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iRISH251
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Tue Jul 26, 2022 10:08 am

AmricanShamrok wrote:
iRISH251 wrote:
Eagleboy wrote:
Utterly overblown story concerning the B777 doing the rounds of social. Media and the dodgy redtop media outlets.

B777 was behind schedule and flying from the Canaries around 2am. Flight crew weren't aware of overnight works on RWY 28/10. They weren't happy to take RWY34. Circled South of the city and then diverted to Shannon. Refuelled then landed at Dublin around 4am.

Irish Sun/Mirror and clickbait websites using comments on social media to claim its was "running out of fuel" and that the crew told the passenger to prepare for evacuation upon landing at Shannon.


Unlike most situations where 34 is in use, the wind was effectively calm so one can understand the crew making a safety-based decision as they did.

Out of interest, how often is 34 normally in use during normal daylight ops?


Almost never. The use of 16/34 imposes restrictions that affect traffic flow and of course, as this runway is shorter, it is only used when 10R/28L is unavailable for operational or weather reasons. More often it is used in the 16 direction in strong southerly winds. There were activity statistics published a few years ago in a study that considered the effect of closing 16/34 permanently. No doubt it is somewhere on the 'Net.
 
PhilipBass
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Tue Jul 26, 2022 10:32 am

deleted by author
 
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ClassicLover
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Tue Jul 26, 2022 11:03 am

Interesting article about how Aer Lingus have hardly cancelled any flights when compared to their competitors.

They also lay the blame squarely on other airports and handling partners.

Aer Lingus claims it is ‘performing better than almost any airline in Europe on holiday getaways’
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/aer-lingus-claims-it-is-performing-better-than-almost-any-airline-in-europe-on-holiday-getaways-41867952.html

Fair enough!
 
nickya340
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Tue Jul 26, 2022 11:40 am

ClassicLover wrote:
Interesting article about how Aer Lingus have hardly cancelled any flights when compared to their competitors.

They also lay the blame squarely on other airports and handling partners.

Aer Lingus claims it is ‘performing better than almost any airline in Europe on holiday getaways’
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/aer-lingus-claims-it-is-performing-better-than-almost-any-airline-in-europe-on-holiday-getaways-41867952.html

Fair enough!


I wouldn’t doubt it, They’re certainly doing better than a couple weeks ago with cancellations, eoghancorry on twitter says just a Boston flight was cancelled yesterday

I purposely booked emerald for a day trip last week because of EI cancellations but probably could have booked mainline
 
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OA260
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Tue Jul 26, 2022 11:41 am

LH982 wrote:
OA260 wrote:
Aer Lingus, the Daa and airport ground handlers have been asked to provide details of how they will manage the busy August bank holiday weekend.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40926167.html?

Lost and delayed bags at DUB is still a major issue.


1 hour 30 waiting for a bag yesterday but at least I got it.

The conveyor came on for 5 minutes, after which the screen showed a first bag delivered time, even though nothing was delivered for another 15-20 minutes


So the first bag time was massaged err I mean an error ;)
 
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OA260
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Tue Jul 26, 2022 11:48 am

planemanofnz wrote:
EIEIDW wrote:

Interesting.

Is there any possibility of EI code-sharing on this route?

I note they're also launching MEL - could be an interesting alternative for the Ireland-Australia market, if connection times work.


Near zero chance to be honest. Ireland has always had a cautious relationship with Israel and historically is closer to the Palestinians. I don't see a demand at all and transiting TLV is far from hassle free. Having been through TLV a few times and the security procedures and interrogations its not for the faint hearted. Maybe a few Anetters would do DUB - TLV -MEL but few else.

TLV is purely point to point and will most likely be filled with Israeli tourists and business . Maybe 20% will be pilgrims heading to the holy land if they are lucky and the climate remains stable. Its a great airline and route to have but lets not get excited about its limitations.
 
LH982
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Tue Jul 26, 2022 1:03 pm

OA260 wrote:
LH982 wrote:
OA260 wrote:
Aer Lingus, the Daa and airport ground handlers have been asked to provide details of how they will manage the busy August bank holiday weekend.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40926167.html?

Lost and delayed bags at DUB is still a major issue.


1 hour 30 waiting for a bag yesterday but at least I got it.

