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PerthBoy1987
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Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Sun Aug 14, 2022 10:14 am

Today 14th of August marks the final day the Alliance F50s operate. QQ3241 just landed back in ADL.  VH-FKZ conducted the last Alliance F50 flight. This brings to an end not only Alliance F50 services but a total of35 years of F50 services in Australia.

A sad day - the F50 has been a workhorse in Australian aviation first up with Ansett in the mid 1980s then its subsidiaries Air NSW, Skywest (then bought by VA) and finally Alliance Airlines 

What are you memories of this great aircraft?

​​​​​​​Cheers.
 
Eikie
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Re: Farewell F50

Sun Aug 14, 2022 10:18 am

Used to fly the F50 on another airline, such a joy to fly them.

Of course cruising at 220kts at FL180 in the middle of clouds and weather wasn't always comfortable, it sure was a blast.

And parking it at terminal 4 at LHR, seeing the Concorde stand next to you was priceless.
 
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ClassicLover
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Re: Farewell F50

Sun Aug 14, 2022 11:02 am

PerthBoy1987 wrote:
What are you memories of this great aircraft?


Always remember seeing them in Ansett livery when I was a kid. They had plenty of them and they were quite a common sight. Quite a different sound from the Dart powered Fokker F27s.

Finally got to fly on a Fokker 50 when Sweden's Amapola Flyg temporarily took over the Public Service Obligation route between Dublin and Donegal in Ireland from July 2021 to earlier this year. I took a flight in September 2021 and reviewed it here - https://www.airliners.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1465155 - it was a lot of fun and great to finally get on board a Fokker 50.

They're good aircraft, and I found the F50 to be quieter inside than then Dash 8 and ATR72, which was a pleasant surprise.
 
AMP44
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Re: Farewell F50

Sun Aug 14, 2022 11:29 am

Have flown the F50 in Europe and in Latin America. It's a great aircraft.
Sad to see them slowly disappear from the sky.
 
PerthBoy1987
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Re: Farewell F50

Sun Aug 14, 2022 11:58 am

Amapola still uses the F50
 
PerthBoy1987
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Re: Farewell F50

Sun Aug 14, 2022 11:59 am

Eikie wrote:
Used to fly the F50 on another airline, such a joy to fly them.

Of course cruising at 220kts at FL180 in the middle of clouds and weather wasn't always comfortable, it sure was a blast.

And parking it at terminal 4 at LHR, seeing the Concorde stand next to you was priceless.


Only 220kts? The F50 can cruise faster then that. Unless you're referring to IAS (Indicated Air Speed).

The F50 can cruise up to 260kts - 270kts TAS.
 
AMP44
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Re: Farewell F50

Sun Aug 14, 2022 12:00 pm

PerthBoy1987 wrote:
Amapola still uses the F50

Easily accessible for people to fly if they really want to. Amapola has quite a few. Air Panama is another with a handful. Some in Colombia fly them I think?
 
PerthBoy1987
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Re: Farewell F50

Sun Aug 14, 2022 12:29 pm

Alliance sold their five F50s, equipment and spare parts for $4.6 million

https://simpleflying.com/alliance-air-fokker-50-sale/
 
Eikie
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Re: Farewell F50

Sun Aug 14, 2022 1:33 pm

PerthBoy1987 wrote:
Eikie wrote:
Used to fly the F50 on another airline, such a joy to fly them.

Of course cruising at 220kts at FL180 in the middle of clouds and weather wasn't always comfortable, it sure was a blast.

And parking it at terminal 4 at LHR, seeing the Concorde stand next to you was priceless.


Only 220kts? The F50 can cruise faster then that. Unless you're referring to IAS (Indicated Air Speed).

The F50 can cruise up to 260kts - 270kts TAS.
For a pilot, an aircraft flies in IAS, TAS isn't that useful.
So indeed I should have been more clear, but to me speeds are always in IAS (or mach).

And it could also go faster than 220kts, even when measuring in IAS, it' s topspeed was a blistering 224 kts (IAS)...

Just quick enough so birds wouldn't hit you from the back.
 
PerthBoy1987
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Re: Farewell F50

Sun Aug 14, 2022 10:47 pm

Eikie wrote:
PerthBoy1987 wrote:
Eikie wrote:
Used to fly the F50 on another airline, such a joy to fly them.

Of course cruising at 220kts at FL180 in the middle of clouds and weather wasn't always comfortable, it sure was a blast.

And parking it at terminal 4 at LHR, seeing the Concorde stand next to you was priceless.


Only 220kts? The F50 can cruise faster then that. Unless you're referring to IAS (Indicated Air Speed).

The F50 can cruise up to 260kts - 270kts TAS.
For a pilot, an aircraft flies in IAS, TAS isn't that useful.
So indeed I should have been more clear, but to me speeds are always in IAS (or mach).

And it could also go faster than 220kts, even when measuring in IAS, it' s topspeed was a blistering 224 kts (IAS)...

Just quick enough so birds wouldn't hit you from the back.


