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SCFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Wed Aug 03, 2022 10:30 am

zkncj wrote:
I didn’t think VA’s services to ZQN had started yet? They kept getting pushed back, and was looking like late 2022 if they ever start it. Missing out on the 2022 ski season.

VA 1.0 must of lost some serious cash on the Tasman? They had an pretty sizeable network pre-covid that was if not on far with QF.

From memory they had
BNE-AKL/WLG/CHC/ZQN/DUD
OOL-AKL/CHC
SYD-AKL/WLG/CHC/ZQN
MEL-AKL/WLG/CHC/ZQN


VA's East Coast - ZQN services according to the GDS actually starts in November of this year, although going by Velocity FF's CEO word I'm tipping that the ZQN service will 'finally' go ahead instead of being deferred/delayed again.

Replace OOL-CHC (didn't last long) with seasonal NTL-AKL that was operating before COVID shutdowns.
NTL-AKL was a 3 weekly service co-subsidised by Newcastle Council and NSW Government from memory on a seasonal basis. That only lasted 1 season before COVID shut that down permanently. From memory the loads on NTL-AKL wasn't meeting 'break-even' standards for a partial subsidised route and at best was half-full on some flights.
 
PR211
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Fri Aug 05, 2022 3:01 am

Hi there

I've been thinking of underserved routes in the Australian domestic market that have the potential for an airline like Bonza to jump on. I realise Bonza are avoiding Sydney for now due to rumoured unfavourable commercial conditions. However, I was kind of surprised to discover there are no direct flights between Sydney and Rockhampton at the moment. Could this route be a possible candidate for a carrier like Bonza or JQ? The Fitzroy basin has close to 200,000 residents. Plenty of flights to and from Brissy. Would have thought there could be justification for at least a daily flight between Sydney and Rocky. Seems to make more commercial sense then routes like Bonza's proposed NTL to PPP?
 
Obzerva
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Fri Aug 05, 2022 3:18 am

PR211 wrote:
Hi there

I've been thinking of underserved routes in the Australian domestic market that have the potential for an airline like Bonza to jump on. I realise Bonza are avoiding Sydney for now due to rumoured unfavourable commercial conditions. However, I was kind of surprised to discover there are no direct flights between Sydney and Rockhampton at the moment. Could this route be a possible candidate for a carrier like Bonza or JQ? The Fitzroy basin has close to 200,000 residents. Plenty of flights to and from Brissy. Would have thought there could be justification for at least a daily flight between Sydney and Rocky. Seems to make more commercial sense then routes like Bonza's proposed NTL to PPP?


I think routes like this may depend on how the domestic airlines behave once SWZ opens.

If they run the current SYD pretty much as is, then anything at SWZ is extra then Bonza many not get as much of a look in.

On the flipside, if QF, VA, JQ and ZL start to reduce a few frequencies here and there, even by say 10%, that may be enough of a spur for SYD management to incentivise new services/airlines.
 
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qf2220
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Fri Aug 05, 2022 4:07 am

@mods, admin question. For threads like this which roll over month to month, can we get an automatic resubscription for the following month's thread when it starts?

If no, no problems.
 
NZ516
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Fri Aug 05, 2022 4:09 am

SCFlyer wrote:
zkncj wrote:
I didn’t think VA’s services to ZQN had started yet? They kept getting pushed back, and was looking like late 2022 if they ever start it. Missing out on the 2022 ski season.

VA 1.0 must of lost some serious cash on the Tasman? They had an pretty sizeable network pre-covid that was if not on far with QF.

From memory they had
BNE-AKL/WLG/CHC/ZQN/DUD
OOL-AKL/CHC
SYD-AKL/WLG/CHC/ZQN
MEL-AKL/WLG/CHC/ZQN


VA's East Coast - ZQN services according to the GDS actually starts in November of this year, although going by Velocity FF's CEO word I'm tipping that the ZQN service will 'finally' go ahead instead of being deferred/delayed again.

Replace OOL-CHC (didn't last long) with seasonal NTL-AKL that was operating before COVID shutdowns.
NTL-AKL was a 3 weekly service co-subsidised by Newcastle Council and NSW Government from memory on a seasonal basis. That only lasted 1 season before COVID shut that down permanently. From memory the loads on NTL-AKL wasn't meeting 'break-even' standards for a partial subsidised route and at best was half-full on some flights.


