JJWess wrote:

Do we know for sure that the max cabins are going to be the same as the current 737's? Or can we expect a refresh?

It seems likely MAX will receive the refreshed cabins as trialled on the ex-Silkair 738s. This is a new recliner seat including footrest and updated Y seats with USB chargers. There is no indication that VA are considering anything more than that and it is highly unlikely they will consider lie-flats etc on the MAX8 due to the amount of space such seats consume.

IndianicWorld wrote:

SCFlyer wrote:

https://newsroom.virginaustralia.com/release/hello-tokyo-virgin-australia-launches-first-ever-cairns-haneda-japan-service-massive-699

Codeshare with NH, a complimentary bottle of water upon boarding in Y plus regular complimentary Tea/Water/Coffee runs in Y alongside the BoB menu.

As expected, funding by the State of Queensland's AAIF fund in partnership with Cairns Airport

I do find it kind of strange that the govt funding would be required, as VA had next to no other options on the table if they wanted to use their HND slot allocation, but maybe it was the deciding factor on whether to continue with that slot or not.

It will be interesting to see how it goes, as it does appear to be a risk to have to operate it daily on a small market against an established carrier (JQ).

I can see JQ looking at using the A321XLR in future for this route though, so we will see.

I don't believe JQ has the A321XLR, aren't they receiving A321LR with the XLRs planned to head to mainline? The LR could quite easily do CNS-HND if JQ wanted to though.

Government funding will have been negotiated on political grounds. CNS is home to a number of state marginal seats and the government will be keen to fly the flag that they are encouraging more international services into FNQ.

qf2220 wrote:

IndianicWorld wrote:

I can see JQ looking at using the A321XLR in future for this route though, so we will see.

Really? Id think QF would use whatever HND slots they had for daily SYD/MEL/BNE, then multiday at those ports and PER/ADL before using the scarce slot for a JQ service from CNS.

You read too much into that, IndianicWorld meant Cairns to Tokyo, and more broadly Cairns to Japan, not specially CNS-HND.

There is virtually no chance that Jetstar leave Narita even if there were more traffic rights made available in the future (which is unlikely as this tranche required changes to military airspace to facilitate more movements through Tokyo approach/departure airspace) as NRT is the base for Jetstar Japan, who do not (and cannot IIRC) fly to Haneda.

tullamarine wrote:

IndianicWorld wrote:

SCFlyer wrote:

https://newsroom.virginaustralia.com/release/hello-tokyo-virgin-australia-launches-first-ever-cairns-haneda-japan-service-massive-699

Codeshare with NH, a complimentary bottle of water upon boarding in Y plus regular complimentary Tea/Water/Coffee runs in Y alongside the BoB menu.

As expected, funding by the State of Queensland's AAIF fund in partnership with Cairns Airport

I do find it kind of strange that the govt funding would be required, as VA had next to no other options on the table if they wanted to use their HND slot allocation, but maybe it was the deciding factor on whether to continue with that slot or not.

It will be interesting to see how it goes, as it does appear to be a risk to have to operate it daily on a small market against an established carrier (JQ).

I can see JQ looking at using the A321XLR in future for this route though, so we will see.

I don't believe JQ has the A321XLR, aren't they receiving A321LR with the XLRs planned to head to mainline? The LR could quite easily do CNS-HND if JQ wanted to though.

Government funding will have been negotiated on political grounds. CNS is home to a number of state marginal seats and the government will be keen to fly the flag that they are encouraging more international services into FNQ.

I do think Bain had some involvement in the State funding arrangements. As a PE company, they would've wanted to reduce their start-up losses where possible. The flight would've clearly met AAIF funding criteria (e.g Regional Tourism) on top of the marginal seats up there.

SCFlyer wrote:

tullamarine wrote:

IndianicWorld wrote:

I do find it kind of strange that the govt funding would be required, as VA had next to no other options on the table if they wanted to use their HND slot allocation, but maybe it was the deciding factor on whether to continue with that slot or not.

It will be interesting to see how it goes, as it does appear to be a risk to have to operate it daily on a small market against an established carrier (JQ).

I can see JQ looking at using the A321XLR in future for this route though, so we will see.

I don't believe JQ has the A321XLR, aren't they receiving A321LR with the XLRs planned to head to mainline? The LR could quite easily do CNS-HND if JQ wanted to though.

Government funding will have been negotiated on political grounds. CNS is home to a number of state marginal seats and the government will be keen to fly the flag that they are encouraging more international services into FNQ.

I do think Bain had some involvement in the State funding arrangements. As a PE company, they would've wanted to reduce their start-up losses where possible. The flight would've clearly met AAIF funding criteria (e.g Regional Tourism) on top of the marginal seats up there.

Two thoughts:

1) What an absolute waste of a scarce Haneda slot pair. This is Virgin slot squatting with a 737MAX, pure and simple. Will they make money on it? Probably but what a waste of Australia's HND slots;
2) Why does Virgin under Bain Capitals ownership even qualify as an Australian Carrier? Carriers using Australia's International Route Rights have to be at least 51% Australian owned which Virgin isn't. So hopefully the Government has clarity on that because from outwards appearances they wouldn't qualify.

