Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
UAUA
Topic Author
Posts: 278
Joined: Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:50 am

Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 1:00 pm

https://simpleflying.com/american-airli ... rst-class/

So no international first class anymore for US carriers. Sad.
Last edited by atcsundevil on Fri Aug 26, 2022 3:52 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: Title edited in accordance with forum rules
 
AAPilot48Heavy
Posts: 101
Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2022 3:50 pm

Re: American Airlines To Eliminate First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 1:06 pm

This is probably a wise move. There are very few planes in their fleet with First Class and probably adds a lot of complexity. Install a very solid Business Class product (like QR's Q-Suite) and it will likely do very well -- great revenue potential and less complexity.

I'll be interested to see what is released on the replacement Business Class seat front.
 
UpNAWAy
Posts: 847
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2016 12:42 pm

Re: American Airlines To Eliminate First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 1:36 pm

I do wonder if the first 16 321 XLRs scheduled for 2024 will be the premium heavy and just slowly replace the 16 321Ts? I don't think that has been announced. The 4 789s scheduled for 2023 will probably be the first look at the new seats. My WAG is the 77W fleet will start a slow reconfiguration in 2025. But ultimately this is mostly semantics, you could have a BC hard and soft product better that the current FC product, but since most businesses restrict FC travel they have to call it BC. AA did just announce an Upgraded to their lounges system wide. I do think the marketing name/choices will be interesting. I think we could see "Flagship" remain.
 
rj777
Posts: 1968
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2000 1:47 am

Re: American Airlines To Eliminate First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 2:05 pm

Will the transcon lieflat seats stay tho?
 
Noshow
Posts: 3685
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 3:20 pm

Re: American Airlines To Eliminate First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 2:17 pm

Business aviation is booming at the same time. Have these people left airline flying all together?
 
UpNAWAy
Posts: 847
Joined: Thu Aug 11, 2016 12:42 pm

Re: American Airlines To Eliminate First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 2:31 pm

rj777 wrote:
Will the transcon lieflat seats stay tho?


The assumption is yes, executives keep mentioning the need for more not less premium seats.
 
Moosefire
Posts: 214
Joined: Wed Aug 15, 2018 12:47 pm

Re: American Airlines To Eliminate First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 2:33 pm

Makes sense. Flew it last year to LHR and the F Seats were arguably worse than the ones in Business. and the catering has never been too impressive prior to/during/post Covid. My only motivation for opting for Flagship first on American has been to get a higher fare/more miles. Just one man’s thoughts.
 
usairways85
Posts: 4360
Joined: Fri Nov 16, 2001 11:59 am

Re: American Airlines To Eliminate First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 2:46 pm

FWIW...the article title is misleading in that it implies that there is a formal announcement from AA. I do not believe this is official, maybe a few implied remarks during interviews, other known bloggers/journalists who have rumored this in recent days, etc.
 
UAUA
Topic Author
Posts: 278
Joined: Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:50 am

Re: American Airlines To Eliminate First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 2:48 pm

AA's first class is nothing even compare to SQ/CX's business class

But I wonder why they do not come up with a true first class suite product similar to SQ/CX/EK's on selected B777-300ERs. Maybe 4-6 seats per plane?
 
mikeyp224
Posts: 62
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2015 6:52 pm

Re: American Airlines To Eliminate First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 3:11 pm

This has not been an official statement from American, nor did this article say it was confirmed by anyone internal at American. While it is probable that it will happen, the forum title is extremely misleading to anyone reading.
 
ahj2000
Posts: 1480
Joined: Wed Nov 26, 2014 5:34 pm

Re: American Airlines To Eliminate First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 3:15 pm

mikeyp224 wrote:
This has not been an official statement from American, nor did this article say it was confirmed by anyone internal at American. While it is probable that it will happen, the forum title is extremely misleading to anyone reading.

Yeah this. While it will probably happen, to say it declaratively based on a SF article is a bit early.
 
