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Brickell305
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AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 6:51 pm

AA is launching MIA-AXA and MIA-DOM starting Dec 11 and Dec 8 respectively. Both routes will be flown with the Embraer 75 and will be twice weekly.

MIA-DOM 11:00-15:21 (We,Sa)
DOM-MIA 16:24-18:55 (We, Sa)

MIA-AXA 10:50-14:49 (We, Sa)
AXA-MIA 15:40-17:53 (We,Sa)

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q ... oOlhzfgG3l

Very big news for both AXA and DOM. I'm excited to see how AA does on both of these routes. I had no idea AXA's runway was long enough for passenger jet service.
 
luckyone
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 6:57 pm

Interesting timing for a nonstop DOM-Miami. The big traffic driver on and off the island to the States was Ross U, which relocated to Barbados after Hurricane Maria. I'll be curious to see how they handle that approach, because I heard people on this forum for years saying that jets can't handle the over mountain approach--never mind that 727 freighters did it regularly.

Edit: it would appear that AA did some proving runs in the last month or so, and the aircraft approached over the mountains.

https://dominicanewsonline.com/news/hom ... ts-shores/
 
BoeingGuy
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 8:31 pm

Interesting. I’d predicted MIA-DOM in another thread recently and a number of others responded with reasons why it will never happen.

Dominica is very cool. Some good outdoor and ecotourism opportunities.
 
ATLgaUSA
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 8:44 pm

With these additions plus San Andres, what other airports with runways long enough lack Miami service?
 
luckyone
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 8:53 pm

BoeingGuy wrote:
Interesting. I’d predicted MIA-DOM in another thread recently and a number of others responded with reasons why it will never happen.

Dominica is very cool. Some good outdoor and ecotourism opportunities.

I still question whether the traffic is there but I guess we shall see.
 
Zidane
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 8:55 pm

ATLgaUSA wrote:
With these additions plus San Andres, what other airports with runways long enough lack Miami service?

I'd say TAB, maybe EIS if they extend the runway.
 
Brickell305
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 8:58 pm

ATLgaUSA wrote:
With these additions plus San Andres, what other airports with runways long enough lack Miami service?


On AA (excluding instances where AA already serves a distinct airport in the same market e.g SLU/UVF and restricted Cuban markets):

AZS
CAP
CAY
CYB
TAB

These are all I could think of. I’m not sure whether the runway at EIS is long enough for an E175. I doubt it though. AA’s Caribbean coverage ex MIA is extremely impressive.
 
Brickell305
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 8:59 pm

luckyone wrote:
BoeingGuy wrote:
Interesting. I’d predicted MIA-DOM in another thread recently and a number of others responded with reasons why it will never happen.

Dominica is very cool. Some good outdoor and ecotourism opportunities.

I still question whether the traffic is there but I guess we shall see.

I also questioned that. However, at 2x weekly, I think there should definitely be enough traffic to support it. I’d question daily service though.
 
luckyone
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 9:04 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
luckyone wrote:
BoeingGuy wrote:
Interesting. I’d predicted MIA-DOM in another thread recently and a number of others responded with reasons why it will never happen.

Dominica is very cool. Some good outdoor and ecotourism opportunities.

I still question whether the traffic is there but I guess we shall see.

I also questioned that. However, at 2x weekly, I think there should definitely be enough traffic to support it. I’d question daily service though.

Possibly. The infrastructure in Dominica is not robust though to support even moderate numbers of tourists. That’s definitely part of its appeal, but both things would struggle to exist at the same time.
 
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Ytraveller
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 9:06 pm

American will actually be returning to these 2 destinations. Both can be seen in AA's route map from 2002: https://www.flickr.com/photos/erussell1 ... /sizes/3k/

Not sure what aircraft type was used back then.
 
luckyone
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 9:10 pm

Ytraveller wrote:
American will actually be returning to these 2 destinations. Both can be seen in AA's route map from 2002: https://www.flickr.com/photos/erussell1 ... /sizes/3k/

Not sure what aircraft type was used back then.