Sydscott wrote:

Two thoughts:

1) What an absolute waste of a scarce Haneda slot pair. This is Virgin slot squatting with a 737MAX, pure and simple. Will they make money on it? Probably but what a waste of Australia's HND slots;
2) Why does Virgin under Bain Capitals ownership even qualify as an Australian Carrier? Carriers using Australia's International Route Rights have to be at least 51% Australian owned which Virgin isn't. So hopefully the Government has clarity on that because from outwards appearances they wouldn't qualify.

Bain is using the same methods that SQ/EY/HNA et al did with Virgin 1.0. Virgin's international subsidiary owned 51% by "Australian registered Investors" whilst they own 49% of that 'subsidiary'. Air New Zealand did the same method with Ansett International back in the day.

SCFlyer wrote:

Sydscott wrote:

Two thoughts:

1) What an absolute waste of a scarce Haneda slot pair. This is Virgin slot squatting with a 737MAX, pure and simple. Will they make money on it? Probably but what a waste of Australia's HND slots;
2) Why does Virgin under Bain Capitals ownership even qualify as an Australian Carrier? Carriers using Australia's International Route Rights have to be at least 51% Australian owned which Virgin isn't. So hopefully the Government has clarity on that because from outwards appearances they wouldn't qualify.

Bain is using the same methods that SQ/EY/HNA et al did with Virgin 1.0. Virgin's international subsidiary owned 51% by "Australian registered Investors" whilst they own 49% of that 'subsidiary'. Air New Zealand did the same method with Ansett International back in the day.

My memory could be failing me, but isn’t the ‘Australian registered investors’ just the Queensland state government? I thought that the ownership coming out of administration was Bain had a 90% ownership stake, while Queensland put in a minor investment of 10% in return for the HQ remaining in Brisbane.

Sydscott wrote:

Two thoughts:

1) What an absolute waste of a scarce Haneda slot pair. This is Virgin slot squatting with a 737MAX, pure and simple. Will they make money on it? Probably but what a waste of Australia's HND slots;
2) Why does Virgin under Bain Capitals ownership even qualify as an Australian Carrier? Carriers using Australia's International Route Rights have to be at least 51% Australian owned which Virgin isn't. So hopefully the Government has clarity on that because from outwards appearances they wouldn't qualify.

Of course it is slot squatting but that doesn't make it wrong. It is a business decision that was forced on them by "use it or lose it" dictums attached to their IASC grant. Will VA still be flying the route in 3 years time? Probably not, but they didn't have the option to defer and QF wouldn't give up any rights in future effectively locking out VA of HND forever.

The ruling on VAI's rights to fly internationally was decided long ago. As was stated above this is using the same interpretation as used by Ansett International in the '90s and VA pre-administration. If QF had their "druthers", it would also apply to them. They would love to be able to go above 50% foreign shareholding as they believe this limits their stock value but are restricted by the Keating era Qantas Sales Act not the general legislation that the IASC uses when considering international rights. For political reasons, it is unlikely a federal government will change the Qantas Sales Act though Qantas have lobbied pretty hard for it to be considered.

Isn’t the current form of VA part owned by the Qld State Government? About 20% but could be wrong - maybe this also had a part in the decision making for state government subsidy for VA on the CNS-HND route?

RyanairGuru wrote:

My memory could be failing me, but isn’t the ‘Australian registered investors’ just the Queensland state government? I thought that the ownership coming out of administration was Bain had a 90% ownership stake, while Queensland put in a minor investment of 10% in return for the HQ remaining in Brisbane.

IINM, you're forgetting that SRB had requested a 10% share of VA, post Bankruptcy emergence. He was knocked back on the 10% investment and later had to settle for a 5% shareholding. On that basis, the QLD government shareholding would represent 5% (or less) or the Bain ownership would be less than 90%.

tullamarine wrote:

I don't believe JQ has the A321XLR, aren't they receiving A321LR with the XLRs planned to head to mainline? The LR could quite easily do CNS-HND if JQ wanted to though.

Government funding will have been negotiated on political grounds. CNS is home to a number of state marginal seats and the government will be keen to fly the flag that they are encouraging more international services into FNQ.

JQ does indeed have XLRs on order from 2024 I believe. My guess is they will fly similar routes and replace the 787 flying from CNS.

My 16:10 qantas flight from BNE to SYD got cancelled this afternoon after they said that my original 16:40 flight could be delayed so I changed to 16:10 and now after they cancelled 16:10 I got put back to even later 5pm flight and was given a middle seat with no other options.

Wonderful customer service

a19901213 wrote:

My 16:10 qantas flight from BNE to SYD got cancelled this afternoon after they said that my original 16:40 flight could be delayed so I changed to 16:10 and now after they cancelled 16:10 I got put back to even later 5pm flight and was given a middle seat with no other options.

Wonderful customer service

Let me put something into perspective: how would you feel if you were kicked out of a window or aisle seat on your original flight to accomodate someone else off a cancelled service? You were accommodated within 20 minutes of your original time and had to bare a middle seat for a 1 hour flight. Who cares. I actually think that's a pretty good outcome.

