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sierrakilo44
Posts: 1068
Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2011 1:38 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:07 am

smi0006 wrote:

Surely we are heading towards the point where international pier will need to be expanded anyway and QF moved over? Even if domestic isn’t ready. It then airport pricing would mean current international operators would pick ip the tag for QFs expansion before the facility is completed….


As QF have said their Perth ops rely on aircraft changes and passenger and baggage connections out of one terminal on one side of the runway, whiteout having to transfer pax, bags or tow aircraft across Perth’s busy main runway.

This would be solved when PAPL and the state government hurry up and build the Qantas domestic terminal adjacent to T1 on the eastern side of the airport, whenever that may be.
 
sierrakilo44
Posts: 1068
Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2011 1:38 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:09 am

planemanofnz wrote:
Perhaps concern about risks from the Foot and Mouth outbreak in Indonesia could be a factor around CGK


Hasn’t affected any of the other multiple flights from Indonesia into Australia, including Perth.
 
ZKNHF
Posts: 31
Joined: Wed Nov 10, 2021 7:49 pm

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Wed Oct 19, 2022 8:45 am

Sorry if this has been covered in a past thread. But does anyone know why JQ went with CFM with their A321Neo (and I assume all other Neos). Being an IAE Ceo operator I would’ve thought they would’ve stayed with P&W like Air NZ have.

Was it purely a decision coming from QF for similarities incase they were to order the Max 737s? Do we know what engines will be on the recently ordered Neos for QF?

With the LR variants supposedly meant for longer sectors with JQ, I would have thought the P&W would’ve had a slight maintenance+fuel cost advantage.

To my knowledge the geared P&W haven’t given Air NZ any major issues. Especially considering the high takeoff power settings needed for trans Tasman A321 loads out of ZQN and WLG.
 
kriskim
Posts: 572
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2016 12:44 am

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Wed Oct 19, 2022 10:03 am

Obzerva wrote:
IndianicWorld wrote:
Obzerva wrote:

Not quite, KE left MEL in 2013 ;)


Oh I thought it was longer.. still, a long time :)


yeah agree still a while, and like Gemuser's post above, when I travelled on the A330, it was only half full, very comfortable flight for economy, but passenger comfort doesn't equal profitable!


There was a graph somewhere a few years back that indicated O&D traffic between Melbourne and Sth Korea was growing, there was a little dip in 2013 when KE stopped services but the market grew year on year after that organically without direct services. Other airlines like SQ, CX, CI etc… also heavily promote MEL in conjunction with the Victorian government in the past to the Korean market. There is a local Korean population in Melbourne but obviously not as large as Sydney and Brisbane, however there is/was a large student population and you can see alot of Korean businesses establishing themselves in Melbourne as of late, both local restaurants and large food chains, even Korean beauty companies. Lotte Duty Free, Amore Pacific, Nene Chicken for example.

From memory KE flights weren’t cheap either, the direct services was quite expensive compared to 1 stop options. Obviously your experiences are all anecdotal, there could have been a lot of belly cargo that also help kept the flight afloat. Just before the services were axed, KE was looking at adding a fourth weekly service to MEL but that never materialised.

We saw OZ introduce a seasonal charter which was almost full, but that was 1 weekly flight over the summer. I heard they were keen to introduce a year round service but it looks like the merger and COVID has caused those plans to not happen.
 
AirbusA322
Posts: 241
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Wed Oct 19, 2022 10:48 am

I’ve noticed Batik Air is growing considerably here at the moment.

Which got me wondering, why does a big player like AirAsiaIndonesia not fly to MEL/SYD/BNE? It is reachable with A320 Sharklets and obviously 320N. Brand awareness isn’t an issue, they have the Bali slots, why are they avoiding?
 
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SCFlyer
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Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2018 11:14 pm

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Wed Oct 19, 2022 11:08 am

AirbusA322 wrote:
I’ve noticed Batik Air is growing considerably here at the moment.

Which got me wondering, why does a big player like AirAsiaIndonesia not fly to MEL/SYD/BNE? It is reachable with A320 Sharklets and obviously 320N. Brand awareness isn’t an issue, they have the Bali slots, why are they avoiding?


The now-defunct Indonesia AirAsiaX did try DPS-SYD/MEL with the Y heavy A330s, but it didn't last very long and Indonesia's AirAsiaX Long Haul division was subsequently liquidated (and planes returned to lessors) not long after departing the Australian market.

