Turkish Airlines has ordered 6 more A350-900s, with deliveries due in 2022 and 2023.

This is taking their total ordered to 26 (with 6 delivered and in use so far). I guess we know where some of the Aeroflot-frames are going to.

https://www.scramble.nl/civil-news/turk ... more-a350s

Cheers!

It's sad to see SU suffer, but congrats to TK!

Didn't TK cancel a few A350s not long ago?

PM wrote:

Didn't TK cancel a few A350s not long ago?

Yes. TK originally ordered 25 A350s. They cancelled 2 in 2020 and then January of this year cancelled 3 more.

Polot wrote:

PM wrote:

Didn't TK cancel a few A350s not long ago?

Yes. TK originally ordered 25 A350s. They cancelled 2 in 2020 and then January of this year cancelled 3 more.

I thought so. Perhaps they are getting a better deal on these new ones.

Polot wrote:

PM wrote:

Didn't TK cancel a few A350s not long ago?

Yes. TK originally ordered 25 A350s. They cancelled 2 in 2020 and then January of this year cancelled 3 more.

So whats next? Another round of cancellations or more orders? Weird. Seems their long term planning changes on a daily basis

Heavierthanair wrote:

Polot wrote:

PM wrote:

Didn't TK cancel a few A350s not long ago?

Yes. TK originally ordered 25 A350s. They cancelled 2 in 2020 and then January of this year cancelled 3 more.

So whats next? Another round of cancellations or more orders? Weird. Seems their long term planning changes on a daily basis

Not likely, but nothing lasts forever.
Operational need changes along with market conditions, fuel price, etc. The doom and gloom feeling where carriers struggled to survive 2 years ago has drastically changed to the better.
I am glad to see demand for widebody aircraft is back. Boeings struggle to get 787 out of the door drives A350 demand as well. Can we maybe be happy for the a while??

Heavierthanair wrote:

Polot wrote:

PM wrote:

Didn't TK cancel a few A350s not long ago?

Yes. TK originally ordered 25 A350s. They cancelled 2 in 2020 and then January of this year cancelled 3 more.

So whats next? Another round of cancellations or more orders? Weird. Seems their long term planning changes on a daily basis

If they are sometime Aeroflot orders they may have been offered at a good price. TK has always been an opportunistic buyer of airliners. Look at their A330 fleet. Some original orders but lots of used planes (with PW, GE and RR) snapped up as and when the opportunity arose.

If I remember right, Turkish also snapped up some ex-Kingfisher A321s.

But 2022 frames means that these are already being built (or parts of).
I wonder what they will do with the cabin.

Exciting news for TK! Hope we see them in Australia at some point!!

What does their order book look like now for narrow and widebodies?

ReverseFlow wrote:

But 2022 frames means that these are already being built (or parts of).
I wonder what they will do with the cabin.

I'd imagine that some of them will be the already built Aeroflot frames.

Definitely a good move by TK to pick up some extra A350s.

Hope to see some of these 350s in AU! Be amazing if they could reach SYD, MEL!

What is the current TK order book looking like for narrow and widebodies?

I wonder would TK ever order a A35KLR now that Qantas has launched it. They could reach Australia and New Zealand with ease.

I can’t help wondering if these ex-Aeroflot A350’s might end up back with Aeroflot sometime soon? Aren’t Turkey still a fairly close trading partner with Russia?

DCA350 wrote:

I wonder would TK ever order a A35KLR now that Qantas has launched it. They could reach Australia and New Zealand with ease.

How far would the new 283t version take them from Istanbul?

JerseyFlyer wrote:

DCA350 wrote:

I wonder would TK ever order a A35KLR now that Qantas has launched it. They could reach Australia and New Zealand with ease.

How far would the new 283t version take them from Istanbul?

IST-AKL is just about 50km farther than QFs planned SYD-LHR, so nonstop Istanbul to New Zealand is doable

smi0006 wrote:

What is the current TK order book looking like for narrow and widebodies?