The vast majority of cancellations this month have been due to Sydney reducing slots due to weather-related single runway ops, or crew going sick with covid again. Be grateful you weren't stuck overnight or forced to fork out thousands of dollars for a ticket on another airline.

ben175 wrote:

a19901213 wrote:

My 16:10 qantas flight from BNE to SYD got cancelled this afternoon after they said that my original 16:40 flight could be delayed so I changed to 16:10 and now after they cancelled 16:10 I got put back to even later 5pm flight and was given a middle seat with no other options.

Wonderful customer service

Let me put something into perspective: how would you feel if you were kicked out of a window or aisle seat on your original flight to accomodate someone else off a cancelled service? You were accommodated within 20 minutes of your original time and had to bare a middle seat for a 1 hour flight. Who cares. I actually think that's a pretty good outcome.

The vast majority of cancellations this month have been due to Sydney reducing slots due to single runway operations, or crew going sick with covid again. Be grateful you weren't stuck overnight or forced to fork out thousands of dollars for a ticket on another airline.

Nah I actually don’t mind if my original flight is delayed or cancelled it is what it is but I don’t have to be grateful.

And I would never ask to kick someone out of their seat so I can have a better seat. The agent at the desk tried to find a seat for me but I just told him politely I’ll just take it.

a19901213 wrote:

ben175 wrote:

a19901213 wrote:

My 16:10 qantas flight from BNE to SYD got cancelled this afternoon after they said that my original 16:40 flight could be delayed so I changed to 16:10 and now after they cancelled 16:10 I got put back to even later 5pm flight and was given a middle seat with no other options.

Wonderful customer service

Let me put something into perspective: how would you feel if you were kicked out of a window or aisle seat on your original flight to accomodate someone else off a cancelled service? You were accommodated within 20 minutes of your original time and had to bare a middle seat for a 1 hour flight. Who cares. I actually think that's a pretty good outcome.

The vast majority of cancellations this month have been due to Sydney reducing slots due to single runway operations, or crew going sick with covid again. Be grateful you weren't stuck overnight or forced to fork out thousands of dollars for a ticket on another airline.

Nah I actually don’t mind if my original flight is delayed or cancelled it is what it is but I don’t have to be grateful.

And I would never ask to kick someone out of their seat so I can have a better seat. The agent at the desk tried to find a seat for me but I just told him politely I’ll just take it.

I mean it's not ideal but it could be worse customer service (aka having to call the call centre 4 times and counting to just get my booking ticketed..) but while not ideal and not an overall long delay, I understand your frustration, been there in similar circumference on Air NZ, main thing is you got there safely in the end

a19901213 wrote:

ben175 wrote:

a19901213 wrote:

My 16:10 qantas flight from BNE to SYD got cancelled this afternoon after they said that my original 16:40 flight could be delayed so I changed to 16:10 and now after they cancelled 16:10 I got put back to even later 5pm flight and was given a middle seat with no other options.

Wonderful customer service

Let me put something into perspective: how would you feel if you were kicked out of a window or aisle seat on your original flight to accomodate someone else off a cancelled service? You were accommodated within 20 minutes of your original time and had to bare a middle seat for a 1 hour flight. Who cares. I actually think that's a pretty good outcome.

The vast majority of cancellations this month have been due to Sydney reducing slots due to single runway operations, or crew going sick with covid again. Be grateful you weren't stuck overnight or forced to fork out thousands of dollars for a ticket on another airline.

Nah I actually don’t mind if my original flight is delayed or cancelled it is what it is but I don’t have to be grateful.

And I would never ask to kick someone out of their seat so I can have a better seat. The agent at the desk tried to find a seat for me but I just told him politely I’ll just take it.

Well then considering your circumstances, it seems like you did receive wonderful customer service after all.

Your original post really grinds my gears. The constant flack airlines are getting in the media is fueling people to get angsty over the most minuscule of issues, and resulting in huge increases of abuse towards frontline staff. I see it firsthand every day. As you said, sometimes it is what it is and your situation is one hardly to get up in arms about.

a19901213 wrote:

ben175 wrote:

a19901213 wrote:

My 16:10 qantas flight from BNE to SYD got cancelled this afternoon after they said that my original 16:40 flight could be delayed so I changed to 16:10 and now after they cancelled 16:10 I got put back to even later 5pm flight and was given a middle seat with no other options.

Wonderful customer service

Let me put something into perspective: how would you feel if you were kicked out of a window or aisle seat on your original flight to accomodate someone else off a cancelled service? You were accommodated within 20 minutes of your original time and had to bare a middle seat for a 1 hour flight. Who cares. I actually think that's a pretty good outcome.

The vast majority of cancellations this month have been due to Sydney reducing slots due to single runway operations, or crew going sick with covid again. Be grateful you weren't stuck overnight or forced to fork out thousands of dollars for a ticket on another airline.

Nah I actually don’t mind if my original flight is delayed or cancelled it is what it is but I don’t have to be grateful.

And I would never ask to kick someone out of their seat so I can have a better seat. The agent at the desk tried to find a seat for me but I just told him politely I’ll just take it.

Single runway ops on Sydney today due to wind - hardly QF fault all carriers are impacted.

