I would imagine Pakistan and India are a bit specific with entry/exit points and airways. The mountainous terrain and single-engine ceiling/drift down will also limit you coming over Afghanistan and part of Pakistan.

The fact that it happened several days in a row suggests that it is indeed the filed route. If you compare the route with Skyvector, it does indeed match the A466 airway via the exit point SULOM.


airbazar wrote:
I believe it is to avoid northern Afghanistan. All SQ flights avoid that area.


All SQ23s that went over Pakistan went almost direct overhead Kabul.
 
RoyalBrunei757
Posts: 350
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Re: SQ23 JFK-SIN detours over Pakistan

Tue Jun 08, 2021 1:58 pm

hervebkk wrote:
SQ23.JPG

Anyone knows how to attach a picture....?

You may use https://imgur.com/upload, once successfully uploaded, hover over the image, click on "...", click on "Get Share Link", select the third option "BBCode (Forums)" copy the link and paste the whole link here at airliners.net.
 
hervebkk
Topic Author
Posts: 37
Joined: Fri Jul 30, 2010 12:01 pm

Re: SQ23 JFK-SIN detours over Pakistan

Tue Jun 08, 2021 3:14 pm

VSMUT wrote:
I would imagine Pakistan and India are a bit specific with entry/exit points and airways. The mountainous terrain and single-engine ceiling/drift down will also limit you coming over Afghanistan and part of Pakistan.

The fact that it happened several days in a row suggests that it is indeed the filed route. If you compare the route with Skyvector, it does indeed match the A466 airway via the exit point SULOM.


airbazar wrote:
I believe it is to avoid northern Afghanistan. All SQ flights avoid that area.


All SQ23s that went over Pakistan went almost direct overhead Kabul.



This is my screenshot:

https://imgur.com/a/uq8qlaw

Maybe now it's more clear.

As I am writing, SQ23 does the same again: https://www.flightradar24.com/SIA23/27f996ec
Route is as suggested by VSMUT: M875 - JHANG . A466 - M890

But as you can see from my screenshot, other SQ flights went straight. It seems it's always the SQ23 who makes the detour
 
Chaostheory
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Re: SQ23 JFK-SIN detours over Pakistan

Wed Jun 09, 2021 1:00 am

BOBCAT at play.
 
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LAX772LR
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Joined: Sun Nov 09, 2014 11:06 pm

Re: SQ23 JFK-SIN detours over Pakistan

Wed Jun 09, 2021 1:15 am

SIDEBAR:
SQ has said they plan to return to EWR. Have they mentioned whether they plan on keeping JFK nonstop, or now that the EU is reopening, do they plan to bring back FRA-JFK?
I myself, suspect a more prosaic motive... ~Thranduil
 
phishphan70
Posts: 223
Joined: Tue Oct 03, 2006 5:23 am

Re: SQ23 JFK-SIN detours over Pakistan

Wed Jun 09, 2021 1:31 am

I would think this route is to avoid Belarus after the Ryanair incident. They come in just north of Belarus.
 
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lammified
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Joined: Fri Nov 25, 2005 11:28 pm

Re: SQ23 JFK-SIN detours over Pakistan

Wed Jun 09, 2021 2:01 am

Chaostheory wrote:
BOBCAT at play.


BOBCAT only imposes flow restrictions for westbound traffic over the Kabul FIR at peak hours.
 
Chaostheory
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Joined: Wed Mar 06, 2013 2:09 am

Re: SQ23 JFK-SIN detours over Pakistan

Wed Jun 09, 2021 2:38 am

In which case most likely capacity/timing constraints at entry and exit points.
 
airboss787
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Joined: Mon Apr 29, 2019 11:39 pm

Re: SQ23 JFK-SIN detours over Pakistan

Wed Jun 09, 2021 7:39 am

SQ23 isnt the only one to do that. I have seen flights bound for DEL also take the same route. Including the long SFO-DEL Air India flights, AI174 and AI184.
Star Alliance Gold
 
airbazar
Posts: 10380
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

Re: SQ23 JFK-SIN detours over Pakistan

Wed Jun 09, 2021 12:18 pm

hervebkk wrote:
This is my screenshot:

https://imgur.com/a/uq8qlaw

Maybe now it's more clear.


Ah ok. That's not the same detour that I was referring to, above that avoids northern Afghanistan. That most likely has to do with entry/exit points predetermined in the flight plan.
 
Oilman
Posts: 112
Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2016 11:10 pm

Re: SQ23 JFK-SIN detours over Pakistan

Wed Jun 09, 2021 12:35 pm

Chaostheory wrote:
In which case most likely capacity/timing constraints at entry and exit points.


Do you mean entry/exit points in Pakistan? So this flight potentially makes a delaying maneuver to hit the exit point at the time when there is room for it? If so, that makes sense.
 
PSAatSAN4Ever
Posts: 1240
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2018 5:38 pm

Re: SQ23 JFK-SIN detours over Pakistan

Wed Jun 09, 2021 2:19 pm

Best way to post an image is the website postimages.org. No log-in or registration required, and a link is provided for "forums":

Image

Image

As for the reasons behind the diversions, I don't have anything to add - both of these flights are flying directly over Afghanistan, at least according to flightaware.

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