The conveyor came on for 5 minutes, after which the screen showed a first bag delivered time, even though nothing was delivered for another 15-20 minutes


So the first bag time was massaged err I mean an error ;)


I've seen similar before, but this was fairly blatant.
 
PhilipBass
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Tue Jul 26, 2022 1:03 pm

Ryanair in their earnings FAQ yesterday claimed 56% of all traffic into Ireland. That means probably roughly the same or more percentage for Dublin Airport. That must be an obscene amount of landing fees, service charges and passenger charges coming from just one airline whose Customers generally arrive through the front door of Terminal1 and take themselves with baggage on their back to Pier D. Dublin Airport isn't really a 30m passenger a year conventional airport. It is more like a 15m a year airport, then some and shouldn't be struggling as much as it is. Apart from Transatlantic, Aer Lingus is basically in the same mould as Ryanair i.e. a do-it-yourself LCC.
 
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OA260
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Tue Jul 26, 2022 2:48 pm

Revealed today :

Around 270 bags being misplaced at Dublin Airport daily

https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2022/07 ... committee/


Apple air tags must be booming .

--


SHP’s managing director Darren Moloney conceded that its standards “have simply not returned to pre-pandemic levels”.

He told the committee that the company currently has 2,897 lost bags.

https://www.thejournal.ie/baggage-handl ... 2-Jul2022/
 
EI321
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Tue Jul 26, 2022 3:39 pm

First A320neo for Aer Lingus is due to arrive in DUB on August 6th with another following the next day.
 
JAmie2k9
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Tue Jul 26, 2022 5:20 pm

ClassicLover wrote:
Interesting article about how Aer Lingus have hardly cancelled any flights when compared to their competitors.

They also lay the blame squarely on other airports and handling partners.

Aer Lingus claims it is ‘performing better than almost any airline in Europe on holiday getaways’
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/aer-lingus-claims-it-is-performing-better-than-almost-any-airline-in-europe-on-holiday-getaways-41867952.html

Fair enough!
.
Apart from long Check-In Delays at T2, first full year of new hand baggage policy and probally zero additional resources.
 
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OA260
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Wed Jul 27, 2022 11:41 am

9H - POP is doing the DUB - JFK for EI . All Economy
config .

https://www.flightradar24.com/data/aircraft/9h-pop
 
planemanofnz
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Wed Jul 27, 2022 12:18 pm

OA260 wrote:
TLV is purely point to point and will most likely be filled with Israeli tourists and business.

Thanks for the context.

Maybe they'll codeshare with AA or B6 through DUB onwards to the US too, to further give a boost to this new route?
 
3D101CA
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Wed Jul 27, 2022 2:23 pm

I do wonder if Aer Lingus would have a much bigger european presence if it wasn't for Ryanair.

Having a giant low cost carrier in your own backyard isn't easy when they can underprice you on everything. There is no way to compete with that as a full service carrier with higher operating costs. Plus Ryanair has a large amount of market share that Aer Lingus doesn't control.
 
Vicenza
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Wed Jul 27, 2022 2:59 pm

3D101CA wrote:
I do wonder if Aer Lingus would have a much bigger european presence if it wasn't for Ryanair.

Having a giant low cost carrier in your own backyard isn't easy when they can underprice you on everything. There is no way to compete with that as a full service carrier with higher operating costs. Plus Ryanair has a large amount of market share that Aer Lingus doesn't control.


Other than T/A it has been a very long time since Aer Lingus was a full-service airline. Equally, a very long time since they showed any great interest in Europe, and are only tunnel-focused on the US.
 
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shamrock350
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Wed Jul 27, 2022 3:50 pm

The Aer Lingus short haul network has been stagnant for the best part of a decade now, they've been forced to retreat from many markets and have become dependant on summer sun to provide growth. They've done nothing to address a very obvious pattern of decline, presumably because they don't consider the fight with Ryanair worth the time and money required but this policy also leaves them open and vulnerable to new competitors. In recent years we've seen Swiss, Air France, Lufthansa, KLM, TAP, LOT, SAS etc. either return or enhance their schedules to Ireland. Aer Lingus now struggles to maintain what were once bread and butter routes, previously safe from Ryanair and of no interest to the big European legacy carriers, they now face competition from both ends and are often left to pick up the scraps.