I have heard QF have reduced capacity by 5% to allow a buffer of free seats to re-accommodate customers over summer due to disrupts. So I think with a 20min delay you should actually be grateful, considering route cause is wind…. What else could they have done for you?

mrkerr7474 wrote:

a19901213 wrote:

ben175 wrote:

Let me put something into perspective: how would you feel if you were kicked out of a window or aisle seat on your original flight to accomodate someone else off a cancelled service? You were accommodated within 20 minutes of your original time and had to bare a middle seat for a 1 hour flight. Who cares. I actually think that's a pretty good outcome.

The vast majority of cancellations this month have been due to Sydney reducing slots due to single runway operations, or crew going sick with covid again. Be grateful you weren't stuck overnight or forced to fork out thousands of dollars for a ticket on another airline.

Nah I actually don’t mind if my original flight is delayed or cancelled it is what it is but I don’t have to be grateful.

And I would never ask to kick someone out of their seat so I can have a better seat. The agent at the desk tried to find a seat for me but I just told him politely I’ll just take it.

I mean it's not ideal but it could be worse customer service (aka having to call the call centre 4 times and counting to just get my booking ticketed..) but while not ideal and not an overall long delay, I understand your frustration, been there in similar circumference on Air NZ, main thing is you got there safely in the end

Yes definitely. If anything I’m grateful of the professionalism shown by the staff at the desk that I even want to write in and compliment that it’s the hardworking staff like him who helps keeping business from the customers.

a19901213 wrote:

mrkerr7474 wrote:

a19901213 wrote:

Nah I actually don’t mind if my original flight is delayed or cancelled it is what it is but I don’t have to be grateful.

And I would never ask to kick someone out of their seat so I can have a better seat. The agent at the desk tried to find a seat for me but I just told him politely I’ll just take it.

I mean it's not ideal but it could be worse customer service (aka having to call the call centre 4 times and counting to just get my booking ticketed..) but while not ideal and not an overall long delay, I understand your frustration, been there in similar circumference on Air NZ, main thing is you got there safely in the end

Yes definitely. If anything I’m grateful of the professionalism shown by the staff at the desk that I even want to write in and compliment that it’s the hardworking staff like him who helps keeping business from the customers.

I think people have misinterpreted your "excellent customer service" comment as sarcastic.

I flew out of SYD Monday and T2 was organised chaos... I don't envy the ground staff having to repeat the explanation of single runway ops to a disgruntled public ad nauseum!

freshwater wrote:

a19901213 wrote:

mrkerr7474 wrote:

I mean it's not ideal but it could be worse customer service (aka having to call the call centre 4 times and counting to just get my booking ticketed..) but while not ideal and not an overall long delay, I understand your frustration, been there in similar circumference on Air NZ, main thing is you got there safely in the end

Yes definitely. If anything I’m grateful of the professionalism shown by the staff at the desk that I even want to write in and compliment that it’s the hardworking staff like him who helps keeping business from the customers.

I think people have misinterpreted your "excellent customer service" comment as sarcastic.

I flew out of SYD Monday and T2 was organised chaos... I don't envy the ground staff having to repeat the explanation of single runway ops to a disgruntled public ad nauseum!

I appreciate that you tried to speak up for me so now I feel bad that I was actually being sarcastic. (Sorry and lol)

I didn’t want to explain in details because I wasn’t in the mood but I was given an extra small bag of chocolate biscuits on board so I’m not frustrated anymore. (Not sure if this is the new cabin service standard because everyone got one)

I wasn’t frustrated by the delay, I was frustrated that I was notified my original flight would likely be delayed so I could change to earlier flight to avoid it and when they cancel my flight they won’t let me do anything on the app.

I asked my colleague for a favour so I could leave early to the airport but just when I about to leave I receive a msg from Qantas saying my flight got cancelled and I will be notified for a new flight.

So I tried to change my flight manually on QF app but all it did was letting me checking in to the cancelled flight and saying I can’t select seats unless I speak to staff in the airport.

So at that moment I didn’t even know whether my flight actually got cancelled or not and I don’t wanna risking missing the flight if it didn’t get cancelled so I just left anyway.

Until I arrived at the airport the app just won’t do anything for me and I never received any msg from Qantas regarding the new booked flight.

And when I was in the line boarding the plane I finally got the msg saying they have rebooked me to the flight I’m boarding right now.

It’s really no one’s fault in Qantas, it’s probably just a bug in their system but again I was just frustrated because I feel bad for my colleague and my family for waiting longer in the airport for me if the system was doing what it was supposed to do.

And finally just want to reiterate that I was genuine when I said the staff was being super helpful and professional at the desk as well as the cabin crew on board.

SCFlyer wrote:

Sydscott wrote:

Two thoughts:

1) What an absolute waste of a scarce Haneda slot pair. This is Virgin slot squatting with a 737MAX, pure and simple. Will they make money on it? Probably but what a waste of Australia's HND slots;

As someone in Queensland I'm happy Virgin is keeping the slot because if Qantas got their hands on it I think there's a good chance it would end up as a second daily Sydney flight given how Sydney focused their international network is at the moment.

smi0006 wrote:

a320fan wrote:

LTEN11 wrote:

That should be 7 hours of fun filled enjoyment. I hope they at least bother to feed the patrons and not force b.o.b.

