SANMAN66 wrote:

BA's "Speedbird" A350 just took off from LHR! She is scheduled to grace our skies for the first time
at 4:50pm! Lufthansa's A350 from Munich will be making her SAN debut three days later!

Pictures and/or video of both, I promise!

AAtakeMeAway wrote:

The OneWorld concourse of misery… yes I’m sure AS is thrilled… it’s so bad.
… and AA … well they’re used to it I guess since they’ve been at those same gates for decades and decades.

AA, on the west side of the concourse, at least has windows and boarding/holding rooms at most all of their gates don't they? Kind of resembling an airport IMO. To me, it's 100% better than the east half which consists of a solid wall with occasional holes in it which are the doors to the jetways. And very few seats.

And let's not forget the gate 28 complex which, AFAIK, is 2 EMJ gates made out of one previous gate that has no jetways and requires pax to walk down stairs to the tarmac level to board their planes. It's been a long time since I've been in T2E so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. And I seem to remember no windows along most of the east wall of the concourse. AS's T2E digs remind me of the underground tunnels at LAX that connect the street-level terminals with the gate satellites, if those still exist. At least AS does have those big holding rooms at the south and north ends of T2E with a cluster of gates at each.

Yeah, SAN's going to be overrun with A350s all of a sudden - WOW! My Dad's little San Diego Airport has come a long way! Perhaps later today we'll see some photos and/or videos of BA's newest Speedbird's arrival and I hope for the same on Wednesday for LH's arrival!

bb

Edit: Thanks PSAat SAN'. Enjoy the event!

SANFan wrote:

Yeah, SAN's going to be overrun with A350s all of a sudden - WOW! My Dad's little San Diego Airport has come a long way!

Yup! A new aircraft type! When I see the likes of Lufthansa, Japan Airlines, British Airways, etc. making scheduled flights
into SAN I still find myself whispering "Lindbergh Field??" It certainly isn't the same little Lindbergh Field when I was kid!

Yes, it is the same little airport as when we were kids. Same amount of acreage. They're simply using what they have for airport purposes and more efficiently. No Teledyne-Ryan, no Convair, no out-dated facilities like the old cargo facilities, no one story terminals, no parking lots instead of multi-level structures. The Airport Authority realized there is no land nor local support for a new airport location, so they're making what they have work.

IFlyOff wrote:

Yes, it is the same little airport as when we were kids. Same amount of acreage. They're simply using what they have for airport purposes and more efficiently. No Teledyne-Ryan, no Convair, no out-dated facilities like the old cargo facilities, no one story terminals, no parking lots instead of multi-level structures. The Airport Authority realized there is no land nor local support for a new airport location, so they're making what they have work.

I remember taking pics of airplanes at SAN near the cafe were Top Gun was filmed and the Copacabana Club.

IFlyOff wrote:

The Airport Authority realized there is no land nor local support for a new airport location, so they're making what they have work.

Yup! That's what I keep telling those "A-netters" who keep repeating the same tired mantra of how inadequate our airport is,
or how the city missed an opportunity to use Miramar as an int'l airport. Never in my wildest dreams did I think I'd see
British Airways. Lufthansa, and Japan Airlines with scheduled flights into our airport! The Airport Authority is making it work.

SANMAN66 wrote:

IFlyOff wrote:

The Airport Authority realized there is no land nor local support for a new airport location, so they're making what they have work.

Yup! That's what I keep telling those "A-netters" who keep repeating the same tired mantra of how inadequate our airport is,
or how the city missed an opportunity to use Miramar as an int'l airport. Never in my wildest dreams did I think I'd see
British Airways. Lufthansa, and Japan Airlines with scheduled flights into our airport! The Airport Authority is making it work.

Didn't SAN have Edelweiss Airlines as well during the summers, prior to the pandemic?

wedgetail737 wrote:

SANMAN66 wrote:

IFlyOff wrote:

The Airport Authority realized there is no land nor local support for a new airport location, so they're making what they have work.

Yup! That's what I keep telling those "A-netters" who keep repeating the same tired mantra of how inadequate our airport is,
or how the city missed an opportunity to use Miramar as an int'l airport. Never in my wildest dreams did I think I'd see
British Airways. Lufthansa, and Japan Airlines with scheduled flights into our airport! The Airport Authority is making it work.

Didn't SAN have Edelweiss Airlines as well during the summers, prior to the pandemic?

Correct! Seasonal (twice weekly) during the summer. My husband and I flew home with them in 2017. An outstanding flight, all the way around, with premium economy at the front of the plane (A340). Also flew here in 2018 and 2019, but since the quarantine, nothing.

SANFan wrote:

AAtakeMeAway wrote:

The OneWorld concourse of misery… yes I’m sure AS is thrilled… it’s so bad.
… and AA … well they’re used to it I guess since they’ve been at those same gates for decades and decades.