They were served through SJU with ATRs until 2013 (Plus or minus a year or so) when the ATRs were retired. At least that’s for DOM. Can’t speak precisely when AXA was discontinued.
 
Q
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 9:11 pm

Thanks for not putting cities for the code. Some members are not aware of it. I had to check and find. AXA is Anguilla, Anguilla and DOM is Melville, Dominica. Please next time comments for example JFK = New York Kennedy.

Thanks,

Q
 
luckyone
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 9:12 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
luckyone wrote:
BoeingGuy wrote:
Interesting. I’d predicted MIA-DOM in another thread recently and a number of others responded with reasons why it will never happen.

Dominica is very cool. Some good outdoor and ecotourism opportunities.

I still question whether the traffic is there but I guess we shall see.

I also questioned that. However, at 2x weekly, I think there should definitely be enough traffic to support it. I’d question daily service though.

It used to be daily ATR from SJU.
 
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BA744PHX
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 9:20 pm

Q wrote:
Thanks for not putting cities for the code. Some members are not aware of it. I had to check and find. AXA is Anguilla, Anguilla and DOM is Melville, Dominica. Please next time comments for example JFK = New York Kennedy.

Thanks,

Q

The benefits of using google when you aren’t sure of something.

I had to google it as well, it is what it is.
 
MAH4546
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 9:42 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
ATLgaUSA wrote:
With these additions plus San Andres, what other airports with runways long enough lack Miami service?


On AA (excluding instances where AA already serves a distinct airport in the same market e.g SLU/UVF and restricted Cuban markets):

AZS
CAP
CAY
CYB
TAB

These are all I could think of. I’m not sure whether the runway at EIS is long enough for an E175. I doubt it though. AA’s Caribbean coverage ex MIA is extremely impressive.


AA flies to AZS but oddly from Charlotte instead of Miami. Also missing is La Romana which AA used to fly to for a very long time.

CAP was discontinued during COVID. I think it will come back soon enough.
 
dfw88
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 9:46 pm

Brickell305 wrote:

On AA (excluding instances where AA already serves a distinct airport in the same market e.g SLU/UVF and restricted Cuban markets):

AZS
CAP
CAY
CYB
TAB

These are all I could think of. I’m not sure whether the runway at EIS is long enough for an E175. I doubt it though. AA’s Caribbean coverage ex MIA is extremely impressive.


AZS was announced a few months ago:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/micheleherrmann/2021/07/23/saman-welcomes-new-seasonal-american-airlines-route-from-charlotte/?sh=722da65344f3

AA recently left CAP. I can't decide if that makes it more or less likely that they return (could they be back post-pandemic? vs. has it always lost money?). The other three you mention would be fascinating. I think the runway at CYB is too short (~6,000ft), but it looks like CAY and TAB could work. Of course, there's probably not much demand, but it would be fun to see them try.
 
Brickell305
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 9:51 pm

dfw88 wrote:
Brickell305 wrote:

On AA (excluding instances where AA already serves a distinct airport in the same market e.g SLU/UVF and restricted Cuban markets):

AZS
CAP
CAY
CYB
TAB

These are all I could think of. I’m not sure whether the runway at EIS is long enough for an E175. I doubt it though. AA’s Caribbean coverage ex MIA is extremely impressive.


AZS was announced a few months ago:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/micheleherrmann/2021/07/23/saman-welcomes-new-seasonal-american-airlines-route-from-charlotte/?sh=722da65344f3

AA recently left CAP. I can't decide if that makes it more or less likely that they return (could they be back post-pandemic? vs. has it always lost money?). The other three you mention would be fascinating. I think the runway at CYB is too short (~6,000ft), but it looks like CAY and TAB could work. Of course, there's probably not much demand, but it would be fun to see them try.


AZS was announced from CLT, not MIA. CYB’s runway is longer than DOM or AXA and it’s a much shorter distance so it should be long enough.
 