Good luck to them, but I don’t really see the point. Mostly seems to be just slot squatting. QF must be happy, seems they’d hedged their bets with the split BNE/MEL schedule so will now have to make a decision on who keeps HND when they increase frequency, unless they keep the split and MEL/BNE get service to both Tokyo airports, just not daily HND.

Yeah be fascinated on the return on investment will tie up a brand new 7M8 for a a fair while - can’t see how the demand could be their for daily, at any decent yield. Seems a bit childish to slot squat, or indicates a mid term plan to return to international.

Can you define "childish" in this instance? And do you not remember slot squatted at LHR for years...

eta unknown wrote:

smi0006 wrote:

a320fan wrote:

Good luck to them, but I don’t really see the point. Mostly seems to be just slot squatting. QF must be happy, seems they’d hedged their bets with the split BNE/MEL schedule so will now have to make a decision on who keeps HND when they increase frequency, unless they keep the split and MEL/BNE get service to both Tokyo airports, just not daily HND.

Yeah be fascinated on the return on investment will tie up a brand new 7M8 for a a fair while - can’t see how the demand could be their for daily, at any decent yield. Seems a bit childish to slot squat, or indicates a mid term plan to return to international.

Can you define "childish" in this instance? And do you not remember slot squatted at LHR for years...

Childish if VA have no intention or plans to restart longhaul - and are only slot squatting to prevent QF from flying the route, and do so with unprofitable flying. VA have always been pretty good at competing on product and strategy, this is the sort of move ZL would make to ruin QFs day. If they do truly feel they can get a good return on investment running CNS-HND well good luck to them.

If VA do one day have reasonably solid plans to fly longhaul again, then yes this is a reasonable albeit risky way to hold on to the slot. I’m just not confident their plans are solid. But agree HND slots are like gold. Tricky part with slot constrained airports never being open to new market entrants.

LHR I would describe as different slightly (I could be wrong) but I believe it’s the only airport in the world where you buy the slots - so QF (I assume you are referring to) paid millions to purchase those slots, so whilst slot squatting they were the owners of them. However I would agree if QF were to slot squat - for the simple reason to prevent VA entering a market as opposed to running a profitable service I’d describe that as childish uncompetitive behaviour- and I’m sure they have done it in the past, or are doing it now somewhere! Lol

eta unknown wrote:

smi0006 wrote:

a320fan wrote:

Good luck to them, but I don’t really see the point. Mostly seems to be just slot squatting. QF must be happy, seems they’d hedged their bets with the split BNE/MEL schedule so will now have to make a decision on who keeps HND when they increase frequency, unless they keep the split and MEL/BNE get service to both Tokyo airports, just not daily HND.

Yeah be fascinated on the return on investment will tie up a brand new 7M8 for a a fair while - can’t see how the demand could be their for daily, at any decent yield. Seems a bit childish to slot squat, or indicates a mid term plan to return to international.

Can you define "childish" in this instance? And do you not remember slot squatted at LHR for years...

Childish if VA have no intention or plans to restart longhaul - and are only slot squatting to prevent QF from flying the route, and do so with unprofitable flying. VA have always been pretty good at competing on product and strategy, this is the sort of move ZL would make to ruin QFs day. If they do truly feel they can get a good return on investment running CNS-HND well good luck to them.

If VA do one day have reasonably solid plans to fly longhaul again, then yes this is a reasonable albeit risky way to hold on to the slot. I’m just not confident their plans are solid. But agree HND slots are like gold. Tricky part with slot constrained airports never being open to new market entrants.

LHR I would describe as different slightly (I could be wrong) but I believe it’s the only airport in the world where you buy the slots - so QF (I assume you are referring to) paid millions to purchase those slots, so whilst slot squatting they were the owners of them. However I would agree if QF were to slot squat - for the simple reason to prevent VA entering a market as opposed to running a profitable service I’d describe that as childish uncompetitive behaviour- and I’m sure they have done it in the past, or are doing it now somewhere! Lol

smi0006 wrote:

If VA do one day have reasonably solid plans to fly longhaul again, then yes this is a reasonable albeit risky way to hold on to the slot. I’m just not confident their plans are solid. But agree HND slots are like gold. Tricky part with slot constrained airports never being open to new market entrants.

LHR I would describe as different slightly (I could be wrong) but I believe it’s the only airport in the world where you buy the slots - so QF (I assume you are referring to) paid millions to purchase those slots, so whilst slot squatting they were the owners of them. However I would agree if QF were to slot squat - for the simple reason to prevent VA entering a market as opposed to running a profitable service I’d describe that as childish uncompetitive behaviour- and I’m sure they have done it in the past, or are doing it now somewhere! Lol

Nope. Qantas paid absolutely nothing for its LHR slots. They were given to them when it was the nationalised flag carrier. It was the same for NZ and most other Commonwealth nations.

tullamarine wrote:

Nope. Qantas paid absolutely nothing for its LHR slots. They were given to them when it was the nationalised flag carrier. It was the same for NZ and most other Commonwealth nations.