There was also a VA BNE to HLZ 737 service that ended a few years ago.
 
qf2048
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Fri Aug 05, 2022 11:46 am

I just took a qf flight syd to bne. Interesting to see a rex flight attendant on board as pax. Presumably heading home after a shift.
 
anstar
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Fri Aug 05, 2022 12:15 pm

I wonder if Bonza also have a 2nd strategy... which is to make all the fuss about secondary routes with the real intention of going onto the main leisure routes... kind of a distraction to QF/JQ. They seem to have a smart bunch of people working there and I just dont see this secondary strategy with 737's working.
 
AMP44
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Fri Aug 05, 2022 12:33 pm

Fuling wrote:
tullamarine wrote:
CostaDelSol90 wrote:
This is just a random render someone did at home and then posted on Facebook. It’s not the design.

Correct It is just a photoshop someone dreamed up. It doesn't even reflect the revised corporate logo and it is still unknown if the revised corporate logo will also lead to any sort of revised livery.


Yeah, and the ever famous DJ's Aviation picked it up and 'reported' on it.

This scheme is literally an invert of the current livery, with a bit of QF, ultimately giving it the AirAsia look. Personally I am hoping for a bit of purple as well, if they do update their livery.

He didn't "reported" on it. He literally tweeted that is was a design done by one of his followers.
https://twitter.com/DjsAviation/status/ ... 1746835457
 
sand26391
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Fri Aug 05, 2022 1:06 pm

Probably too early to ask, but curious at the same time.

Any idea of how the booking or demand has been for the SYD-BLR flight by Qantas?
I was randomly checking the fares in Nov/Dec and the fares have been extremely high (Mostly in Dec).
 
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LoganTheBogan
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Fri Aug 05, 2022 3:18 pm

qf2048 wrote:
I just took a qf flight syd to bne. Interesting to see a rex flight attendant on board as pax. Presumably heading home after a shift.


They do it all the time out of regional ports, especially WGA. Quite common to see ZL FAs and pilots flying in and out on QantasLink.

I’ve noticed it’s either because:

A) they need to operate an upcoming flight and have come from operating a flight elsewhere resulting in no available company flights at the time.

B) the company flight that is available is full/going to be full, is payload restricted due to WX etc or is overweight.
 
NZ516
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Fri Aug 05, 2022 11:38 pm

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/220805-qfns23perjnb

Qantas makes changes to their Perth to Johannesburg service.
 
bunumuring
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Sat Aug 06, 2022 10:14 pm

Hey guys
Anyone know what’s happening right now here at Sydney airport?
QF91 SYD-NOU has taxied back from the third runway before takeoff followed by 4 fire engines and two other emergency cars.
It’s currently sitting in the middle of the cross runway with three fire engines behind it, one alongside it plus the two other emergency vechiles next to it.
VH-VZJ ….
Hope it’s all ok! I’m watching it all from the Rydges Hotel.
Cheers
Bunumuring

UPDATE:
It’s just taxied along the runway towards Cooks River / Western end and is sitting off the end of the terminal out of my sight. All six emergency vehicles followed it with lights blazing. Quite a sight! No idea what’s going on. According to FR24, it must’ve at least started it’s take off roll before stopping and returning.
Anyone currently on Shep’s Mound would’ve had a great view of whatever’s going on!
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Sun Aug 07, 2022 12:31 am

bunumuring wrote:
Hey guys
Anyone know what’s happening right now here at Sydney airport?
QF91 SYD-NOU has taxied back from the third runway before takeoff followed by 4 fire engines and two other emergency cars.
It’s currently sitting in the middle of the cross runway with three fire engines behind it, one alongside it plus the two other emergency vechiles next to it.
VH-VZJ ….
Hope it’s all ok! I’m watching it all from the Rydges Hotel.
Cheers
Bunumuring

UPDATE:
It’s just taxied along the runway towards Cooks River / Western end and is sitting off the end of the terminal out of my sight. All six emergency vehicles followed it with lights blazing. Quite a sight! No idea what’s going on. According to FR24, it must’ve at least started it’s take off roll before stopping and returning.
Anyone currently on Shep’s Mound would’ve had a great view of whatever’s going on!


