Southwest Airlines News and Discussion Thread - 2022

TWA772LR · Tue May 17, 2022 2:47 am

GalaxyFlyer wrote:
Gee, I thought WN was bus service!

That was actually their initial competition in their beginning. Buses have too many variables that can affect on time performance, IMO. They don't want to deal with it.

If Republic is successful in their LIFT program getting an exception from the feds to have pilots at 750 hours, I would expect WN to seek the same with their program and maybe even form a regional just to have their own feedstock of pilots, but that is a tremendous hurdle even for them.

Lootess · Tue May 17, 2022 6:57 am

ncflyer wrote:
Halo? Well I have to be careful I could be in an airliners.net bubble but I'm not seeing a halo and I don't think I'm unique with the following sentiments.

Their fares are very expensive, especially if it's a connecting route. The days of Herb's famous quote "we're competing against the bus lines" are long past.
They run a hub and spoke airline just like everyone else. Their turn times are nothing special.
Their on time performance is abysmal. It's not just the % of flights that are late, it's the degree to which they are late this is just not Herb like anymore.
They've cut back service tremendously-- for whatever reason-- consumers don't know the why, all they know is there have been cutbacks outside of some of the hub cities.
They've lost their creativity. I suppose their Hawaii launch was creatively done but that impacts few relative to the lower 48.

THe Boeing story isn't in the news much anymore, I don't think it's about WN, I think it's more about how much else is going on in the news.

Southwest is a legacy-lite that is still trying to wear LCC clothes. Nothing is really low cost, jet fuel certainly isn't, wages are in the market-leading for domestic. On-time performance always a hit going to slot-constrained airports, along with now less capacity.

Yes they had to chase the business customers in their hub and focus city markets, which they have done well with over the years because of frequency, so they pay the fares. Now it's the same problem like everyone else, having enough planes to garner all the demand out there.

INFINITI329 · Tue May 17, 2022 8:26 am

Opus99 wrote:
https://twitter.com/dominicgates/status/1524790590570831884?s=21&t=7b-i9Gp5YeWjHJjGX-f1JA

This is absolutely wild

It sounds like a crime was committed under 923. 18 U.S.C. § 371—CONSPIRACY TO DEFRAUD THE UNITED STATES. I hope the DOJ opens an investigation into this this shouldn't go unchecked

avi8 · Tue May 17, 2022 11:20 am

Well, I just booked 2 separate, nonstop flights on WN that were significantly cheaper than other airlines. They were the only direct option and cheaper by about 50$ (The second flight almost 90$). If you add checked bags then it’s almost 80$ cheaper.

Western727 · Tue May 17, 2022 12:57 pm

LHUSA wrote:
UA444 wrote:
AMALH747430 wrote:
Seattle Times has now picked up the story the Wall Street Journal published last week re: possible Southwest Airlines involvement in the 737 max design and training issues. Does not appear to be behind a paywall.

https://www.seattletimes.com/business/b ... g-737-max/

Should be its own thread. Mods doing what they can to lessen impact on a.net favorite.

Yes. Pretty shocking that this major story keeps getting deleted from anet. Absolutely deserves to be its own thread that doesn't get deleted again.

This. Yes, it's huge and easily deserves its own thread.

orlandocfi · Tue May 17, 2022 1:25 pm

INFINITI329 wrote:
Opus99 wrote:
https://twitter.com/dominicgates/status/1524790590570831884?s=21&t=7b-i9Gp5YeWjHJjGX-f1JA

This is absolutely wild

It sounds like a crime was committed under 923. 18 U.S.C. § 371—CONSPIRACY TO DEFRAUD THE UNITED STATES. I hope the DOJ opens an investigation into this this shouldn't go unchecked

I think an investigation will reveal that multiple airlines provided similar input regarding training requirements. Every carrier has a vested interest in minimizing training costs across all variants of a fleet type. WN is a convenient scapegoat, but I’m sure there are “scandalous” emails and texts from UA, AA, et. al., that may be uncovered in the investigation process. I would be curious to see what types of communications are flying back and forth for the MAX10 certification fiasco…

WN732 · Tue May 17, 2022 2:17 pm

I am surprised that no one has noticed that Wanna Get Away Plus, has officially launched.

Wneast · Tue May 17, 2022 6:20 pm

WN732 wrote:
I am surprised that no one has noticed that Wanna Get Away Plus, has officially launched.

To me it’s seems like a ploy to end up doing assigned seats.

southwest1675 · Tue May 17, 2022 6:23 pm

Wneast wrote:
WN732 wrote:
I am surprised that no one has noticed that Wanna Get Away Plus, has officially launched.

