Virgin Australia set to commence daily OOL-DPS and resume BNE and SYD to APW (Samoa) / VLI (Vanuatu) in March 2023.

OOL-DPS will be a late afternoon flight in and a redeye back from DPS to OOL, same timings as the other East Coast flights.

https://newsroom.virginaustralia.com/re ... estination

SCFlyer wrote:

OOL-DPS will be a late afternoon flight in and a redeye back from DPS to OOL, same timings as the other East Coast flights.

I'm sure these timings work best for aircraft utilisation meaning a 737 is active at a time when it would otherwise be parked. Red-eye on a 737 is not ideal but it is pretty much par for the course when coming home from Bali unless you get the afternoon JQ 787.

Actually VA are moving to pre covid departure times for MEL and SYD to DPS later in the year. A recent search showed both leaving in the morning and arriving into DPS in the afternoon. Much more palatable to leisure guests than the current interim schedule.

SCFlyer wrote:

Virgin Australia set to commence daily OOL-DPS and resume BNE and SYD to APW (Samoa) / VLI (Vanuatu) in March 2023.

OOL-DPS will be a late afternoon flight in and a redeye back from DPS to OOL, same timings as the other East Coast flights.

https://newsroom.virginaustralia.com/re ... estination

Nice to see OOL get some more international love - seems a good port for more A220 and 321XLR expansion into Asia. Does the new terminal expansion have proper international facilities? Not necessarily dedicated just space appropriate

Does anyone know if QF is still offering a hot meal during meal times on the golden triangle or is this a thing of the past? A friend of mine travelled around 6pm the other day and only got a snack, but wasn’t sure if this is the new normal or just a catering blip for that particular flight.

I remember in 2019 receiving a full pasta dish on MEL-SYD and even warmed up bao buns on ADL-MEL evening flights.

ben175 wrote:

Does anyone know if QF is still offering a hot meal during meal times on the golden triangle or is this a thing of the past? A friend of mine travelled around 6pm the other day and only got a snack, but wasn’t sure if this is the new normal or just a catering blip for that particular flight.

I remember in 2019 receiving a full pasta dish on MEL-SYD and even warmed up bao buns on ADL-MEL evening flights.

I think they are definitely reducing their offerings. I have received some warmed snacks but no meal for a while. I think QF has used the cover of COVID to reduce costs and services, meals are just an example. In addition to the well publicized reduction in ground staff, another example is newspapers are no longer available in the lounge or at the gate. These are only minor changes but do constitute unit cost savings which is a business positive; the associated negative is the more these things are removed, the less the gap between the higher priced Qantas offering and its competition particularly VA.

ben175 wrote:

Does anyone know if QF is still offering a hot meal during meal times on the golden triangle or is this a thing of the past? A friend of mine travelled around 6pm the other day and only got a snack, but wasn’t sure if this is the new normal or just a catering blip for that particular flight.

I remember in 2019 receiving a full pasta dish on MEL-SYD and even warmed up bao buns on ADL-MEL evening flights.

I did a morning MEL-SYD flight with Qantas last month, no word of breakfast, only a muffin and a coffee.

Even on longer Sydney-Perth flights (of which I take around 6-10 a year), I've witnessed a straight up decline in their offerings, back in 2015 you'd get a tray with a bun, crackers, decent sized meal, a drink and an ice cream afterwards - now it's just a box (only about 3/4s the size of the old trays) and a drink, maybe a lindt chocolate afterwards.

ben175 wrote:

Does anyone know if QF is still offering a hot meal during meal times on the golden triangle or is this a thing of the past? A friend of mine travelled around 6pm the other day and only got a snack, but wasn’t sure if this is the new normal or just a catering blip for that particular flight.

I remember in 2019 receiving a full pasta dish on MEL-SYD and even warmed up bao buns on ADL-MEL evening flights.

This is an interesting question, their homepage isn’t helpful either - only talks of “meal boxes and snacks” but I believe the boxes are now limited to long sectors (East Coast to PER or DRW). While I haven’t flown them on the triangle this year, I recently did an ADL-SYD and also CBR-MEL during dinner hours and it was cheese and crackers only. MEL-CBR in the morning was not even a muffin, just drinks (not complaining tbh, it is a short sector and I wasn’t expecting anything).