According to the following news report ATC reported to the crew that the right engine had flames coming out of it, so it was shut down and passengers are being moved to a different aircraft so the flight can continue

https://twitter.com/9newssyd/status/155 ... IodMVIayfg
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Sun Aug 07, 2022 12:32 am

QF will drop ADL tag on MEL-DEL from 15 August

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/220806-qfaug22del
 
Pcoder
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Sun Aug 07, 2022 12:57 am

https://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-u ... 2d9fa3388f

A bit more news about QF91, it appears one of the engines started producing lots of smoke, not sure if any of the engine warnings went off and when the crew notice they shut down the engine and called on assistance.
 
smi0006
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Sun Aug 07, 2022 6:40 am

qf789 wrote:
QF will drop ADL tag on MEL-DEL from 15 August

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/220806-qfaug22del


Interesting what’s allowed them to removed the ADL stop? Load factor, or have they got a better understanding of fuel consumption, and weather to better plan non-stop? Sounds like India is remaining in the QF-network post Covid!
 
Whatsaptudo
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Sun Aug 07, 2022 7:24 am

It was planned cabin crew duty times that required the stop. They must have come to some arrangement (crew rest like LA probably)
 
vhebb
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Sun Aug 07, 2022 8:26 am

Anyone know if any of the 8 A332s that do the long distance flying have had those new crew rest curtains fitted yet im the mid economy cabin?

Some renders were released a few months ago.
 
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QuayWeeAir
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Sun Aug 07, 2022 10:33 am

smi0006 wrote:
qf789 wrote:
QF will drop ADL tag on MEL-DEL from 15 August

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/220806-qfaug22del


Interesting what’s allowed them to removed the ADL stop? Load factor, or have they got a better understanding of fuel consumption, and weather to better plan non-stop? Sounds like India is remaining in the QF-network post Covid!


New Zealand based JetConnect crew will be operating these Qantas flights, much like the current Brisbane - LA flights... The NZ Cabin Crew EBA allows the crew to operate longer flights without the need for a "proper" crew rest area... Currently the cabin crew set up the last three middle rows onboard the A330 as their crew rest.. the international A330 fleet is in the midst of being upgraded with a curtain around those rows to "enchance" the crew rest experience...
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Sun Aug 07, 2022 11:27 am

Whatsaptudo wrote:
It was planned cabin crew duty times that required the stop. They must have come to some arrangement (crew rest like LA probably)


If that was the case why didn’t they only crew it with NZ based crew, like they did with LAX?
 
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qf2220
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Sun Aug 07, 2022 12:33 pm

RyanairGuru wrote:
Whatsaptudo wrote:
It was planned cabin crew duty times that required the stop. They must have come to some arrangement (crew rest like LA probably)


If that was the case why didn’t they only crew it with NZ based crew, like they did with LAX?


Did they have enough crew on the books at the time?
 
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QuayWeeAir
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Sun Aug 07, 2022 12:38 pm

qf2220 wrote:
RyanairGuru wrote:
Whatsaptudo wrote:
It was planned cabin crew duty times that required the stop. They must have come to some arrangement (crew rest like LA probably)


If that was the case why didn’t they only crew it with NZ based crew, like they did with LAX?


Did they have enough crew on the books at the time?


I'm sure they have enough crew now to operate those flights as non-stop, as to my knowledge there have been 12 Jetconnect Cabin Crew Ground Schools that have commenced/completed since mid-May...
 
smi0006
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Sun Aug 07, 2022 10:05 pm

RyanairGuru wrote:
Whatsaptudo wrote:
It was planned cabin crew duty times that required the stop. They must have come to some arrangement (crew rest like LA probably)


If that was the case why didn’t they only crew it with NZ based crew, like they did with LAX?


I’ve heard they have adjusted the schedule to 13hrs 45mins, which is 15mins shorter than the requirement for horizontal crew rest ie bunks. Perhaps they were able to reduce ground time in DEL or changes in slots, or average flight times?
 