To me it’s seems like a ploy to end up doing assigned seats.

It’ll probably happen one day.

Wneast · Tue May 17, 2022 6:26 pm

southwest1675 wrote:
Wneast wrote:
WN732 wrote:
I am surprised that no one has noticed that Wanna Get Away Plus, has officially launched.

To me it’s seems like a ploy to end up doing assigned seats.

It’ll probably happen one day.

I’m thinking with the other changes it might be next.

avi8 · Tue May 17, 2022 6:41 pm

I truly doubt WN will transition to assigned seats. For some reason this forum thinks doomsday is close for WN. Don’t fly them if you don’t want to. The numbers don’t lie and they outperform almost all other US Airlines

Wneast · Tue May 17, 2022 6:51 pm

avi8 wrote:
I truly doubt WN will transition to assigned seats. For some reason this forum thinks doomsday is close for WN. Don’t fly them if you don’t want to. The numbers don’t lie and they outperform almost all other US Airlines

I mean being honest did we think WN was getting outlets last week… probably not and Bob Jordan has Said it is possible down the road.

dstblj52 · Tue May 17, 2022 8:59 pm

TWA772LR wrote:
GalaxyFlyer wrote:
Gee, I thought WN was bus service!

That was actually their initial competition in their beginning. Buses have too many variables that can affect on time performance, IMO. They don't want to deal with it.

If Republic is successful in their LIFT program getting an exception from the feds to have pilots at 750 hours, I would expect WN to seek the same with their program and maybe even form a regional just to have their own feedstock of pilots, but that is a tremendous hurdle even for them.

They cant form a regional their scope clause is really really tight if a southwest passenger gets on it or it has a southwest code southwest crews operate it

freakyrat · Tue May 17, 2022 9:18 pm

TWA772LR wrote:
GalaxyFlyer wrote:
Gee, I thought WN was bus service!

That was actually their initial competition in their beginning. Buses have too many variables that can affect on time performance, IMO. They don't want to deal with it.

If Republic is successful in their LIFT program getting an exception from the feds to have pilots at 750 hours, I would expect WN to seek the same with their program and maybe even form a regional just to have their own feedstock of pilots, but that is a tremendous hurdle even for them.

Southwest has their Destination 225 program in partnership with Skywest.

https://www.flyingmag.com/skywest-airli ... tion%20225°%20program%20establishes%20a%20career%20path,Airlines%20%28NASDAQ%3A%20LUV%29%20career%20pathway%20program%20Destination%20225°.

Wneast · Tue May 17, 2022 10:38 pm

Did WN put out a full push of schedule I only saw one thing over in the Fresno thread about FAT-LAS increasing to 4x in July.

airzona11 · Tue May 17, 2022 10:50 pm

Wanna Get Away Plus seems to have but the difference between Wanna Get Away and Anytime in half. Classic dynamic pricing/price elasticity. The upgrades to Anytime are where the most benefits are for business travelers or others willing to pay, but not having status on WN. Seems like a smart move.

whatusaid · Wed May 18, 2022 3:25 am

Wneast wrote:
Did WN put out a full push of schedule I only saw one thing over in the Fresno thread about FAT-LAS increasing to 4x in July.

They added a single RT out of LAS to several CA markets, including FAT, SMF, OAK, SAN, LAX.

Chemist · Wed May 18, 2022 5:42 am

I just HATE boarding the legacies with the milling crowds and gate lice.
I recently flew United, I was in Group 4. Group 3 was the first called group that had a lot of people. I stood by waiting for group 4 to be called as almost the entire planeload got in line. Then they called all groups through Group 5! It's just a huge mess compared to WN's process.

avi8 · Wed May 18, 2022 11:56 am

whatusaid wrote:
Wneast wrote:
Did WN put out a full push of schedule I only saw one thing over in the Fresno thread about FAT-LAS increasing to 4x in July.

They added a single RT out of LAS to several CA markets, including FAT, SMF, OAK, SAN, LAX.

Do you think that that’s how they will start restoring their network? Adding flights here and there without making any specific announcements?

pmanni1 · Wed May 18, 2022 4:14 pm

avi8 wrote:
whatusaid wrote:
Wneast wrote:
Did WN put out a full push of schedule I only saw one thing over in the Fresno thread about FAT-LAS increasing to 4x in July.

They added a single RT out of LAS to several CA markets, including FAT, SMF, OAK, SAN, LAX.

Do you think that that’s how they will start restoring their network? Adding flights here and there without making any specific announcements?