I understand what you're saying however in terms of flight times etc from point A to point B...the F50 could fly quicker then 220kts. For the sake of flight times etc.
 
PerthBoy1987
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Fri Aug 19, 2022 5:51 am

I wonder what the routes will be. Long way to go to Panama. I wonder if extra tanks with fuel will be installed in aircraft although the F50 is a fuel truck...can have just over 4,000kg of fuel. It has a pretty good range too (not sure in km)?
 
JRadier
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Fri Aug 19, 2022 9:48 am

Eikie wrote:
Just quick enough so birds wouldn't hit you from the back.

I remember the following joke on the F50.

"Why does the Fokker 50 have de-icing boots on the rear of the wing?"
"For when it get's overtaken by a stationary cold front"

PerthBoy1987 wrote:
I wonder what the routes will be. Long way to go to Panama. I wonder if extra tanks with fuel will be installed in aircraft although the F50 is a fuel truck...can have just over 4,000kg of fuel. It has a pretty good range too (not sure in km)?

If memory serves, the Fokker 50 can ferry for 7 hours without pax, marking a Northern route (via Iceland) a viable option.
 
PerthBoy1987
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Sat Aug 20, 2022 11:04 pm

JRadier wrote:
Eikie wrote:
Just quick enough so birds wouldn't hit you from the back.

I remember the following joke on the F50.

"Why does the Fokker 50 have de-icing boots on the rear of the wing?"
"For when it get's overtaken by a stationary cold front"

PerthBoy1987 wrote:
I wonder what the routes will be. Long way to go to Panama. I wonder if extra tanks with fuel will be installed in aircraft although the F50 is a fuel truck...can have just over 4,000kg of fuel. It has a pretty good range too (not sure in km)?

If memory serves, the Fokker 50 can ferry for 7 hours without pax, marking a Northern route (via Iceland) a viable option.


Will be interesting to see which way they fly to get to its destination (Panama).
 
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SRQKEF
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Sun Aug 21, 2022 3:16 am

I sympathise having had a long and fruitful relationship with the F50 here in Iceland too, before saying goodbye in early 2017. A unique aircraft for sure, great workhorse and that takeoff sound can't be mistaken!
 
PerthBoy1987
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Fri Aug 26, 2022 3:53 am

SRQKEF wrote:
I sympathise having had a long and fruitful relationship with the F50 here in Iceland too, before saying goodbye in early 2017. A unique aircraft for sure, great workhorse and that takeoff sound can't be mistaken!


The taxi sound is very good too.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Fri Aug 26, 2022 11:58 am

According to Airfleets, there are now just a hundred (exactly) F50 registered:
https://www.airfleets.net/exploit/production-f50.htm

I see Alliance has 39 F70/F100 in the fleet, so the Fokkers will still fly in Australia. Interesting there are still 118 F70/100 still flying.

https://www.airfleets.net/exploit/production-f100.htm

It will be interesting to see how long they can be economically supported.

Lightsaber
 
PerthBoy1987
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Sun Aug 28, 2022 2:17 pm

lightsaber wrote:
According to Airfleets, there are now just a hundred (exactly) F50 registered:
https://www.airfleets.net/exploit/production-f50.htm

I see Alliance has 39 F70/F100 in the fleet, so the Fokkers will still fly in Australia. Interesting there are still 118 F70/100 still flying.

https://www.airfleets.net/exploit/production-f100.htm

It will be interesting to see how long they can be economically supported.

Lightsaber


So 100 F50s registered throughout the world, but how many of them are still operating and how many are sitting around somewhere waiting to be used as spare parts or turned into scrap?

I think from memory Fokker built 213 F50s before the company went bankrupt in 1996.
 
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CrimsonNL
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Sun Aug 28, 2022 3:08 pm

A fantastic aircraft! In 2007 I traveled AMS-LCY and back, to sample the VLM Fokker 50. They offered a single-class full service with real drink glasses, and metal cutlery. My first flying trip I made just for the sake of flying. The start of a very interesting and very expensive hobby :shock:

Later on I flew the '50 on a different iteration of VLM, and finally on Air Antwerp (which was something of a VLM 8.0).

 
AA737-823
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Sun Aug 28, 2022 3:38 pm

Planespotters shows 93 "active" Fokker 50's, but I think that's way, way overestimated.
Apart from Air Panama and Amapola, plus I think one operator in Nigeria, I can't readily rattle off any other current operators.
In any case, I'm very much looking forward to my first Fokker 50 rides in Sweden next month on Amapola!
 
PerthBoy1987
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Wed Sep 14, 2022 8:12 am

AA737-823 wrote:
Planespotters shows 93 "active" Fokker 50's, but I think that's way, way overestimated.
Apart from Air Panama and Amapola, plus I think one operator in Nigeria, I can't readily rattle off any other current operators.
In any case, I'm very much looking forward to my first Fokker 50 rides in Sweden next month on Amapola!