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Velocity7
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 1:27 am

I took a walk through the Heritage Park at Eagle Farm over the weekend. Didn't know it existed! Located on part of the site of the old Eagle Farm airport - of notable interest the Allison Engine Testing Stands and Hangar 7 which QF occupied for a time. If you have a spare 45 minutes, worth a look.
The memories heading down Lamington Avenue to Terminal Drive are still vivid even if Southern Cross Way and the Gateway Motorway have dissected the access to the old airport!

https://tradecoastcentralheritagepark.com.au/
 
F100Flyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 1:55 am

Alliance to dispose of all of its F50s.

https://cdn-api.markitdigital.com/apima ... a206a39ff4
 
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Goodbye
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 2:08 am

anstar wrote:
I wonder if Bonza also have a 2nd strategy... which is to make all the fuss about secondary routes with the real intention of going onto the main leisure routes... kind of a distraction to QF/JQ. They seem to have a smart bunch of people working there and I just dont see this secondary strategy with 737's working.


I just don't understand how they expect to fill 737s flying from MCY to Albury, Proserpine, Coffs Harbour, Mildura, Port Macquarie and Tamworth (amongst others!) multiple times a week? I know Brisbane is technically part of the catchment but how many people are going to travel from BNE 1 and a half hours up the highway to MCY to take these flights?
 
a320fan
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 2:40 am

Goodbye wrote:
anstar wrote:
I wonder if Bonza also have a 2nd strategy... which is to make all the fuss about secondary routes with the real intention of going onto the main leisure routes... kind of a distraction to QF/JQ. They seem to have a smart bunch of people working there and I just dont see this secondary strategy with 737's working.


I just don't understand how they expect to fill 737s flying from MCY to Albury, Proserpine, Coffs Harbour, Mildura, Port Macquarie and Tamworth (amongst others!) multiple times a week? I know Brisbane is technically part of the catchment but how many people are going to travel from BNE 1 and a half hours up the highway to MCY to take these flights?


Whilst it’s exciting to see some of these smaller cities get new flights I too find it perplexing to think about when considering it further.

Southern Cities like Mildura, Albury, Newcastle would be primarily outbound demand. Bonza is offering Sunshine Coast, which is primarily inbound tourist demand. However these are small cities that won’t have large volumes of passengers travelling specifically to Sunshine Coast, except for maybe school holiday periods. I wonder if operating into BNE could be a better option for most the MCY routes Bonza has announced. Then you’re getting capital city catchment plus being in the middle of two popular leisure locations, the sunshine and Gold Coast. Now you’re better capturing traffic from places like Mildura and Albury going to the whole SEQ region. Passengers going to a Gold Coast holiday would I presume be more favourable to flying into BNE than MCY.
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 3:16 am

A memo has gone out to white collar workers at Qantas asking for 200 to step forward and work 3 months on the ramp mainly as baggage handlers

https://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-u ... hpkkigqv9n

Having done baggage handling myself this is nothing more than a bandaid solution, it’s not going to fix the problem.

As aviation analyst Neil Hansford says if they don’t have the staff to fulfil these roles it’s time they cutting services, of course this causes other issues like higher fares and more costs to the airline for parking planes

https://www.3aw.com.au/qantas-asks-seni ... &fs=e&s=cl
 
IndianicWorld
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 3:23 am

I agree that Bonza’s MCY routes in particular will be harder to fill year round, especially with a 737.

Looking at the BNE example listed, their MEL base likely has better outbound/inbound year round demand potential in many of these markets they are chasing, but MCY should do ok in peak travel periods.

Given how much time and money they have likely invested already in setting up in MCY (it’s their HQ), it will be interesting to see as their model appears to be something that will be quite hard to make work here.
 
IndianicWorld
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 3:27 am

qf789 wrote:
A memo has gone out to white collar workers at Qantas asking for 200 to step forward and work 3 months on the ramp mainly as baggage handlers

https://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-u ... hpkkigqv9n

Having done baggage handling myself this is nothing more than a bandaid solution, it’s not going to fix the problem.

As aviation analyst Neil Hansford says if they don’t have the staff to fulfil these roles it’s time they cutting services, of course this causes other issues like higher fares and more costs to the airline for parking planes

https://www.3aw.com.au/qantas-asks-seni ... &fs=e&s=cl


That’s a big undertaking for anyone to accept. What happens to the work they are meant to be doing day to day in their existing roles?

Very challenging situation that airlines across the world are facing, but I agree that these bandaid solutions only go so far to covering over the cracks.
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 3:55 am

IndianicWorld wrote:
qf789 wrote:
A memo has gone out to white collar workers at Qantas asking for 200 to step forward and work 3 months on the ramp mainly as baggage handlers

https://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-u ... hpkkigqv9n

Having done baggage handling myself this is nothing more than a bandaid solution, it’s not going to fix the problem.