Considering QF for a while had load restrictions on a 738 on the SYD/MEL-DPS sector and VA for a while decided to take on fully-loaded 738 with fuel stop in DRW during a recent holiday season where the 'alternate' airports in Indonesia were closed during that time, I don't think a fully loaded all-Y A320neo may make DPS-SYD/MEL/BNE without a fuel stop.
 
tullamarine
Posts: 3610
Joined: Thu Aug 05, 1999 1:14 pm

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Wed Oct 19, 2022 1:15 pm

SCFlyer wrote:
AirbusA322 wrote:
I’ve noticed Batik Air is growing considerably here at the moment.

Which got me wondering, why does a big player like AirAsiaIndonesia not fly to MEL/SYD/BNE? It is reachable with A320 Sharklets and obviously 320N. Brand awareness isn’t an issue, they have the Bali slots, why are they avoiding?


The now-defunct Indonesia AirAsiaX did try DPS-SYD/MEL with the Y heavy A330s, but it didn't last very long and Indonesia's AirAsiaX Long Haul division was subsequently liquidated (and planes returned to lessors) not long after departing the Australian market.

Considering QF for a while had load restrictions on a 738 on the SYD/MEL-DPS sector and VA for a while decided to take on fully-loaded 738 with fuel stop in DRW during a recent holiday season where the 'alternate' airports in Indonesia were closed during that time, I don't think a fully loaded all-Y A320neo may make DPS-SYD/MEL/BNE without a fuel stop.

Citilink (Garuda's LCC) operated an all Y A320 on AVV-DPS briefly before COVID shut it down. It hasn't come back with Citilink changing its focus as part of the wider Garuda restructure.
 
tsurumaru
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Wed Oct 19, 2022 3:44 pm

SCFlyer wrote:
AirbusA322 wrote:
I’ve noticed Batik Air is growing considerably here at the moment.

Which got me wondering, why does a big player like AirAsiaIndonesia not fly to MEL/SYD/BNE? It is reachable with A320 Sharklets and obviously 320N. Brand awareness isn’t an issue, they have the Bali slots, why are they avoiding?


The now-defunct Indonesia AirAsiaX did try DPS-SYD/MEL with the Y heavy A330s, but it didn't last very long and Indonesia's AirAsiaX Long Haul division was subsequently liquidated (and planes returned to lessors) not long after departing the Australian market.

Considering QF for a while had load restrictions on a 738 on the SYD/MEL-DPS sector and VA for a while decided to take on fully-loaded 738 with fuel stop in DRW during a recent holiday season where the 'alternate' airports in Indonesia were closed during that time, I don't think a fully loaded all-Y A320neo may make DPS-SYD/MEL/BNE without a fuel stop.


Not sure there is any reason to think the A320neo couldn’t make these routes work profitably - as mentioned, Citilink very briefly flew to AVV, and Jetstar have also used the 320ceo to add supplemental capacity from MEL for several years now (the sharklets really make a difference here). VA, and Pacific Blue before them, have flown the 738 for close to 15 years on these routes despite reportedly facing restrictions (somewhere in the order of 140 pax per flight, I’ve heard), proving that as an LCC you don’t need to have the most optimal frame to still turn a profit on long sectors. In any case, the A321LR/XLR will more than take care of any limitations on payload or range.

Although Batik’s growth has been impressive, it is also important to remember that they aren’t run in the same way AirAsia and its subsidiaries are. Look at Indonesia for example - having two LCCs in addition to Batik flying wingtip to wingtip in some cases does not make much sense from an outside perspective. I still don’t understand why (barring some sort of regulatory issue) Batik operates its entire DPS-AUS network with their Malaysian subsidiary. As for AirAsia, I think it’s a matter of if and not when - but they need to focus on rebuilding and returning to profitability before chasing new routes.
 
CPH-R
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Wed Oct 19, 2022 5:55 pm

QF9 once again heavily delayed out of PER, but ZNC which operated the MEL-PER leg is currently in the air as QF7009 with a destination of N/A (though I'd imagine it's headed for LHR to operate tomorrow's QF10). Curious...
 
zkncj
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Wed Oct 19, 2022 6:30 pm

ZKNHF wrote:
Sorry if this has been covered in a past thread. But does anyone know why JQ went with CFM with their A321Neo (and I assume all other Neos). Being an IAE Ceo operator I would’ve thought they would’ve stayed with P&W like Air NZ have.

Was it purely a decision coming from QF for similarities incase they were to order the Max 737s? Do we know what engines will be on the recently ordered Neos for QF?

With the LR variants supposedly meant for longer sectors with JQ, I would have thought the P&W would’ve had a slight maintenance+fuel cost advantage.

To my knowledge the geared P&W haven’t given Air NZ any major issues. Especially considering the high takeoff power settings needed for trans Tasman A321 loads out of ZQN and WLG.