AABB777
Posts: 597
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 12:05 pm

Re: American Airlines To Eliminate First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 3:21 pm

mikeyp224 wrote:
This has not been an official statement from American, nor did this article say it was confirmed by anyone internal at American. While it is probable that it will happen, the forum title is extremely misleading to anyone reading.


This Simple Flying story is shoddy journalism. Correct, there has been no statement from AA regarding official elimination of Flagship First or even the long-term future of the product. Also, this article incorrectly says the First and Business seats on the 321T are the same seats but spaced differently—they are clearly not the same seat. The 321T Flagship First seat is the same as the Flagship Business seat on the 77W, as many know.
 
User avatar
atcsundevil
Moderator
Posts: 5337
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 12:22 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 3:54 pm

The title has been updated to reflect two things: one, this specifically applies to international first class, and two, this announcement has not been confirmed by the company. Regardless of its likelihood or eventuality, it still isn't official, and therefore is considered a rumor per forum rules.

✈️ atcsundevil
 
UAUA
Topic Author
Posts: 278
Joined: Wed Mar 06, 2019 10:50 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 4:08 pm

Oh yes it is still a rumour
 
ben7x
Posts: 222
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2021 8:58 am

Re: American Airlines To Eliminate First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 4:28 pm

usairways85 wrote:
FWIW...the article title is misleading in that it implies that there is a formal announcement from AA. I do not believe this is official, maybe a few implied remarks during interviews, other known bloggers/journalists who have rumored this in recent days, etc.


Simple flying seems to be very convinced:
There are only eight Flagship First seats on the 777s, which will start to be phased out next year.
and
The airline also has plans to reconfigure its Airbus A321T aircraft in a standard domestic configuration

But we all know, how serious they are…
 
gwrudolph
Posts: 643
Joined: Sat Sep 13, 2008 3:46 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 4:53 pm

I think this change would make a lot of sense. Today’s biz class is better than F was 10-20 years ago and as others have stated, most companies won’t pay for F in a three-class cabin. Honestly, there really isn’t much of a perceivable difference between biz and F anyway.

In many cases, they are comp upgrades from biz class so might as well get a few more biz class seats in the same space, standardize ,etc
 
USAirALB
Posts: 3204
Joined: Tue Sep 11, 2007 4:46 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 5:08 pm

I don't doubt that the rumor is true, but IMO SimpleFlying is somewhat garbage and akin to an aviation tabloid.

They edited it out, but when they first published the article this article this morning, they (incorrectly) said that the A321T seats in F and J are the same, just in a different configuration, which is false.
 
User avatar
ikolkyo
Posts: 3823
Joined: Tue Nov 05, 2013 8:43 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 5:08 pm

Wasn’t it rumored that a new Super J seat was coming soon to the 789? Probably the replacement.
 
9w748capt
Posts: 1933
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2008 10:27 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 5:10 pm

Surely they're ripping out seatback screens from intl J next, right?
 
JoseSalazar
Posts: 829
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2019 3:18 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 5:36 pm

atcsundevil wrote:
The title has been updated to reflect two things: one, this specifically applies to international first class, and two, this announcement has not been confirmed by the company. Regardless of its likelihood or eventuality, it still isn't official, and therefore is considered a rumor per forum rules.

✈️ atcsundevil

That’s not accurate. The A321Ts don’t fly international. They only fly transcon. Both of the flagship first products (international and transcon) are going away, not just the international. Here you can see where they differentiate the two:

https://www.aa.com/i18n/travel-info/exp ... tional.jsp
https://www.aa.com/i18n/travel-info/exp ... nental.jsp

If your statement said this specifically applies to “flagship first” as opposed to “international first,” it would be accurate.

And as to #2, I can tell you with 100% certainty it isn’t just a rumor, regardless of an official statement not yet being out. But I guess forum rules are forum rules.
 
