Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR
TWA772LR wrote:DEN-AMS is one I want to see, personally.
TWA772LR wrote:IAH-GYE will more than likely happen. It was done on CO not too many moons ago.
DEN-AMS is one I want to see, personally. And I think UA could stand to make SFO/LAX-BNE happen, as well as IAH-CDG come back. The later they can use as "the gateway to the southwest" for the likes of AUS, SAT and outdoorsy areas.
rjbesikof wrote:TWA772LR wrote:IAH-GYE will more than likely happen. It was done on CO not too many moons ago.
DEN-AMS is one I want to see, personally. And I think UA could stand to make SFO/LAX-BNE happen, as well as IAH-CDG come back. The later they can use as "the gateway to the southwest" for the likes of AUS, SAT and outdoorsy areas.
I agree with you on GYE. I am thinking DEN-ZRH could be the next UA long-haul route out of DEN simply because there is feed on both ends (Swiss in Zurich, United in Denver). Brisbane might be a bloodbath, especially if Qantas wants to run what would be on some days 3 flights to Brisbane this coming year. Again, I would expect ZRH to be added before CDG at IAH simply because of the connecting hubs on both ends.
rjbesikof wrote:TWA772LR wrote:IAH-GYE will more than likely happen. It was done on CO not too many moons ago.
DEN-AMS is one I want to see, personally. And I think UA could stand to make SFO/LAX-BNE happen, as well as IAH-CDG come back. The later they can use as "the gateway to the southwest" for the likes of AUS, SAT and outdoorsy areas.
I agree with you on GYE. I am thinking DEN-ZRH could be the next UA long-haul route out of DEN simply because there is feed on both ends (Swiss in Zurich, United in Denver). Brisbane might be a bloodbath, especially if Qantas wants to run what would be on some days 3 flights to Brisbane this coming year. Again, I would expect ZRH to be added before CDG at IAH simply because of the connecting hubs on both ends.
N292UX wrote:https://flightaware.com/live/flight/UAL200/history/20211231/2310Z/PGUM/PHNL
Interesting thing I saw today. UA 200 (773) took off from Guam on Jan. 1 2022, and landed in Honolulu on December 31, 2021.
N292UX wrote:https://flightaware.com/live/flight/UAL200/history/20211231/2310Z/PGUM/PHNL
Interesting thing I saw today. UA 200 (773) took off from Guam on Jan. 1 2022, and landed in Honolulu on December 31, 2021.
SCFlyer wrote:I'd say SFO-MNL/BKK (yes I went there) would likely happen than SFO/LAX-BNE at this stage. Considering the news articles of UA filing an objection against the proposed PR/AA codeshare on the basis UA couldn't get slots for a 2nd GUM-MNL service, although theoretically UA could use the slots to start MNL-SFO.
Out of MNL or BKK, it's likely the former (SFO-MNL) than BKK as BKK is a thin route approaching ULR status. But both cities have heavier VFR traffic than BNE.
BNE is very likely to dependent on State Government/Tourism body funding as assistance for UA to 'start up' the service.
*Flame away*
Source: https://www.forbes.com/sites/willhorton ... ac548a3346
portola2727 wrote:Hopefully LAX-FRA/MUC. I've been waiting for this for a while now and am frankly surprised UAL is very reluctant to launch LAX-FRA, considering that it's the only hub without service to FRA. LH's LAX-FRA service is mostly for P2P traffic and I am hoping UA, if it decides to step in, launches flights with a schedule that allows it to connect to LH's Asia services.
ContinentalEWR wrote:SCFlyer wrote:I'd say SFO-MNL/BKK (yes I went there) would likely happen than SFO/LAX-BNE at this stage. Considering the news articles of UA filing an objection against the proposed PR/AA codeshare on the basis UA couldn't get slots for a 2nd GUM-MNL service, although theoretically UA could use the slots to start MNL-SFO.
Out of MNL or BKK, it's likely the former (SFO-MNL) than BKK as BKK is a thin route approaching ULR status. But both cities have heavier VFR traffic than BNE.
BNE is very likely to dependent on State Government/Tourism body funding as assistance for UA to 'start up' the service.