They tend to make announcements when adding new routes but not so much when they add frequencies to existing routes.

385441 · Wed May 18, 2022 8:16 pm

Looks like more labor trouble ahead. Customer service workers’ union has rejected the proposed agreement.

https://www.dallasnews.com/business/air ... utType=amp

Wneast · Wed May 18, 2022 10:30 pm

I saw article about the shareholders call but it was behind a paywall anybody hear if there was anything worth noting ?

gdavis003 · Fri May 20, 2022 10:47 pm

gdavis003 wrote:
They have already begun to crush some of the WN 737s that have been parked at BHM in the last few months. Two pictured here today, they've painted out the registration and fleet number on the ones in the scrapping area. I'll hopefully be able to take inventory with the camera in the coming week to see what is still standing (they seem to be fairly quick at the moment with parting out and subsequently scrapping, so anything that I can't see from the deck are likely gone already)

I was able to get a better look at what is currently at BHM this afternoon with my camera. Can hopefully get some pics uploaded eventually but might take me a while, so if you're interested in any of these, shoot me a PM and I can go ahead and send them to you unedited.

The 6 737s that remain standing at the moment (with engines removed and multiple other parts removed) are: N707SA (first NG), N797MX, N714CB (Desert Gold), N433LV, N717SA, N716SW

This would subsequently mean that N711HK (former Desert Gold livery) was crushed in recent weeks, and that N798SW and N271LV were the two that were crushed last week (they are gone now), as there have only been 9 aircraft in total from my count.

WN732 · Fri May 20, 2022 11:23 pm

gdavis003 wrote:
gdavis003 wrote:
They have already begun to crush some of the WN 737s that have been parked at BHM in the last few months. Two pictured here today, they've painted out the registration and fleet number on the ones in the scrapping area. I'll hopefully be able to take inventory with the camera in the coming week to see what is still standing (they seem to be fairly quick at the moment with parting out and subsequently scrapping, so anything that I can't see from the deck are likely gone already)

I was able to get a better look at what is currently at BHM this afternoon with my camera. Can hopefully get some pics uploaded eventually but might take me a while, so if you're interested in any of these, shoot me a PM and I can go ahead and send them to you unedited.

The 6 737s that remain standing at the moment (with engines removed and multiple other parts removed) are: N707SA (first NG), N797MX, N714CB (Desert Gold), N433LV, N717SA, N716SW

This would subsequently mean that N711HK (former Desert Gold livery) was crushed in recent weeks, and that N798SW and N271LV were the two that were crushed last week (they are gone now), as there have only been 9 aircraft in total from my count.

That is remarkably fast.

gdavis003 · Fri May 20, 2022 11:35 pm

WN732 wrote:
gdavis003 wrote:
gdavis003 wrote:
They have already begun to crush some of the WN 737s that have been parked at BHM in the last few months. Two pictured here today, they've painted out the registration and fleet number on the ones in the scrapping area. I'll hopefully be able to take inventory with the camera in the coming week to see what is still standing (they seem to be fairly quick at the moment with parting out and subsequently scrapping, so anything that I can't see from the deck are likely gone already)

I was able to get a better look at what is currently at BHM this afternoon with my camera. Can hopefully get some pics uploaded eventually but might take me a while, so if you're interested in any of these, shoot me a PM and I can go ahead and send them to you unedited.

The 6 737s that remain standing at the moment (with engines removed and multiple other parts removed) are: N707SA (first NG), N797MX, N714CB (Desert Gold), N433LV, N717SA, N716SW

This would subsequently mean that N711HK (former Desert Gold livery) was crushed in recent weeks, and that N798SW and N271LV were the two that were crushed last week (they are gone now), as there have only been 9 aircraft in total from my count.

That is remarkably fast.

Very. They are making quick work. Now that I think about it too, the three that have been crushed were the first three to arrive in March, so it seems that they are crushing in order of arrival.

n471wn · Sat May 21, 2022 12:59 am

gdavis003 wrote:
gdavis003 wrote:
They have already begun to crush some of the WN 737s that have been parked at BHM in the last few months. Two pictured here today, they've painted out the registration and fleet number on the ones in the scrapping area. I'll hopefully be able to take inventory with the camera in the coming week to see what is still standing (they seem to be fairly quick at the moment with parting out and subsequently scrapping, so anything that I can't see from the deck are likely gone already)

I was able to get a better look at what is currently at BHM this afternoon with my camera. Can hopefully get some pics uploaded eventually but might take me a while, so if you're interested in any of these, shoot me a PM and I can go ahead and send them to you unedited.