User avatar
atcsundevil
Moderator
Posts: 5337
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 12:22 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 6:27 pm

JoseSalazar wrote:
atcsundevil wrote:
The title has been updated to reflect two things: one, this specifically applies to international first class, and two, this announcement has not been confirmed by the company. Regardless of its likelihood or eventuality, it still isn't official, and therefore is considered a rumor per forum rules.

✈️ atcsundevil

That’s not accurate. The A321Ts don’t fly international. They only fly transcon. Both of the flagship first products (international and transcon) are going away, not just the international. Here you can see where they differentiate the two:

https://www.aa.com/i18n/travel-info/exp ... tional.jsp
https://www.aa.com/i18n/travel-info/exp ... nental.jsp

If your statement said this specifically applies to “flagship first” as opposed to “international first,” it would be accurate.

And as to #2, I can tell you with 100% certainty it isn’t just a rumor, regardless of an official statement not yet being out. But I guess forum rules are forum rules.

I provided clarity in the title because there's a clear distinction with this discussion and the domestic F product. Everyone participating in this thread is aware that the A321T flies domestically — myself included, because I work that aircraft on an almost daily basis, so there's no need to split hairs. Everyone knows what we're talking about.

I can tell you with 100% certainty that the company has not made an official statement, which is why forum rules are forum rules. This goes for any topic, and I believe the majority of users want to be fully informed as to which information is presented as fact and what is presented as rumor, opinion, or conjecture. Your certainty that this is more than a rumor doesn't alter those facts, and it will be clearly labeled as a rumor until the company confirms.
 
kiowa
Posts: 978
Joined: Wed Jun 08, 2011 12:37 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 6:34 pm

If the rumor is wrong then that is a mistake.
If it is correct, I believe that to be a mistake as well.
 
9w748capt
Posts: 1933
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2008 10:27 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 8:54 pm

kiowa wrote:
If the rumor is wrong then that is a mistake.
If it is correct, I believe that to be a mistake as well.


Meh, the bigger mistake is AA completely trashing it's domestic Y product. Very curious if ULCC management just sits idly by as UA and DL forge ahead with vastly superior mainline cabins.

AA's int'l F product is by all accounts a joke. I can't even fathom an experience like this: https://viewfromthewing.com/whats-american-airlines-first-class-service-like-one-victim-shared-it-live-hong-kong-dallas/
 
Sancho99504
Posts: 869
Joined: Sun Dec 11, 2005 2:44 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 10:55 pm

The Simple Flying article was written based off of an op ed from onemileatatime. However, AA has unintentionally(maybe intentional) hinted that Flagship First is not part of the future when they "accidentally" rolled out an update last summer IIRC, that eluded to Flagship Business, Business, Premium and Economy on its website for flights operated by A321T and 77W but quickly removed it. I think there was even a thread created on here that talked about what it meant. They're introducing a new J seat on the 787-9, so it's anyone's guess.
 
Sancho99504
Posts: 869
Joined: Sun Dec 11, 2005 2:44 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 11:01 pm

9w748capt wrote:
kiowa wrote:
If the rumor is wrong then that is a mistake.
If it is correct, I believe that to be a mistake as well.


Meh, the bigger mistake is AA completely trashing it's domestic Y product. Very curious if ULCC management just sits idly by as UA and DL forge ahead with vastly superior mainline cabins.

AA's int'l F product is by all accounts a joke. I can't even fathom an experience like this: https://viewfromthewing.com/whats-american-airlines-first-class-service-like-one-victim-shared-it-live-hong-kong-dallas/

I read the article and something that stood out to me was the part where it talked about comments Doug Parker made in 2018 about service being the differentiator between products, not the seats. The interesting part is I think he was serious about AA upgrading its service standards in F and J but everything came to a crashing halt due to Covid. Sadly, AA onboard service has declined immensely in the past 2 years, some of it understandable at the beginning since we didn't know much about Covid. However, it's continued to go downhill without any sight of a bottoming out. I fly AA mainly because they're the only Business at KLAW and there was convenience I'm jumping on a red eye after work on a Thursday and being at home in Lawton by 11. Other options, like flying into OKC didn't get me home til after noon and this was exacerbated by the pandemic as the 2nd best option became a morning departure on DL thru SLC that got me home by 8pm or AS nonstop that got me home by 7pm.
 
zuckie13
Posts: 615
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:23 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Fri Aug 26, 2022 11:24 pm

Unless I missed something on Seat Guru, these are only on the 777-300's right?
 
rj777
Posts: 1968
Joined: Sat Dec 02, 2000 1:47 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sat Aug 27, 2022 12:36 am

zuckie13 wrote:
Unless I missed something on Seat Guru, these are only on the 777-300's right?