Could have something todo with planned mission profile? QF/JQ have preferred to order the LR/XLR modes which will give them more flexibility.

NZ brought its a321NEO on a bare basics budget, also with a lower seat count that JQ.

NZ’s purchasing method is different to QF group, it you look at QF they are replacing 738s with a321XLR’s some of which will fly SYD-MEL!

Where you get NZ who seem to be happy, with having a split a321NEO fleet. The 3x a321N being delivered over the next month, are base models completely stripped back to the basics.
 
AirbusA322
Posts: 241
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Wed Oct 19, 2022 9:31 pm

zkncj wrote:
ZKNHF wrote:
The 3x a321N being delivered over the next month, are base models completely stripped back to the basics.

Interesting. What sort of stuff do they forgo in stripping back to the basics, vs the JQ 321LR?

I guess if they are not really ever going to venture outside of Trans Tasman no point going for the LR. However the flexibility is always good to have up your sleeve with the Le.
 
strfyr51
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Wed Oct 19, 2022 10:03 pm

AirbusA322 wrote:
zkncj wrote:
ZKNHF wrote:
The 3x a321N being delivered over the next month, are base models completely stripped back to the basics.

Interesting. What sort of stuff do they forgo in stripping back to the basics, vs the JQ 321LR?

I guess if they are not really ever going to venture outside of Trans Tasman no point going for the LR. However the flexibility is always good to have up your sleeve with the Le.

It could be? they don't want to give up any cargo capacity uplift. they don't need any extra fuel to fly transcon do they? Then if they can fly Transcon? they can also fly west coast to Hawaii and the east coast to LHR. wouldn't you agree? they have now and have always had planes that had longer ranges and uplifts. they also have an extensive 737 catalog that can do all of that as well with no extra tanks. the A321 will have to earn it's keep among other siblings and you can BET! It will be judged along side of them in performance, capability, and reliability. We'll get an even view on what the airplane can and Can't do. and its flexibility in doing it.
I've waited for this for quite a while. and I'm interested to see if the airplane will hang in there like its siblings the A320and A319 as they've proven themselves in United service as workhorse aircraft. and I ecpect no less from the A321. It's not going to become the next Geat airplane at United. It's just going to be the next. We'll see if it's great.
 
DeltaB717
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Wed Oct 19, 2022 10:25 pm

zkncj wrote:
ZKNHF wrote:
Sorry if this has been covered in a past thread. But does anyone know why JQ went with CFM with their A321Neo (and I assume all other Neos). Being an IAE Ceo operator I would’ve thought they would’ve stayed with P&W like Air NZ have.

Was it purely a decision coming from QF for similarities incase they were to order the Max 737s? Do we know what engines will be on the recently ordered Neos for QF?

With the LR variants supposedly meant for longer sectors with JQ, I would have thought the P&W would’ve had a slight maintenance+fuel cost advantage.

To my knowledge the geared P&W haven’t given Air NZ any major issues. Especially considering the high takeoff power settings needed for trans Tasman A321 loads out of ZQN and WLG.


Could have something todo with planned mission profile? QF/JQ have preferred to order the LR/XLR modes which will give them more flexibility.

NZ brought its a321NEO on a bare basics budget, also with a lower seat count that JQ.

NZ’s purchasing method is different to QF group, it you look at QF they are replacing 738s with a321XLR’s some of which will fly SYD-MEL!

Where you get NZ who seem to be happy, with having a split a321NEO fleet. The 3x a321N being delivered over the next month, are base models completely stripped back to the basics.


Both engine options for the NEO family are perfectly capable of the types of missions JQ & QF might like to use their A321neo for. B6, for example, has both the LR & XLR ordered (and, of course, the LR already in service) with the P&W engines. Where the QF Group would have seen some benefits had they gone with the P&W is commonality with the A220. Maybe we'll see a case where JQ will have CFM and QF will have P&W?
 
BNEFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Thu Oct 20, 2022 1:13 am

NZ's AKL-PER-AKL flights will be operated on a wet lease by Wamos for three months from November.

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... wamos-a330
 
jrfspa320
Posts: 924
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Thu Oct 20, 2022 1:30 am

BNEFlyer wrote:
NZ's AKL-PER-AKL flights will be operated on a wet lease by Wamos for three months from November.

https://www.executivetraveller.com/news ... wamos-a330


NZ prudent to have operational spare in the long-haul fleet. Apparently QF were looking at options for something similar but nothing has come of it as yet.

Pre covid the 747s used to operate as back up aircraft across the network now with no spare capacity long delays and cancellations seem common.
 
zkncj
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Thu Oct 20, 2022 1:45 am

AirbusA322 wrote:
zkncj wrote:
ZKNHF wrote:
The 3x a321N being delivered over the next month, are base models completely stripped back to the basics.