Just one of the many little things - death by a thousand cuts…

I regularly fly around the triangle on QF and haven't seen anything resembling the old 'dinner' service in economy since COVID, though I have had a quiche on a few breakfast flights. I'm not overly phased about it, but it's definitely led me to move more flying to JQ when the schedule is suitable since I'd rather be able to buy something to eat rather than get hangry on the plane (I usually arrive at the airport at the last minute so rarely have time to visit the lounge if on QF).

Thai Airways to resume PER from 5 July, 3 weekly

https://www.facebook.com/235553232457/p ... G2qsCYpKl/

Passengers are being warned about delays over the Winter holiday break similar to what was experienced over Easter with Qantas head office staff to step into airport roles including baggage handling

https://www.skynews.com.au/australia-ne ... e69fbd336e

Does anyone know what the story is with the delayed QF8 from DFW? Twitter and Facebook are lighting up with multiple threads criticising QF.

Apparently 200+ people were abandoned within terminal at 2AM following delay and told to come back at 9AM, no hotels etc were offered, no QF staff were around to help. People including children and elderly were made to sleep on terminal floor. When people returned to counter at 9AM, no QF staff were around still and check-in had been changed to a check-in for a LH flight. DFW staff were saying that they were unable to get into contact with any QF staff.

Delays happen but this is sounding a bit messy and more like you'd expect from Jetstar.

qf789 wrote:

Passengers are being warned about delays over the Winter holiday break similar to what was experienced over Easter with Qantas head office staff to step into airport roles including baggage handling

https://www.skynews.com.au/australia-ne ... e69fbd336e

It is a bit of a worry. I have travelled through QF domestic terminals throughout April and May and they have never really got on top of the issues particularly with baggage handling. At this rate, I'd be expecting absolute chaos from tomorrow week as school holidays start. Unfortunately, I am travelling QF domestic early on Saturday week. I'll be at the airport quite early but am expecting to walk into a complete shambles.

If nothing else, QF announcing the likelihood of delays is a good way of managing expectations!!

Outsourcing....

Turned into a very costly excersize. The brand damage alone it's caused.

vhebb wrote:

Outsourcing....

Turned into a very costly excersize. The brand damage alone it's caused.

I don’t know - CEO of SYD airport was on sunrise today, they are looking for 5K staff across the airport. Yes some are outsourced - but ABF, Biosecurity, Rex, Virgin we’re all advertising too. Can’t blame everything on QF and outsourcing, not saying it has helped them. But the industry was repeatedly shut down, it’s a labour crisis- and it’s hardly an attractive industry to work in. We could pay people more…. But it’s such a marginal yielding industry - shareholders wouldn’t like that… I did see an interesting commentary out of Europe that fundamentally days prices can’t go lower, and any ULCC who tries is unlikely to succeed, and it impacts the whole ecosystem of the airport/industry.

https://www.linkedin.com/posts/sydneyai ... um=ios_app

https://www.linkedin.com/posts/sydneyai ... um=ios_app

QF reviewing options for international WiFi:

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... ional-wifi

Cheers

tullamarine wrote:

Does anyone know what the story is with the delayed QF8 from DFW? Twitter and Facebook are lighting up with multiple threads criticising QF.

Apparently 200+ people were abandoned within terminal at 2AM following delay and told to come back at 9AM, no hotels etc were offered, no QF staff were around to help. People including children and elderly were made to sleep on terminal floor. When people returned to counter at 9AM, no QF staff were around still and check-in had been changed to a check-in for a LH flight. DFW staff were saying that they were unable to get into contact with any QF staff.

Delays happen but this is sounding a bit messy and more like you'd expect from Jetstar.

Here is a bit more about the issue - but still not quite the full story (with gaps in what Qantas did to support passengers, and what they didn't do): https://www.theguardian.com/business/20 ... us-airport

QF is axing PER-ASP due to “low passenger numbers”.

I would have thought this is a perfect route for the Alliance E90s going forward. Are they currently flying a 737?

Even a 190 would only be 1/3 full.

ben175 wrote:

QF is axing PER-ASP due to “low passenger numbers”.

I would have thought this is a perfect route for the Alliance E90s going forward. Are they currently flying a 737?

It used to be a 717 when there were some based in PER but has changed to a 737 since the 717s moved east.

An E90 may be too much still. It is a marginal route at best and if there is sufficient demand elsewhere, it makes more sense to use the fleet where it can generate good loads.

Chipmunk1973 wrote:

QF reviewing options for international WiFi:

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... ional-wifi

Cheers

Finally, its always irronic to cross the Tasman on a wifi enabled 738 without any coverage.