The 6 737s that remain standing at the moment (with engines removed and multiple other parts removed) are: N707SA (first NG), N797MX, N714CB (Desert Gold), N433LV, N717SA, N716SW

This would subsequently mean that N711HK (former Desert Gold livery) was crushed in recent weeks, and that N798SW

and N271LV were the two that were crushed last week (they are gone now), as there have only been 9 aircraft in total from my count.

Thank you so much for taking the time to share these with us—painful as it is. Shame on SWA and Boeing for not preserving the first NG built.

SXDFC · Sat May 21, 2022 1:44 am

n471wn wrote:
gdavis003 wrote:
gdavis003 wrote:
They have already begun to crush some of the WN 737s that have been parked at BHM in the last few months. Two pictured here today, they've painted out the registration and fleet number on the ones in the scrapping area. I'll hopefully be able to take inventory with the camera in the coming week to see what is still standing (they seem to be fairly quick at the moment with parting out and subsequently scrapping, so anything that I can't see from the deck are likely gone already)

I was able to get a better look at what is currently at BHM this afternoon with my camera. Can hopefully get some pics uploaded eventually but might take me a while, so if you're interested in any of these, shoot me a PM and I can go ahead and send them to you unedited.

The 6 737s that remain standing at the moment (with engines removed and multiple other parts removed) are: N707SA (first NG), N797MX, N714CB (Desert Gold), N433LV, N717SA, N716SW

This would subsequently mean that N711HK (former Desert Gold livery) was crushed in recent weeks, and that N798SW

and N271LV were the two that were crushed last week (they are gone now), as there have only been 9 aircraft in total from my count.

Thank you so much for taking the time to share these with us—painful as it is. Shame on SWA and Boeing for not preserving the first NG built.

You realize WN and Boeing have a lot more things to worry about than preserving an aircraft right? Ive worked on that airplane many times, and would have loved nothing more than to see her at the Frontiers Of Flight Museum or The Museum Of Flight. However I’d imagine her parts are worth a lot more than nostalgia..

n471wn · Sat May 21, 2022 2:22 am

SXDFC wrote:
n471wn wrote:
gdavis003 wrote:

I was able to get a better look at what is currently at BHM this afternoon with my camera. Can hopefully get some pics uploaded eventually but might take me a while, so if you're interested in any of these, shoot me a PM and I can go ahead and send them to you unedited.

The 6 737s that remain standing at the moment (with engines removed and multiple other parts removed) are: N707SA (first NG), N797MX, N714CB (Desert Gold), N433LV, N717SA, N716SW

This would subsequently mean that N711HK (former Desert Gold livery) was crushed in recent weeks, and that N798SW

and N271LV were the two that were crushed last week (they are gone now), as there have only been 9 aircraft in total from my count.

Thank you so much for taking the time to share these with us—painful as it is. Shame on SWA and Boeing for not preserving the first NG built.

You realize WN and Boeing have a lot more things to worry about than preserving an aircraft right? Ive worked on that airplane many times, and would have loved nothing more than to see her at the Frontiers Of Flight Museum or The Museum Of Flight. However I’d imagine her parts are worth a lot more than nostalgia..

700 series parts are plentiful and compared to other models reasonably priced. SWA is the most to blame here as they have room at Love Field to display this aircraft. N707SA should be treasured.

Flflyer83 · Sat May 21, 2022 4:42 am

n471wn wrote:
SXDFC wrote:
n471wn wrote:

Thank you so much for taking the time to share these with us—painful as it is. Shame on SWA and Boeing for not preserving the first NG built.

You realize WN and Boeing have a lot more things to worry about than preserving an aircraft right? Ive worked on that airplane many times, and would have loved nothing more than to see her at the Frontiers Of Flight Museum or The Museum Of Flight. However I’d imagine her parts are worth a lot more than nostalgia..

700 series parts are plentiful and compared to other models reasonably priced. SWA is the most to blame here as they have room at Love Field to display this aircraft. N707SA should be treasured.

Why should a private company waste its resources to do that? There are many flight museums to do such activities or a collection of private citizens, like yourself, could have raised money to do it.

n471wn · Sat May 21, 2022 7:06 pm

Flflyer83 wrote:
n471wn wrote:
SXDFC wrote:

You realize WN and Boeing have a lot more things to worry about than preserving an aircraft right? Ive worked on that airplane many times, and would have loved nothing more than to see her at the Frontiers Of Flight Museum or The Museum Of Flight. However I’d imagine her parts are worth a lot more than nostalgia..

700 series parts are plentiful and compared to other models reasonably priced. SWA is the most to blame here as they have room at Love Field to display this aircraft. N707SA should be treasured.