Regarding narrow bodies, they received 33 A321neos and still have 55 on order (88 in total). They canceled the rest of their Max order last year, but probably because they could get better deals now. That's why they just leased up 7 more 737 Max 8s (also destined to a russian airline, S7).

Regarding widebodies, they received 6 A359s already and have 19 to go (with the new order included) alongside 5 options. They also received 15 789s and are expecting further 10, also with 5 options.

PM wrote:

Heavierthanair wrote:

Polot wrote:

Yes. TK originally ordered 25 A350s. They cancelled 2 in 2020 and then January of this year cancelled 3 more.

So whats next? Another round of cancellations or more orders? Weird. Seems their long term planning changes on a daily basis

If they are sometime Aeroflot orders they may have been offered at a good price. TK has always been an opportunistic buyer of airliners. Look at their A330 fleet. Some original orders but lots of used planes (with PW, GE and RR) snapped up as and when the opportunity arose.

Maybe the 'cancelled' orders were orders which needed to be reconfirmed at a certain stage, and TK decided not to. Airbus books these kind of orders as firm, and if an airline decides not to reconfirm these show up as cancellations. Something like that happened with the last 3 A380's for LH for example. Not sure this is what happened with the TK A359s, but it's a theory.

airsmiles wrote:

I can’t help wondering if these ex-Aeroflot A350’s might end up back with Aeroflot sometime soon? Aren’t Turkey still a fairly close trading partner with Russia?

Do you mean TK will take the SU frames and then sell them to Aeroflot? Pretty sure contractual agreements would prevent that. If Turkey/TK would breach that and/or international sanctions, the consequences would be huge for Turkish aviation and possibly beyond. Erdogan can be a poker player sometimes but he wouldn't bet with so little to gain and so much to lose.

JerseyFlyer wrote:

DCA350 wrote:

I wonder would TK ever order a A35KLR now that Qantas has launched it. They could reach Australia and New Zealand with ease.

How far would the new 283t version take them from Istanbul?

TK is as PM posted an opportunistic buyer, and if the circumstances are favorable they will buy. Could be travel is now increasing faster than expected, or possibly cheap frames suddenly becoming available, or indeed the 283t A359 making non-stop flights to Australia profitable. I think IST-SYD / IST-MEL could potentially be winners.

frigatebird wrote:

, or indeed the 283t A359 making non-stop flights to Australia profitable. I think IST-SYD / IST-MEL could potentially be winners.

As these 6 are allegedly pre-built frames, the extra 3t MTOW would need to be applied as a paper upgrade. Entirely possible, but also applicable to frames TK already have delivered or on order.

frigatebird wrote:

PM wrote:

Heavierthanair wrote:

So whats next? Another round of cancellations or more orders? Weird. Seems their long term planning changes on a daily basis

If they are sometime Aeroflot orders they may have been offered at a good price. TK has always been an opportunistic buyer of airliners. Look at their A330 fleet. Some original orders but lots of used planes (with PW, GE and RR) snapped up as and when the opportunity arose.

Maybe the 'cancelled' orders were orders which needed to be reconfirmed at a certain stage, and TK decided not to. Airbus books these kind of orders as firm, and if an airline decides not to reconfirm these show up as cancellations. Something like that happened with the last 3 A380's for LH for example. Not sure this is what happened with the TK A359s, but it's a theory.

airsmiles wrote:

I can’t help wondering if these ex-Aeroflot A350’s might end up back with Aeroflot sometime soon? Aren’t Turkey still a fairly close trading partner with Russia?

Do you mean TK will take the SU frames and then sell them to Aeroflot? Pretty sure contractual agreements would prevent that. If Turkey/TK would breach that and/or international sanctions, the consequences would be huge for Turkish aviation and possibly beyond. Erdogan can be a poker player sometimes but he wouldn't bet with so little to gain and so much to lose.

