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FlyingHonu001
Topic Author
Posts: 603
Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2020 2:33 pm

Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 5:40 am

Well... This would come sooner or later. I wonder what would it take regain their trust?

https://www.skyteam.com/en/about/press- ... d-aeroflot
 
Iluvtofly
Posts: 125
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2015 4:22 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 6:32 am

A long long time ...what Russia is doing is unforgivable
 
32andBelow
Posts: 6256
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2012 2:54 am

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 7:00 am

FlyingHonu001 wrote:
Well... This would come sooner or later. I wonder what would it take regain their trust?

https://www.skyteam.com/en/about/press- ... d-aeroflot

Total democratic regime change
 
panam330
Posts: 2395
Joined: Sun Mar 14, 2004 11:58 am

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 7:29 am

Seeing as none of their aircraft will likely be allowed to fly in the EU or North America again anytime soon, if ever, this was all but a foregone conclusion. Shame, really - I'd hoped to try SU one day and visit Moscow, but it looks like that chance has passed me by.
 
F9Animal
Posts: 4821
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 7:13 am

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 7:46 am

FlyingHonu001 wrote:
Well... This would come sooner or later. I wonder what would it take regain their trust?

https://www.skyteam.com/en/about/press- ... d-aeroflot


The airline itself isn't the one we should mistrust. It's a very unfortunate circumstance, and I can guarantee almost every single Aeroflot employee wants this war over with.

The question really is, how can they regain entry back into SkyTeam? Hopefully Putin will be ousted, and this war ended sooner than later.

Honestly, I do feel bad for the employees of SU. They are literally innocent in this.
 
konrad
Posts: 612
Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2002 3:54 am

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 8:17 am

F9Animal wrote:
The airline itself isn't the one we should mistrust. It's a very unfortunate circumstance, and I can guarantee almost every single Aeroflot employee wants this war over with.
The question really is, how can they regain entry back into SkyTeam? Hopefully Putin will be ousted, and this war ended sooner than later.
Honestly, I do feel bad for the employees of SU. They are literally innocent in this.


You are overly optimistic about the attitude of "every single Aeroflot employee".
Honestly, I don't feel bad for the employees of SU who approve and support the war and its atrocities as most of the Russians do.
 
DaCubbyBearBar
Posts: 493
Joined: Sat Apr 05, 2008 12:31 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 8:46 am

Why didn’t this happen already?? I guess since they couldn’t fly out, there was no hurry
 
davidjohnson6
Posts: 2213
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2016 10:10 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 8:49 am

Perhaps related to membership fees not being paid on a specific date ?
 
WayexTDI
Posts: 3029
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2018 4:38 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 1:30 pm

F9Animal wrote:
FlyingHonu001 wrote:
Well... This would come sooner or later. I wonder what would it take regain their trust?

https://www.skyteam.com/en/about/press- ... d-aeroflot


The airline itself isn't the one we should mistrust. It's a very unfortunate circumstance, and I can guarantee almost every single Aeroflot employee wants this war over with.

The question really is, how can they regain entry back into SkyTeam? Hopefully Putin will be ousted, and this war ended sooner than later.

Honestly, I do feel bad for the employees of SU. They are literally innocent in this.

Not sure if I feel bad for most of SU employees, or Russian citizens for that matter: they voted Vladimir in (when it was still somewhat a democracy) and they supposedly support the war.
SU is owned at 57.3% by the Russian Federation (source); just like in the "old days", they represent the Russian Government. and are an instrument of it.
 
aa1818
Posts: 1650
Joined: Sat Feb 04, 2006 2:03 am

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 1:50 pm

It appears oneworld has quietly removed S7 from it's website and as a listed member. Not seeing a press release or anything.
Good on the alliances!
AA1818
 
Blerg
Posts: 5461
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:42 am

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 3:48 pm

I suppose Saudia is next or do special terms apply to them?
 
ChrisKen
Posts: 1149
Joined: Tue Aug 05, 2008 11:15 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 4:28 pm

aa1818 wrote:
It appears oneworld has quietly removed S7 from it's website and as a listed member. Not seeing a press release or anything.
Good on the alliances!
AA1818

There's a thread about S7 temporarily suspending it's membership in these forums.
https://www.s7.ru/en/en/about/oneworld.dot S7's own release.
 
MIflyer12
Posts: 11169
Joined: Mon Feb 18, 2013 11:58 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 4:41 pm

Blerg wrote:
I suppose Saudia is next or do special terms apply to them?