They've been very lucky someone like Wizzair hasn't made Dublin their next focus, a new entrant battling it out on fares would devastate Aer Lingus' marketshare and relevance. In a way, Ryanair has actually protected Aer Lingus from this kind of onslaught, most won't go up against them in their own backyard so Aer Lingus gets a free pass but that won't last forever.

The last major shake up in short haul would have been the creation of Aer Lingus Regional which saved their UK marketshare. The European network is long overdue some similar thinking or it will continue to become increasingly one dimensional and exposed to new entrants.

The whole 'DUBHUB' strategy appears to have little to no impact on the long term prospects of the short haul business, any connections from European cities are treated as an added bonus rather than something to genuinely build a network around.
 
Galwayman
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Wed Jul 27, 2022 4:52 pm

shamrock350 wrote:
The Aer Lingus short haul network has been stagnant for the best part of a decade now, they've been forced to retreat from many markets and have become dependant on summer sun to provide growth. They've done nothing to address a very obvious pattern of decline, presumably because they don't consider the fight with Ryanair worth the time and money required but this policy also leaves them open and vulnerable to new competitors. In recent years we've seen Swiss, Air France, Lufthansa, KLM, TAP, LOT, SAS etc. either return or enhance their schedules to Ireland. Aer Lingus now struggles to maintain what were once bread and butter routes, previously safe from Ryanair and of no interest to the big European legacy carriers, they now face competition from both ends and are often left to pick up the scraps.

They've been very lucky someone like Wizzair hasn't made Dublin their next focus, a new entrant battling it out on fares would devastate Aer Lingus' marketshare and relevance. In a way, Ryanair has actually protected Aer Lingus from this kind of onslaught, most won't go up against them in their own backyard so Aer Lingus gets a free pass but that won't last forever.

The last major shake up in short haul would have been the creation of Aer Lingus Regional which saved their UK marketshare. The European network is long overdue some similar thinking or it will continue to become increasingly one dimensional and exposed to new entrants.

The whole 'DUBHUB' strategy appears to have little to no impact on the long term prospects of the short haul business, any connections from European cities are treated as an added bonus rather than something to genuinely build a network around.


EI need something like the A220 if they're serious about Europe or else start connecting with FR Europe flights to EI long haul
 
PhilipBass
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Wed Jul 27, 2022 5:02 pm

Galwayman wrote:
shamrock350 wrote:
or else start connecting with FR Europe flights to EI long haul

would you put your destiny in the hands of DAA? I agree they should, all things being equal, but DAA own the football pitch on which they play.
 
BrianDromey
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Wed Jul 27, 2022 5:39 pm

Galwayman wrote:
EI need something like the A220 if they're serious about Europe or else start connecting with FR Europe flights to EI long haul


I have long felt that EI have lost interest in their short haul network and do think the A220 would be perfect for many EI routes, IF the seat-costs can get close enough to FR’s -8200 sardine cans. I can easily imagine a couple of A220s at BHD, ORK and SNN. A pair of -100’s DUB for LCY, if they wanted to go back there. Another 8 would easily find work across the peak UK regional routes, off-peak European routes and exploring new markets in the Baltics and Scandinavia. With ~20 Long Haul aircraft (LR’s and A330s), the network will soon look a bit imbalanced. A fleet of around 50 short-haul aircraft with the balance being A320s feels about right.
I can only assume the returns are steady, but not so attractive that anyone fancies the hard work of developing and promoting it internally in the face of FR competition and IAG targets. EI do need to be ready for the inevitable slot grab when the new runway opens too.

That said the 6 new A320neo’s to come will be a welcome addition - albeit one for one replacements of retired A320s and A321s. And although modest, there has been some growth in SH at DUB over the years. SNN has lost the based A320, ORK has lost 2 based A320s and BHD is down to a single A320. Further back the two VS A320s went to DUB as well. The ATRs freed up some capacity too. Hardly FR-scale growth, but steady enough and not the complete stagnation the fleet numbers suggest.
 