There is something more to this than meets the eye. Qantas are far more vulnerable to this than Virgin and Jetstar. All Qantas fares are eligible for free checked bags. Additionally, a lot more passengers connecting onto longhaul flights. The result is that the density of checked bags for any given Qantas flight is very likely higher than Virgin and Jetstar. Similar challenges are seen with catering and other ground handling, also influenced by slightly longer stage lengths.

What you have said cannot be an excuse. Qantas have a higher average fare level so its cost model is also different. It cannot charge at its price levels but only provide Jetstar levels of service.

Experience in the US and Europe shows that the more they segment this, the greater the incentive to not check a bag. In doing so, airlines are better placed to assess whether it's worthwhile hiring more ground handlers,

Flying domestically in the US is a complete nightmare because of the resistance to checked luggage. The battle for space in the overhead bins is often ugly particularly as US gate agents rarely manage the supposed limitations. In Australia, there is no doubt that QF is also worst at managing this with people often being allowed to board with 3 carry-on bags. VA and JQ gate agents are much more likely to manage limits and force people to check in luggage over the limit.

Many LCCs that segment fares are not always setting prices to maximise yield by itself (like most mainline carriers do) but looking at a wider dynamic optimisation system. It's why we see less complex but far more granular pricing systems than mainline/legacy carriers.

Whilst a great revenue earner, LCCs and many legacy carriers are unbundling fares because pax appreciate that. Earlier this week, this forum was talking about how poor QF's meals are. Given this, people may be happier to pay a lesser fare and either skip inflight meals or chose something they actually desire. This is VA's experience where BoB is actually preferred to the previous included but often weird catering inclusions. Likewise, for some people WIFI on board is a Godsend whilst, for others, it is a complete waste and they would prefer not to have to pay for it if that is an option.

tullamarine wrote:

What you have said cannot be an excuse. Qantas have a higher average fare level so its cost model is also different. It cannot charge at its price levels but only provide Jetstar levels of service.

Where or how am I making an excuse for Qantas? I'm simply highlighting how their business model is likely outdated and that the macro level cost cutting that they pursue as a result is generating massive negative externalities. If anything, I'm critiquing them, not excusing them.

tullamarine wrote:

Whilst a great revenue earner, LCCs and many legacy carriers are unbundling fares because pax appreciate that. Earlier this week, this forum was talking about how poor QF's meals are. Given this, people may be happier to pay a lesser fare and either skip inflight meals or chose something they actually desire. This is VA's experience where BoB is actually preferred to the previous included but often weird catering inclusions. Likewise, for some people WIFI on board is a Godsend whilst, for others, it is a complete waste and they would prefer not to have to pay for it if that is an option.

Exactly my point. However, it's very difficult to anticipate the revenue elements, particularly the willingness to pay (and ultimately price elasticities) within different market segments and on different routes until one start unbundling the fares a little more. They have some data and experience from Jetstar, but the market segments different substantially. Furthermore, to make it work in a substantial way, one needs to be able to price discriminate, but Qantas simply do not have the systems capacity to do this. With no price discrimination, it's too much of a race to the bottom in terms of revenues. LCCs are in an advantageous position in that they start with a blank slate and build their systems, experience and ultimately revenue management with this in mind. Qantas are years behind and they'll take a long time to catch-up. While Qantas have been great innovators in recent years in terms of operations, network planning and yield management, they've been real laggards to unbundling.

tullamarine wrote:

Does anyone know what the story is with the delayed QF8 from DFW? Twitter and Facebook are lighting up with multiple threads criticising QF.

Apparently 200+ people were abandoned within terminal at 2AM following delay and told to come back at 9AM, no hotels etc were offered, no QF staff were around to help. People including children and elderly were made to sleep on terminal floor. When people returned to counter at 9AM, no QF staff were around still and check-in had been changed to a check-in for a LH flight. DFW staff were saying that they were unable to get into contact with any QF staff.

Delays happen but this is sounding a bit messy and more like you'd expect from Jetstar.

Jetstar are usually pretty good in IRROPS as they allow you to manage a lot online yourself. To be honest I'd say Jetstar have become more customer centric than QF these days.

tullamarine wrote:

ben175 wrote:

QF is axing PER-ASP due to “low passenger numbers”.

I would have thought this is a perfect route for the Alliance E90s going forward. Are they currently flying a 737?

It used to be a 717 when there were some based in PER but has changed to a 737 since the 717s moved east.

An E90 may be too much still. It is a marginal route at best and if there is sufficient demand elsewhere, it makes more sense to use the fleet where it can generate good loads.