Hmm, what sanctions do the U.S. and EU have on Saudi Arabia to require such a thing as removing Saudia?
 
User avatar
adambrau
Posts: 406
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2007 11:44 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 4:50 pm

Does Saudia even matter to Skyteam? Plus they don't serve alcohol onboard. Another of many sad Skyteam partners!
 
Blerg
Posts: 5461
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:42 am

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 5:18 pm

MIflyer12 wrote:
Blerg wrote:
I suppose Saudia is next or do special terms apply to them?


Hmm, what sanctions do the U.S. and EU have on Saudi Arabia to require such a thing as removing Saudia?


Well you just proved the West's hypocrisy right there.
 
johns624
Posts: 5345
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2008 11:09 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 5:21 pm

Blerg wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:
Blerg wrote:
I suppose Saudia is next or do special terms apply to them?


Hmm, what sanctions do the U.S. and EU have on Saudi Arabia to require such a thing as removing Saudia?


Well you just proved the West's hypocrisy right there.
Saudi Arabia, while far from my favorite country, isn't threatening the world with nuclear warfare.
 
davidjohnson6
Posts: 2213
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2016 10:10 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 6:16 pm

This did not come from airline CEOs in western countries having some great sympathy for Ukraine... it was about ensuring compliance with various laws and the difficulty of doing business while sanctions are in place.
The moment sanctions are removed, S7 and SU will reappear in the marketing blurb as members of their respective alliances
 
MalevTU134
Posts: 2417
Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2016 8:04 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 7:03 pm

Blerg wrote:
I suppose Saudia is next or do special terms apply to them?

Why, did Saudia stop paying their membership fee? And do they fly around with stolen aircraft, without internationally accepted insurance?

If you were trying to make a stink about Saudi Arabia being less than perfect on human rights, supporting a war in Yemen, etc, then that is all true, but there are also airlines from China, Malaysia, Thailand, Singapore, Turkey, Ethiopia, Egypt, Qatar- just to name a few - in the alliances. And yes, from the US, too. All can be accused of different degrees of human rights violations, but who said membership of the alliances are a litmus test of your home country's human rights record? Saudi Arabia meddles in an internal conflict in another country, yes, but it has not invaded a peaceful neighbouring country.

Does Kosovo and 1999 still hurt so much that it blinds your compass of what's right and wrong?
 
WayexTDI
Posts: 3029
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2018 4:38 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 7:10 pm

johns624 wrote:
Blerg wrote:
MIflyer12 wrote:

Hmm, what sanctions do the U.S. and EU have on Saudi Arabia to require such a thing as removing Saudia?


Well you just proved the West's hypocrisy right there.

Saudi Arabia, while far from my favorite country, isn't threatening the world with nuclear warfare.

And Saudi Arabia was "invited" in Yemen by the Yemeni ousted president; whereas Russia "invited themselves" in Ukraine.
 
AtlasRise
Posts: 37
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2016 5:45 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 7:53 pm

MalevTU134 wrote:
Blerg wrote:
I suppose Saudia is next or do special terms apply to them?

Why, did Saudia stop paying their membership fee? And do they fly around with stolen aircraft, without internationally accepted insurance?

If you were trying to make a stink about Saudi Arabia being less than perfect on human rights, supporting a war in Yemen, etc, then that is all true, but there are also airlines from China, Malaysia, Thailand, Singapore, Turkey, Ethiopia, Egypt, Qatar- just to name a few - in the alliances. And yes, from the US, too. All can be accused of different degrees of human rights violations, but who said membership of the alliances are a litmus test of your home country's human rights record? Saudi Arabia meddles in an internal conflict in another country, yes, but it has not invaded a peaceful neighbouring country.

Does Kosovo and 1999 still hurt so much that it blinds your compass of what's right and wrong?


Speaking of Kosovo, why is it ok for Kosovo to secede from Serbia but not ok for Donbas to secede from Ukraine? Western hypocrisy at its finest right there...
 
USAirKid
Posts: 1222
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2016 5:42 am

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 7:55 pm

konrad wrote:
F9Animal wrote:
The airline itself isn't the one we should mistrust. It's a very unfortunate circumstance, and I can guarantee almost every single Aeroflot employee wants this war over with.
The question really is, how can they regain entry back into SkyTeam? Hopefully Putin will be ousted, and this war ended sooner than later.
Honestly, I do feel bad for the employees of SU. They are literally innocent in this.