Brickell305
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 9:56 pm

MAH4546 wrote:
Brickell305 wrote:
ATLgaUSA wrote:
With these additions plus San Andres, what other airports with runways long enough lack Miami service?


On AA (excluding instances where AA already serves a distinct airport in the same market e.g SLU/UVF and restricted Cuban markets):

AZS
CAP
CAY
CYB
TAB

These are all I could think of. I’m not sure whether the runway at EIS is long enough for an E175. I doubt it though. AA’s Caribbean coverage ex MIA is extremely impressive.


AA flies to AZS but oddly from Charlotte instead of Miami. Also missing is La Romana which AA used to fly to for a very long time.

CAP was discontinued during COVID. I think it will come back soon enough.

I forgot LRM. I think that one is especially odd. I guess we could also add Aguadilla and Ponce in Puerto Rico to that list as I don’t believe AA ever served those from MIA.
 
maps4ltd
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 10:37 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
MAH4546 wrote:
Brickell305 wrote:

On AA (excluding instances where AA already serves a distinct airport in the same market e.g SLU/UVF and restricted Cuban markets):

AZS
CAP
CAY
CYB
TAB

These are all I could think of. I’m not sure whether the runway at EIS is long enough for an E175. I doubt it though. AA’s Caribbean coverage ex MIA is extremely impressive.


AA flies to AZS but oddly from Charlotte instead of Miami. Also missing is La Romana which AA used to fly to for a very long time.

CAP was discontinued during COVID. I think it will come back soon enough.

I forgot LRM. I think that one is especially odd. I guess we could also add Aguadilla and Ponce in Puerto Rico to that list as I don’t believe AA ever served those from MIA.

Speaking of PSE, I'm surprised AA still lacks service to Aguadilla (BQN), especially since JetBlue, Spirit, and United have it.
 
iwastemyday
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 10:44 pm

MIA-VQS would be really nice too! But mot sure the 4k foot runway would be long enough for E175 to MIA.
 
MAH4546
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Fri Jul 23, 2021 11:40 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
MAH4546 wrote:
Brickell305 wrote:

On AA (excluding instances where AA already serves a distinct airport in the same market e.g SLU/UVF and restricted Cuban markets):

AZS
CAP
CAY
CYB
TAB

These are all I could think of. I’m not sure whether the runway at EIS is long enough for an E175. I doubt it though. AA’s Caribbean coverage ex MIA is extremely impressive.


AA flies to AZS but oddly from Charlotte instead of Miami. Also missing is La Romana which AA used to fly to for a very long time.

CAP was discontinued during COVID. I think it will come back soon enough.

I forgot LRM. I think that one is especially odd. I guess we could also add Aguadilla and Ponce in Puerto Rico to that list as I don’t believe AA ever served those from MIA.


AA did fly MIABQN in the early 1990s. It’s also in the cards to come back this year, stay tuned.
 
phatfarmlines
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 12:18 am

iwastemyday wrote:
MIA-VQS would be really nice too! But mot sure the 4k foot runway would be long enough for E175 to MIA.


Other than that fancy "W" resort on Vieques, which by the way is closed since it got damaged by Hurricane Maria, is there really that much hotel room space there to warrant a mainland NS?
 
phatfarmlines
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 12:29 am

luckyone wrote:
Interesting timing for a nonstop DOM-Miami. The big traffic driver on and off the island to the States was Ross U, which relocated to Barbados after Hurricane Maria. I'll be curious to see how they handle that approach, because I heard people on this forum for years saying that jets can't handle the over mountain approach--never mind that 727 freighters did it regularly.