Interesting. What sort of stuff do they forgo in stripping back to the basics, vs the JQ 321LR?

I guess if they are not really ever going to venture outside of Trans Tasman no point going for the LR. However the flexibility is always good to have up your sleeve with the Le.


The domestic editions no venture outside of New Zealand... they are overwater equiped, things skipped but not limited too.
- HR Radios
- Additional navigation equipment (they get the basics plus RNP for ZQN)
- Life rafts
- WIFI
- AVOD IFE
- Moveable headrests.
- Galley Equipment

Here is a International A321N https://www.airnewzealand.co.nz/seat-ma ... 21neo-214i vs a Domestic A321N https://www.airnewzealand.co.nz/seat-ma ... 21neo-217d.

From what I understand all of JQ's A320's are current overwater equiped?
 
AirbusA322
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Thu Oct 20, 2022 9:16 am

strfyr51 wrote:
AirbusA322 wrote:
zkncj wrote:

Interesting. What sort of stuff do they forgo in stripping back to the basics, vs the JQ 321LR?

I guess if they are not really ever going to venture outside of Trans Tasman no point going for the LR. However the flexibility is always good to have up your sleeve with the Le.

It could be? they don't want to give up any cargo capacity uplift. they don't need any extra fuel to fly transcon do they? Then if they can fly Transcon? they can also fly west coast to Hawaii and the east coast to LHR. wouldn't you agree? they have now and have always had planes that had longer ranges and uplifts. they also have an extensive 737 catalog that can do all of that as well with no extra tanks. the A321 will have to earn it's keep among other siblings and you can BET! It will be judged along side of them in performance, capability, and reliability. We'll get an even view on what the airplane can and Can't do. and its flexibility in doing it.
I've waited for this for quite a while. and I'm interested to see if the airplane will hang in there like its siblings the A320and A319 as they've proven themselves in United service as workhorse aircraft. and I ecpect no less from the A321. It's not going to become the next Geat airplane at United. It's just going to be the next. We'll see if it's great.

We are not talking about United we are talking about Jetstar and Air New Zealand. Your post makes no sense regardless
 
vhebb
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Thu Oct 20, 2022 9:34 am

Looks like QF have pulled the A380 off MEL-LAX which was planned from March next year.

That leaves SYD-SIN-LHR and SYD-LAX as the only A380 routes.

Anyone know what the plans are?
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Thu Oct 20, 2022 9:48 am

vhebb wrote:
Looks like QF have pulled the A380 off MEL-LAX which was planned from March next year.

That leaves SYD-SIN-LHR and SYD-LAX as the only A380 routes.

Anyone know what the plans are?


This breaks it down

SFO pushed backed to May
Some frequency adjustments and equipment changes

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/221020-qfns23intl

On a separate note there are currently 3 QF 787’s on the ground in PER
 
AirbusA322
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Thu Oct 20, 2022 11:17 am

Anymore detail on the Virgin Max? Being delivered in Jan which isn’t far away.
 
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SCFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Thu Oct 20, 2022 11:22 am

On a related note regarding the VA Maxes.

https://australianaviation.com.au/2022/ ... l-network/
 
smi0006
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Thu Oct 20, 2022 12:19 pm

AirbusA322 wrote:
Anymore detail on the Virgin Max? Being delivered in Jan which isn’t far away.


When is the first Max- 10 due? Wiki has a config of 8/196. Has this been confirmed? Again a great way to add capacity into Golden triangle cheaply. Not to mention DPS if VA can get some more seats allocated.

Still hoping we see a refreshed livery on the Maxes with some more colour!
 
CPH-R
Posts: 6209
Joined: Thu May 03, 2001 5:19 pm

Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Thu Oct 20, 2022 1:00 pm

qf789 wrote:
vhebb wrote:
Looks like QF have pulled the A380 off MEL-LAX which was planned from March next year.

That leaves SYD-SIN-LHR and SYD-LAX as the only A380 routes.

Anyone know what the plans are?


This breaks it down

SFO pushed backed to May
Some frequency adjustments and equipment changes

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/221020-qfns23intl

On a separate note there are currently 3 QF 787’s on the ground in PER

Looks like they're cleaning up after the recent delays on QF9. ZNH departed slightly late as QF9 and ZNI has just become active on FR24 as QF7009, so will presumably depart for LHR soon'ish.
 