I seem to recall that QF acquired a pair of slots at LHR in January 2004 for somewhere in the region of UK 20 million pounds STG, Reported in The Australian:

-------------------------------------------------------
"Wed "The Australian"

Qantas gets its coin into London slot
By Clive Mathieson and Steve Creedy
January 21, 2004

QANTAS last night sealed the acquisition of two prized landing slots into London's Heathrow Airport in a deal worth about £20 million ($47 million) that will give the airline the opportunity to increase flights to the UK. (snip)

A Qantas spokesman said the airline was "very pleased" to have managed to secure extra slots at the world's busiest airport, which were rarely made available and highly prized by airlines around the world.

He said the slots, bought from European airline FlyBe, were also for landings and take-offs at "premium" times. "These will certainly give us the opportunity to increase services into Heathrow," he said."

kimshep wrote:

tullamarine wrote:

Nope. Qantas paid absolutely nothing for its LHR slots. They were given to them when it was the nationalised flag carrier. It was the same for NZ and most other Commonwealth nations.

I seem to recall that QF acquired a pair of slots at LHR in January 2004 for somewhere in the region of UK 20 million pounds STG, Reported in The Australian:

-------------------------------------------------------
"Wed "The Australian"

Qantas gets its coin into London slot
By Clive Mathieson and Steve Creedy
January 21, 2004

QANTAS last night sealed the acquisition of two prized landing slots into London's Heathrow Airport in a deal worth about £20 million ($47 million) that will give the airline the opportunity to increase flights to the UK. (snip)

A Qantas spokesman said the airline was "very pleased" to have managed to secure extra slots at the world's busiest airport, which were rarely made available and highly prized by airlines around the world.

He said the slots, bought from European airline FlyBe, were also for landings and take-offs at "premium" times. "These will certainly give us the opportunity to increase services into Heathrow," he said."

...and the other two were free.

Some major delays over in PER last night, yesterday evenings QF72 ex SIN hasn't left yet, currently showing as a 0720 departure and being operated by a A333 which is slightly unusual.

Normally the aircraft which operates this flight is a domestic A332 and operates a return PER-SIN-PER routing, -EBC operated QF71 up which was delayed by several hours, however it never returned so guessing it's still up in SIN. Interestingly prior to operating QF71 -EBC operated a QF7xxx freight flight across from MEL, which is also what -EBK has also done this morning which is something I haven't seen in a while.

QF744ER wrote:

Some major delays over in PER last night, yesterday evenings QF72 ex SIN hasn't left yet, currently showing as a 0720 departure and being operated by a A333 which is slightly unusual.

Normally the aircraft which operates this flight is a domestic A332 and operates a return PER-SIN-PER routing, -EBC operated QF71 up which was delayed by several hours, however it never returned so guessing it's still up in SIN. Interestingly prior to operating QF71 -EBC operated a QF7xxx freight flight across from MEL, which is also what -EBK has also done this morning which is something I haven't seen in a while.

Maybe one of the A321 freighters is out of action.

tullamarine wrote:

kimshep wrote:

tullamarine wrote:

Nope. Qantas paid absolutely nothing for its LHR slots. They were given to them when it was the nationalised flag carrier. It was the same for NZ and most other Commonwealth nations.

I seem to recall that QF acquired a pair of slots at LHR in January 2004 for somewhere in the region of UK 20 million pounds STG, Reported in The Australian:

-------------------------------------------------------
"Wed "The Australian"

Qantas gets its coin into London slot
By Clive Mathieson and Steve Creedy
January 21, 2004

QANTAS last night sealed the acquisition of two prized landing slots into London's Heathrow Airport in a deal worth about £20 million ($47 million) that will give the airline the opportunity to increase flights to the UK. (snip)

A Qantas spokesman said the airline was "very pleased" to have managed to secure extra slots at the world's busiest airport, which were rarely made available and highly prized by airlines around the world.

He said the slots, bought from European airline FlyBe, were also for landings and take-offs at "premium" times. "These will certainly give us the opportunity to increase services into Heathrow," he said."

...and the other two were free.

Which they had been using for decades, long before Heathrow became slot restricted and before airlines could trade what slots they had.

Just looked through this on a whim; https://flightaware.com/live/flight/QFA11

IS Qf11 ever going to return to operating daily...?
I know Qf17 operates on Thursdays instead, but it's that evening departure.

I'm guessing this is an aircraft availability issue?

Just seen a email form JQ saying they are starting BNE-AKL from the end of March.

Great to get some more capacity into that route pair, flight have been supperful between AKL & BNE.

QF744ER wrote:

Some major delays over in PER last night, yesterday evenings QF72 ex SIN hasn't left yet, currently showing as a 0720 departure and being operated by a A333 which is slightly unusual.

Normally the aircraft which operates this flight is a domestic A332 and operates a return PER-SIN-PER routing, -EBC operated QF71 up which was delayed by several hours, however it never returned so guessing it's still up in SIN. Interestingly prior to operating QF71 -EBC operated a QF7xxx freight flight across from MEL, which is also what -EBK has also done this morning which is something I haven't seen in a while.

I would say the delay on QF72 is related to crew. From what I saw on FR24 yesterday the flight from PER left later than planned, initially it was still delayed and as the crew on this flight normally do PER-SIN-PER they probably exceeded their limits, hence why the return was delayed by 13 hours.