As aviation analyst Neil Hansford says if they don’t have the staff to fulfil these roles it’s time they cutting services, of course this causes other issues like higher fares and more costs to the airline for parking planes

https://www.3aw.com.au/qantas-asks-seni ... &fs=e&s=cl


That’s a big undertaking for anyone to accept. What happens to the work they are meant to be doing day to day in their existing roles?

Very challenging situation that airlines across the world are facing, but I agree that these bandaid solutions only go so far to covering over the cracks.


Yes, at the end of 3 months, you can imagine being told "we coped fine without you, thanks for your efforts on the ramp, here's your redundancy package. We recommend you now contact Swissport as we know you are perfectly qualified as a baggage handler."
 
brucetiki
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 5:07 am

qf789 wrote:
A memo has gone out to white collar workers at Qantas asking for 200 to step forward and work 3 months on the ramp mainly as baggage handlers

https://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-u ... hpkkigqv9n

Having done baggage handling myself this is nothing more than a bandaid solution, it’s not going to fix the problem.

As aviation analyst Neil Hansford says if they don’t have the staff to fulfil these roles it’s time they cutting services, of course this causes other issues like higher fares and more costs to the airline for parking planes

https://www.3aw.com.au/qantas-asks-seni ... &fs=e&s=cl


How long until the union starts accusing Qantas of wage theft and stealing people's jobs like the time Qantas wanted to put management in terminals over Christmas a few years ago.
 
Qf648
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 5:20 am

IndianicWorld wrote:
qf789 wrote:
A memo has gone out to white collar workers at Qantas asking for 200 to step forward and work 3 months on the ramp mainly as baggage handlers

https://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-u ... hpkkigqv9n

Having done baggage handling myself this is nothing more than a bandaid solution, it’s not going to fix the problem.

As aviation analyst Neil Hansford says if they don’t have the staff to fulfil these roles it’s time they cutting services, of course this causes other issues like higher fares and more costs to the airline for parking planes

https://www.3aw.com.au/qantas-asks-seni ... &fs=e&s=cl


That’s a big undertaking for anyone to accept. What happens to the work they are meant to be doing day to day in their existing roles?

Very challenging situation that airlines across the world are facing, but I agree that these bandaid solutions only go so far to covering over the cracks.


Like any secondment you do both!
 
dredgy
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 5:33 am

Goodbye wrote:
I just don't understand how they expect to fill 737s flying from MCY to Albury, Proserpine, Coffs Harbour, Mildura, Port Macquarie and Tamworth (amongst others!) multiple times a week? I know Brisbane is technically part of the catchment but how many people are going to travel from BNE 1 and a half hours up the highway to MCY to take these flights?


This will depend on prices and market forces. Flights from BNE to ROK have exceeded $1000 return in past weeks and regularly exceeding $500, with direct flights often being sold out and having to go via Mackay. I had to take the train the other week, would have absolutely travelled to MCY - an Uber to Maroochydore and a reasonably priced flight would almost definitely have worked out cheaper (and faster than the train/flying via Mackay).

But I suspect it's just price low enough to stimulate demand - if you're in Tamworth and want to duck to the Sunny Coast for the weekend, if a price is $50 it's a no-brainer. If it's $150 it could still be compelling given flights from TMW to BNE can also exceed $500 return.
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 5:33 am

VARA engineers to strike over pay and conditions

https://www.perthnow.com.au/news/aviati ... -c-7800348
 
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 5:40 am

Yesterday’s QF9 PER-LHR has diverted to FRA, looks like it might be a medical diversion
 
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SCFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 5:47 am

Goodbye wrote:
anstar wrote:
I wonder if Bonza also have a 2nd strategy... which is to make all the fuss about secondary routes with the real intention of going onto the main leisure routes... kind of a distraction to QF/JQ. They seem to have a smart bunch of people working there and I just dont see this secondary strategy with 737's working.


I just don't understand how they expect to fill 737s flying from MCY to Albury, Proserpine, Coffs Harbour, Mildura, Port Macquarie and Tamworth (amongst others!) multiple times a week? I know Brisbane is technically part of the catchment but how many people are going to travel from BNE 1 and a half hours up the highway to MCY to take these flights?