Edit: it would appear that AA did some proving runs in the last month or so, and the aircraft approached over the mountains.

https://dominicanewsonline.com/news/hom ... ts-shores/


We had discussed this in another thread which I can't find, but the airport received improvements by leveling some of the hills close to the west end of the runway. Still a complicated approach though.

https://www.flightradar24.com/data/airc ... n#2825bec2
 
USAirALB
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:58 am

AA's Caribbean route network is extremely impressive; not just from MIA, but rather from each hub. I totaled up the number of nonstop destinations served from each US3 hub, and no one comes even close to AA's size in the region:

1) AA/MIA: 33 destinations
2) AA/CLT: 24 destinations
3) UA/EWR: 22 destinations
4) DL/ATL: 19 destinations
5) Tie between AA/PHL and DL/JFK at 14 destinations each
 
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YQBexYHZBGM
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:25 am

Bravo for AA. This is a welcome addition. While the timing is sensible for passengers originating in or traveling to MIA, it will likely require an overnight in MIA for those travelling to or from points north. Still, it will provide an easier option to reach MIA than connecting through one of the nearby islands on LIAT, Air Antilles or Inter Caribbean.

While Dominica lacks the large, all-inclusive beach resorts of some other islands to attract mass-market tourists, it does have adequate capacity for those who deliberately choose The Nature Isle over its neighbours. This flight will also be a boon for Dominica residents for shopping, given the limited availability and high prices of local retailers.

I believe the previous AA (Eagle) service to DOM was an ATR from SJU; I don't believe they operated nonstop from MIA in the past.
 
usflyer msp
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:01 am

YQBexYHZBGM wrote:
Bravo for AA. This is a welcome addition. While the timing is sensible for passengers originating in or traveling to MIA, it will likely require an overnight in MIA for those travelling to or from points north. Still, it will provide an easier option to reach MIA than connecting through one of the nearby islands on LIAT, Air Antilles or Inter Caribbean.

While Dominica lacks the large, all-inclusive beach resorts of some other islands to attract mass-market tourists, it does have adequate capacity for those who deliberately choose The Nature Isle over its neighbours. This flight will also be a boon for Dominica residents for shopping, given the limited availability and high prices of local retailers.

I believe the previous AA (Eagle) service to DOM was an ATR from SJU; I don't believe they operated nonstop from MIA in the past.


Those flights fit right into AA's existing banks in MIA - connecting to/from most cities will not require an overnight.
 
maps4ltd
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:26 am

iwastemyday wrote:
MIA-VQS would be really nice too! But mot sure the 4k foot runway would be long enough for E175 to MIA.

Vieques? That's Cape Air territory man 8-) :D

(and they got a local carrier called Vieques Air Link. Either way, your main route off the island is through SJU)
 
n797mx
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:55 am

The bad thing about DOM is that it will be a VFR only city. The approach to 09 is a visual one and the RNAV to 27 approach only covers category A/B aircraft. The ERJ-175 is category C.
 
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adamh8297
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:57 am

USAirALB wrote:
AA's Caribbean route network is extremely impressive; not just from MIA, but rather from each hub. I totaled up the number of nonstop destinations served from each US3 hub, and no one comes even close to AA's size in the region:

1) AA/MIA: 33 destinations
2) AA/CLT: 24 destinations
3) UA/EWR: 22 destinations
4) DL/ATL: 19 destinations
5) Tie between AA/PHL and DL/JFK at 14 destinations each


Do your numbers count Bahamas and Turks and Caicos? - Some consider these non-Caribbean.

If you do then B6 has 24 destinations from JFK and 15 destinations from BOS as well though the majority in BOS are not daily. I did not count anything Mexico or South America as well that may be on the Caribbean like CTG or CUN.
 
USAirALB
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:03 pm

adamh8297 wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
AA's Caribbean route network is extremely impressive; not just from MIA, but rather from each hub. I totaled up the number of nonstop destinations served from each US3 hub, and no one comes even close to AA's size in the region:

1) AA/MIA: 33 destinations
2) AA/CLT: 24 destinations
3) UA/EWR: 22 destinations
4) DL/ATL: 19 destinations
5) Tie between AA/PHL and DL/JFK at 14 destinations each


Do your numbers count Bahamas and Turks and Caicos? - Some consider these non-Caribbean.

If you do then B6 has 24 destinations from JFK and 15 destinations from BOS as well though the majority in BOS are not daily. I did not count anything Mexico or South America as well that may be on the Caribbean like CTG or CUN.

