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LAXintl
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ICAO approves creation of Doha FIR

Tue Mar 29, 2022 11:55 pm

ICAO Council gave final approval for the establishment of the Doha Flight Information Region giving Qatar sovereignty of its airspace and control of traffic over portions of the Gulf previously managed by Bahrain and Iran.

The GCC blockade starting in 2017 (which ICAO found was a breach of the Chicago Convention) pushed Qatar to formally request ICAO establishment of the Doha FIR as its upper airspace fell entirely under Bahrain FIR.

The phased transition will see Qatar fully take over its new blocks of airspace by 2024.

https://www.dohanews.co/qatar-airspace- ... n-history/

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https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FOtJuDHXEAk ... name=large
 
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mercure1
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Re: ICAO approves creation of Doha FIR

Wed Mar 30, 2022 2:14 am

Good, Qatar not some sleepy fishing village anymore and certainly should be able to control its airspace.

Bit ironic Bahrain managed Qatar's airspace as the emirate gained its original independence and British protectorate recognition from Bahrain after the 1867-1868 Qatari-Bahrain war.
 
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lesfalls
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Re: ICAO approves creation of Doha FIR

Wed Mar 30, 2022 8:41 am

Bahrain’s airspace is massive considering it covers much of Saudi if you look at the picture above.

Anyone know why such a big airspace for such a small country?
 
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zeke
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Re: ICAO approves creation of Doha FIR

Wed Mar 30, 2022 11:10 am

I think it goes way back when so many airlines before the 747-400 would go via BAH for a fuel stop.
 
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Polot
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Re: ICAO approves creation of Doha FIR

Wed Mar 30, 2022 11:13 am

lesfalls wrote:
Bahrain’s airspace is massive considering it covers much of Saudi if you look at the picture above.

Anyone know why such a big airspace for such a small country?


zeke wrote:
I think it goes way back when so many airlines before the 747-400 would go via BAH for a fuel stop.


And that all goes back to Bahrain having much more influence, power, and traffic in the region prior to the rise of Dubai and Doha.
 
Tristarsteve
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Re: ICAO approves creation of Doha FIR

Wed Mar 30, 2022 3:18 pm

When I went to work in Bahrain in 1976, Bahrain was by far the most important airport in the area. DOH AUH DXB and MCT were all much smaller. The BAH FIR then went all the way from Iraq to the border with BOM. I had some friends who worked for the FIR ATC, and often went to visit them on nightshift. They lived in a little hut below the BAH Control Tower. Two controllers on shift at night controlled the whole area, and they tried to give direct routings to all.
BAH was very busy at night. There were six gates with airbridges, and they were all full of aircraft from 1800 to 0600, mostly B747-200 refuelling.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: ICAO approves creation of Doha FIR

Wed Mar 30, 2022 9:28 pm

Indeed, from its first establishment in 1954 until 1980s, the Bahrain FIR was the primary upper airspace control agency through Gulf airspace.
 
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lesfalls
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Re: ICAO approves creation of Doha FIR

Wed Mar 30, 2022 9:47 pm

LAXintl wrote:
Indeed, from its first establishment in 1954 until 1980s, the Bahrain FIR was the primary upper airspace control agency through Gulf airspace.


Who were the other players then?
 
Thenoflyzone
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Re: ICAO approves creation of Doha FIR

Thu Mar 31, 2022 12:44 am

lesfalls wrote:
Bahrain’s airspace is massive considering it covers much of Saudi if you look at the picture above.

Anyone know why such a big airspace for such a small country?


That map is wrong. Or outdated. Jeddah FIR controls all Saudi territorial airspace.