Why should a private company waste its resources to do that? There are many flight museums to do such activities or a collection of private citizens, like yourself, could have raised money to do it.

There is ample ramp space at the SWA Love Field Museum to park this aircraft. Sorry you do not share the desire many of us have to preserve historical aircraft and the first NG is just that.

jbs2886 · Sat May 21, 2022 7:11 pm

Flflyer83 wrote:
n471wn wrote:
SXDFC wrote:

You realize WN and Boeing have a lot more things to worry about than preserving an aircraft right? Ive worked on that airplane many times, and would have loved nothing more than to see her at the Frontiers Of Flight Museum or The Museum Of Flight. However I’d imagine her parts are worth a lot more than nostalgia..

700 series parts are plentiful and compared to other models reasonably priced. SWA is the most to blame here as they have room at Love Field to display this aircraft. N707SA should be treasured.

Why should a private company waste its resources to do that? There are many flight museums to do such activities or a collection of private citizens, like yourself, could have raised money to do it.

Those airline museums are often structured as non-profits allowing the airlines get tax benefits. Look at DL has a 767, DC-9, 747, etc. - its just not as simple as “wast[ing] resources.”

ChetManly24 · Sun May 22, 2022 2:56 am

i'll just say, there is nothing special about the NG 737-700 and i am as much of an aviation enthusiast as the next. The first delivered Max to southwest would mean more in 15 years when im sure it will be the last iteration of the 737 produced. I'm sure ill get railed for this opinion though lol

PVD523 · Sun May 22, 2022 7:43 pm

ChetManly24 wrote:
i'll just say, there is nothing special about the NG 737-700 and i am as much of an aviation enthusiast as the next. The first delivered Max to southwest would mean more in 15 years when im sure it will be the last iteration of the 737 produced. I'm sure ill get railed for this opinion though lol

I hope most users on this site are adult enough not to do that. I think we forget sometimes that there are things called opinions, and if everyone shared the same one about everything this world would be a very boring place. And while I disagree - I think the NG was one of the absolute milestones in the legacy of the 737 - WN chose not to preserve these aircraft for their own reasons and that’s their prerogative.

BMWdrvr75 · Mon May 23, 2022 5:44 am

I’m not quite sure why everyone is so obsessed with a 737 as long as Southwest Airlines is around I’m sure Boeing will come up with some sort of 737 max super Duper 10,000 elite… So there really is no need to preserve N707

FlyingMSY · Mon May 23, 2022 1:28 pm

n471wn wrote:
SXDFC wrote:
n471wn wrote:

Thank you so much for taking the time to share these with us—painful as it is. Shame on SWA and Boeing for not preserving the first NG built.

You realize WN and Boeing have a lot more things to worry about than preserving an aircraft right? Ive worked on that airplane many times, and would have loved nothing more than to see her at the Frontiers Of Flight Museum or The Museum Of Flight. However I’d imagine her parts are worth a lot more than nostalgia..

700 series parts are plentiful and compared to other models reasonably priced. SWA is the most to blame here as they have room at Love Field to display this aircraft. N707SA should be treasured.

Side note, N700GS (also retired) was the first NG 737 delivered to WN; theoretically both 707 and 700 have equal significance in the WN history.
https://community.southwest.com/t5/Blog ... ba-p/35811

jplatts · Tue May 24, 2022 8:27 pm

Stations where WN carried more passengers in February 2022 than in February 2020 include AUS, CHS, DEN, ECP, ELP, GSP, HNL, KOA, LGB, LIH, OGG, ORF, PHX, PNS, RIC, RNO, and SLC.

Vctony · Tue May 24, 2022 9:35 pm

jplatts wrote:
Stations where WN carried more passengers in February 2022 than in February 2020 include AUS, CHS, DEN, ECP, ELP, GSP, HNL, KOA, LGB, LIH, OGG, ORF, PHX, PNS, RIC, RNO, and SLC.

WN is growing like crazy at PHX and is projected to overtake AA as the largest carrier by year end.

highflyer100 · Wed May 25, 2022 5:17 am

The amount of cheap intra-California flying WN is doing this summer is insane.