AA, on the west side of the concourse, at least has windows and boarding/holding rooms at most all of their gates don't they? Kind of resembling an airport IMO. To me, it's 100% better than the east half which consists of a solid wall with occasional holes in it which are the doors to the jetways. And very few seats.

And let's not forget the gate 28 complex which, AFAIK, is 2 EMJ gates made out of one previous gate that has no jetways and requires pax to walk down stairs to the tarmac level to board their planes. It's been a long time since I've been in T2E so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. And I seem to remember no windows along most of the east wall of the concourse. AS's T2E digs remind me of the underground tunnels at LAX that connect the street-level terminals with the gate satellites, if those still exist. At least AS does have those big holding rooms at the south and north ends of T2E with a cluster of gates at each.

Yeah, SAN's going to be overrun with A350s all of a sudden - WOW! My Dad's little San Diego Airport has come a long way! Perhaps later today we'll see some photos and/or videos of BA's newest Speedbird's arrival and I hope for the same on Wednesday for LH's arrival!

bb

Edit: Thanks PSAat SAN'. Enjoy the event!

I would say in general your assessment is correct. The AA end is slightly better than the AS end, but pretty much all the gates in the entire concourse are in the hallway will little to no seating. There’s one small hold room on the AA side (NE corner) and that may be what you referred to as the Gate 27 complex. This small hold room has gates 28,30, and 32. I’ve never flown out of these gates as I believe they were formerly Eagle gates and are now being used for AS RJ flights. They all have jetways.
Gate 27 is a mainline gate for AA, faces west and is one of the many gates that are just in the hallway with no seating. That gate along with 29 and 31 are pretty close together in the same dead end hallway at the NW corner so it’s absolute hell if more than one of those gates are in use at a time. That small hold room can only hold the passengers for 28,30,32 … there isn’t really room for anyone in the many hallway gates. It just wasn’t designed for all these 321s, 737s, etc.

All that said, the AS end is a special kind of hell. I think there is just one holdroom around gate 22 in the SW area of the concourse. Whenever I peak over there when headed from TSA to the lounge it’s a chaotic scene.

The whole T2E is just dreadful.

wedgetail737 wrote:

Didn't SAN have Edelweiss Airlines as well during the summers, prior to the pandemic?

Yes Wedgie', WK began service here in June 2017 and flew for 2 more summers; Covid cancelled the 2020 & 2021 seasons for them and it has been officially reported that they will be unable to serve SAN this year (fleet issues.) I would expect in reality 2023 is still up in the air but I think I read or heard somewhere that the carrier hoped they would return next year to SAN. I hope so too.

bb

A couple of quick items with ATC and BA's A350K as I listened to approach and departure. Coming in, approach control had to ask the pilots what their normal approach speeds are, the handler had not dealt with A350's. The flight responded and was thanked, normal speeds indicated 135 to 140 knots with normal wind conditions.
For departure, what was sort of interesting is after receiving taxi instructions, taking Bravo to 27, BA replied that they couldn't use B1 to access runway 27. They said they need to use C1, doing the Lindy hop at B/C4. I thought this was eliminated with all the work redoing the B taxiway, especially from B3 to B1. I googled size between the A350K and B773ER which BA used to fly to SAN in the past and the 350K is slightly smaller than the 773.. I don't recall if the 773 had to also take the Lindy hop when departing 27.
So the question is did the 773 do the hop? And if anyone knows, why wasn't the upgrade of B1-3 taken into account A350K's? Hopefully the A359 from LH won't need to do the same as BA!

wedgetail737 wrote:

IFlyOff wrote:

Yes, it is the same little airport as when we were kids. Same amount of acreage. They're simply using what they have for airport purposes and more efficiently. No Teledyne-Ryan, no Convair, no out-dated facilities like the old cargo facilities, no one story terminals, no parking lots instead of multi-level structures. The Airport Authority realized there is no land nor local support for a new airport location, so they're making what they have work.

I remember taking pics of airplanes at SAN near the cafe were Top Gun was filmed and the Copacabana Club.

Which cafe??

Here's a recent video where the Tijuana airport director talks about the expansion there. He even says it's "mainly focused for San Diego travelers" in his opening remarks. (start video at 3 min 17 seconds) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTGPnzA ... Dg&index=5

the main points are:
- expanding from 8 to 36 check-in counters
- special facility for oversize baggage (it seemed mainly meant for the surfing crowd)
- new flight to Puerto Escondido starting next month
- the check-in area will open in early summer
- full-opening late this year (it sounded like they're still working on the customs and immigration component)

In a different presentation by a China-Baja business group, the idea of TJ airport perhaps offering a stopover option similar to Lisbon was mentioned. So, for example, a person flying in from China connecting to a flight to Panama City could spend a few days in San Diego. If implemented somehow, that should be good for tourism in San Diego.