I actually contacted SeatGuru and they said they're not updating their site anymore. They still have 777s listed under Delta.
 
JoseSalazar
Posts: 829
Joined: Mon Oct 14, 2019 3:18 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sat Aug 27, 2022 12:54 am

zuckie13 wrote:
Unless I missed something on Seat Guru, these are only on the 777-300's right?


As far as 777s, yes, only on the 777-300ERs and not 772/787 fleet. But A321Ts also have flagship first seats installed in row 1-5 (which are also going away, as the A321s will be reconfigured like the rest of their A321s), and those fly on premium transcons (getting replaced by A321XLR with lie flat business class direct aisle access seats).
 
ScottB
Posts: 7922
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2000 1:25 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sat Aug 27, 2022 1:11 am

UAUA wrote:
So no international first class anymore for US carriers. Sad.


International first class is a dinosaur of a product. The demographic which might have flown long-haul F in the past now flies private and very few businesses will pay to fly their employees in long-haul F. Plus today's international business class products are generally superior to what would have been sold as F 25 years ago; the premium economy products of today are pretty comparable to what passed for business back then.

Well-run businesses adapt to the business environment, if possible.
 
Sancho99504
Posts: 869
Joined: Sun Dec 11, 2005 2:44 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sat Aug 27, 2022 2:51 am

ScottB wrote:
UAUA wrote:
So no international first class anymore for US carriers. Sad.


International first class is a dinosaur of a product. The demographic which might have flown long-haul F in the past now flies private and very few businesses will pay to fly their employees in long-haul F. Plus today's international business class products are generally superior to what would have been sold as F 25 years ago; the premium economy products of today are pretty comparable to what passed for business back then.

Well-run businesses adapt to the business environment, if possible.

The current F on the 77Ws is nearly identical to the 16 F cabin they introduced when the 77E debuted over 20 years ago. The only differences are the updated seat controller, the IFE and seat manufacturer. UA had a somewhat similar F on their 777s before they introduced the ITPE but only 12 seats.
 
User avatar
vhtje
Posts: 1432
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2009 12:40 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sat Aug 27, 2022 9:53 am

How would AA’s elimination of FF impact JVs with BA and QF?
 
User avatar
readytotaxi
Posts: 9013
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 2:09 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sat Aug 27, 2022 2:37 pm

Never tried it, but reading reviews and YouTube the food is nothing to shout about and the seat looks tired,perhaps it is mostly used as FF upgrades Does AA really need to be seen as a First Class carrier?
 
FLYFIRSTCLASS
Posts: 304
Joined: Fri Jan 14, 2022 7:41 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sat Aug 27, 2022 2:52 pm

vhtje wrote:
How would AA’s elimination of FF impact JVs with BA and QF?


It goes back to the origins of One World, so AA/BA/QF can have aligned products in certain markets. Has to do with revenue sharing and a consistent product. Not sure if its still in effect. Back when USAir first took over AA and slashed the services to pathetic levels, BA was not happy. Imagine if you were top tier on BA and they booked you on AA and the service sucked, you would not be happy with either carier.
There were rumors around that BA was going to leave OW for *
 
9w748capt
Posts: 1933
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2008 10:27 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sat Aug 27, 2022 6:24 pm

readytotaxi wrote:
Does AA really need to be seen as a First Class carrier?