I would guess they're also planning for self-connections, although connecting traffic would be MINIMAL at best. E.g Bonza may sell a xxx-MCY-xxx ticket, but as per all ULCCs and most LCCs, they do not offer baggage interlining and they will need to collect and re-check at MCY. Recollect and re-checking shouldn't be a problem at MCY as baggage collection and check-in are within metres of each of other at the airport.

This was similar to when Tiger Airways Australia began, they offered xxx-MEL-xxx connections but made it clear that they would NOT interline baggage.
 
tsurumaru
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 6:30 am

Bonza’s model certainly has the potential to work - Allegiant has been in business for over 20 years by connecting similarly-sized towns in the US with tourist hotspots, and there are countless charter airlines doing the same in Europe. What all these have in common though is that a large proportion of ticket sales are in the form of package holidays - flights combined with hotels and other extras.

Although self-organised holidays are becoming more popular, I think Bonza would have a much greater chance of success on these routes if they were able to sell packaged trips. At the right price point, I could see there being a lot of demand for QLD beach holidays in places like MQL and ABX, or long weekend getaways (or even food + wine tours) to various destinations ex-MEL.
 
vhebb
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 6:40 am

brucetiki wrote:
qf789 wrote:
A memo has gone out to white collar workers at Qantas asking for 200 to step forward and work 3 months on the ramp mainly as baggage handlers

https://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-u ... hpkkigqv9n

Having done baggage handling myself this is nothing more than a bandaid solution, it’s not going to fix the problem.

As aviation analyst Neil Hansford says if they don’t have the staff to fulfil these roles it’s time they cutting services, of course this causes other issues like higher fares and more costs to the airline for parking planes

https://www.3aw.com.au/qantas-asks-seni ... &fs=e&s=cl


How long until the union starts accusing Qantas of wage theft and stealing people's jobs like the time Qantas wanted to put management in terminals over Christmas a few years ago.


It is wage/job theft isn't it?

The QF and JQ staff were given genuine redundancies which means the job no longer exists within the company. Now that management from the same company are doing the job doesn't that show the jobs still exist and are infact needed?
 
qf2048
Posts: 213
Joined: Sat Apr 09, 2016 3:16 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 7:24 am

Flypelican to commence SYD-BHS from 5th Sept. Looks like they've dropped Taree too.
 
Qf648
Posts: 97
Joined: Thu Dec 28, 2017 3:49 pm

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 9:32 am

tsurumaru wrote:
Bonza’s model certainly has the potential to work - Allegiant has been in business for over 20 years by connecting similarly-sized towns in the US with tourist hotspots, and there are countless charter airlines doing the same in Europe. What all these have in common though is that a large proportion of ticket sales are in the form of package holidays - flights combined with hotels and other extras.

Although self-organised holidays are becoming more popular, I think Bonza would have a much greater chance of success on these routes if they were able to sell packaged trips. At the right price point, I could see there being a lot of demand for QLD beach holidays in places like MQL and ABX, or long weekend getaways (or even food + wine tours) to various destinations ex-MEL.


To be honest I can see their model working - but I can see them skimming the pool with flights from Adelaide to tourist destinations and from Perth to similar. this should give them a bit of critical mass to make some money
 
melpax
Posts: 2327
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2005 12:13 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 9:50 am

tsurumaru wrote:
Bonza’s model certainly has the potential to work - Allegiant has been in business for over 20 years by connecting similarly-sized towns in the US with tourist hotspots, and there are countless charter airlines doing the same in Europe. What all these have in common though is that a large proportion of ticket sales are in the form of package holidays - flights combined with hotels and other extras.

Although self-organised holidays are becoming more popular, I think Bonza would have a much greater chance of success on these routes if they were able to sell packaged trips. At the right price point, I could see there being a lot of demand for QLD beach holidays in places like MQL and ABX, or long weekend getaways (or even food + wine tours) to various destinations ex-MEL.


There is plenty of demand both ways for MEL-MQL, Mildura is a popular foodie destination for Melbournians, and cheap flights will make it a popular weekend destination, instead of a road-trip add on as how most people currently visit.