On Wednesday, July 6

20x SAN-SJC
20x SAN-SMF
14x SAN-OAK
14x BUR-OAK
12x BUR-SJC
12x BUR-SMF
10x LAX-OAK
9x SNA-SJC
8x SNA-OAK
7x LAX-SJC
7x LAX-SMF
7x SNA-SMF
6x BUR-SFO
6x ONT-SMF
6x ONT-OAK
5x LAX-SFO
5x ONT-SJC
5x SAN-SFO
5x LGB-SMF
5x LGB-OAK
3x LGB-SJC

Almost all of those flights are priced under $70, with many as low as $49. Given these crazy low fares in the current fuel environment and WNs operational issues and other cuts across the system, how is this remotely justifiable? Seems like way too much capacity? Similar shuttle type flights in the northeast have significantly higher priced tickets.

WN732 · Wed May 25, 2022 5:51 am

highflyer100 wrote:
The amount of cheap intra-California flying WN is doing this summer is insane.

On Wednesday, July 6

20x SAN-SJC
20x SAN-SMF
14x SAN-OAK
14x BUR-OAK
12x BUR-SJC
12x BUR-SMF
10x LAX-OAK
9x SNA-SJC
8x SNA-OAK
7x LAX-SJC
7x LAX-SMF
7x SNA-SMF
6x BUR-SFO
6x ONT-SMF
6x ONT-OAK
5x LAX-SFO
5x ONT-SJC
5x SAN-SFO
5x LGB-SMF
5x LGB-OAK
3x LGB-SJC

Almost all of those flights are priced under $70, with many as low as $49. Given these crazy low fares in the current fuel environment and WNs operational issues and other cuts across the system, how is this remotely justifiable? Seems like way too much capacity? Similar shuttle type flights in the northeast have significantly higher priced tickets.

Because they need to squash AS on the intra California routes. They have way more money to burn than AS does.

panam330 · Wed May 25, 2022 6:23 am

WN732 wrote:
Because they need to squash AS on the intra California routes. They have way more money to burn than AS does.

I also think it’s a not so subtle way of saying “don’t even think about it” to Breeze and Avelo.

pmanni1 · Wed May 25, 2022 10:52 am

highflyer100 wrote:
The amount of cheap intra-California flying WN is doing this summer is insane.

On Wednesday, July 6

20x SAN-SJC
20x SAN-SMF
14x SAN-OAK
14x BUR-OAK
12x BUR-SJC
12x BUR-SMF
10x LAX-OAK
9x SNA-SJC
8x SNA-OAK
7x LAX-SJC
7x LAX-SMF
7x SNA-SMF
6x BUR-SFO
6x ONT-SMF
6x ONT-OAK
5x LAX-SFO
5x ONT-SJC
5x SAN-SFO
5x LGB-SMF
5x LGB-OAK
3x LGB-SJC

Almost all of those flights are priced under $70, with many as low as $49. Given these crazy low fares in the current fuel environment and WNs operational issues and other cuts across the system, how is this remotely justifiable? Seems like way too much capacity? Similar shuttle type flights in the northeast have significantly higher priced tickets.

Would love to see the load factors on these flights.

LBBflyer · Wed May 25, 2022 12:02 pm

highflyer100 wrote:
The amount of cheap intra-California flying WN is doing this summer is insane.

On Wednesday, July 6

20x SAN-SJC
20x SAN-SMF
14x SAN-OAK
14x BUR-OAK
12x BUR-SJC
12x BUR-SMF
10x LAX-OAK
9x SNA-SJC
8x SNA-OAK
7x LAX-SJC
7x LAX-SMF
7x SNA-SMF
6x BUR-SFO
6x ONT-SMF
6x ONT-OAK
5x LAX-SFO
5x ONT-SJC
5x SAN-SFO
5x LGB-SMF
5x LGB-OAK
3x LGB-SJC

Almost all of those flights are priced under $70, with many as low as $49. Given these crazy low fares in the current fuel environment and WNs operational issues and other cuts across the system, how is this remotely justifiable? Seems like way too much capacity? Similar shuttle type flights in the northeast have significantly higher priced tickets.

I agree entirely on the point about other cuts across the system. Perhaps they are actually making a profit with these flights that they could not elsewhere, but it is difficult to stomach when you local airport is down vs. 2019 on both flights and destinations. It makes it very hard to remain loyal to Southwest.

avi8 · Wed May 25, 2022 12:17 pm

LBBflyer wrote:
highflyer100 wrote:
The amount of cheap intra-California flying WN is doing this summer is insane.