EIBPI
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Wed Jul 27, 2022 7:03 pm

Aer Lingus haven’t done much to make themselves relevant as a carrier. I fly home to Ireland quite a bit from a few major cities in mainland Europe. I’m fairly price sensitive (like everyone), but also quite schedule sensitive due to the nature of the trips and combining these with other commitments. I’ve been on Aer Lingus once in quite a few years, and even that was in one direction only.

Galwayman wrote:
EI need something like the A220 if they're serious about Europe or else start connecting with FR Europe flights to EI long haul


That wouldn’t be any good for the consumer. The last thing one would want is Ryanair and Aer Lingus teaming up on anything at all. The only people to gain would be the shareholders and corporate profits.
 
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ClassicLover
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Wed Jul 27, 2022 8:04 pm

Yet pre-pandemic Aer Lingus made the highest percentage return on invested capital in IAG Group.

So network quibbles and leaving marketshare on the table comments aside, they seem to do exceedingly well financially, so perhaps it's not all doom and gloom?
 
YUAND
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Thu Jul 28, 2022 10:43 am

ClassicLover wrote:
Yet pre-pandemic Aer Lingus made the highest percentage return on invested capital in IAG Group.

So network quibbles and leaving marketshare on the table comments aside, they seem to do exceedingly well financially, so perhaps it's not all doom and gloom?


I’ve brought this up on these threads before and my question remains: yes they’re doing good but can they do significantly better and what is the opportunity cost of their approach?

By neglecting their European network they’re making it very difficult for potentially loyal customers to default to flying Aer Lingus.

For instance those of us with AerClub accounts can earn avios very easily on TATL, UK flights and flights to main Western European capitals and sun destinations but other than that we’re forced onto SAS, FR, LO and others, which in my opinion makes being loyal to Aer Lingus quite unattractive and difficult.

With that in mind, on the routes they do operate, they have to compete with full-service carriers on service and FR on price, neither of which they have a competitive advantage in.

If they worked on their short haul network, it has the potential for the following:

- Improved feed for long-haul flights enabling the expansion of that network which is very profitable for them.
- Potential to create a very loyal customer base given that Ireland is an island nation. This would also require a significant marketing effort.
- Risk is spread across multiple markets as opposed to the airline being heavily dependent on the US market.

I accept that their long haul routes are likely to be a lot more profitable than their short haul network but if the short haul network does shrink to just LHR and a few other European capitals, would that just lead to EI slowly fading into irrelevance?
 
PhilipBass
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Thu Jul 28, 2022 11:00 am

outside of Heathrow, bucket and spade routes and US Aer Lingus don't need A32X or larger.
Doesn't have to be A220, could be Embraer and God knows Embraer would like the business.
2 abreast instead of 3 abreast is a luxury in itself which placates passengers
 
Eirules
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Thu Jul 28, 2022 12:41 pm

I’ve long since argued that for EI to re-establish themselves on the European routes, a complete rethink is required;

Rejoin OneWorld (even as a connect partner). Their competitors on major hub routes such as LHR, FRA, AMS, CDG & even ZRH & LIS are all in major alliances and business (and to a lesser extent tourists) get the alliance benefits.

Put a proper short haul business product on the core routes ex DUB. I simply refuse to accept LH , AF, KL and even lesser carriers such as TP can operate flights with a business cabin but EI can’t. It doesn’t have to be what we see on a TK A321 but an enhanced AerSpace. And those flying business on transatlantic routes including JV partners should automatically be booked into this instead of the current nonsense that is booked into economy on the DUB-LHR sector on a BA J ticket.

Build a decent lounge in your home airport that actually allows people to eat in it instead of the pathetic rubber cheese and pre made sandwiches

Overnight in key European markets just as almost every competitor is doing in Dublin

If Aer Lingus don’t invest, they’ll continue to decline. A recession is almost certainly on the way & their complete exposure to the US is an incredibly dangerous strategy
 
PhilipBass
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Thu Jul 28, 2022 1:00 pm

when is this weakened currency rate going to start hurting them:
https://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=EUR&to=USD

They are paying for fuel in dollars and I think IAG are only half-hedged. Wouldn't most of their transatlantic Customers be predominately European so they wouldn't be benefitting from Americans having greater purchasing power. Fuel costs are a bigger unit cost for transatlantic than a quick hop to Heathrow.
 