AAtakeMeAway wrote:

I would say in general your assessment is correct. The AA end is slightly better than the AS end, but pretty much all the gates in the entire concourse are in the hallway will little to no seating. There’s one small hold room on the AA side (NE corner) and that may be what you referred to as the Gate 27 complex. This small hold room has gates 28,30, and 32. I’ve never flown out of these gates as I believe they were formerly Eagle gates and are now being used for AS RJ flights. They all have jetways.
Gate 27 is a mainline gate for AA, faces west and is one of the many gates that are just in the hallway with no seating. That gate along with 29 and 31 are pretty close together in the same dead end hallway at the NW corner so it’s absolute hell if more than one of those gates are in use at a time. That small hold room can only hold the passengers for 28,30,32 … there isn’t really room for anyone in the many hallway gates. It just wasn’t designed for all these 321s, 737s, etc.

All that said, the AS end is a special kind of hell. I think there is just one holdroom around gate 22 in the SW area of the concourse. Whenever I peak over there when headed from TSA to the lounge it’s a chaotic scene.

The whole T2E is just dreadful.

I haven't been in T2E since NW operated over there, but during the green build they bumped out the east side of the concourse around gates 24-28. I assumed this was to put proper hold rooms in this area, but based on your assessment they must have used this space for another purpose. Is that just concession space?

timf wrote:

AAtakeMeAway wrote:

I would say in general your assessment is correct. The AA end is slightly better than the AS end, but pretty much all the gates in the entire concourse are in the hallway will little to no seating. There’s one small hold room on the AA side (NE corner) and that may be what you referred to as the Gate 27 complex. This small hold room has gates 28,30, and 32. I’ve never flown out of these gates as I believe they were formerly Eagle gates and are now being used for AS RJ flights. They all have jetways.
Gate 27 is a mainline gate for AA, faces west and is one of the many gates that are just in the hallway with no seating. That gate along with 29 and 31 are pretty close together in the same dead end hallway at the NW corner so it’s absolute hell if more than one of those gates are in use at a time. That small hold room can only hold the passengers for 28,30,32 … there isn’t really room for anyone in the many hallway gates. It just wasn’t designed for all these 321s, 737s, etc.

All that said, the AS end is a special kind of hell. I think there is just one holdroom around gate 22 in the SW area of the concourse. Whenever I peak over there when headed from TSA to the lounge it’s a chaotic scene.

The whole T2E is just dreadful.

I haven't been in T2E since NW operated over there, but during the green build they bumped out the east side of the concourse around gates 24-28. I assumed this was to put proper hold rooms in this area, but based on your assessment they must have used this space for another purpose. Is that just concession space?

Hmmm... I think that would be the area where some retail concessions are now. Across from it is another bump out with food concessions.

I got her! It was close, but I timed it perfectly!!



There's a screenshot of San Diego's first regularly scheduled Airbus A350 gracefully gliding over Sixth Avenue.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdYlfTl8QmQ

A very short video from which I derived the picture. Not a long approach here, but it does frame the airplane perfectly...

Whiteguy wrote:

wedgetail737 wrote:

IFlyOff wrote:

Yes, it is the same little airport as when we were kids. Same amount of acreage. They're simply using what they have for airport purposes and more efficiently. No Teledyne-Ryan, no Convair, no out-dated facilities like the old cargo facilities, no one story terminals, no parking lots instead of multi-level structures. The Airport Authority realized there is no land nor local support for a new airport location, so they're making what they have work.

I remember taking pics of airplanes at SAN near the cafe were Top Gun was filmed and the Copacabana Club.

Which cafe??

It has been gone for years, but it was where Signature Flight Support is now. Was a great place in the 90's to have breakfast/lunch. Some great memories there geeking out to L1011's, etc.

n92r03 wrote:

Whiteguy wrote:

wedgetail737 wrote:

I remember taking pics of airplanes at SAN near the cafe were Top Gun was filmed and the Copacabana Club.

Which cafe??

It has been gone for years, but it was where Signature Flight Support is now. Was a great place in the 90's to have breakfast/lunch. Some great memories there geeking out to L1011's, etc.

Which scenes were filmed there?

vedatil4 wrote:

Here's a recent video where the Tijuana airport director talks about the expansion there. He even says it's "mainly focused for San Diego travelers" in his opening remarks. (start video at 3 min 17 seconds) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTGPnzA ... Dg&index=5

the main points are:
- expanding from 8 to 36 check-in counters

That's pretty ambitious. Avoiding a U.S. origin will avoid lots of taxes in a SAN-Mexico trip.

SAN-SJD taxes

US Passenger Facility Charge (XF)
$4.50
Mexico Tourism Tax Derecho No Inmigrante (UK)
$31.15
United States Passenger Civil Aviation Security Service Fee (AY)
$5.60
US International Departure Tax (US)
$39.40
United States Immigration User Fee (XY)
$7.00
United States Customs User Fee (YC)
$6.11
United States APHIS Passenger Fee Passengers (XA)
$3.96
Mexico Airport Departure Tax Tua International (XD)
$57.48

total $155.20

TIJ-SJD

Mexico Transportation Tax IVA Domestic (MX)
$30.11
Mexico Airport Departure Tax Tua Domestic (XV)
$39.46

total $69.57

MIflyer12 wrote:

vedatil4 wrote:

Here's a recent video where the Tijuana airport director talks about the expansion there. He even says it's "mainly focused for San Diego travelers" in his opening remarks. (start video at 3 min 17 seconds) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTGPnzA ... Dg&index=5

the main points are:
- expanding from 8 to 36 check-in counters

That's pretty ambitious. Avoiding a U.S. origin will avoid lots of taxes in a SAN-Mexico trip.