LOL I mean all LCC management does is sing F9 and NK's praises, so you may be onto something
 
9w748capt
Posts: 1933
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2008 10:27 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sat Aug 27, 2022 6:25 pm

FLYFIRSTCLASS wrote:
vhtje wrote:
How would AA’s elimination of FF impact JVs with BA and QF?


It goes back to the origins of One World, so AA/BA/QF can have aligned products in certain markets. Has to do with revenue sharing and a consistent product. Not sure if its still in effect. Back when USAir first took over AA and slashed the services to pathetic levels, BA was not happy. Imagine if you were top tier on BA and they booked you on AA and the service sucked, you would not be happy with either carier.
There were rumors around that BA was going to leave OW for *


Wow I didn't know that! Is that actually real that BA considered leaving oneworld? That would have been crazy. And all because of Dougie? Yikes.
 
RvA
Posts: 550
Joined: Tue Sep 15, 2015 12:37 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sat Aug 27, 2022 8:38 pm

FLYFIRSTCLASS wrote:
vhtje wrote:
How would AA’s elimination of FF impact JVs with BA and QF?


It goes back to the origins of One World, so AA/BA/QF can have aligned products in certain markets. Has to do with revenue sharing and a consistent product. Not sure if its still in effect. Back when USAir first took over AA and slashed the services to pathetic levels, BA was not happy. Imagine if you were top tier on BA and they booked you on AA and the service sucked, you would not be happy with either carier.
There were rumors around that BA was going to leave OW for *


Revenue sharing in oneworld? Was the AA/QF revenue sharing tie up not much more recent? JL and QR, also oneworld, have First class and does JLs joint venture with AA not predate QFs?

Either way, First class doesn’t seem to be dead, plenty of airlines still investing in new products there. AA is in markets where there is demand for it but maybe be the math for AA just doesn’t make sense.
 
DLPMMM
Posts: 2376
Joined: Wed Apr 20, 2005 12:34 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sat Aug 27, 2022 9:00 pm

9w748capt wrote:
FLYFIRSTCLASS wrote:
vhtje wrote:
How would AA’s elimination of FF impact JVs with BA and QF?


It goes back to the origins of One World, so AA/BA/QF can have aligned products in certain markets. Has to do with revenue sharing and a consistent product. Not sure if its still in effect. Back when USAir first took over AA and slashed the services to pathetic levels, BA was not happy. Imagine if you were top tier on BA and they booked you on AA and the service sucked, you would not be happy with either carier.
There were rumors around that BA was going to leave OW for *


Wow I didn't know that! Is that actually real that BA considered leaving oneworld? That would have been crazy. And all because of Dougie? Yikes.


I would not put too much trust in the traction of that rumor…I can never remember any serious consideration ever being given to it on any of the airlines boards and BA never made any statement to the effect that they were considering any type of such a move.
 
NYCAAer
Posts: 853
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 10:22 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sun Aug 28, 2022 1:16 am

RvA wrote:
FLYFIRSTCLASS wrote:
vhtje wrote:
How would AA’s elimination of FF impact JVs with BA and QF?


It goes back to the origins of One World, so AA/BA/QF can have aligned products in certain markets. Has to do with revenue sharing and a consistent product. Not sure if its still in effect. Back when USAir first took over AA and slashed the services to pathetic levels, BA was not happy. Imagine if you were top tier on BA and they booked you on AA and the service sucked, you would not be happy with either carier.
There were rumors around that BA was going to leave OW for *


Revenue sharing in oneworld? Was the AA/QF revenue sharing tie up not much more recent? JL and QR, also oneworld, have First class and does JLs joint venture with AA not predate QFs?

Either way, First class doesn’t seem to be dead, plenty of airlines still investing in new products there. AA is in markets where there is demand for it but maybe be the math for AA just doesn’t make sense.


Qatar doesn’t have F, just business but it’s the hugely popular Q-suites that people love.
 