Quite a dogleg in the future then for folks having to travel via DRW or ADL.

Didn’t they run this as a PER-ASP-CNS rotation many years ago on the 717? Or was that via AYQ?

Can we all just lay off Qantas for a while. They are not perfect but a bucket load better than what is offered in other parts of the world. So what if all you got was a muffin and coffee for breakfast! A lot of people got a lot less than that for their breakfast!

Can't believe what I am reading!

a36001 wrote:

Can we all just lay off Qantas for a while. They are not perfect but a bucket load better than what is offered in other parts of the world. So what if all you got was a muffin and coffee for breakfast! A lot of people got a lot less than that for their breakfast!

Can't believe what I am reading!

Its the fact they are charging substantially more then VA and JQ and providing substantially less then what they should be for that price. They want to be Australia's full-service carrier and charge accordingly so you would expect them to provide a service to justify that premium, which frankly at the moment, is not happening. I can completely get why people are peeved off. Yes there is are some conditions which they can't control but there's still a fair bit they have complete control over.

a36001 wrote:

Can we all just lay off Qantas for a while. They are not perfect but a bucket load better than what is offered in other parts of the world. So what if all you got was a muffin and coffee for breakfast! A lot of people got a lot less than that for their breakfast!

Can't believe what I am reading!

A few years ago I would agree - but having just done a return trip to the US in QF J I don't think they offer anything over and above than what you get from the US3 or equivalent airlines these days (sorry, aside from the cheap PJs which were probably stitched together by a toddler somewhere in Asia). The actual quality of service was far superior on my domestic DL sectors and I'd probably be looking to try them next time I fly to the US.

The cherry on top was waiting 90+ minutes post-arrival for my 'priority' luggage to come onto the carousel at SYD this morning. Even the crew were left standing around waiting for their bags. I realise there are challenges for everybody at the moment - but QF used to be able to justify their big talk by getting the basics right. They deserve every bit of criticism they are receiving at the moment and need to invest some serious money in regaining the goodwill of their customer base.

a36001 wrote:

Can we all just lay off Qantas for a while. They are not perfect but a bucket load better than what is offered in other parts of the world. So what if all you got was a muffin and coffee for breakfast! A lot of people got a lot less than that for their breakfast!

Can't believe what I am reading!

I have been a fan of the QF brand for quite a long time, but I have to admit their standards of late have been sloppy.

No they aren't perfect. On a couple of flights in J just over a year ago, they were not able to provide the meal selection on offer; poor catering. However they did offer me the choice to redeem a voucher or they offered a bottle of complimentary red wine. Actually I took the wine having a little bit of knowledge about what it was. Fair and reasonable to a degree.

QF culled a LOT of staff to survive the pandemic, which was to be expected. However, forward bookings would have indicated the amount of pax they would be expecting and allowed them to better manage the situation by providing appropriate staff levels. The amount of chaos at airports at both check-in and luggage handling has been, for lack of a better term, piss poor. And To make matters worse, for the CEO to come out and state that "passengers were not travel ready", is more than an unwanted slap in the face. They need to take ownership of this, offer an apology, both verbally and comps' to passengers.

I still recall in the ABC 4Corners article about QF32, Alan Joyce saying "We thought Rolls Royce's decision to say nothing was a mistake". I think QF's decision to say nothing about their problems is a mistake.

Cheers.

I will be in SYD next week, and will be there for a whole month. Anyone have any tips for a neat aviation adventure? For example, I'd like to fly on the Fokker 100, but I'm having difficulty figuring out which routes they're on, and which flights will cost me the least to get to it. Are there any other interesting aircraft types or flights that I can try? I'm aware of the Airnorth milk run flight, and will look into that as well.

EchoWSierra wrote:

I will be in SYD next week, and will be there for a whole month. Anyone have any tips for a neat aviation adventure? For example, I'd like to fly on the Fokker 100, but I'm having difficulty figuring out which routes they're on, and which flights will cost me the least to get to it. Are there any other interesting aircraft types or flights that I can try? I'm aware of the Airnorth milk run flight, and will look into that as well.

If you head north to Newcastle you're a big chance of getting an F100 to Brisbane on a Virgin ticket.

oskarclare wrote:

a36001 wrote:

Can we all just lay off Qantas for a while. They are not perfect but a bucket load better than what is offered in other parts of the world. So what if all you got was a muffin and coffee for breakfast! A lot of people got a lot less than that for their breakfast!