As I said in the post, I only looked at the US3-not B6.

I did count Bahamian destinations, as well as BDA and PLS, but I did not count RTB.
 
Cubsrule
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:35 pm

USAirALB wrote:
AA's Caribbean route network is extremely impressive; not just from MIA, but rather from each hub. I totaled up the number of nonstop destinations served from each US3 hub, and no one comes even close to AA's size in the region:

1) AA/MIA: 33 destinations
2) AA/CLT: 24 destinations
3) UA/EWR: 22 destinations
4) DL/ATL: 19 destinations
5) Tie between AA/PHL and DL/JFK at 14 destinations each


AA was strong to the Caribbean before the last round of mergers and is even stronger now because it’s the only one of the Big 3 with both a high-O&D Caribbean hub and a domestic hub well-placed for leisure connections. This makes possible lots of synergies.
 
Brickell305
Topic Author
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:59 pm

Cubsrule wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
AA's Caribbean route network is extremely impressive; not just from MIA, but rather from each hub. I totaled up the number of nonstop destinations served from each US3 hub, and no one comes even close to AA's size in the region:

1) AA/MIA: 33 destinations
2) AA/CLT: 24 destinations
3) UA/EWR: 22 destinations
4) DL/ATL: 19 destinations
5) Tie between AA/PHL and DL/JFK at 14 destinations each


AA was strong to the Caribbean before the last round of mergers and is even stronger now because it’s the only one of the Big 3 with both a high-O&D Caribbean hub and a domestic hub well-placed for leisure connections. This makes possible lots of synergies.


I posit that DL could be similarly placed if it chose to be as JFK also has high O&D to the Caribbean. However, DL has left lots of that traffic to B6. ATL is similarly positioned as CLT. I never truly understood why DL hasn't attempted to become stronger in the Caribbean other than deciding that the market just isn't worth it.
 
Cubsrule
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:05 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
Cubsrule wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
AA's Caribbean route network is extremely impressive; not just from MIA, but rather from each hub. I totaled up the number of nonstop destinations served from each US3 hub, and no one comes even close to AA's size in the region:

1) AA/MIA: 33 destinations
2) AA/CLT: 24 destinations
3) UA/EWR: 22 destinations
4) DL/ATL: 19 destinations
5) Tie between AA/PHL and DL/JFK at 14 destinations each


AA was strong to the Caribbean before the last round of mergers and is even stronger now because it’s the only one of the Big 3 with both a high-O&D Caribbean hub and a domestic hub well-placed for leisure connections. This makes possible lots of synergies.


I posit that DL could be similarly placed if it chose to be as JFK also has high O&D to the Caribbean. However, DL has left lots of that traffic to B6. ATL is similarly positioned as CLT. I never truly understood why DL hasn't attempted to become stronger in the Caribbean other than deciding that the market just isn't worth it.


You’re right about the demand ex-JFK, but I think part of the problem is geographic. From MIA, AA makes liberal use of regional jets (including 50-seaters to places like GGT). That’s harder from JFK.
 
USAirALB
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:14 pm

Brickell305 wrote:
I never truly understood why DL hasn't attempted to become stronger in the Caribbean other than deciding that the market just isn't worth it.

I recall they equipped several ASA CR7s to be capable of flying overwater and launched a number of routes between 2005-2006. They did ATL-PSE/BQN/FDF/PTP.

They also used to do ATL-BGI/CUR/GND; all stations that DL has since closed.
 
BangersAndMash
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:31 pm

Cubsrule wrote:
Brickell305 wrote:
Cubsrule wrote:

AA was strong to the Caribbean before the last round of mergers and is even stronger now because it’s the only one of the Big 3 with both a high-O&D Caribbean hub and a domestic hub well-placed for leisure connections. This makes possible lots of synergies.


