Welcome to the Boeing 747-400 Passenger Fleet Movements / Write-Off / Retirements / Scrapping Thread - 2022. Please continue your discussion and to post your updates below.

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Boeing 747-400 Passenger Fleet Tracking/Retirements Thread - 2021

Did the recent sale of A6-HMM 28551/1131 Boeing 747-48E(M) of Dubai Air Wing to Air Atlantic Icelandic signify a
move away from big VIP AC? Or was this just the normal evolution to the highest and best use of a low hour Combi Queen during the cargo bonanza? Have to assume this combi will see cargo use plus preighter?

This is from CH Aviation about the Combi going to Air Atlanta Icelandic

Air Atlanta Icelandic (CC, Reykjavik Keflavik) has added its first B747-400(M) combi freighter on dry-lease from JetOneX, the Icelandic register has shown.

At 24.3 years of age, TF-AMH (msn 28551) was formerly operated as a government transport by the Dubai Air Wing (DUB, Dubai Int'l) as A6-HMM, the ch-aviation fleets history module shows. JetOneX is also planning to acquire sistership A6-COM (msn 25074). It is not clear if the second aircraft will also be placed with Air Atlanta Icelandic. The carrier did not respond to ch-aviation's request for comment.

The two B747-400(M)s constitute half of the type's global fleet. The remaining two are also owned by JetOneX and placed with Bermuda's Longtail Aviation (LGT, Bermuda), although they have remained inactive since their acquisition by the American ACMI/charter carrier.

Air Atlanta Iceland's fleet is built around the B747 Family with three B747-400s, one B747-400(BCF), five B747-400(BDSF), three B747-400(FSCD)s, and now the B747-400(M). It also operates one A340-300 and two A340-600s in a makeshift freighter configuration. The carrier's Maltese sister, Air Atlanta Europe (AAE, Malta Int'l), operates one more B747-400.

Seen at Kemble today;

B747 G-BYGA hole in forward fuselage
B747 F-GTUI no undercarriage, cargo door or radome (102745 FH on nose). Hole in rear fuselage

I believe that Rossiya is still flying those in pax config, ex-United or ex-JAL. I could be wrong about who those came from.

American 767 wrote:

I believe that Rossiya is still flying those in pax config, ex-United or ex-JAL. I could be wrong about who those came from.

Due to current events, I would say Rossiya's pax 744's may not be in service for much longer. Spare part availability, lack of airframe support from Boeing and disappearing demand for international travel will definitely mark the end for their 747 service im sure.

James42 wrote:

American 767 wrote:

I believe that Rossiya is still flying those in pax config, ex-United or ex-JAL. I could be wrong about who those came from.

Due to current events, I would say Rossiya's pax 744's may not be in service for much longer. Spare part availability, lack of airframe support from Boeing and disappearing demand for international travel will definitely mark the end for their 747 service im sure.

While I agree with your first points, Rossiya's 747s almost exclusively fly on domestic holiday routes to Crimea and Sochi, and the occasional flights from Moscow to the far east.

Nope… Rossiya’s 747’s we’re Always flying down to Hurghada and Sharm.
Infact XLC is there now, with XLF just about to arrive in DXB
Now they’ll end their days in the Russian wilderness awaiting parts.

Apparently AI is not gonna use its 744s on repatriation efforts due to a lack of pilots...
https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/busin ... 84441.html

But couldn't they lease another crew from another airline who is qualified for the 747? The evacuation of Indians from Ukraine is widely important and it would obviously make sense to use the largest airliner in the Indian fleet. Not only that but the 747 series is the fastest subsonic airliner in service as well.

Boeing757100 wrote:

Apparently AI is not gonna use its 744s on repatriation efforts due to a lack of pilots...
https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/busin ... 84441.html

But couldn't they lease another crew from another airline who is qualified for the 747? The evacuation of Indians from Ukraine is widely important and it would obviously make sense to use the largest airliner in the Indian fleet. Not only that but the 747 series is the fastest subsonic airliner in service as well.

Why would speed be relevant. Once they're airborne and out of there, they're safe as far as I'm concerned. They can fly as slow as they like at that point.

Boeing757100 wrote:

Apparently AI is not gonna use its 744s on repatriation efforts due to a lack of pilots...
https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/busin ... 84441.html

But couldn't they lease another crew from another airline who is qualified for the 747? The evacuation of Indians from Ukraine is widely important and it would obviously make sense to use the largest airliner in the Indian fleet. Not only that but the 747 series is the fastest subsonic airliner in service as well.