SAN-SJD taxes

US Passenger Facility Charge (XF)
$4.50
Mexico Tourism Tax Derecho No Inmigrante (UK)
$31.15
United States Passenger Civil Aviation Security Service Fee (AY)
$5.60
US International Departure Tax (US)
$39.40
United States Immigration User Fee (XY)
$7.00
United States Customs User Fee (YC)
$6.11
United States APHIS Passenger Fee Passengers (XA)
$3.96
Mexico Airport Departure Tax Tua International (XD)
$57.48

total $155.20

TIJ-SJD

Mexico Transportation Tax IVA Domestic (MX)
$30.11
Mexico Airport Departure Tax Tua Domestic (XV)
$39.46

total $69.57

Thanks for the breakdown.

For a TIJ-SJD flight, if staying more than 7 days, the tourist visa is around $30, CBX bridge tickets are $32, and the uber ride or parking fees may add more. Sometimes the final prices are similar but sometimes the difference is tremendous depending on the destination and the time of year. Flying to Mexico City or Guadalajara is almost always cheaper via the CBX bridge as opposed to SAN though.

Yes, it's an ambitious expansion alright. They're more than quadrupling the number of check-in counters. I figured doubling would be enough. They were already having to use canopies outside on the USA side of the border. The immigration and customs area on the Mexico side going southbound is a bottleneck too. I'm glad they're addressing that problem (borne out of success).

It would be interesting to see a similar breakdown of USA vs Mexico fees for an airline like Air France flying from Tahiti to Paris stopping in TIJ (with San Diego as a stopover option similar to TAP airline's program at Lisbon) versus stopping at LAX.

But that's an idea probably a few years down the road. First they need to get the terminal open and all the final checklist and unforeseen challenges worked out.

PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:

I got her! It was close, but I timed it perfectly!!



There's a screenshot of San Diego's first regularly scheduled Airbus A350 gracefully gliding over Sixth Avenue.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdYlfTl8QmQ

A very short video from which I derived the picture. Not a long approach here, but it does frame the airplane perfectly...

Great video! That's a wonderful location for speedbird-watching. There are some other locations a few blocks west where flights come closer but there are too many overhead wires for a clean picture. Thanks again.

PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:

I got her! It was close, but I timed it perfectly!!



There's a screenshot of San Diego's first regularly scheduled Airbus A350 gracefully gliding over Sixth Avenue.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdYlfTl8QmQ

A very short video from which I derived the picture. Not a long approach here, but it does frame the airplane perfectly...

The A350 is a magnificent plane! The A350-1000 is a pretty loooong plane! I wonder if it's the
same length as the 777-300?

757SanCam wrote:

A couple of quick items with ATC and BA's A350K as I listened to approach and departure. Coming in, approach control had to ask the pilots what their normal approach speeds are, the handler had not dealt with A350's. The flight responded and was thanked, normal speeds indicated 135 to 140 knots with normal wind conditions.
For departure, what was sort of interesting is after receiving taxi instructions, taking Bravo to 27, BA replied that they couldn't use B1 to access runway 27. They said they need to use C1, doing the Lindy hop at B/C4. I thought this was eliminated with all the work redoing the B taxiway, especially from B3 to B1. I googled size between the A350K and B773ER which BA used to fly to SAN in the past and the 350K is slightly smaller than the 773.. I don't recall if the 773 had to also take the Lindy hop when departing 27.
So the question is did the 773 do the hop? And if anyone knows, why wasn't the upgrade of B1-3 taken into account A350K's? Hopefully the A359 from LH won't need to do the same as BA!

What’s interesting is that lately BA and JL have been requesting to cross over to C or as some of you folks coin it the: “lindy hop.” B is still open to aircraft with wide wingspans such as those A332s and A333s from DL and HA respectively. I wonder if it has to do with payload. BA’s 77W back in the Summer of 2019 went down B all the way as well as JL’s 788 up until recently.

PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:

I got her! It was close, but I timed it perfectly!!
There's a screenshot of San Diego's first regularly scheduled Airbus A350 gracefully gliding over Sixth Avenue.

A very short video from which I derived the picture. Not a long approach here, but it does frame the airplane perfectly...

Beautiful job PSA'! Thanks so much for your effort and your results! And of course it appears to have been a beautiful day in downtown yesterday, which doesn't hurt the quality of the video/photo!

Boy this Speedbird is one sleek, long beauty isn't she? Almost reminiscent of the Stretch DC-8s (-61 & -63s) of "the good old days."