You are overly optimistic about the attitude of "every single Aeroflot employee".
Honestly, I don't feel bad for the employees of SU who approve and support the war and its atrocities as most of the Russians do.


Given how manipulated the media environment is in Russia, most of those who approve and support the war are forming that opinion with information that is either outright false, or manipulated to the point that it has very little truth.
 
Blerg
Posts: 5461
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:42 am

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 8:13 pm

MalevTU134 wrote:
Blerg wrote:
I suppose Saudia is next or do special terms apply to them?

Why, did Saudia stop paying their membership fee? And do they fly around with stolen aircraft, without internationally accepted insurance?

If you were trying to make a stink about Saudi Arabia being less than perfect on human rights, supporting a war in Yemen, etc, then that is all true, but there are also airlines from China, Malaysia, Thailand, Singapore, Turkey, Ethiopia, Egypt, Qatar- just to name a few - in the alliances. And yes, from the US, too. All can be accused of different degrees of human rights violations, but who said membership of the alliances are a litmus test of your home country's human rights record? Saudi Arabia meddles in an internal conflict in another country, yes, but it has not invaded a peaceful neighbouring country.

Does Kosovo and 1999 still hurt so much that it blinds your compass of what's right and wrong?


What does Kosovo's failed attempt at statehood have anything to do with this disucssion? Or are you out of arguments so you have to resort to personal attacks?

Whole point is that the world has ignored Saudi crimes for decades, both domestic and international yet now the whole world is angry at Russia. What is happening in Yemen is a thousand times worse than what is happening in Ukraine. The only reason SU is being kicked out of ST is because of media attention.
 
WayexTDI
Posts: 3029
Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2018 4:38 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 8:21 pm

AtlasRise wrote:
MalevTU134 wrote:
Blerg wrote:
I suppose Saudia is next or do special terms apply to them?

Why, did Saudia stop paying their membership fee? And do they fly around with stolen aircraft, without internationally accepted insurance?

If you were trying to make a stink about Saudi Arabia being less than perfect on human rights, supporting a war in Yemen, etc, then that is all true, but there are also airlines from China, Malaysia, Thailand, Singapore, Turkey, Ethiopia, Egypt, Qatar- just to name a few - in the alliances. And yes, from the US, too. All can be accused of different degrees of human rights violations, but who said membership of the alliances are a litmus test of your home country's human rights record? Saudi Arabia meddles in an internal conflict in another country, yes, but it has not invaded a peaceful neighbouring country.

Does Kosovo and 1999 still hurt so much that it blinds your compass of what's right and wrong?


Speaking of Kosovo, why is it ok for Kosovo to secede from Serbia but not ok for Donbas to secede from Ukraine? Western hypocrisy at its finest right there...

Last I checked, Kyiv is not in Donbas yet has been shelled by the Russian forces.
 
MalevTU134
Posts: 2417
Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2016 8:04 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 8:23 pm

Blerg wrote:
MalevTU134 wrote:
Blerg wrote:
I suppose Saudia is next or do special terms apply to them?

Why, did Saudia stop paying their membership fee? And do they fly around with stolen aircraft, without internationally accepted insurance?

If you were trying to make a stink about Saudi Arabia being less than perfect on human rights, supporting a war in Yemen, etc, then that is all true, but there are also airlines from China, Malaysia, Thailand, Singapore, Turkey, Ethiopia, Egypt, Qatar- just to name a few - in the alliances. And yes, from the US, too. All can be accused of different degrees of human rights violations, but who said membership of the alliances are a litmus test of your home country's human rights record? Saudi Arabia meddles in an internal conflict in another country, yes, but it has not invaded a peaceful neighbouring country.

Does Kosovo and 1999 still hurt so much that it blinds your compass of what's right and wrong?


What does Kosovo's failed attempt at statehood have anything to do with this disucssion? Or are you out of arguments so you have to resort to personal attacks?

Whole point is that the world has ignored Saudi crimes for decades, both domestic and international yet now the whole world is angry at Russia. What is happening in Yemen is a thousand times worse than what is happening in Ukraine. The only reason SU is being kicked out of ST is because of media attention.

I would say the reason SU is kicked out, as I stated in my previous post, is that their membership has been terminated for non-payment, and/or non-fulfillment of other clauses, such as operating according to ICAO guidelines and standards, which Russian airlines aren't doing today. Exactly the same would happen to United Airlines, British Airways - or Saudia - under those conditions.

The one out of arguments is the one introducing Saudia all of a sudden into the question of why SU's SkyTeam membership is being terminated, thereby politicising the issue.
 