Can't believe what I am reading!

Its the fact they are charging substantially more then VA and JQ and providing substantially less then what they should be for that price. They want to be Australia's full-service carrier and charge accordingly so you would expect them to provide a service to justify that premium, which frankly at the moment, is not happening. I can completely get why people are peeved off. Yes there is are some conditions which they can't control but there's still a fair bit they have complete control over.

QF are charging what the market lets them get away with. It's like mobile phone service in the USA that is ridiculously expensive compared to other countries- but the free market supports that pricing.

First Bonanza frame : https://flic.kr/p/2nsEENR

They'll be taking 8 ntu LOT frames that I'm aware of thus far. No idea why the paint on this one has been stripped at VCV and flown back to BFI like that, but Bonanza rudder installed already.

RobK wrote:

First Bonanza frame : https://flic.kr/p/2nsEENR

They'll be taking 8 ntu LOT frames that I'm aware of thus far. No idea why the paint on this one has been stripped at VCV and flown back to BFI like that, but Bonanza rudder installed already.

Looks like it was pre fitted with wifi for LOT, I wonder if they will plan to offer an paid wifi service?

RobK wrote:

First Bonanza frame : https://flic.kr/p/2nsEENR

They'll be taking 8 ntu LOT frames that I'm aware of thus far. No idea why the paint on this one has been stripped at VCV and flown back to BFI like that, but Bonanza rudder installed already.

It’s Bonza not bonanza

A few days ago Rex announced increased services on 11 regional routes, while confirming it will exit the SYD-OOM route: https://australianaviation.com.au/2022/ ... ney-cooma/

qf789 wrote:

RobK wrote:

First Bonanza frame : https://flic.kr/p/2nsEENR

They'll be taking 8 ntu LOT frames that I'm aware of thus far. No idea why the paint on this one has been stripped at VCV and flown back to BFI like that, but Bonanza rudder installed already.

It’s Bonza not bonanza

Sometimes I confuse WIZZ Air (W6) with Sizzler

Edit: Showing my age

Couple of questions. This morning I saw an article online about the runway at Sunshine Coast was closed due to a possible "sinkhole" at on end of the runway. Since it's not been discussed here (I think) does that mean it was a nothing story?

And, when Boeing is cleared to resume deliveries of the B789, how many will QF be expecting in all of this backlog?

Re MCY, a JQ flight just took off so it is operational. Article from a reputable source below

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-06-15/ ... /101152926

qf2220 wrote:

Re MCY, a JQ flight just took off so it is operational. Article from a reputable source below

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-06-15/ ... /101152926

Thanks, the article I saw linked to an article behind a paywall at another site, so I couldn't see the details.

csturdiv wrote:

Couple of questions. This morning I saw an article online about the runway at Sunshine Coast was closed due to a possible "sinkhole" at on end of the runway. Since it's not been discussed here (I think) does that mean it was a nothing story?

And, when Boeing is cleared to resume deliveries of the B789, how many will QF be expecting in all of this backlog?

3, but I don't know where abouts in the line up repairs they are.

Gemuser

csturdiv wrote:

qf2220 wrote:

Re MCY, a JQ flight just took off so it is operational. Article from a reputable source below

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-06-15/ ... /101152926

Thanks, the article I saw linked to an article behind a paywall at another site, so I couldn't see the details.

The old runway should never have been closed
There was never any mention about the closure on the original proposal, seemed only when council did the deal with a private company that things changed
The northern part of the old runway has been slated for commercial development
A nice little earner for Palisade Investment Partners, but once it's gone it's gone
Sinkhole today, strong southerly or northerly winds or god forbid, an accident, closing the runway for perhaps days
There is no plan B
The bulls%*t excuse for shutting down the runway was to accommodate widebodies and their jet blast being too close to the old runway was never brought up on the draft proposal and IMO was just the excuse to close the runway and flog off the land up the northern end and provide Palisade with a significant backhander
Disgraceful!!!

As of today QF1 is routed vis SIN instead of DRW, A388 operating as well, OQJ operating today

https://twitter.com/aa380fanclub/status ... umBOnemgYw

Meanwhile there is about a 6 hour delay on MEL-PER-LHR, looks like ZNH will do a quick turnaround after arriving as QF10, ZND seems to be out of action atm having not flown for 5 days

I'm a regular flyer with sporting equipment and have just returned from my second trip to Fiji this year on VA. Our entire party had our luggage left behind in SYD on the flight over with no contact whatsoever from Virgin about the how or why. It was inconvenient but nothing more than that, being a member of this forum has given me a great insight into the challenges the industry is facing at the moment.