Thanks again PSA' for your usual success in capturing moments like yesterday for those of us who can't make it to SAN to enjoy in person!

757SanCam wrote:

A couple of quick items with ATC and BA's A350K as I listened to approach and departure. Coming in, approach control had to ask the pilots what their normal approach speeds are, the handler had not dealt with A350's. The flight responded and was thanked, normal speeds indicated 135 to 140 knots with normal wind conditions.
For departure, what was sort of interesting is after receiving taxi instructions, taking Bravo to 27, BA replied that they couldn't use B1 to access runway 27. They said they need to use C1, doing the Lindy hop at B/C4. I thought this was eliminated with all the work redoing the B taxiway, especially from B3 to B1. I googled size between the A350K and B773ER which BA used to fly to SAN in the past and the 350K is slightly smaller than the 773.. I don't recall if the 773 had to also take the Lindy hop when departing 27.
So the question is did the 773 do the hop? And if anyone knows, why wasn't the upgrade of B1-3 taken into account A350K's? Hopefully the A359 from LH won't need to do the same as BA!

Interesting finds, 757San'. I can't answer any of your questions but I hope someone will be able to. It seems to me that even "The Queen" (744) did not have do The Hop when she was still flying from SAN a couple of years ago. (Or did she?) As SAN continues to get more congested as the years go on, The Hop is going to create more and more delays and issues I would think. I, like you, would have thought the taxiway work done by the airport -- I assume that project is all done by now? -- would have taken care of the problem.

I guess it's possible that the airport folks and BA have different ideas about whether the 350-1000 needs to do The Hop or not so we'll have to keep an eye on this and see if things change at some point.

bb

SANFan wrote:

Interesting finds, 757San'. I can't answer any of your questions but I hope someone will be able to. It seems to me that even "The Queen" (744) did not have do The Hop when she was still flying from SAN a couple of years ago. (Or did she?) As SAN continues to get more congested as the years go on, The Hop is going to create more and more delays and issues I would think. I, like you, would have thought the taxiway work done by the airport -- I assume that project is all done by now? -- would have taken care of the problem.

I guess it's possible that the airport folks and BA have different ideas about whether the 350-1000 needs to do The Hop or not so we'll have to keep an eye on this and see if things change at some point.

bb

To my knowledge, the queen (747) and the 777-300 had to take the Lindy Hop to C because of wing width. Given the information here, comparing the size of the A350 and the 777-300:


http://www.aviatorjoe.net/go/compare/A3 ... 777-300ER/

I would assume that the wingspan of the A350 is, like its British Airways predecessors, too wide for Taxiway B.

Side note: for Monday, March 28, 2022, at 12:25 PM local time, I see all SAN arrivals in a holding pattern offshore:



It looks like several planes took off okay; however, arrivals are being shunted to the south, away from the runway.

Any ideas?

Next up to grace our skies, Lufthansa's A350-900 on Wednesday! I love how the
winglets on the A350 have a graceful sweep upwards!

LindyFlight wrote:

What’s interesting is that lately BA and JL have been requesting to cross over to C or as some of you folks coin it the: “lindy hop.” B is still open to aircraft with wide wingspans such as those A332s and A333s from DL and HA respectively. I wonder if it has to do with payload. BA’s 77W back in the Summer of 2019 went down B all the way as well as JL’s 788 up until recently.

There is probably work going on the taxiway down in that area, which could be the reason why
BA and JL have been requesting "lindy hops". I remember seeing the JL 788 taxiing all the way down
(pre-covid).

PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:

Side note: for Monday, March 28, 2022, at 12:25 PM local time, I see all SAN arrivals in a holding pattern offshore:



It looks like several planes took off okay; however, arrivals are being shunted to the south, away from the runway.

Any ideas?

They could be doing that because the storm that is coming, it's pretty windy right now, maybe the aircraft
are in a holding pattern offshore waiting for weather instructions in case they have to start arriving
on runway-9? According to SAN's website, many flights are delayed.

SANMAN66 wrote:

LindyFlight wrote:

What’s interesting is that lately BA and JL have been requesting to cross over to C or as some of you folks coin it the: “lindy hop.” B is still open to aircraft with wide wingspans such as those A332s and A333s from DL and HA respectively. I wonder if it has to do with payload. BA’s 77W back in the Summer of 2019 went down B all the way as well as JL’s 788 up until recently.

There is probably work going on the taxiway down in that area, which could be the reason why
BA and JL have been requesting "lindy hops". I remember seeing the JL 788 taxiing all the way down
(pre-covid).

Won't rule that out. Yet, DL's A332/A333s & HA's A332 (ie: DL820, HA15, DL350 yesterday) continue to taxi down B all the way which makes me think it's weight-related in BA and JL's case. 787 (all variants) and A330 (all variants) have the same relative wingspan of 197 ft. Will also add-on to the conversation about how the 744 and 77W were too wide for B. I filmed the 77W and 744 taxiing down B all the way (744 wingspan is 211 ft. 77W is 212 ft which is the same relative wingspan of the A35K).