JerseyFlyer wrote:

DCA350 wrote:

I wonder would TK ever order a A35KLR now that Qantas has launched it. They could reach Australia and New Zealand with ease.

How far would the new 283t version take them from Istanbul?

TK is as PM posted an opportunistic buyer, and if the circumstances are favorable they will buy. Could be travel is now increasing faster than expected, or possibly cheap frames suddenly becoming available, or indeed the 283t A359 making non-stop flights to Australia profitable. I think IST-SYD / IST-MEL could potentially be winners.

The current Turkish Gov. are really pushing IST to be the largest passenger airport in the World and with the mix of geo-politics, wouldn't surprise me if TK ended up starting flights to Australia or even NZ like their great rivals over in Dubai. At the same time I could certainly see TK doing well with traffic feeds to potential Australia flights.

frigatebird wrote:

airsmiles wrote:

I can’t help wondering if these ex-Aeroflot A350’s might end up back with Aeroflot sometime soon? Aren’t Turkey still a fairly close trading partner with Russia?

Do you mean TK will take the SU frames and then sell them to Aeroflot? Pretty sure contractual agreements would prevent that. If Turkey/TK would breach that and/or international sanctions, the consequences would be huge for Turkish aviation and possibly beyond. Erdogan can be a poker player sometimes but he wouldn't bet with so little to gain and so much to lose.

Yes, sell them onto Aeroflot, but not immediately. Perhaps Turkey would facilitate Aeroflot regaining some A350’s in their configuration after a decent interval. That would give Aeroflot quick access to modern aircraft without ordering factory fresh aircraft. As for Erdogan he’s already causing problems for Sweden and Finland’s membership of NATO, so nothing would surprise me with him.

airsmiles wrote:

frigatebird wrote:

airsmiles wrote:

I can’t help wondering if these ex-Aeroflot A350’s might end up back with Aeroflot sometime soon? Aren’t Turkey still a fairly close trading partner with Russia?

Do you mean TK will take the SU frames and then sell them to Aeroflot? Pretty sure contractual agreements would prevent that. If Turkey/TK would breach that and/or international sanctions, the consequences would be huge for Turkish aviation and possibly beyond. Erdogan can be a poker player sometimes but he wouldn't bet with so little to gain and so much to lose.

Yes, sell them onto Aeroflot, but not immediately. Perhaps Turkey would facilitate Aeroflot regaining some A350’s in their configuration after a decent interval. That would give Aeroflot quick access to modern aircraft without ordering factory fresh aircraft. As for Erdogan he’s already causing problems for Sweden and Finland’s membership of NATO, so nothing would surprise me with him.

Because of their support for organisations that threaten Turkey's national security. Why exactly should Turkey care about Sweden and Finland's security when they don't care about a longstanding NATO member's security?

smi0006 wrote:

What is the current TK order book looking like for narrow and widebodies?

According to Wikipedia, they have 64 narrow (57 A21N, 7 B38M) and 30 wide (20 A359, 10 B789) for a total of 94 on the books.

https://www.abcdlist.nl/a350f/a350f.html

I have always found the production list useful

To Airsmiles: I do not think that SU will need more longhaul aircraft but they will need a lot of spare parts for aircraft they already have. There will be a lot of smuggling attempts via Turkey and other asian countries.

Breathe wrote:

The current Turkish Gov. are really pushing IST to be the largest passenger airport in the World and with the mix of geo-politics, wouldn't surprise me if TK ended up starting flights to Australia or even NZ like their great rivals over in Dubai. At the same time I could certainly see TK doing well with traffic feeds to potential Australia flights.

Lots of demand for Australia-Europe flights at the moment, a good opportunity for TK to get in on the action. Don't forget that the Chinese airlines (including CX) are out of play on the Kangaroo route at the moment, and are unlikely to return in the near future (with the exception of CX). If you're getting a MEL/SYD-Europe flight for under AUD$1500 ATM, you're doing well. MEL-IST would be a good starter route for them, given that a lot of capacity is still waiting to return to MEL especially.

melpax wrote:

Breathe wrote:

The current Turkish Gov. are really pushing IST to be the largest passenger airport in the World and with the mix of geo-politics, wouldn't surprise me if TK ended up starting flights to Australia or even NZ like their great rivals over in Dubai. At the same time I could certainly see TK doing well with traffic feeds to potential Australia flights.