I posit that DL could be similarly placed if it chose to be as JFK also has high O&D to the Caribbean. However, DL has left lots of that traffic to B6. ATL is similarly positioned as CLT. I never truly understood why DL hasn't attempted to become stronger in the Caribbean other than deciding that the market just isn't worth it.


You’re right about the demand ex-JFK, but I think part of the problem is geographic. From MIA, AA makes liberal use of regional jets (including 50-seaters to places like GGT). That’s harder from JFK.


I'd say classic case of opportunity cost as well. There is simply far more money to be made elsewhere out of JFK. The VFR and leisure skew of Caribbean traffic makes it quite low-yielding.

I always remember what Willie Walsh said when he was asked why BA gutted its African network. Profitable, but just too low-yielding.
 
DaveMetroD
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:38 pm

Flew into/out of DOM on American Eagle ATR-72 from SJU years ago.

Coming in over the mountains shouldn't be a problem for the ERJ-175 as long as the visibility isn't impaired.

But what concerns me is the possibility of using runway 27 at night.
While the winds calm towards nightfall, I wouldn't want to be on an aircraft that has to go around.
Make a steep climb out of the valley with the possibility of tailwinds? No thanks.
In any case, I suspect that the use of runway 27 by an ERJ-175 is beyond the tech specs.

IIRC, the Amerijet 727 was weight restricted out of DOM.
The ATR-72 was weight restricted.
While waiting to load at SJU, we were switched to a different ATR-72.
The one that was scheduled had too much fuel on-board.
It was quicker to get another one than offload some fuel.
 
737MAX7
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:40 pm

Q wrote:
Thanks for not putting cities for the code. Some members are not aware of it. I had to check and find. AXA is Anguilla, Anguilla and DOM is Melville, Dominica. Please next time comments for example JFK = New York Kennedy.

Thanks,

Q

I didn’t know these city codes either yet it only took me 20 seconds on the Flightradar 24 app to figure them out. You’ll survive just like I did. :roll:
 
Cubsrule
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Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:04 pm

BangersAndMash wrote:
Cubsrule wrote:
Brickell305 wrote:

I posit that DL could be similarly placed if it chose to be as JFK also has high O&D to the Caribbean. However, DL has left lots of that traffic to B6. ATL is similarly positioned as CLT. I never truly understood why DL hasn't attempted to become stronger in the Caribbean other than deciding that the market just isn't worth it.


You’re right about the demand ex-JFK, but I think part of the problem is geographic. From MIA, AA makes liberal use of regional jets (including 50-seaters to places like GGT). That’s harder from JFK.


I'd say classic case of opportunity cost as well. There is simply far more money to be made elsewhere out of JFK. The VFR and leisure skew of Caribbean traffic makes it quite low-yielding.

I always remember what Willie Walsh said when he was asked why BA gutted its African network. Profitable, but just too low-yielding.


All correct, and the longer the stage length, the higher the opportunity cost. So geography and opportunity cost are related.
 
DaveMetroD
Posts: 88
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:05 pm

Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:06 pm

Playing around with ITA Matrix.
American has a round trip DTW-MIA that will work with the announced times MIA-DOM-MIA(not loaded yet in the schedule).
When I went I had to overnight in Tampa both ways. DTW-DOM and return wasn't possible in one day.

I noticed that Delta has a convenient DTW-SJU-DOM and return schedule.
Not so sure being in a Saab 340 for 1 hour 45 minutes is convenient. I've been in one for 40 minutes and that was long enough.
 
BangersAndMash
Posts: 249
Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2021 5:21 pm

Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:15 pm

DaveMetroD wrote:
Playing around with ITA Matrix.
American has a round trip DTW-MIA that will work with the announced times MIA-DOM-MIA(not loaded yet in the schedule).
When I went I had to overnight in Tampa both ways. DTW-DOM and return wasn't possible in one day.

I noticed that Delta has a convenient DTW-SJU-DOM and return schedule.
Not so sure being in a Saab 340 for 1 hour 45 minutes is convenient. I've been in one for 40 minutes and that was long enough.