Depending on insurance, AOC and union rules, such ideas while good, are often too complicated to become reality.

YMHBSpotting wrote:

James42 wrote:

American 767 wrote:

I believe that Rossiya is still flying those in pax config, ex-United or ex-JAL. I could be wrong about who those came from.

Due to current events, I would say Rossiya's pax 744's may not be in service for much longer. Spare part availability, lack of airframe support from Boeing and disappearing demand for international travel will definitely mark the end for their 747 service im sure.

While I agree with your first points, Rossiya's 747s almost exclusively fly on domestic holiday routes to Crimea and Sochi, and the occasional flights from Moscow to the far east.

Point of order -- there's nothing "domestic" in flights from Russia to Crimea. The peninsula is still occupied by Russia, but it doesn't change its status as Ukrainian territory.
Flights to Sochi are indeed domestic.

James42 wrote:

American 767 wrote:

I believe that Rossiya is still flying those in pax config, ex-United or ex-JAL. I could be wrong about who those came from.

Due to current events, I would say Rossiya's pax 744's may not be in service for much longer. Spare part availability, lack of airframe support from Boeing and disappearing demand for international travel will definitely mark the end for their 747 service im sure.

if I'm correct they're planning to retire them at 2024

EAGaviation wrote:

James42 wrote:

Due to current events, I would say Rossiya's pax 744's may not be in service for much longer. Spare part availability, lack of airframe support from Boeing and disappearing demand for international travel will definitely mark the end for their 747 service im sure.

if I'm correct they're planning to retire them at 2024

Absolutely correct. Boeing 747-400 was scheduled for retirement anyway. Majority of airframes are (or, at least, were) to leave as soon as in 2023, and two remaining 747s are/were to go in 2024 (link, in Russian).

Remember, these are ex-Transaero airframes, and by 2015, which was the final year of Transaero operations, Boeing 747-400s were already on their way out. Transaero started the year with 20 747-400s and got rid of two before the collapse. If I'm not mistaken, one of them went to Kabo Air, and there should be a picture in the database available. Not sure about the other one. The initial plan was to replace 747-400s with Boeing 747-8 on 1:2 basis, but it never materialized.

Extrapolating the 2015 retirement rate, operations of Boeing 747-400 in Russia would have ended in 2024 anyway.

The only reason why the operations of Boeing 747-400 continued in Rossiya after collapse of Transaero was, in my opinion, the fact that these aircrafts are owned by Russian lessor, namely Sberbank Leasing (link, in Russian). Sberbank likely had no knowledge on what to do with such assets and negotiated the placement of Jumbos with Aeroflot group.

LebedevXD wrote:

EAGaviation wrote:

James42 wrote:

Due to current events, I would say Rossiya's pax 744's may not be in service for much longer. Spare part availability, lack of airframe support from Boeing and disappearing demand for international travel will definitely mark the end for their 747 service im sure.

if I'm correct they're planning to retire them at 2024

Absolutely correct. Boeing 747-400 was scheduled for retirement anyway. Majority of airframes are (or, at least, were) to leave as soon as in 2023, and two remaining 747s are/were to go in 2024 (link, in Russian).

Remember, these are ex-Transaero airframes, and by 2015, which was the final year of Transaero operations, Boeing 747-400s were already on their way out. Transaero started the year with 20 747-400s and got rid of two before the collapse. If I'm not mistaken, one of them went to Kabo Air, and there should be a picture in the database available. Not sure about the other one. The initial plan was to replace 747-400s with Boeing 747-8 on 1:2 basis, but it never materialized.

Extrapolating the 2015 retirement rate, operations of Boeing 747-400 in Russia would have ended in 2024 anyway.

The only reason why the operations of Boeing 747-400 continued in Rossiya after collapse of Transaero was, in my opinion, the fact that these aircrafts are owned by Russian lessor, namely Sberbank Leasing (link, in Russian). Sberbank likely had no knowledge on what to do with such assets and negotiated the placement of Jumbos with Aeroflot group.

Interesting, so I guess the writing was on the wall for the 747's anyway. I can't see any of them making it out of Russia in one piece once their leases are up unfortunately.