On Wednesday, July 6

20x SAN-SJC
20x SAN-SMF
14x SAN-OAK
14x BUR-OAK
12x BUR-SJC
12x BUR-SMF
10x LAX-OAK
9x SNA-SJC
8x SNA-OAK
7x LAX-SJC
7x LAX-SMF
7x SNA-SMF
6x BUR-SFO
6x ONT-SMF
6x ONT-OAK
5x LAX-SFO
5x ONT-SJC
5x SAN-SFO
5x LGB-SMF
5x LGB-OAK
3x LGB-SJC

Almost all of those flights are priced under $70, with many as low as $49. Given these crazy low fares in the current fuel environment and WNs operational issues and other cuts across the system, how is this remotely justifiable? Seems like way too much capacity? Similar shuttle type flights in the northeast have significantly higher priced tickets.

I agree entirely on the point about other cuts across the system. Perhaps they are actually making a profit with these flights that they could not elsewhere, but it is difficult to stomach when you local airport is down vs. 2019 on both flights and destinations. It makes it very hard to remain loyal to Southwest.

Let’s hope they keep rebuilding their network throughout the year as opposed to only California. LAX is still below 2019 levels, though.

mcdu · Wed May 25, 2022 12:27 pm

WN732 wrote:
highflyer100 wrote:
The amount of cheap intra-California flying WN is doing this summer is insane.

On Wednesday, July 6

20x SAN-SJC
20x SAN-SMF
14x SAN-OAK
14x BUR-OAK
12x BUR-SJC
12x BUR-SMF
10x LAX-OAK
9x SNA-SJC
8x SNA-OAK
7x LAX-SJC
7x LAX-SMF
7x SNA-SMF
6x BUR-SFO
6x ONT-SMF
6x ONT-OAK
5x LAX-SFO
5x ONT-SJC
5x SAN-SFO
5x LGB-SMF
5x LGB-OAK
3x LGB-SJC

Almost all of those flights are priced under $70, with many as low as $49. Given these crazy low fares in the current fuel environment and WNs operational issues and other cuts across the system, how is this remotely justifiable? Seems like way too much capacity? Similar shuttle type flights in the northeast have significantly higher priced tickets.

Because they need to squash AS on the intra California routes. They have way more money to burn than AS does.

That’s interesting as that is what they claimed other carriers were trying to do to them years ago.

jplatts · Wed May 25, 2022 12:35 pm

avi8 wrote:
Let’s hope they keep rebuilding their network throughout the year as opposed to only California. LAX is still below 2019 levels, though.

There are a few more markets such as BHM and CMH that could probably support WN nonstop service to LAX with WN having fewer nonstop flights to LAX from MDW, DEN, DAL, HOU, and STL in Summer 2022 than it did prior to the COVID-19 pandemic.

WN732 · Wed May 25, 2022 12:42 pm

mcdu wrote:
WN732 wrote:
highflyer100 wrote:
The amount of cheap intra-California flying WN is doing this summer is insane.

On Wednesday, July 6

20x SAN-SJC
20x SAN-SMF
14x SAN-OAK
14x BUR-OAK
12x BUR-SJC
12x BUR-SMF
10x LAX-OAK
9x SNA-SJC
8x SNA-OAK
7x LAX-SJC
7x LAX-SMF
7x SNA-SMF
6x BUR-SFO
6x ONT-SMF
6x ONT-OAK
5x LAX-SFO
5x ONT-SJC
5x SAN-SFO
5x LGB-SMF
5x LGB-OAK
3x LGB-SJC

Almost all of those flights are priced under $70, with many as low as $49. Given these crazy low fares in the current fuel environment and WNs operational issues and other cuts across the system, how is this remotely justifiable? Seems like way too much capacity? Similar shuttle type flights in the northeast have significantly higher priced tickets.

Because they need to squash AS on the intra California routes. They have way more money to burn than AS does.

That’s interesting as that is what they claimed other carriers were trying to do to them years ago.

It's business and they are not the little underdog they used to be.

WNflyer1523 · Wed May 25, 2022 12:56 pm

highflyer100 wrote:
The amount of cheap intra-California flying WN is doing this summer is insane.

On Wednesday, July 6

20x SAN-SJC
20x SAN-SMF
14x SAN-OAK
14x BUR-OAK
12x BUR-SJC
12x BUR-SMF
10x LAX-OAK
9x SNA-SJC
8x SNA-OAK
7x LAX-SJC
7x LAX-SMF
7x SNA-SMF
6x BUR-SFO
6x ONT-SMF
6x ONT-OAK
5x LAX-SFO
5x ONT-SJC
5x SAN-SFO
5x LGB-SMF
5x LGB-OAK
3x LGB-SJC

Almost all of those flights are priced under $70, with many as low as $49. Given these crazy low fares in the current fuel environment and WNs operational issues and other cuts across the system, how is this remotely justifiable? Seems like way too much capacity? Similar shuttle type flights in the northeast have significantly higher priced tickets.