I presume the SJU-DOM would be a Silver codeshare?
 
usflyer msp
Posts: 4295
Joined: Tue May 23, 2000 11:50 am

Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:20 pm

USAirALB wrote:
Brickell305 wrote:
I never truly understood why DL hasn't attempted to become stronger in the Caribbean other than deciding that the market just isn't worth it.

I recall they equipped several ASA CR7s to be capable of flying overwater and launched a number of routes between 2005-2006. They did ATL-PSE/BQN/FDF/PTP.

They also used to do ATL-BGI/CUR/GND; all stations that DL has since closed.


AA has been able to expand its CLT-Caribbean network since the merger because the variable costs are low. They already have a full station set up for the MIA flights so adding a few CLT flights a week is not logistically difficult and probably actually lowers the cost per passenger for AA at that station.
 
DaveMetroD
Posts: 88
Joined: Sat Jan 02, 2021 4:05 pm

Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:23 pm

BangersAndMash wrote:
DaveMetroD wrote:
Playing around with ITA Matrix.
American has a round trip DTW-MIA that will work with the announced times MIA-DOM-MIA(not loaded yet in the schedule).
When I went I had to overnight in Tampa both ways. DTW-DOM and return wasn't possible in one day.

I noticed that Delta has a convenient DTW-SJU-DOM and return schedule.
Not so sure being in a Saab 340 for 1 hour 45 minutes is convenient. I've been in one for 40 minutes and that was long enough.


I presume the SJU-DOM would be a Silver codeshare?

Yes, I should have included that.
I can't see Delta getting any Saabs ;)
 
travaz
Posts: 1125
Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2001 1:03 am

Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:29 pm

This photo of the ATR is labeled Oct 2018. Also if you google Airport DOM you get some nice Photos of a C-117:
https://www.google.com/maps/uv?pb=!1s0x ... 3oECFcQAw#

Edit Typo
 
BangersAndMash
Posts: 249
Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2021 5:21 pm

Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:39 pm

DaveMetroD wrote:
BangersAndMash wrote:
DaveMetroD wrote:
Playing around with ITA Matrix.
American has a round trip DTW-MIA that will work with the announced times MIA-DOM-MIA(not loaded yet in the schedule).
When I went I had to overnight in Tampa both ways. DTW-DOM and return wasn't possible in one day.

I noticed that Delta has a convenient DTW-SJU-DOM and return schedule.
Not so sure being in a Saab 340 for 1 hour 45 minutes is convenient. I've been in one for 40 minutes and that was long enough.


I presume the SJU-DOM would be a Silver codeshare?

Yes, I should have included that.
I can't see Delta getting any Saabs ;)


We've seen weirder things! :lol:

When are they bringing the ATRs to SJU? Those Saabs must be on their last legs!
 
USAirALB
Posts: 2629
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 4:46 am

Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:41 pm

usflyer msp wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
Brickell305 wrote:
I never truly understood why DL hasn't attempted to become stronger in the Caribbean other than deciding that the market just isn't worth it.

I recall they equipped several ASA CR7s to be capable of flying overwater and launched a number of routes between 2005-2006. They did ATL-PSE/BQN/FDF/PTP.

They also used to do ATL-BGI/CUR/GND; all stations that DL has since closed.


AA has been able to expand its CLT-Caribbean network since the merger because the variable costs are low. They already have a full station set up for the MIA flights so adding a few CLT flights a week is not logistically difficult and probably actually lowers the cost per passenger for AA at that station.

Indeed. I think at this point however, Caribbean expansion from CLT is likely complete. Every other Caribbean city that AA serves (but does not serve nonstop from CLT) is either an extremely small, premium market (like FTF) or a VFR market (like KIN, PAP, STI) that are best served elsewhere. The only market I could see them adding from CLT is BON.
 
usflyer msp
Posts: 4295
Joined: Tue May 23, 2000 11:50 am

Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:50 pm

USAirALB wrote:
usflyer msp wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
I recall they equipped several ASA CR7s to be capable of flying overwater and launched a number of routes between 2005-2006. They did ATL-PSE/BQN/FDF/PTP.