Phosphorus wrote:

YMHBSpotting wrote:

James42 wrote:

Due to current events, I would say Rossiya's pax 744's may not be in service for much longer. Spare part availability, lack of airframe support from Boeing and disappearing demand for international travel will definitely mark the end for their 747 service im sure.

While I agree with your first points, Rossiya's 747s almost exclusively fly on domestic holiday routes to Crimea and Sochi, and the occasional flights from Moscow to the far east.

Point of order -- there's nothing "domestic" in flights from Russia to Crimea. The peninsula is still occupied by Russia, but it doesn't change its status as Ukrainian territory.
Flights to Sochi are indeed domestic.

While I agree the occupation is completely illegal and inherently wrong, it's a de facto part of Russia, in terms of travel at least, and is treated as such by Russian airlines. In practice if you're travelling from Russia to Crimea you don't need a passport, but if you're travelling from Belarus, for example, you do.

YMHBSpotting wrote:

Phosphorus wrote:

YMHBSpotting wrote:

While I agree with your first points, Rossiya's 747s almost exclusively fly on domestic holiday routes to Crimea and Sochi, and the occasional flights from Moscow to the far east.

Point of order -- there's nothing "domestic" in flights from Russia to Crimea. The peninsula is still occupied by Russia, but it doesn't change its status as Ukrainian territory.
Flights to Sochi are indeed domestic.

While I agree the occupation is completely illegal and inherently wrong, it's a de facto part of Russia, in terms of travel at least, and is treated as such by Russian airlines. In practice if you're travelling from Russia to Crimea you don't need a passport, but if you're travelling from Belarus, for example, you do.

Well, that's the point. Traveling from Russia to Crimea you need russian domestic ID/"Internal passport", and yes, you are breaking the law in the act.
Not that "russia breaks laws" is in short supply for some time now.

Mahan Air has reactivated one of their 747-400s:
https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=4

EP-MEE, ex EP-MNA, ex N176UA, built in 1990, acquired by Mahan Air in 2008.

In other news Rossiya has reregistered their 747-400s to the Russian register following its "theft" by the Putin war regime.

na wrote:

Mahan Air has reactivated one of their 747-400s:
https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=4

EP-MEE, ex EP-MNA, ex N176UA, built in 1990, acquired by Mahan Air in 2008.

In other news Rossiya has reregistered their 747-400s to the Russian register following its "theft" by the Putin war regime.

Apparently stored since January/February 2012. Amazing.

na wrote:

In other news Rossiya has reregistered their 747-400s to the Russian register following its "theft".

Boeing 747-400s operated by Rossiya are owned by Russian lessors, namely Sberbank Leasing, VTB Leasing and VEB Leasing (link).
Please clarify what You mean by "theft" in regards to those aircrafts.

Went to Kemble again today.

F-GTUI is now gone, last seen on 5 March, and believed scrapped by the 16th.

G-CIVN has now taken it' place in the scrapping area.

How many 747s are left at Kemble now?

G-CIVB preserved.

G-CIVN and G-BYGA in the scrap area.

Down by Rapid Racking are Saudi TF-AAD and TF-AAH. Plus G-MKGA which is a 200F.

Is HL7428 finally retired?

LebedevXD wrote:

na wrote:

In other news Rossiya has reregistered their 747-400s to the Russian register following its "theft".

Boeing 747-400s operated by Rossiya are owned by Russian lessors, namely Sberbank Leasing, VTB Leasing and VEB Leasing (link).
Please clarify what You mean by "theft" in regards to those aircrafts.

7 out of 9 appear to be still 'EI' registered with plans to transfer them to the 'RA' register. Whether that's a genuine transfer via the above Russian leasing agencies or this so called "theft" I don't know...

https://m.planespotters.net/airline/Ros ... n-Airlines

CoronadoConrad wrote:

Is HL7428 finally retired?

not sure, it flew around Seoul a few days ago. Not sure if it was a test flight or mechanical failure mid-takeoff. https://flightaware.com/live/flight/HL7428

na wrote:

Mahan Air has reactivated one of their 747-400s:
https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb. ... av4&page=4

EP-MEE, ex EP-MNA, ex N176UA, built in 1990, acquired by Mahan Air in 2008.

In other news Rossiya has reregistered their 747-400s to the Russian register following its "theft" by the Putin war regime.

Glad to see another -422 going

The ex-B-18702 B744F that was stored in VCV for ten years has apparently been reactivated and is now flying as N575CL.