Qantas has had an A330 overnight in SIN on a daily basis for a while now. I wonder if this is part of their contingency plans that they have put in place over the peak season, though it does seem like a waste of an aircraft which is sitting there for 24 hours when I am sure it could be put to good use on domestic runs

Qantas has been running additional freight runs this week. It started with the Atlas (Qantas) 744 at the start of the week and since then there have been A330's doing freight runs which are also planned for next week as well. Yesterday alone there were 2 A330 freight flights from SYD and 1 from MEL. These extra flights are due to the extra freight (parcels) at this time of the year of which the current freighter fleet is struggling to keep up with and also there was a recent derailment on the east/west train line which has contributed to the delay of things arriving in PER that typically come by rail

There was also a 13hr delay on last night's QF9 PER-LHR, not sure why this was but would expect it was related to crewing or to Tuesday's delay QF1 service which was delayed just over 24 hours and is a couple of hours behind yesterday's QF1

There have been a couple of lengthy delays on PER-JNB as well over the past couple of weeks as well, due to A330's arriving later on domestic runs

Qantas to increase domestic flying from late March next year

Additional 57 return flights on Golden Triangle between MEL, SYD and BNE
Increase on A330 flying between PER and SYD/MEL, approximately 50% of all services will be flown by widebody aircraft

Overall this increase in flying is expected to lift QF's domestic capacity to 104% compared to pre-Covid for the June quarter

https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media ... nts-offer/

jrfspa320 wrote:

qf789 wrote:

Qantas to increase domestic flying from late March next year

Additional 57 return flights on Golden Triangle between MEL, SYD and BNE
Increase on A330 flying between PER and SYD/MEL, approximately 50% of all services will be flown by widebody aircraft

Overall this increase in flying is expected to lift QF's domestic capacity to 104% compared to pre-Covid for the June quarter

https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media ... nts-offer/

Are there still A330s stored which can add capacity back? Otherwise I dont understand where they are coming from.

I wonder if they have pushed back their P2F conversation?

I note they are exploring other options - wonder what this means? Could they do a domestic wet-lease, or more E190 flying to free up 737s? I did see some idle 717s the other day, could they be added into the triangle for some incitement flying when not maxed out? International is pretty tight as is, wouldn’t want to pull capacity from there. Slots will always be the issue on the triangle, they need those 321s asap!

jrfspa320 wrote:

JJWess wrote:

Just looked through this on a whim; https://flightaware.com/live/flight/QFA11

IS Qf11 ever going to return to operating daily...?
I know Qf17 operates on Thursdays instead, but it's that evening departure.

I'm guessing this is an aircraft availability issue?

QF11 will as soon as more A380s come back online. MEL-LAX is still only 5 weekly on the 789. Huge reduction from the daily A380. UA seems to have really stepped up capacity in QFs place.

I know more A380's are set to come back + QF did order the A350... but what are the chances they order more 787's in the near future?

jrfspa320 wrote:

qf789 wrote:

Qantas to increase domestic flying from late March next year

Additional 57 return flights on Golden Triangle between MEL, SYD and BNE
Increase on A330 flying between PER and SYD/MEL, approximately 50% of all services will be flown by widebody aircraft

Overall this increase in flying is expected to lift QF's domestic capacity to 104% compared to pre-Covid for the June quarter

https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media ... nts-offer/

Are there still A330s stored which can add capacity back? Otherwise I dont understand where they are coming from.

There are still 2 Cityflyer A332s not reactivated (EBB and EBD) and there is one A333 (QPG) that has been inactive since April for whatever reason. Neither of the A332s listed are earmarked for freighter conversion. I think those are EBE and EBF.

jrfspa320 wrote:

qf789 wrote:

Qantas to increase domestic flying from late March next year

Additional 57 return flights on Golden Triangle between MEL, SYD and BNE
Increase on A330 flying between PER and SYD/MEL, approximately 50% of all services will be flown by widebody aircraft

Overall this increase in flying is expected to lift QF's domestic capacity to 104% compared to pre-Covid for the June quarter

https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media ... nts-offer/

Are there still A330s stored which can add capacity back? Otherwise I dont understand where they are coming from.

Yes A332's EBB and EBD are still in storage and A333 QPG hasnt flown since April

Regarding transcon flying QF increased A330 flying at the end of October and its around about 50% at the moment. Looking at today's schedule there are 6 flights from both SYD and MEL to PER, SYD is 2 A330's and 4 737's while MEL in 5 A330's and 1 737, combined that there are 7 A330 flights and 5 737's, so you have you 50% there. I would say initially they were going to cut back the A330 flying going into NS23 but that its going to continue now. On top of the passenger services today there are 2 A330 freight runs from both SYD and MEL to PER

JJWess wrote:

jrfspa320 wrote:

JJWess wrote:

Just looked through this on a whim; https://flightaware.com/live/flight/QFA11

IS Qf11 ever going to return to operating daily...?
I know Qf17 operates on Thursdays instead, but it's that evening departure.

I'm guessing this is an aircraft availability issue?

QF11 will as soon as more A380s come back online. MEL-LAX is still only 5 weekly on the 789. Huge reduction from the daily A380. UA seems to have really stepped up capacity in QFs place.

I know more A380's are set to come back + QF did order the A350... but what are the chances they order more 787's in the near future?