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eta unknown
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Thu Oct 20, 2022 1:40 pm

tsurumaru wrote:
Not sure there is any reason to think the A320neo couldn’t make these routes work profitably - as mentioned, Citilink very briefly flew to AVV, and Jetstar have also used the 320ceo to add supplemental capacity from MEL for several years now (the sharklets really make a difference here). VA, and Pacific Blue before them, have flown the 738 for close to 15 years on these routes despite reportedly facing restrictions (somewhere in the order of 140 pax per flight, I’ve heard), proving that as an LCC you don’t need to have the most optimal frame to still turn a profit on long sectors. In any case, the A321LR/XLR will more than take care of any limitations on payload or range.
Although Batik’s growth has been impressive, it is also important to remember that they aren’t run in the same way AirAsia and its subsidiaries are. Look at Indonesia for example - having two LCCs in addition to Batik flying wingtip to wingtip in some cases does not make much sense from an outside perspective. I still don’t understand why (barring some sort of regulatory issue) Batik operates its entire DPS-AUS network with their Malaysian subsidiary. As for AirAsia, I think it’s a matter of if and not when - but they need to focus on rebuilding and returning to profitability before chasing new routes.


FYI the GA payload restriction on BNE-DPS was even worse than the figures mentioned above- IIRC they had a different gross weight version of the 738. The route was supposed to be operated 3x/week by an A330 until some idiot in head office decided to make the route daily just before flights started with the 737 that didn't have the operational capability.

PER-DPS was operated by Batik Air Indonesia, not the Malaysian subsidiary, so no regulatory issues.

And yes, Air Asia X's A330 flights didn't last long at all.
 
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eta unknown
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Thu Oct 20, 2022 1:43 pm

SCFlyer wrote:
Considering QF for a while had load restrictions on a 738 on the SYD/MEL-DPS sector and VA for a while decided to take on fully-loaded 738 with fuel stop in DRW during a recent holiday season where the 'alternate' airports in Indonesia were closed during that time, I don't think a fully loaded all-Y A320neo may make DPS-SYD/MEL/BNE without a fuel stop.

THE VA DRW fuel stop was self-inflicted- even when the alternate Indo airports were open VA refused to use them for operational purposes- they want to use DRW. FYI Indo carriers use Kupang as the alternate.
 
vhebb
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Thu Oct 20, 2022 6:41 pm

qf789 wrote:
vhebb wrote:
Looks like QF have pulled the A380 off MEL-LAX which was planned from March next year.

That leaves SYD-SIN-LHR and SYD-LAX as the only A380 routes.

Anyone know what the plans are?


This breaks it down

SFO pushed backed to May
Some frequency adjustments and equipment changes

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/221020-qfns23intl

On a separate note there are currently 3 QF 787’s on the ground in PER


Thanks for that.

So where are all the A380s? Surely more will return to service before March next year?
 
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Velocity7
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Thu Oct 20, 2022 8:50 pm

Travelled with SQ over the last few weeks on the A359 Regional - man, are those things uncomfortable in Y. Limited leg room, hard seats, entertainment screen way to close to you and the ergonomics of the seat are all wrong. The service was still very good and I love Changi as a transit airport but that seat :yuck:

Going to have to re-think my Y travel into Asia I feel - it didn't feel like the SQ I love...
 
evanb
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Thu Oct 20, 2022 10:59 pm

vhebb wrote:
qf789 wrote:
vhebb wrote:
Looks like QF have pulled the A380 off MEL-LAX which was planned from March next year.

That leaves SYD-SIN-LHR and SYD-LAX as the only A380 routes.

Anyone know what the plans are?


This breaks it down

SFO pushed backed to May
Some frequency adjustments and equipment changes

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/221020-qfns23intl

On a separate note there are currently 3 QF 787’s on the ground in PER


Thanks for that.

So where are all the A380s? Surely more will return to service before March next year?


QF are short further A380s since they are rotating trough maintenance for wing spar checks due to a recent EASA directive. Up to two months per aircraft. VH-OQJ is currently getting its check and has been in Sydney for it since early September.

Edit: VH-OQB, OQD, OQH and OQK are all operational. Three are undergoing heavy maintenance and/or return to service checks: OQA in LAX, OQG in AUH, OQJ in SYD. OQC is in storage in AUH, and should be in or about to go into heavy maintenance and/or return to service checks there. Remainder are in storage in VCV, either awaiting heavy maintenance and/or return to service checks or scrapping (OQE, OQF, OQI, OQL). Once OQJ returns to service, it will be replaces with one of OQB, OQD, OQH and OQK that all need to rotate back to maintenance for the wing spar checks. Safe to assume that the others will receive the wing spar check during heavy maintenance and/or return to service checks.
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 12:54 am

Velocity7 wrote:
Travelled with SQ over the last few weeks on the A359 Regional - man, are those things uncomfortable in Y. Limited leg room, hard seats, entertainment screen way to close to you and the ergonomics of the seat are all wrong. The service was still very good and I love Changi as a transit airport but that seat :yuck:

Going to have to re-think my Y travel into Asia I feel - it didn't feel like the SQ I love...