D L X
Posts: 12875
Joined: Thu May 27, 1999 3:30 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sun Aug 28, 2022 1:59 am

FLYFIRSTCLASS wrote:
vhtje wrote:
How would AA’s elimination of FF impact JVs with BA and QF?


It goes back to the origins of One World, so AA/BA/QF can have aligned products in certain markets. Has to do with revenue sharing and a consistent product. Not sure if its still in effect. Back when USAir first took over AA and slashed the services to pathetic levels, BA was not happy. Imagine if you were top tier on BA and they booked you on AA and the service sucked, you would not be happy with either carier.
There were rumors around that BA was going to leave OW for *

This seems like revisionist history.

BA’s J kinda sucked. Still does. US’s J was sneaky awesome. BA was never going to Star.

But yes, AA had to have F because of BA.
 
9w748capt
Posts: 1933
Joined: Sat Feb 02, 2008 10:27 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sun Aug 28, 2022 2:11 am

NYCAAer wrote:
RvA wrote:
FLYFIRSTCLASS wrote:

It goes back to the origins of One World, so AA/BA/QF can have aligned products in certain markets. Has to do with revenue sharing and a consistent product. Not sure if its still in effect. Back when USAir first took over AA and slashed the services to pathetic levels, BA was not happy. Imagine if you were top tier on BA and they booked you on AA and the service sucked, you would not be happy with either carier.
There were rumors around that BA was going to leave OW for *


Revenue sharing in oneworld? Was the AA/QF revenue sharing tie up not much more recent? JL and QR, also oneworld, have First class and does JLs joint venture with AA not predate QFs?

Either way, First class doesn’t seem to be dead, plenty of airlines still investing in new products there. AA is in markets where there is demand for it but maybe be the math for AA just doesn’t make sense.


Qatar doesn’t have F, just business but it’s the hugely popular Q-suites that people love.


They definitely have F, just on the A380s, but they fosho have F.
 
ikramerica
Posts: 15241
Joined: Mon May 23, 2005 9:33 am

Re: American Airlines To Eliminate First Class Product

Sun Aug 28, 2022 2:41 am

Moosefire wrote:
Makes sense. Flew it last year to LHR and the F Seats were arguably worse than the ones in Business. and the catering has never been too impressive prior to/during/post Covid. My only motivation for opting for Flagship first on American has been to get a higher fare/more miles. Just one man’s thoughts.

No, catering was great under Bob Crandel. I flew F ORD-ZRH in the late 90s and the dinner meal was excellent, the swiss purser was wonderful, and it was the first time I ever tasted Royal Tokaji.

My F flights to and DFW-NRT in 2003 were also great in terms of catering.

When US tookover AA the product tanked. That’s the reality of it.
 
User avatar
DocLightning
Posts: 22390
Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2005 8:51 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sun Aug 28, 2022 3:31 am

UAUA wrote:
https://simpleflying.com/american-airlines-eliminate-first-class/

So no international first class anymore for US carriers. Sad.


Appropriate. AA's International F offering is a truly inferior product that can't remotely compete with the likes of LH, QF, or BA, let alone SQ, EK, or QR. I hope they put these resources into improving their also substandard J product.
 
jetwet1
Posts: 3606
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2007 4:42 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sun Aug 28, 2022 5:12 am

NYCAAer wrote:
RvA wrote:
FLYFIRSTCLASS wrote:

It goes back to the origins of One World, so AA/BA/QF can have aligned products in certain markets. Has to do with revenue sharing and a consistent product. Not sure if its still in effect. Back when USAir first took over AA and slashed the services to pathetic levels, BA was not happy. Imagine if you were top tier on BA and they booked you on AA and the service sucked, you would not be happy with either carier.
There were rumors around that BA was going to leave OW for *


Revenue sharing in oneworld? Was the AA/QF revenue sharing tie up not much more recent? JL and QR, also oneworld, have First class and does JLs joint venture with AA not predate QFs?

Either way, First class doesn’t seem to be dead, plenty of airlines still investing in new products there. AA is in markets where there is demand for it but maybe be the math for AA just doesn’t make sense.