77W taxiing down B: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KR2H3iUHgrQ&t=1s
744 taxiing down B: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=foTIkMPF2Ek&t=5s
(Sorry that it's dark, don't have the best low light capable equipment)

I like SanFan have concern that if A350's have to do the hop to to get to C1 for normal 27 departures, delays are certain. Last night's BA departure from request to taxi to actual departure took approximately 15 minutes. They had to wait for 2 arrivals to cross 27 at B4, then had to wait for more arrivals at C1 and this was a real slow time for activity at SAN, around 7:20pm. One can only imagine with the earlier departure of the LH 359 (right in the middle of the evening rush hour at SAN), that there will be some delays. I looked up wingspan of the A359 vs. A350K and they are identical, so as SanFan indicated with traffic picking up, this will be a pain. FYI, the A330's series and B767 aircraft are not nearly as large as the 350's. And why JAL's 788 used C1 is perplexing, BA and their 789 used B1 all the time, the 789 is much longer than the 788. If it's a weight issue at B1, I don't get that either considering the taxiway project was just finished recently.

SANMAN66 wrote:

PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:

Side note: for Monday, March 28, 2022, at 12:25 PM local time, I see all SAN arrivals in a holding pattern offshore:



It looks like several planes took off okay; however, arrivals are being shunted to the south, away from the runway.

Any ideas?

They could be doing that because the storm that is coming, it's pretty windy right now, maybe the aircraft
are in a holding pattern offshore waiting for weather instructions in case they have to start arriving
on runway-9? According to SAN's website, many flights are delayed.

I was driving past SeaWorld around 10:30 this morning and there were multiple flights landing on runway 9. I didn’t see any departures but I suppose if they were arriving 9 and departing 27, they’d need some arrivals to hold while others depart.

Mystery solved on BA 350K using crossing 27 to C1. Just heard on SAN ground talking to tonite's flight, gave clearance to use Bravo to 27, BA said they need to use Charlie. ATC then asked reason, BA cockpit stated they need full length.

Yesterday, tower called BA operations in England after Sunday's flight explaining that both B and C are full length departures. The flight tonight said they are following company policy. Baffling!!! They are just delaying their departure and using a bit more fuel. It's their time and money! Hopefully, LH is a bit smarter and uses Bravo all the way to 27 on Wednesday.

757SanCam wrote:

Mystery solved on BA 350K using crossing 27 to C1. Just heard on SAN ground talking to tonite's flight, gave clearance to use Bravo to 27, BA said they need to use Charlie. ATC then asked reason, BA cockpit stated they need full length.

Yesterday, tower called BA operations in England after Sunday's flight explaining that both B and C are full length departures. The flight tonight said they are following company policy. Baffling!!! They are just delaying their departure and using a bit more fuel. It's their time and money! Hopefully, LH is a bit smarter and uses Bravo all the way to 27 on Wednesday.

It could be that since BA is using a brand new aircraft type, they don't want to take
any chances bumping into anything while taxiing? New pilots maybe?

757SanCam wrote:

Mystery solved on BA 350K using crossing 27 to C1. Just heard on SAN ground talking to tonite's flight, gave clearance to use Bravo to 27, BA said they need to use Charlie. ATC then asked reason, BA cockpit stated they need full length.

Yesterday, tower called BA operations in England after Sunday's flight explaining that both B and C are full length departures. The flight tonight said they are following company policy. Baffling!!! They are just delaying their departure and using a bit more fuel. It's their time and money! Hopefully, LH is a bit smarter and uses Bravo all the way to 27 on Wednesday.

Using the northern taxiway "Charlie" does allow the aircraft to enter Runway 27 200 feet further back thus giving them a extra couple of hundred feet of take-off length. I guess every inch counts.

Whiteguy wrote:

n92r03 wrote:

Whiteguy wrote:

Which cafe??

It has been gone for years, but it was where Signature Flight Support is now. Was a great place in the 90's to have breakfast/lunch. Some great memories there geeking out to L1011's, etc.

Which scenes were filmed there?

Towards the end of the film, where Charlie goes to see Maverick after his incident and he's drinking water at the bar; you can see the travel posters that hung behind him. They used to have styrofoam logos of airlines on the wall as well; When it converted from JB's to The Windsock (I want to say it was around 1995 or 1996), the interior was gutted and they removed the travel/airline themed wall decor, they put up light wood paneling and beiges tones. At the bar area, which behind was an outdoor patio that overlooked the Jimsair ramp, there was a small placard that said this was one of the "Top Gun" bar scene locations. I can't find any photos from the inside, although I'm sure I have some somewhere. It was a great spotting location

I came across an article about Aeromexico running a special involving US cities. I share it because it seems like, at least from an intrepid traveler's perspective, low price competition is coming to the San Diego area once the new terminal at TIJ with the CBX bridge opens in a few months: https://thepointsguy.com/deals/wine-cou ... -from-153/

They listed a bunch of USA cities there. For kicks, I looked up flying to Miami around Memorial Day weekend. The layover in Mexico City wouldn't be too bad for a flight like that.