Yes, I recently flew in Y on the regional SQ A359 and was surprised by how uncomfortable the seat was. It was hard and seemed much narrower than the Y seat on CX's A359. I wonder if SQ has chosen to fit the same seats on both the regional A359s and 78Js which mean there is no real advantage in the wider A350 cabin which is a shame.
 
Fuling
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 3:39 am

VA has posted on their social that 'Wonderful is coming - 23.10.2022'. Is this the event we've been waiting for? Any guesses what's going to happen?
 
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csturdiv
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 4:53 am

smi0006 wrote:
AirbusA322 wrote:
Anymore detail on the Virgin Max? Being delivered in Jan which isn’t far away.


When is the first Max- 10 due? Wiki has a config of 8/196. Has this been confirmed? Again a great way to add capacity into Golden triangle cheaply. Not to mention DPS if VA can get some more seats allocated.

Still hoping we see a refreshed livery on the Maxes with some more colour!


I'm not even sure Boeing knows when the first Max-10 will be delivered. Still trying to get certification.
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 5:18 am

csturdiv wrote:
smi0006 wrote:
AirbusA322 wrote:
Anymore detail on the Virgin Max? Being delivered in Jan which isn’t far away.


When is the first Max- 10 due? Wiki has a config of 8/196. Has this been confirmed? Again a great way to add capacity into Golden triangle cheaply. Not to mention DPS if VA can get some more seats allocated.

Still hoping we see a refreshed livery on the Maxes with some more colour!


I'm not even sure Boeing knows when the first Max-10 will be delivered. Still trying to get certification.

Correct, 737-MAX10 certification is mired in the whole EICAS debate as it won't comply with the laws applicable from the end of the year but won't be certified before then. There is an attempt to get a waiver for the MAX7 and MAX10 but it is unclear if the waiver will get through Congress.

If Boeing have to develop EICAS for MAX10, they may ditch the program due to the extended development costs and they loss of a common type rating for all 737s. There is a rumor that Southwest (the largest customer of MAX7) has a clause in their agreement with Boeing that if extra training is required, Boeing will compensate Southwest at USD1M per pilot!!!

Were the MAX10 to be cancelled, VA would have the choice of replacing the orders with MAX8 or MAX9 though the MAX9 is a bit of a compromise performance wise and MAX8 a compromise on size. I'd assume VA would also receive some other financial compensation. VA could also walk away from the MAX completely but, with the large NEO backlog, this remains unlikely.
 
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qf789
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 5:55 am

In addition to yesterday’s update QF’s SYD-SFO will see 3 weekly instead of 4 weekly, planned to resume in late May though subject to change

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/221021-qfns23sfo
 
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SCFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 6:03 am

Fuling wrote:
VA has posted on their social that 'Wonderful is coming - 23.10.2022'. Is this the event we've been waiting for? Any guesses what's going to happen?


Considering the recent Australian Aviation article of Jayne talking about International (Short Haul) expansion, my guess is that it'll be that in combination with another major announcement, possibly new partnerships (The long-delayed NH partnership maybe?).
Can't see it being a new livery, or being the arrival of the single-class 700s.

Or of course it'll could be a 'fizzer' *cough* Toasters in the QF Hobart Lounge.
 
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Velocity7
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 6:19 am

tullamarine wrote:
Velocity7 wrote:
Travelled with SQ over the last few weeks on the A359 Regional - man, are those things uncomfortable in Y. Limited leg room, hard seats, entertainment screen way to close to you and the ergonomics of the seat are all wrong. The service was still very good and I love Changi as a transit airport but that seat :yuck:

Going to have to re-think my Y travel into Asia I feel - it didn't feel like the SQ I love...

Yes, I recently flew in Y on the regional SQ A359 and was surprised by how uncomfortable the seat was. It was hard and seemed much narrower than the Y seat on CX's A359. I wonder if SQ has chosen to fit the same seats on both the regional A359s and 78Js which mean there is no real advantage in the wider A350 cabin which is a shame.


It was that uncomfortable on the way over that I spent an extra ~$150/seat and booked the exit row for the return. It was much better having the screen in the armrest but the seat was still unbearable and row 55 is right behind the mid cabin lavs so its super busy. It doesn't seem to have any shoulder support and felt I was perpetually tilted backwards which does nothing for the pressure on your lower back. I am tall but haven't suffered that bad on a 7 hour flight before. The 10 year old seats on the Scoot A320 were far more comfortable!
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 6:38 am

SCFlyer wrote:
Fuling wrote:
VA has posted on their social that 'Wonderful is coming - 23.10.2022'. Is this the event we've been waiting for? Any guesses what's going to happen?