Eagleboy
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Thu Jul 28, 2022 4:45 pm

Eirules wrote:
I’ve long since argued that for EI to re-establish themselves on the European routes, a complete rethink is required;
.........
.........
.........
.........
If Aer Lingus don’t invest, they’ll continue to decline. A recession is almost certainly on the way & their complete exposure to the US is an incredibly dangerous strategy

I 100% agree.
Unfortunately there is close to zero chance of this happening. The current CEO is basically absent, punching her ticket 3 days a week until she moves somewhere else inside IAG. Their is zero leadership among EI exec team. Paying back IAG seems to be the only goal.
The recent omnishambles of their DUB operation is a sign of this. They have a network/handling partners staff shortage and a misplaced baggage problem. For months they couldn't manage to have stuff to sell on their aircraft. They are hiring in expensive aircraft daily to operate key routes. They are cancelling flights due to lack of staff. They are losing groundstaff who are fed up of no support from above, daily firefighting and abuse from customers. .
This is the time that EI Mgmt think they should have an argument with their own staff.
 
TUGMASTER
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Thu Jul 28, 2022 6:50 pm

Quick question for those that know.
Haven’t flown EI short haul since late 2019,
What should I expect in Y…
It wasn’t much pre-covid… I’ll assume it’s sweet FA now…?
Anyone..???
 
TUGMASTER
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Thu Jul 28, 2022 11:24 pm

Cheers for that…
Boots meal deal it is.
 
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OA260
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 6:36 am

Aer Lingus Will Not Review Shannon Cabin Crew Base Closure

https://www.clare.fm/news/aviation/aer- ... e-closure/

--

Aer Lingus calls on Dublin Airport to scrap early arrival advice

https://www.dublinlive.ie/news/dublin-n ... 598002.amp

Aer Lingus has said that any reversal of the SNN base would put its TATL services at risk .

--


Lost airport luggage dumped in bin by baggage handlers at Dublin Airport

https://www.itv.com/news/utv/2022-07-27 ... e-handlers
 
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ClassicLover
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 7:21 am

OA260 wrote:
Lost airport luggage dumped in bin by baggage handlers at Dublin Airport

https://www.itv.com/news/utv/2022-07-27 ... e-handlers


You have to wonder what was in those bags if it is "attracting vermin". I'd still be really upset if they disposed of my bag in a bin like that. Sure, you will be compensated up to the limit, but you still need to go and buy all new replacement items.
 
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OA260
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 9:10 am

ClassicLover wrote:
OA260 wrote:
Lost airport luggage dumped in bin by baggage handlers at Dublin Airport

https://www.itv.com/news/utv/2022-07-27 ... e-handlers


You have to wonder what was in those bags if it is "attracting vermin". I'd still be really upset if they disposed of my bag in a bin like that. Sure, you will be compensated up to the limit, but you still need to go and buy all new replacement items.


Indeed if it was meat or dairy products then thats kind of different but then again if they had their operation in order the bags would have been delivered. The compensation should be like an EU261 thing maybe setting a minimum and maximum. EUR1000 per bag min might concentrate the minds of the management to get their finger out and work a lot harder.
 
PhilipBass
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 9:30 am

ClassicLover wrote:
OA260 wrote:
Lost airport luggage dumped in bin by baggage handlers at Dublin Airport

https://www.itv.com/news/utv/2022-07-27 ... e-handlers


You have to wonder what was in those bags if it is "attracting vermin". I'd still be really upset if they disposed of my bag in a bin like that. Sure, you will be compensated up to the limit, but you still need to go and buy all new replacement items.

hermetically seal them in clear pallet wrap if there is a nasty niff off the bags but don't throw them out for Christ's sake.
edit: and call pest control.
Last edited by PhilipBass on Fri Jul 29, 2022 9:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
 
PhilipBass
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 9:32 am

Which Airlines do Sky Handling Partners serve in Dublin.

edit: this seems the partial answer
https://www.dublinairport.com/latest-ne ... in-airport
 
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AmricanShamrok
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 11:14 am

OA260 wrote:
Aer Lingus has said that any reversal of the SNN base would put its TATL services at risk .

I understand it's cheaper for EI not to maintain a base at SNN (they've obviously crunched the numbers) but I don't understand how. To me, surely the costs of transporting crew by ground every day from DUB to SNN (and vice versa) and overnighting them in a local hotel are quite substantial. Could anyone shed some light on the costs of operating a crew base or give examples of what they are? They may be blatantly obvious when described (and if so, apologies!).

On another note, it's reassuring to hear from Ms. Embleton that the SNN-LHR route is commercially viable so soon after its resumption.
 
Orlaithdub
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 12:49 pm

AmricanShamrok wrote:
OA260 wrote:
Aer Lingus has said that any reversal of the SNN base would put its TATL services at risk .

I understand it's cheaper for EI not to maintain a base at SNN (they've obviously crunched the numbers) but I don't understand how. To me, surely the costs of transporting crew by ground every day from DUB to SNN (and vice versa) and overnighting them in a local hotel are quite substantial. Could anyone shed some light on the costs of operating a crew base or give examples of what they are? They may be blatantly obvious when described (and if so, apologies!).

On another note, it's reassuring to hear from Ms. Embleton that the SNN-LHR route is commercially viable so soon after its resumption.



Its a bit of a situation where Aer Lingus hasnt much option for manoeuvre. The crew based in SNN were on old contracts that are no longer in place (everyone who joined before 2009 is on this contract). So yes its cheaper to send crew back and forward on taxis from Dublin and even paying hotel accommodation rather than having those crew on old contracts based there. Also the base is very seasonal, winter time looses one long haul flight and passenger loads can be extremely poor, and you would still have to pay the crew there even if they arent flying much.
You may ask: why wouldnt they create new contracts/cheaper like in Belfast or Manchester.
Because all the crew in the republic of Ireland are kept in the same contract even if they move bases. Lets say your basic is 50k a year in cork (an example) if you transfer to Dublin, it’ll be the same. You cant suffer a paycut because of base transfer inside the Republic of Ireland. So if they wanted to open a base in Shannon, the former shannon crew who many transferred to Dublin and Cork would be the first ones to show interest in moving back and would again leave aer lingus with a huge bill in a base that has a seasonal operation. At least in Dublin/Cork these crew are being paid the same but also used in full capacity in relation to hours worked. Hope this clarifies.
 
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shamrock350
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 1:27 pm

Continued improvement in Aer Lingus performance in the second quarter but still lagging slighty behind its IAG counterparts.

Image

- Q2 Profit €15m; first profit post-Covid
- H1 Loss €95m; down from €192 same period last year
- 78% load factor
- Short haul leisure strongest performer
- 1% cancellation rate

https://www.iairgroup.com/~/media/Files ... tation.pdf

Full presentation very light on extra detail for Aer Lingus but worth a read anyway.
 
PhilipBass
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 1:38 pm

Only one reference to Dollar but Currency mentioned a number of times.
• Currency differences cost impact (-€75m vs -€21m in 2Q-19)
what is that all about then.
why aren't they making money out of wealthy Americans. Are they the LCC of the airlines travelling between US and Dublin.
 
Clydenairways
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Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2007 8:27 am

Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 2:10 pm

Anybody know any update on the former EI A321's that were ferried from storage to be converted to freighters?
 
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ClassicLover
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 3:46 pm

PhilipBass wrote:
Only one reference to Dollar but Currency mentioned a number of times.
• Currency differences cost impact (-€75m vs -€21m in 2Q-19)
what is that all about then.
why aren't they making money out of wealthy Americans. Are they the LCC of the airlines travelling between US and Dublin.


I would say it is because the EUR and USD are trading almost at parity (€1.00 is worth US$1.02).

Since certain costs are denominated in USD (aircraft leases tend to be, then you have fuel on the other side of the Atlantic and so on), Aer Lingus would not be getting as much bang for their buck, so it's costing them money. When the currency goes the other way and the Euro is worth more, it's beneficial for the airlines in Euro using countries.
 
BrianDromey
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 4:38 pm

ClassicLover wrote:
You've proven your own argument there to some extent, since there has been a bunch of investment into the long-haul fleet. Aer Lingus is not a large airline, so not much more was really required. The A320 fleet is only now coming due for renewal and you'd hardly expect it to be replaced early. I believe mood lighting also came post IAG.