Lots of demand for Australia-Europe flights at the moment, a good opportunity for TK to get in on the action. Don't forget that the Chinese airlines (including CX) are out of play on the Kangaroo route at the moment, and are unlikely to return in the near future (with the exception of CX). If you're getting a MEL/SYD-Europe flight for under AUD$1500 ATM, you're doing well. MEL-IST would be a good starter route for them, given that a lot of capacity is still waiting to return to MEL especially.

Given the spread of the Turkish diaspora in Australia, I think SYD would probably be more attractive to TK initially.

airsmiles wrote:

I can’t help wondering if these ex-Aeroflot A350’s might end up back with Aeroflot sometime soon? Aren’t Turkey still a fairly close trading partner with Russia?

Probably AB will deposit there orders until the sanctions will be lifted. Which is unlikely to happend anytime soon are there any criteria for lifting sanction beside ending the invasion like reperation form damages by russian forces and prosecution of war criminals?

tullamarine wrote:

melpax wrote:

Given the spread of the Turkish diaspora in Australia, I think SYD would probably be more attractive to TK initially.

Depends on what market sector they want to target. For VFR, SYD would be best, if they're chasing connecting traffic in the manner of the ME3, they can't go wrong with either MEL or SYD, especially in current market conditions with demand exceeding the available capacity.

TK787 wrote:

So, TK getting more Max8 afterall
I'm sure you are all aware that LH also interested in SU 350s.
Any info how many frames of A & B, SU have on order? Thank you.

TKflyer wrote:

on the topic SU A350:
AEROFLOT has ordered 22 Airbus A30-941s. 7 were already delivered before the embargo

The following MSN are currently available:
msn 457 ff 21.10.2021, F-WZNJ, VP-BXS
msn 493 ff 04.04.2022, F-WZGY, VP-BYB
msn 463 ff 15.11.2021, F-WZFP, VP-BYE
msn 471 ff 15.02.2022, F-WZGB, VP-BYH
msn 554 on Order F-WZFZ, VP-BYG
msn 558 on Order F-WZFN, VP-BYX
msn 498 on Order
msn 508 on Order

By which 4 TURKISH AIRLINES and by how many and especially which Lufthansa are interested and finally who will be awarded the contract is still open. In addition to the two interested parties, other airlines or leasing companies could also be considered.

only to supplement the ,
msn 448, ff 23.04.2021, F-WZHI, VP-BXS, EC-NOI World2Fly
was delivered ex works via ALC to World2fly.
Moreover, the 2 planned A350 msn 242 & 253 were not built

Btw, the First ex SU A350 msn 457 ex F-WZNJ (ntu VP–BXS Aeroflot) will get the Reg. TC–LGI
See the fist pic, with standard TURKISH AIRLINES titles, basic Aeroflot cs
https://www.airporthaber.com/havacilik-haberleri/thynin-yeni-ucagi-boyle-goruntulendi.html (only in Turkish)

Istanbul to Melbourne is 7,903nm
Istanbul to Sydney is 8,073nm

The 283t A350-900 could comfortably do that with 320 passengers.

Perth to London is 7,818nm and that is done with a 787-9. Turkey would be crazy not to start flights to Australia

TC-LGI wears basic SU livery.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/aircrafts/52087329604/

RJMAZ wrote:

Istanbul to Melbourne is 7,903nm
Istanbul to Sydney is 8,073nm

The 283t A350-900 could comfortably do that with 320 passengers.

Perth to London is 7,818nm and that is done with a 787-9. Turkey would be crazy not to start flights to Australia

A 787-9 with only 235 seats…