Using departing May 25th and returning June 1st, I was able to find, but didn't buy, $188.52 round trip on Aeromexico ,including the CBX tickets, flying out of Tijuana as opposed to $677 round trip for roughly the same times flying out of San Diego.

The price difference being $489 per ticket may be enough for some to consider that type of routing. Its something to keep an eye on in the next few months after the terminal opens.

Tonight, Tuesday, BA accepted B1 with their A350K, guess BA ops changed their mind, no more delays!

vedatil4 wrote:

Using departing May 25th and returning June 1st, I was able to find, but didn't buy, $188.52 round trip on Aeromexico ,including the CBX tickets, flying out of Tijuana as opposed to $677 round trip for roughly the same times flying out of San Diego.

The price difference being $489 per ticket may be enough for some to consider that type of routing. Its something to keep an eye on in the next few months after the terminal opens.

I’m not sure what you’re looking at, but checking Google Flights, I see significantly better than $677 from SAN to MIA on those dates. For TIJ to MIA, the flights looks like overnight trips, while SAN offers daytime trips starting at $290 on Spirit (with return on American) or $366 on round trip on American.

757SanCam wrote:

Tonight, Tuesday, BA accepted B1 with their A350K, guess BA ops changed their mind, no more delays!

Looks like they finally realized, thanks for keeping us up to date with their operations.

And another video of BA 273 landing at SAN, this time on Tuesday, March 29:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtEdtoMqy7Y

I am planning on getting a video today of LH 466 arriving from my favorite position on Sixth Avenue, so if you see me, say hello!!

Lufthansa's flight#466 from Munich is halfway here! She just passed over Greenland.
She's scheduled to show up in town at 3:32pm (three minutes early!)

PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:

And another video of BA 273 landing at SAN, this time on Tuesday, March 29:
am planning on getting a video today of LH 466 arriving from my favorite position on Sixth Avenue, so if you see me, say hello!!

Geeze PSA', where did you take this video, standing on a ladder in the left lane of Kettner?! Your work is beautiful but please don't get yourself run over by a bus in the process!

In any case, thanks for another great job! I'm looking forward to seeing your shots of LH's arrival this afternoon. Just be careful!

SANMAN66 wrote:

Lufthansa's flight#466 from Munich is halfway here! She just passed over Greenland.
She's scheduled to show up in town at 3:32pm (three minutes early!)

Thanks for the update L-Man! Exciting times, eh?

Who'da thunk we'd all be watching huge, state of the art jets like this landing at our itty-bitty airport, nonstop from Europe and Asia?!?! This is really amazing!

bb

SANFan wrote:

PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:

And another video of BA 273 landing at SAN, this time on Tuesday, March 29:
am planning on getting a video today of LH 466 arriving from my favorite position on Sixth Avenue, so if you see me, say hello!!

Geeze PSA', where did you take this video, standing on a ladder in the left lane of Kettner?! Your work is beautiful but please don't get yourself run over by a bus in the process!

In any case, thanks for another great job! I'm looking forward to seeing your shots of LH's arrival this afternoon. Just be careful!

Thanks Bob! The video was taken from the pedestrian overcrossing of Interstate 5 right at the Pacific Highway interchange. I parked on India Street, walked over, descended the second level on the opposite side, since the top level has a no-jump screen that is too high for me to lift the camera above.

I might see if the top level of the rental car garage is open...talk about unobstructed!!

SANMAN66 wrote:

Lufthansa's flight#466 from Munich is halfway here! She just passed over Greenland.
She's scheduled to show up in town at 3:32pm (three minutes early!)

Thanks for the update L-Man! Exciting times, eh?

Who'da thunk we'd all be watching huge, state of the art jets like this landing at our itty-bitty airport, nonstop from Europe and Asia?!?! This is really amazing!

bb[/quote]

And it's all coming back!! Maybe next year at this time we'll be seeing the inaugural KLM or Air France flight...

SANFan wrote:

Who'da thunk we'd all be watching huge, state of the art jets like this landing at our itty-bitty airport, nonstop from Europe and Asia?!?! This is really amazing!

bb

Yup! It is amazing! I'm still hoping for the return of Edelweiss, in addition to KLM or AF
announcing service here!

I just wanted to chip in with a thanks to the local videographers for filming these arrivals. Is the spot at Harbor Drive still open? I'd assume it would give you a little better lighting since the sun would be behind you at this time of year. Or is that old familiar spot (see photo) getting a little tired at this point?

Speaking of spotting locations, is there anything happening with the viewing locations that were supposed open up on top of the rental car center or nearby on PCH? I need to figure out a plan to visit San Diego in the upcoming months and try to fit in a photography session at the airport.