Considering the recent Australian Aviation article of Jayne talking about International (Short Haul) expansion, my guess is that it'll be that in combination with another major announcement, possibly new partnerships (The long-delayed NH partnership maybe?).
Can't see it being a new livery, or being the arrival of the single-class 700s.

Or of course it'll could be a 'fizzer' *cough* Toasters in the QF Hobart Lounge.

Don't know what it is but a Sunday is a good day to launch something and get maximum press coverage as it is generally a quiet day newswise and the networks are keen to get content to fill their 1 hour bulletins.
 
smi0006
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 7:17 am

SCFlyer wrote:
Fuling wrote:
VA has posted on their social that 'Wonderful is coming - 23.10.2022'. Is this the event we've been waiting for? Any guesses what's going to happen?


Considering the recent Australian Aviation article of Jayne talking about International (Short Haul) expansion, my guess is that it'll be that in combination with another major announcement, possibly new partnerships (The long-delayed NH partnership maybe?).
Can't see it being a new livery, or being the arrival of the single-class 700s.

Or of course it'll could be a 'fizzer' *cough* Toasters in the QF Hobart Lounge.


Those VA - Tassie puffer jackets were pretty bad too… couldn’t ever understand that one…
 
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EK413
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 10:39 am

qf789 wrote:
In addition to yesterday’s update QF’s SYD-SFO will see 3 weekly instead of 4 weekly, planned to resume in late May though subject to change

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/221021-qfns23sfo

QF never should’ve retired -OQE & -OQF…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
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RyanairGuru
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 11:01 am

Fuling wrote:
VA has posted on their social that 'Wonderful is coming - 23.10.2022'. Is this the event we've been waiting for? Any guesses what's going to happen?


If not an outright new livery, announcing a new corporate identity seems likely. They switched to the VS/VX-style branding back in June, when they were talking about an “Instagrammable” event, but never announced doing so or made any statement on what/why etc.
 
LTEN11
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 11:18 am

EK413 wrote:
qf789 wrote:
In addition to yesterday’s update QF’s SYD-SFO will see 3 weekly instead of 4 weekly, planned to resume in late May though subject to change

https://www.aeroroutes.com/eng/221021-qfns23sfo

QF never should’ve retired -OQE & -OQF…


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Would make bugger all difference at the moment and in the near term, when each 380 has to go through the wing inspection and repair. Without that, QF would have 6 or 7 of the 380's back by now, they would make a substantial difference to the airlines schedule.
 
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eta unknown
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 11:22 am

RyanairGuru wrote:
Fuling wrote:
VA has posted on their social that 'Wonderful is coming - 23.10.2022'. Is this the event we've been waiting for? Any guesses what's going to happen?


If not an outright new livery, announcing a new corporate identity seems likely. They switched to the VS/VX-style branding back in June, when they were talking about an “Instagrammable” event, but never announced doing so or made any statement on what/why etc.

As long as it's a better roll out than the Bureau of Meteorology!
 
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SCFlyer
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 1:05 pm

The Age Business Columnist speaks of the proposed Bain partial IPO of VA 2.0 in 2023.

On a related note, it speaks of the proposed short-haul international expansion which includes the discussion of the Tokyo-HND slot which also refers to IASC's warning to 'Use It or Lose It' by the end of March ultimatum. Maybe CNS-HND on the Max-8 by the end of March 2023 isn't that much of a stretch?

As mentioned in the article, Long Haul / Widebodies at VA is deferred indefinitely for the foreseeable future, as widely expected.

Link:
https://www.theage.com.au/business/comp ... 5brfx.html
 
Deano969
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 7:53 pm

If one had to join the dots and make a prediction
Max8 CNS-HND to secure slot
IPO in 2023 with mention of 789s
When revenue comes in from float, International expansion with 789s
US, HND-BNE plus a few others
As more Max 8,9 or 10s come into service, more Asian routes trialled with view to upgrading to 789s
Potential 789s on transcontinental
Some 738s move to WA to replace A320 as more Max arrive

Others now underway
737 700s replacing QQ
Expanded regional with Link with Link encouraged to took at ATRs
 
Obzerva
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 9:34 pm

Fuling wrote:
VA has posted on their social that 'Wonderful is coming - 23.10.2022'. Is this the event we've been waiting for? Any guesses what's going to happen?


VA have said they're interested in more short haul international, and as per your above "Wonderful" is coming.