Blerg
Posts: 5461
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:42 am

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 8:25 pm

MalevTU134 wrote:
Blerg wrote:
MalevTU134 wrote:
Why, did Saudia stop paying their membership fee? And do they fly around with stolen aircraft, without internationally accepted insurance?

If you were trying to make a stink about Saudi Arabia being less than perfect on human rights, supporting a war in Yemen, etc, then that is all true, but there are also airlines from China, Malaysia, Thailand, Singapore, Turkey, Ethiopia, Egypt, Qatar- just to name a few - in the alliances. And yes, from the US, too. All can be accused of different degrees of human rights violations, but who said membership of the alliances are a litmus test of your home country's human rights record? Saudi Arabia meddles in an internal conflict in another country, yes, but it has not invaded a peaceful neighbouring country.

Does Kosovo and 1999 still hurt so much that it blinds your compass of what's right and wrong?


What does Kosovo's failed attempt at statehood have anything to do with this disucssion? Or are you out of arguments so you have to resort to personal attacks?

Whole point is that the world has ignored Saudi crimes for decades, both domestic and international yet now the whole world is angry at Russia. What is happening in Yemen is a thousand times worse than what is happening in Ukraine. The only reason SU is being kicked out of ST is because of media attention.

I would say the reason SU is kicked out, as I stated in my previous post, is that their membership has been terminated for non-payment, and/or non-fulfillment of other clauses, such as operating according to ICAO guidelines and standards, which Russian airlines aren't doing today. Exactly the same would happen to United Airlines, British Airways - or Saudia - under those conditions.

The one out of arguments is the one introducing Saudia all of a sudden into the question of why SU's SkyTeam membership is being terminated, thereby politicising the issue.


Because this is a political issue. They are being kicked out because they are a Russian airline, the same way Russian property is being confiscated all around the world. Russian athletes are banned from competing internationally (see Wimbledon) and so on.

This fits perfectly into this whole anti-Russian hysteria.
 
johns624
Posts: 5345
Joined: Mon Jul 07, 2008 11:09 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 8:26 pm

WayexTDI wrote:
AtlasRise wrote:
MalevTU134 wrote:
Why, did Saudia stop paying their membership fee? And do they fly around with stolen aircraft, without internationally accepted insurance?

If you were trying to make a stink about Saudi Arabia being less than perfect on human rights, supporting a war in Yemen, etc, then that is all true, but there are also airlines from China, Malaysia, Thailand, Singapore, Turkey, Ethiopia, Egypt, Qatar- just to name a few - in the alliances. And yes, from the US, too. All can be accused of different degrees of human rights violations, but who said membership of the alliances are a litmus test of your home country's human rights record? Saudi Arabia meddles in an internal conflict in another country, yes, but it has not invaded a peaceful neighbouring country.

Does Kosovo and 1999 still hurt so much that it blinds your compass of what's right and wrong?


Speaking of Kosovo, why is it ok for Kosovo to secede from Serbia but not ok for Donbas to secede from Ukraine? Western hypocrisy at its finest right there...

Last I checked, Kyiv is not in Donbas yet has been shelled by the Russian forces.
Beat me to it!
 
MalevTU134
Posts: 2417
Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2016 8:04 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 8:46 pm

Blerg wrote:
MalevTU134 wrote:
Blerg wrote:

What does Kosovo's failed attempt at statehood have anything to do with this disucssion? Or are you out of arguments so you have to resort to personal attacks?

Whole point is that the world has ignored Saudi crimes for decades, both domestic and international yet now the whole world is angry at Russia. What is happening in Yemen is a thousand times worse than what is happening in Ukraine. The only reason SU is being kicked out of ST is because of media attention.

I would say the reason SU is kicked out, as I stated in my previous post, is that their membership has been terminated for non-payment, and/or non-fulfillment of other clauses, such as operating according to ICAO guidelines and standards, which Russian airlines aren't doing today. Exactly the same would happen to United Airlines, British Airways - or Saudia - under those conditions.

The one out of arguments is the one introducing Saudia all of a sudden into the question of why SU's SkyTeam membership is being terminated, thereby politicising the issue.


Because this is a political issue. They are being kicked out because they are a Russian airline, the same way Russian property is being confiscated all around the world. Russian athletes are banned from competing internationally (see Wimbledon) and so on.

This fits perfectly into this whole anti-Russian hysteria.