Qatar doesn’t have F, just business but it’s the hugely popular Q-suites that people love.


Sure they do.
https://www.qatarairways.com/en-us/onbo ... class.html

However, its IMHO more of a status thing, the Q Suites took away any real reason for it.



D L X wrote:
FLYFIRSTCLASS wrote:
vhtje wrote:
How would AA’s elimination of FF impact JVs with BA and QF?


It goes back to the origins of One World, so AA/BA/QF can have aligned products in certain markets. Has to do with revenue sharing and a consistent product. Not sure if its still in effect. Back when USAir first took over AA and slashed the services to pathetic levels, BA was not happy. Imagine if you were top tier on BA and they booked you on AA and the service sucked, you would not be happy with either carier.
There were rumors around that BA was going to leave OW for *

This seems like revisionist history.

BA’s J kinda sucked. Still does. US’s J was sneaky awesome. BA was never going to Star.

But yes, AA had to have F because of BA.


Especially if you got one of the former first class lay flats
 
Detroit313
Posts: 786
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2017 2:56 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sun Aug 28, 2022 6:39 am

Why is this such a big deal? United and Delta don’t even offer first class. Why should AA?
 
jfk777
Posts: 7700
Joined: Tue Aug 22, 2006 7:23 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sun Aug 28, 2022 7:24 am

When AA eliminated First Class from their 777-200 they should have killed it on their 777-300ER fleet too.
 
cedarjet
Posts: 9128
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 1:12 am

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sun Aug 28, 2022 8:34 am

It’s more of a housekeeping exercise to tidy up how the products are sold, a more accurate narrative would be “AA remains a three class carrier” instead of having four hard products. Having a decent premium economy is what has prompted this. And it’s the right thing to do. (If they do it.)
 
User avatar
vhtje
Posts: 1432
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2009 12:40 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sun Aug 28, 2022 9:24 am

NYCAAer wrote:

Qatar doesn’t have F, just business but it’s the hugely popular Q-suites that people love.


A two-second Google search disproves your post about QR not having F:

https://scottscheapflights.com/guides/qatar-airways-first-class
 
rbavfan
Posts: 4190
Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2015 5:53 am

Re: American Airlines To Eliminate First Class Product

Sun Aug 28, 2022 9:40 am

ben7x wrote:
usairways85 wrote:
FWIW...the article title is misleading in that it implies that there is a formal announcement from AA. I do not believe this is official, maybe a few implied remarks during interviews, other known bloggers/journalists who have rumored this in recent days, etc.


Simple flying seems to be very convinced:
There are only eight Flagship First seats on the 777s, which will start to be phased out next year.
and
The airline also has plans to reconfigure its Airbus A321T aircraft in a standard domestic configuration

But we all know, how serious they are…


I see the A321T being reconfigured to standard A321 layout with the new A321's having 3 doors it will allow another row of Business class at least. 4 more business class seats on the newer A321xlr's will allow better margins then the classics. Plus they will have better options for EU/UK routes that need higher premium seats using A321-xlr's.
 
NYCAAer
Posts: 853
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2004 10:22 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sun Aug 28, 2022 3:59 pm

vhtje wrote:
NYCAAer wrote:

Qatar doesn’t have F, just business but it’s the hugely popular Q-suites that people love.


A two-second Google search disproves your post about QR not having F:

https://scottscheapflights.com/guides/qatar-airways-first-class


Oh, I thought I read somewhere on here that they had eliminated it. Learn something new every day.
 
User avatar
ClassicLover
Posts: 5598
Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2004 12:27 pm

Re: Rumor: American Airlines To Eliminate International First Class Product

Sun Aug 28, 2022 4:28 pm

NYCAAer wrote:
Oh, I thought I read somewhere on here that they had eliminated it. Learn something new every day.


They had, as they retired the A380s, then the A350 kerfuffle occurred and they needed the capacity and the A380s are back, along with First Class. How long for? Who knows, but presumably not for too long.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos