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PatrickZ80
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CDG to be temporarily renamed

Thu Dec 01, 2022 9:53 pm

Source: https://www.luchtvaartnieuws.nl/nieuws/ ... -de-gaulle (in Dutch)

Starting this Saturday Paris Charles de Gaulle airport will be renamed into Anne de Gaulle airport for one week.

Google translation of the article:

Paris - The largest airport in Paris will go through life for a week as Anne de Gaulle Airport from Saturday. The airport does this within the framework of the World Handicapped Day, which takes place every year on December 3. The daughter of the former President Charles de Gaulle, after whom the airport is named, suffered from Down's syndrome.

During next week, various signage panels and other signs will bear the name Anne de Gaulle on and around the airport. In addition, Air France will broadcast on certain flights that the passengers have landed at Anne de Gaulle airport.

Augustin de Romanet, CEO of Aéroports de Paris (ADP), the airport group that includes Charles de Gaulle, also sees the action as a way to increase the level of care for people with disabilities at the airport. Taking good care of people with a physical or mental illness is not always optimal, Romanet told news medium France 3.

Some airlines do not report in time that there are people on board, who need assistance, according to Romanet.


A great way to draw attention to this problem I think.
 
rta
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Fri Dec 02, 2022 2:03 am

I appreciate the intent behind this - and though I don't have any strong feelings one way or the other - I just wonder if this might be confusing for people.
 
N415XJ
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Fri Dec 02, 2022 2:48 am

rta wrote:
I appreciate the intent behind this - and though I don't have any strong feelings one way or the other - I just wonder if this might be confusing for people.


I don't think it'll be anything more than mildly confusing for a minor number of people. It's not like the IATA code on bag tags will be changed from CDG to ADG, or they'll change the road signs going to the airport, or change aeronautical charts. The most 'confusion' I'd expect is some thinking 'wait, isn't the airport named Charles de Gaulle' or 'who is Anne de Gaulle?'- and that is among the small percentage of people who will be paying attention in the first place.

At best this is a good way to raise awareness of CDG's daughter, and the sweet and slightly sad story of her life and relationship with her father. From wikipedia:

De Gaulle's relatives all testified that the General, who was normally undemonstrative and stoic in his affections for his family, was more open and extroverted with Anne. De Gaulle would entertain her with songs, dances, and pantomimes [...] She could only say one word clearly: "Papa". Upon her death, her father said: "Now, she is like the others." ("Maintenant, elle est comme les autres.")[...]
On 22 August 1962, Charles de Gaulle was the victim of an attempted assassination at Petit-Clamart. He later said that the potentially fatal bullet had been stopped by the frame of the photograph of Anne that he always carried with him; placed this particular day on the rear shelf of his car.


The only "problem" I have with it is that it seems performative and superficial despite what I'm sure are good intentions: a disabled person's name being trotted out for a week and then everything is back to normal with nothing having changed, other than ADP having a new paragraph to put in its quarterly reports about how socially conscious they are. I'm not sure how the CEO thinks a week long name change could in any way change the level of care disabled people receive at the airport. Maybe a more fitting tribute to her memory could be some sort of foundation or scholarship to support people with Down's Syndrome learning about aviation or getting careers in the industry, or maybe some sort of permanent name change to one of the terminals. Or, thinking of direct change to access- instituting (or increasing) fines to airlines who fail to give sufficient notification to the airport about services being needed for disabled passengers, which the CEO complained about.
 
loofaman
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Fri Dec 02, 2022 10:27 am

This is the sort of tokenistic virtue-signalling nonsense that is very popular with businesses and organisations (see the current World Cup) but achieves nothing for those it claims to help. Why not put in place a proper system to assist disabled travellers at the airport, plus adequate training for staff in different peoples needs, and name the programme after the lady concerned? That would help solve the problem, but would also require money and long term commitment rather than a seven day gesture.
 
planecane
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Fri Dec 02, 2022 10:48 am

loofaman wrote:
This is the sort of tokenistic virtue-signalling nonsense that is very popular with businesses and organisations (see the current World Cup) but achieves nothing for those it claims to help. Why not put in place a proper system to assist disabled travellers at the airport, plus adequate training for staff in different peoples needs, and name the programme after the lady concerned? That would help solve the problem, but would also require money and long term commitment rather than a seven day gesture.


100%. If those in charge were truly interested in helping handicapped people they would DO THINGS, not SAY THINGS. Talk is cheap.

If I wish to support a charity or cause I will donate money to it. I don't just make a post about it on social media or something similar.
 
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Rajahdhani
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Fri Dec 02, 2022 11:09 am

loofaman wrote:
This is the sort of tokenistic virtue-signalling nonsense that is very popular with businesses and organisations (see the current World Cup) but achieves nothing for those it claims to help.


I cannot fully support your argument, though I do see your perspective. I always have to wonder, in your professional capacity, how are you and your organization, doing a better job? I ask, because the community could use as many allies as possible, and here's a forum where we can discuss moving forward progressively. While returning to the topic - how often do you travel through CGD, and when was the last time?

loofaman wrote:
Why not put in place a proper system to assist disabled travellers at the airport....


https://easycdg.com/passenger-information/reduced-mobility/

H/T google. It's a pretty great site. It addresses many of your concerns, and was honestly well written enough that I enjoyed it to explain my next trio of trips through.

loofaman wrote:
... plus adequate training for staff in different peoples needs,


https://img.static-af.com/m/374e8d5c8f02a1de/original/Guide-PMR-Service-EN.pdf
https://wwws.airfrance.us/information/passagers/acheter-billet-avion-pmr-autres-handicaps#tab

Well, CDG's largest tenant (and more importantly, a continuation of said service into flight, and departure has a whole PDF/website, and in multiple languages...) I mean, actually better put together than many of the materials that I have used at major U.S. corporations. Updated as of June 2022 (the Summer Season) and in order to be this organized, they certainly have put the resources in place, in order to accomplish this.

loofaman wrote:
... and name the programme after the lady concerned?


Which is what they are doing, for a week, and then not 'virtue signaling' by naming it after a famous person (and garner further publicité) but rather complying with state and (inter)national laws as these programs are intended to assist and guide the passenger, more than just during that week, and well past the reach of CDG (as CDG is only their point of departure).

loofaman wrote:
That would help solve the problem, but would also require money and long term commitment rather than a seven day gesture.


I get what you are saying, however the facts here prove that you are actually correct in that major organizations have paid monies (and trained their staffs, and continue to fund these programs), and been in long term commitments (...and went further, in the case of AF - Saphir has been ongoing for a while...), and that also compliments then 'seven day gesture'. I do however believe that after learning of Anne, I'll be changed forever, so in seven days, they're going to make immeasurable change. I get being cynical, and especially so, in regard to those that need our assistance, however - (and I'll stay away from the shoes/steps analogies) consider the perspective of those that do not have that platform, or that do not normally have the exposure. It's a poignant moment to stop, think and reflect - and the name change, is likely to make a larger impact with those normally unaffected by these issues. At this point the impact may well be immeasurable, however it is necessary, and far too unique in this space. Support, build on it, and we can move towards better in future. I don't think that you're incorrect, and/or the you're not likely to be right into the future - however there are people (like you) that are intelligent enough, to keep them honest. Come to CDG, and do just that - I think that you're likely right (could be extended for a longer period of time, or onto another project, or perhaps a terminal/service et al) however, far too many are afraid and unwilling to move forward for fear of doing the wrong thing, even though they don't know what that is. Speak up, and guide that change into the future, and you'll find a very grateful crowd of allies behind you.
 
Heinkel
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Fri Dec 02, 2022 11:18 am

I think, naming airports after people in general is not a good idea. Does anybody use these given names, when they talk about the airport?

An airport should be named after the town ot the locatioon. Frankrut airport, Berlin airport, Han(n)over airport.

Nobody I know uses any given name of these airports.

A renaming of an airport for a week or so makes even less sense. Who will notice that????

Do they switch any signs and markings? Just a PR stunt.
 
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PHBVF
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Fri Dec 02, 2022 12:34 pm

Heinkel wrote:
I think, naming airports after people in general is not a good idea. Does anybody use these given names, when they talk about the airport?

An airport should be named after the town ot the locatioon. Frankrut airport, Berlin airport, Han(n)over airport.

Nobody I know uses any given name of these airports.

A renaming of an airport for a week or so makes even less sense. Who will notice that????

Do they switch any signs and markings? Just a PR stunt.


It can help distinguish what airport is meant if a city has multiple airports.
i.e. you wouldn't want the taxi to drop you off at Paris CDG if your flight departs from Paris ORY....
 
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scbriml
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Fri Dec 02, 2022 12:50 pm

Heinkel wrote:
I think, naming airports after people in general is not a good idea. Does anybody use these given names, when they talk about the airport?

An airport should be named after the town ot the locatioon. Frankrut airport, Berlin airport, Han(n)over airport.


That's all well and good if said city only has one single airport. If I get into a taxi in central London and ask to be taken to "London airport", where's the driver taking me - Heathrow, Gatwick, City, Stansted, Luton, or Southend?
 
venemaje
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Fri Dec 02, 2022 3:28 pm

Heinkel wrote:
I think, naming airports after people in general is not a good idea. Does anybody use these given names, when they talk about the airport?

An airport should be named after the town ot the locatioon. Frankrut airport, Berlin airport, Han(n)over airport.

Nobody I know uses any given name of these airports.

A renaming of an airport for a week or so makes even less sense. Who will notice that????

Do they switch any signs and markings? Just a PR stunt.



I don't agree; I think a nice legacy to people that deserve celebration or awareness, or who are otherwise part of the national legacy or identity. It is also a nice token to international visitors who just may look at who that person was. The best I can think of quickly, just as examples, are Warsaw's Frederic Chopin, New York's JFK, and Lahore's Allama Iqbal. I also wished they'd name Amsterdam after Anne Frank and an airport in South Africa after Nelson Mandela.
 
gzm
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Fri Dec 02, 2022 4:27 pm

N415XJ wrote:
I don't think it'll be anything more than a disabled person's name being trotted out for a week and then everything is back to normal with nothing having changed, other than ADP having a new paragraph to put in its quarterly reports about how socially conscious they are. Maybe a more fitting tribute to her memory could be some sort of permanent name change to one of the terminals.

You and other readers have said everything in your posts. However, I would also like to add my own comment, having worked in both Athens airports, the old and the new one. You are right when you say it is only a matter of glittering public relations and the image airport managers like to present as if their airport were an institution or a cultural thing to be proud of. It is not. You have seen on YouTube what kind of people take the plane instead of staying home. They wouldn’t care less. The best I can suggest, is to have the VIP lounge named after her permanently. In the new airport, Olympic airlines VIP lounge was named after Melina Mercouri, you know, the lady who tried -unsuccessfully- to get some Parthenon marbles back to the homeland. Such gestures are in vain.
 
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kjeld0d
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Fri Dec 02, 2022 11:01 pm

For a week next month it will be Charles Nelson Reilly International.
 
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BoeingVista
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Sat Dec 03, 2022 9:55 am

loofaman wrote:
This is the sort of tokenistic virtue-signalling nonsense that is very popular with businesses and organisations (see the current World Cup) but achieves nothing for those it claims to help. Why not put in place a proper system to assist disabled travellers at the airport, plus adequate training for staff in different peoples needs, and name the programme after the lady concerned? That would help solve the problem, but would also require money and long term commitment rather than a seven day gesture.


Oh, I'm sorry you know that CDG has not put into place a proper system for helping disabled travellers? You didn't even bother trying to google what they were doing before you fired off your hot take.

Also how is your post not virtue-signalling? Just to the other side of the aisle.
 
DIJKKIJK
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Sat Dec 03, 2022 10:44 am

They should do more practical things like appointing more immigration officers or at least, keeping the automatic passport control for EU nationals operational, instead of these pointless name changes. I flew through it yesterday and it was complete chaos with many people missing flights.
 
AtomicGarden
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Sat Dec 03, 2022 12:43 pm

It's just the mkt department, bear with them!

I thought it was about some feminist, woke nonsense. I am glad it's about disability awareness, no matter how silly or insufficient some people think it is. vI have several coworkers with family with DS and it's heartwarming the love and devotion they have for them. Harmless, but still better than nothing.
 
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nbc7
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Sat Dec 03, 2022 2:01 pm

loofaman wrote:
This is the sort of tokenistic virtue-signalling nonsense that is very popular with businesses and organisations (see the current World Cup) but achieves nothing for those it claims to help. Why not put in place a proper system to assist disabled travellers at the airport, plus adequate training for staff in different peoples needs, and name the programme after the lady concerned? That would help solve the problem, but would also require money and long term commitment rather than a seven day gesture.

Very well said.

Heinkel wrote:
I think, naming airports after people in general is not a good idea. Does anybody use these given names, when they talk about the airport?

An airport should be named after the town ot the locatioon. Frankrut airport, Berlin airport, Han(n)over airport.

Nobody I know uses any given name of these airports.

A renaming of an airport for a week or so makes even less sense. Who will notice that????

Do they switch any signs and markings? Just a PR stunt.

Hmmm it can go both ways, but I generally find that people use the official names. Especially in cases of multiple airports in one place like people have said, but even otherwise. However, I live in Paris and almost everyone here refers to the airport as "Roissy" since that's where it is, rather than "Charles de Gaulle" which is kind of long and clunky. But I formerly lived in Connecticut and people would talk about "Bradley airport" for example rather than Hartford. I definitely agree that the weeklong name change is just a pr stunt, and probably quite a costly and wasteful one.
 