The maps in the following link are correct. Scroll down to see a map of the existing Bahrain FIR and then the new Doha FIR. As you can see, Bahrain will lose a significant portion of its airspace, and rightfully so.

https://fl360aero.com/detail/doha-fir-t ... roceed/877

You can also check skyvector.com for current worldwide FIR boundaries.

https://www.skyvector.com

LAXintl wrote:


The overlay for the new Doha FIR is wrong in that link. Part B is shown as being within the current Tehran FIR. That is not the case. Part A and B will be carved out from within Bahrain FIR. Tehran FIR is not involved with the creation of Doha FIR.
 
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mercure1
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Re: ICAO approves creation of Doha FIR

Thu Mar 31, 2022 1:14 am

Thenoflyzone wrote:
That map is wrong. Or outdated. Jeddah FIR controls all Saudi territorial airspace.

The first link in the OPs post has the correct maps of Bahrain FIR.

You can also check skyvector.com for current worldwide FIR boundaries.


The map is correct. Dimensions and control area of the Bahrain FIR/SRR is also being revised with the creation of Doha FIR.

This was approved at ICAO council meeting this month.

Here is another image of Bahrain FIR covering what was previously Saudi-managed airspace.

Image
https://fl360aero.com/ckfinder/userfile ... tarfir.jpg
 
Thenoflyzone
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Re: ICAO approves creation of Doha FIR

Thu Mar 31, 2022 1:21 am

Why on earth is Saudi Arabia giving up control of a huge part of it's territorial airspace? It's interesting that there is no mention of this airspace relinquishment in any of the articles. I figured it was an old Bahrain FIR map from the 70s or 80s.
 
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LAXintl
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Re: ICAO approves creation of Doha FIR

Thu Mar 31, 2022 3:36 am

From what I understand, the loss of Qatari airspace renders Bahrain FIR essentially a terminal control area facility with only small bit of overflight management towards Kuwait. In order to make the Bahrain FIR more viable, ICAO is taking the opportunity for a broader redesign of Gulf airspace building on the previous round in 2015-2017.

As adopted these changes won't occur until 2024 and beyond and still require final negotiations between parties, but suspect this all builds on the 2012 GCC agreement to improve the regional airspace structure which has already seen some boundaries move and no longer corresponds exactly to land borders. Since images have been published in ICAO documentation, this cant be a surprise to the member states.
 
factsonly
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Re: ICAO approves creation of Doha FIR

Thu Mar 31, 2022 8:07 am

Just what the aviation community needs, a further fragmentation of global airspace.

The world has invested decades in harmonising and 'defragmenting' global airspace by breaking down national borders.

With today's highly capable satellite technology, FIR's - as we know them - are seriously "Out-of-Date" thinking, so launching an all new FIR in 2024 is just plain silly!

Satellites don't see national boundaries, will ICAO members join the 21st Century ??

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y59vMyD1Nlg

https://www.europarl.europa.eu/factshee ... ropean-sky
 
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lesfalls
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Re: ICAO approves creation of Doha FIR

Thu Mar 31, 2022 9:33 am

factsonly wrote:
Just what the aviation community needs, a further fragmentation of global airspace.

The world has invested decades in harmonising and 'defragmenting' global airspace by breaking down national borders.

With today's highly capable satellite technology, FIR's - as we know them - are seriously "Out-of-Date" thinking, so launching an all new FIR in 2024 is just plain silly!

Satellites don't see national boundaries, will ICAO members join the 21st Century ??

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y59vMyD1Nlg

https://www.europarl.europa.eu/factshee ... ropean-sky


This isn’t only about control but also about money as any airline flying through a countries airspace has to pay.

Anyone have any more insight on the following of how much an airline actually pays?
 
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zeke
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Re: ICAO approves creation of Doha FIR

Thu Mar 31, 2022 4:45 pm

lesfalls wrote:
Who were the other players then?


I seem to remember Bahrain, Jeddah, Tehran, Sharjah, and Muscat, been a while. A lot of flights back then went via Iran into Pakistan. These days we avoid Iran so we fly more south Pakistan over water control into Muscat, UAE, Bahrain etc

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