*Flame away*
Source: https://www.forbes.com/sites/willhorton ... ac548a3346
Very unlikely you'll see UA or any other US airline for that matter add MNL or BKK nonstop. But let's stick with UA. MNL and BKK are very different markets for sure, but they have one thing in common. They are long stage length and neither are particularly lucrative in the premium cabin. MNL is overwhelmingly VFR. BKK, and Thailand for that matter, are mostly leisure markets for the more adventuresome American traveller.
I actually think BNE is very likely on UA metal, now more than ever, as UA and Virgin Australia are entering into a partnership. Brisbane is Australia's third largest city, UA is the largest US carrier serving Australia, and my guess is UA would fly it from SFO, not LAX.
portola2727 wrote:Hopefully LAX-FRA/MUC. I've been waiting for this for a while now and am frankly surprised UAL is very reluctant to launch LAX-FRA, considering that it's the only hub without service to FRA. LH's LAX-FRA service is mostly for P2P traffic and I am hoping UA, if it decides to step in, launches flights with a schedule that allows it to connect to LH's Asia services.
MIflyer12 wrote:
Seriously, LAX-Asia via Europe?! Worthless.
cosyr wrote:Does anyone have any predictions about how the partnership with Virgin Australia is going to fit in with Air New Zealand, after COVID? Or is that the point, that UA had to form this new partnership, because of the lack of connections through New Zealand right now?
cosyr wrote:Does anyone have any predictions about how the partnership with Virgin Australia is going to fit in with Air New Zealand, after COVID? Or is that the point, that UA had to form this new partnership, because of the lack of connections through New Zealand right now?
adamblang wrote:
Why pay a Oneworld airline to give your customers an inferior intra-Austrlia experience when you can have a non-aligned airline do so while at least fully particpating in MileagePlus?
LAXdude1023 wrote:I was looking at the list of terminated regional routes and I had some thoughts and where this may put future connectivity.
1) Small airports within 100 miles of larger airports are up for termination - GRK, CLL, LAN, AZO, CWA, EVV, and RST.
2) Communities that produce very small levels of O&D: PIR, ATY, and TWF.
3) Airports where UA had a very small token presence: MLU and EVV.
Based on that, what regional markets would we find at risk? The ones I think are more stable would be:
1) Markets that have high levels of O&D to the hub: DEN-FAR/FAT, IAH-AMA/XNA, ORD-TYS/HSV, etc.
2) Markets that high good demand and isolated from other major cities: GJT, RDD, RDM, etc.
So has UA finished cutting regional routes?
cosyr wrote:Does anyone have any predictions about how the partnership with Virgin Australia is going to fit in with Air New Zealand, after COVID? Or is that the point, that UA had to form this new partnership, because of the lack of connections through New Zealand right now?
LAXdude1023 wrote:I was looking at the list of terminated regional routes and I had some thoughts and where this may put future connectivity.
1) Small airports within 100 miles of larger airports are up for termination - GRK, CLL, LAN, AZO, CWA, EVV, and RST.
2) Communities that produce very small levels of O&D: PIR, ATY, and TWF.
3) Airports where UA had a very small token presence: MLU and EVV.
Based on that, what regional markets would we find at risk? The ones I think are more stable would be:
1) Markets that have high levels of O&D to the hub: DEN-FAR/FAT, IAH-AMA/XNA, ORD-TYS/HSV, etc.
2) Markets that high good demand and isolated from other major cities: GJT, RDD, RDM, etc.
So has UA finished cutting regional routes?
flyfresno wrote:LAXdude1023 wrote:I was looking at the list of terminated regional routes and I had some thoughts and where this may put future connectivity.
1) Small airports within 100 miles of larger airports are up for termination - GRK, CLL, LAN, AZO, CWA, EVV, and RST.
2) Communities that produce very small levels of O&D: PIR, ATY, and TWF.
3) Airports where UA had a very small token presence: MLU and EVV.
Based on that, what regional markets would we find at risk? The ones I think are more stable would be:
1) Markets that have high levels of O&D to the hub: DEN-FAR/FAT, IAH-AMA/XNA, ORD-TYS/HSV, etc.
2) Markets that high good demand and isolated from other major cities: GJT, RDD, RDM, etc.