Either way, it's up to the people running Aer Lingus to plan their CapEx and pass it along to IAG, so the Irish team are responsible.


I agree, but the formula here is simple and the smaller the capital number is, the higher the potential return. In broad terms IB and BA have already made significant progress rolling over their fleets and technology. Roughly around 10 Billion has been invested in those aircraft, Vs around 2.5 Billion at EI over the same period (these are my figures and super rough). Fundamentally, BA and IB are not 4 times more profitable than EI, so the return at EI will appear better on that basis. You’re right though, its up to the EI management team to put proposals to the IAG board that justify the investment. The lack of investment implies that the team are unable to do that - which is worrying.

ClassicLover wrote:
Since certain costs are denominated in USD (aircraft leases tend to be, then you have fuel on the other side of the Atlantic and so on), Aer Lingus would not be getting as much bang for their buck, so it's costing them money. When the currency goes the other way and the Euro is worth more, it's beneficial for the airlines in Euro using countries.

Does being part of the OW JV change this at all? The JV has significant income in USD, EUR and GBP, I wonder if they can do some internal financial acrobatics to minimise the currency swings? Could the US income pay more of the fuel and leasing costs, for example?
 
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ClassicLover
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 5:00 pm

BrianDromey wrote:
Does being part of the OW JV change this at all? The JV has significant income in USD, EUR and GBP, I wonder if they can do some internal financial acrobatics to minimise the currency swings? Could the US income pay more of the fuel and leasing costs, for example?


It doesn't yet, because even though EI are approved to be in it, they still have some work to do before it all becomes operational.

Usually the group will currency hedge to lock in the price of their money to allow for stronger planning and to reduce the impact of fluctuations. They would also do as you say, use their USD to pay USD, depending on how much they have. There would also be times when it's more beneficial to use X currency against Y depending on exchange rates etc. That's really done as a matter of course really. Sometimes they come out ahead, sometimes not, bit like fuel hedging. You do it right and you do well, do it badly and you lose a lot of money. It's all a gamble to one extent or another in that area. Though an informed one!
 
Orlaithdub
Posts: 38
Joined: Sun Oct 22, 2017 7:24 pm

Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 5:29 pm

ClassicLover wrote:
BrianDromey wrote:
Does being part of the OW JV change this at all? The JV has significant income in USD, EUR and GBP, I wonder if they can do some internal financial acrobatics to minimise the currency swings? Could the US income pay more of the fuel and leasing costs, for example?


It doesn't yet, because even though EI are approved to be in it, they still have some work to do before it all becomes operational.

Usually the group will currency hedge to lock in the price of their money to allow for stronger planning and to reduce the impact of fluctuations. They would also do as you say, use their USD to pay USD, depending on how much they have. There would also be times when it's more beneficial to use X currency against Y depending on exchange rates etc. That's really done as a matter of course really. Sometimes they come out ahead, sometimes not, bit like fuel hedging. You do it right and you do well, do it badly and you lose a lot of money. It's all a gamble to one extent or another in that area. Though an informed one!



Can you elaborate on what aer lingus has left in doing to integrate the JV in full and also when is this meant to happen? Genuinely interested if you could share.
Last edited by Orlaithdub on Fri Jul 29, 2022 5:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
Orlaithdub
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 5:32 pm

I noticed Aer Lingus stopped selling the early AMS/CDG transit flights to the early atlantic flights (JFK 105, ORD 123, BOS 133). This is because of ongoing delays in those two airports so they only sell the connection to the afternoon jfk/ord/bos. If Aer Lingus overnighted aircraft in CDG/AMS for earlier departures from those airports, they could still sell connections onto the early transatlantic flights.
 
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ClassicLover
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 6:41 pm

Orlaithdub wrote:
Can you elaborate on what aer lingus has left in doing to integrate the JV in full and also when is this meant to happen? Genuinely interested if you could share.


I'm not privy to what exactly they have left to do or when it's meant to happen, I'm afraid. It's clear it's still in progress because once it's done you'll see the EI flights as options on the other airlines like BA, Iberia and Finnair when making a booking and vice versa.
 
Eirules
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 7:21 pm

ClassicLover wrote:
Orlaithdub wrote:
Can you elaborate on what aer lingus has left in doing to integrate the JV in full and also when is this meant to happen? Genuinely interested if you could share.