Found this link https://www.indonesia.travel/gb/en/home which has the slogan as Wonderful Indonesia
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 9:52 pm

Deano969 wrote:
If one had to join the dots and make a prediction
Max8 CNS-HND to secure slot
IPO in 2023 with mention of 789s
When revenue comes in from float, International expansion with 789s
US, HND-BNE plus a few others
As more Max 8,9 or 10s come into service, more Asian routes trialled with view to upgrading to 789s
Potential 789s on transcontinental
Some 738s move to WA to replace A320 as more Max arrive

Others now underway
737 700s replacing QQ
Expanded regional with Link with Link encouraged to took at ATRs

It is probably unlikely there will much talk of an excursion into widebodies before an IPO. Such a move would mean a significant capital investment and investors may be wary of what sort of drag such an expansion would have on short to mid term earnings. The best way to maximise Bain's profit is to list the business in its current effectively all-737 domestic oriented state. International widebodies are glamourous but the real money is the domestic franchise which is basically a duopoly and, run properly, a licence to print money.

Even if VA do eventually get 789s or A350s for an international expansion, I doubt they will ever again operate them on domestic services with any regularity. The days of The Business are well and truly over.
 
tullamarine
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 9:55 pm

Obzerva wrote:
Fuling wrote:
VA has posted on their social that 'Wonderful is coming - 23.10.2022'. Is this the event we've been waiting for? Any guesses what's going to happen?


VA have said they're interested in more short haul international, and as per your above "Wonderful" is coming.

Found this link https://www.indonesia.travel/gb/en/home which has the slogan as Wonderful Indonesia

Wonderful Indonesia has been a slogan in Indonesia for many years. I doubt that is what VA are announcing given they already regularly operate to DPS to the maximum extent of their current IASC allotment. I can't see VA operating into CGK. Their limited international operations are primarily leisure focussed and, as a regular visitor to Jakarta, I can say it is not ever likely to become a tourist hotspot.
 
smi0006
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 11:39 pm

Deano969 wrote:
If one had to join the dots and make a prediction
Max8 CNS-HND to secure slot
IPO in 2023 with mention of 789s
When revenue comes in from float, International expansion with 789s
US, HND-BNE plus a few others
As more Max 8,9 or 10s come into service, more Asian routes trialled with view to upgrading to 789s
Potential 789s on transcontinental
Some 738s move to WA to replace A320 as more Max arrive

Others now underway
737 700s replacing QQ
Expanded regional with Link with Link encouraged to took at ATRs


I mean that sounds like a strategy to return to their loss making days…. Unnecessary expansionary at high risk.

Maybe it’s just VA/Bain - and may change after an IPO - but I can’t see VA venturing beyond 737s - a single fleet type has been a huge advantage for them. And seems to be assured profitability. With the right product maxes will give them some growth into South East Asia - MNL,CGK, return to Tasman. They can then invest back into lounges and on ground experience.

In saying this I hadn’t kept close to Max-10 sounds like a right debacle!!
 
evanb
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Fri Oct 21, 2022 11:44 pm

LTEN11 wrote:
Would make bugger all difference at the moment and in the near term, when each 380 has to go through the wing inspection and repair. Without that, QF would have 6 or 7 of the 380's back by now, they would make a substantial difference to the airlines schedule.


Agreed, and add to that return to service, heavy maintenance and cabin refurbishments. Only once the 10th A380s has returned to service will we really know if retiring the two A380s was premature.
 
FromCDGtoSYD
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Sat Oct 22, 2022 12:56 am

Just a bit of theorising but, if VA ever do go down the widebody route where do you reckon they’d fly?

Assuming 787-9 I would think the long awaited BNE-HND, but for other dots I think the path of least resistance would be SIN/DOH. DOH especially could be rather lucrative considering how much bigger QRs network is compared to EY and because of how desperate they are for capacity into the 4 capital hubs.
 
evanb
Posts: 1360
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Re: Australian Aviation Thread - October 2022

Sat Oct 22, 2022 1:02 am

FromCDGtoSYD wrote:
Just a bit of theorising but, if VA ever do go down the widebody route where do you reckon they’d fly?

Assuming 787-9 I would think the long awaited BNE-HND, but for other dots I think the path of least resistance would be SIN/DOH. DOH especially could be rather lucrative considering how much bigger QRs network is compared to EY and because of how desperate they are for capacity into the 4 capital hubs.


Slight technicality. It's not clear that they could do a JV with QR since Australia and Qatar do not have an open skies deal. Generally speaking, open skies is a necessary requirement for a JV. However, VA could make a persuasive case to ACCC.
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