Would be lots of demand from Albury to the Queensland resorts as you said, the catchment area for Albury flights would extend the Hume down to Benalla, and possibly Shepparton, driving time to ABX & MEL from Shepp would be around the same, with parking, checkin, etc at ABX easier than parking in long-term at MEL & having to bus it to the terminal. Albury-Melbourne is an easy 3 hour drive, so not much demand for ABX-MEL flights, especially if you're drive to/from the Eastern side of Melbourne.
 
IndianicWorld
Posts: 3531
Joined: Mon Jun 04, 2001 11:32 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 9:54 am

Qf648 wrote:
tsurumaru wrote:
Bonza’s model certainly has the potential to work - Allegiant has been in business for over 20 years by connecting similarly-sized towns in the US with tourist hotspots, and there are countless charter airlines doing the same in Europe. What all these have in common though is that a large proportion of ticket sales are in the form of package holidays - flights combined with hotels and other extras.

Although self-organised holidays are becoming more popular, I think Bonza would have a much greater chance of success on these routes if they were able to sell packaged trips. At the right price point, I could see there being a lot of demand for QLD beach holidays in places like MQL and ABX, or long weekend getaways (or even food + wine tours) to various destinations ex-MEL.


To be honest I can see their model working - but I can see them skimming the pool with flights from Adelaide to tourist destinations and from Perth to similar. this should give them a bit of critical mass to make some money


How many markets would there be from ADL or PER that don’t already have service and can support a 737?

Many of the main markets are already covered by QF, JQ and VA, and anything else would likely be hard work, especially year round.

Australia is not Europe or the US, with many smaller airports to fly to that are in easy reach of cities with large enough catchment areas to make them work. Even some of the smaller cities that Allegiant fly to in the US are hundreds of thousands in population, not tens of thousands in Australia’s case.
 
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EK413
Posts: 5897
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 10:24 am

qf789 wrote:
A memo has gone out to white collar workers at Qantas asking for 200 to step forward and work 3 months on the ramp mainly as baggage handlers

https://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-u ... hpkkigqv9n

Having done baggage handling myself this is nothing more than a bandaid solution, it’s not going to fix the problem.

As aviation analyst Neil Hansford says if they don’t have the staff to fulfil these roles it’s time they cutting services, of course this causes other issues like higher fares and more costs to the airline for parking planes

https://www.3aw.com.au/qantas-asks-seni ... &fs=e&s=cl

Here’s the part where we say “I told you so”… Qantas outsourcing their ground handling was a mistake and this is their way of acknowledging they under estimated the value of owning & managing their ground handling…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
ben175
Posts: 924
Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2008 12:44 pm

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 12:07 pm

IndianicWorld wrote:
Qf648 wrote:
tsurumaru wrote:
Bonza’s model certainly has the potential to work - Allegiant has been in business for over 20 years by connecting similarly-sized towns in the US with tourist hotspots, and there are countless charter airlines doing the same in Europe. What all these have in common though is that a large proportion of ticket sales are in the form of package holidays - flights combined with hotels and other extras.

Although self-organised holidays are becoming more popular, I think Bonza would have a much greater chance of success on these routes if they were able to sell packaged trips. At the right price point, I could see there being a lot of demand for QLD beach holidays in places like MQL and ABX, or long weekend getaways (or even food + wine tours) to various destinations ex-MEL.


To be honest I can see their model working - but I can see them skimming the pool with flights from Adelaide to tourist destinations and from Perth to similar. this should give them a bit of critical mass to make some money


How many markets would there be from ADL or PER that don’t already have service and can support a 737?

Many of the main markets are already covered by QF, JQ and VA, and anything else would likely be hard work, especially year round.

Australia is not Europe or the US, with many smaller airports to fly to that are in easy reach of cities with large enough catchment areas to make them work. Even some of the smaller cities that Allegiant fly to in the US are hundreds of thousands in population, not tens of thousands in Australia’s case.


The only two unserved transcons to PER I see working would be NTL and MCY.
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 12:46 pm

Qantas SYD-SFO resumption now pushed back to 2 Dec 22

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/220808-qfnw22sfo
 
ben175
Posts: 924
Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2008 12:44 pm

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 12:54 pm

qf789 wrote:
Qantas SYD-SFO resumption now pushed back to 2 Dec 22

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/220808-qfnw22sfo


I would say this is most certainly due to lack of frames. QF93 is cancelled tomorrow night because of QF9 diverting to FRA.
 
melpax
Posts: 2327
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2005 12:13 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 2:03 pm

brucetiki wrote:
How long until the union starts accusing Qantas of wage theft and stealing people's jobs like the time Qantas wanted to put management in terminals over Christmas a few years ago.