Sorry, you made me see it your way now, you are right. We (and more specifically SkyTeam) should all just ignore the fact that SU doesn't pay their membership fees. Never mind also that they don't comply with basic ICAO standards, such as sourcing their spare parts from the manufacturer, not carrying out maintenance at contractors approved by the OEMs, that their aircraft are confiscated/nationalised/putinised/stolen. Just ignore all that and let them stay in SkyTeam (who knows why, because they don't benefit from their membership anyway right now or in the foreseeable future, nor does SkyTeam, but anyway, let'em stay!).

Also, let's just buy plenty of popcorn and watch as Putin and his cronies brutalise, rape, bomb, loot and steal whatever they want in Ukraine, because, you know, it's not a proper country anyway, it's always been part of Russia. Let's not remind ourselves that Russia signed to respect the territorial integrity of Ukraine, that Ukraine even gave up its nukes in exchange for that...naaaah, that would be fueling the anti-Russian hysteria. And let's just pretend nothing bad is going on, so let's let all the Russian athletes compete as normal, don't disturb their mental concentration by mentioning atrocities, murders and genocide. That wouldn't be being a good sport, not dope (pun intended) at all. And also, we should leave alone all the money Putin and his cronies have been stealing and hiding away in properties, bank accounts, yachts, cars...or Putin will get annoyed, and it's not fair to treat Russians like that. Only because they're Russians, not because they have done anything bad. They're not killers, and thieves, the West is just misunderstanding them.

Now I understand you. How could I not see it clearly until now?
 
MalevTU134
Posts: 2417
Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2016 8:04 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 8:48 pm

Blerg wrote:
AtlasRise wrote:
MalevTU134 wrote:
Why, did Saudia stop paying their membership fee? And do they fly around with stolen aircraft, without internationally accepted insurance?

If you were trying to make a stink about Saudi Arabia being less than perfect on human rights, supporting a war in Yemen, etc, then that is all true, but there are also airlines from China, Malaysia, Thailand, Singapore, Turkey, Ethiopia, Egypt, Qatar- just to name a few - in the alliances. And yes, from the US, too. All can be accused of different degrees of human rights violations, but who said membership of the alliances are a litmus test of your home country's human rights record? Saudi Arabia meddles in an internal conflict in another country, yes, but it has not invaded a peaceful neighbouring country.

Does Kosovo and 1999 still hurt so much that it blinds your compass of what's right and wrong?


Speaking of Kosovo, why is it ok for Kosovo to secede from Serbia but not ok for Donbas to secede from Ukraine? Western hypocrisy at its finest right there...


Because in Donbas the West can't exploit natural riches and build bases as was/is the case in Kosovo. However, hypocrisy is synonymous with the West so no shock there. That is why SU is kicked out while others are not.

This is now wildly off-topic, but can you explain what "the West" exploits in Kosovo, the poorest corner of Europe?
 
MalevTU134
Posts: 2417
Joined: Tue Oct 11, 2016 8:04 pm

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 8:52 pm

AtlasRise wrote:
MalevTU134 wrote:
Blerg wrote:
I suppose Saudia is next or do special terms apply to them?

Why, did Saudia stop paying their membership fee? And do they fly around with stolen aircraft, without internationally accepted insurance?

If you were trying to make a stink about Saudi Arabia being less than perfect on human rights, supporting a war in Yemen, etc, then that is all true, but there are also airlines from China, Malaysia, Thailand, Singapore, Turkey, Ethiopia, Egypt, Qatar- just to name a few - in the alliances. And yes, from the US, too. All can be accused of different degrees of human rights violations, but who said membership of the alliances are a litmus test of your home country's human rights record? Saudi Arabia meddles in an internal conflict in another country, yes, but it has not invaded a peaceful neighbouring country.

Does Kosovo and 1999 still hurt so much that it blinds your compass of what's right and wrong?


Speaking of Kosovo, why is it ok for Kosovo to secede from Serbia but not ok for Donbas to secede from Ukraine? Western hypocrisy at its finest right there...

Secession is not what it is when a part of a country is invaded by another country, as happened in Crimea and Donbas. That is called invasion. Secession is what happened in South Sudan, what would have happened in Scotland, Mayotte, New Caledonia etcetera (if they had voted for it). Which other country invaded Kosovo (or Serbia) to make that secession happen?
 
tys777
Moderator
Posts: 691
Joined: Sat Aug 26, 2006 1:43 am

Re: Skyteam suspends membership SU

Thu Apr 28, 2022 8:53 pm

Thread has gone wildly off-topic and has been locked.

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