Heinkel
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Sat Dec 03, 2022 3:34 pm

scbriml wrote:
Heinkel wrote:
I think, naming airports after people in general is not a good idea. Does anybody use these given names, when they talk about the airport?

An airport should be named after the town ot the locatioon. Frankrut airport, Berlin airport, Han(n)over airport.


That's all well and good if said city only has one single airport. If I get into a taxi in central London and ask to be taken to "London airport", where's the driver taking me - Heathrow, Gatwick, City, Stansted, Luton, or Southend?


You are absolutely right, it is essential to go to the correct airport, if a big city has more than one. But aren't Heathrow, Gatwick, Stansted, Luton and Southend just the names of the villages / counties, where these airports are located? That's what I ment, the name of the airport should be the name of the town/region, not a person.

Many big cities have more than one railway station. I've never heard, that a railway station was named after a politician (or any other person).

I've googled for the officicial names of the airports around London, you've mentioned:

- Heathrow Airport or London Heathrow (Until 1966: London airport) (LHR)
- London Stanstead Airport (STN)
- Gatwick airport, also known as London Gatwick (LGW)
- London Luton Airport (LTN)
- London Southend Airport (SEN)

So none of these airports in and around London is named after a person.

So naming airports after persons must be an American thing, which later came to Europe.

The infamous BER airport is officially called "Berlin Brandenburg Airport Willy Brandt". I've never heard anyone using the "Willy Brandt" part of the name, when they mention going to BER.

In Berlin we've had Tempelhof and Tegel. Now we have Willy Brandt...
 
JibberJim
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Sat Dec 03, 2022 9:43 pm

Heinkel wrote:
Many big cities have more than one railway station. I've never heard, that a railway station was named after a politician (or any other person).


London Victoria is named after Victoria - well possibly named after a street that was named after her. Manchester Victoria exists too, and I guess St Pancras is sort of named after a person, although the area was probably named first?

I think the difference with airports is that they're new - was naming your train station after Queen Victoria really that different from naming your airport after De Gaulle?

I think lots of Irish train stations are named after Irish rebublicans too, maybe 'cos the stations had British names before?
 
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Rajahdhani
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Sun Dec 04, 2022 2:02 am

I think that this is the majestical mystery of modern English. Though 'new', it hides ancient roots. Think about it, though - aren't these names only barely hiding their origins?

Heinkel wrote:
I've googled for the officicial names of the airports around London, you've mentioned:


Did you mean "official"? Just want to be sure that it's not brilliantly sarcastic.

Heinkel wrote:
- Heathrow Airport or London Heathrow (Until 1966: London airport) (LHR)


...named as a geographical feature "Heath Row" between/of Hounslow Heath (named after a Hound, or a famous person), and Harmondsworth (hailing from Heremod's enclosure).

More importantly - to diminish the presence of Queen Elizabeth and LHR, is hard to do
In 1955, The Queen opened the Terminal At LHR (and, admittedly, the concept of how future airports would be conceptualized and function...).
...and in 2014, Terminal Two was officially renamed after her, and remains so today (and will likely do so for the foreseeable future/permenantly).
...and that's past the opening of the Elizabeth line to get there.

Heinkel wrote:
- London Stanstead Airport (STN)


A 'stony field'...named due to association with Stansted Mountfitchet, named after/by Robert Gernon de Montfichet.

Heinkel wrote:
- Gatwick airport, also known as London Gatwick (LGW)


https://www.sussexlive.co.uk/news/sussex-news/incredible-history-gatwick-airport-aristocratic-4980334
In 1241 John de Gatewyk purchased four acres of meadow land and 18 acres of arable farm land.
On this land he built a property called The Sub Manor of Gatwick where it stayed with his family and heirs for more than 450 years.
In 1696 the manor was sold to William Jordan who built the grand and luxurious Gatwick Manor House to the east of Povey Cross, near the North Terminal.
The house was still standing until 1950 when it was demolished. Though, the site of the manor house was undeveloped for many years but eventually was swallowed up under a flood mitigation pond and buildings at the edge of the North Terminal.



Heinkel wrote:
- London Luton Airport (LTN)


...named after the River Lea (which is named after the God Lugus). How many have named themselves, in the name of God?


Heinkel wrote:
- London Southend Airport (SEN)


It's the South End-on-the Sea, in Essex (named after the "Eastern Saxons"), and/or a village at the South End (on the Sea) of Prittlewell Priory.