Cheers,

Edward

lindy field wrote:

I just wanted to chip in with a thanks to the local videographers for filming these arrivals. Is the spot at Harbor Drive still open? I'd assume it would give you a little better lighting since the sun would be behind you at this time of year. Or is that old familiar spot (see photo) getting a little tired at this point?

Speaking of spotting locations, is there anything happening with the viewing locations that were supposed open up on top of the rental car center or nearby on PCH? I need to figure out a plan to visit San Diego in the upcoming months and try to fit in a photography session at the airport.
Cheers,
Edward

Hey Edward, great to hear from you; it's been a while and you are missed here! Glad to hear you're coming by for a visit.

That space at Laurel & Harbor Drive is still open although a bit shrunken but at the same entrance to the lot, there's some newer parking just to the west that you may not have seen yet. There are still lots of fences at that old gate that was used for the Coast Guard station on the waterfront to access 27 but I see people either standing on that green communication box right next to the fences or on their truck beds, or car hood, or roof... That's still my first choice for spotting, for being close to the action, the noise, the smells.

To be honest, I'm not sure what's happened with the planned Spotter's Spot in the parking area on Pacific Highway -- I'm not aware that it exists -- or at the rental car center but as PSA' said, what a location that would be!!!! Some people like Liberty Station to see the newly-airborne planes just climbing off 27. And keep in mind, practically all 663 acres of SAN are being torn up and moved around as part of all the projects surrounding the T1 replacement!

bb

Yes gentlemen, it's kind of hard to not be excited and optimistic right now with all the great events happening at SAN this year!

Even with business travel still waiting in the wings (sorry), things sure seem to be heading in the right direction. Of course once that business travel starts again in earnest, that should do nothing but help move things along even faster!

I would be very surprised if we didn't see another European flag decide it's time to add SAN to their network and of course, as has been mentioned, AF/KL would seem the most likely candidate... almost expected. I also feel strongly that we will see Edelweiss return to SAN next year with their Zurich service.

It's also a fact that Latin America is still very much being chased by SAN so we can hope to see some results on that front, at some point. It seems most likely that a Central American hub might be the first to happen, probably with one of the foreign carriers based there but I'm not ruling out other possibilities from my thinking. I also know there's lots of competition from other US airports to snag service to that region so we just need to keep our fingers crossed.

Another Asian carrier? I sure hope so but we have a lot of ground to make up for those destinations to the far west. Once things start a major recovery, and the further we get from the world of covid, I could certainly see the possibility of (most probably) KE flying to Seoul and eventually, maybe even one of the Chinese carriers starting service here. Remember that JL resumed their SAN-service long before any other foreign cx did - a whole year ago! That must say something about traffic to Asia from here!

bb

hawaiian717 wrote:

vedatil4 wrote:

Using departing May 25th and returning June 1st, I was able to find, but didn't buy, $188.52 round trip on Aeromexico ,including the CBX tickets, flying out of Tijuana as opposed to $677 round trip for roughly the same times flying out of San Diego.

The price difference being $489 per ticket may be enough for some to consider that type of routing. Its something to keep an eye on in the next few months after the terminal opens.

I’m not sure what you’re looking at, but checking Google Flights, I see significantly better than $677 from SAN to MIA on those dates. For TIJ to MIA, the flights looks like overnight trips, while SAN offers daytime trips starting at $290 on Spirit (with return on American) or $366 on round trip on American.

Normally I want to overnight my way to the east coast.

But yes, I did find flights out of San Diego to Miami at around $330 on those dates assuming a carry-on bag. That's still around a $140 difference that would multiplied by the number of people..

I just thought it strange that Aeromexico would even have a special to USA cities. It's something to keep an eye on as Volaris and VivaAerobus are more or less killing them. Maybe the bridge and airport expansion at TIJ is part of a future strategy for the airline? They keep touting that it's Tijuana's airport in San Diego on billboards at CBX.

The private owner/developer at TIJ shares little information about their goals. In fact, on the very day the CBX was having its grand opening, I wasn't even sure they were opening. They hold everything close to the vest since there isn't much government oversight.

Heck, they've had their water meter shut off, they don't pay property taxes to the City, and they had strange run off flowing into the adjacent neighborhood. Imagine San Diego airport doing that? (haha).

It's still too risky for me with that Mexico City layover. But if Volaris starts flying diectly from TIJ to places in the USA years into the future, I might be tempted then bite on the offers.

It's just something to keep an eye on going forward. Again, whatever plans they have, they are for the San Diego's benefit.

PSAatSAN4Ever wrote:

And another video of BA 273 landing at SAN, this time on Tuesday, March 29:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vtEdtoMqy7Y

I am planning on getting a video today of LH 466 arriving from my favorite position on Sixth Avenue, so if you see me, say hello!!

Great video! That seems like a wonderful birdwatching spot.

At the 53 second mark you can see down the road a place where you can get off the car rental shuttle, walk a little to Pacific Highway, then catch an uber or lyft. It's usually much cheaper and quicker from there.