I'm not privy to what exactly they have left to do or when it's meant to happen, I'm afraid. It's clear it's still in progress because once it's done you'll see the EI flights as options on the other airlines like BA, Iberia and Finnair when making a booking and vice versa.



I’m not going to pretend I know the ins & outs of how the JV works but I find it very odd that on BA.com I can book a NYC-DUB and it won’t offer me the direct EI option but does LGA-YYZ AA & YYZ-DUB EI or that I can’t book BOS-DUB or LAS-DUB using EI metal for the transatlantic on BA.com but I can book CUN-PHL-DUB on AA/EI metal
 
LH982
Posts: 290
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 8:11 pm

Clydenairways wrote:
Anybody know any update on the former EI A321's that were ferried from storage to be converted to freighters?


All now canceled to the Cayman Islands. Still siting at Lasham with no work done. Unclear if the work will be done at Lasham, or if they are just stored waiting for slots at another location
 
LH982
Posts: 290
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Fri Jul 29, 2022 8:12 pm

Clydenairways wrote:
Anybody know any update on the former EI A321's that were ferried from storage to be converted to freighters?


All now canceled to the Cayman Islands. Still siting at Lasham with no work done. Unclear if the work will be done at Lasham, or if they are just stored waiting for slots at another location
 
Avoation1091
Posts: 26
Joined: Sat Oct 03, 2020 2:48 pm

Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Sat Jul 30, 2022 6:19 am

Orlaithdub wrote:
AmricanShamrok wrote:
OA260 wrote:
Aer Lingus has said that any reversal of the SNN base would put its TATL services at risk .

I understand it's cheaper for EI not to maintain a base at SNN (they've obviously crunched the numbers) but I don't understand how. To me, surely the costs of transporting crew by ground every day from DUB to SNN (and vice versa) and overnighting them in a local hotel are quite substantial. Could anyone shed some light on the costs of operating a crew base or give examples of what they are? They may be blatantly obvious when described (and if so, apologies!).

On another note, it's reassuring to hear from Ms. Embleton that the SNN-LHR route is commercially viable so soon after its resumption.



Its a bit of a situation where Aer Lingus hasnt much option for manoeuvre. The crew based in SNN were on old contracts that are no longer in place (everyone who joined before 2009 is on this contract). So yes its cheaper to send crew back and forward on taxis from Dublin and even paying hotel accommodation rather than having those crew on old contracts based there. Also the base is very seasonal, winter time looses one long haul flight and passenger loads can be extremely poor, and you would still have to pay the crew there even if they arent flying much.
You may ask: why wouldnt they create new contracts/cheaper like in Belfast or Manchester.
Because all the crew in the republic of Ireland are kept in the same contract even if they move bases. Lets say your basic is 50k a year in cork (an example) if you transfer to Dublin, it’ll be the same. You cant suffer a paycut because of base transfer inside the Republic of Ireland. So if they wanted to open a base in Shannon, the former shannon crew who many transferred to Dublin and Cork would be the first ones to show interest in moving back and would again leave aer lingus with a huge bill in a base that has a seasonal operation. At least in Dublin/Cork these crew are being paid the same but also used in full capacity in relation to hours worked. Hope this clarifies.


Sorry im still a bit confused. SNN only looses JFK for a few weeks Jan-Feb and id say loads are low that time anyway even from Dublin.

EI had LHR/ACE from SNN aswell during the winter so surely that could have kept the crew going. This has been reported since 2009 that EI have wanted to close the base. Its defo not just because of COVID.

Do you know if any of the Shannon crew have bid to fly from Shannon now even though they are DUB based? It surely must be a inconvenience for DUB crew to have to stay an extra night away from home
 
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chrisnh
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Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Sat Jul 30, 2022 1:23 pm

DL ups BOS from 763 to 764 this fall.
 
TUGMASTER
Posts: 1667
Joined: Wed Jul 07, 2004 8:56 pm

Re: Irish 7/22: Sunshine and Neos

Sat Jul 30, 2022 7:56 pm

Saw a newly converted A330-343(P2f) arrive at DUB today. M-MWYL still in quasi HiFly Malta scheme with plenty of green primer from the work

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