Let us know in this thread how the flight goes
 
PerthBoy1987
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Thu Sep 22, 2022 11:40 am

For those interested,

VH-FKZ left ADL earlier today and is not far away from landing in BME. First leg to BME took around 6 hours and 22 minutes. Its the first aircraft to be ferried to Panama. Air Panama bought the 5 Alliance F50s - 3 of them will fly to Panama whilst 2 of them will be broken up for spare parts and transported to Panama.

VH-FKV and VH-FKW will be the other 2 F50s to ferry fly to Panama.

VH-FKO and VH-FKX are the aircraft to be scrapped for spare parts.

Aircraft ferry route will be via Asia, M/E, Europe, North Atlantic, Canada and USA to Panama.
 
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ClassicLover
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Thu Sep 22, 2022 11:44 am

PerthBoy1987 wrote:
For those interested,

VH-FKZ left ADL earlier today and is not far away from landing in BME. First leg to BME took around 6 hours and 22 minutes. Its the first aircraft to be ferried to Panama. Air Panama bought the 5 Alliance F50s - 3 of them will fly to Panama whilst 2 of them will be broken up for spare parts and transported to Panama.

VH-FKV and VH-FKW will be the other 2 F50s to ferry fly to Panama.

VH-FKO and VH-FKX are the aircraft to be scrapped for spare parts.

Aircraft ferry route will be via Asia, M/E, Europe, North Atlantic, Canada and USA to Panama.


Wow, they are going to be some very long ferry flights!

Great to see which ones will continue to fly and which ones will be scrapped for parts. I guess it's good that three of them will stay in the air.

I enjoyed my flights with Amapola Flyg last year on the F50. Great aircraft!
 
PerthBoy1987
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Fri Sep 23, 2022 1:59 am

ClassicLover wrote:
PerthBoy1987 wrote:
For those interested,

VH-FKZ left ADL earlier today and is not far away from landing in BME. First leg to BME took around 6 hours and 22 minutes. Its the first aircraft to be ferried to Panama. Air Panama bought the 5 Alliance F50s - 3 of them will fly to Panama whilst 2 of them will be broken up for spare parts and transported to Panama.

VH-FKV and VH-FKW will be the other 2 F50s to ferry fly to Panama.

VH-FKO and VH-FKX are the aircraft to be scrapped for spare parts.

Aircraft ferry route will be via Asia, M/E, Europe, North Atlantic, Canada and USA to Panama.


Wow, they are going to be some very long ferry flights!

Great to see which ones will continue to fly and which ones will be scrapped for parts. I guess it's good that three of them will stay in the air.

I enjoyed my flights with Amapola Flyg last year on the F50. Great aircraft!


You can track VH-FKZ now as we speak.

But here is a question - because these flights are ferry flights....do the pilots fly at a slower speed so that maximum range/endurance can be achieved. Is there such thing as a "long range cruise speed" or "ferry cruise speed"?
 
PerthBoy1987
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Fri Sep 23, 2022 4:58 am

Just landed in Surabaya Juanda Airport (from Broome). Flight time roughly 3 hrs and 30 mins
 
PerthBoy1987
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Fri Sep 23, 2022 5:43 am

Just departed Surabaya. On its way again
 
PerthBoy1987
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Fri Sep 23, 2022 10:21 am

Just landed in Penang (from Surabaya)....flight time 4 hours and 35 minutes.
 
PerthBoy1987
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Wed Sep 28, 2022 3:14 pm

https://ontimeaviation.net/noticias-mun ... jX7YERvROE


Interesting article. Just revert it to English. Also I don't think extra wing tanks have been installed either so it's 9nly using the fuel 8n its wing tanks. It has got very good range.
 
AA737-823
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Re: Alliance (Australia) retires the F50

Wed Sep 28, 2022 11:23 pm

PerthBoy1987 wrote:
AA737-823 wrote:
Planespotters shows 93 "active" Fokker 50's, but I think that's way, way overestimated.
Apart from Air Panama and Amapola, plus I think one operator in Nigeria, I can't readily rattle off any other current operators.
In any case, I'm very much looking forward to my first Fokker 50 rides in Sweden next month on Amapola!


Let us know in this thread how the flight goes


Amapola was a WONDERFUL experience. Just got back a few days ago.
Crews were friendly and chatted with me a couple times along the way, flight attendant was great, and Hemavan airport is a neat little place... made me actually want to visit Hemavan for a vacation in the future.
We had a mechanical delay for a minor radio problem in Kramfors; I was concerned that we'd be stuck there overnight and I'd miss my flights back to the US, but it was all resolved in about 15 minutes and I enjoyed a wonderful sunset segment on what turns out to be the smoothest, quietest turboprop I've ever flown in.

Oh, and the seats are wonderful. Best recline motion of any coach seat, ever. Super comfortable.
The Finnair ATR-72's I flew in a couple days prior had the same seats as Spirit and Frontier Airlines here in the USA; at least they're more appropriate in an ATR doing 1 hour hops than they are in an A320neo doing six hour trips to South America, but they're still not going to win any awards, and don't recline at all.
The Amapola Fokker seats are far comfier than anything else flying today!

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