A friend managed to pull some strings to get our luggage placed on the next FJ flight but the explanation from people we know working at the airport is just alarming... the problems outlined ad nauseum in this forum are here to stay. Outsourcing, staff shortages across the board, the aviation industry across the board has lost its lustre as an employer of choice.

The more concerning issue for me was the group of roughly 15 pax waiting at the oversize baggage collection area while surfboards, golf clubs, prams etc were all stuck on the carousel ramp with no one there to unload it for over half an hour. I personally ended up pulling the luggage out myself and was joined by everyone else waiting... all airport staff in the area simply ignored us. SYD is now a glorified bus station.

Chipmunk1973 wrote:

qf789 wrote:

RobK wrote:

First Bonanza frame : https://flic.kr/p/2nsEENR

They'll be taking 8 ntu LOT frames that I'm aware of thus far. No idea why the paint on this one has been stripped at VCV and flown back to BFI like that, but Bonanza rudder installed already.

It’s Bonza not bonanza

Sometimes I confuse WIZZ Air (W6) with Sizzler

Edit: Showing my age

On my last trip home I managed to sneak in one last Sizzler, awwww the memories. That poor 'ol LOT tail has seen better days lol.

Qantas has recently applied to operate flights between Australia (SYD/BNE) and Samoa (APW)....

I've always wondered why QF never flew these routes... Apparently at VA, the Samoa flights were one of their highest revenue earners for international flights...

https://eglobaltravelmedia.com.au/qanta ... -to-samoa/

QuayWeeAir wrote:

Qantas has recently applied to operate flights between Australia (SYD/BNE) and Samoa (APW)....

I've always wondered why QF never flew these routes... Apparently at VA, the Samoa flights were one of their highest revenue earners for international flights...

https://eglobaltravelmedia.com.au/qanta ... -to-samoa/

That's exciting, always felt the pacific island had been underserviced by QF, even VA. Wonder if we'd see a low frequency BNE-TBU, or SYD-TBU? Pacific now more than ever seems like reasonably sensible routes for the Federal Government to sponsor connectivity as a part of their soft diplomatic push back into the Pacific.

I always wonder how a 738 copes on this route, as APW generate a huge amount of excess baggage, add in weather and en-route alternates. Perhaps if it's no issue could be good A220 routes moving forward?

VA has loaded some BNE-DRW and BNE-TSV flights into the booking engine on the E190, but on Airnorth (which Airnorth's E190s themselves are leased from Alliance).

TL's E190 seat config is 7J84Y.

Interesting that VA's gradual expansion internationally has yet to really include New Zealand, outside of Queenstown. Though with these PI flights you can use otherwise idle aircraft on overnight rotations whereas kiwi flights would require substantially more equipment that would have to be drawn from the already stretched domestic 737 fleet.

I'd say it's well into 2023 before we see substantial re-engagement by VA on the NZ flights, which is remarkable to consider from a competition perspective. The Tasman used to have daily A380s ploughing the trunk routes alongside Virgin, Air NZ, Qantas, Jetstar and a smattering of other tag on carriers like China Airlines and LATAM. Now with Virgin, Emirates and China Airlines and others gone the decline in capacity is remarkable. No wonder fares are so much higher.

aerokiwi wrote:

Interesting that VA's gradual expansion internationally has yet to really include New Zealand, outside of Queenstown. Though with these PI flights you can use otherwise idle aircraft on overnight rotations whereas kiwi flights would require substantially more equipment that would have to be drawn from the already stretched domestic 737 fleet.

I'd say it's well into 2023 before we see substantial re-engagement by VA on the NZ flights, which is remarkable to consider from a competition perspective. The Tasman used to have daily A380s ploughing the trunk routes alongside Virgin, Air NZ, Qantas, Jetstar and a smattering of other tag on carriers like China Airlines and LATAM. Now with Virgin, Emirates and China Airlines and others gone the decline in capacity is remarkable. No wonder fares are so much higher.

VA know they will never be able to have the frequencies across the Tasman offered by NZ and QF; this means they will not be very attractive to higher yielding business travellers so will need to compete on price. It is never ideal if the only thing you can compete with is price. On this basis I doubt VA is in any rush to return to trunk routes across the Tasman particularly as they are booming on their core Australian domestic routes with the fleet generally well utilised.
.