N5301D wrote:

The ex-B-18702 B744F that was stored in VCV for ten years has apparently been reactivated and is now flying as N575CL.

Its sistership B18703 is getting reactivated too
ln 1254 N297CL went to MZJ Jan, presumably to get ready for trip to TPE for further work like N575CL

Surprised this hasn't been mentioned, TF-AAK (formerly Air France, Saudia, and Air Atlanta), most famously 'Ed Force One' when she toured with Iron Maiden and Bruce piloted her, flew to Kemble today for scrapping.....

https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/tf-aak

LGWGate49 wrote:

Surprised this hasn't been mentioned, TF-AAK (formerly Air France, Saudia, and Air Atlanta), most famously 'Ed Force One' when she toured with Iron Maiden and Bruce piloted her, flew to Kemble today for scrapping.....

https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/tf-aak

wow, I guess they're done with her cargo flights.

And Air India says goodbye to the Queen of the Skies

https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/india ... 21731.html

another one...

The EX-AI birds will most likely be scrapped, but where? Or maybe they will sit in storage for 10 years, not unlike that MD-80 in Raipur...

6Echo wrote:

And Air India says goodbye to the Queen of the Skies

https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/india ... 21731.html

Yup, looks like it:

https://www.ch-aviation.com/portal/news/114982

The Indian Directorate General of Civil Aviation (DGCA) has deregistered all four B747-400s formerly operated by Air India (AI, Mumbai Int'l) as the now privately-owned carrier seeks to roll over to a more efficient fleet, sources told the PTI news agency.

VT-ESO (msn 27165), VT-ESP (msn 27214), VT-EVA (ms 28094), and VT-EVB (msn 28095) were retired from commercial service in 2020 and 2021. Air India's last scheduled B747 flight was on March 10, 2021, when VT-EVA flew from Delhi Int'l to Mumbai Int'l as AI863. Since then, all four have been parked at Mumbai airport, although the airline denied plans to retire the type in 2021.

The Boeing quadjets had a dual role as passenger aircraft on Air India's scheduled network and as VIP transports for the government. At 26.9 years of age on average, the subfleet is by far the oldest in Air India's network. The ch-aviation fleets advanced module shows that other widebody types operated by the airline are B777-200(LR)s (three units), B777-300(ER)s (thirteen), and B787-8s (twenty-seven).

Air India is currently undergoing restructuring under the ownership of Tata Sons.

Certainly an end of an era after 50 years of 747 service for Air India.

Is the very useful database with pictures showing the latest 744 pax in service still available ? With LH using 744 PAX in full service made me wonder.

Air Atlanta Icelandic ferried their PAX 744 (TF-AAM) to Leige Belgium today. That plane used to be leased by Saudia before returning lease and being stored for last 26 months at Jeddah and then Sharjah. Will that aircraft be scrapped in Liege?

The other two 744 PAX (AH-AZA and AH-AZB) that Saudia leases are owned by Air Atlanta Europe, Does Saudia use these birds for charters?

Has VH-OEJ been scrapped by Kallita?

TF-AAM just finished a C-Check in SHJ and is being ferried to LGG to be reregistered to Air Atlanta Europe as 9H-AZC. It will be joining 9H-AZA and 9H-AZB for Hajj and Umrah flights for Saudia.

jimmy9irons wrote:

Has VH-OEJ been scrapped by Kallita?

Not yet but according to insider info on the air cargo thread, that will be its fate.

aristoenigma wrote:

Air Atlanta Icelandic ferried their PAX 744 (TF-AAM) to Leige Belgium today. That plane used to be leased by Saudia before returning lease and being stored for last 26 months at Jeddah and then Sharjah. Will that aircraft be scrapped in Liege?

The other two 744 PAX (AH-AZA and AH-AZB) that Saudia leases are owned by Air Atlanta Europe, Does Saudia use these birds for charters?

if it went to liege then it's either there for inspection/repairs and/or to go into operation, so no idea but probably not.

6Echo wrote:

And Air India says goodbye to the Queen of the Skies

https://www.moneycontrol.com/news/india ... 21731.html

Wow, you'd think they could actually include the right picture for the story. Yea, generic subtitle, but geeze.

Spacepope wrote:

jimmy9irons wrote:

Has VH-OEJ been scrapped by Kallita?