...Wow. Seems all they care about recently is the West Coast, while they leave the East Coast to rot.

LotsaRunway · Wed May 25, 2022 1:46 pm

LBBflyer wrote:
highflyer100 wrote:
The amount of cheap intra-California flying WN is doing this summer is insane.

On Wednesday, July 6

20x SAN-SJC
20x SAN-SMF
14x SAN-OAK
14x BUR-OAK
12x BUR-SJC
12x BUR-SMF
10x LAX-OAK
9x SNA-SJC
8x SNA-OAK
7x LAX-SJC
7x LAX-SMF
7x SNA-SMF
6x BUR-SFO
6x ONT-SMF
6x ONT-OAK
5x LAX-SFO
5x ONT-SJC
5x SAN-SFO
5x LGB-SMF
5x LGB-OAK
3x LGB-SJC

Almost all of those flights are priced under $70, with many as low as $49. Given these crazy low fares in the current fuel environment and WNs operational issues and other cuts across the system, how is this remotely justifiable? Seems like way too much capacity? Similar shuttle type flights in the northeast have significantly higher priced tickets.

I agree entirely on the point about other cuts across the system. Perhaps they are actually making a profit with these flights that they could not elsewhere, but it is difficult to stomach when you local airport is down vs. 2019 on both flights and destinations. It makes it very hard to remain loyal to Southwest.

This shows how WN's strategic priorities have changed. Long ago, they competed with the bus and operated frequency and offered low fares everywhere they flew. Now they still offer that, but only where they are competing to "own" a market. In much of the rest of the network, frequency is stripped and fares have soared. Another huge change is that they used to master the "quick turnaround" on the ground and avoided delay prone airports. Seems they now want to "own" many of those delay prone airports.

jplatts · Wed May 25, 2022 3:34 pm

LotsaRunway wrote:
LBBflyer wrote:
highflyer100 wrote:
Almost all of those flights are priced under $70, with many as low as $49. Given these crazy low fares in the current fuel environment and WNs operational issues and other cuts across the system, how is this remotely justifiable? Seems like way too much capacity? Similar shuttle type flights in the northeast have significantly higher priced tickets.

I agree entirely on the point about other cuts across the system. Perhaps they are actually making a profit with these flights that they could not elsewhere, but it is difficult to stomach when you local airport is down vs. 2019 on both flights and destinations. It makes it very hard to remain loyal to Southwest.

This shows how WN's strategic priorities have changed. Long ago, they competed with the bus and operated frequency and offered low fares everywhere they flew. Now they still offer that, but only where they are competing to "own" a market. In much of the rest of the network, frequency is stripped and fares have soared. Another huge change is that they used to master the "quick turnaround" on the ground and avoided delay prone airports. Seems they now want to "own" many of those delay prone airports.

There are some more adds that WN could make out of LAS to provide additional connecting feed onto its LAS-California/Hawaii/Oregon routes, including
(a) the addition of LAS-CVG/GRR/MEM nonstop service,
(b) the return of LAS-FLL/MSP nonstop service, and
(c) increasing LAS-BHM/CLE/DSM/DTW/LIT/SDF/MCO/RDU/TPA/ICT nonstop service back to daily nonstop service.

Jshank83 · Wed May 25, 2022 4:52 pm

LBBflyer wrote:
highflyer100 wrote:
The amount of cheap intra-California flying WN is doing this summer is insane.

On Wednesday, July 6

20x SAN-SJC
20x SAN-SMF
14x SAN-OAK
14x BUR-OAK
12x BUR-SJC
12x BUR-SMF
10x LAX-OAK
9x SNA-SJC
8x SNA-OAK
7x LAX-SJC
7x LAX-SMF
7x SNA-SMF
6x BUR-SFO
6x ONT-SMF
6x ONT-OAK
5x LAX-SFO
5x ONT-SJC
5x SAN-SFO
5x LGB-SMF
5x LGB-OAK
3x LGB-SJC

Almost all of those flights are priced under $70, with many as low as $49. Given these crazy low fares in the current fuel environment and WNs operational issues and other cuts across the system, how is this remotely justifiable? Seems like way too much capacity? Similar shuttle type flights in the northeast have significantly higher priced tickets.

I agree entirely on the point about other cuts across the system. Perhaps they are actually making a profit with these flights that they could not elsewhere, but it is difficult to stomach when you local airport is down vs. 2019 on both flights and destinations. It makes it very hard to remain loyal to Southwest.

It is hard for me to believe they are making more profit than they could on routes with $300+ fares across the board that aren't that much longer of a stage length.

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