A similar situation to how the large retailers get their HQ staff to help out in the stores over Christmas & other busy periods, although usually it's not for a 3 month stretch.

Can't see any exec staff doing a 3 month stretch, wouldn't surprise me if some rank & file HQ staff are 'voluntold' for airport duty.
 
IndianicWorld
Posts: 3531
Joined: Mon Jun 04, 2001 11:32 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 2:34 pm

melpax wrote:
brucetiki wrote:
How long until the union starts accusing Qantas of wage theft and stealing people's jobs like the time Qantas wanted to put management in terminals over Christmas a few years ago.


A similar situation to how the large retailers get their HQ staff to help out in the stores over Christmas & other busy periods, although usually it's not for a 3 month stretch.

Can't see any exec staff doing a 3 month stretch, wouldn't surprise me if some rank & file HQ staff are 'voluntold' for airport duty.


Given the vast difference in the scope of duties that a head office role and a baggage handler would undertake, it would be hard to force someone to do it. Other duties is still a fairly close relationship to your core role responsibilities and can’t be stretched too far without causing a fair few issues.

I agree with an earlier post though that said that taking this on for a 3 month timeframe would be risky given that the work they are currently employed for would still need to be done somehow, and if they figured out a way to not need it anymore it would become an ‘efficiency gain’.

As for Bonza and PER, NTL and MCY would be interesting but are very long, thin routes to try and make work.

I have heard from some previously how many of these markets that Bonza has identified would somehow bring about significant demand, but we are talking about filling potentially over 360 or so seats at minimum each way (2 x weekly) from relatively modest catchment areas. It may well tap into a certain excitement in the market that fills some more seats initially, but the challenge is sustainability over the longer term when there are only limited opportunities available.

I tend to think they will look to tweak their model over time, just as Tiger did. Starting out in a similar way, they also looked at unserved/underserved routes but then started to move their focus even prior to their takeover by VA.

I do wish them well though as it’s nice to see something different in the skies.
 
tsurumaru
Posts: 13
Joined: Sat Jan 08, 2022 6:38 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - August 2022

Mon Aug 08, 2022 3:14 pm

IndianicWorld wrote:
Qf648 wrote:
tsurumaru wrote:
Bonza’s model certainly has the potential to work - Allegiant has been in business for over 20 years by connecting similarly-sized towns in the US with tourist hotspots, and there are countless charter airlines doing the same in Europe. What all these have in common though is that a large proportion of ticket sales are in the form of package holidays - flights combined with hotels and other extras.

Although self-organised holidays are becoming more popular, I think Bonza would have a much greater chance of success on these routes if they were able to sell packaged trips. At the right price point, I could see there being a lot of demand for QLD beach holidays in places like MQL and ABX, or long weekend getaways (or even food + wine tours) to various destinations ex-MEL.


To be honest I can see their model working - but I can see them skimming the pool with flights from Adelaide to tourist destinations and from Perth to similar. this should give them a bit of critical mass to make some money


How many markets would there be from ADL or PER that don’t already have service and can support a 737?

Many of the main markets are already covered by QF, JQ and VA, and anything else would likely be hard work, especially year round.

Australia is not Europe or the US, with many smaller airports to fly to that are in easy reach of cities with large enough catchment areas to make them work. Even some of the smaller cities that Allegiant fly to in the US are hundreds of thousands in population, not tens of thousands in Australia’s case.


I would think that there would be enough viable new routes to support the eight frames they have coming - basically their current route map. However, if Bonza have any ambition to grow beyond this (and scale up to profitability), they will need to start taking on routes which are already served. It will also be hard for Bonza to make any serious inroads into the Australian market without serving Sydney - whether through Kingsford Smith or the new airport once it opens.

Here is a great piece outlining the viability and expected demand for two of Bonza’s proposed routes:

https://www.linkedin.com/posts/drtonywe ... 91456-iMs3

As for Perth, I think Bonza could make a go of more than NTL and MCY. With a little market stimulation, destinations like AVV, AYQ (now unserved), LST (VA tried this one last summer) and another beach destination in QLD could also work. I doubt that any of these would justify a base in WA, though.
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