Not yet but according to insider info on the air cargo thread, that will be its fate.

It hardly seems worth the conversion by Kallita and one of the youngest 747-400s?

jimmy9irons wrote:

Spacepope wrote:

jimmy9irons wrote:

Has VH-OEJ been scrapped by Kallita?

Not yet but according to insider info on the air cargo thread, that will be its fate.

It hardly seems worth the conversion by Kallita and one of the youngest 747-400s?

It's also one of only 6 pax 747-400ERs built, all purchased by QF, so I suspect that complicates the conversion process vs the normal 747-400 non ERs.

Jokeair wrote:

TF-AAM just finished a C-Check in SHJ and is being ferried to LGG to be reregistered to Air Atlanta Europe as 9H-AZC. It will be joining 9H-AZA and 9H-AZB for Hajj and Umrah flights for Saudia.

Thanks for that. Makes sense that the three PAX 744s of Air Atlanta will be registered to Air Atlanta Europe arm and dedicated as Hajj and Umrah fliers by Saudia. The Saudia internet site does not advertise there still being 747s in the fleet. That is it for Saudi Queen service other than the 744 and 743 VIPs of the Saudi Royals.

https://www.controller.com/listing/for- ... t-aircraft

This site shows one of the retired Japan Air Force One 744s for sale again. It and its sister 744 was previously reported to have been sold to Cargojet in 2019 for the eight low-time GE engines. Has Cargojet decided to resell one of the 744s and its 4 engines?
The agent CSDS is the same agent that advertised N458BJ for sale for quite awhile along with a nonexistent SCD.

aristoenigma wrote:

https://www.controller.com/listing/for-sale/215575615/1991-boeing-747-400-jet-aircraft

This site shows one of the retired Japan Air Force One 744s for sale again. It and its sister 744 was previously reported to have been sold to Cargojet in 2019 for the eight low-time GE engines. Has Cargojet decided to resell one of the 744s and its 4 engines?
The agent CSDS is the same agent that advertised N458BJ for sale for quite awhile along with a nonexistent SCD.

The engines in the ad are described as :

GENERAL ELEC
All GE CF6-80C2B1F Engines.
Engine#1 1700 Cycles to the first limiter,
Engine#2 600 Cycles to the first limiter,
Engine#3 6000 Cycles to the first limiter,
Engine#4 2000 Cycles to the first limiter

Does this mean the engines are replacement engines? Unsure what is meant by cycles to the first limiter.

PhilMcCrackin wrote:

jimmy9irons wrote:

Spacepope wrote:

Not yet but according to insider info on the air cargo thread, that will be its fate.

It hardly seems worth the conversion by Kallita and one of the youngest 747-400s?

It's also one of only 6 pax 747-400ERs built, all purchased by QF, so I suspect that complicates the conversion process vs the normal 747-400 non ERs.

The 400ER had extra fuel tanks and modifications to the airframe and landing gear. It seems as if there were a significant amount of modifications to fly 500 miles further or carry an extra 15 thousand lbs of payload.
Kalitta has a YouTube video titans of cnc and it shows a line 10-15 747’s that they use to harvest parts. I suspect they bought this one for the engines only. That’s were most of the value is.Delta bought from Boeing Ex Ethiopian MD-11’s and scrapped them for engines to service their 767’s. There seems to be a strong market for already converted or factory built 747’s no matter how long they have been stored zero market pax models. It must be an expensive and lengthy process to do a cargo conversion. If there was a market the ex DL 747’s were delivered new 1999-2003 and were parked in 2014 with 6k cycles and 50k hours. I’m sure there are similar examples parked with no interest.

On YouTube Sam Chui has a video of 747’s that were in the hangar for 4 months just to get it a ferry permit to go in for HMV. I think those were bought by National.

Looks like HL7428 is back in service after a maintenance check in Taipei. I assume it will be retired in May of 2023 once it is 25 years old in line with South Korean policy on aircraft age. Does anyone have any further info why they still fly a single example?

nuke wrote:

Looks like HL7428 is back in service after a maintenance check in Taipei. I assume it will be retired in May of 2023 once it is 25 years old in line with South Korean policy on aircraft age. Does anyone have any further info why they still fly a single example?

OZ still still has a fleet of 11 744F, so from a maintenance/pilots scheduling perspective its just one frame in a 12-frame fleet, not an orphan.