Heinkel wrote:
The infamous BER airport is officially called "Berlin Brandenburg Airport Willy Brandt". I've never heard anyone using the "Willy Brandt" part of the name, when they mention going to BER.
In Berlin we've had Tempelhof and Tegel. Now we have Willy Brandt...


Brandenburg as in electors thereof (and the lineage hailing from the line of Hohenzollern).
Tempelhof (referring to the Knight's Templar).

...and fun fact, (Es tut mir leid, aber ich komme nicht aus Berlin...) the JFK-Platz (in Tempelhof/Schöneberg) was actually named after JFK (in November 1963),
...before the U.S. was able to rename the Idlewild Field (in December).
So, technically - the most famous example of airports and 'naming of a famous people', and the Europeans beat us to that punch.

So, I get that the names might not be as easily apparent (and I get then why it might be easy to not as easily see it). A historical perspective, though would help in better understanding how/where you are technically correct (in some cases) and I hope that the historical perspective helps. I get your point though, in the vast majority not using current 'celebrities' or famous people - has an allure, and perhaps a majesty in that those names, and more importantly their legacies (and/or peoples) have survived the fates of time (in ways that modernity may not afford current celebrities/peoples).
 
rove312
Posts: 32
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Sun Dec 04, 2022 3:11 am

Heinkel wrote:
I think, naming airports after people in general is not a good idea. Does anybody use these given names, when they talk about the airport?

An airport should be named after the town ot the locatioon. Frankrut airport, Berlin airport, Han(n)over airport.

Nobody I know uses any given name of these airports.

A renaming of an airport for a week or so makes even less sense. Who will notice that????

Do they switch any signs and markings? Just a PR stunt.

In U.S. cities served by multiple airports, I don't know of alternate names for O'Hare, LaGuardia, and Dulles (although I see that Dulles became a place name after the airport was opened). On message boards and social media, I have seen people avoid using the JFK name and refer to Idlewild or New York International.
 
Planetalk
Posts: 487
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Sun Dec 04, 2022 10:20 am

AtomicGarden wrote:
It's just the mkt department, bear with them!

I thought it was about some feminist, woke nonsense. I am glad it's about disability awareness, no matter how silly or insufficient some people think it is. vI have several coworkers with family with DS and it's heartwarming the love and devotion they have for them. Harmless, but still better than nothing.


You realise a lot of people would call renaming it for disability rights 'woke nonsense?'.

It's a shame you can't bring your genuine support one reducing one form of inequality to another. By perpetuating the ridiculous use of woke in one area, you are actually making it harder for the people you want to help in other areas too.
 
richcandy
Posts: 786
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2001 4:49 pm

Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Sun Dec 04, 2022 10:43 am

The French have done similar things to this before. "George V" metro station, named after British King George V was temporarily renamed "Elizabeth II" for the day of her funeral. They also re-named temporarily some metro stations after football players.
I would think that would be way more confusing than renaming a airport. However it must not of been an issue as they have renamed metro stations a few times.

Alex
 
beachroad
Posts: 161
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Sun Dec 04, 2022 11:00 am

DIJKKIJK wrote:
They should do more practical things like appointing more immigration officers or at least, keeping the automatic passport control for EU nationals operational, instead of these pointless name changes. I flew through it yesterday and it was complete chaos with many people missing flights.


That chaos sounds like every day at every Paris transport hub! To be fair, none of that is ADP's influence, that's all PAF.
 
AmericanAir88
Posts: 365
Joined: Wed May 27, 2020 8:59 pm

Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Sun Dec 04, 2022 11:07 pm

Heinkel wrote:
I think, naming airports after people in general is not a good idea. Does anybody use these given names, when they talk about the airport?

An airport should be named after the town ot the locatioon. Frankrut airport, Berlin airport, Han(n)over airport.

Nobody I know uses any given name of these airports.

A renaming of an airport for a week or so makes even less sense. Who will notice that????

Do they switch any signs and markings? Just a PR stunt.


It is for differentiation and honoring someone. Also, that argument of “does anyone use these given names” is very shallow.

John F. Kennedy and Laguardia are big examples. Easy for public and private transit. Differentiates the airports. Everyone knows JFK and LGA.

O’Hare is another example.

As a counter, I do see it working where the name is based off location (Lax, sna, ont, bur) (sfo, oak, sjc). But naming airports is common and it gives identity
 
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Goodbye
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Re: CDG to be temporarily renamed

Sun Dec 04, 2022 11:53 pm

AtomicGarden wrote:
I thought it was about some feminist, woke nonsense.


Yikes

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