So has UA finished cutting regional routes?
Considering that UA has a mainline flight FAT-DEN for most of the year, I can't see it ever being considered as "at risk"...
SCFlyer wrote:adamblang wrote:Why pay a Oneworld airline to give your customers an inferior intra-Austrlia experience when you can have a non-aligned airline do so while at least fully particpating in MileagePlus?
Not sure about that one. QF at least does provide a snack and drink on all flights (included in all fares including the cheapest Y bucket).
Since their emergence from Voluntary Administration (Australian Chapter 11), VA has since repositioned as a mid-tier airline with BoB Y in-cabin service with a Full Service J cabin. VA has also moved away from complimentary checked luggage in all fares by introducing a "Economy Lite" like carry-on fare.
The only inclusion in all VA fares, including the cheapest Y bucket fare, are a complimentary inflight non-alcoholic drink (Water, Tea, Juice, Coffee). All other drinks and meals/snacks are now BoB in Y.
LAXdude1023 wrote:I was looking at the list of terminated regional routes and I had some thoughts and where this may put future connectivity.
1) Small airports within 100 miles of larger airports are up for termination - GRK, CLL, LAN, AZO, CWA, EVV, and RST.
2) Communities that produce very small levels of O&D: PIR, ATY, and TWF.
joeblow10 wrote:At some point this decade I am guessing there will be a revamp of the EAS system, which will help some of the smaller markets survive, even if it’s thru a carrier like Denver Air Connection or Cape Air. It will also probably bring back markets that are extremely isolated but non-EAS back into the fold - EKO is one example
The reality is many very isolated communities will be taken off the map if it isn’t - VEL and PIR are perfect examples. At the same time, I would expect some of the “less necessary” communities to be removed from the list. Expecting someone to drive 1-1.5 hours for commercial air service is one thing, 3+ is another. And we all know congressmen will not be happy to see service slashed to the cities they represent.
I certainly don’t think UA or any airline for that matter is finished cutting routes. If anything, they will slash more and more for use as leverage in any regulation reform they seek
atrude777 wrote:Paducah, Kentucky's (PAH) Bid is up for Summer 2022, so we will see if SkyWest chooses to rebid, they've been there for over 10 years!
Alex
LAXdude1023 wrote:atrude777 wrote:Paducah, Kentucky's (PAH) Bid is up for Summer 2022, so we will see if SkyWest chooses to rebid, they've been there for over 10 years!
Alex
I dont know this for certain, but I would think ORD-PAH would be a good route for Chicago travelers looking to get to destinations in Southern Illinois. I would think there would be some value to that.
atrude777 wrote:joeblow10 wrote:At some point this decade I am guessing there will be a revamp of the EAS system, which will help some of the smaller markets survive, even if it’s thru a carrier like Denver Air Connection or Cape Air. It will also probably bring back markets that are extremely isolated but non-EAS back into the fold - EKO is one example
The reality is many very isolated communities will be taken off the map if it isn’t - VEL and PIR are perfect examples. At the same time, I would expect some of the “less necessary” communities to be removed from the list. Expecting someone to drive 1-1.5 hours for commercial air service is one thing, 3+ is another. And we all know congressmen will not be happy to see service slashed to the cities they represent.
I certainly don’t think UA or any airline for that matter is finished cutting routes. If anything, they will slash more and more for use as leverage in any regulation reform they seek
I don't disagree there could be a revamp of EAS, but not because these markets are failing for United.
United has not ended ANY EAS route by breaking the contract or pulling out before the contract ended.
In the case of PIR and ATY, SkyWest Airlines lost the contract and DOT did not choose them. Even after battling and filing lawsuits, SkyWest lost and was forced to pull out due to the loss of the contract.
TWF also wasn't EAS for United but was a grant, this would line up with cities like San Angelo, Texas and such.
EKO Airport is served right now by SkyWest as Delta Connection with services to SLC.
Whether SkyWest will continue to bid for EAS routes into 2022 will be the question....
Paducah, Kentucky's (PAH) Bid is up for Summer 2022, so we will see if SkyWest chooses to rebid, they've been there for over 10 years!