They also used to do ATL-BGI/CUR/GND; all stations that DL has since closed.


AA has been able to expand its CLT-Caribbean network since the merger because the variable costs are low. They already have a full station set up for the MIA flights so adding a few CLT flights a week is not logistically difficult and probably actually lowers the cost per passenger for AA at that station.

Indeed. I think at this point however, Caribbean expansion from CLT is likely complete. Every other Caribbean city that AA serves (but does not serve nonstop from CLT) is either an extremely small, premium market (like FTF) or a VFR market (like KIN, PAP, STI) that are best served elsewhere. The only market I could see them adding from CLT is BON.


I would agree however they added AZS from CLT which was way out of left field so who knows?

I do think they will continue to connect some of the VFR markets with PHL - they've added STI and KIN and I wouldn't be surprised if they added another PR airport and PAP once things stabilize there.
 
USAirALB
Posts: 2629
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 4:46 am

Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 5:18 pm

usflyer msp wrote:
USAirALB wrote:
usflyer msp wrote:

AA has been able to expand its CLT-Caribbean network since the merger because the variable costs are low. They already have a full station set up for the MIA flights so adding a few CLT flights a week is not logistically difficult and probably actually lowers the cost per passenger for AA at that station.

Indeed. I think at this point however, Caribbean expansion from CLT is likely complete. Every other Caribbean city that AA serves (but does not serve nonstop from CLT) is either an extremely small, premium market (like FTF) or a VFR market (like KIN, PAP, STI) that are best served elsewhere. The only market I could see them adding from CLT is BON.


I would agree however they added AZS from CLT which was way out of left field so who knows?

I do think they will continue to connect some of the VFR markets with PHL - they've added STI and KIN and I wouldn't be surprised if they added another PR airport and PAP once things stabilize there.

I believe that the only reason AZS was added from CLT is there is some type of resort contract onto the route that stipulated CLT. In any case, the route was supposed to be summer-seasonal IIRC and it looks like it was extended to operate over this coming Winter...very strange route IMO, almost reminds me of the old PHX-GYM for Club Med.

I can't remember if PHL-KIN was flown before. I know US initially operated PHL-GND, and then cancelled it after Hurricane Ivan.

US also did CLT-LRM and CLT-KIN for a while (KIN was transferred to CLT after they suspended FLL-KIN). I'm surprised AA isn't on MIA-LRM.
 
LCDFlight
Posts: 1216
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2020 9:22 pm

Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sat Jul 24, 2021 6:28 pm

These are cool missions for the modest E175. I like seeing airplanes used to their full capability. These are long overwater trips that the E175 can do with ease.
 
airplanedaj
Posts: 213
Joined: Wed Aug 14, 2013 1:05 am

Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sun Jul 25, 2021 1:26 am

LCDFlight wrote:
These are cool missions for the modest E175. I like seeing airplanes used to their full capability. These are long overwater trips that the E175 can do with ease.


MIA-AXA is 1300 nm, MIA-DOM is 1500 nm. With an alternate theres no way these flights don't leave weight restricted or needing a tech stop. Especially out of these short runways. The 175 can barely do it, theres no ease about it.
 
LCDFlight
Posts: 1216
Joined: Wed Jan 01, 2020 9:22 pm

Re: AA Launches MIA-AXA, MIA-DOM

Sun Jul 25, 2021 1:37 am

airplanedaj wrote:
LCDFlight wrote:
These are cool missions for the modest E175. I like seeing airplanes used to their full capability. These are long overwater trips that the E175 can do with ease.


MIA-AXA is 1300 nm, MIA-DOM is 1500 nm. With an alternate theres no way these flights don't leave weight restricted or needing a tech stop. Especially out of these short runways. The 175 can barely do it, theres no ease about it.


Then I like it even better, it will be very entertaining for crews! And comfortable for passengers. It gives you the wonder of having the service at all. We stopped on Dominica on a cruise in 1990. The guy who drove us around would be an elder today.

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