Its possible more 787's could be ordered, I think most agree here that a few more would be good for the LH Fleet. Qantas is also expected to announce a replacement for the A330 sometime next year

https://www.reuters.com/business/aerosp ... 022-08-25/

I do wonder now that the 787 production will eventually return back to 10 a month and the 787-10 will have its MTOW increased to 570,000 pounds that this may of be an interest to QF for A333 replacements along with some 789's. On the otherhand they could order A359's though I think they may be too big for some of the routes the A332 flies

https://twitter.com/ByERussell/status/1 ... ZvdlkO3PUQ

jrfspa320 wrote:

Thanks, makes sense. EBB & D are domestic config so nice to see more A330s back on transcon, they are much nicer to fly.
No talk of A330 on the BNE-PER route, which isnt surprising as precovid it was only occasional, maybe 1 daily which is a shame for the longest capital route but id imagine less demand for business class compared to SYD/MEL.

Pre-Covid PER-BNE was daily most days doing the redeye to BNE then doing a trans tasman run then doing the late evening BNE-PER run.

Currently QF are running an A330 on PER-BNE(oneway) on a Sunday, used as a positioning flight for the aircraft that is used for JNB

Considering the announcement of CNS-HND with VA… I do wonder if Cairns has any potential further expansion into Asia?
I know China is probably off the cards for a while… but what about Seoul or Taipei..?
Perhaps even HKG if that ever returns to its former glory?

Only suggesting this because Cairns is a notable tourism destination + most of these cities can be reached with next Gen NB’s like the A320Neo or 737Max

qf789 wrote:

On the otherhand they could order A359's though I think they may be too big for some of the routes the A332 flies

https://twitter.com/ByERussell/status/1 ... ZvdlkO3PUQ

Has QF ever expressed any interest in the A338 as direct replacements?

qf789 wrote:

JJWess wrote:

jrfspa320 wrote:

QF11 will as soon as more A380s come back online. MEL-LAX is still only 5 weekly on the 789. Huge reduction from the daily A380. UA seems to have really stepped up capacity in QFs place.

I know more A380's are set to come back + QF did order the A350... but what are the chances they order more 787's in the near future?

Its possible more 787's could be ordered, I think most agree here that a few more would be good for the LH Fleet. Qantas is also expected to announce a replacement for the A330 sometime next year

https://www.reuters.com/business/aerosp ... 022-08-25/

I do wonder now that the 787 production will eventually return back to 10 a month and the 787-10 will have its MTOW increased to 570,000 pounds that this may of be an interest to QF for A333 replacements along with some 789's. On the otherhand they could order A359's though I think they may be too big for some of the routes the A332 flies

https://twitter.com/ByERussell/status/1 ... ZvdlkO3PUQ

Yes, it will either be 789/Js or A359s as replacements for the medium haul fleet. It could be possible that new A359s take over the long-haul flying for which they are optimised whilst the existing 789 fleet replaces the A333s on medium haul into Asia as well as limited long-haul such as BNE-LAX. The A332s are capable but not directly replaceable unless QF went with more 788s which is very unlikely. It is more likely that the A321XLRs will take over Asian routes where the A333 or 789 are judged too big.

Such a scenario as outlined above could result in a very efficient fleet of just 4 types by around 2030. The 359/K could do ULH and LH, 789s doing medium haul and limited LH, 321XLRs doing regional and domestic with the A220s doing the remainder of mainline domestic and limited short-haul regional such as trans-Tasman.

JJWess wrote:

Considering the announcement of CNS-HND with VA… I do wonder if Cairns has any potential further expansion into Asia?
I know China is probably off the cards for a while… but what about Seoul or Taipei..?
Perhaps even HKG if that ever returns to its former glory?

Only suggesting this because Cairns is a notable tourism destination + most of these cities can be reached with next Gen NB’s like the A320Neo or 737Max

the amount of traffic on CNS-HKG I believe was thinning approaching Covid, that was on A330s, although if they have the right aircraft type, Hong Kong Express might be a good fit.

qf789 wrote:

jrfspa320 wrote:

qf789 wrote:

Qantas to increase domestic flying from late March next year

Additional 57 return flights on Golden Triangle between MEL, SYD and BNE
Increase on A330 flying between PER and SYD/MEL, approximately 50% of all services will be flown by widebody aircraft

Overall this increase in flying is expected to lift QF's domestic capacity to 104% compared to pre-Covid for the June quarter

https://www.qantasnewsroom.com.au/media ... nts-offer/

Are there still A330s stored which can add capacity back? Otherwise I dont understand where they are coming from.

Yes A332's EBB and EBD are still in storage and A333 QPG hasnt flown since April

Regarding transcon flying QF increased A330 flying at the end of October and its around about 50% at the moment. Looking at today's schedule there are 6 flights from both SYD and MEL to PER, SYD is 2 A330's and 4 737's while MEL in 5 A330's and 1 737, combined that there are 7 A330 flights and 5 737's, so you have you 50% there. I would say initially they were going to cut back the A330 flying going into NS23 but that its going to continue now. On top of the passenger services today there are 2 A330 freight runs from both SYD and MEL to PER

Technically QF haven't replaced -EBF which has gone off for P2F conversion, so they are -1 A330. Read somewhere that -QPG was awaiting a new rudder.