Alex
Gillbilly wrote:Hawaii flights question:
SFO to KOA is currently an even mix of 737s and 753s. Eventually it switches to all 737s.
SFO to LIH is all 737s now. On Feb 11 UA1111 switches to a 752.
Do you think these changes are actually real and going to occur? Planning a trip and I love the 757s but hate the 737s. Thanks.
ericm2031 wrote:Gillbilly wrote:Hawaii flights question:
SFO to KOA is currently an even mix of 737s and 753s. Eventually it switches to all 737s.
SFO to LIH is all 737s now. On Feb 11 UA1111 switches to a 752.
Do you think these changes are actually real and going to occur? Planning a trip and I love the 757s but hate the 737s. Thanks.
Depends how far out you are looking. The schedule through March and even April is firming up, assuming COVID doesn’t derail things again.
rjbesikof wrote:Big year for long haul intl flights:
-IAD-AMM/BER/HND
-EWR-HND/BGO/PDL/PMI/TFS/NCE
-ORD-MXP/ZRH
-DEN-MUC
-SFO-BLR
-LAX-HND
-BOS-LHR
What I hope to see:
-More intl routes out of DEN with the new gates opening up.
-More India flights (hopefully HYD, MAA).
-GYE service now that Ecuador has an Open Skies with the U.S.
atrude777 wrote:joeblow10 wrote:At some point this decade I am guessing there will be a revamp of the EAS system, which will help some of the smaller markets survive, even if it’s thru a carrier like Denver Air Connection or Cape Air. It will also probably bring back markets that are extremely isolated but non-EAS back into the fold - EKO is one example
The reality is many very isolated communities will be taken off the map if it isn’t - VEL and PIR are perfect examples. At the same time, I would expect some of the “less necessary” communities to be removed from the list. Expecting someone to drive 1-1.5 hours for commercial air service is one thing, 3+ is another. And we all know congressmen will not be happy to see service slashed to the cities they represent.
I certainly don’t think UA or any airline for that matter is finished cutting routes. If anything, they will slash more and more for use as leverage in any regulation reform they seek
I don't disagree there could be a revamp of EAS, but not because these markets are failing for United.
United has not ended ANY EAS route by breaking the contract or pulling out before the contract ended.
In the case of PIR and ATY, SkyWest Airlines lost the contract and DOT did not choose them. Even after battling and filing lawsuits, SkyWest lost and was forced to pull out due to the loss of the contract.
TWF also wasn't EAS for United but was a grant, this would line up with cities like San Angelo, Texas and such.
EKO Airport is served right now by SkyWest as Delta Connection with services to SLC.
Whether SkyWest will continue to bid for EAS routes into 2022 will be the question....
Paducah, Kentucky's (PAH) Bid is up for Summer 2022, so we will see if SkyWest chooses to rebid, they've been there for over 10 years!
Alex
sprxUSA wrote:atrude777 wrote:joeblow10 wrote:At some point this decade I am guessing there will be a revamp of the EAS system, which will help some of the smaller markets survive, even if it’s thru a carrier like Denver Air Connection or Cape Air. It will also probably bring back markets that are extremely isolated but non-EAS back into the fold - EKO is one example
The reality is many very isolated communities will be taken off the map if it isn’t - VEL and PIR are perfect examples. At the same time, I would expect some of the “less necessary” communities to be removed from the list. Expecting someone to drive 1-1.5 hours for commercial air service is one thing, 3+ is another. And we all know congressmen will not be happy to see service slashed to the cities they represent.
I certainly don’t think UA or any airline for that matter is finished cutting routes. If anything, they will slash more and more for use as leverage in any regulation reform they seek
I don't disagree there could be a revamp of EAS, but not because these markets are failing for United.
United has not ended ANY EAS route by breaking the contract or pulling out before the contract ended.
In the case of PIR and ATY, SkyWest Airlines lost the contract and DOT did not choose them. Even after battling and filing lawsuits, SkyWest lost and was forced to pull out due to the loss of the contract.
TWF also wasn't EAS for United but was a grant, this would line up with cities like San Angelo, Texas and such.
EKO Airport is served right now by SkyWest as Delta Connection with services to SLC.
Whether SkyWest will continue to bid for EAS routes into 2022 will be the question....
Paducah, Kentucky's (PAH) Bid is up for Summer 2022, so we will see if SkyWest chooses to rebid, they've been there for over 10 years!
Alex
Actually, Skywest was not forced from PIR and ATY. Just the opposite. They stayed even after the new winner (Denver Air Connection) started up both cities. I assume just to lower DAC revenue from the cities and be a thorn in their sides.
adamblang wrote:cosyr wrote:Does anyone have any predictions about how the partnership with Virgin Australia is going to fit in with Air New Zealand, after COVID? Or is that the point, that UA had to form this new partnership, because of the lack of connections through New Zealand right now?
Well, just for fun, I punched these cities into United.com for travel from Chicago in the middle of July to see what comes back:
- Brisbane
- Perth
- Adelaide
- Gold Coast
- Newcastle
- Canberra
- Sunshine Coast
- Geelong
- Hobart
- Townsville
- Cairns
- Darwin
- Toowoomba
- Bendigo
- Allbury
Every single one of them came back with United transpacific connecting to Qantas intra-Australia itineraries. Not one came back with an Air New Zealand connection over Auckland.
Granted, COVID restrictions might not be providing the most representative Air New Zealand schedule.
But I imagine the Virgin Australia codeshare is more about replacing Qantas and less having anything to do with Air New Zealand.
For instance:
- United's been interlining with Qantas (and selling Qantas on United.com) as long as I can remember. Those passengers got no MileagePlus earnings and no MileagePlus benefits.
- If you wanted to fly from Brisbane to Adelaide and earn MileagePlus miles in the past, you had to connect in New Zealand. Now you'll be able to fly nonstop on Virgin Australia.
Why pay a Oneworld airline to give your customers an inferior intra-Austrlia experience when you can have a non-aligned airline do so while at least fully particpating in MileagePlus?
airzim wrote:Going via AKL adds lots of extra distance to the downline segment, and hence UA gives up more revenue to NZ (since I assume the trans-Tasman is not covered under the JV).
ScorpioMC3 wrote:UAL 1 SFO-SIN resumes tonight 05JAN. No word on another suspension based on Singapore's freeze of new VTL ticket sales.
FlyHossD wrote:ScorpioMC3 wrote:UAL 1 SFO-SIN resumes tonight 05JAN. No word on another suspension based on Singapore's freeze of new VTL ticket sales.
Just looked at UAL's website and it's still showing as departing tonight, so I'm doubtful that there will be a last minute suspension. If it were going to happen, it probably already would have been cancelled for tonight.
TWA772LR wrote:rjbesikof wrote:TWA772LR wrote:IAH-GYE will more than likely happen. It was done on CO not too many moons ago.
DEN-AMS is one I want to see, personally. And I think UA could stand to make SFO/LAX-BNE happen, as well as IAH-CDG come back. The later they can use as "the gateway to the southwest" for the likes of AUS, SAT and outdoorsy areas.
I agree with you on GYE. I am thinking DEN-ZRH could be the next UA long-haul route out of DEN simply because there is feed on both ends (Swiss in Zurich, United in Denver). Brisbane might be a bloodbath, especially if Qantas wants to run what would be on some days 3 flights to Brisbane this coming year. Again, I would expect ZRH to be added before CDG at IAH simply because of the connecting hubs on both ends.
Interesting you mention ZRH. A.net had also mentioned IAH-ZRH before. Houston is also huge in medical and biotech. Granted the European hub for that is GVA, ZRH would be the next best thing for air service for the industry with feed on both ends, it could possibly even edge out CDG for IAH service.
I believe IAH has better chances than DEN for CDG and ZRH, but DEN for sure has a better shot at DUB than Houston does. I live in Denver but I'm an IAH fanboy lol
manny wrote:Why does UA always treat DEN like the bastard child of its network. With the kind of traffic that DEN commands there should be a lot more international connections. Would love to see more transatlantic and atleast one nonstop Indian flight from DEN.
manny wrote:Why does UA always treat DEN like the bastard child of its network. With the kind of traffic that DEN commands there should be a lot more international connections. Would love to see more transatlantic and atleast one nonstop Indian flight from DEN.